What's up Bills Mafia and welcome back to the Buffalo Bread Podcast. I am your host Dan Roberts. Folks, we have real live Buffalo Bills football to talk about. albeit preseason football, but nonetheless, we inch ever closer to the opening of the 2025 regular season. The Bills will square off this Saturday against the New York Giants. And we are very fortunate to have a resident Giants expert that we have added to our ever deepening bench of Friends of the Pod, not Friends
of the Bills co -hosts. We are very excited to welcome one Logan Delutis today to talk about the G -Men. Logan, how you doing? I'm good, Dan. It's an honor to be here. Thank you for having me. I'm excited that we're rolling into the season. I'm excited to talk football. I'm excited to
talk about my Giants. Awesome man i'm excited to talk about your giants too i mean a lot of bills mafia we have a we have a soft affinity for the giants in a lot of ways just because of the day ball shane connection which will get to in a little bit but it's also just exciting to have someone who like can talk. NFC football on the pod. For all of our listeners know that JJ and I while we love all NFL football, we're
pretty much beasts of the AFC East. So it is great Logan to get your perspective on the G men this upcoming season and this game on Saturday is the perfect segue into it. But before we get to that, We always love hearing the stories from our first time hosts about how they came across their fandom their love for their team And I'd love to give you the floor to talk a little bit about how you came about your fandom of the Giants and like why you love the squad so much. Yeah,
so You know growing up. I was always a football player Never really dove deep into rooting for an NFL team. My dad was a lifelong Raiders fan I was like, eh, don't really want to root for them. So, and I've always been a lifelong Yankees fan. So I was like, you know, there's the Yankee, there's the Giants and the Jets. I'm going to go with the Giants. Such a good pick. So, you know, I kind of just being young and And getting into the NFL more, I kind of just chose the Giants
as being a New Yorker. And that was the team that I kind of got into early and first. And then early on in my fandom of the Giants was when we defeated the Patriots in the 2012 Super Bowl and ended their undefeated season. So that was kind of like, oh, OK, we're a good team. It was, I can remember watching that game. I relive to this day the David Tyree helmet catch.
One of the few positive things in recent years of being a Giants fan is we seem to have a knack for highlight reel catches between David Tyree and ever famous Odell Beckham Jr. one handed catch against the Cowboys. Hate to say that seems to have been my highlight of my Giants fandom so far throughout the little over a decade of being a Giants fan but yeah, I think I Think
watching this team over the years. I think you know Coming from the Eli Manning era and seeing how we now, you know Try to grow back into this successful franchise that we've been you know for decades prior it's It's obviously been a rocky road, but it's been a fun road. And as someone who loves football, you know, like yourself, it's it's always great to see the decisions that the front office makes, whether it's decisions
I enjoy or decisions I don't enjoy. So, yeah, it's kind of a little history about my Giants fandom. So, yeah. Very cool, dude. And listen, despite how rocky a road it has been recently, as you alluded to, you have a living memory that many and no one in Bill's mafia does, which is the cherished core memory of winning a Super Bowl championship. So take that with you nurture
that memory for all time. That's cool. And listen, man, you segued beautifully into where I want to start things before we get into the game preview here. You talked a little bit about front office and how as a fandom, we kind of live and die good or bad, we roll with the decisions that a lot of the leadership for our favorite teams deal with. And your leadership has been under some fire over the past few years, and one Joe
Shane and one Brian Dayball. So before we jump into the game, I'd love to get your take especially as someone coming from the Eli Manning era, right, where where the organization was so successful. What has been sort of your take? What has been your thoughts so far on the Shane Dayball experiment? Where are some of those areas you've noted that they've hit? And then what are some of those areas you're like, Nah, man, that that's a complete
mess. Yeah, so Based on what other people have you know, maybe said about the the table in Shane era I I don't think it's been a complete bust so far I think a struggle that they have come into is they are now they have been trying to build out of what Gettleman had built when he was here which was nothing short of a dumpster fire. Total disaster. Yes. And I went into every draft year just praying we pulled at least one decent drafted player that made sense for what
we needed. Um, so I think as far as what they've hit on and alluded to kind of what I just said about drafts, I think, I think they've hit on drafts for the most part. Um, I think they've picked up some guys in the draft that have come in and been real contributors. One I'll hint to is Nubin. He's come in and really filled a gap at safety, a gap that was kind of Shane's doing and not bringing back Xavier McKinney. But then again, he went and still filled that
gap with young talent. You know, he's... Made attempts to fill the the massive gaps we have at O line whether it be through the draft or through free agency So I think draft classes.
I've loved how Joe Shane has gone about these draft classes Again, you know I say for the most part because probably like every team they passed on someone that ended up being a big star for example, we picked up Cordell flot out of the draft over someone like a Nicoby Dean Who I'd love to have Or we picked up a Wanda Robinson in the draft who hasn't been horrible by any means I mean, I think Wanda Robinson is an extremely underrated guy for for his position But we pass
on a guy like George Pickens You have that with every team though. So I mean it's you can't you can't stress about that too much, but I do think Joe Shane and his team have done a pretty good job so far in his short tenure as the Giants general manager with draft classes. With Brian Dable, I would say Brian Dables brought a little bit of a different culture to the team that I think was very much needed. I think for the few years before Brian Dable became the Giants head
coach, I think we had no culture. I think we had no identity. I think we had a lot of experimental head coaches that weren't really cut out for the job and we're just trying to kind of pass it by. I think Brian Dable came in with the fire that he brings and wanted to win. And that's what was so exciting for me seeing Brian Dable come in. This is a guy that cares about winning and you see it on the field. And you see it in press conferences. Now, some may say the flames
get a little too high with him sometimes. I have in fact said that, yes. But I think for me, I'd rather see that and say, hey, maybe in my mind, take a step back a little bit rather than does this guy even care that we're three and 14 to end a year? So I think that's kind of some some hits on this on this regime that's been in there. I think I think Mrs. You know, I touched on on Shane's draft classes. I do think something he's
missed on slightly is his free agency. We brought in some big names, you know, Brian Burns was a big need. I think that was a great signing.
The defensive side he's he's done some things that I I'm a fan of Paul Sinodibo this past offseason helping out the the very struggling secondary But I think Where I think Joe Shane's missed is making that big splash and free agency I think his biggest splash up to this point is Brian Burns who has again been great, but I I would have liked to see, with our team and how much our offensive struggled, a big splash on the offensive side. And I wouldn't call Russell Wilson
a big splash at this point in his career. I think he's a guy who can come in and provide a veteran leadership that the offensive needs. But I think he had an opportunity with Saquon Barkley and he let it go. He had an opportunity with Xavier McKinney that I kind of touched on on the defensive side and kind of let it go You know, hopefully what we've done after that will pan out and it looks like so far it well with You know Tyrone
Tracy as our running back. He's you know Slowly, but surely, you know making his way into a really good running back from what I've seen And like I mentioned before about Newman, he's coming on as a solid safety. I think he just hasn't been as aggressive as I think he can be in free agency. And I think it's played into us not reaching our potential. I think we can as a team. With Brian Dable, I would say a miss would be the
offensive play calling. I think taking play calling away from Mike Kafka was a big mistake when he did it. Purely because the year Mike Kafka was running our offense, we made the playoffs with Daniel Jones. And I arguably say Mike Kafka got Daniel Jones his $40 million contract. So I think taking those play calls, that play calling ability from Mike Kafka away was kind of a mess. I was
never really sure why they did it. So I've I've seen that work that day ball and Kafka kind of collaborated collaborating on the offense this year. And I think Kafka is kind of coming back into the mix. That's what I kind of like to see, because, again, we were successful when he was in the mix of the offensive play calling. And
another I think big mess and. What and this goes for both Shane and dables we've been completely non -competitive in our division You know a division that's you know tough of course especially with how the Cowboys the Eagles and and now the commanders have developed but We we've kind of just become the laughing stock of the division and almost the laughing stock at the NFC and and that's just something I think They need to build out of and I think we've seen with the commander's
Team that I think widely was regarded as a rebuilding team last year Make the playoffs and completely shock everyone So it's possible and it's even possible in the division we're in And I would of course like to see more progression from that from that end of things So yeah, that's kind of my my hits and misses for for the Shane Dable regime so far in New York Dude, you and I have
known each other for a few years now. And I remember several conversations we've had where we have talked about the recent recent history of New York Giants draft. And I've been like, man, that should have been the bills draft for so many years, right? I mean, bringing in guys like Drew Phillips, even a guy like Jalen Hyatt, who it's so hard to do, it's so hard to evaluate wide receivers coming out of Tennessee, because they're not running anything close to a normal route
tree. But take it taking bets on guys with traits like that has always been something I have approved of with Shane. And of course, like Tyler new been coming out of Minnesota was one of my draft crushes. Right. So I always feel like Shane still carries with him that talented eye that he had in Buffalo when he was advising being on the draft picks that they wanted to make. And I definitely think he's brought that to New York for sure. You know, you bring up such a good point about
signing homegrown talent. And I wonder now that so much of the Gettleman era has now been completely purged from the roster. I wonder if you do see that change in free agency with him prioritizing a lot more of the guys he has drafted. That is a hallmark of the Buffalo Bills and how they operate. I mean, we just resigned Cleo Shakir,
Greg Rousseau, Terrell Bernard. I do wonder if if that is now the next step Shane is going to take, particularly after how publicly and poorly, the Saquon Barkley situation landed, which we will absolutely get to later on in this pod. I cannot wait to hear your take on that. Do day ball like, listen, love day ball. If I ever see him in Buffalo, he'll never have to buy a beer, right? beers are on Bill's mafia for everything
dayball did for this organization. But a big reason for the tension between him and McDermott is that dayball does refuse to kind of be modulated. He refuses to like be checked in a way, which I totally agree with your play calling take. He's a talented play caller. But there is no one now that he has head coach that can check his accesses. Like there was in Buffalo with
McDermott, right? So you have to hope that he's going to take that next step in his professional development and his professional maturity and allow other voices into the room when it comes to that stuff. I agree with you. I think Kafka is talented. I think Kafka understands personnel and I think he understands the personnel you guys have. I think if you can combine some of that understanding. of what you have on paper
with some adables chops and X's and O's. I do think you guys can be an improved offense this year, particularly in the run game. Your offensive line should be a really solid run blocking unit. So I think I totally agree with your misses for this era. And I definitely think that hope is potentially on the horizon just based on some
of the recent changes we've seen. However, your owner Mara Was very clear at the end of last season he went through this big public evaluation process and basically told both of these guys You have a year to get your shit together. And if something doesn't change remarkably, then you're both out the door. So We've identified
the steps. We think these two need to take but in your mind what needs to happen This season for both Shane and day ball to retain their positions and come back for 2026 Yeah, so I think For this year, I think it's just competitiveness all around throughout the year. And I touched on the division a little bit, but I think it's just from top to bottom, first week to last week, just being competitive, showing competitiveness on tape. You know, I think they both both Shane and Dable
can't afford to. Go into a home game against the Baltimore Ravens like we did last year a game in which I attended and get the doors Blown off of them the entire game. I mean it was a bloodbath They can't afford games like that anymore. And I think I think from top to bottom no matter who we face I think on tape we have to show that we can be competitive and And that doesn't mean I expect them to come out and put up a crazy record. I don't think that's a smart goal for
them. As much as I would love to see us make the playoffs like everyone else, I think in order for Shane and Deval to keep their jobs, they need to be competitive with everyone. And I think we have the roster to do so. I think, you know, they made some pickups again to be competitive, I think. there's scheme possibilities that they can run to take some teams off guard and put some points on the board. And that's on both
sides of the ball. So I think and I think another thing, too, in regards to and I touched on free agency and the draft, I think it's it's showing that the moves they made in the past were the
right moves. And that's kind of touching again on the Saquon Barkley move and, you know, the Xavier McKinney move and showing not only Mara, but, you know, the entire football world, you know, maybe we made the right decision because now we have Tyrone Tracy, we have Camp Scadaboo, Devin Singletary still in the backfield as a veteran presence. Can they devise a scheme to where, you know, they still put up good numbers as a unit. Obviously, none of them are going
to be a Saquon Barkley type of player. But can they still prove to the league, hey, we still have a good run game, regardless of who's back there? And I think the same goes on the defensive side. I think there's a lot of talk going around that we have one of the more Say scary defense is purely because of our front and how do we utilize that to to take advantage of other teams weaknesses? So yeah, I think overall for me.
It's just competitiveness. You know, I don't want to see a lot of blowouts this year I think they can't afford to just be embarrassed week in week out and I think it's also you know for for table specifically I think It's just smart coaching decisions and games. I think we've seen times where it's late in the game and I'm watching time drain off the clock in two minutes and now we're screwed because we didn't handle clock
properly to end the game and now we lost. In a game, it's an easy game we could have won. I think it's things like that that we have to put by the wayside and improve on and just play smart football. Cuz like you said, if they don't, they're both gone. And and Mara is not going to mince words or worry about feelings. He wants to win and I don't blame him. No, absolutely. I mean, that's, that's the culture in all New York sports, be it the Yankees, right, the Giants,
the Knicks, what have you. You know, you touch on something interesting with the defense and and this this idea that you have about competitiveness showing that the team isn't quitting, right? That defense you guys are going to be rolling out there week after week, I think is going to be key to that. There's actually a couple of keys I want to talk to you about when it comes to improvements your team can make. Let's start with the defense since you're rolled into that.
But I think number two on this is the first round QB that that you guys drafted in one Jackson dart, right? But before you get to dart, excuse me, let's talk about this defense. All right. Dude, this D line is scary. This D line was scary last year. Um, before the addition of Abdul Carter, they had the third quickest time to pressure rate out of any team in the league at 2 .56 seconds.
And they did a great job keeping most plays in front of them, allowing the third lowest yak in the league yet struggled in the red zone, gave up some points in a bend, but kind of don't break mentality. They have gone all out, bringing in guys like Jevon Holland to add to that safety room, uh, and help improve the play of Tyler new Nubin and support him. You of course have added Abdul Carter. You still have Dexter Lawrence
ye of 71 % double teams last season. And it didn't seem to matter because the sack numbers were still outrageous. Um, top to bottom, this defense is great. And Oh, by the way, you've got if healthy, a legitimate cover corner and um, Poulsen Adibo as well, yet another guy I wish the Bills would have looked at this offseason. So let's start with that defense. But let's zoom in on that on that defensive line. The Giants week in and week out are going to go up against some really
good offensive lines within division. You've got the O -line factory that is the Philadelphia Eagles and defending Super Bowl champions. You've got the Washington commanders. who added Laramie Tunsel from the Houston Texans, and also have a budding kind of controversy competition at the other tackle spot between the veteran Andrew Wiley and the rookie they drafted out of Oregon, Josh Connerly. So you've got lots of improvements
in Washington. And then you've got Dallas, which always seems to roll out a really solid offensive line units with guys like Guyton and Smith in the rolls. So talk to me a little bit, Logan, if you would. How do you think this already impressive now maybe, maybe best in the league defensive line is going to fare week in and week out against some of these talented offensive lines within division? Yeah. So again, a lot of our divisional
opponents obviously bolstered their line. Um, as you had mentioned, um, I think what we have a great opportunity to do is come up with so many different looks and schemes that we pretty much negate the talent that these other teams, you know, specifically our divisional rivals have added to their offensive line. You know, Dexter Lawrence is known around the league as an absolute force in the middle of that defensive line, you know, negating even double teams that
get put on him. I think having Having him so worried about in the center It's gonna free up a lot of opportunity for the guys we have on the edge and Abdul Carter cave on Thibodeau Brian Burns To just wreak havoc off the edge and these are all guys who can move off of the edge of the line So I think we have a great opportunity to to take the lead by storm because again Yes offensive lines have five guys, but How fat how much can they keep up for you know 15 minutes
a quarter? With this defensive line, you know, how quickly can we tell your teams out? I think I think we can really take advantage of the speed we have on this line to tire these offensive lines out and now you get into the fourth quarter and They're gassed and our guys are still coming off the edge attacking the quarterback and we're just It's pressure, pressure, pressure. And I think it'll make it easier for everyone behind
them. It'll make it easier for those linebackers that have to maybe cover a quick guy out of the backfield. It'll make it easy for our secondary. You know, you mentioned Javon Holland, obviously a very successful safety coming over from Miami.
You know, I think it'll be interesting to see how Maybe we factor in Tyler new been to that that front because he's a guy who can come up and fail and he can Come into the box because now we have a strong guy behind him in Jevon Holland to cover I Just think there's so many scheme opportunities we can put together with this D line That I'm extremely excited for and I'm looking forward to seeing what we what we do on the field I think everyone Who's a part
of that D line has a chance to put up insane numbers? Whether it's your your everyday stats or your your deeper Statistical categories, you know, you know pressure rate stuff like that. I think they can all put up insane numbers and I think You know there there's guys behind those big names that also have ability to to contribute You got you have a guy like DJ Davidson who's another big guy who, you know, not many people know about because he sits behind Dexter Lawrence.
You know, what can you do with two massive dudes in the middle who clog up that middle and now you have, you know, a scheme where you still have Kavon Thibodeau, Brian Burns, and a dual Carter out there, you know, rushing from the outside or maybe one drops back into cover. It's just a very exciting scenario that we have for this year. I'm pumped for it. And I can't wait to see what they do that weekend and week out. And dude, you guys are going to be not just solid
against the pass, right? But I mean, low key, you guys are going to be so good against the run Dexter Lawrence, as we have said, as a gap eater in the middle of that line, but cave on Thibodeau. Low key maybe one of the better edge edge setters when it comes to defending the run game as well. I watched I was watching some of his tape in preparation for this and you know the pressure rate is not always there with him. in the pass rest situation. But I ended up watching
a lot of his run stops and run stuffs. Dude, that guy gets clean off the edge. He gets a beat on the on the opposing running back so quickly. His his play recognition and his run diagnosis is so fast. And he makes his decisions in a split second. And with that raw athleticism, he is off. I got to tell you, he's very impressive
against the run. I just think you guys have a well rounded defensive line that Honestly, and I mean this wholeheartedly nothing sarcastic like is the envy I think of Bill's mafia because this is the type of line block by block. personnel type by personnel type that Bean has been trying to build for so long, and for whatever reason just has not been able to and here it is gift
wrapped for you Giants fans. I think it's a great building block to again regain that competitive edge that you noted you feel like is needed for this team to kind of take that next step into relevance in the division. So let's flip over to the offensive side of the ball. We alluded to this earlier, Shane and Dayball. Got to use the first round pick this year on their guy. They got to pick their QB and one Jackson Dart.
And he is going to start the Saturday against the Buffalo Bills, uh, seeing his first live football action. So I have not admittedly, uh, done a lot of homework on Jackson Dart as of yet. Um, not a part of the dart discourse only because, you know, JJ and I, because we have the benefit of Josh Allen, we don't scout a lot of QBs in the preseason. So give us some insights if you could into what you're seeing from Jackson Dart and what you hope you're going to see this
Saturday when he takes the field. Yeah. So I think Jackson Dart is another one of these young quarterbacks who fits this mold that Brian Dable loves. And it fits this. I said the same thing when we had Daniel Jones. He he compares in ways with Josh Allen. He's a guy who, you know, it's not necessarily your your Lamar Jackson of running and running past people, but he can move and he's not afraid to take a hit and he will fight for those extra yards. And Jackson also got a
big arm as does Josh Allen. So I think he. He fits that mold that I think you know Brian Dable is looking to have at quarterback And I think just this year so far as a rookie in camp he's he's done a lot of good things He's had some growing pains like, you know, most rookie quarterbacks do From what I've seen is he's he's caught on to Just the NFL scheme quickly and the Giants game quickly, which is great I think he's soaking in every opportunity that he has with the veteran
quarterbacks on our roster, especially Jameis Winston. I mean, he made it known that he wants to come to New York and help a guy like Jackson Dart who was a rookie progress in the NFL. And I think Jackson Dart has really taken advantage
of that. And that's great to see because, you know, you see these guys coming to the NFL and, you know, Whether they're expected to be this first year starter or not They kind of just do things on their own whether and they may even have their own their own way of doing things, but You know Jackson Dart has really taken The he's really taken advantage of the ability to the learn of the veterans that Joe Shane brought in To to assist Jackson Dart and I think just
watching some of his tape from the preseason It looks like he's making a lot of good decisions with the ball He's made a couple off script plays that I've seen where he's still gotten the ball to the receiver even on a busted play Which of course is always good to see because those type of things happen in game And I think he's developing connections early with receivers I think Theo Johnson is someone who he's favored it as far as a target which you know We have two phenomenal
tight ends already And it's good to see that he's developing a connection with these with these guys who are most definitely gonna play a big role in our offense You know I Touching on the good things and maybe you know touching
on a quick struggle. I've seen where he's maybe held on to the ball a Tick too long and someplace But again, it's it's a part of those growing pains It'll be interesting to see how he does against live -action this weekend You know another team coming at him that can hit him, you know that that speed of the game How was he gonna react to the speed of the NFL? Now that you know, we're live and this isn't practice anymore. So
I'm excited for him. I think there's a lot of good things that have shown I think he Was the best option for Brian Dable coming out of this draft just with his play style and and his kind of the swag he brings with him and his Characteristics, I think he's the perfect guy for Brian table coming out of this draft and Hopefully we can succeed enough as a team to where Brian Dable gets to use him at quarterback And and John Mara doesn't ship Brian Dable off somewhere else and
someone else gets to use Jackson dirt. So But yeah. Let me ask you, let me ask you about that, right? Cause your guys schedule the season, bro. It is scary stuff, right? So, so do you really want to see Jackson Dart this season? Let me, I'm going to run through some of your first games and you tell me where you want to see Jackson Dart finally get the keys to the, to the, to the Porsche. All right. So you open up the season, uh, at commanders, then you've got the Cowboys.
Then you've got the chiefs. Then you've got the chargers. So you've got for out of your first four games, you've got three playoff teams from last season. Then you've got the saints kind of an easy one, but then you got the Eagles. Then you got the Broncos. Then you got the Eagles again. Then you got the Niners. Then you have the much improved Ben Johnson led bears. Then the Packers, the lions, the Patriots, the commanders.
The Vikings and then you finish up with the Raiders and the Cowboys Sir that is a brutal draw this season so like it I get it everyone wants to see like their their first round pick it in there but like do you really want to see him in there this season because I feel like there's there is risk to the young man's life right so pick your spot. If you see him roll out this season where would you want it to be. If he does roll out this season, I would I would like to see
it probably post week 13. You know, once I wouldn't want to see him roll out this season until we're out of playoff picture. And even if we're out early, I still wouldn't want to see it until
later in the year. I think for me and I think I think for me, I don't Don't really want to see him out there at all this year I think this is an opportunity to learn from our mistakes with Daniel Jones and rushing on early QB and to a starting role now mind you I There's a part of me that understands that we kind of had to with Daniel Jones. We we didn't have much outs at the time You know, we were one of those teams
where it was top quarterback. He was gonna start first year Now what in hindsight when I say Daniel Jones was the top quarterback in that draft probably not but You know again, we learned from our mistakes I think what Jackson dart I would like us to to take a route That I think a lot of Patriots fans last year wanted to see what Drake may This is the correct comp. Yes, keep going. We utilize our veterans to just get beat down and save Jackson Dart for another year and just let him develop
again. He's got all the opportunity in the world to develop and learn from two veterans, one who is a former Super Bowl champion and one who Had both success at the college level and Jamis Winston as a Heisman Trophy winner and has had some success in the NFL though. It hasn't been a lot He's
out. He has had some success and as a veteran in the league and has been around multiple different teams So I I think there's a great opportunity to learn from our past mistakes and I would love to see us do so and again save Jackson darts life from as you said and a brutal draw for a
schedule. Dude, it is rough. And I get you guys have made some tweaks to the offensive line too, but he's inheriting an offensive line that gave up the sixth highest pressure rate last year and the fifth highest quick pressure rate last season to like the almost the complete opposite of your defense, right? It's a tough situation to put a rookie and then you add that schedule on top of it. I kind of agree with you. I think you just roll out the vets for as long as you
can. And also keeping in mind, too, that at Ole Miss, Jackson Dart didn't really run a traditional pro style offense, right? You know, Lane Kiffin is highly creative head coach and a highly creative play caller. But we have seen Ole Miss. We have seen Ole Miss products before really struggled to adapt to NFL offenses. And Dayball runs. you know, despite his hotheadedness, one of the most in structure type of offensive particular offenses, particularly in the passing game that you could
imagine he loves these big guys. And he loves the ability to option the quarterback run. But that pass game is all about picking your spots downfield and pushing the ball and operating in structure. And he starts going to have to acclimate to that for sure. But it is exciting, dude. I'm with you. I hope If you do see him, it's not till the end of the season, even though I don't also love the idea of him like facing a blind Brian Flores led Minnesota defense either.
But if you got to see it, dude, I agree with you. The timing has to be at the end of the year. All right, before we get to the game real quick. I need your take on this. So the bills are being featured on Hard Knocks this season. I actually had the chance to watch the first episode. I've watched a lot of Hard Knocks in my time as a football fan, and this had to be the most wholesome episode of Hard Knocks I've ever seen in my life.
Like a third of the episode is Trey White, and they're following him to this ice cream shop in like Pittsburgh or something. And he's just trying to get an ice cream sundae named after himself, which I believe he was successful in doing. I loved it. It was very Bill's Mafia coded and I absolutely loved it. But the connective tissue here is that your giants were on it last
season. Very, I would say infamously for one interaction in particular, and this was the Joe Shane, Saquon Barkley debate and then ultimate phone call between Shane and Barkley where Shane tells them they're not going to make him a make him an offer, right? It has become memeable. It has been pointed to by a lot of football execs as why Hard Knocks is a bad thing to have in
your camp. So I want to ask you this one. What was it like watching all that play out in real time on Hard Knocks and then to do you think the Buffalo Bills Hard Knocks season this year will give us anything as remotely memorable as that clip of the Shane Barkley debate? Yeah, so I can sum up watching. that series of events with one word, and that one word is pain. I'm so sorry. Yeah, so it wasn't fun. I still have a Saquon Barkley jersey sitting in my closet.
That's so awesome. And every Sunday when I go to choose a jersey, I look at it, a small sigh comes out of me, and I move on to the next one. But yeah, it was... Certainly not a fun situation to watch unfold. It was quite. Frustrating at the time you have this. Essentially golden egg at the running back position sitting there telling you he wants to be part of your team, not really pressing on the financial aspect. And again, he deserves every dollar he gets with his talent.
And we're kind of like. We're fine. No, thanks. Do I think you guys will have as memorable of a moment? I'm not sure you could have as memorable of a moment, even if you tried. Again, that's probably the correct take. I think you guys have, whether you believe so or not, have handled the James Cook situation a little bit better. Mind you, I haven't watched it as intently. But it seems you are in a much better situation that
we were with Saquon Barkley. I think, you know, Bean has probably got this in the back of his mind, like Kayla. Let's not embarrass ourselves like they did last year and create this clip. Maybe I'll watch what I say to some of our star players who we might be in contract negotiations with. It's in touching on the hard knocks thing. It's it's super cool to watch the the bills this
year I'm a big hard knocks fan myself. I I loved watching my my own team It last year as much as like you had much in the exact show like this is why it's horrible for you know the league As a fan. I love it. I get to see all the behind -the -scenes stuff I hope you enjoy it, and I believe you'll enjoy it as much as I watched it. Hopefully, you don't have as many infuriating
moments as I had, but I hope you enjoy it. I do enjoy watching it this year, mainly because they're at my alma mater and St. John Fisher University. Yo, shout out. Hey, now. That's a fun part for me. To circle back to kind of your question, no, I don't think you guys will have as memorable of a moment as Joe Shane did last year. Yeah, I agree. I think Bean and McDermott are going to be allergic to finding moments like
that. I think we're supposed to get some of the James Cook hold in stuff on next week's episode, I assume. But I agree with you. I mean, I recorded a podcast earlier here at the start of the preseason. And I made the case for paying James Cook, I think, you know, and I would this is off script, I would love your take on this. Because I've been maligned on the interwebs for this take.
But you know, we brought in a guy like Josh Palmer, who is, you know, supposedly the separation expert at the wide receiver position and time will only tell. And I am told we can't pay James Cook $13 million a year, because he's a running back, right. And there's only so few guys that are in that 13 to $15 million range. And he he doesn't qualify for that, because of the position he plays takeaway position. And I asked myself the question, who is more valuable to the Buffalo
Bills? Is it James Cook? or is it Josh Palmer? To me, it's James Cook for everything he needs to this run scheme, for everything how he fits into the zone blocking alignments that Aaron Kromer wants to run. And to me, position aside, the guy who has the ability to have the most impact on the roster is a guy like James Cook. And I'd rather give him the $13 million a year, as opposed to like the third or fourth wide receiver from the LA Chargers bench. You know what I mean?
Yeah. But like, I understand the positional value argument, like I've seen all the charts, I get it, right? But when it just comes down to which dude is more valuable, I think back to that AFC Championship game, and the person who played his best game in that loss to Kansas City wasn't Josh Allen for as much as I love Josh. He came out super nervous at the beginning of that game. Wasn't anyone on the defense. Wasn't even Khalil
Shakir. It was James Cook on 13 touches. two touchdowns shredding the Kansas City defense and keeping us in that game offensively. That's the dude I want to give $13 million to not a guy who is departing a team that is desperate for wide receivers, but also was happy to like say goodbye to him and let him leave the, you know, walk out the door. But I am open to being wrong Logan. So tell me, am I wrong with that take on James Cook? No, I, I agree with you.
Um, I felt the same way with Saquon Barkley last year. I can understand the argument with positional value. Obviously, everyone makes the argument where running backs don't last in the NFL. How long will that argument last? We have no idea. But like every position in the NFL, the minimum ask for new contracts is growing. I mean, for example, the wide receiver market right now. Some of these top guys are getting insane Contracts
that a few years ago. We would have never thought would have been getting rolled out the quarterback markets always growing I Think the running back markets gonna grow too. Oh, you know in a couple years it I Think I think the value of a running back is going to change as Once teams and execs truly recognize how much it opens up an offense to have a good running back. And if you really build, I mean, not to beat a dead horse, but
say Juan Barclay and the Eagles, great. And again, they have a phenomenal offensive line that really played to his success, but how much he opened up their offense. Teams had to load boxes against the Eagles because if they didn't, it was an
easy 200 yard day for him. And that opened up now a top tier receiver and AJ Brown and another Very good receiver and Devontae Smith To take advantage of a weak secondary on teams because there was no one to shadow them over top They were one -on -one and all they had to do was beat their guy so so to your point if you have a guy like a James Cook who You know is proven to be valuable in many facets of your offense.
Why not pay him? I mean What why why not he if he opens up your offense as much as he has and and brings But like you you can't You can't sit there and say while our offense is better without him And everything he opens up for our offense is gonna stay open once he's gone 100 % I doubt it. I doubt it happens. I mean, maybe it does who know who knows maybe Ray Davis can come in and be James Cook 2 .0 Yeah, maybe probably helpful,
but you know Again, that's to me. That's me not knowing a lot about Ray Davis But still you have such a valuable guy who's done nothing but be successful for you in your offense Why why take the risk and now you know You're gonna run you might run into the same scenario in another four years with another running back get your guy Who's gonna be successful for you for another, you know? maybe five, six years. And then you you of course have to reevaluate later on. Yes,
I agree with you. And I think your take on the the ever evolving nature of positional value for running backs is it's at the forefront of my mind as we have this conversation. Like you guys paid Darius Slayton The money that Saquon Barkley was asking for last season. You paid that to him this off season and no one batted an eye. But can anyone honestly say that Darius Slayton, for as solid as a wide receiver as he is, is more valuable to the Giants offense than
Saquon Barkley was? I think the answer is universally no. You know, and you mentioned Barkley and how he unlocked Philly. I would add you a Derek Henry and how he unlocked Baltimore and Lamar Jackson as well. And these are two O -line factories, right? Baltimore and Philly, they seem to find great offensive linemen at every level of the draft, at every level of the scrap heap and free agency. They bring these guys into their system
and they are almost immediately successful. Mackay Beckton resurrected his career in Philly last year after a disastrous turn with the Jets to start his career. The Buffalo Bills had a similar sort of O -line Academy under Cromer. And I think a lot of Bills mafia are like, well, you can plug and play anybody into that system and they'll be successful. And I would argue, no, that there has to be this, this meeting in the middle of traits and skills of the right wide receiver.
and the scheme to in order to fully maximize it. And I feel like James Cook is the guy that can fully maximize it. I love Ray Davis, but he's a much different running back than James Cook is. And I don't think people understand how much that blocking scheme and Buffalo would have to change to accommodate a guy like Ray Davis, who is more of a north south runner. One cut, boom runs downhill. Whereas James Cook has
S tier field vision. And he can buy time behind the line of scrimmage, find the right hole, the perfect hole, and then boom, he is through it with that elite level acceleration that he brings to the table. You can you find another guy like James Cook someday? Sure, right? I just don't think that person's on the roster right now. And I again, If I'm investing $13 million on somebody in the bill's current cap situation, I'd rather give it to the guy who has proven
to be successful in the scheme. And oh, by the way, their most successful and the biggest moments that this team has faced, right? We oh my god, I could go on this forever. I can go on this forever. The bills are constantly like Brandon Bean, where are the stars? Why don't you draft stars? All you drafted was Josh, right? James Cook is probably a star in the system. And we're like, ah, but he's a running back, let him go. And let's see what this like fifth round pick
out of Iowa State can do next year. I'm like, it just drives me crazy. Just pay, pay the man and stop giving money to Curtis Samuel, right? All right. Anyway, all we got a game to talk about. Let's talk about a game. All right. So you've already talked about what you want to see from Jackson Dart real quick here, Logan, because I want to see if I can get us an under
an hour for the pod today. Give us some names that Buffalo Bills fans should keep an eye out other than Jackson Dart and other than some of the more notable guys. Who are some dudes who you think we should be keeping an eye out for as the GMN take the field against the Bills this week? My first name to keep an eye out for is, I would say Jalen Hyatt. A guy who, you know, at a point in his young career where he almost
has to resurrect his career. And it's wild to say that considering where we picked him up in the draft. But this is a guy who has to prove
he belongs still on this roster. I think it'll be interesting to see what he does and and kind of the the route tree they have him run And a new what I think is gonna be a new kind of offense given the pieces we have now You know, he came out of college being that deep threat guy and we never really utilized him as such and he's playing at a heavier weight this year by about 15 20 pounds Is he still that guy that we expect to go down the field and and just burn past everyone?
Is he gonna be a more technical guy with his routes? That's that's someone who I'm definitely Keeping an eye out for and I I think you know, that's someone bills fans should keep an eye out for especially, you know You know, I I know the secondary is a touch point we've talked about with with your bills for for quite some time and You know, it's it'll be interesting to see Who Jalen Hayek gets matched up against on the
Bills? I don't expect it to be a tradavious white or anyone like that, but still I still Look to to see him take some strides in this first game and show he belongs Another guy who I doubt many people know of is Dante Miller one of our running backs He is a guy who he goes by turbo for his explosiveness Such a good nickname for running
back. Yeah turbo Miller is his nickname I think he's a guy who it'll be interesting to watch and Buffalo's to keep an eye out for for his pure explosiveness as he tries to Prove that he belongs and potentially take a third string roll away from a veteran like Devin Singletary I think he can provide some depth explosiveness, especially given Camp's cataboo is currently battling a hamstring injury. So it'll be interesting to see what he does as he tries to prove that
he belongs on the Giants. My third and final guy is a guy that most football fans probably know, especially in the Giants nation, Evan Neil. I am very curious to see how he performs on the
inside as he makes this shift. Especially as you notated a Bills D -line who is looking to find their identity and that's something I'm kind of watching out for too is how our offensive line looks against a team who obviously has some guys in the front who can make plays and might be our Put some new schemes and stuff like that. So I'm, I'm very curious to see how I have a new place. Does he make that shift smooth? Um,
and does it look right for him? Um, because he's another guy, he doesn't perform on the inside. He might be, he might be a, a cut victim. So, um, those are kind of three guys that I've, I'm kind of keeping an eye out for as they kind of try to prove themselves, um, for the giants. Love it, man. We have this segment here that we call prediction sure to go wrong. It's where me and JJ will make a bunch of game time predictions and stuff like that for whatever the bills are
facing in the week ahead. So give us your prediction sure to go wrong here for the G men this weekend on Saturday. What do you think is going to be the final score for this game? Final score. I know it's a preseason game, right? The over -under I think is like two and a half in favor of the Bills because it's at home Like none of these lines matter if you're betting preseason football lines, please seek help to all the listeners
out there. Yeah Yeah, I fully agree if you're bad and I probably got some good buddies that are that are probably bad preseason football I say this and I may or may not have a four -leg parlay on this game My score prediction, I honestly, truthfully, I think it'll be like a 28 -21 game. I think we see some points put on the board. I think I'm going to go in favor of my Giants. I have to, 28 -21 Giants, but I think we'll see some points put on the board. I think it'll be
a good game. I think it'll be definitely an eye -opening game and I'm excited for it. Nice. I'm gonna give you a prop bet here too, because this is also a signature of the show. So I'm gonna give you over under one and a half TDs for Jackson Dart and his first pro action. I'm hitting the
over. Yo, all right, I mean listen our secondary is beat up but come on man I'm heading over and no shade at the bill secondary, but I'm hitting over I think one of them's gonna be a deep ball and I think he another one's just gonna be a good driving leads down and and gets another touchdown so I'm gonna hit over Very nice. I will definitely make sure to bring this up in the post game when I when I recap this game All right, man, I'm gonna get you out of here on
this. You are an avid fantasy football junkie, right? Me and JJ, we like to recklessly gamble, you like to play fantasy football, and I respect your discipline way more than ours. You are in... I want to talk about players, right? But before we do that, I am fascinated by the fantasy league that you're in, because you're in one of this like long running, very competitive league with
some of your bunnies. And you guys have... Maybe the most creative loser bets I've ever heard of before So I need a sneak peek and I think our listeners would love this as well What are some of the what are some of the things you guys are? Contemplating this year in your league to make the losers of your league do yeah, so I Love the punishment thing we've put into our league. It's a phenomenal twist so incredible
A couple this year. Now these are ones that have not been chosen in the past and I think they'll make a return in the pool of punishments. The first one being a raft made of milk cartons where you will then have to use that raft to cross Delta Lake here in Rome, New York. Oh my god. And the milk I've been told will have to be consumed by the one will that is building the raft will hold true or not. I'm not sure that That is not my punishment, but that is when I have heard
will make a return most likely. Oh my god It's so good. The second one is to sign up and do a one -minute stand -up comedy set unprepared prior to I really wish we weren't audio only I'm like tearing up with fresh off the mind Comedy set one minute at a comedy club that you can possibly get into to do a one minute set Just
one minute open mic. Oh my god The third one that I've been told may make a return is to recreate the Darren Waller music video Now, as many football fans know, Darren Waller left the game of football to become a rapper. It was unsuccessful. A large meme that came from that was his music video. That was one that was one that was brought up
in a return. The final one and is the one that I have chosen to bring back this year that was unfortunately not selected last year, as you must take a blow up doll on a date to a restaurant. Now I am praying this gets chosen I will personally be attending the restaurant of the loser when they go if my gets chosen So those are just a few that I that I'm pretty sure will make a return
this year It's always fun. It is always a thrill at the end of the year When you have they get you the guys that are battling to not finish last because they don't want to suffer through this so Oh my god, I have so much respect for you right now. These are all these are all absolutely incredible, Logan. Absolutely incredible. All right. Let's talk real quick about some of your
top picks, right? Yeah, give me give me like two or three guys you think are going to be sneaky good picks this year and then guys you think we should stay away from. Yeah, so so a first guy that I think could be a sneaky good pick this year and it's going to be a giant is Wanda Robinson Really? Oh good talk. Yeah, talk to
me about this. Oh So we saw what the Steelers and this is more so about Russell Wilson, you know Russell Wilson to the surprise of I think some Steelers fans, especially ones that I know Didn't feed George Pickens as much as you think
he would be in your star receiver. He fed some of the guys around him I think Wanda Robinson has proven to be a Good slot receiver and I think he could possibly be a viable flex option If Russell Wilson takes that same route as far as you know, maybe he doesn't feed Malik neighbors as much As people might think and he's feeding some guys around him and I think Wanda Robinson can can be that guy and produce and give you some You know 10 -point flex weeks For your fantasy
team, so he's he's a guy who who I'm I definitely think could be a sneaky back and draft guy Um, another pick for me, um, I have multiple in my head, so I'm trying to go through that Rolodex. I'm trying, I'm trying to just choose one. Um, uh, I think another good one for me who I think some people should keep an eye on. I think he's kind of gone by the wayside given his counterpart is Dave in Montgomery. Um, yeah. I understand the injury worries with David Montgomery, especially
the back half of the year. But prior to his injury, I mean, David Montgomery and Jameer Gibbs were hand in hand in fantasy production. I think people are counting him out sooner than he should be. I don't know how much the Lions are really going to feed Jameer Gibbs if they don't have to. Do they go back to what they had when they had a
healthy Dave in Montgomery? And you know, maybe Jameer Gibbs gets to starting not every game and Dave in Montgomery is the second string guy But does Dave Montgomery take a lot of touchdowns from Jameer Gibbs? Does he take that red zone work? I think that's definitely something to look out for And then Let's see my my third and my final one Go on to my Rolodex again, so I take it down You know, I'm gonna I'll pick a different position I'll go with tight end here.
Um I'm gonna take Travis Kelsey And it's it's surprising to even me to say that Travis Kelsey is like a sneaky option for fantasy But I think last year there were a lot of fantasy players who are incredibly disappointed with Travis Kelsey and his production rightfully So he had some drop problems He was not the fantasy tight end people thought he was going to be. And I understand the age worries, but Travis Kelsey is Travis Kelsey. He's arguably one of the best tight ends
to ever play the game for a reason. I think he could have a bounce back year. I think when the Chiefs get their full receiving corps and all the weapons that they now have at their receiving corps with Rashid Rice, Xavier Worthy. They still have Pacheco and Kareem Hunt. Do we see Kelsey come back and kind of remake a name for himself in the fantasy light and put up those old numbers he did because now teams have more to worry about
than just Travis Kelsey. So those are kind of my three people to look out for, kind of guys that go under the wayside. You know some some later some guys that I think will follow later rounds this year I think would definitely keep your eye on and definitely consider For your fantasy team this year Nice very cool, dude. I appreciate that and listen Logan I appreciate you taking the time to chat with us today. Of course. It was a pleasure Great having you on,
man. Hopefully we'll get you back on soon. For all of you listening at home, like, share and subscribe wherever you get your podcasts. We are on YouTube, Apple and Spotify. And as always, go Bills.