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Lot that is interesting. This morning.
We had some breaking news overnight, President Trump posting the private text messages that he had with Emanuel Macron and others, as well as he gets set for Davos's Greenland updates there.
We've also got Don.
Lemon now is threatened with charges by the administration for documenting an anti ice.
Protest that disrupted church services.
We've got some new crazy censorship crackdowns on Israel that you with regard to Israel commentary that you have to see to believe Josh Shapiro. So the Shapiro in the show bar here is Josh not Ben is mad about the VP vetting process is a pretty interesting one. Sean Ryan is mad about the White House protecting pedophiles. You've got some Epstein updates for you as well. And Matt Damon and Ben Affleck sounding off on a I some pretty interesting comments there from those two guys.
Yeah, I know.
I mean, look, I love Matt love Ben together. They're the perfect dynamic duo. And every like six months they just do. Ben in particular will just drop like immense wisdom in like a six in like a six minute period, particularly on AI, and we're like, man, you know the Goodwill hunting gang.
He's had some epic Bill Maher appearance. Oh, he's an athlete, He's the legendary.
That's why I just.
Don't I don't understand how that person can exist in the same body as the tabloid figure of like involving all of his j LO and all this other stuff.
Like what is going on?
Some guys love them, crazy bitch.
He's just he's the goat. But anyway, we'll talk about it. Oh, I have not watched the rip. I will admit I have not watched it yet. I also good, right, I don't know. I haven't seen any of the reviews.
Right.
I think I've unfortunately been out of the game.
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the economic fallout as the Greenland crisis. I guess you could call it continues threatening the strength of the US dollar and potential economic fallout here in the US.
Yes, let's go ahead.
And we had a big truth social burst overnight that we woke up to and had to incorporate into the show that is already moving market. So let's put this up on the screen. Among other things that he posted was this, which the French have now confirmed is a legitimate private message that was sent to Trump from French President Emmanuel Macron. He says, my friend, we are totally in line on Syria to do my friend Jackson, we can do great things on Iran. I do not understand
what you're doing on Greenland. Let us try to build great things. Number One, I can set up a G seven meeting after Davos in Paris on Thursday afternoon. I can invite the Ukrainians, that Danish, the Syrians and the Russians in the margins. Let us have a dinner together in Paris together on Thursday before you go back to the US. So pretty interesting in terms of the tone here. It just shows you behind the scenes how much they
all suck up to him. You also had the Secretary General of NATO, Mark Root, Is that how you say his name? In any case, we got even more sort of slavishly fawning text messages from him as well. So this is the tone that is being professed to President Trump from the Europeans behind the scenes. The Mark Root one says, mister President, dear Donald, what you accomplished in serious today is incredible. I will use my media engagements in Davis to highlight your work there, in Gaza.
And in Ukraine.
I'm committed to finding a way forward on Greenland. Can't wait to see you yours.
Mark.
Oh my god, these people are so pathetic.
I mean, it's embarrassing for everyone involved. Like posting the private text message as you're getting from various world leaders is crazy. B I mean, it's that is psychotic behavior from literally anyone, especially from the President of the United States.
But this tone from them, I can understand. I guess I did a little bit more.
That's from the Secretary General of NATO, because truly his fate is held in the palm of Trump's hands. But I mean, like Emmanuel Macrome, have some self respect, no of a sovereign nation.
Supposedly, So I said this yesterday I cannot stand the hypocrisy of these people. Can we put the text message please black up on the screen because look.
And note what they deal with.
We can are totally in line in our al Qaeda backed regime in Syria, where by the way, there are currently literally massacres where women are having their throats slit on camera. If anybody's interested, we can do great things on Iran. Oh, so we can do regime change in Iran. But Greenland, oh man, this is why they're all of their worship and all of this is of the UN Charter. They are happy to sponsor these CIA black wars that happened in Syria over the last fourteen years. They had
nothing whatsoever. They basically celebrated turning into an is really rumps.
Right now, right now, by the way, Ryan and Dropsite have been documenting them.
I hate to say, I've watched some of these videos.
You know it is it's like worse than Gaza in some respects, like not because it's not bopy, Like we're talking about hand to hand physical combat and actual torture of people that are happening now we have we can do great things on Iran.
So we can do regime change.
We can violate the UN Charter, international principles, all of that. But again, oh Greenland, Oh well, you can't have that, because that's about European sovereignty. This is where these people are just completely not only spineless, but it demonstrates that they just want carve outs for themselves. They back to the US kidnapping of Maduro. They said that the Venezuelan government was illegitimate, and they just never and that at the very same time, Oh well, it would be a
violation of international norms for Russia to invade Ukraine. But oh, if the United States wants to take Venezuela, we want to do regime change on it.
We are totally aligned.
We want to take take over Gaza, and right.
These people are gonna take over Gaza the bord of You know, the only thing they object to on the Board of Peace is that we're not colonizing Gaza the correct way.
Right.
It's like, it's not that they care whenever it comes to self determination. So they have never understood that if you're going to operate like that, then yes, you will open the door, not just to China, Taiwan or any of the other US average at Russia and Ukraine. Yes, now the United States can come in with the same logic if they under their you know, under the way that they operate and be like, okay, we're gonna take Greenland. And so this is where you cannot have sympathy for
these leaders. They have no self respect whatsoever. Like you were saying on NATO and Markra, it just gives the whole game away. NATO is part of the American empire, end of story period, especially whenever it comes to military power. That's why they're freaking out right now because they know that if this quote blows up NATO, which again you know, don't threaten me with a good time, Well, it demonstrates is the farcical nature of like the entire way that
they have tried to operate as quasi independent. And if you're a European watching this, you should be furious with your leaders for allowing you to be in this position. This is why the people I respect the most are the friend and the European right, who are like, listen, that we have we have completely mortgaged.
Are economic and foreign policy.
To these Brussels bureaucrats who work on behalf of a block instead of our own national interests. And I also respect them because they're not sucking up to America.
They're like, no, bitch, we're Europeans. That is not true.
They are sucking up to America.
No, AFE and the French right on the on the Greenland thing are not going along whatsoever.
Yeah, but I mean the AFC for example. What I mean is the AFC was one hundred percent sucking up to the American right. The one thing they broke on is Greenland, which is actually not that. But that's not that different from what the liberals are doing at this point, because they suck up to Drump on everything too, and are also drawing the line at Greenland. So I didn't see their positions as being all that different.
To be honest, the reason I take it differently is because they're like, no, we will never allow another country to come in to dictate, Like what exactly it means
for us as Europeans to have our foreign policy? That is the prime Like, that is the prime principle whenever it comes to being nationalists, and so fundamentally, like, what these people have done is put themselves into a corner where they want to endorse Western imperialism and take over of the globe, except whenever it applies to their own territory, right, they have no leg to stand on.
I mean zooming out the deal post World War two, as we discussed yesterday with Jeffrey Sachs, and I really encourage you guys to listen to that interview, is effectively, Okay, we're going to take care of like, you don't have to spend that much on your defense. You can rely on us for that. And you know we're going to do NATO. We're going to have our bases, we're going to you can count on our nuclear umbrella, we're gonna have Article.
Five whatever, We're going to have all of that. And in return, you are going to accept the dollars the reserve world's reserve currency.
And that is an enormous, incalculable benefit to us. So the only really strategic move on the table. There's two possibilities. One is what they're doing, which is basically like has been appeasement, like let's see if we can and they talk to this guy. Also, this is why it's humiliating for Trump too. They talked to him like he's a toddler that you're trying to appease and get to go to bed, or you know, like, oh, if you're a good boy, then we can have a you know, we
can have a nice time tomorrow whatever. Like they talk to him like he's a child and clearly see him as a psychopathic like emotionally volatile, insane person. That totally comes through in the way the tenor of the text here. But in any case can do that, which is what they've been doing, Or you can reach out to the rest of the world. I'll oh, what Canada is doing with China, and you can try to Okay, we're not
getting that defense part of the deal anymore. Then you're not going to be able to reliably count on us to you know, follow your policy visa VI China, like for example the UK at our request band Huawei technology in the UK. I mean, okay, so those sorts of things are not going to happen anymore.
And they also hold.
A good bit of our debt, of our treasury debt. Start telling some of that into the market, like if you want. And there's no choice on the board at this point other than to look elsewhere in the world and to try to achieve your own sovereignty at this point, let me put one up on the screen because we also had this which Trump posted as well, which.
Is you know, him with this map that has.
Canada and Greenland and Venezuela, and you pointed out Cuba.
Yes, if you zoom in you can actually see Cuba in Venezuela there. Cuba is very small there as an island, but if you do zoom in you can see it.
Yeah, so all under the American flag. So this is another thing that he posted. And to your point, you know, the markets are reacting to all of this, including the you know, the tariff threats and the ramping up the trade war. Put them too up on the screen. Dollar falls sharply. Wall Street stock set for heavy losses after Greenland crisis. You know, at the time of this writing, you've got let's see, US currency fell point seven percent
against the Euro. Futures are tracking the S and P five hundred down one point five percent amid increasing transatlantic tensions.
And threats of a trade war.
Tech focused Nasdaq futures were down one point nine percent. Also, the you know, US ten year treasury bond yields are up, which is a bad thing. That means our debt is more expensive. So a lot of tumult in the markets this morning because of the you know, the wild actions of the President of the United States and all of the turmoil that that entails. The other thing with these, you know, the trade thing is like the EU and the UK thought they had these trade deals and Keir Starmer,
who was pathetic and unpopular. I mean, most of these leaders that we're talking about, like Emmanuel Macron is really unpopular in France, which is another thing just politically, like the leaders who stand up to Trump, obviously their approval ratings skyrocket.
Look at Lula, Yeah, look at Lula.
Look at I mean, Shine Mom is really popular, Like you know Carney. The whole reason he's Prime Minister is because of Canada's fight with Trump et cetera. But in any case, so politically it doesn't even even make any sense. But you know, this is this is the landscape.
Where we are. They thought they had these trade deals in place.
Starmar thought that this was some win that he could take and say, look, you know this thing that I negotiated, it's going to beneficial for us, blah blah blah.
Now nope, that's all out the window. Like you can't.
You can't do a deal with this person because he is so volatile, he is so much like a child and unpredictable, like Toddler, constantly in danger of doing something insane or throwing some sort of tantrum that may be self destructive and self defeating ultimately, and just you know, so you can't. You can't rely on anything that he says or any deal that you strike with All.
That can be true, but you can also look at the people who have successfully negotiated with Trump and have come out on the right end. You've got Mexico, You've got China, and you've got Russia where running.
Like invade and bomb Mexico. I don't I want to say that that's been like a you.
Know, it hasn't happened yet, and they wanted to do it.
Don't yet.
The Claudia Scheinbaum has not only been able to work with them on fentanyl drug cartels, but has also maintained her popularity and has kept trade flowing.
Look at the Chinese.
The Chinese immediately whenever we levied tariffs on them, they just doubled it and then doubled it and doubled it again.
Well, that's all that they showed strength.
Yes, they showed strength, and I don't know why they these people can't get it in their heads. That is the only thing that he respects. It's the only thing he respects. And so if you're not willing and look, everybody knows the lopsided nature of the relationship, but it's not like the Europeans have nothing they can do.
And Trump is not really down.
For a lot of pain. He's very worried about the stock market. You know, he's going to be looking at these treasury bond yields. That was the thing that pulled him back from the first liberation day, right, So he's going to be looking closely at this. And so if you, you know, start selling some treasuries into the market, not you know, it doesn't have to.
Be a whole huge deal.
But if you say, well, hey, listen, we've got some things we can do and it's going to cause you some pain. He does not really have that kind of willpower to stay in it. And the only thing that he will ever respect is you standing strong. So these text messages like it's so embarrassing, it's so the wrong way to deal with him.
It's humiliating, on the world stage.
Like I said, I think it's also humiliating for him because of the way people feel, because revealing these sorts of things is just like inherently disgusting. Everybody's had that situation where their friend or there it's like an abusive relationship, is what you get from these text messages, right right.
The point is around this is that they can't get out of it and they have to continue. And also we all know none of their behavior will change. They'll be privately furious, there'll be.
A lamand report and then cum Davos.
They're going to be kissing each other on the cheek and pretending that none of this ever happened.
Because they're pathetic, they're weak people.
And you know, you look at this situation and I don't know, like for me, yes you can, you know, oh Trump bad, etc. But you have to look at these people who lack self respet and who for twenty five years have been warned that the NATO security umbrella, your lack of investment and the way that you structure your society has turned you into a vassal state, incapable of defending your own sovereignty and acting independently and This
is the net and the end result. That's why the people who either decoupled or built up their domestics strong militaries, they always had.
Some sort of a plan.
B India, China, Russia, some of the South American countries are the ones who stand strong today. Remember our trade crisis with India. Nothing happened, literally nothing to them. But they're doing fine. They're absolutely fine. Yeah down there, I mean. And so you look at these European leaders in this current context, and you're right. You know, the Japanese are the ones who dumped a huge number of US debt after Liberation Day, and that's ultimately what caused us to buckle.
Don't forget that they also got a trade deal where all they had to do was like some fake promises about five hundred billion dollars and effectively in place right now with a modest amount of tariffs. Their economy is okay, and their own leader is conservative like quasi nationalists, trying to keep it relations with the US.
But they've handled it well, and of course we respect them.
We don't respect the French and NATO and all these other people who are going to be flocking at Davos and who are going to be kissing his ass in twenty four hours. This isn't even the first text message, private text message. People forget that Mark Rutt has sent Trump which has been released and he's the same guy. Yeah, you know, because we track this stuff every day.
I remember. I also remember when he.
Called Trump daddy whenever it comes to Yeah, this thory of that, this, these are the people we're dealing with.
Yeah, and again I can with Nato, I mean, his whole fate isn't like I feel like I sort of get the embarrassing nature of what they're doing here.
It didn't have to be this way, but you made it this one.
But the thing, I mean, listen with Macron, I will say he is the one European leader who came out and said they should use you know what they call this like trade bazuka, like we should use the most aggressive measures we have in our toolkit pushback against this. The and he does say in this message, like listen, we got to do something. You're like, oh, I love you on Syrian and I love you on around blah
blah blah. Greenland's another matter. But the overall approach of you know, of the Europeans the rest of the world has to get their act together.
I mean, that's just the truth of the matter.
Like you have to move away from the US, you have to unite, and you have to move away through the US. You have to like, you know, do what Bricks has done. You have to do what Mark Karney is doing and striking these deals with China. And I think you're right that Ukraine is a big part of the reason why the Europeans have not gotten their act together to you know, unite, have some pushback, show a little bit of that is all.
Let me just expand on them.
Yeah, the main reason that they can't do anything is because they're obsessed with Ukraine. And I've tried to make this point for the Europeans too. If you're French, you should not mortgage your foreign policies to sovereignty and national pride to the Eastern dun Boss region of Ukraine.
That's what's currently happening.
The European leaders are so panicked that Trump will go and make a side deal with Russia on Ukraine.
They have to they have to start.
This is like the destabilization of their complete like mortgaging of sovereignty from the European Union to now the expansion of NATO has created this crisis, like you should be I mean, I could you know, go on for a long time, but like just thinking about how vindicated the de Gaal vision was about the United States NATO and how you know, he would drive us crazy at times, but in retrospect he is one of the most vindicated Europeans of all time who saw this very very early on.
And they've they moved away from that vision and that's on them. They turned themselves into vassal states. They have no true economies that are capable of producing things at scale which make them truly independent and economically viable. They're totally dependent on us, and they've created a situation where, you know, where they have to act like this in
public and their own democracies. You know, look, I'm not Europeano, pretend to be, but like for those people like they have created and put you in a situation where you're emasculated on such, you know, to such a historic degree. And you know it's funny, you know, I shouldn't be cheering for people to unite against America. I like balance. I think balance creates stability. This is why I would always talk about Israel. If we had a balanced nature in the Middle East, none of this would happen.
There would be nothing with Palestine.
And they're also you know, Syria would be a relatively stable state, and Iran too. Everything would would we would be created and have a situation where mutually assured destruction or some credible threat would make it so that rogue gangsterism is impossible now here. With the US, we have a similar situation where look, Trump is an aberration, but all he does is dial up everything that we do. He takes it from six to eleven. The United States
has been operating this way for quite some time. It's caused great pain to us as citis, and you know, the world has accepted it. And so I like balance because it creates ultimately stability. And we have lived in a totally unbalanced world largely not just because of our own actions, because we've mortgaged really, you know, our unipolar moment.
We also are.
In this situation because of exactly people like this, and so I don't know, I just maybe I'm being too hard.
I just think they're clearly my.
I guess perhaps cope on all of this is that I'm hoping that Trump's the brazeness and undeniable nature of the way that Trump operates in the room will force that sort of reckoning because listen old, the old world order was already bankrupt, right it was. And these, you know, the international institutions, which I would love to I would love them to be functioning. I would love for international law to actually have some teeth and for there to be rules of the road. That's not the world that
we live in. And Trump has just Trump has made that undeniable. And so I am hoping that that forces a realignment of the world order that leads to a something that is genuinely better, that is genuinely functional, that strikes some sort of balance. The danger and the risk is that is that we are breaking apart the post World War two order, which, for all its flaws, did keep US out of World War Three.
So we do have to give it made.
This country fantastic. I mean, it was a great deal for the US. Like all of the you know, Trump's carping ow is not fair, the Europeans taking advantage of blah blah blah, Like we set up these institutions, we set up this order to benefit us. It has been fantastically beneficial to the United States of America by design, but putting that aside, you know, my fear is that we're breaking apart those institutions without replacing them with a
more stable order. And we cannot afford to do that because now we have a nuclear world, now we have AI you know, driven killer robots. It is a different it's a different time, and so that's the fear. The whole is that this forces some sort of a reckoning and a building of a world order that is actually superior. Speaking of that sort of like brazenness and reckoning, some of that is coming through at Davos, which is in a very interesting identity crisis kind of moment. We can
put a zero up on the screen. Trump is going to be speaking there. Tomorrow's the World Economic Forum, you know, all of the world like global elites gather here, infamously, CEOs from major companies, a ton of world leaders.
Show up, et cetera.
And it says, as Davos can means, difference to Trump has replaced everything. So previously, the ethos of Davos was always stridently neoliberal right, meaning that they you know, they they want total market freedom. They want low taxes for themselves. They want low regulation, but they also want to go to Davos and talk about get pay lip service to how they're going to make the world a better place.
Climate change, Yeah, buy car urban credit.
They did something it talks about in this article one year just to give you a sense of this sort of thing they had, like the refugee experience or like be blindfolded and hear gunshots or whatever.
Anyway, that's like you fly in on.
Your private jet right where after you're you know, you're the Exon Mobile CEO or whatever. You fly in on your private jet after doing horrific things in the developing world, and then you spend a couple of days publicly pretending like you care about making the world a better place, the world that you are personally defiling, and behind the scenes you're doing deals with the other business leaders and world leaders there to continue consolidating wealth power and defiling
said world. So that was the previous Davos ethos.
Now in the.
Trump era, they like that sort of patina of we need to be responsible citizens, We need to care about poverty or world hunger or climate change or refugee crisis or whatever. That's all kind of out the window. So the theme this year, I don't remember. It's something very generic. It's like big ideas, something like that.
I have to look at the article.
It was something like that, like the most generic thing that you could possibly think of, and you know, a lot of a.
Lot committed to improving the state of the world.
No, that's not it, that's not even it's oh, you're right. The slogan, the slogan of the forum committed to that's the overall one. But no, the specific one for this year is a spirit of dialogue.
That's the theme. Spirit of Dialogue.
A lot of stuff that turns me into like a raging like a true radical.
Like it makes me turns me into a communist.
Yeah, I'm like, I cannot believe we are ruled by such incompetent pathetic.
Well it's and so the the previous thing has all been like the hypocrisy, right. The thing now is the brazenness, and you know that's that's the shift. And there's going to be a lot to talk about AI and crypto and all of that, but really they're in sort of the previous The guy who's founded World Economic Forum Club,
he's stepped down. You've now got I think the head of like black Rock is running it along with somebody else that I remember, and and yeah, so they're in kind of like a they're in kind of an identity crisis because they don't know how to exactly position themselves. Now in the era of Trump, Trump was planning on going there and making some sort of a speech. You know, it also comes at a time of incredible, like world historic levels of income inequality. Put a three up on
the screen. This is from Gabriel Zeckman, who you know is one of the leading foremost trackers of wealth inequality, fantastic economist. He says, back in nineteen ten, so like at the peak of the Gilded Era, the richest point zero zero zero zero one percent households in the US owned wealth equivalent to four percent of US national income. Today that mount is twelve percent the wealth and power the super rich, he says, now far exceeds.
It's Gilded Age peak.
And you can see the lines on this graph that just effectively go completely vertical. And it's set to continue even more aggressively in that direction with the advent of AI. These giant tech companies, these giant tech. You know, tech oligarchs who seek to become and are on track to become the world's first trillionaires. Of productivity in this country in particular is spiking, but workers are seeing none of those gains. They are all flowing to the very I'm
not even talking about the top one percent. The top, as he says, point one percent are the ones who are consolidating the vast majority of the wealth and political power, and so that is really the backdrop in the context of Davos this year as well.
Yeah, no, I mean I think that's why. That is why.
Look, we were originally going to talk about inequality. Not only that, but Trump is planning on making an affordability pit. I will say, you know, one of the problems here. As much as I would love to crap on the Europeans and all that, that's a more of a side project for me personally. You know, it's just still side quests of a long health vendetta have against the continent. But you know, the thing that really matters is affordability.
And actually, you know, out of the inequality graphic, it's really the importance of how people are able to make it here and to be able to fulfill even like a modicam or hope that your children are going to have a better life than you currently have, which is just currently not the case the entire millennial generation.
That's the sound like.
That is why the Greenland thing, even though as you know, my feelings are well known, most people are going to look at this and be like, I don't care about Greenland.
This is insane, Like why are you wasting.
All of this capital in percent support?
Right because people they're like, I don't ultimately care that much about it, Like this is not eighteen fifteen or whatever the Louisiana purchase was, where it's like there's this vast land where we get to move into and all these resources that we're going to get because at this point, as you just pointed out, even if we were to have this idea of all these minerals and things in Greenland which would be able to exploit, nobody is under the illusion that we're all going to get rich because
of that.
Because of the way.
That the market's and wealth and all of that is distributed broadly, right, Like, yeah, understand that this would be a bonanza to a certain select few of companies that we personally though would not reap the benefit. That's the issue that I think, you know, structurally, they're never going to be able to solve. Like from what I've understood in my conversations around, I'm like, what is up with the Greenland thing, because like, you know, what is it?
And they're like, well, first of all, and I keep using this term, it's a sugar high. They're just literally like they're basking in midnight hammer and Venezuela. They're like, we can do anything where America bitch is basically the
Trump doctrine. And in that they're like, well, this is something where he could solidify his legacy as expanding the territory of the United States more than any you know time since eighteen I forget when the Steward purchased of Alaska was I think it was like eighteen sixty eight, that it would be the biggest expansion of the map, and he loves that. But again, this is a central problem for Trump. The more that things are about him personally and using the US as a plaything and.
Not about any of us.
That's the fundamental issue in his general politics. Okay, let's get to the church. Turning now to Minneapolis has been a very high profile protest I guess if you could call it, where a bunch of BLM activists who are now part of the anti ICE movement stormed into a church in the state of Minnesota. The reasoning behind this was that they had found names of ICE officers and suspected that one of the pastors at this church was
the leader of a local ICE field office. It did end up, by the way, that the pastor who they alleged was an ICE officer was not even present there at the time. It set off a high profile incident now showdown with the Trump administration. Don Lemon, the current YouTube streamer I guess, a disgraced XCNN anchor, was actually present at the protest, which has heightened some of the discussion around this. So we're going to show you some of the clips that has happened. We're going to discuss
it on the other side. Let's take a listen, so you can.
See the protesters here have gathered over here. They're in the.
Middle of the church.
So in the beginning of the church service, the pastor was speaking and Nichema stood up and said her piece, and then the protesters surrounded her. But this is a clandestine mission. I think they found out one of according to them, this is according to Operation pull Up, that one of the pastors here is a.
Member of ICE.
And so there we go, and we were interrupted by this group of protesters.
We asked them to leave, and they obviously have not lived.
So what do you think of it?
I mean, this is unacceptable, it's shameful.
It's shameful to interrupt a public gathering.
Of Christians in workship. But there were post I have to take care of my flow.
Listen, we live in there's a constitution in the First Amendment to freedom of speech and the freedom to assemblant protest.
We're here to worship. We're here to worship Jesus because that's the hope of these cities. That's the hope of the world is Jesus Christ.
Be very respectful, but please don't push me there.
We're here.
We're here to worship Jesus. That's why we're here.
Tell you is that they're bearing arrays of views on the political situation here. What do you what do you mean?
But I'm going to leave it at that.
But there there's bearing an array of views in this church on politics of immigration, right recognize the complexity issue. Yeah, some people don't like what's happening.
Some people like I'm not going to reduce it to that.
I won't reduce it in that simply but acknowledge the complexity of a situation.
Thank you, sir.
I appreciate you talking about By the way, just so you know, this is what you get with independent journalism that you will not get with corporate media. I'm just here to tell you. So if you're in the chat, if you're with us, support us, support us, support us, like and subscribe, becoming member support independent journalists.
So there's Don in the church asking for people to like and subscribe after accompanying these activists where he appeared to have had some fore knowledge. This is relevant, by the way, whenever we'll get to some of the charges that may be levied against him with the Trump administration. Of all these protesters who decide because they suspect again they did not.
Even have it confirmed.
It's been confirmed now later that a pastor who was not there is cape was potentially a leader of the local ice office that they decide to come in to disrupt this service, to harass, intimidate, scream at including by the way women and children. And if anybody's wondering it was a multiracial congregation, I don't know, Crystel. I mean looking at this like I think that the spirit of BLM is alive, and well it's very clear specifically because it is also a BLM group that was behind this protest.
And I've actually been frustrated that everybody's talking about Don Lemon and not about the actions of these protesters themselves. And then the re action from Democratic lawmakers. So you had the Minnesota state attorney general defend this protest action and he said, oh, well, people will have to feel uncomfortable, so he doesn't see anything unlawful here. He actually doesn't
think it's a violation of the Face Act. You have the state governor Walls of Minnesota put out some mealy mouthed statement, and it's like this just seems intrinsic to me. And I remember in our debate, you know, people got mad because I talked about liberal protest norms. This is liberal protest, like they seem to believe it is okay. And again, this is a violation actually a federal law.
At least clearcut to me. Whenever you have the face Act, which was written in nineteen ninety four, specifically says you can't intimidate and go in and.
Disrupt religious worship services.
It is unbelievable to me like that there is no general consensus and effectively just silence in the same way that you seem many right wingers be silent on let's say, the excesses of ice to what is something which is so egregious in its form of protests and it seems completely normalized and permissed, like in the liberal establishment within the state of Minnesota, and the fact that the Attorney general immediately dismiss it, the local police literally doing nothing
whenever these people and again let's be clear, screaming, making children cry, following them to their cars, intimidation, direct trespass, not leaving whenever they want.
I just I truly do.
Not understand how can this cannot be like actually condemned, especially when this already happened in twenty twenty and there was a massive backlash against it. So I really actually want like, don't I don't understand, as somebody who swims in this world, like what is happening here? Like, how is it that this is completely permissive and it's just like, oh, our side is good, so they can do whatever they want.
The Minnesota state Attorney general was making a big stink about political you know, political persecutor non prosecution or whatever in the Renee Good case immediately comes out and says that this is totally fine, especially in a state where you have to shoot very recently in church, Like, how could you possibly try to encourage this type of behavior.
I just don't get it.
So let's separate a few things out.
And that's why don't want to talk about Don Lemon, because you know, but.
We do need to talk about Don Lemon because that's what they're focused on. And the administration is threatening to charge him specifically with Face Act and also with the KKK violation, which is insane.
So I watched a good bit.
I didn't watch the whole thing, but I watched a good bit of his stream, and to be honest with you, it was genuinely good. Like it was like, I mean, we played a little bit of it here. He was tipped off by the protesters that they were going to do this action. Okay, as a journalist, and no doubt he has a perspective. That doesn't mean that he isn't a journalist, right, So as a journalist, he goes in, he documents what they're doing. As you saw, he spoke
with the pastor, he spoke with parishioners. You know, he at times was asking them challenging questions. But he also asked a challenging question of the protesters as well. So of course you come away with a sense of where Don Lemon is on the issue. But I actually it was for me it was genuinely valuable to watch his stream and to hear from the parishioners themselves, because if you do just come at this from either a right or a left perspective, then you're going to have a
very flattened view of the human beings involved. But you know, it actually gave me sort of more texture and more context to be able to think about the whether this was a sound tactical approach. Hearing like that guy that we heard there who's like, listen, you know, to be honest with you. There's a lot of different political views
in this church. There were other people there who said, you know, to be honest with you, like some of what the protesters are saying, like I kind of agree with I just this to me is way on a line and it's you know, too comfort and I am very upset about what they've done here, But to be honest with you, some of the things that they're saying might be things that I agree with. So you know, in terms of as a journalistic endeavor, like I think
you should like and subscribe. He's on the ground in Minneapolis. He is actually tracking what is going on here and giving you a window in that is not just caricaturistion. Well, so the idea, the idea of charging him is truly insane, and we all know the reason why they are focusing on him, which I think is also we're saying as well, because he's famous, because he's liberal, because he's hated. Yes, I think because he's black and gay. All of that plays into it.
But he's the first person to remind you he's black and gay. Okay, it has nothing to do.
There is no doubt that that is part of why he is a lightning rod here. I just don't like that that is liberal. I think that that is deniable. But in any case, that's the reason that they have
made the face. He wasn't even the only journalist there, by the way, so for don lemon for them to even float charging him with the face act with this KK insane and like on principle as journalists we should be vehemently opposed to that because genuinely, you may not like I know, you know, you don't like his views, he's.
A liberal, all of that.
It's not because, yes, but you don't like it.
But nobody as a as a you know, as a journalist, like the ability to go in to document this protest, to be live, to talk to the protesters, to talk to the parishioners, to talk to the pastor, to talk to everybody.
On the ground.
It was genuine, It was actually valuable content and it is worthwhile looking at it because you know, I think he in some senses did a favor to the to the right because you get tactics, Yes, yes, because you do get more of a sense of you can't just view the church members there in a caricatureish way when you actually listen to what they have to say and
you're there in the room with them and experiencing that. Now, for me, in terms of the protest tactics, you know, do I have like a moral issue with No, I don't have a moral issue I think it's crazy that there's an ICE field officer who is in any sort of position of moral leadership.
This is a guy, This is a guy. Well it is. It is my business. It is a b business.
I mean, I'm a taxpayer of this country. I'm paying his salary.
They are, you know, in the local in the local community.
Just finished for a second. So do I have a moral issue with No, I don't have a moral issue with it, do I think? And people get very mad when you say this. Do I think it was tactically smart?
No, of course not.
You've given a major propaganda win to your adversary. You protected zero immigrants, right the work you're undermining the good work of the will Stancils of the world who are out in the streets tracking ICE agents, blowing whistles and recording.
I mean.
And Trump posted actually yesterday before he started posting like his private text with Emmanuel Macron or whatever, he posted that there was too much focus on ice agents and
not enough on the fraud. Why because he sees that these videos that everybody's seeing of, you know, pulling some elderly American citizen out in practically his underwear in the snow, tear gassing a six month old baby, shooting now a Venezuelan national on top of the killing of Renee Good, Like he's seeing that this is not going well for him in the public opinion.
Those tactics are working.
And instead today of being able to talk about those things and those abuses, we're having to have a debate about interrupting church services in this way that I think for a lot of Americans is going to look over the top and very uns.
Because it is over the top and it is ridiculous, like the people violate the social contract at the most basic level.
Can I ask you one thing though, because do you also I think you use the term egregious?
Is that fair?
Yeah?
Do you also think it's egregious that ICE has interrupted church services to arrest make arrests of undocumented in moment?
But so you know, this is kind of my point is that it is a race to the bottom and if we want to have some sort of norms whenever we're like and by the way, even but do you because it is a bit difficult when you have churches who basically declare themselves as a place where the law itself, immigration law does not be allowed to enforce like that would be like saying that you can commit any crime inside of a church and as long as you do that,
you're going to be immune from federal or estate prosecution. So you know, I do think it is fundamentally different. And then second, you.
Know, journal in a sense, I mean, I agree with you that it's fundamentally different because the harm of coming in and like arrest, Like those people that were at the church, I think they were upset and they were angry.
They're fine right.
To come in and interrupt services, to make arrest in front of everybody and with children and families there, like that is deeply so you could.
Just never arrest if a murderer was hiding inside of a church, could you go and.
You could, Cary, we're not talking about them, We're not talking about violation. We're talking about what is a civil offense in terms of not all.
The time, we've had multiple illegals who live in churches to escape prosecution.
So then it's clear. Then you find it egregious when people protest in a church, but you do not find it egregious when Ice reads it's kit it out in.
All the military year and pulls people out.
I would not do it.
I would not do it for some, but personally, I can only speak for myself. If it was just purely like uh, you know, like women, children, people have committed no crime, yeah, I would say don't do it.
I think that you you should be able to do it a different way.
What I have seen, though, is there have been extremely high profile illegal activists who are actually have committed felonies, who go and hide in churches at the direction often somebody right down there.
Let's use the specifics of what we've seen unfold. There's a lawsuit right now against the federal government alleging violations of people's constitutional right to worship and disrupting, you know, their religious practices that were brought by a variety of religious organizations. I know the Quakers are involved, there's a number of other religious groups that are involved as well.
And what they allege is not only that these rates have occurred, you know, during services on church property, et cetera, but it creates a climate. We're not only undocumented immigrants, but many other church members are fearful of even going to church. So you are, you know, so if you're upset about this incursion in terms of you know, protest activity where I think you're wrong about the Face Act being applicable here, but you.
Know, as you can, but it also or disruptive.
No, it does not know, it doesn't say disrupt the text you can find that it's about threats intimidation, but it also specifically says carves out peaceful first dimensions.
Following people to the.
Peaceful.
But in any case putting that aside, right, I think if you are upset about people going into a church to protest peacefully during a church service, I would say that to be morally consistent, you should be even more upset about the violation by federal agents coming in during service to arrest people. And so that's why, you know, I mean the the rights upset about this. Again, I think the tactic was not smart. I think it caused, you know, gave the right something that obviously they see
as a propaganda whin. I don't think it was the right way to go about things. But I also can't take seriously the rights like oh my God, the sanctity of religion, blah blah blah, because these are also in some cases the same people.
I think Tommy.
Tupperville, like yesterday said that all Muslims are terrible, and the enemies within the case like they have no respect for any sort of like blanket religious tradition. It's only when it comes to, you know, something they don't like from the left and specifically with regards.
Yeah, but okay, you can say the other side is inconsistent, but that doesn't mean that you shouldn't condemn it. And here we have the law specifically says injure intimidate or interfere with religious worship. There's no it's like open and shut for every single one of these pro You don't think that they injure into interfere.
They did not intimidate or And again there is I'm sorry.
Specific car bounce for again peaceful First Amendment protest activity.
I don't think now do I.
Think, you know, maybe maybe like a trespassing charge potentially, But the person that they focused in on here is specifically Don Lemon, and that to me, I think I think should be again, as a journalist, I think you should find very troubling.
So here's here's my transgressive take.
I would agree with you if we had not already had multiple journalist who were prosecuted on the day of January sixth. You had three, at least three streamers that I know of, Isabella de Luca, Baked Alaska, and Owen Schroyer, who were all prosecuted by the DOJ and basic some of them actually spent time in prison even though they were streaming what was going on under the same thing. You could make that argument is that they were interviewing people.
You support that.
No, I don't. And that's why I'm saying.
That's my transgressive take is while I despise don Lemon, I think we should set a standard. Actually, and this is part of my frustration is we're all focusing on don No. It's about the story is the protesters and Keith Ellison and Governor Walsh and Jacob Fray and the entire like live industrial complex, which has zero to say about it. Promila and Japaul even did the meme where she said it was mostly peaceful whenever she was.
Pro And that's why I'm like, that's true.
Look if a if Nike, surely.
When Governor Wallas's well, Nick Shirley did go and.
They care if a Somali fraudster was a leader of a mosque and it was Nick Shirley and people went in. These people would be screaming to high heaven. You think they'd be talking about mostly peaceful not for a second. No, I actually would not be defending him because I think this is crazy behavior. I'm even said that Nick Shirley literally did a piss poor job and is a retard.
It doesn't know what the word benevolent means. So I'm not somebody who's sitting here and defending all of these types of tactics.
And I defended all the January sixth streamers.
I don't think Don Lemon should be charged, which is why I'm so frustrated that Don Lemon somehow, by the way, we can get to his little clip about claiming white supremacy and denigrating people. Again, the enduring image of that protest is an Asian family who are trying to protect their child from these freaks who are screaming.
In their face.
But this is the issue, is that BLM and people always are like, why does he talk about it so much? This is the beating heart of liberal activism. The right to distrib the right to be anti social protest, Yes that is protest is that they believe gives them the right to destroy.
Can you acknowledge those?
Can you acknowledge though that it is some crazy business to have a guy who is the.
Field officer, like the head of.
The agency, the regional agency of ICE, to be in a position of moral authority like that, like that is that is.
Why up to me to defend. That's up to the church. And if they're okay with the then fine whatever. There are crazy black pastors around who are literally believing in like straight black national consistent.
Lawsuits about all of the aggressive and illegal tactics here. And I think that, and I think the reason why people you know, oftentimes comment on how much you bring up black lives matter, and like the the level of energy that you bring to this, which is some private individuals who did a protest.
That you don't like.
But then to me, the much more important and consequential part of this story is those are those are like relatively powerless individuals, right who of course it is you're looking at it.
Who did a thing you did?
Can I finish who did a thing that you don't like? Okay?
I think that that is so much less consequential than the fact that you have a the federal government with all of its powers who are aggressively and illegally using tactics in a widespread manner that amounts to a terror campaign in these communities, and with this story specifically, I find the most important and most troubling thing not to be some tactics that I don't think are effective, but to be the fact that you immediately reach for, let
me criminalize this journalism. That's the part that is far more has far more far reaching consequences than you know, some protesters did a thing that you found to be distasteful.
Well, I would give you the same thing. Is I find many of the tactic to the extent that I have problems with ice. It is violation of US two process, violation of US rights fundamentally built Like you, I support deporting people who are here illegally, so yes, my tactical objection is going to be on that. But fundamentally I think that people who are illegally should lead. You don't agree with that, that's fine, But this gets to my
point about the moral equivalents. Is they are so certain in their moral righteousness that they can walk into and disrupt every facet of our lives. They can burn our cities to the ground, They can turn every major blue city into a literal shithole for two to three years, spike the murder, raid, take over federal and educational institutions. That's why you're saying powerless completely not true, elite, No,
but it did happen. And that's why that's why people like us bring it up because when they were in power, and then Keith Ellison, who is in power, is defending this. Are we see with our own eyes very clearly? Oh right, So when you people are in power, they're going to allow this. They're going to use the same selective political prosecution.
Nobody gave two shits about journalism when all of these two, when these three I think it might have even been five streamers who were all charged under January sixth, they held it up.
They said they're not legitimate journalists.
Now, when Don Lemon is here because now he apparently because he's black and gay, then all all of a sudden, we've rediscovered the First Amendment.
There is zero consistency like there is I.
Think there is zero consistency in saying it is fine for ice agents to go in and rate a church. And you haven't said anything about that up until I asked you about it, and to be so incredibly upset about one.
Church service getting interrupted by a handful.
Of pion because fundamentals, I think that is wildly because what you're trying to defend is the principle that illegals who are tens of millions here present can go and find safe sanctuary.
I'm a church in anyone.
What I'm trying to do.
I don't believe criminals. I believe have the right to sanctuary anyway.
ICE agents should not be brought in to American cities by the thousands to terrorize entire communities. Well, which is what has been done here and is not about this is not even about immigration, that is true, true, Then why are they in Minneapolis?
Tell me?
Because tell me why did they chose many.
Agents are in Minneapolis? Because the Nike surely video and because that's how this administration.
Operates, which has nothing to do with immigration.
Well, there are.
Several, like thewhelming.
Number of Somali immigrants are in fact American citizens.
Yeah, but that's why they're there.
I mean, let's just open our eyes to what is really going on here. It has to do with the fact that they hate some They hate anyone who's not white and Christian. They are after anyone who you know has opposed to Trump.
They hate walls.
They now hate Jacob Fry because he opposed him as well. But I mean, if you look at what these people are actually doing, it's incredibly weak.
Like Fry is out.
There basically saying like there's nothing really good we can do about ice agents who are abusing people in the streets, immigrants and Americans alike. Well, I am much more, yes, I am much more upset about that, which has the backing of the largest law enforcement budget in history, and is backed by the entire federal government, and yes, my taxpayer dollars. Then one church protest that I think was probably that's what I'm saying.
You're looking at as an ail advised church protest and not a sustained campaign since twenty fourteen, which has normalized this behavior across the nation and which again literally burned almost in America.
Tell me about the tactics that are being used right now.
Yes, I've criticized all those tactics here consistently.
No no protesters, the protests.
Tell me about those tactics, because it has been overwhelmingly what people have been doing is documenting what ICE.
I mean ICE, Yeah, you use it, you could say, and they have tried well. Documenting is a very very small cry from the vast majority of them actually are trying to disrupt. And you know, that's a whole other type of conversation where again, we've normalized it so that ordinary Americans just think that it's that they're like Martin Luther King Junior reincarnate, going and putting their cars, let's say, often in front of ICE agents whenever they're trying to conduct a raid.
I won't even defend some of the tactics of the raid.
I think it's chaotic, and again, like you, I tactically think it's a bad idea, but fundamentally, like you do agree with these protesters.
I think illegal should be deported. I think they should leave. And you got that's the fundamental Can you.
Not see the Can you not see and that's not even true what you just said, But can you not see the vast disparity between interrupting a church service and shooting a woman dead three times in the face and facing zero accountability well, and one being a group of powerless private citizens and the other being the full force of the United States federal government and the largest law enforcement budget in history, larger than all but thirteen countries, militaries,
and the Vice President of the United States saying they have quote absolute immunity, like which one is, which one? No one is more of a danger, more of a threat, or arrow.
View of it, considering the fact that not that long ago they actually did have the full power of the government, nobody actually sustained they will charges they do.
But they do.
And that's why they don't now, Yes, because much of the tactics of the way that they're behaving, and I will even freely admit much of the way of the tactics that the Right and Ice and all of them are employing make it so that very likely these.
Freaks are all going to be back into power.
But you know, if we're trying to talk here about the way that this all arise and the way that liberal protest norms have evolved now to this point, and where the entire democratic liberal industrial complex will defend it and or stay silent or criticize it only as tactical, you can then realize why most people who may find the Ice thing distasteful are going to be like.
Yeah, well you know, look at what we've got face in us.
Whenever the other side is in power you and that's exactly what happened with Keith Hell's but saga.
We can't always like go back to it's it's this person, it's that person's fault, it's this backlash, it's that backlash because you love to start with the liberal the Black Lives Matter liberal protest tactics that, yes, at times, you know, the fringe of that was very violent. It was not anything that should and not anything that should be condoned, and was incredibly counterproductive in terms of the goals of
that movement. But you never look to what precipitates that, which is decades I mean of you know, decades of systematic racism, which is police killings of unarmed black men. So how is there no accountability for that that leads.
To an extreme reaction.
We want to relitigate reaction. It was a completely fake crisis. The number people can go check if they want you the number of unarmed black people were.
Proberts in the year two. Doocrity.
I know you're not genuinely I know you're not genuinely asserting that there is no racism in this country, and that there hasn't been systematic races not just from Republicans, but from both parties right in power that have criminalized, that have made it so that you have, you know, a mass incarcerated population that has backed redlining.
I mean, we can go through the history.
So if you so, it's not accurate to say that that protest movement was based on nothing and came out of nowhere because statistics that is just no, that's not there is no ability to create that kind of a mass movement out of nothing, right, you have to acknowledge that there has to have been something. Yes, last note to just start with the things that liberals do that you don't like, and you you act like that and you love to act like that is the biggest problem.
So for example, again you have so you're so exercised about this incursion in a church, you have nothing to say about the way that systematically, across the country religious worship spaces have been violated and made unsafe by the attacks from the special.
I think like quite clearly that there is a difference. And because you don't.
Get the difference is that one way works and it's coming in around.
They fundamentally think that illegals just have a right to sanctuary church.
I don't.
I don't think criminals who are here illegally have a right to sanctuary anywhere. The only sanctuary they have is in the home where.
They were past presidents able to deport undocumented immigrants.
I'm glad that you talked were they There's this new fake statistic.
Going around about how Obama was able to deport three million people. What he did is he reclassified, turning people away at the border. Internal enforcement was an all time low. All they did was recross fight, just like they did with massive were here is the.
Big previous Were previous presidents able to deport undocumented immigrants?
Oh?
Were they able to deport illegals at an extremely low rate and at a net rate in which it resulted in the last.
Ten to fifteen million people here?
Not violating church services was the key reason.
No, don't.
Yeah, of course, I mean, because it's ridiculous and they're doing the same things at school. Okay, so this is something that is genuinely different under the Trump administration. They rescinded the guidance that previously said schools and houses of worship are off limits, and that was fine with you.
You had nothing to.
Say about it. I don't think so.
I don't so.
I don't take seriously you're now deep concern about the sanctity of.
The church services people are so trauma.
As people know, I'm an atheist.
I don't particularly care that much about sanctity of churches.
I care about liberal protest norms because I can see and I lived through literal mass psychosis where people were storming buildings, restaurants, streets everywhere, rioting, looting, destroying property, exploding our murder rate, destroying the city that I literally lived in, to the point where we still have the same problems that from what five six years ago now at that time, Like that's why you're saying like it's an old thing, It's not like we live with the enduring consequences of that.
In fact, literally across the nation, multiple cities and places and areas which I love have been ruined completely because of BLM and the so called criminal justice movement that followed and exploded through all of the people who are actually in power, people like Keith Ellison, who have nothing to say whenever a literal church is violated here because to them, that is permissible whereas any any sort of action to arrest people here illegally is what really gets.
Them all spun up about. But there have the same selected that way.
Not through before this, Before this, you know, multiple thousand federal agents storming the streets of Minneapolis, the whole region, twin cities. Before that, I was doing enforcement, there was immigration enforcement in Minnesota.
No, that's not true, because is true. This is this is the problem.
Sanctuary cities make it so that the jails do not turn over report.
That is that is not true.
They do not comes with detention.
True when it comes to violent criminals. There has been cooperation between Minneapolis and the state of Minnesota. Have there been ICE enforcement actions in Minneapolis prior to the.
Search Yes, previous regime where you only believe that people functions.
Under this Trump administration, there have been ongoing ICE actions in and around Minneapolis.
Did they stoke this back? No, So what does that tell you.
No, people do not object to any undocumented in or there may be some people like that, but by and large to any undocumented immigrants getting deported. No. What they object to is what they're seeing right now in the streets of Minneapolis, and.
They should object to that they should be horrified by that. I'm horrified by that.
I'm horrified by giving the absolute immunity to a bunch of massed thugs who have said to people now they have threatened them, They've said, didn't you learn the lesson from that lesbian bitch. They are using the murder of Renee Goods as their ability to threaten people with the same type actions we have already seen now multiple shootings. We've seen also immigrants dying routinely now when they're in detention. So yes, I think people are right to be upset
about that. That doesn't mean that they object to any immigrant ever being deported. It means they object to what is happening right now, and they should.
And so I am.
Going like, I think that is a far more consequential thing to happen in this country right now, backed by our tax dollars, with this private army for Trump and for Steven Miller that is completely rogue and completely unaccountable to the law. I think that is a vastly, vastly more important issue than some protesters who you know, I
think you could probably listen. I think when you protest, if you violate the law, like there's an expectation that you may risk arrest, like could they get trespassing charges potentially, you know, will the government go after them for the Face Act? That can be litigated in court. I don't think that they'll succeed, but sure they took on that risk.
Is vie is usually not is met with a fine. So just to be clear, like, I'm not saying all these people should be thrown in prison for years at all, and that's why again I would ignore it. But you know, to your point there, I do think it is a bit of a canard whenever people are saying they don't like even when you're talking about violent protesters, People like me believe, I mean Joe Biden, the so called moderate believe that people who are here illegally, who are caught
drunk driving should not be deported. That is insane, insane. You're putting people at risk and you shouldn't be deported. The liberal line appears now to be that unless you're a violent rapist or murderer, that you get to stay here, even though you cross into our country illegally, and even though you're probably going to be a massive net drain on our social safety net, which just grant you all citizenship like this is what like is. It is genuine
slide of hand. There are tens of millions, somewhere between twenty and thirty people thirty million people who are present in this country illegally, and I think people should just be honest liberals and say, yes, we want to vast we want to legalize the absolute, vast majority of them areless of the consequences, and we want people I would like to talk about tax dollars to pay for all of their healthcare.
People who don't speak any English.
Authority of them are net contributors to This is a complete canard.
And even if you had a small percentage, which are going to be.
I think people should be saying that.
I think people should say that because that is actually the place where the American people are, that is where the majority position is. They be No, even even at the height of the anti immigrant backlash, even at the height of that, you still had much more complex views on immigration than has been portrayed. So yes, the American people do not they the view that you're articulating as being just like some stupid liberal position.
That is the position of the American people.
That we should legalize everyone and give them all free.
But if you that, if you have been here and you've abided by the law and you've paid your taxes, that there should be some path to citizens.
And yet they don't.
They don't agree with what is going on. They don't agree certainly with the you know, insane tactics of this private these private thugs, which again, I it your immigration is the pretext here, but this really is about a police state.
It is about a mass crackdown.
It is about threatening retribution against the opposition, making it so that you know, things are you know, basic protest is criminalized.
I think the multiple things can be true.
The administration believes that if you protest against them, you are a domestic terrorists. That is there, That is their stated definition. And again I think that is like, that's that's the thing that we should really be focused on right now, because these are the people that are in power right now. This is what they're doing right now, and you know, most of America is horrified by it.
Frankly, look, I think they should be horrified.
I objected immediately to labeling Renee Good a terrorist, but you know, one of these is it's always you know, yesterday I was feeling very left wing.
Today I feel very right wing. I'm like, oh, right, I forgot what.
Exactly it is like or would be like to live back under the thumb of these people, And like, I don't think that we should really forget what you know, you're talking about normalization. This was normalized over literally a decade. It has been accepted. There is an extreme position in the way that you look at mass deportation, Like I'm sorry, like legalizing people giving them free health care. No, it's not happening if I get.
This free healthcare this country.
Your position is free health care for everyone, and legalization that is for illegals and for people who are here illegally. That is not something I will ever support. I don't think anybody should support that empirically. And like, this is where I do think it is important to also note that because of the position of the moral righteousness, which is the heart of all liberal activism, where they genuinely cannot see, like, I don't think anybody can see in
the way that you're framing it. Your look ice purely as some sort of intimidation factor, and the fact is immigration is a part of that. Now, can it be done without many of the bad things that they've done.
And that's what you know.
Often the criticism is like, you only object to the tactics. It's like, yeah, because I agree with the idea they should get deported. I think it's basically your view here on the protests. Yes, we can't agree on enforcement. I would be much happier with one hundred percent remittance tax and mandatory verify and taking a bunch of these employers who vastly profit off of all of this and throw them in prison and then basically encourage everybody to go back,
more humane way to do it, less headlines. Yeah, but to be honest, and let's let's be clear here. Libs would be screeching and crying about that too. They would like the idea that they only object to ice tactics is bullshit.
They want them to stay your legally hypothetical.
We have the reality the criticized them and gide in anybody who even remotely sent people back.
They were mad about it.
They believe that they should stay it and we should do nothing. They don't care about the time.
Are allowed to have that view. We're allowed to have that view.
You can leave anything.
Here's The thing is, you know, you're very upset about their moral righteousness, like they are allowed to have a perspective. And I do think, I do think that their perspective is morally righteous because it is about you know, so I don't quit. I don't think the two things are equivalent, like I don't think that no position of the right
eye and the position of the left are more. But I'm saying there is there is right and wrong, Like it is wrong watching that man, elderly man drug out on the street in the cold, humiliated in his shorts only, and you know, turns out he's an American citizen. Hours later they bring him back. Right, Watching that seventeen year old at Target who they beat the shit out of him and then drop him off, you know, miles away, and he's crying and bloodied, watching a six month old baby get tear gassed.
And then the way they lie about all of it.
This Venezuelan man who got shot on the leg completely lied about all of that, and of course Rene good like, yes, I yes, I feel.
Very much that is on the correct, morally right.
Tous side to say those things are wrong, and that the people who are protesting those things are genuinely courageous and noble, and that like more people should aspire to hold values and actually fight for them.
Which is why, you know, even with.
These protesters, the only reason I'll criticize the tactics.
I think the tactics were foolish, but I think.
It was freakin' ballsy. I admire the fact that they have the balls to do something I'm not doing right now and go out there in the streets and try to make a difference. Do I think that this was the wrong approach in terms of the Yes, I do. I don't think it was beneficial. Admire the hell on and yeah I do, I actually do, because they are putting their actions where their mouth is. They're not just
complaining about it on Twitter or posting. They're going out and they are trying to do something about a moral wrong that they see. And I think that is I think it is incredibly noble thing to do to have a value and to be willing to actually go out and fight.
Fine, then you know, every right winger January sixth was courageous and noble under your definition, because only because you agree, you're basically saying no, because because we are actually.
Moral there.
Is defined, but you don't even agree with the thing they were doing. Like the election was not rigged and stolen. They were like breaking the law and violent, like you know, beating up cops. Yes, and it was vastly more violent than anything that we have seen.
I'm not protest. I'm saying that moral equivalence is.
It's no, no, no, no, I'm saying there is no moral equivalence between those two things, only for.
Many people, the morality of tens of millions of people here.
I legally, you're doing like a very relativist thing.
Yes, where we live in a country.
No, you're doing a moral relativist position where there can be no right or wrong. It's all just in the eye of the beholder, which is actually a very left wing thing to do and which I don't agree with. I think there is right and wrong. I think there is good and bad. I think there is good and evil, and so, yes, what they did on January sixth was stupid and it was for a bad and wrong cause.
What these protesters are.
Doing in general in Minneapolis is for a righteous cause. And I think that that is no, because there is such a thing as good and bad.
Yeah, everybody who marched against civil rights who were in the white crowds. Black people thought that they were in the right and they were uploading and they were wrong.
That's my point.
That's my point is that the January sixers, but in their mind they were morally righteous, were incorrect. Right, these people are correct, And you agree with me on that, like you also objected these ice tactics, and you also don't think that the election was stolen and that that was stupid.
So clearly there is some you know.
Ability to see objectively that some things causes are worthy and noble, and some causes are bad and wrong. That's all I'm saying. Okay, fine, because you're doing a home morel relative.
Well, in their mind they think, but they're wrong and these people are not.
Yeah, but if I went back to the nineteen fifties, a vast portion of the public would have agreed with the people who were storming, and there would have and let's say a debate here on and many people. Okay, we could say that in retrospect. But the point is is what matters actually in the moment, and what matters in the moment, as you just laid out, is while you think it's noble and courageous. I think that anybody who wants to normalize these types of things is despicable.
In the same way that we.
I mean, I feel like I'm living in crazy land sometimes because it's like we haven't sat here and criticized ice. We haven't sat here, and so that the tactics are bad as if we haven't sat here and said yes, they've often violated.
All of that is readily admittable.
However, However, again that does not give you license to be rampaging through private institutions and to go and intimidate people who you disagree with, which is the fundamental belief of left wing activism in and of itself. They do not actually believe that my position or the position of millions of people, for many who voted in twenty twenty four that mass deportation and illegal should go back, which
again won the popular vote. Let me remind everyone that is not a legitimate position, and that any of those people should be driven from public life and have no right and tower to speak. That is probably the mainstream view of liberal activism. And let's say DSA or any of these types of people, that is objectionable because it is pretty clear to me that those people are not
really consistent with any sort of democratic values. And for all the left's talk of nineteen thirties Germany, what they forget is that these were the same tactics used by the communists. This is actually the exact same playbook of street gangs and all of that that was playing out of anarchism at the time didn't work out so well
for all of you. Or the Spanish Civil War and the same murder of a lot of people who were in religious institutions, which is eventually what led to the rise of Spanish fascism.
Because it's not just about tactics.
It is also about the same level of moralism of protest behavior, and I view that fundamentally as a danger. You don't because you think it's courageous. It is a
massive danger to living in a heterogeneous society. And the same way that you see illiberalism on the right, I can point to this exactly and the handling and the basically effective endorsement of this by the democratic industrial complex and to say, wow, illiberalism is still alive and well whenever it comes to the institutionalized that we can.
We can wrap this up.
But I will just say there is really no comparison between the quote unquote illiberalism of the Biden administration, which I you know, yes condemn, you were.
One of the few europe that's.
Okay, yeah, and the illiberalism of the Trump administration. There is no comparison. There is no comparison. And I mean we're about to cover some of the like rise of censorship and whatever. You have the criminalizing of pro Palestinian descent, you have the labeling of anyone who would protest them as domestic terrorists. You have the absolute immunity granted to ice thugs to rampage in American streets.
Can we can we just say just because the Vice president said it doesn't make it true?
That is no, but it but not to harp on this, but it does actually make it true because that is the way that they're operating. I mean, is Jonathan Ross being investigated?
No, but you absolutely yes.
It would be to say that he's forever has immunity, which is like not true. Liberals will eventually come back into power and there's no statute of limitation on murder. I think you would also, Yeah, but it's pretty maybe, I mean, but yet that are even eligible for pardon.
Yes, uh, well, yeah, I'm pretty sure.
I checked on this and there was some weird case lock something about state charges.
I'm not exactly sure, but my understanding is that he could be pardoned the state and federal thing. It's a it's a question mark. But in any case, the view of this administration is that they have absolutely immunity, and that is the way that they have that those agents have clearly internalized based on the way they're acting and also the things that they're saying to protesters on the street.
So in any case, that is nowhere like they are not in the same ballpark with the illiberalism that was evidenced in the Biden administration, which was you know, marginal compared to what we are seeing here in terms of the criminalization of dissent and the you know, the crushing of the media, the crushing like even bringing law firms to heal universities, getting professors fired, all of that, and they genuinely, like Trump will say it, he thinks it
should be illegal to criticize him. He says that out loud, right, So I don't see the two things as equivalent, and you can rely on me that if you know, democrats are the left gets in power and there is our abuses that are truly illiberal that I will be critical there, but I am not going to do it both sides, because I don't think that the two sides have been remotely equivalent. And by the way, one of them is in power right now and one of them a list.
One will soon be in power. And I think that many of the norms that may have kept the Biden administration or any of those people from doing what truly was in those hearts are now shattered. And next thing we know, and you know, I mean, I don't think people should confuse. I am really not arguing with you. I don't think you're the problem. I really don't. Yeah, but I think the democratic industrial complex is the problem.
And Keith Ellison and all of the people who are actually going to be in power, I'm like, oh yeah, especially we it's have been normalized now under Trump. I think a lot of people like a lot of the same tactics which were dreams of the BLM movement and all of that and anti racism amendments.
After what has now.
Happened under the Trump administration, I think it will be a reality, and I don't doubt that you would speak on behalf of civil liberties for right wingers, but I don't think that that's necessarily a consistent view, and much of the right is to blame for it as well, which is why I often call it out, especially on the censorship stuff, because I'm not dumb. The people who are lawyers, professors, and governors are all watching this and saying, Okay, we never did it out of norms. Now the norm
is shattered, which means it's going to happen. And I think that America is basically going to go through some sort of like nineteen nineties South Africa truth and reconciliation movement whenever a Democrat comes back into the White House.
And yeah, I don't think it's going to go that well, all right, long debate.
I apologize to the audience, but I hope it was somewhat elucidating.
Is that the right word. Let's get to the next block.