Hey, guys, Saga and Crystal here.
Independent media just played a truly massive role in this election, and we are so excited about what that means for the future of this show.
This is the only place where you can find honest perspectives from the left and the right that simply does not exist anywhere else.
So if that is something that's important to you, please go to Breakingpoints dot com. Become a member today and you'll get access to our full shows, unedited, ad free, and all put together for you every morning in your inbox.
We need your help to build the future of independent news media and we hope to see you at Breakingpoints dot com.
Let's talk about Iran, shall we. Let's go ahead and start with this.
We have got President Trump threatening to bomb Iran.
Let's take a listen.
You said that quote. If they don't make a deal, there will be bombing.
It will be bombing the likes of which they have never seen before. If they don't make a deal, we're going to bomb them. Okay, well, bad news for everybody, because let's go and put this up there on the screen. Things continue to go in a very bad direction here. Donald Trump yesterday tweeting or truthing I guess is how he says that the Iran backed who the terrorists, have been decimated by the relentless strikes over the past two weeks.
Not true.
Many of their fighters and leaders are no longer with us. We hit them every day and night, harder and harder. Their capabilities that threaten shipping in the region are rapidly being destroyed. Our attacks will continue until they are no longer a threat to freedom of navigation. The choice for the Hoothies is clear, stop shooting at US ships and we will stop shooting at you. Otherwise, we have only just begun and the real pain is yet to come
for both the Hoothies and their sponsors in Iran. So remember that little signal Chat debate, all of that, that little signal Chat debate that preceded the first of what has now been a week or so of strikes. The attacks from the Hoothies have not continued, not stopped, literally at all. There does not appear to be any endgame. Trump said that he would hold Iran responsible. Now, I mean, he's basically as I think we said that here at the time.
Now you're stuck between a.
Rock and hard place because you issued the threat, you said, you will pay for this, and they didn't stop at all. As we also have tried to talk about here is what they don't have nearly the amount of control that we you know, in the press or whatever, and that America seems.
To believe that these people do.
It's ridiculous that, yes, what do they provide them some weaponry and a little bit of support. Yeah, they've also been an independent Ish type organization fighting against the Saudis, you know and all them for more than a decade.
Yeah, they have their own capability.
And about these people survived literal bombing, starvation, like you think that these missiles are you know, miraculously can just solve the problem like this. There's like a theory that, oh, we the Biden administration didn't bomb them enough despite looking at the statistics, and bomb couldn't solved this. The Saudis would have solved it, you know, eight years ago. So yeah, it's it's not good because you're setting us up for confrontation.
And as he said at the original he said that we will bomb Iran if they don't make a deal. Well guess what they said, Yeah, we don't really want to talk to you, right.
Now, yeah, that was the argument that was basically made the signal chat if I'm remembering correctly, of like, oh, well, the Biden administration, they just let them get away with it, completely ignoring the way that the Biden administration pursued like basically the same strategy.
And now, I mean we already see.
The results, like they've been bombing them in whatever more aggressive way and leveling apartment buildings and whatever, and has it worked. No, of course not could put D three up on the screen. In terms of Iran's response, So NBC News says Trump's threat to bomb Ran would spark retaliation, according to their Supreme Leader around Supreme Leader Ayatola Ali Kamani said Monday, the US will receive a strong blow if it acts on Trump's threat to bomb Tehran unless
it reaches a new nuclear deal with Washington. Trump reiterated his threat on Sunday. That's what we were talking about, and Supreme Leader says the enmity from the US and Israel has always been there. They threaten to attack us, which we don't think is very probable, but if they commit any mischief, they will surely receive a strong reciprocal blow.
And if they are thinking of causing sedition inside the country as in past years, the Iranian people themselves will deal with them, speaking to you know some of the theoretical stirring up of domestic unrest within Iran that they believe that we are feilty of.
Maybe we are, I don't really know for sure.
Well, this is the problem, is that we have set ourselves up now for potential confrontation where the President has spoken out and said if we don't make a deal, then.
We're going to have bombs.
Now, we also have an idiot national security advisor who continues to be in his job, who constantly is advocating for bombing Iran, and is somebody who we saw in the chat who's a brain dead moron talking about freedom of navigation, who obviously is trying to set us up for some sort of future military confrontation and quote holding them responsible as Trump has said. So at a certain point we have to take Trump and them seriously. And
you are in a tight time frame. You have the Gaza stuff, you have the Gaza war which is popping off. Things are only going to get worse if we see mass expulsion, which we talkalked about previously, then you add on top of that with the Iran section, and you look at all of the people in the administration at the White House like Mike Wallace, Marco Ruby, and others who have talked a big game about bombing Iran, and
what else can you conclude? And you see here from the Trump from the Iranian response, where they have their own domestic political situation. US pulling out of the deal burned them at a domestic political level and made it much more difficult for any Iranian leader to try and pursue that in terms of their own internal politics. So you really have two things coming here. I guess all you can hope for is that we're all bluffing. But that's not a good hope. That's not a good bet to make.
I think also, what was revealing within the signal chat is you definitely do not get much sense that there's going to be much pushback on whatever the hawkish direction of the Trump administration was. There was the only voice that raised any concerns at all was Jadie Vance, and he quickly backs down once he realizes there's no one else in this chat that is Jeffrey Goldberg is not coming to bat for me on my side on this one.
Are the people who are leaking to Jeffrey Goldberg going to go to bat against taking any sort of hawkish actions and escalatory actions. Quincy Institute for Responsible state Craft over on their blog, which is excellent by the way, they write really fantastic analyzes that are that are definitely worth reading. We can put this up on the screen. They have been tracking the increasing beating of the war drums, and the headline here is the war of the war
over war with Iran has just begun. Trump says he wants a deal, but stakeholders in and outside of his administration are pushing for conflict. The first paragraph here reads, in recent weeks, many of the same neo conservative voices who pushed the US into Iraq are calling for strikes on Iran. Groups like the Foundation for Defensive Democracies and the Washington Institute for Gear East Policy are once again promoting confrontation, claiming that there may never be a better
time to act. But this is a dangerous illusion that risk derailing what Donald Trump himself says he wants a deal, not another disaster war in the Middle East. I think that's a little pretty charitable to Trump, given that he's said he wants a deal but also threatened to bomb them. But you know, they're trying to write this in a way that would appeal to him and potentially, you know,
some of his allies within the administration. But in any case, I thought it was important that they were tracking the way that these influential think tanks within Washington were increasingly pushing towards this confrontation, because as much as we would like those people to be irrelevant, they are not. They have a lot of allies within this administration, within every administration, who are listening to the case and making a similar case internally.
Well, what I like about this Quincy Institute article is that it points out the foundation for DEFNDS democracies, the Washington Near Institute for Peace, and the op ed war that's currently happening in the Wall Street Journal and elsewhere to shape a media environment. What people need to understand here too is, you know, when we previously had talked about the Jewish Insider publication and a lot of the war against these Erica first more appointees, people who are more restrainers.
Do you know why they do that?
It's all about shaping the environment to make it so that those people are uncomfortable in their meetings, or that people can use it as an excuse to silence them, or even you know, if their names are mentioned in a policy document, to begin to attack, and then to create this alternative ecosystem in the journal and on Twitter, you know, Barry Weiss and all these other folks who can just gin up the impression for a lot of these people that the public is actually on their side.
So look right now, I mean, are we going to war with Iran? Let's really hope not. But the point is is that the ground is laid for something to pop off. Is that Trump has now made several decisions and the people around him are obviously advocating for this. There are off ramps. Steve Whitkoff, Send Steve over there, Send him to Iran. He made some comments in this Trump Tucker Carlson interview apparently which were noticed by the Iranians and they might be willing to talk with them.
But watch how Steve got sidelined by the Israelis. I mean, they attacked the sh shit out of him. The reason why this ceasfire fell apart, I believe is because they were successfully able to Sideline Witcough and Adam into the same with a lot of the other voices in Washington. I mean, remember the guy who said we're not a client state of Israel. He's been you know, he's with the disappeared, he's down in that ice facility, Like I wouldn't want to be him, not for the rest of
my life. No, it's not funny, but it is like there's something to it. Right, he hasn't been on television since and you are watching, like as those people in the war on that is successful, and then the administration voices and all these other people. The more there's no accountability for folks like Mike Waltz, it would be it's very easy to see many of the mistakes of the first term get repeated and then you're never coming back from that well.
And most of these people internally like they're you know, they're strivers.
They want to stay in good standing.
And they see the way that that dude, Adam Bowler is same that's was disappeared, and the way Steve Whitcoff was sidelined. So they're watching, they're reading this leaves of you know, who's able to sustain their position, and Mike Waltz with this giant buck up still gets to stay in place. So they're reading all of those tea leaves, just last thing in this block because it's.
Just too good. Can't resist.
So you guys know, there's a number of special elections today. There's the Wisconsin Supreme Court one. Ryan and Emiley will have full coverage of what happens in this. And then there's these two Florida special elections. One to film Matt Gates's seat, which looks like that's done deal for the Republicans. I don't see any nervousness around that one. But the other one to fill Mike Waltz's seat, has had a
little more intrigue. You want to set this up, Sager, of this gentleman who is looking to replace Mike Walts on the Republican side in a plus thirty Trump district. And now this race is apparently close. I still think the Republican is very likely to win here, let's be clear, but the fact that there's nervousness about this at all is totally insane.
Let's go and put it up there on the screen. Senator Randy Fine, he is a state senator.
There.
Some of you may know that name if you spend any time online, guys, go ahead and put D five please up on the screen just so people can take a look. So here Trump says, America First Patriot, Randy Fine is running to represent the wonderful people of Florida sixth Congressional District. Highly successful. Blah blah blah. He has my complete total endorsement. Now let's look at some past statements for mister Fine. Quote, it's time for Israel to
destroy Iran. This was on October first of twenty twenty four. Bombs away. Go to the next one, so you guys can see here he is.
He put this out. He's not even a shame.
This is a photo of him in his office where he has the Israeli flag prominently next to the American flag. I would note actually the American or the Israeli flag is actually in a more prominent position in the picture than the American flag.
And then second, American first Patriot.
There's somebody who says you should be ashamed of yourself. How do you sleep at night with a photo of a dead baby in Gaza, to which he required applies quite well. Actually, thanks for the pick. So that's who we're dealing with. That's who is mister america First Patriot and gets to some of our debate earlier about the whole Anti Semitism task Force and how this term has become effectively meaningless in the Trump administration. There's major war
obviously online. There's a lot of influencers who are willing to call him out. But let's be honest. I mean, Trump has endorsed this guy, and just the other day he endorsed Lindsay Graham.
This is the reality of who we're dealing with here.
There's no ideological consistency. It's just about who, you know, he thinks is going to be the most loyal soldier. And so yeah, Randy Fine is america First Patriot, even as he's you know, got his Israeli flagged, I go front and center and is monstrously totally comfortable with babies being killed in Gaza. This week, Elon Musk took time on of his vote buying spree to announce a new
lie about supposed security fraud. Now, this lie happens to kill two birds with one stone, serving as it does, to feed his attacks on social security, which he of course derives as a Ponzi scheme and his attacks on our electoral system, portraying it as being rife with fraud. Take a listen to Elon's longtime close associate and new
Social Security official Antonio Grassias. He is claiming that millions of non citizens are receiving Social Security cards and that the existence of these immigrant social Security cards is proof that they're receiving fraudulent benefits and that Democrats were allowing non citizens to vote in order to rig elections. Listen to what he has to say, and then I'll tell you the facts on the other side.
This is what jumped out at us when we saw these numbers. We're like, what is this? In twenty one you see two hundred and seventy thousand people goes all the way to two point one million and twenty four These are non citizens that are getting Social K numbers.
Yeah, this is a mind blowing charge. People sometimes think that under the Biden administration that he was simply asleep with the switch. Who wasn't a sleep They weren't a sleep at the switch. It was a massive, large scale program to import as many illegals as possible, ultimately to change the entire voting map. Of the United States and disenfranchise the American people and make it a permanent, deep blue, one party state from which there would be no escape.
Look, if I hadn't seen this myself, I'm not trying to believe it. I went through it myself and mapped it. And Elon is right. This is true that defaults in the system, from Social Security to all of the benefit programs have been set to max inclusion, max pay for these people, and minimum collection. That's what's happening. We found one point three million of them already on Medicaid as
an example. We've gone through on every benefit program we went through, we found groups from this particular group of people, this five point five million people in those benefit programs. And then what was really really disturbing us was why we're asking ourselves why. And so we actually just took a sample and looked at voter registration records, and we found people here registered to vote in this population, Yes, ed who did vote, And we found some by sampling
that actually did vote. And we have referred them to prosecution at the Home mad Security Investigation Service. Yeah, already already, that is already happening.
All right, So you should take all of those claims with a lot of skepticism. But here's what you should know about the facts with regard to immigrants and Social Security. So legal immigrants can apply for Social Security numbers is through a program. One of the programs is called Enumeration beyond Entry, so they can work and pay taxes, which, of course you want people to be paying taxes. Here
is what those particular Social Security cards look like. You can see that they say valid for work only with DHS authorization, meaning that they explicitly bar voting intellections, which is of course a right reserved in our constitution for citizens.
Having a Social.
Security card also doesn't guarantee you social Security benefits. Only those who qualify pay into the program are then eligible for benefits. Undocumented immigrants pay billions of dollars into Social Security every year, but they don't receive Social Security numbers and they are not eligible for benefits. Grossius also claims that some of these non citizens with Social Security numbers are voting and have been referred for prosecution.
I'll believe that when I see it.
Republicans have been on a decades long quest to find mass voter fraud, especially among non citizens, and undocumented immigrants, and they have completely failed. You might recall in Trump's first term, he was very salty that Hillary Clinton had won the popular vote, so he claimed that millions of illegal immigrants had voted illegally for him, and he went so far as to appoint Chris Kobock to a commission that was charged with locating this fraud.
They completely failed.
In the end, the commission quietly closed up shop without finding a single instance of illegal alien voting, let alone the millions that Trump claimed. A draft of that commission's final report was revealed. It contained nothing more than a list of blank categories of potential fraud. Not one instance had ever actually been identified. Now, Elon's lies about social security and voter fraud, though, are non out stupidity. They're part of a larger coordinated plan, the other piece of
which clicked into place last week. So somewhat lost the mid last week's Signal Gate debacle, Trump signed an executive order on elections. Now, the bulk of what the order demanded is actually illegal. In particularly, the order requires that voters not only attest to their citizenship, which they must already do, but also provide some documentary proof, something like a passport. This is directly at odds with the National
Voter Registration Act. In fact, Arizona previously tried to add such a requirement and had their laws struck down by the Supreme Court in a seven to two ruling. What's more, Constitution makes clear that what election rules are not left to the states are to be handled by Congress, not by the executive branch. But what really caught my eye on the executive order wasn't so much the proof of citizenship requirement, which, like I said, is probably going to
be blocked from being fully implemented. It was the announcement that Trump is putting Elon Musk's doge at the center of our elections. So the TLDR is this, This executive order would put the richest man on the planet, who is obviously a radicalized partisan, in a position to say who gets a vote and who does not get a vote, and his say would be enforced by a Trump administration that has already proved itself ready and willing to put
states through hell in order to force their compliance. It's a playbook for shifting the country from a democracy towards what some experts call a hybrid regime. Where we may still have democratic institutions in form but not really truly in substance. Now, Elon's repeated lies about non citizens voting and Trump's executive order giving Elons say over who can vote, or a coordinated effort to hobble democracy. All right, here's the key provision. You can see it there up on
the screen. Apartment of Homeland Security and coordination with the DOSEE Administrator shall review each state's publicly available voter registration list and available records concerning voter list maintenance activities as required by this section, alongside federal immigration databases and state records requested through subpoenaware necessary and authorized by law for
consistency with federal requirements. So what that means in plain language is that it's directing the DOGE administrator to review every state's voter registration list using subpoenas if necessary, to force the states to hand over their data to identify lists of supposedly non compliant voters. Now, similar efforts have been tried at a smaller scale on the state level, and so we can know what the expected results would be.
Here's investigative journalist Greg Pallis talking about how state efforts to match voter rolls and make sure the same people weren't registered in multiple states has ended up in practicality, in mass disenfranchisement.
One of the things that they want to apparently want to resurrect is a Chris Koback. Again, this is the right wing ag who's really the brains behind the Heritage Foundation and Trump administration attack on voter rolls. And he had a program which was struck down by the courts, and I'll take some credit for that because of my
exposey and Rolling Stone and called interstate crosscheck. Now what this is is they take lists of voters from two states, Arizona and Texas, and they say, oh, Jose Rnandez voted in Arizona, and there's a Jose Nandez voted in Texas. It must be the same guy voting twice. So we're going to remove their registrations because we have a double registered voter. Now you might say, well, Jose Ornandez is a common name, it's not necessarily for a Republican. But
so here's the story. So they were literally they Chris Kobach created lists cross check lists of names state to state. For example, they said one guy named James Brown, and Georgia voted two hundred and thirty eight times. I'm not making this up, by the way, So they remove all these James Brown's, they know what they're doing, by the way. Hit fun fact, ninety percent of them, of all of the one hundred most common surnames in America, ninety percent our majority minority names.
So what's more, Kansas also instituted that proof of citizenship requirement back in twenty eleven. The goal the stated goal was to root out mass voting by immigrants. They found next to none of that, but they did keep thirty one thousand eligible US citizens from being able to cast ballots. That was twelve percent of the entire population that was trying to register during the relevant period. Now dojan Ai.
Obviously they could put those efforts on steroids. And remember Elon's mindset here, his ketamine adult brain thinks he's on some civilizational mission to save humanity. He has already demonstrated his willingness to do anything from letting the elderly starve without social Security payments to sacrificing kids with HIV in Africa, to define court orders and running roughshod over our constitutional system.
In order to accomplish his goals.
Now, the same way Doje hacked into the Treasury, dough has been given now the green light to hack into our national election systems and bend the voter rolls to Elon's will. Do you think he's going to carefully root out fraud?
Of course not.
We've seen the insane, dishonest, and bungling ways that Elon and Doge operate. They claimed millions were going to condoms in the Gaza Strip, complete lie. They claimed research money was funding transgender mice.
Another lie.
They claimed the Department of the Interior spent a billion dollars on a single survey, also a lie. He is literally the number one liar on his own platform in the entire world, and trust me, people, it is a very high barrow over there. So he and his zapparajects will get access to all his voter data. It's been a remarkable fairy tale of mass fraud and we get a huge purge of legitimate voters now. Traditionally, these voter suppression effort efforts target black voters because they are the
most likely to vote for Democrats. But if Elon wanted to, he could use AI to get even fancier. He's got plenty of data pull up form across the federal government to discern who is a Democratic voter and who's a Republican voter with a very high level of certainty.
He will run through.
The data and in an intentionally dishonest and idiotic way, as doshe done at Social Security in other places, he will meant to present to states a list of voters that they should block. Now, Republican led states, they are likely to go along enthusiastically with this plan and with Elon's efforts to purge voter roles of suspected Democrats. And there are plenty of swing districts in Republican led states.
So what about the Democratic states? How will they react? Well, Trump has already proven willing to use the entire federal government apparatus to bully democratic states into going along with his dictates. He and Elon will likely provide the narrative fuel by loudly and repeatedly claiming that the resistance of these states to purging voter roles is because they're corrupt
and want to keep their elections rigged. This is, of course a complete inversion of the truth, as Elon and Trump's efforts will be directly aimed at rigging the results for Republicans. Now, I don't know how these states would ultimately react. I guess most will resist, although civil society and Democratic Party resistance to Trump two point zero has been less than inspiring. But twenty seven states have Republican governors. They're going to try to do whatever Trump and Elon
want them to do. And even if only these states fell in line, you could be talking about tens millions of voters kicked off of the voter rules and blocked from the ballot box. Not to mention that the whole loud effort, amplified on x and by every brain dead MAGA influencer in the world to cast every race as rigged is going to be deeply damaging to our ability to persist as a democracy, since that status does depend on people broadly accepting election results as fair, and that too,
is really part of the goal. Now, watching the Trump administration and action, you sometimes get the feeling they really don't think they're ever going to have to face voters again. After all, they are brazenly attacking the most popular programs in the country, like Social Security and medicaid, they are pushing an economic policy that is threatening a system wide collapse. They're threatening new, wildly unpopular wars in places like Mexico
and Greenland, and complete ethnic cleansing in Gaza. Yet not only are the midterms just around the electoral corner, but Trump himself is promising to run for a third term. Elon's lies and Trump's Executive Order the first hints of a potential playbook to make sure voters never truly get the final say. And I thought the way that the Executive Order was covered last week.
And if you want to hear my reaction to Crystal's monologue, become a premium subscriber today at Breakingpoints dot com.
So Bernie and AOC have been out making huge waves with their stop Oligarchy tour. So to talk about that in the future of the Democratic Party and all things in that direction. Very likely to be joined this morning by Fashikira. He is an advisor to Bernie Sanders and also be founder and executive director of More Perfect Union, a fantastic news website. Great to see you fast, always great to see you christ Yeah, of course, So let's
put some of these images up on the screen. I mean this has been extraordinary to see the number of people who have come out for these rallies really coast to coast. You're talking tens of thousands of people. You probably know the numbers better than I do, but my understanding is one of the rallies was larger than any of the ones that Bernie was giving when he was running for president, either in twenty sixteen or twenty twenty.
Just talk to us a little bit about what the energy has been and who it is predominantly that is showing up to the Stop Oligarchy Tour.
Yeah, when we're in Tucson, we had about twenty three thousand show up and Senator Sanders and I were driving in the car along the line and he was shocked to look at the line and say, there's a lot of older people here too. Because we're used to a very progressive audience, people of color, younger people, working class people, and then we saw a lot a lot of older people. And I think when you look at the older people too, it's across the board of their ideological spectrum. You can
sense at somebody's rallies. When Senator Sanders is talking, you see some older white men kind of standing their arms crossed, not really angry, not really excited, but just like observing and listening, and you know that they voted for Donald Trump or they didn't vote at all. So I think we are reaching people that we just didn't reach in the twenty twenty primary. And I think, you know, the
observation on that there's many fold. One is if you have that many people, thirty four thousand show up in Denver, why they know that Bernie Sanders is running for president of the United States? What's going on there in the sense that these people people are not done, they're almost they're making they're registering a vote at a time when there isn't a vote to say, hey, there's a populis
revolt in this nation. You guys in DC might not see it, you don't care, but I'm going to show up for this guy right now in this place to tell you to send you care that you are off course. And that's a message to both parties, I think. And then related to that is the sense that we've got politics all wrong and we get into this discourse, which is the left right prism you know, of understanding politics versus the top versus nine nine percent prism, which is
the way we should be observing politics. But too often we get into this left versus right, which suggests that Bernie is quote unquote far left right. You know you're missing this. He's an iconic class of a top versus the bottom fighter, and that's why he's very popular at the moment.
Cos let me ask you this basic question, what is the purpose of these rallies?
Is it a political movement?
If I think back to the Tea Party, it was a revolution against the Republican Party establishment. But I haven't seen yet any calls for primaries. If anything, I've seen, you know, not explicit. We've seen some call out of leadership, et cetera, but nothing even approaching twenty ten levels.
What is it coming? Okay, well break it down for so so I don't want to get too far ahead of where Senator Sanders is on this, but I promise you he's in a mode of wanting to recruit candidates to run for office all the way up and down the ticket, and you may be seeing more from us in that regard, not just to your point, in primaries against Democrats, which is certainly an area of interest for him,
and also is independent candidates. I mean he's very enamored by and supportive of, you know, Dan Osborne when he ran for Senate, and we're hopeful he'll do it again. But as an independent, are there other working class people who'd be able to run, would want to run, throw their hat in the ring, And obviously, you know, I think he'd be interested in trying to support those candidates
to the extent that they wanted Center Sanders support. So that's the kind of a razure hand ask that's going to be coming, I think in the near future from Senator Sanders. But also, like you know, I think he's been urging and again shift too far ahead of urging people to run in various open you know, primaries, whether they're you know, you look at some of the Senacs that are out, they're going to be primaries, as you know. And so he's making calls talking to people saying, hey,
get into this race, offer an alternative. Let's not assume that the establishment has you their pick and it's just going to run down the line. And behind the scenes, he's also telling the Democratic Caucus centershoomer, hey, I'm going to get involved in these We're going to have primaries. I don't want to see super PACs being dumping millions of dollars to put their finger on the scale and fight progressive candidates again, and so that conversation is also happening behind the scenes.
So as my sense and I love to get your reflections on this, is that you know, the energy in the Democratic Party, which is increasingly the basic the Democratic Party is increasingly disgusted with Democratic leadership for what they perceive and I think accurately so as.
A lack of fight.
And I don't think that that is particularly ideological since it is you know, Bernie and AOC, among others, Jasmine Crockett, who is progressive on some issues but not as much as a like firm lefty as Bernie and AOC are, but they are predominantly the ones who are filling the void. So how do you think this shakes out in terms of the direction of the future of the Democratic Party, both in terms of twenty six and the type of candidates that are likely to find appeal in twenty twenty eight.
AOC has been a fantastic partner, no doubt, and she's been huge for getting us, you know, the attention and focus on this. I would also say some things that overlook sometimes in the way we built these events. It's you know, you had Mark Pokin and one when we're in out in Wisconsin and Kenosha Di, Sean Fain and Warren Michigan with us. Jimmy Williams, who's the head of the Painters Union, spoke in Denver. We had alvaa Badoya
fired by Donald Trump speak in Denver. You get out, you know, I think Adelita Grihalva, who's now going to run for cron Congress, spoke at our Tucson rally. So we're trying to do our partner, and I promise you when we get into some of these other stays. We're going to la on Friday or Saturday, April twelfth, then you've got you know, some others come in shortly after that.
I want to preview some of those, but there's gonna We're trying to make sure those who are interested in a kind of populous revole populous fight see the issues of concentration of wealth and power. The door is open. I mean, we we do know that there's people who may not have supported Bernie Sanders in twenty twenty. It may not have been their cup of tea you take
to somebody like a Chris Murphy. You know, it's clearly moving in the direction of wanting to suggest you know, they're they're fighting, they're interested in fighting concentrations of wealth and power. And if that's the case, you know, the door is open. Please contact me if you don't know, if that is at Bernie Sanders dot com, always welcome. You know you want to be in it. But we're trying to make this as expansive a movement as possible.
To the point that Sager was raising, you know, it is an opportunity to do recruitment, especially knowing that you know, unlikely Bernie Sanders wants for president again, but he said he's trying to build this class consciousness in America. Now is the moment's let's expand.
Because where does your confidence come from that this can become an ideological project? There was I mean, yeah, I mean, if I'm being blunt, it seems to me like a lot of people just hate Elon and hate Trump. I think that's fine. It's America. You can do whatever you want.
But you guys have been doing and working on this for what fifteen twenty years now at this point, so where does your confidence come that somebody who shows up with a I hate Elon sign or something like that actually cares at all about let's say, taxing the rich.
I'm not fully there on the level of confidence, but I would say to you, Sager, you know, we live through occupying other things where you did see moments of you know, a populous revolt of the kind I do think in this moment that if you take those as moments where you're building building building, I think we're at a higher moment now and understanding I mean the hubrisk, the kind of exploitation degree that slaps you across the face and the form of elon is particularly galling, and
it has a way of mobilizing people. To your point, we're not doing our job fully though, if we haven't gotten to the place of how in the ways in which you have a rig corporate power over the economic structure of America, how are we best confronting that. You know,
you see the discourse on tariffs now ticket Master. It's still I worry a little bit that the a liberal left who gets angry about, you know, rightly so about wrongful deportations isn't as enervated and motivated yet about the outsourcing of jobs problem, the tax code issues, the deprivations of healthcare. I think people are head of the Democratic Party, but you do need leaders, and Bernie Sanders has been an iconoclastic leader, and Sean Fain, there's some other stepping out.
I'd like more of those. And that to your point, Sager, if I'm raising appropriate level of skepticism alongside where your comments where I'm saying we don't have enough of them yet, but this is an opportunity to be a breeding ground.
I will say that you know Josh Wiel who's running in Florida, when you called and asked for Senator Sanders endorsement, I mean this is a guy who's who is running in a very kind of class based, populous way that I think if you're running in Florida any time over the last decade, and I don't think you even call Bernie Sanderson as for endorsement, I don't know if you've even run in this particular way. So I'm like, Okay, there's moments, there's glimmers, there's ways in which people are
talking and thinking in different ways. I'm hopeful that there's more leaders though, who want to build a class based movement, got it.
So there are a few different strains that are competing for ideological space within the Democratic Party. And it's not even that these strains are necessarily mutually exclusive. But you have the stop oligarchy frame, which really, you know, it is the ninety nine percent versus the one percent, top versus bottom. You know, that I think explains a lot of what's happening in our country, specifically with regards to
what this administration is doing. There's a variant of that which focuses more on antitrust and corporate monopolies are sort of embodied politically by Elizabeth Warren, by Lena Khan that wing of the party. And then you have a of new entrant, which is the abundance concept, which is co authored the book co authored by Ezra Klein and Derek Thompson, and Ezra has been both of them have been doing media tour. We had Derek here to talk about the
books and his ideas as well. And Ezra explained some of the concept behind this in a recent interview with John Stewart that got a lot of attention. Let's go ahead and take a listen to a bit of what he had to say so.
For a oral broadband, for instance, what you end up having is a fourteen stage process, like there's a period where the Commerce Department needs to drop a map of which parts of the country don't have the right amount of broadband, and then there's a challenge period on the map and dah da da da da da da da, and fifty six states and jurisdictions try to apply for this money. And again this passes. At the end of
twenty twenty one, they have time. By the end of twenty twenty four, three have got into the end of the process. They were trying three of these fifties.
Yes, end of the process, meaning they've actioned it, they've built it, or they've they've.
Got Of course I didn't mean they thought that, John, Sorry, I was so good I confused you. They just got to the point where in theory they could get the money to build.
They had been approved for the money.
Yes, yes, basically, so Faz, Basically I'm asking you to wait into the abundance discourse. What are your thoughts and do you see it as complimentary to the framing that that you and Bernie and myself share. Do you feel like this is a competing project that could supplant the top versus bottom framework that that you you know, have been talking about.
It could be either TVD. I haven't read the book, talked to a little bit about it. I tend to agree on the bureaucratic morass that we do have. We have inefficiencies and government. We have inefficiencies in the corporate sector that often, you know, this is the middleman economy that we've talked about. You know, Ticketmaster as a middleman just jacking up fees, jump fees that we've talked about for many times. It also happens in government. You've got
middle men doing things that are stopping progress. And I tend to see a lot of those middlemen, the bureaucrats as in the corporate sector of the profit seeking and government their risk aversion. They're just like, oh, well, I don't want to get blamed if we built broadband in the wrong place. So, like you're eighteen, lawyers will descend on the scene and give you, you know, different judgments about how best not to get something done. That is, there
is a problem in government. But I will say that if we're rank ordering things about the major things I want to tackle, it is the prevalence of corporate power, and it's greed over both the economy and the political system. And to some degree, when I hear some of Abundant's friends talk, I'm like, are we getting at the political
corruption problem? Do we understand that some of these are Joe Manchin working with you know, his corporate actors to write in provisions that make it near impossible to execute a bipartisan infrastrucure alaw. Do we understand that there's corporate corrupt netflike political corruption? And I want to see a good progressive is one who wants to tackle not only corporate concentrations of power, but when government is inefficient. And
I think we've lost that DNA. I mean, I know Bertie Sanders has, if there aren't many who say, I want to come in and tackle governments in efficiency. That's why Bertie is called long call for cutting defense budget, auditing the FED. These kinds of things are not in the mainstream of democratic thought, but I would urge them to be to dig in and understand having a good
idea is only half the battle. You've got to execute that idea and understand that there's going to be a lot of choke points that have now been created by economists, by lawyers, by accountants. These are and by moneyed interests to prevent good things from happening.
That is all well said, Faz, Thank you so much for checking in with us. We really appreciate you taking the time.
Thanks man, Thank you guys. Appreciate you guys time to check in now. On the tabloid section of Breaking Points. Just can't resist this one.
We have got the baby Mama drama involving.
Ashley Saint Claire, who alleged that she has a child fathered by Elon Musk. She recently called the Paparazza. People are speculating that she called the paparazzi as she sold a tesla that was given to her to Carvana, saying that she needs to make up for the cut child support from Elon Musk.
Let's take a listen.
I'm selling it because I need to make up for the sixty percent cut that you made two or seven child with them. Why did you that he did that?
That's a great question.
You feel like he was sold more vindictive against you in suffay.
Yeah, that's his momus operandi.
One man speak out.
When was all of the sun that you you spoke to him a tragic speech. Have you worried her too?
But he's just not responding too though.
How would you characterize the ways.
So you can check the stops?
I am.
I'm not the only one.
Who looks like a Tesla Model X there selling to Carvana, one of many Tesla people who is trading in their car.
Currently, let's go.
And checking the stop price and check checkond the stop prices.
Right, Let's go and put this up there on the screen. From Elon. He responds, I don't know if the child is mine or not. I am not against finding out.
No court order is needed despite not knowing for sure, I have given Ashley two and a half million dollars and I am sending her five hundred thousand dollars per year.
Okay, let's go to the next one. This is from Ashley.
She retorts, Ela, we asked you to confirm paternity through a test before our child, who you named, was even born.
You refused. You weren't sending me money.
You were sending support for your child that you thought was necessary until you withdrew most of it to maintain control and punish me for disobedience. But you're really only punishing our son. It's ironic that your last effort in court was to try and to gag me while you use a social media channel you literally own, to distribute derogatory messages about me and our child to the entire world. It's all about control with you, and everyone can see it.
America needs you to grow up, you petulant manchild.
So that's where we are.
Crystal deserve each other, to be honest.
I think they deserve each other as well. You're absolutely right, that is well. I don't know.
I am in a tough position. You know, people know I've got a very conservative disposition. So would I act myself like Ashley Saint Clair. There's never in a million years where I could endorse that type of behavior. However, you know, you father a child with somebody, You're signing up for a contract with that person for life. So openly sitting there and going to war over monetary payments and paternity.
Litigating the child's paternity on Twitter.
It's too much for me.
So look, I mean, Elon says, like a paragon of good character, is ridiculous with somebody who has father children with like multiple different women and often has like insane relationships with them and his ex wives.
I also thought it.
Was funny, were insightful the way she tries to needle him with the Tesla in particular, because yeah, I mean, obviously all these photographers happened to be there when she's selling the Tesla to Carvana and having it, you know, loaded up to be towed away.
What I feel bad for the Carvana guy.
He's like, what the He's like, what did I give myself today?
He's got a good story, you know, he's got a good story. But it definitely made his workday much more interesting. But yeah, she clearly like she wanted them there. She had planned out the things she wanted to say about elon the Tesla stock thing, like clearly that bothers him a lot, and so she's trying to use that to get at him, and you know, yeah, it's it's wild. I don't know, there's like you said, you were asking me, like,
whoo who we cheer for? The you want to know what to cheer for in this whole situation is and it is. I guess the part that to me was the most grotesque was the him jumping in and being like, I don't even know, if the baby's mine, like exactly, that is ugly and this is a human being who is going to grow up and be able to see those things that you said, So, yeah, that is pretty disgusting.
Yeah right, and he's got you know, adult children literally who could go in and we're looking at the behavior of your father. I don't know, man, there's a lot of lessons for life, and basically, don't act like either of these individuals and you'll save yourself a lot of trouble. But unfortunately, if you look at the data, pretty common situation. All Right, we will see you guys later