Before we get started, we'd like to acknowledge the custodians of the land on which we record, and for me today that's the Gaddigel people of the urination.
And for me it's a roundered people of the cooler nation.
Hey, Brenda fans, my name's Mattie Mills.
And I'm Brook Blatton and we host another Nova podcast called First Things First.
And this week we interviewed our queen, Courtney Act and we thought it might be a chat you'd love to listen to.
Courtney dishes some goss about whether she'd go back on Drag Race, what reality TV shows she would do, and whether her and Rue have fixed the rift.
Now that is some good goss. And if you enjoyed the episode and you'd like to listen to more, feel free to come over to the First Things First podcast and catch us every week.
Enjoy all right, really have Courtney in studio.
I'm even in high drag, which is more than we ever did for Brenda. Call me so I love this.
Well, that's the first question I said, Is it Shane or is it Courtney?
Right, it's Courtney, And I will say I am in high drag, but I am wearing a wig with bangs, which to me is it's not quite drag. It's like because it's like gluing on a lace front. It's a lot for early in the morning. Totally, I'm wearing Doc Martins and bangs, and it's it's as minimal effort but still with maximum impact drag.
Well it's more than Valentina when she wore the mask.
Okay, let's drag references.
Always so excited to have you in studio. I mean, it's been a little while. How to be back here at Novo.
It's so lovely. I miss it. I miss Brenda call me. We had so much fun. And I love podcasting. I love listening to podcasts, and I love listening to like
friends chatting on podcasts. And this week I kind of realized I have this weird relationship with podcasts, Like if I listen to you too, I'm like, oh, I know these two people, and so I feel like I'm listening to like people that I know have a friendly conversation and I know details about your lives and know you personally, and so it's kind of you get that intimate experience. And then I was like, I think that's just what
everybody loves about listening to friendship podcast totally. For me, it's like I get to keep up on your lives even when I don't get to them. Yeah.
Yes.
But then for other people, they're not in them at all, and so it's say this parasocial relationship. But then for me, I don't know. It was just a weird moment where I realized that all podcasts that I love are actually my friends talking to each other. I love that.
Well, Courtney, You've been on so many shows, you know, reality TV shows over the years. Currently, there's a global All Styles of Drag Race.
And which was filmed in Columbia. Were you just WHOA?
Okay? Yeah? The first question that comes to mind was why A don't you want it?
Why aren't I on it?
You know?
What are you? And you're not telling us the next season?
I just got back from Columbia. No, that's what That's what I was doing.
You know what my drag name would be.
Both on a TV show without me.
I have a drag name that somebody should scoop up. A First Nation's drag queen, indie, genius.
Indie genious, indigenous, Yeah, indigenous. Who that's good?
Why doesn't anyone have that, Like, come on, somebody, take it's yours.
It's yours.
It'd be so bad to trust me.
No talking shit.
No, I would he'd love that.
I would love it, but I would be bad. I've tried to think, and it's terrible.
We don't have to lip sink. I'm a terrible lip syncer. Two. That's why I sing live there you go, And that would be even worse to me.
But yeah, tell me about global starts. Were you approached.
No, I've never been approached. I really loved being on drag Race and being there and filming it is like the most fun all of us. Adore Bunker, Darien, Ben, Milk, Laganga, Ga April, all of these names that we know and love, like it was such a golden era of drag Race. The personalities were amazing. It was fun to film it. But there's something about going back for me that is even going on drag Race in the first place. So I remember thinking like, is this a good idea? Do
I want to do this? So now it was a really great idea. But there's a certain amount of control that you give over to sort of the editors to World of Wonder in telling your story and your narrative, and I feel that, like I've gone back and watched Drag Race season six. At the time it was like
peak Twitter. I remember waking up every morning there was like nuanced characterizations about me that were sort of portrayed on Drag Race that I didn't feel aligned with who I was, and I kind of got sucked into the
comment section. Like I'd wake up every morning literally the first hour and the last hour of every day was scrolling the comments and then like were replying to people trying to like make them love me because they were like, why were you mean to Joscelyn Fox, which really, to ninety eight percent of people who have watched Drag Race is not even a memory or a consideration in their
head anymore. But it's those two percent of people who I think what happened there is they saw like Joscelyn who was like like portrayed as like a fan of me, and me being like rude or disrespectful to them, and it was sort of like this like weird hairline fracture of my core personality that like impacted how people and like, literally it doesn't matter now nobody even thinks about it, but still there's one comment on Everything Day with you.
Yeah, it really does.
Like I remember when I was filming The Bacher at All, I think it was even The Bachelor, and they had these like forum rooms and you would go on the forums they were trying to sleuth. Basically, they were slouthing for the answers of who ends up with the honey badger at the end.
And I was the same. I used to go on then and you were commenting.
Like can you imagine if someone left and just walked away from him?
Guys, and they had like weird names like bad girl, kiddy me or like something like it.
Was Christian mum, but then calling you a whore.
But there was this one person that was just so good at slothing that they just knew, like all the things that they would post were so accurate and were happening on the show. But they wrote this comment and told me that I was like really boring, and you know I wouldn't last like all this just really nicety stuff.
And it's like really stuck with me.
Boring.
Yeah, Like I'm okay with being fucking boring.
Like I don't try to be anything, you know, and if I'm boring, like fine, people get along with me, some people don't, and it sticks with you and you're like.
How stuck with you? Because whenever someone says something about being boring and I've seen your reaction, it's like it's a it's a visceral thing where you're like, yeah, that's so interesting.
Yeah. I think post Drag Race, watching it back was almost just like reckoning for me and like my disillusionment with my worldview at that time where I went in with it's really like self help, universe, Laura of attraction, kind of like vibe where I was like putting good things out there and then what I perceive that I got back with something negative and it kind of broke apart. I was like, wait, I was a good person, I did everything right. Why am I being punished in a
weird good way. It kind of set me free from that where I was like, oh, actually, in life, even if you're a good person, sometimes shit happens and that's okay and you just have to accept your reality as it is. But the thought to go back to Drag Race or All Styles or Global All Stars, it just feels like where I'm at in my career personally, I think it would be so much fun, but like, actually, there's almost like too much at risk to hand over
everything to somebody else. Now, I mean you will. I'm sure you'll see me on another reality show somewhere soon, because you know, Mama got to pay the bills. But I'd rather host a show or make documentaries or do interviews or podcasts or chat shows or something like that.
Why the fuck is Michelle Vassage hosting and not you? Come on? Yeah, I said it, I mean, can do it in Canada. You would be amazing. But as a question, is there any rift between you and.
Rue, I don't know. I mean there's never been. I'm definitely on like the Bad Kids list, like from I'm off the Christmas card list, although I did make it back on. There is a literal Christmas card list. I remember I wasn't on it for years, and then all of a sudden I got my World of Wonder like block of RuPaul chocolate Christmas card and I was like, oh, I'm back on the Christmas card list. Maybe I still learn. Maybe I just moved and I didn't update my address.
I just think that you would have been a great host and it would have been such an amazing representation for our country as you know, a drag queen who is you know, known as like one of the pinnacle drag queens from Australia to host the series. I think it was a no brainer. But yeah, but I mean, you've done more than drag race. You've done Dancing with the Stars.
You've done the mass sing.
Yeah, tell us about that dancing. I've been and this is a testament to anyone on Dancing with the Stars. But somebody told me don't do Dancing with the Stars because it will end your career. It obviously hasn't.
No, why would it end your career?
I know, it's ridiculous, what a stupid slogan. I think it was someone from Channel nine, But tell me that. Yeah, the experience there and was it fun?
It was your partner.
His name's Josh. We're still best friends, Josh Keith. He's he's yeah, he's hot and lovely and amazing and it's so much fun. Like the thing that is fun about it is you are for six to eight hours a day for fifteen weeks. Is that long season one? Because it's twelve episodes twelve weeks. And then I think then we had rehearsal rehearsals. I think it was five weeks of rehearsals, so let's have seventeen weeks.
That's a long time.
No time for anything else, And like, when in life have you ever dedicated eight hours a day, five days a week to anything anything. Yeah, if you loved jobs, I guess we are boring people.
But like, yeah, that sounds amazing. I mean dancing though, for that many hours a day it must be grueling. Did you like have any many bees? Did you break down throughout the series?
No, my body kind of you know, there was a few things during Contemporary Week. I remember getting like a bruised rib or a crack trib or something or rather, but physically it was amazing, Like your fitness also something that people never think about bor and dancing it's basically like hugging someone. So you're dancing with them for like eight hours a day. It's like being hugged for eight hours, and there's something quite lovely and nourishing. One of my
love languages is touched. So I'm just like dancing with Josh each day, just like holding each other, dancing away. It's very delightful.
Well, that's beautiful. Would you go on any news shows.
Like would you write your own show?
Oh, I've been pitching brook. Oh I did that Channel ten pilot season. We had Courtney's Closet. We made the pilot we love very well received. But no, you know what I've realized, it's that thing with like every meeting that I go to. I was in the UK having meetings, in the US having meetings, everybody says, oh, it's really tough right now, everybody struggling. They want things that will
definitely work. And so what I've realized, which is kind of been a theme of my career, is that sometimes rather than waiting for other people to say yes, you just go out and do it by yourself, which is where like YouTube, podcasting, these sorts of things are all really like of great tools to like young creatives or any creatives of any age, Like you can do things cheaply enough that you can get them online and just
get the seed out there and start it going. So I went to the shop and I bought a whole bunch of new lights and things, and I've started sort of getting back on a YouTube train just at home in the drag room, which is fun, beautiful.
Yeah, I feel like Courtney's Closet needs to be an actual, legitimate like series, whether it's on YouTube or something.
I fucking loved that episode with Luke.
Yeah, and it's now married to Amy Amy, which is one of my friends who was on my season, and I'm like, fuck, that was just like so wholesome and so like people need to see that.
Ship, you know what. That day that we filmed, and I haven't asked Luke this, but that day that we filmed, he was going on a date, like a first date, and I in my mind, I've just decided that it was Amy, but I don't know if it was. But I just, for some reason, I want to be like the inceptions.
You injected me with confidence.
Yeah, that's just called narcissism. Yes, in this business.
With a bit of the show that I think of his survivor would you do it?
Yeah, as Courtneyet, you get in drag on the first day stay. Yeah, it's like going to Mardi Gras and like leaving Mardy go at eight am when the sun comes up and you're still in drag. You've been on the dance for all night, like sweating, pashing people, and you're just like you're weeks, slightly askew your beds, poking through your lipsticks, all smudge, but you are still there. I feel like that should be for all.
It's all drag queens and like it. It's like twelve drag queens and then not allowed to get out of that.
That's it. We have this rule for the Diva Awards back in back in the day when we used to you know, party. The Diva Awards are on a Monday night, and the rule was nobody gets out of drag ever, So you would go out and I remember one night or one day or one day after the night, I remember turning to Vanity and I was like, oh, did you get out of drag? And she was like no, And I was like, oh, oh, I think you won. You didn't get out of it. Like she physically didn't
get out of drag. She'd just been in drag so long that like the drag left her like it had like rubbed her himself. Yeah.
Oh my, I wanted to talk to you about like a recent thing that's in the media about the census. Oh yeah, and you know, obviously it's been a conversation in the public. You were on the project. I think talking about it. Why are you so passionate about pushing that?
Well, I think that Okay. So the Census Soviet that happens every five years in Australia to get sort of a snapshot of the Australian people and understanding who we are, where we live, and therefore how we can allocate resources and funds. And we kind of have these sort of ideas or percentages of like how many LGBTQ people there
are in Australia. But often people who are detractors are sort of like, well, there's no we don't know this, it's not official information, and or they're like, oh, you're too freeingjoy, you're too niche. We're not going to bother with that, or we're not going to allocate resources because we don't actually know. And then the census is the
perfect time to gather that data. But then so the Labor Government had agreed to include questions about sexuality and gender identity in the census, and then they sort of backpedal and withdrew them, and so a that just sucked because I think recording that data is really important. I think that having an understanding of our LGBTQ people are in Australia as well, really helps because like we are like, okay, let's say there's ten percent, and like do we just
distribute that evenly? Like, actually, are there more people in regional areas who need more help or more money or is it all in the city, because like people would have you believe that all queer people live in Oxford Street. Yeah, of course, And so having a better understanding I think is this really important. I think just from a fundamental
level of visibility, Yeah, every household in Australia. It sounds so weird and so like insignificant, but I think when you're a young queer person or any sort of minority who isn't used to seeing themselves, when all of a sudden you see yourself in an official document and you have the opportunity to sort of check that box. I remember actually Making Markell. She wrote an article about being mixed race, and she said that there was a box that was like white black, like it was kind of
like pretty rudimentary boxes. And she was like, oh, I don't know which box to tick because my mum is black and my dad is white. Yeah, And she said to the teacher's the little girl in school here and she said that to the teacher, and the teacher was like, well, honey, you tick white because that's what you look like. And in that moment for her, there was like, but this is my mum. You want me to deny Yeah, my mother and half as to who I am because of
like trying to fit into the right box. And her dad told her, you draw your own box, like you And there was something about the idea of like ticking those boxes and filling in those things that really helps us to feel seen and understood in who we are. And so I think for LGBTQ people seeing ourselves on the census and other people seeing that question on the census is a really powerful thing.
Yeah. Yeah, I definitely think it's First Nations people. We've had to tick a box most majority of our lives. You know, that whole idea of are you first Nations Aboriginal, Torrestraate islander that's what it was worded as, or Australian. You know, there was always like there's a difference. I never thought of it as denying a part of myself because my mummy is white. But I can understand where
she's coming from. When she spoke about that but I think the census is obviously crucial, including that they've gone back on it right now, Yeah, so they're going to include it.
They went back first with the sexuality question and said yes, we will ask people about their sexuality, and it was sort of like, oh, that's a good step in the right direction, and then we can sort of continue the pressure. People signed a petition a Quality Australia did a lot of amazing work, and then they announced that they would be including questions about gender as well, which is great.
So we just have more data. The questions about intersex characteristics aren't included, but those weren't a part of the sort of agreed question and so that is something that is still to be worked on for the future. But I think having gender and sexuality included in the census is just a great thing.
Well, I think you know, there's three percent of the population that is first nation and that's just a million people. So in my mind, there is way more than a million homos out there.
I agree.
I wanted to talk to you about like it's a little bit left to field, but I wanted to talk to you about recently you spoke about like exploring your masculinity and that side of things. Is that something that you've like recently discovering more of or is it like something that you're prioritizing more of. Why is it suddenly, you know, popped up for you.
Well, I think masculinity was always something that I pushed against. I always thought that I wasn't masculine enough, and so there was sort of like a shame about that, and then sort of turning eighteen coming out still didn't feel like I was masculine enough, but then found that drag was an opportunity for me to express femininity in like
a compartmentalized way. But then as a boy, despite not being masculine, would still always try to be more masculine and always felt like I was either performing masculinity and I was failing at that. So I think as I've gotten older and I've become more comfortable with the femininity and the masculinity, I've realized that even just straight culture and if I put masculinity and like heteronormative things all
in one box, I was always just like ill. And I think now that I'm more comfortable in who I am, I don't feel threatened by those things, and so I'm interested in kind of exploring what masculinity means for me, and I think rather than trying to be masculine or perform masculinity or having shame about that, I'm just like, oh, well, who am I and just kind of like embracing all the parts of me, whether that's feminine or masculine.
I love that. Is there anyone that you're inspired by that does that, that you can see that does it?
Well? Well, that's the thing that I find really interesting. I'm actually doing a talk a panel at south By
Southwest about masculinity and the idea. I think the title that I'm working with is something about positive role models masculinity positive role models, because there's lots of toxic masculinity role models like You're Andrew Taits and your Joe Rogan's and Jordan Peterson sort of advocates for a lot of that sort of stuff, and I think all of these young men, particularly straight men, are finding a message in those people, and I think a lot of that messaging
can be toxic. So I'm like, masculinity isn't bad, but toxic masculinity is bad. And I think that sort of the fragile parts of masculinity like to misrepresent those conversations and say like, oh, you're not allowed to be a man anymore, and masculinity is toxic, And it's like no, no, no, masculinity is not toxic. Toxic masculinity is toxic, and what is positive masculinity? And therefore, who are the role models? And I think I've been doing lots of research. I
was listening to like men's podcasts. It's so horrible. It was actually so horrible, yes, and like listening and watching documentaries and trying to like listen to like those folks on that side of the fence. And I realized that a lot of the content was about role modeling and that they were just giving young men a sense of belonging and a sense of community like maybe what we find in the queer community or like watching drag race, or like whatever it is they are finding in listening
to these podcasts. And it was like being a part of something. Yeah, like yeah, it was like a big brother, like as in like to be a brother to someone. It was like here's how to get your hair cut, and here's how to like everybody looks good with the fade. And these are different types of hair products, and it was like beauty influences for blokes almost, and I just realized that, yeah, a lot of young men are just
looking for role models. And so I know that I'm not a person that young straight blokes are going to listen to about masculinity, but perhaps as someone who had a complicated relationship to gender growing up and is sort of exploring those topics that maybe I'm now looking for, Well, who are the positive masculinity role models? So that's sort of what the south By Southwest talk will be all about.
I love that. Yeah, it's such a nuanced conversation too, because, like I think, our experience as queen men is different
to you know, those who identify as straight. And I think that, like sometimes I in the past have definitely had battles in my own mind about, you know, how to be feminine or to allow my feminine because I'm quite a feminine man naturally, and then I have this other masculine side that sometimes is a bit of a facade when I'm in a room full of other men, you know, that I feel like I need to bring to the table to be accepted.
And hey, it gets all real straight Madie, I.
Mean, yeah, it's a weird.
It is. It's a weird thing that happens for me, especially when you know in this business a TV. It's like going in I call them pink dicks and you're talking to you know, white straight elderly men about roles and jobs and my pink dick syndrome. All of a sudden it drops in and I'm this straight, you know, masculine identity in this room, and I'm like, if that's not me, you know, there's a force there that feels that makes me feel like that. But yeah, I love that.
Where is the conversation at and how can we be a part of it?
It's at the ic C. It's part of south By Southwest, which I guess if you google.
Yeah, it'll be online.
Yeah, T going TED talk. I haven't, and I've I've been asked, and I've thought about it, and I always try and like work out like what my TED talk would be, and I definitely think it would be about gender and sexuality and masculinity. So I feel like maybe the south By Southwest Talk is like dipping my toe in the water. It's a panel with some other speakers and yeah, I don't know. I just I'm always thinking about, like how do you be effective rather than how do
you be right? Like I think it's easy to get up on my soapbox and point to finger. But I mean even last night I was at the Ensemble, the Ensemble Theater in Kurubilly. Yeah, yeah, thanks. I was like over the other side of the bridge, the other way, and I was watching a play. And the audience there are not even predominantly like one hundred percent like retirees, white silver hair, and yeah, like a very older audience who I presume a role of a similar lived experience,
interested in similar things. And the play that we were watching, the Queens Nanny Had, it was just a few it was actually it was the word colonizer was said twice in jest, and I thought that word is probably a trigger for people in this room now that a part of that generation and sort of like a part of that narrative. But I could imagine that like all comments on like masculinity or like male privilege, I can imagine both of those topics in that room would get a
grown or an eyeball roley. And I always think like and they were so subtly used, and it wasn't like aggressive or finger pointy or finger waggy. But I thought, how do you get people to incrementally like change their opinions? Like how do you what's the saying about, like hiding the something in the vegetable, adding the vegetables in the dessert.
Or the meat or the meat LOFE.
I don't know something. But like we're all on board and we're like making art and commentary, which sometimes can be a bit almost like not self congratulatory, but like like if you're already in the circle, then how do we get to the Coldplay fans?
Absolutely?
And I feel that because what happens is when I talk about representation and mainstream representation, sometimes it's an echo chamber because I'm talking to Mota. Oh I'm on n ITV. Now It's like I'm preaching to the converted.
How do you go out?
How do you go outside of that box? It is like a task for people who want to make change, But I think there are ways to do it, and I think art.
Is, Yeah, I think art is one of them. The thing that I come back to when I like, I sit there and I think about it and I think about, like what I would want to say if I was. I used to have this thing when I lived in the UK, if I was ever on like Piers Morgan's show, because I got asked to go on a bunch but I always said no, Okay, So I'd always have these imagine Mary conversations in my head and I'd always.
Get the shower argument.
Yeah yeah, And I always got to the end and I was like, the reason that you're saying no is because there's actually no point in engaging these people on their line of questioning. And the best way forward is
through positive storytelling. It's through role modeling, having positive storytelling that platforms like LGBTQ, people, First Nations people, you know, empowering stories for women that aren't almost like they're not reactionary to the patriarchal gaze, where it's just like people thriving and being themselves and then the people watching sort of seeing the shared humanity in that.
It's living you want to see the world, right.
Yeah.
The funny thing is it doesn't feel like you're doing anything. When you're like arguing with somebody and telling them why they're wrong. You feel really like, oh, I really done the work today, totally just having fun and living your life and telling wonderful stories about your community. It almost doesn't feel like you've done anything. But I actually think in a weird way, in the long term, I feel like that does more.
Because droplets in an ocean, yeahs like it's just a ripple, you know, it just start to filter.
Out, it does it. Sometimes I doesn't feel like it's happening fast enough. But I think that just telling more positive stories and like doing that positive role modeling is really the thing that changes.
And I love when you have a plethora of like people in a community. You need your extremists, you know, you need people who allowed like you know, I think of lydia in our community. I'm like, I don't agree with everything you say, but gee, you make some noise, yeah, you know, and like we need those people, and we need the people who are just doing there. Yeah, you know day to day sort of like you need to have.
A shit day to have a good day, Like you need the days to fucking heaven, so you appreciate the good ones.
Yeah, And I think those extreme views and those people who are like further like we probably follow like people who are a lot more radical than I do. And I agree with a lot of the things they say, and I feel inspired by those people, and I take part of their message, and then I think of myself here sort of closer to the middle and being like, all right, how do I they're pushing the boundary feather that way, which creates more space in the middle for me.
How do I then also sort of listen to what they're saying and incorporate some of their messaging in ways that people who I talk to might understand.
Well, I think over the years I've seen that you've been, you know, a great daylight of First nation people. It's started way back on Rupu's drag race. Let's do a full circle moment with my flag.
That was the correct way around, the correct way around.
You were the first to bring you our flag to an international you know stage, And I think from that moment, and you know, throughout your career you've always championed first nation's voices. What is it about using your platform to do that not just for first nations but people outside of your own lived experience. Why is it really important for you?
I think that as a queer person, I have come to understand, probably through my own healing or as i've like understood myself more. Actually, Brene Brown has a quote that's like, empathy cannot exist where shame does. And so when I was younger and had shame about my identity, I probably wasn't being very good at being empathetic to
anybody with a struggle different to my own. And I think that's why, particularly in the gay male community, the white gay male community, we have sort of seen like sexual racism and things like that play such a part, and whilst we are part of a minority, we often aren't able to reach across the aisle and be allies to other people, like white gay men can particularly sort of reinforce some of those negative ideas. Sometimes hashag not
a white gay men. And so I think that as I kind of healed my shame, I then saw that there was intersections of being queer that were there was like a shared experience, and that's what I love about being queer. So I was like, oh, queer First Nations people, we share our queerness and there's something about our shared
queer identity that helps me understand other people's experiences. And then I'm like, I'm able to sort of use that as an empathetic connection to someone's experience who I don't understand. I can't understand, but I listen and I believe and I see that other people's allies ship was important in me getting the liberation that I now have, and therefore I can be a part in being a good ally to other people, particularly First Nations people here in Australia. Yeah.
I love to see it, and I think, you know you obviously continue to do that. So thank you, thank you for that. Thank you, We appreciate it. But thank you so much for coming on our pod. It's cool to have you back in the country. It's nice to see you again. I mean, what is happening in the future for you, Like, what's what's the next thing for you? Before we wrap up.
Yeah, I'm excited because I'm going up to Brisbane, my hometown, for the Melt Festival, which is this open access queer arts festival. It goes for three weeks. It basically means anybody is welcome to put in a show, but it's like a festival of queer art culture happening in Brisbane from October twenty third. Yes, for three weeks. There's so many events, Like there's the people that I know in love like Harms is doing a show, and much of Borrow's doing a show, but there's plenty of other really
great shows. And it's culminating with a river Pride parade. Oh so like Mardi Gras, hop happens on the street in Brisbane. They're doing a pride parade on the river on.
Boats like the Olympics, like the Gay Olympics, but hopefully.
Like with less complaints and less range.
Yeah and less Now it was a little bit. Oh, I hope Lady Gaga is flying into.
Perform No, I am you are there, you go. I'm currently getting the dress made. I'm like, how many meters of bellowing chiffon is safe to have flowing off the end of a ship.
At least five?
At least five. But yeah, if you're in Brisbane or if you're in that area, like look up the Mount Festival because there's so many like fun, queer, cabaret, theater, music, Spencer Tunic as well. If you've ever wanted to get naked on the.
Story Bridge, I ever wanted to get naked in general.
In general, you can be photographed by Spencer Tunic as a part of one of those mass where if you don't know who Spencer Tunic is. He does those photos where like thousands of people get naked and beach.
I just couldn't do it. I mean, I just couldn't do it. I'm like, oh, I just I just think I'm you know, I'm too much of a grower, not.
A show avenue same.
I'm like, it's just wouldn't be my vibe.
I'm the same.
I can do it taped, but then I feel like I'm cheating. I feel like the whole point is about like liberation, but maybe it's about baby steps.
I do want to say, you know, Brisbane is a good place to have a good time. So October twenty third.
Yeah, go all the way through the next three weeks.
We'll probably pop it in the show notes.
Yeah, people can do that.
And then the River Pride Parade is on that final Saturday, the ninth of November.
In Sydney.
Oh, Brooks should be fine and go for the River Preade.
Come, let's get on the boat. Speak to Harry.
Call it the brown Snake.
The brown Snake is the Brisbane River.
All right, Well, thank you so much, Courtney.
Love to see you, lovely to talk to you bout