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Workotato five fifty five KRCD talk station. Happy Wednesday to you, Judejennita Poulatana bottom of the hour, Trump War and the Constitution. But in the meantime, Welcome back to the fifty five Carssey Morning. You're running for the Cincinnian Inquirer, mostly on sports, but combining his two favorite topics now, Jason Williams, We're gonna be talking politics and sports, specifically the Bengals lease agreement and where we sit with that because the deadline's
fast approaching. Jason Williams, saw is a pleasure to talk with you.
Man.
Welcome back to the morning show.
Brian. Always enjoy joining you and love the KARC listeners and every time Joe message to me, hey, can you come on. I'm I'm there man.
I'm glad. I'm glad you're there, and I'm glad you're following this because this is this is crazy. You know, most of my listeners, probably as do most people that understand the Cincinnati lease agreement, recorded as one of the worst, if not the worst in the entire world of football, professional football, and so the lease is set to expire.
And my understanding is if they don't work out terms for an ongoing lease agreement, regardless of how long the terms is, and I guess that's one of the things they have to discuss. How long will the terms be for the new lease agreement. The Bengals can just extend the terms of the current agreement in two year increments. Have I got that part right anyway?
Yeah? Yeah, they could extend it in two year increments up to ten years, so five there's a lot of numbers going there, but five two year extensions. So yeah, so this current lease could go up to ten more years. I don't think that there's I'm not getting any sensors, any any any indication, and that's what's on the table. And I do potentially a two year extension, the first of what could be five two year extensions could be
on the table, but I don't know. Some of the things that are, you know, kind of coming out of the county and some of the public records that the Inquirer obtained, I don't seem to indicate that, you know, certainly there is an effort on both sides to get something done beyond just extending this current lease.
Well, theoretically, I guess right now they haven't come up with an agreement on a new lease. Of course, the county officials hopefully are trying to argue for better terms of conditions than we've gotten under the current lease. I'm sure the Bengals are scrapping and fighting for a bunch of stuff that they want. So that's where the negotiations
are going on. If if they're not done by the deadline, which is June thirtieth for a new lease, and the Bengals extra is their right to extend the current one, is it still a possibility they could continue working on a new agreement during that two year period and sort of put that in place while that extension is on.
Oh yeah, they can, they can. They can continue to do that at any time. This is as far as I understand it. I'm just talking to people that you know, they can at any point beyond really at anytime now, Like you you know, it's really not much different than where you would be at now, is that you could then be working on an extension beyond that extension. So
you know, and you mentioned the top top there. Uh, you know, sticking point, it's just something that's kind of gotten buried a little bit and in the news or just even in the discussion about about the stadium lease. Is you know, so many people, we all want to know the money, the money, the money, how much money? Well almost equally as because it is you know, the money's involved. Is the amount of years and so is it ten years, is it fifteen years, is it twenty years?
Is it even more? And you know, and then how much money in that ten year period are you going to willing to give? Like if that makes sense in that like you're not going to pay eight So there's eight hundred and thirty million dollars worth of whatever upgrades and bells and whistles that they say or I hate
the thing needed to be done to that stadium. But you know, are you if you're not going to spend eight hundred and thirty million if they're only going to do a ten year extension, but you might if they're going to do it twenty And so that's where the years and the money all come together there. And so if people don't talk a lot about the years, but the years are very important.
Here excellent point well, and I saw one of the reports from the inquiry the parties will in good faith commenced negotiations as early as twenty thirty five. That's ten years about the need for a new NFL stadium. And I must choked when I read those words out loud. I'm thinking, Oh my god, we're going to go through this again another ten years. We're going to knock down pay Corps and build a brand new it'll be what
ten billion dollar facility at that point. I mean, I scratched my head over that concept, Jason, I really do. I just I struggle with public dollars paying for sports stadiums in the first instance, but the idea of that place would be actually considered obsolete in ten years. I mean, there's nothing wrong with it right now.
Amen, everything you just said, Brother Brian, I am one hundred percent with you on this, and you know, I got to be honest with you. I'm a little surprised that there hasn't been more of a push or more talk from the Bengals side anyway of a new stadium this time around, because you have seen that in Nashville
with the Tennessee Titans. Yeah, there's a great example there of I mean, that's a stadium that I think it opened to just a year ahead of Paycorp stadiums is sort of out of that same kind generation of stadiums, and they're building a new stadium there in Nashville two billion dollars, I believe, And so I'm a little surprised that, especially with an eight hundred and thirty million dollars price tag, that there wasn't more of a push from the Bengals,
even from I don't know Bengals supporters or that you know, chatter anyway about oh, you know, why don't they just build a new stadium? And frankly, if that would have been the case, and would have been highly critical of it and highly critical of the state hundred thirty million, which is what over double what the original cost of the stadium cost to build. So yeah, yeah, that doesn't surprise me that in ten years there would be talk
of wanting to build a new stadium. And so then there you if you factor that in Brian, that also is like, you know, are you're gonna pump one hundred and eight hundred and thirty million dollars into this stadium for the next ten years only to turn around in ten years and be chattering or talking about looking at building a new stadium. I find that hard to believe. Yes, I find it more as an either or kind of thing.
And it's the the you know, you know, put band aids on things and fix some of the you know, the leaky faucets and all that over the next ten years, and then you look at a new stadium. But I cannot see spend an eight hundred thirty million dollars to do whatever to this stadium and then turn around in ten years and say, oh, well, let's build a new stadium. That's just that's just flat out It's already physically irresponsible as it is, and that's just flat out ridiculous.
Well, unless you can declare something functionally obsolete, there's no argument in favor of a new stadium. And I don't think anybody can call Payhorse Stadium functionally obsolete. You know, if it's if they maintained it in its current status, fix the pipes, you know, fix the concrete, whatever needs to be maintained, it'll still operate as a sports stadium. You can play football in ten years from now, twenty
years from now. So anyhow, we're not, we're not in disagreement, and we're at least in a court on that concept. And for a while they were talking about, and I'm sure this lease agreement has to contemplate whether any money is going to come from the Ohio state taxpayers. It looked like appeers as though the Cleveland Browns got six
hundred million. There was some widely circulated comments about maybe we would get three hundred and fifty million, or at least they asked for three hundred and three hundred and fifty million from the state. Is there any updates on that, whether that even remains a possibility. I think since the budget's been done at least I thought it was done in Columbus, that it's it's not under the ram of consideration this year, not this year.
I certainly think the state will give the Bengals money, and that that's the debate now is what pot will that come from or potentially come from. I know Senator Bill Blessing is, you know, push for there to be a legislation that Hamilton County could do a cigarette tax. I've got my opinions on that. I think even though that's I guess could be considered a user fee. If you look in Cleveland, then I would encourage listeners to do that. Do a little research on what they call
the sim tax in Cleveland. That's on alcohol and tobacco in Cuyahoga County, and that helps pay for the Guardians, the Browns, and the Cavs stadiums and arena. And at the end of the day, that all just generates thirteen million dollars a year. And I say, just that's of course a lot of money. But if you think about here, this will just be I believe the say a cigarette tax, and they don't have another state up there where people
can go. There's a bigger population, and so you're looking at you would just put this tax in and it's not going to really move the needle, and so you get another tax. I don't care who that tax is on. I'm of the mind that there should be no more, no app asolutely, no more, no matter where it comes from. Hamilton County tax levee on Hamilton County tax payers. Well, I'm not the state once good.
No, I just gonna say, you know, sin is in the eye of the beholder. And I don't know why we always you know, we we heap the burden of paying for a lot of things on certain products. It's like, as soon as a new product comes on the market, like vaping, that's immediately deemed something that's worthy of an additional tax just because it's new. But then again, gee, how about I walk over to northern Kentucky and buy my smokes there?
You know?
Duh?
Well, I mean yeah, I think you know. I mean there's a lot. I just at the end of the day, I don't think it would be worth it, and I just it. Look, the bigger picture of that too, is that it'd be yet another viewed it's kind of another sort of bailout for the Bengals. Yeah, and at some point, like you got to get the burden off the Hamilton
County tax payer, and I don't care. Yeah, I'm I'm not smoker, do you know, smokeless tobacco or anything like so I wouldn't be paying that tax, but I don't care. Like in terms of just getting the burden off of off of the county, off of Hamilton County that Hamilton County has carried. It's more, way, way, way more than it's fair share on this stadium with an ongoing sales tax, and there should absolutely be no more sales tax, any kind of tax put on the citizens, the voters, the
tax payers of Hamilton County. And now if they want, if they want, they're exploring, you know, taxing sports betting across the state and then using some of that to help with the arenas and stadiums and cities across the Ohio. You know that that's one Like if that's the state wide tax on on sports gaming that goes to things that are across the state. I'm I'm I'm a lot with you, Brian, Like I'm of the mind, like I don't I think we already spend way too much money
tax money on stadiums, arenas. It's just way out of whack and it's way out of proportion. But if that's something that is going to continue to happen, you've got to look at revenue streams like that, and they're looking at what the unclaimed property or unclaimed money pot of money is a potential like okay, but then again, you know there's all these arguments, like you know, I mean we could go down the yeah, the basic the you know, the basic route of I mean, how many how many
roads and highways and bridges do we drive on. There's potholes, and there's bridges that are as you mentioned, functionally obsolete. Speaking of I mean how many bridges in the state in this area alone or functionally obsoletes? Yeah. And if you're looking at that pot of money of unclaimed money in the state, which is what three billion dollars or something, well, why wouldn't you Why wouldn't you look at doing it on like things that you know, actually really helped the general citizen ry.
Or property tax relief. I don't know if you got the word, Jason, property tax have gone through the roof. I mean there's always there's a lot of money, and there's a million people who want to get their hands in the cookie jar. And this takes us always back to this is a privately owned sports franchise. That is last time I checked, they are profitable, aren't they? Jason? Does the Bengals make money for the Bengal family? I mean the Brown family.
Hey, look, Brian, when the when this sales tax was passed in ninety six, the mid nineties, the Bengals were valued by four just short of two hundred million dollars. They're now valued at four billion dollars. Okay, a matter of thirty years, how much the valuation of that franchise has gone up, Well, that's a significant, significant jump. And then certainly a big, a big, a significant chunk of that money. And what the money that the franchise has made has been off of the stadium deal. And so
don't don't, No one should be fooled by the fact. Yes, the NFL is the Golden Goose, it's it's crazy popular. It is a money printing machine, it's going to continue to be a money printing machine. The TV revenue is just insane. So, yes, there's a lot of money that's come from the NFL on football side of this, but there's no doubt about that a chunk of that money has come also from the good taxpayers of Hamilton County.
Well, in this agreement that we're currently operating on. Is the reason that that property or that that sales tax is still in place. We were promised sales tax relief a long time ago. Is part of the reason that we voted for it, and yet it remains. And the reason it remains is because all the obligations we as the Hamilton County taxpayers, have under the terms of conditions of the current lease agreement, which sucks.
Yeah. No, I mean we were promised a property tax rollback every single year of this of this deal, and it's I don't know how many. I don't have it in front of me, But what was the last time when a lease cherisse first came into office? So I think the last was at twenty twenty two? Maybe we got one and I don't think we've had one twenty twenty one, but I don't think we've had one since, right, And I haven't heard any buzz whether that's going to happen again. I could be wrong on that, and it's
it's happened. I knew it got a lot of news back when Alisha Resee made a big deal out of it because it hadn't happened for a long time, and that was when all the COVID money was coming in and the county was kind of flushed with money, and there was talk of from the administration side that no, we're not going to give a prep property tax rollback on this, and Alisha Resee really led the way on
getting on getting that property tax rollback. And I haven't heard anything about it since, so it may have happened, it just hasn't gotten the headlines or anything. But you that's something that should be happening. That was a promise. Now it wasn't a it wasn't an iron clad promise, legal legal promise, but yeah, that was a promise made by the politicians at the time, and you know, I think it should be followed through on amen very at the at the very least.
Well tea leaf reading. I'm going with the Bengals exercise their extension because the terms of conditions they have now are wonderful. They're not wanting to put in any more than one hundred and twenty million that they offered up front, and they won a lot of improvements to the ten of one hundred and eighty three million, one hundred and thirty million, which I suppose under the current conditions they're entitled to, which seems crazy. Oh, Jas, I know you're
going to follow this close to Jason Williams. Thank you so much for spending time with my listeners mean today on this topic. I'll look forward to having you back on the program again real soon, hopefully with some good news.
Hey, Brian, you and I both love talking about this. I'm always happy to join you anytime and chat it up. And it's as we say in the media world, the stadium thing is the gift that keeps on giving.
It is provides for good copies Cincinnati dot com. You'll find Jason what he you write. It's about take care of my friend. It's eight twenty two, fifty five cares of the talk station, Judging and Apolitano coming up.
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