Energy, Marriage, Math, and Japanese Whiskey with Eric Kowalski

[SPEAKER_01]: Welcome to Bourbon with Brad. [SPEAKER_00]: The views and opinions shared on the bourbon with Brad podcast are our own, and those of our guests. [SPEAKER_00]: Nothing we discussed should be taken as financial, legal, business, or gambling advice. [SPEAKER_00]: Don't make investment, business, or betting decisions based on our conversations as you should always talk to a qualified professional.

[SPEAKER_00]: Always drink responsibly, never drink and drive, and only consume alcohol if you are of legal drinking age.

[SPEAKER_07]: welcome back as you might have noticed we have changed our scenery it's no longer winter so fire would be roasting us out of here but we do have the fire going in the backdrop but we thought the most appropriate place for our spring summer filming would be right at the bar so why not be right at the bourbon bar and we have a great selection behind us and we got a great

[SPEAKER_07]: uh... guessed in the house today mister air coalski and uh... we have a special segment that we're starting today uh... with the familiar face that was on uh... last week and that's loose her bowl and uh... it's going to be called lubricity and we'll get into that later on but i'm gonna start uh... start off a little bit with some of the headlines that are are going on in the the week uh... especially in the a i space uh... there was a couple big ones uh... you might have read about and first being that open a i raised a hundred

[SPEAKER_07]: This round, which is the largest raise by any company, not just a tech company, so it's They certainly still have the confidence of the investors behind them.

[SPEAKER_07]: I know we've debated in the past Whether or not they was continuing to be able to raise money, but when they raised the most money Then anybody's raised that includes anybody in history [SPEAKER_07]: It's pretty incredible that they're still going so, you know, they raised 120 billion in March They've reported earnings over the month of two million or two billion dollars So they're on track for about 24 billion 25 billion over over the year in revenue

[SPEAKER_07]: And they're up to 900 million users a day. [SPEAKER_07]: So the numbers are big. [SPEAKER_07]: I know there's been some concern over the anthropic and open AI wars that we're going on. [SPEAKER_07]: especially as a result of the Department of War. [SPEAKER_07]: But now, there was even a call to have to have subscribers blackball, open AI over the fact they stepped in without any guardrails up that like anthropic was asking for.

[SPEAKER_07]: And supposedly they lost close to two and a half million users, but when they have 900 million users a month, that's less than 1% so it's kind of a drop in the bucket. [SPEAKER_07]: So but anthropic on the other hand has has has benefited from it. [SPEAKER_07]: So this is the first time since anthropic has started and in mind you remember Dario used to work for OpenAI.

[SPEAKER_07]: He was the one that designed chat GPT 2 in 3. [SPEAKER_07]: So, you know, he's very familiar with the OpenAI product and started anthropic in Claude and cursor and is now for the very first time after the first quarter,

[SPEAKER_07]: are actually more than open AI, which is quite amazing if you think about it since anthropics is a much younger company, open AI is impressive in and of itself, but they're actually reported earnings to the tune of about $30 billion if you look at what they reported over the month. [SPEAKER_07]: Kudos to Dario, I think a lot of it has also been the quality of his cursor product and Claude.

[SPEAKER_07]: I've been using in them myself, and I got to tell you, it's impressive, that was telling you before we went on to air, that's, you know, I'm getting into the software business and cursor, Claude cursor is amazing, that's all I can say. [SPEAKER_07]: If I can do it, anybody can do it. [SPEAKER_09]: you should be a screenshot of that, that coding screen. [SPEAKER_09]: I was like, my eyes kind of boggles like home.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, it's a little intimidating at first, but once you get the hang of it and realizes, it's just a conversation between you and the agent and the agent's doing all the heavy lifting of the coding on the background. [SPEAKER_07]: It's pretty impressive. [SPEAKER_07]: Interesting. [SPEAKER_07]: Pretty impressive. [SPEAKER_07]: So that was a major headline of the week.

[SPEAKER_07]: Another major, not so good news was there [SPEAKER_07]: autonomous agent that hacked into one of the oldest operating systems and thought to be one of the most secure systems. [SPEAKER_07]: In fact, Netflix uses it. [SPEAKER_07]: Sony uses it for the PlayStation. [SPEAKER_09]: There's lots, it was me. [SPEAKER_07]: I do it. [SPEAKER_07]: I'm sure that figured out Perry was playing around with these agents a little bit.

[SPEAKER_07]: But then the operating system for all the techies out there is called FreeBSD and it's an open source and it allows like Apple uses it and then they're allowed to also modify it but then they don't have to disclose it. [SPEAKER_07]: So it's nice to be able to use it as a baseline for your operating system and a lot of the big companies use it. [SPEAKER_07]: So it was frightening this this past week is an autonomous agent broken and hacked it.

[SPEAKER_07]: in four hours so it wasn't even enough time to assemble a governance team to be able to take care of it.

[SPEAKER_07]: So obviously the governance in cyber security folks it put chills down their spines a little bit this week and measures are going to have to be taken place on the defensive side to make sure that this doesn't happen again as it could have you know quite some ram [SPEAKER_07]: Also on the crypto world, I don't know if anybody's been following the crypto world this week, but you know, with the Iran, you know, are we stopping ceasefire or not stopping ceasefire?

[SPEAKER_07]: The crypto world in the stock market, I'm sure is doing the same thing, is bouncing like a rubber ball. [SPEAKER_07]: So it's, you know, are we stopping? [SPEAKER_07]: So I think we're on a semi-pause right now for two weeks, and so the crypto is seen in an uptick, which is great.

[SPEAKER_07]: But, uh, [SPEAKER_07]: It's very volatile, so if you're going to have an appetite for crypto, you better be prepared to watch the ups and downs as it goes up and down with just the slightest nudge in the news.

[SPEAKER_07]: Fundamentals don't seem to, you know, always [SPEAKER_07]: hold strong through the news stories with crypto they certainly push crypto one way or another when they do come out but it seems like the latest headlines with with the numbers on what oils at which we're going to get into here with Erica as we as we go on and

[SPEAKER_07]: And also, you know, what inflation's doing and the interest rates and all the stuff that are in the normal discussion points of the market crypto is seeing now those come into play, especially since the Gemini Act is is is is again place and ready to go.

[SPEAKER_07]: One last headline I wanted to kind of relay, especially since Lou's going to be here with us on the next segment is that Utah in the AI world is the first state to adopt and allow or should save medical refills and prescriptions by AI agents. [SPEAKER_05]: interesting. [SPEAKER_07]: So it is interesting. [SPEAKER_07]: So it's really a burst of many. [SPEAKER_09]: I'm sure. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, it's a big step in the right direction. [SPEAKER_07]: Now it's the refill.

[SPEAKER_07]: So there's obviously been a doctor that has looked over at first hand and I'm sure it's the follow-up questions that the agent can do very well and make sure that the scorecard is checking all the boxes that it needs to make sure that they're going to actually approve that refill.

[SPEAKER_07]: But [SPEAKER_07]: It's the start of what I anticipate more to come, especially in the medical world, so we'll see what Lou has to think about that when he comes on to set, but it certainly is interesting. [SPEAKER_07]: In the final thing in the medical field, the chief officer of the New York Hospital System, which is the largest hospital system in America, came out this week and he said, I can

[SPEAKER_07]: especially that now that they know that the quality is there, he got a lot of kickback, of course, you know, the radiologist, you know, we're kicking back and others as well, saying you're putting literally people's life's apparel, if you're going to be relying solely on agents and imaging and to do it, they certainly can do it. [SPEAKER_07]: I still think there needs to be in my opinion, you know, human oversight because, [SPEAKER_07]: the risk.

[SPEAKER_07]: I mean, if you want to talk about a high risk category, as the European Union likes to categorize these things into three, I think life and death when it comes to missing something on a radiology report is certainly one of them. [SPEAKER_07]: So, at least initially, I would hope to see that if they're going to try to roll these out, that there's folks [SPEAKER_07]: folks actually looking over what's being done to make sure it is reliable and accurate, like a final set of eyes.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, definitely. [SPEAKER_07]: You definitely need a final set of eyes, or or, you know, in what the preliminary studies, especially out of the Cleveland Clinic, have showed is that, you know, this imaging, you know, with AI, it studies all these different images is able to tell you exactly, you know, this is what it looks like when this happens, you know, [SPEAKER_07]: So let's say able to pick up anomalies at the human eye, you know, certainly can't pick up.

[SPEAKER_07]: So we do know that the potential is there to pick up things that the radiologists would normally miss. [SPEAKER_07]: And obviously earlier on that they can detect it, you and I have talked about this over the past. [SPEAKER_07]: I think you were even there when I first talked about it at one of my first speeches at the library. [SPEAKER_07]: So, you know, imaging is one of those things that is going to be impacted. [SPEAKER_07]: I agree with. [SPEAKER_07]: with what he had to say.

[SPEAKER_07]: But we'll see how they roll it out. [SPEAKER_07]: And we should all be cautious and I hope he is too. [SPEAKER_07]: So those are the major headlines this week. [SPEAKER_07]: And now I want to formally introduce Eric Kolsky again as he's on set. [SPEAKER_07]: And in the in the in the new Bourbon studio. [SPEAKER_07]: Welcome, brother. [SPEAKER_05]: Thank you, brother. [SPEAKER_05]: I appreciate it. [SPEAKER_07]: It's good to see you. [SPEAKER_07]: Cheers, dear.

[SPEAKER_07]: Cheers, bud. [SPEAKER_07]: Thank you. [SPEAKER_07]: So, and I, you know, we got more things to cheers about. [SPEAKER_07]: I mean, you just recently got married. [SPEAKER_07]: I did. [SPEAKER_07]: Yep, I did. [SPEAKER_07]: Congratulations. [SPEAKER_07]: Congratulations, sir. [SPEAKER_07]: I appreciate that. [SPEAKER_07]: Tell us all about it. [SPEAKER_07]: No, it was over in Japan, right?

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, over in Japan, my wife, she's a lovely Japanese lady, with no one each other since 2010. [SPEAKER_05]: Okay. [SPEAKER_05]: So about 16 years, no one each other. [SPEAKER_05]: Had the wedding in Tokyo, awesome. [SPEAKER_05]: At the Mandarin Oriental, had the reception in the Oak Room, just waiting for those photos to come back. [SPEAKER_05]: And I'll share those with you one hour. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: Will we do happen? [SPEAKER_05]: Be another couple months.

[SPEAKER_05]: Awesome. [SPEAKER_05]: Can't wait to see him. [SPEAKER_05]: Can't wait to show him to you. [SPEAKER_05]: Well, you know, did you meet her because, you know, you worked over in Japan, right? [SPEAKER_05]: I did. [SPEAKER_05]: I worked in Japan for seven years. [SPEAKER_05]: I was in Osaka for one year and then six years in Tokyo. [SPEAKER_05]: And I was actually in Japan when the great Hanchu earthquake hit.

[SPEAKER_05]: I was in, I was in, I was in Genza, right across in the palace, and then in an office room. [SPEAKER_05]: I think it was around 245, 247 and [SPEAKER_05]: 2011. [SPEAKER_05]: We were getting ready to leave for the week. [SPEAKER_05]: And here it was, we've felt other earthquakes before, but not quite like that. [SPEAKER_05]: Well, that was a, I mean, that was a boomer and it was the, what was it on the Richter scale above nine?

[SPEAKER_05]: Wow. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, that's impactful. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, and it's very, and it felt like you were on a wave. [SPEAKER_05]: It just felt this small wave and just got more violent to that you couldn't stand. [SPEAKER_05]: You could barely sit. [SPEAKER_07]: Where were you when it first started? [SPEAKER_07]: Um, in the bathroom? [SPEAKER_05]: I see. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_10]: I see. [SPEAKER_07]: Can I say that? [SPEAKER_10]: Can I say that?

[SPEAKER_07]: It was a terrorist quake. [SPEAKER_07]: No, we're going to expose the podcast. [SPEAKER_07]: Trust me. [SPEAKER_07]: We could have the four warning. [SPEAKER_06]: It was it was moving everywhere. [SPEAKER_06]: No, it's right now. [SPEAKER_09]: Sinami, Sinami is a splash in water splash in everywhere. [SPEAKER_05]: Yes, water everywhere. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, for just horrible, horrible experience. [SPEAKER_09]: Was that the Fukushima one? [SPEAKER_05]: Yes. [SPEAKER_05]: Exactly.

[SPEAKER_05]: And then the Sinami happened. [SPEAKER_05]: We didn't even know about the tsunami until about two and a half hours after. [SPEAKER_05]: Well, finally, finally left the building. [SPEAKER_05]: She's. [SPEAKER_05]: But that was scary. [SPEAKER_07]: I mean, that's a whole different... [SPEAKER_07]: hold a different type of natural disaster that, you know, here in Indiana Pennsylvania, we don't have to really worry about too much.

[SPEAKER_07]: I mean, we do get a few quivers of earthquakes, but that's more from the Marcellal shell, uh, essentially, essentially. [SPEAKER_07]: As we're don't see on, that's not really the natural injection wells that we have. [SPEAKER_05]: That's right. [SPEAKER_05]: We can talk about that as well. [SPEAKER_05]: You go injection wells. [SPEAKER_05]: We do. [SPEAKER_05]: We do.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, interesting part of that story is [SPEAKER_05]: I would we talk about first mover advantage and I think when you talk about first mover advantage I'll think many people understand there is there is a significant first mover advantage in some cases not always If you have second mover advantage if you talk about technology, but we when Fukushima when the first reactor When they had to hydrogen explosion One of my really good friends one of my best friends.

[SPEAKER_05]: I was the best man in this wedding a couple years ago [SPEAKER_05]: He, um, who's on the leadership team for the company I was working for, and having a chat with him saying, Kai, we need to evacuate our expats, and we have to, we have to be first, because you look at scarcity of, of shinkansen tickets, the bullet train, right?

[SPEAKER_05]: Hotel rooms, but flight, et cetera, and, and all the other foreign companies in Tokyo, [SPEAKER_05]: If we didn't move first, someone else was gonna move first. [SPEAKER_07]: So is it just first come first serve then? [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, there's a limited, well, limited number of seats, right? [SPEAKER_05]: I know people were concerned about their families. [SPEAKER_05]: Pretty scary when a nuclear plant explodes, and you don't know why.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: So we were the first to evacuate our expats and their families. [SPEAKER_05]: Rented two, seven, four, sevens. [SPEAKER_05]: I met every family at Osaka station, brought them to different hotels in the area. [SPEAKER_05]: And I moved 80 of my team members were moved down as well for about a month at a rolling blackouts in Tokyo But that was a I was a heck of it. [SPEAKER_05]: That was a heck of a that was a heck of a time. [SPEAKER_05]: How long ago was that no?

[SPEAKER_05]: That was 2011. [SPEAKER_05]: Okay. [SPEAKER_05]: Yep. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, so that they haven't had anything like that since not like that since so they were obviously Hopefully able to learn from there did they were they able to pinpoint what caused that? [SPEAKER_05]: Um, they understand the earthquake piece of it. [SPEAKER_05]: What happened at Fukushima was, there's a great show in Netflix called The Days. [SPEAKER_05]: It's in Japanese. [SPEAKER_07]: Well, yeah.

[SPEAKER_07]: I know it's the earthquake. [SPEAKER_07]: I mean, so I'm assuming that these, if you're having a nuclear plant there, or an hydrogen explosion, it's kind of made for at least the normal earthquakes are going to happen, right? [SPEAKER_05]: So. [SPEAKER_07]: Right. [SPEAKER_07]: But, uh, did they, were they able to take other measures?

[SPEAKER_07]: Uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, [SPEAKER_07]: So, if this happens again, this isn't something that the folks of Japan have to worry about. [SPEAKER_05]: I think they understand the root cause, which was the tsunami was the root cause. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: And it knocked out one of the general readings about backup power stations at the plant. [SPEAKER_05]: It wasn't high enough.

[SPEAKER_05]: And they knew it wasn't high enough. [SPEAKER_05]: But had it been, I think, another 30 meters higher in a different location. [SPEAKER_09]: Yeah, that's what I mean, I've watched the documentary. [SPEAKER_09]: I think it was on Netflix.

[SPEAKER_09]: I don't know if it was the one you're talking about, but But they talked a lot about the salt water that infiltrated that caused a lot of problems and then the power outage shut off the pumps Yep, they couldn't pump the water in there to keep it cool and it overheated and blah, blah, blah And it was very reminiscent of three mile analytics except for different reasons

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, that's kind of the way I remember it, but I guess it all makes sense that it's all connected, right? [SPEAKER_07]: So, it's scary and to think that, you know, I guess when I'm asking is there a fix and it sounds like the fix is fairly easy, you just put it a little higher, right? [SPEAKER_07]: A little higher.

[SPEAKER_07]: And that's reassuring to the population and know that this wasn't something that was very high tech that we're still trying to find to this day, so correct. [SPEAKER_05]: The problem, I think, is the government and TEPCO, the Tokyo Electrical Power Company. [SPEAKER_05]: They had a study that was done prior to the placement. [SPEAKER_05]: And they knew, I think it was back in the 1800s.

[SPEAKER_05]: That tsunami could reach if a tsunami did hit, it would reach those, those, those height. [SPEAKER_05]: So they knew a few more millions of dollars and you wouldn't have lost billions, I guess. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, the infrastructure initially, right? [SPEAKER_07]: So you're always, you're always waiting out, how far do we go? [SPEAKER_07]: And is it always, is it even enough if we go that far? [SPEAKER_07]: So yeah, true. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, exactly.

[SPEAKER_09]: No, that makes sense. [SPEAKER_09]: And two of those units are still online, right? [SPEAKER_07]: No. [SPEAKER_09]: I'll say it's totally shut down. [SPEAKER_07]: Totally shut down. [SPEAKER_05]: I think I don't have another one now. [SPEAKER_05]: Have they gone to different power source now? [SPEAKER_05]: You know? [SPEAKER_05]: It's highly, Japan is highly nuclear, you know, as, as, as base load. [SPEAKER_05]: But, uh, the other head of the curve.

[SPEAKER_05]: They're ahead of the curve from that perspective, yes. [SPEAKER_05]: And, you know, it's interesting, too, is after we could talk about energy markets. [SPEAKER_05]: But after that happened, um, Germany and, and some other countries in Europe started to be tired. [SPEAKER_05]: They're, they're power plants. [SPEAKER_05]: They're base load nuclear plants. [SPEAKER_05]: and we know, and it was all good until 2023 when you crane happened, right?

[SPEAKER_05]: It was all good until that, and gas wasn't cheap anymore. [SPEAKER_07]: No. [SPEAKER_07]: No, it wasn't. [SPEAKER_07]: It wasn't. [SPEAKER_07]: And oil's not cheap right now either. [SPEAKER_07]: Thanks to the, you know, let's talk about that. [SPEAKER_07]: So that, before we get into that. [SPEAKER_07]: What were you doing? [SPEAKER_07]: What industry were you in when you were over in Japan?

[SPEAKER_05]: I'm sure the listeners looked like they know I worked for Ericsson Swedish company telecommunications company. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, yeah, that's a thing. [SPEAKER_05]: I'm cutting edge stuff. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, yeah Mobile mobile technology. [SPEAKER_05]: I mean It's the backbone of of our of our devices of everything. [SPEAKER_05]: Everything. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, everything. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, so Interesting company was good times.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah [SPEAKER_07]: Was that the, was that the position you were in right before you started into the oil and natural gas business? [SPEAKER_05]: No, I had, um, so after Ericsson, I moved to California, uh, work for a startup, telecommunication startup, uh, which was very interesting. [SPEAKER_05]: And after that, I ended up moving to, or who's Denmark. [SPEAKER_05]: And as my first, first time in the energy field, it would work Vestus wind systems.

[SPEAKER_05]: Okay. [SPEAKER_05]: Another interesting technology generating technology, yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: Good to place the habit and the windmill capital of the world. [SPEAKER_05]: Yep, exactly. [SPEAKER_05]: I think it was 47% of all generated power comes from windmills. [SPEAKER_05]: At that time, that was 2015 to 2017. [SPEAKER_05]: That's probably going up, since. [SPEAKER_05]: Yep. [SPEAKER_05]: Yep. [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, for sure. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, for sure.

[SPEAKER_07]: Well, it makes sense to make, you know, use of your natural resources of whatever they might be, especially when you can capture it at a reasonable rate than past it on, right? [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, you did a mix of power. [SPEAKER_05]: You can't just all the, we can't put all your eggs in the same basket, right? [SPEAKER_07]: No, we're seeing that right now with Iran, right?

[SPEAKER_07]: Yep. [SPEAKER_07]: I mean, you know, when you, and right now a lot of, you know, at states, especially in not just the United States, but China and you go across the European Union.

[SPEAKER_07]: a lot of them are relying on natural gas and oil and oil has spiked significantly and you know we're we're it's affecting everybody or you know from the pumps to you know you're heating bill at home to to you know we're looking at getting a parking lot paved at the country club and and it prices spike 30 we one month we we have so I weren't for [SPEAKER_09]: They, they, they, they are partly soy based, but they're still petroleum product.

[SPEAKER_09]: And we just, we just, today, or yesterday, got hit with a, uh, they're calling it a search charge. [SPEAKER_09]: I, those things tend to never go away, but a search charge on ink because of what's going on in their hand. [SPEAKER_05]: It, it affects the global economy. [SPEAKER_05]: Everything. [SPEAKER_05]: And I think that the concern, at least my concern, it is, it is, it's stagnation. [SPEAKER_05]: And we can get into that a little bit later.

[SPEAKER_05]: Oh, yeah, get into it. [SPEAKER_05]: But, um, [SPEAKER_05]: If you look at Oramark, it's specifically energy markets. [SPEAKER_05]: Your LNG and Japan, South Korea, Philippines, those countries are really going to feel the crunch. [SPEAKER_05]: They're all price takers. [SPEAKER_05]: And here in the United States, we have so much gas. [SPEAKER_05]: I mean, the Permium hub is negative. [SPEAKER_05]: So it's negative pricing. [SPEAKER_05]: They're paying.

[SPEAKER_05]: to put the gas through a pipeline, essentially. [SPEAKER_05]: And here, in the Appalachia, there's multiple different hubs, Dominion South, for example. [SPEAKER_05]: We're priced at a discount to Henry Hub. [SPEAKER_05]: That's what you'll see on 9x.

[SPEAKER_05]: But if we think about energy markets, and we think about cost, and we think about inflation, you have to think about the opposite as well, which is if costs are higher and economic growth decreases, [SPEAKER_05]: in the same time period, then you have your makings of stagflation, which what's happened in the 70s. [SPEAKER_05]: That was a little bit different though because price controls were a policy at that time, but this could be in the next eight months.

[SPEAKER_05]: Ten months you could see a global recession, which I hope does not happen. [SPEAKER_05]: They have to clean this thing up and around as soon as possible. [SPEAKER_07]: Well, and that's, you know, it's amazing how something like this, you know, has such a ripple effect, you know, it's almost like a tsunami effect.

[SPEAKER_05]: It's almost a tsunami effect, and then you have, you have to take even third order effects as well, where, you know, those, those golf countries, those reservoirs for oil. [SPEAKER_05]: shutting those, shutting those in, it's not shutting like it's not shutting a gas wall in where it repressurizes and you could flow it a little later time, it's not when maybe prices are better.

[SPEAKER_05]: But in this case, they could be permanently damaged, those reservoirs could be permanently damaged, where you do not have the, what you thought you had in the ground.

[SPEAKER_05]: is no longer the case no longer the case you almost have to do hold a new geological study to figure out what you're dealing with after exactly and there's a bunch of reasons why yeah yeah that makes sense so that could happen in the future so we we need some optionality here I know Chevron is looking into Venezuela

[SPEAKER_05]: They're infrastructure is just so poorly managed over the past couple decades before they could even get back into 90s production they'll have to spend about eight to ten billion dollars just in the infrastructure Pipelines etc. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, so [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, I've heard a couple companies that are going over the data centers are going over there too.

[SPEAKER_07]: So I think, you know, it makes sense why why share runs looking over there to try and they're obviously trying to provide the The power source for those data centers.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, no, it's the energy business right now is a fascinating business and you know, we start talking a little bit about nuclear and obviously that's that's a big push under the current administration is nuclear, you know, they've [SPEAKER_07]: Westinghouse has an $80 billion initiative that they're undertaking and that's just them alone and there's other companies out there as well.

[SPEAKER_07]: So, you know, the small nuclear modular reactors are going to be, I think, the future. [SPEAKER_07]: They're not as quite high risk of a fallout, you know, that we thought, you know, from three mile an hour island. [SPEAKER_07]: they do provide a reliable long-term energy source, little capital intensive of front, but very clean, once it's up and running. [SPEAKER_07]: Very clean and very cheap as well. [SPEAKER_05]: Exactly, so once it's going, it's a great energy source.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yep, it's great, great for base power. [SPEAKER_05]: Yes, base load power is fantastic. [SPEAKER_07]: So I think we're close to getting to there, but it's not going to happen overnight, obviously regulatory measures because we're still under the old regulations that we're still in effect after the three mile. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, one fallout, so the Congress needs to get together and figure out how we're going to regulate this industry as it comes online.

[SPEAKER_07]: But also, you know, the money that's being put into it, you know, it doesn't happen overnight, you know, that, yeah, they're all, all guns, you know, are brought up to the front line for this, but it's going to take four or five years, I think, at least. [SPEAKER_07]: It's at least, you know, before we even see it making any kind of headway into the market.

[SPEAKER_07]: But natural gas when we come back after this segment, we're going to talk about natural gas because that is really, you know, it's it's it's fun to me is my background is in in that as well and that's you know, that's a reunite kind of bonded over our first bourbon, but we're going to get into the natural gas industry a little bit more than what's going on right now when we come right back. [SPEAKER_07]: Awesome. [SPEAKER_07]: Cheers brother.

[SPEAKER_10]: Cheers. [SPEAKER_03]: Mike, N-I-L is getting expensive. [SPEAKER_03]: Schools need new revenue. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, but not another alumni fundraiser. [SPEAKER_02]: I've got enough tote bags. [SPEAKER_02]: What if your EDM adds saved you 10% and donated 10% to JMU? [SPEAKER_04]: Wait. [SPEAKER_04]: What? [SPEAKER_03]: How? [SPEAKER_03]: AlumniMeds.com, you get US License Healthcare, and the school gets a cut. [SPEAKER_03]: Win, win, win.

[SPEAKER_12]: Now, that's a stat I can get behind. [SPEAKER_12]: Go Dukes. [SPEAKER_03]: Already low prices, fast turnaround, totally discreet. [SPEAKER_03]: Visit alumnimedes.com and choose your alma mater. [SPEAKER_07]: And we're back.

[SPEAKER_07]: And we're back with air cool all school we've been talking energy and as you can see we we have Lou on set As we start off the lucidity segment so we figured we wouldn't talk about the bourbon yet as [SPEAKER_07]: Before we get to the even the bourbon let's talk about what lubricity is because you know we know what lubricity is But you know, and when we say lubricity for the listeners out there. [SPEAKER_07]: We're not talking like the L U B Liberty.

[SPEAKER_08]: We're talking about the L O U B Well, interestingly, we actually probably aren't talking about the lubricity as we know lubricant [SPEAKER_08]: It just opens and my name is Lou. [SPEAKER_08]: So we change it just to create a new brand. [SPEAKER_07]: You are through on the ED pills right back into the mix, all right? [SPEAKER_07]: Just say right back into the Lou. [SPEAKER_08]: I try to stay away from that, but as we learned a couple of weeks ago, the jokes keep writing themselves.

[SPEAKER_08]: I can't stay away from it. [SPEAKER_08]: But no, actually it's not my term a friend of mine a couple of years ago said, you know, I'm just just about getting perfectly lubricatized and I said, Dan, and what the hell does that mean? [SPEAKER_08]: He says, well, there's different levels of lubricity and I said explain it to me. [SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, what is, what is lubricant? [SPEAKER_08]: Well, lubricity is kind of that, I don't know if it's going, I'm with two smart guys here.

[SPEAKER_08]: Is it a bell curve when you kind of go up and then plateau and then drop off or what kind of curve would we call that error? [SPEAKER_07]: It's definitely a bell curve, but it definitely falls off. [SPEAKER_08]: That is fall off. [SPEAKER_08]: So real quick to tell you, um, we're, uh, we're copywriting the word and, uh, what my definition is, and I think, uh, you guys might get it right away. [SPEAKER_08]: Is lubricity is there's three levels of lubricity.

[SPEAKER_08]: And we haven't figured out if it's a noun, a verb, an adjective, or word fits in, could be all into any, you know, you need to look in the western dictionary. [SPEAKER_07]: Many times there's words that have many different meanings. [SPEAKER_07]: Sure. [SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, sure.

[SPEAKER_08]: So the first level of lubricity is that first drink when you get out in an evening when you come out, you've had a bad day, you're not sure what to do and you're sitting there and you're just kind of chilling and nothing has nothing's working and then all of a sudden like maybe that second drink all of a sudden you're like [SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, maybe I think I'm ready to talk to somebody right now and start to move a little bit with the music in the background.

[SPEAKER_08]: Checking everything out across the bar. [SPEAKER_08]: So that's what I like to call the minimum lubricity. [SPEAKER_08]: Minimum lubricity and the data isn't so bad at that point. [SPEAKER_08]: It doesn't, right? [SPEAKER_08]: Everything's looking up at that point. [SPEAKER_08]: And then once you kind of hang out and you're moving a little bit, then you order another one or whatever one or two. [SPEAKER_08]: then I go to optimum lubricity.

[SPEAKER_08]: And optimum lubricity is when you're really good at. [SPEAKER_08]: It's when you think you're John Travolta, right? [SPEAKER_08]: You're on the pants or dancing. [SPEAKER_07]: But are you really John Travolta? [SPEAKER_07]: I mean, so is there, is there a correlation between what you think and what you're actually doing? [SPEAKER_08]: At this point, an optimum lubricity, you're still connected to it. [SPEAKER_07]: Okay, good. [SPEAKER_08]: We're still good with that.

[SPEAKER_08]: So you're a Travolta on the dance floor. [SPEAKER_08]: You could be, whoever the, one of the all-time studs was, you think you're that right now. [SPEAKER_08]: So you're getting good. [SPEAKER_08]: You're talking to everybody. [SPEAKER_08]: You can even actually sing right now. [SPEAKER_08]: So if you have any ability now, optimum lubricity is about where you reach your as good as you're going to be. [SPEAKER_08]: And do you have a number that goes along with us?

[SPEAKER_08]: Well, I do. [SPEAKER_08]: I'm kind of even though I'm a reasonably big guy. [SPEAKER_08]: I'm kind of on the lightweight side of things. [SPEAKER_08]: So my minimum diversity is about 1.2 beers. [SPEAKER_08]: Like a good IPM talking about here about 1.2. [SPEAKER_08]: I can talk with you and I'm starting to loosen up a little bit. [SPEAKER_08]: And I probably come and on some things that I don't really know much about. [SPEAKER_08]: But I think I do.

[SPEAKER_07]: You just rolled it here without having a drink. [SPEAKER_07]: I'm telling you what, you're, I think you're already at your home. [SPEAKER_07]: I'm pointy. [SPEAKER_09]: He is Lou, so, you know, Lou Brissley is just kind of bullshit. [SPEAKER_08]: So now I'm about 1.2 IPAs, and then I reach my optimum lubricity, generally, about 2.9 to 3.5 IPAs, and that's when I'm really good. [SPEAKER_08]: I'm going America's got to. [SPEAKER_08]: talent.

[SPEAKER_08]: I could go on one of those dance shows go on American Idol. [SPEAKER_08]: I could maybe even be one of those broadcasters from the war zone when your hair is perfect and everything. [SPEAKER_08]: Well, your hair is really perfect. [SPEAKER_08]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_08]: So that generally in the 2.7 to 3.5 range. [SPEAKER_07]: Now, just so our listeners know, when you're saying these numbers, let's not confuse them with what you'd blow into, you know, when you get pulled over.

[SPEAKER_08]: Oh, no. [SPEAKER_08]: No. [SPEAKER_08]: I think probably an optimum lubricity, you're probably still under the legal limit. [SPEAKER_08]: And I do want to point out, this is non-scientific, folks. [SPEAKER_08]: I can't believe a personal wrap that I have in my hand. [SPEAKER_09]: Brad took care of all the disclaimers of the previous year. [SPEAKER_07]: Good, you're good. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, I think, yeah, I would say it's non-scientific, but you've talked about lubricity for years.

[SPEAKER_08]: Well, in my case, it's my science. [SPEAKER_08]: I do have a different science, right? [SPEAKER_08]: And you have a different science. [SPEAKER_08]: So I can't wait to unveil in a week or two, perhaps the logo that we're going to use Brad for this whole thing. [SPEAKER_08]: But my, as I said, I'm generally good up to about three point four. [SPEAKER_08]: Okay. [SPEAKER_08]: Now, optimum reciprocity is really close to maximum reciprocity.

[SPEAKER_07]: So it's kind of like the Saturday night to Sunday morning, uh, while it could be the crossover, it's that let's use when they, when the clock strikes midnight. [UNKNOWN]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_08]: The optimum lubricity is just one beer from max lubricity, which is generally one drink from a fall off a cliff right into assholeville, okay?

[SPEAKER_08]: I think y'all guys, everybody with all of them, that's just guys, but everybody's at assholeville with the new little town that's right there, we've all been there, we've all been to assholeville and each street is named after a different asshole, it's just kind of my own little nerdy pharmacist, my street to call this guy, I just keep going around and [SPEAKER_08]: that happens too. [SPEAKER_08]: That's happened a couple of things people recently.

[SPEAKER_08]: Sometimes you flip over when you go round and serve something that you take into your sharp. [SPEAKER_08]: But no, you know, it's bigger get better. [SPEAKER_08]: that's that's that's that is my definition and one of the new ventures that I'm going to start rolling out here with some product and merch and just start hanging out with people and finding out what's your lubricant. [SPEAKER_08]: What is your lubricant?

[SPEAKER_08]: What is your mind's mind's generally done with beer because I'm more of a beer drinker obviously everything changes. [SPEAKER_07]: Now we also now we all know what the folks the have a lubricant [SPEAKER_08]: Well, I hate, I have one of my best buddies, he's a big guy, man, and he goes from zero to to optimum and real close to assholeville, like when he pops the cup, like he can go like this. [SPEAKER_09]: He gets to be, can we?

[SPEAKER_09]: So can we could we put an assholeville on some of the merch? [SPEAKER_09]: I mean, that has to be on the merch. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, no, I think that's all of them.

[SPEAKER_07]: No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no [SPEAKER_07]: But then you also get over to like you said asshole villain.

[SPEAKER_07]: I'm sure we all know buddies that you want to What them know that after two or three beers or two or three Burbans Maybe that's a neat thing that we should have Asshole bill cards and pass them out when when a guy's crossed over [SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, just letting it or a girl. [SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, the problem is we don't have to just keep this mail. [SPEAKER_08]: There's I've seen I've seen a lot of women get to the point.

[SPEAKER_09]: Yeah, same point as well Once they're an asshole build on the territory you can tell me Perry's not really male or female. [SPEAKER_07]: He's kind of like crossing both lines, but you know it applies to you too, brother. [SPEAKER_09]: Thanks, buddy [SPEAKER_09]: appreciate you shout me out. [SPEAKER_09]: But once you're an assholeville, they don't care. [SPEAKER_09]: You could tell them all night on there.

[SPEAKER_09]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_09]: They're going to take the card and rip it up or stick it up your ass. [SPEAKER_08]: It does become, what does the card do? [SPEAKER_08]: It comes written in stone. [SPEAKER_08]: What does the card do is that? [SPEAKER_08]: We should work on a deal with the bar that we're in interviewing people that night that once you hit assholeville, you get a reprieve and you get a discount on your next beer. [SPEAKER_07]: Or you get an Uber.

[SPEAKER_08]: Are you going to Uber out there would be a need it's almost like I get out of jail court It's to get out of jail free car.

[SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, so maybe we can do we can serve two purposes here We can help you get where you need to be and we can help you get home from there too Yeah, what we got we can just kind of subtly let you know you went into asshole bill night and get out for free sure one time Yeah [SPEAKER_08]: next time is, as I said, my, my, my, my internal, uh, lubricity chart is based on my beers. [SPEAKER_08]: Eric, I know you're more of a, uh, you're, uh, kind of a whiskey and fine, bourbon guy.

[SPEAKER_08]: Where are you at? [SPEAKER_08]: What, uh, I, do you go into a place totally on, on the, uh, smooth side of things? [SPEAKER_08]: Eric's always smooth.

[SPEAKER_07]: Uh, to take you a drink, I mean, he's, he's a Carnegie Mellon, like a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, a, [SPEAKER_09]: Eric starts an optimum will there. [SPEAKER_09]: I start. [SPEAKER_07]: He starts right there.

[SPEAKER_09]: He lives in a perpetual state of Optimistic. [SPEAKER_07]: Optimistic. [SPEAKER_07]: A perpetual horizontal state. [SPEAKER_08]: Yes. [SPEAKER_08]: Well, I guess I didn't say it. [SPEAKER_08]: You money or no. [SPEAKER_08]: No. [SPEAKER_08]: No. [SPEAKER_08]: No. [SPEAKER_08]: So, yeah, it's just kind of a funny thing that I've put together my buddy Dan came up with the word years ago, and it's a great word.

[SPEAKER_08]: You can actually show me a, yeah, I can open her that he had from, and I know Al Gore's probably going to get pissed at me, but he had a site called drinking with Dan. [SPEAKER_08]: I remember that. [SPEAKER_08]: 25 or 30 years ago and I actually had a motor home that he was traveling around. [SPEAKER_08]: I remember that was I think that was before L Gore claimed it.

[SPEAKER_08]: So my buddy Dan did a lot of things back then that we're trying to bring back today and well he was ahead of the times I think in that regard because [SPEAKER_08]: If you would have had YouTube and had the ability to film all that, oh there have been totally- 30 years ago, you mean, if you guys remember the movie, Dumb and Dumber, when the muslode of girls go on their way here, in any context, that was close. [SPEAKER_08]: What were the two? [SPEAKER_08]: Lloyd and Harry.

[SPEAKER_08]: Lloyd Harry, guys, can we get directions? [SPEAKER_08]: Yes, and that way. [SPEAKER_08]: Okay? [SPEAKER_08]: You should have been taken him. [SPEAKER_08]: He said it's that way, right, right? [SPEAKER_08]: So but that's what Dan did back in the day and Dan actually coined the term Lubricity for me and it goes with lubricated when you just get going good. [SPEAKER_08]: We could have called a WD 40. [SPEAKER_08]: Because it's copy or we should maybe have a grease gun at the end.

[SPEAKER_07]: You might want to embed the term lubricity into the ED pills too. [SPEAKER_07]: I mean, just because it gets you lubricated. [SPEAKER_07]: Well, uh, maybe in the metaphorical sense, not in that loose jump a little bit. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, how was it? [SPEAKER_08]: And we want to be loose in that case. [SPEAKER_08]: So we like a tight. [SPEAKER_08]: I don't know. [SPEAKER_08]: Well, and it's another conversation. [SPEAKER_07]: That's a, that's a, that's a matter of preference.

[SPEAKER_07]: I'm sure. [SPEAKER_07]: But when we're talking about that, it maybe I should ask this before we assume. [SPEAKER_07]: If you're taking needy pills, uh, is it okay to drink alcohol while you're taking needy pills? [SPEAKER_08]: OK, now I'm going to go farmers to sign. [SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, I'm not going to tell you to take any medication without a call.

[SPEAKER_08]: That's one of those ones that if you have a drink with it, it's probably not going to have that much of an adverse effect on you. [SPEAKER_08]: But I'm not going to sit here and advocate here for hitting three vahagra and three, which [SPEAKER_07]: I would say it's a Japanese whiskey today and I'm going to bring it in for us here shortly. [SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, I cannot advocate for that, I think maybe keep those two things separate.

[SPEAKER_08]: You'll make probably make better decisions. [SPEAKER_07]: Well, that's good advice, Lou, but the practicality is if you're on ED pills, you're probably out socializing, you're having a few drinks, you know, you're especially for single, you know, you know, or on the second go around, right? [SPEAKER_07]: But, uh, [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, yeah, but there's no there's no world danger. [SPEAKER_08]: I mean, as far as like death kind of danger No, I'm not gonna say there's no danger.

[SPEAKER_07]: Okay. [SPEAKER_07]: You can die. [SPEAKER_07]: That's what he's saying. [SPEAKER_07]: You can just die. [SPEAKER_08]: Just Take your life into your own. [SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, I like to go out that way, right? [SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, no, I do. [SPEAKER_08]: You guys we knew the one on that way [SPEAKER_08]: respect, respect setting, but no, I can't advocate for putting down five beers on top of a couple of a Hagrid tablet.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, that's a that's a a perfect auction that's just ready to explode like what happened over in Japan. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, speaking of Japan, let's let's talk about what we are in Biden today. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, so this is a, this is a sun-todied product. [SPEAKER_05]: Yama-zaki. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: This one is not the Yama-zaki-12. [SPEAKER_05]: It's 1923. [SPEAKER_05]: Yama-zaki was founded by Shinjuri Tori in 1923, hence the year.

[SPEAKER_05]: It's a distillery outside of Kyoto, which in West Japan. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: Their source of water is apparently [SPEAKER_05]: It's incredible so-so water. [SPEAKER_05]: Well, that's a period, which gives it this kind of cloudy with the ice, but- No, but it's a golden moon. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, it gives it a great flavor. [SPEAKER_07]: I mean, there's a few different hints in there, you know, a little bit of strawberry, a little bit.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, it's a little cinnamon. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, a little cinnamon. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, lovely. [SPEAKER_07]: Really, it is lovely. [SPEAKER_07]: How do you like it, Lily? [SPEAKER_08]: It is good. [SPEAKER_08]: Actually, again, I'm not much of a whiskey guy, but the last couple of times with you guys. [SPEAKER_08]: You guys, you guys, you take a meetup to [SPEAKER_08]: past diversity. [SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, you're the optimum. [SPEAKER_08]: You're getting me to max lubricity.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, if you know, if you want to make modifications, you just go with the borrower, borrower owner. [SPEAKER_08]: Interestingly, I happen to be a fan, the IPAs that I like, generally have a hint of grapefruit in and I get just a touch of a grapefruit type. [SPEAKER_08]: That could be a little just a hint of it. [SPEAKER_07]: There's a little bit of fruity. [SPEAKER_06]: Yeah, that's definitely fruity. [SPEAKER_06]: I'll tell them for you a second. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, I love it.

[SPEAKER_07]: But just our listeners know because we are a bourbon podcast. [SPEAKER_07]: This is not a bourbon. [SPEAKER_07]: This is a whiskey. [SPEAKER_07]: But one of our guests in the studio, Bernie Lockard, was so kind to bring us this and we thought we would showcase it and no better to showcase it with somebody. [SPEAKER_07]: I actually live in Japan. [SPEAKER_07]: It can talk firsthand. [SPEAKER_07]: Not only live in Japan, got married in Japan. [SPEAKER_06]: They don't Japan.

[SPEAKER_07]: but can talk first-hand what is it what is this reputation over in Japan? [SPEAKER_05]: Yamazaki is one of the higher reputable brands. [SPEAKER_05]: The story, the House of Suntari is very reputable in Japan. [SPEAKER_05]: This is exceptional.

[SPEAKER_09]: weren't they the ones who just sold uh... what was the one we did a few few weeks ago centaurie uh... had owned it and sold it four roses for roses four roses they did yeah one point yeah there you go and international well it is already in j it is okay it's it's it's it's it's it's it's big yeah i think they might even own gym being but i'm not sure about that

[SPEAKER_07]: That's amazing when you start getting into the parent companies of the brands when you think every every brand that's on the shelf has a separate company It's not not necessarily case. [SPEAKER_07]: There's probably five or six major players out there on 80% of the brands. [UNKNOWN]: Yep. [SPEAKER_07]: Yep. [SPEAKER_07]: Then you get in the offshoot which you can always find a good offshoot and we were we were enjoying when the earlier today, you know.

[SPEAKER_05]: That was phenomenal. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, right. [SPEAKER_05]: I really enjoyed that. [SPEAKER_09]: And we'll be showcased. [SPEAKER_09]: That's a good bottle. [SPEAKER_09]: Yeah, that's. [SPEAKER_09]: I have an extra one up. [SPEAKER_09]: Oh, yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_09]: I bought two. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_08]: That's a phenomenal. [SPEAKER_08]: That's a good. [SPEAKER_09]: That's a good. [SPEAKER_08]: So can I ask Eric at your wedding in Japan?

[SPEAKER_08]: did you have is their custom does it allow alcohol at those weddings or is it more of a a dry type thing? [SPEAKER_08]: And if you did have alcohol, was it more Japanese things like this or would have been things from around the world? [SPEAKER_05]: So that's a great question, Lou. [SPEAKER_05]: My lovely beautiful life.

[SPEAKER_05]: a few years ago, she purchased a 17-year-old Japanese whiskey, and we had, obviously I hadn't been there for, for a while when she purchased it, but we did have that at the, at the ceremony, and that was, I mean, that was special. [SPEAKER_05]: And then a 17-year-old Japanese whiskey, pretty phenomenal. [SPEAKER_05]: It's interesting, too. [SPEAKER_07]: So pretty much came out right before the tsunami, yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: He was like, how did you get the honest?

[SPEAKER_05]: When things were straight, still there. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: But what a bottle. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: What a bottle. [SPEAKER_05]: It was lovely, yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: I mean, we continued to, we've actually brought it to a, I had dinner with her parents and a Chinese restaurant. [SPEAKER_05]: It was incredible as well. [SPEAKER_07]: How are the Chinese restaurants in Japan? [SPEAKER_07]: Not the bottle. [SPEAKER_05]: They're not actually doing good.

[SPEAKER_05]: They're pretty good. [SPEAKER_05]: They're better than the Chinese restaurants in China Been to a few of those [SPEAKER_09]: That's pretty cool. [SPEAKER_09]: Well, that's awesome. [SPEAKER_09]: This awesome. [SPEAKER_09]: You know, I hope Dan got some of that. [SPEAKER_09]: The Dan gave it all. [SPEAKER_05]: He did, Dan, Dan, Dan, Dan. [SPEAKER_09]: He probably loved that. [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, he very much enjoyed it. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: Awesome.

[SPEAKER_05]: It's a very, very bottle, too. [SPEAKER_05]: I don't know what the price would be, but it's, you don't find it very often, yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: I want to put that one on the old auction board. [SPEAKER_05]: I think I finished it. [SPEAKER_07]: What's left of it? [SPEAKER_07]: Or maybe just, you know, since it was the wedding bottle, you might want to put that on the, in the sacred chest. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: We'll save that one.

[SPEAKER_07]: I think. [SPEAKER_07]: I know that feeling brother. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: Congratulations. [SPEAKER_07]: I'm so happy for you. [SPEAKER_07]: That's awesome and I can't wait to meet her. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I can't wait till she's here, just going through the visa process now, which takes to take time. [SPEAKER_07]: And you know, I've talked about that too. [SPEAKER_07]: So I'm so happy for you. [SPEAKER_08]: I appreciate you so much.

[SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, I do have a little bit of a question given the opening to this segment. [SPEAKER_08]: I saw I was fortunate to see some of the pictures and it looked so elegant. [SPEAKER_08]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_08]: Did anybody go past Optimum Liberation? [SPEAKER_08]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_08]: They call up. [SPEAKER_08]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_08]: Are we any good people? [SPEAKER_07]: Absolutely. [SPEAKER_08]: Is it an asshole, Bill? [SPEAKER_10]: I'm joking.

[SPEAKER_07]: I feel like there's one cousin that says, you know what, that 17 is going down really easy. [SPEAKER_06]: That didn't happen, because the wedding was 1130 and the afternoon. [SPEAKER_06]: Oh, the wedding doesn't matter in the morning. [SPEAKER_06]: I guess it. [SPEAKER_06]: Well, no, it's just like you're trying to get a more dangerous. [SPEAKER_05]: Let's put it that way. [SPEAKER_05]: And then, yeah, good behavior than the, yeah.

[SPEAKER_07]: Speaking of 11 in the afternoon, I'm going to, I'm a guest on Christie's after hours. [SPEAKER_07]: I'm going to put a little plug for her. [SPEAKER_07]: When's that come out? [SPEAKER_07]: That comes off Friday. [SPEAKER_07]: So, and we filmed on a Friday at 11 a.m. and of course, I was partaking in a bourbon. [SPEAKER_07]: You know, because that's my stick. [SPEAKER_07]: So, she's like, you're, you're drinking, I said, well, oh, yeah, that was just matter of time.

[SPEAKER_09]: Have you seen my podcast? [SPEAKER_09]: I was here for that. [SPEAKER_07]: That was a film here in the studio, and we, you know, sent it electronically over the digital airwaves to Christie. [SPEAKER_07]: She's in. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: What city was she? [SPEAKER_09]: She's dating, I think. [SPEAKER_07]: I don't know. [SPEAKER_07]: I don't know. [SPEAKER_07]: But she's, she had asked to be a guest on, we're going to have her on the show too.

[SPEAKER_07]: So, well, you know, she's very knowledgeable about, you know, and she's an Emmy nominated host. [SPEAKER_07]: She used to work with MPR. [SPEAKER_07]: Good thing going there. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, she does so. [SPEAKER_07]: Okay. [SPEAKER_07]: I guess check me and Christie out this Friday after hours Want to tag into that. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, we will in that podcast. [SPEAKER_08]: It's Christy Christy K's after hours. [SPEAKER_08]: Christy K's after hours.

[SPEAKER_09]: Yeah, you should check it out

[SPEAKER_08]: I'm learning this whole podcast thing as I told you guys the first time I'm learning about podcast I learned how to spell AI I'm not I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm

[SPEAKER_07]: Is it two capitals or one?

[SPEAKER_08]: No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no [SPEAKER_07]: Oh, that's that's very nice.

[SPEAKER_07]: That's just the whiskey docking right now. [SPEAKER_07]: After a fan. [SPEAKER_06]: There's some lubricied y'all. [SPEAKER_06]: Yeah, I think he's up to me. [SPEAKER_06]: He's getting this. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, he's getting this. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, you get to everybody. [SPEAKER_07]: The convince ordered him side. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: We're going to wrap it up for this segment. [SPEAKER_07]: But when we come back, I want, I want Lou to stay on the set.

[SPEAKER_07]: If it's all right, Lou, I know you got a schedule tomorrow. [SPEAKER_07]: Sure. [SPEAKER_07]: No, I'm good. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, we're going to finish up the last segment with both Eric and Lou and and continue to talk about all things. [SPEAKER_07]: I know we were supposed to get the National Gas. [SPEAKER_07]: We never got to. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, we're going to get the National Gas part of it. [SPEAKER_07]: Well, and it's finally, we're going to talk about Gossie there.

[SPEAKER_08]: I'm going to say Gossie's still here, I know Gossie's still here, I know Gossie's still here. [SPEAKER_07]: We'll be right back at this. [SPEAKER_07]: Cheers. [SPEAKER_03]: Mike, N-I-L is getting expensive. [SPEAKER_03]: Schools need new revenue. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, but not another alumni fundraiser. [SPEAKER_02]: I've got enough tote bags. [SPEAKER_02]: What if your EDMAD saved you 10% and donated 10% to J-M-U? [SPEAKER_04]: Wait. [SPEAKER_04]: What? [SPEAKER_03]: How?

[SPEAKER_03]: AlumniMeds.com, you get US License Healthcare, and the school gets a cut. [SPEAKER_03]: Win, win, win. [SPEAKER_12]: Now, that's a stat I can get behind. [SPEAKER_12]: Go Dukes. [SPEAKER_03]: Already low prices, fast turnaround, totally discreet. [SPEAKER_03]: Visit alumnimedes.com and choose your alma mater. [SPEAKER_07]: Be as expert in the field and use the business. [SPEAKER_07]: We're not the name of the business. [SPEAKER_05]: You know, give my title if you want.

[SPEAKER_05]: I could say some of my books. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: Do you read both of them? [SPEAKER_07]: I haven't yet. [SPEAKER_07]: But I haven't both logged up. [SPEAKER_07]: I'm totally haven't been sitting there doing iterations. [SPEAKER_07]: Oh, yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: Okay. [SPEAKER_07]: I mean, until this weekend, half is over. [SPEAKER_07]: I haven't gotten shit for sleep much. [SPEAKER_08]: Oh, yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: It's every hour. [SPEAKER_07]: It's every hour.

[SPEAKER_08]: Guys are writing books. [SPEAKER_08]: I can't. [SPEAKER_07]: Brad or we're gonna watch a book, too.

[SPEAKER_07]: So be don't let me get off, let me get off, let me get off, let me get off, let me get off, let me get off, let me get off, let me get off, let me get off, let me get off, let me get off, let me get off, let me get off, let me get off, let me get off, let me get off, let me get off, let me get off, let me get off, let me get off, let me get off, let me get off, let me get off, let me get off, let me get off, let me get off, let me get off, let me get off, let me get off, let me get off, let me get off, let me get off, let me get off, let me get off, let me get off, let me get off, let me get off, let me get off, let me get off, let me get off, let me get off, let me get

[SPEAKER_08]: All right, I was subject of a book once was it all lubricated for success. [SPEAKER_08]: Okay. [SPEAKER_08]: Oh, was it got when I played football and now you pay what you say the Saturday magazine for the Indiana Gazette was about 25 pages and I was on the cover with the professor who was our intellectual coach back then was Leonard de Favo and he said you got a [SPEAKER_08]: got myself a nice pinstripe suit back in a day, man. [SPEAKER_08]: I had bushy ass hair.

[SPEAKER_07]: I'm pitcher in the gym carry movie right before he goes into the mask. [SPEAKER_07]: Is that the suit that you are? [SPEAKER_08]: I didn't see the music so I can't. [SPEAKER_09]: You've never seen the best. [SPEAKER_08]: Come on, Lou. [SPEAKER_08]: It wasn't a point to believe that. [SPEAKER_08]: But I did go to a prom looking like John Travolta, but I did say it all day and express it. [SPEAKER_07]: Never said it. [SPEAKER_08]: I didn't wear tuxedos.

[SPEAKER_08]: I wore spread collars like Denny Terrier. [SPEAKER_07]: I can see that. [SPEAKER_07]: I can see that. [SPEAKER_08]: No, set or well. [SPEAKER_07]: No, now you are in high school or you're talking about high school now, right? [SPEAKER_07]: We backed up. [SPEAKER_07]: We backed up from college when you're dressing for success, but you were ahead of this. [SPEAKER_07]: Curve, you were dressing for success, even at the prom.

[SPEAKER_07]: Now, was there any lubricy, love what the prom? [SPEAKER_08]: No, well, interestingly, I couldn't because my parents run the school board. [SPEAKER_08]: My dad was on the school board, so they So the punch was not getting punched. [SPEAKER_08]: No, no, no, my prom ticket didn't get I enjoyed both my prom So I went with the same awesome woman both times That's the longest year of her dating anybody, isn't it? [SPEAKER_08]: Well, we weren't even dating.

[SPEAKER_08]: I was interested in part of it But in terms of longevity, I'm gonna turn and dating. [SPEAKER_08]: I'm gonna go [SPEAKER_08]: 10 months, you know, that's pretty bad in 65 years. [SPEAKER_08]: No, I agree. [SPEAKER_09]: That was the longest, that was the longest. [SPEAKER_09]: I'm gonna say yeah, but what do you just a heartbreaker or what? [SPEAKER_09]: He's John Travolta. [SPEAKER_09]: He's breaking hearts all over in the in account.

[SPEAKER_07]: Were you breaking up the dance floor two with that What even you were dressed for the occasion? [SPEAKER_08]: No, no, there was no there was no new bristies So yes, no, this is this is a loop I need to my optimum the bristie back in the day, but I had some good old nice day go shoes Oh, I look like I I look like I stepped out of a climber mobster [SPEAKER_07]: No, it's all about the shoes right it was a shoe. [SPEAKER_08]: It's the shoes money. [SPEAKER_08]: It's the shoe.

[SPEAKER_07]: It's always a shoe. [SPEAKER_07]: It's always a shoe.

[SPEAKER_07]: No, I'm not too sure [SPEAKER_07]: We're going to get back to now, we've been talking about lubricity and we've been talking about all the fun stuff that comes back and trust me, we're going to interplay that as we talk about natural gas, but you know, we were talking a little bit before Luke came on about the oil market and what's going on there and because of what's go, you know, I ran and and that conflict, you crane, that conflict. [SPEAKER_07]: You crane that conflict.

[SPEAKER_09]: Everybody's forgetting about your crane. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, no, the rain still still still there, right? [SPEAKER_07]: It just isn't and the top of the headline. [SPEAKER_07]: You're, you know, again, this is what I really respect about. [SPEAKER_07]: You're the man of, it's done, you know, telecommunications. [SPEAKER_07]: You've done the wind, the energy business. [SPEAKER_07]: You've done, you've done a lot of startups.

[SPEAKER_07]: But now you, you were in the natural gas business and you're one of the prominent executives of a, you know, [SPEAKER_07]: of a big natural gas company here in the Appalachian Basin. [SPEAKER_07]: What are you seeing going on in the gas market? [SPEAKER_05]: So I think when we look at the gas market, you have to look at it in a couple different ways. [SPEAKER_05]: Whether you produce natural gas in your country or you don't.

[SPEAKER_05]: And if you don't, we talked about this earlier, you're a price taker. [SPEAKER_05]: That means you're importing LNG, that means your energy costs are associated with things you can't control. [SPEAKER_05]: Right. [SPEAKER_05]: And this is happening in Europe, especially Britain, it's happening in Asia, South Korea, Japan, any employers of LNG are feeling the price pressure. [SPEAKER_05]: and we've been one of the biggest exporters here in the United States.

[SPEAKER_05]: We're one of the biggest, and when the Qatar Rastafan was hit in that attack, that the Qatari natural gas or LNG, [SPEAKER_05]: it went offline. [SPEAKER_05]: So you take a percentage, any percentage of in a system that's pretty much constrained, we'll have severe price effects. [SPEAKER_05]: And that's what you're going to see, which is why we talked about earlier about inflation and you're going to see it's going to happen.

[SPEAKER_05]: It has to work just way through the system. [SPEAKER_07]: No, with the spikes in oil, what is natural gas being done? [SPEAKER_05]: in the United States pretty much on par with where it should be. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, it really hasn't affected it has a good reason. [SPEAKER_07]: We're sitting on such an abundant supply, right? [SPEAKER_07]: We are.

[SPEAKER_07]: And that's the one thing that we were talking off camera about, and maybe you can let the listeners in on a little bit, you know, is that with the national gas business, we're able to shut the wells in. [SPEAKER_07]: Correct. [SPEAKER_07]: So, there's walls that have been drilled 10, 15 years ago that still have them brought into production, but we're sitting on it. [SPEAKER_05]: They're sitting on it. [SPEAKER_05]: They haven't been fracked yet. [SPEAKER_05]: That's correct, yeah.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yep. [SPEAKER_05]: So, the drill, leave it and tell the price pricing is right. [SPEAKER_07]: It's off the limit and they can maximize that natural resource to where that it makes the most sense, right? [SPEAKER_07]: That's correct, yeah.

[SPEAKER_07]: So, we are sitting on quite a bit of supply, not just in the Appalachian Basin, but you look at the [SPEAKER_07]: all the different basins elsewhere, and we talked about the premium natural gas was actually thought of as the nuisance gas when it came to oil.

[SPEAKER_07]: In fact, back in the day, [SPEAKER_07]: uh... when i say back in the day i mean like last year they they were still uh... burning it off you know it because that was easiest way to get rid of the natural gas just just burn off so when you would fly over Texas for example it would look like a roman candle lit up at night solid gas flaring all the gas flaring that's changed [SPEAKER_05]: That's changed, LNG's changed the game. [SPEAKER_05]: It has.

[SPEAKER_05]: And LNG, it's very interesting with, especially with the damage to that, in gutter to their LNG facility. [SPEAKER_05]: They're talking maybe three to five years before it's repaired. [SPEAKER_05]: The interesting thing about natural gas is going to be 2028. [SPEAKER_05]: When we have when the United States is going to increase its LNG capacity in terms of exports in Trump's no longer an office in Trump's no longer an office.

[SPEAKER_05]: So, but that's going to be super interesting. [SPEAKER_05]: And because what are we competing for? [SPEAKER_05]: We're competing with the Middle East to export our gas in a liquified form.

[SPEAKER_05]: if that if that plants offline for three to five years and they can't repair it who's going to get the contracts it's going to be the it's going to be the US LNG facilities right and that's what's going to happen and and the big the big country is going to be India India Pakistan so you wonder why it Pakistan is I always thought about this but you think Pakistan is trying to broker a peace deal with the United States and and and Iran

[SPEAKER_05]: you wonder why has to do with energy. [SPEAKER_07]: It's all about energy. [SPEAKER_07]: I think a lot of this is energy, right? [SPEAKER_05]: It's all energy. [SPEAKER_07]: And we saw the drop today after the two week, you're mentioning the big drop. [SPEAKER_07]: I mean, it was almost $17 a barrel. [SPEAKER_05]: You still see it's still interesting with with the oil and you could see it in the in the prices. [SPEAKER_05]: Typically crude.

[SPEAKER_05]: is going to be lower than bright. [SPEAKER_05]: We've seen crude higher than bright and we've seen some really interesting pricing movements over the past couple weeks. [SPEAKER_05]: Well, that's different. [SPEAKER_05]: Different. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: Not standard. [SPEAKER_05]: Let's put it down. [SPEAKER_05]: No, that's definitely not standard. [SPEAKER_05]: 40 days ago, it was 63 and 60 dollars a barrel.

[SPEAKER_05]: It [SPEAKER_07]: I'll give you back into my conspiracy theories where we create these conflicts to pick care of our, or just not be part of all that conspirator, I understand it, it's, you know, it's a quick, quick, quick, enjoy your time for the next few months and then we're off the next battle. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_08]: Eric, you mentioned the Pakistani need. [SPEAKER_08]: Do they have any natural gas? [SPEAKER_08]: Do you call them reserves or pockets?

[SPEAKER_08]: Is there any natural gas of their own that they can draw upon? [SPEAKER_05]: I know. [SPEAKER_08]: So, areas around Pakistan, you also mentioned India. [SPEAKER_08]: Do they not have the gas natural gas like we do here in the United States? [SPEAKER_08]: They don't know. [SPEAKER_08]: They do not. [SPEAKER_09]: So, their oil wells [SPEAKER_05]: You don't necessarily have a oil either. [SPEAKER_09]: Well, not in India, but I mean Saudi Arabia and Kuwait.

[SPEAKER_05]: Oh, and Saudi, yeah, yeah, there you have it. [SPEAKER_09]: So their gas is, is plentiful there as well. [SPEAKER_05]: It's, it's plentiful. [SPEAKER_05]: There's a plentiful gas off, off the coast of Israel as well. [SPEAKER_05]: Massive, massive, massive. [SPEAKER_09]: But there's no money in it for them because they can't like we're fired and exported. [SPEAKER_09]: That's correct. [SPEAKER_09]: So they're burnt, just burning off. [SPEAKER_05]: I want to get to it.

[SPEAKER_05]: Well, it's right. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, now you know, you start talking about constrained systems as well. [SPEAKER_05]: So it's what we have in Appalachia. [SPEAKER_05]: It's not about drill baby drill, it's about, let's build pipelines. [SPEAKER_11]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: How can we get out of here? [SPEAKER_07]: And that's why a lot of the big Marcellas and Utica wells are shut in. [SPEAKER_07]: I mean, I mean, there was a big rush, you know, back and, you know, we can go back.

[SPEAKER_07]: 15, 17, 18 years, you know, when it first started here in the Appalachian Basin, and a lot of the the real big ones are still not even producing it. [SPEAKER_05]: Yep. [SPEAKER_05]: And yeah, and you still have, he still have formations such as the, the deep Utica that have just not even been touched. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: So there's there's always a deeper, yeah, version of what's going on. [SPEAKER_07]: And usually a deeper pocket has even more.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yep, and there's just an abundance of gas, but it's typically why, you know, the constraint in the system, typically why the Appalachian Basin is always discounted to 100. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_09]: Yeah, that was, I'm sorry, didn't I? [SPEAKER_09]: No, no. [SPEAKER_09]: It reminds me of a story talking to a friend of mine who owns Penn Mechanical Group. [SPEAKER_09]: Oh, yeah. [SPEAKER_09]: Tyler? [SPEAKER_09]: So he was telling me.

[SPEAKER_09]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_09]: back when our kids were both playing hockey together and we were a buffalo and he was talking about Terry Pagula and range resources. [SPEAKER_09]: So he had Terry sold to Royal Dutch Shell, I think, for $4.6 billion. [SPEAKER_07]: He had East Resources, yeah. [SPEAKER_09]: East Resources.

[SPEAKER_09]: So Tyler said those wells [SPEAKER_07]: Not a single well produced One bit of gas they shut them all in they did after they paid four point however many billion dollars for it But it's holding it just blows my mind, but it's holding a lease hold in this what's underneath So it still holds value Formation is as long as it's producing and paint quantities and we can talk about that too because that's always that's always been a battle between the landowners and the

[SPEAKER_07]: And the operators always is. [SPEAKER_07]: It is, right? [SPEAKER_08]: Is that generally to control the price if they're shutting, if they're buying production or is it called buying production? [SPEAKER_08]: I'm kind of an obvious here. [SPEAKER_08]: Are they buying production just to control price? [SPEAKER_08]: Or is it that they don't need it? [SPEAKER_08]: They want to wait until there's bigger demand?

[SPEAKER_08]: Why would, as Perry mentioned, why would somebody buy those and shut them in, Eric? [SPEAKER_05]: It's the reserves. [SPEAKER_05]: It would be for the reserves and if it's a long-term investment, it'd be a long-term play. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, and these companies that are well-heeled, they have the funds that they can do that.

[SPEAKER_07]: So instead of being a company that's up and coming in, or if you're balancing out your balance sheet, you're looking at long-term plays for that and how are we going to maximize the assets that we have on the balance sheet?

[SPEAKER_08]: If you could look 30 years from now, [SPEAKER_08]: what I think again my novice energy experience I think nuclear is a pretty cool thing and it seems to be cheap but we're we're averse to that because of the nimbee not in my backyard premise is natural gas going to be the fuel of the future 30, 40 years from now [SPEAKER_05]: It'll be a component of it. [SPEAKER_05]: It's not going to go away, and mainly, every nation state would have to adopt a strategy for nuclear.

[SPEAKER_05]: So it's not just, you think about the United States, we can adopt a strategy for base load power, increase our nuclear footprint.

[SPEAKER_07]: you're still gonna have gas he's still need to get india still needs gas uh... asia still needs gas it it's not going away so it's uh... and we were talking about nuclear a little bit yeah we were on the s and b's were at maybe before he came on set or even offset but uh... it's definitely going to be the future uh... but that's still [SPEAKER_07]: In my opinion, six to ten years from being actually meaningfully seen in the market.

[SPEAKER_07]: And even when it's in the market, we still have this abundance. [SPEAKER_07]: of a resource that's shut in. [SPEAKER_07]: That's just waiting to turn the bell on. [SPEAKER_07]: So why would we not take a badge of that? [SPEAKER_07]: And moreover, it seems a no-brainer to me. [SPEAKER_08]: Well, I got to believe there's political issues. [SPEAKER_07]: There's definitely there there there there there always is political issues on that right?

[SPEAKER_07]: And so as as a clean as the carbon footprint versus wind and energy and solar, yes, I mean, there's there's always a given take with with that being said. [SPEAKER_07]: And we were talking about Texas, for example, in the Permian Basin, and now the LNG market is open that up for them. [SPEAKER_07]: You know, it's also open it up as the AI market. [SPEAKER_07]: So the data centers are coming down there. [SPEAKER_05]: 100% correct.

[SPEAKER_07]: And so now instead of flairing this off into the evening horizon, they can short pipeline these right into the data centers. [SPEAKER_05]: Yep, exactly. [SPEAKER_07]: And that's a powerful asset that was just otherwise getting burnt off into the night sky. [UNKNOWN]: Yep. [SPEAKER_05]: Well, I found the use for it. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: And data center growth is driving demand for gas.

[SPEAKER_05]: Not, I would say it's driving it now, but you see in the future when we start building these power plants that are going to enable these data centers to operate.

[SPEAKER_05]: it's it's going to be interesting in your future next five years we sit right here right now we see in Homer City we are four point five gigalop power natural gas power power plant one of the biggest generation yeah yeah it is the biggest it will be the biggest in North America [SPEAKER_08]: In Homer City, Pennsylvania. [SPEAKER_08]: That's right. [SPEAKER_08]: Really. [SPEAKER_08]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: I think they announced another one in Texas.

[SPEAKER_07]: It might be bigger, but it was and it's holding that ground for at least until that announcement. [SPEAKER_09]: So we have power plant NV now. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: I'm going to get a little bit of power plant. [UNKNOWN]: A little empty. [SPEAKER_09]: That's funny because, you know, you hear living here and we're, what do we, four miles from that plan? [SPEAKER_09]: We're not far, yeah, as the crow flies.

[SPEAKER_09]: And you hear people complaining, oh, wow, it's going to be polluting this. [SPEAKER_09]: It's like, you know, you're always, you know, you're always, you're [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, but by the way, they have like 3600 acres.

[SPEAKER_09]: So, you know, the noise is going to be very diluted by the time he reaches, if anybody's human years off from, if we, if we all agree that he had a legitimate complaint when it was a coal-fired plant, you can't make the same argument right, it's a gas-fired plant. [SPEAKER_07]: I mean, if we put a side by side, yeah, depiction. [SPEAKER_07]: So of what the coal plant was doing at a two point, [SPEAKER_07]: something gigawatt facility.

[SPEAKER_07]: And now we're, I think it's equitable, right? [SPEAKER_07]: That's piping in the six inch line to the power that. [SPEAKER_07]: So, which is a great outlet. [SPEAKER_07]: I mean, you're talking about an outlet now that again, one of the biggest, you know, uh, [SPEAKER_07]: naysayers of a coming out of the Appalachian Basins, we had no outlet. [SPEAKER_07]: That's right.

[SPEAKER_07]: So now we have a perfect in Ohio, just by the way, announced one of the biggest data centers that's going over there, and they're also big in the National Gas Basins. [SPEAKER_07]: So now you have a couple of meaningful users. [SPEAKER_07]: that are going to need a large supply of this large supply that we can open up and to Trump's credit in the in the governor's credit here in Pennsylvania.

[SPEAKER_07]: We want to make sure or they want to make sure not me because I have no say in this.

[SPEAKER_07]: There are no power whatsoever other than my bourbon Mike and as a bump bump the bourbon Mike Is that is that we don't raise prices for consumers as we're doing this and because these companies are making a lot of money I'm talking when the AI companies not not necessarily the natural gas companies are making a lot of money off of this But we have the resource to power this We do now now the limiting factor is the turbine [SPEAKER_05]: that is the living factor.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yes, and that's the bottleneck. [SPEAKER_05]: Yep, and there's why's that. [SPEAKER_07]: Well, because G for Nova. [SPEAKER_05]: Yep. [SPEAKER_05]: Go ahead. [SPEAKER_05]: Yep. [SPEAKER_07]: No, yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: You know, they're they're the ones that correct. [SPEAKER_07]: Uh, or they're the ones that sold the homercity plant. [SPEAKER_07]: Uh, there are seven turbines. [SPEAKER_07]: And there's a almost a six year, six and a half year waiting list.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yep, for turbines, for gas turbines. [SPEAKER_07]: For those type of turbines. [SPEAKER_07]: You know, so you're talking in that.

[SPEAKER_07]: uh... type of capacity and those turbines are very powerful and i'm talking seven hundred may want kind of terrible and powerful and they're very efficient and very efficient and by the way uh... the one thing the homer city i'll give him credit for is is that the turbines that they have there they can flip the switch and go to hydrogen so it's even it's it's awesome and that they're they're very uh... uh... forward thinking and that regard yes

[SPEAKER_09]: And the one thing that Eric mentioned, you know, so as compared to the coal plant, and I live where I live, when they were running coal to the homercity power plant up until a couple years ago, twice a day at least the train would go by. [SPEAKER_09]: So you can argue about the train and, you know, whatever carbon footprint it may have, but the bottom line is they could haul that fuel on train cars to the power plant. [SPEAKER_09]: You can't do that with gas.

[SPEAKER_09]: So you had mentioned about pipelines. [SPEAKER_09]: So do we have the infrastructure and the pipelines to get that gas where it needs to be? [SPEAKER_09]: Whether it be home or city, or if they build a plant and clear field or anywhere else, like do they have that in place and what's it take to put it in place? [SPEAKER_05]: I don't. [SPEAKER_09]: That's got to be a huge undertaker. [SPEAKER_05]: And that's the problem. [SPEAKER_05]: I think that's the problem.

[SPEAKER_05]: They don't Now for homicity Gas is coming from both sides come from the south and from the south. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, so that it's not that big of a connector. [SPEAKER_05]: They have to build up 4.6 miles. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, so they're able to build that up pretty quickly [SPEAKER_07]: But before it was always, everybody was surprised and how do we get the natural gas to the Northeastern corridor where New York Boston, right, right?

[SPEAKER_05]: And I exactly, and they, um, they don't have pipelines. [SPEAKER_09]: No, that's why we have all this gas and all these wells that you can't get it to where you need it. [SPEAKER_09]: You can't get it where it needs to be. [SPEAKER_05]: And it's very expensive, uh, like the Erocoi, those pipes, those hubs becomes very expensive over the, [SPEAKER_09]: So, Eric, you need to invent an on-site liquefication process that can turn gas, gas, and to liquid gas.

[SPEAKER_09]: There you go, and you can retire, my friend. [SPEAKER_05]: Okay, we'll just check it out. [SPEAKER_05]: We'll just check it out. [SPEAKER_09]: Yeah, we'll use AI for that. [SPEAKER_09]: Put it right on the well-sighted game over. [SPEAKER_05]: Game over, I agree. [SPEAKER_05]: But those are some of the most complex facilities I think that man has ever developed from a technology perspective. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, those LNG facilities, trains.

[SPEAKER_09]: Is there a loss of volume to like, how do you how do you equate a gas volume to a liquid volume like that there's a formula yeah I can't remember I can't remember what it is. [SPEAKER_07]: I love the way you look you looked at it.

[SPEAKER_08]: I know Perry's like, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no [SPEAKER_07]: I mean to rip on you there, but dialing the same thing. [SPEAKER_07]: So, you know, there's definitely a formula for it.

[SPEAKER_07]: And there may be a little bit of loss as it's better. [SPEAKER_09]: If there is there is loss, it's still better than not selling it, right? [SPEAKER_09]: So, if you're losing five or 10%, you're still way ahead of the curve, because otherwise you'd be selling nothing. [SPEAKER_07]: Well, it's the LNG, Barnard, that opened up the market for the natural gas market. [SPEAKER_07]: That's so stale for all these years.

[SPEAKER_05]: That's been this way, if we can sell our natural gas to India, [SPEAKER_05]: Uh-huh. [SPEAKER_05]: Below the switching cost to coal, that's typically what they're going to what they use in China. [SPEAKER_05]: You're going to win every, every, every time. [SPEAKER_08]: What is the difference to produce a kilowatt? [SPEAKER_08]: How much coal do you need to produce? [SPEAKER_08]: I don't even know if there's a right term.

[SPEAKER_08]: How much coal do you need to produce a kilowatt of energy versus how much natural gas do you need to produce the same kilowatt? [SPEAKER_08]: It's a good question. [SPEAKER_08]: I don't know the answer. [SPEAKER_08]: I know the more. [SPEAKER_07]: Sorry. [SPEAKER_07]: There's a formula out there and it's a good question because, you know, I know we have industry partners here in our region that are shipping coal to China. [SPEAKER_07]: So, you know, that's a big time.

[SPEAKER_07]: So, that's where it's going. [SPEAKER_07]: So, you get a look at what is that cost versus shipping LNG in a liquid form? [SPEAKER_05]: So, to answer your question, there's multiple variables. [SPEAKER_05]: One is heat rate, how efficient are the turbines? [SPEAKER_05]: What's your spark spread? [SPEAKER_05]: Which means what's your local marginalized price, minus your... Or your fuel, minus your fuel price, right? [SPEAKER_05]: Which includes transportation.

[SPEAKER_05]: And that gives you... that'll give you your answer. [SPEAKER_05]: But you need that heat rate. [SPEAKER_05]: And typically coal plants have a heat rate of 10,000... [SPEAKER_05]: Maybe ten and a half thousand the higher the heat rate the more expensive the plant got Popped rates sure lower the heat rate the better and that's why some of these these G E Turbides going home or city.

[SPEAKER_05]: I think their heat rates five six thousand which is which is Which is half of a coal plant yeah, which means you you have a lot less cost sure [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, and when you only when you only look, Perry, thanks for turning that off Mitch That's my wife calling that was someone you guys talking I'm gonna get that that wasn't your wife [SPEAKER_09]: You guys keep talking, I'm going to take that.

[SPEAKER_08]: Eric, that last two minutes there, I felt like I was back in your Carnegie Mellon room, and you were with some type of energy engineer. [SPEAKER_08]: He had these formulas on the board, and you're talking about heat rate, and all of that, I can I ask you, to the common person. [SPEAKER_08]: What is the amount of gas that is going into this plant, just to give them some relativity, [SPEAKER_08]: How big of a town could that provide energy for? [SPEAKER_08]: It's pretty big in.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_08]: Something that's what you see. [SPEAKER_08]: Four gigawatts. [SPEAKER_08]: Four gigawatts. [SPEAKER_05]: Four gigawatts. [SPEAKER_05]: Two gigawatts. [SPEAKER_05]: Six gigawatts. [SPEAKER_05]: Whatever. [SPEAKER_05]: Let's look at it from this perspective. [SPEAKER_05]: I'd say between anywhere between. [SPEAKER_05]: where you could all of all of Allegheny County, is that right? [SPEAKER_08]: Yep, that big.

[SPEAKER_08]: And that doesn't put a dent in the actual reserves and gas available to us on this planet Earth. [SPEAKER_05]: It doesn't actually, it does not know. [SPEAKER_08]: So we have no feel. [SPEAKER_08]: The common person out there, the consumer really doesn't have a feel for the magnitude and how relatively large [SPEAKER_08]: this is about how small we are. [SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, and that we're going to have energy and that's correct. [SPEAKER_07]: No, you're absolutely right.

[SPEAKER_07]: And I think of I can just chime in here for the consumer that's just at the end game and feeling the pain as to where the price points go. [SPEAKER_07]: If there's one thing that can be done and if you want something to be done is to give an outlet. [SPEAKER_07]: for this gas. [SPEAKER_07]: Not only in the Appalachian Basin, but there's basins all over the country.

[SPEAKER_07]: So we're sitting on one of the biggest largest energy reserves that's already been tapped into in many respects. [SPEAKER_07]: We just need the ability to outlittle it out. [SPEAKER_08]: You're talking about more cellos. [SPEAKER_07]: Well, I'm old. [SPEAKER_07]: I'm talking about our Appalachian Basins. [SPEAKER_07]: Not only the more cellos, I'm talking about the Utica, I'm talking about the Deep Utica, I'm talking about you get down into any of the other basins as well.

[SPEAKER_07]: If you don't have an outlet that meaningfully takes you to a market, [SPEAKER_05]: Then it's mean less, which is why you have prices as low than Henry Hub, which is why you're always discounted. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: It's constrained. [SPEAKER_07]: But it should be discounted. [SPEAKER_07]: That's my point. [SPEAKER_07]: I agree with you. [SPEAKER_07]: We're sitting on one of the largest natural reserves.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yep. [SPEAKER_07]: That's pretty clean too when you burn it. [SPEAKER_05]: It's very clean. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, unlike, you know, Cole, we want to talk about Cole and you want to talk about all the other sources. [SPEAKER_05]: It's such a thing. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: Or the amount of water that has to go, you know, all that stuff. [SPEAKER_07]: Right. [SPEAKER_07]: So at the end game, it's a very clean resource that we need to maximize and at this point.

[SPEAKER_07]: And I'm looking back, because when I was in the oil and gas industry, heavily, you know, 15 years ago, I'm surprised looking 15 years back. [SPEAKER_07]: It hasn't changed. [SPEAKER_07]: I mean, the shut-ins are still there. [SPEAKER_07]: There's still the same story. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, same story. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: Even even though we're producing 109 BCF a day on average. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: I mean, and that's a big number.

[SPEAKER_07]: And so for our listeners, what is the BCF that, so they can kind of compare what they can keep the key. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: And inverses like what they use in their house versus put it into consumer terms. [SPEAKER_05]: Uh, that's tough. [SPEAKER_05]: Let me think about that. [SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, around, let me, let me last in a little bit differently. [SPEAKER_08]: How big of a space does it take to store a BCF? [SPEAKER_08]: Is it a, is it the size of a sink?

[SPEAKER_08]: Is it the size of a house? [SPEAKER_08]: It's what, if you're storing a BCF underground. [SPEAKER_05]: So your underground storage is a couple different types of storage. [SPEAKER_05]: There's, there's wells, and there's salt caverns. [SPEAKER_05]: If you're storing wells, [SPEAKER_05]: It's like trying to get the gas out of the well, okay. [SPEAKER_05]: Pressurized, right? [SPEAKER_05]: Saltcaryns a little bit easier. [SPEAKER_05]: So what are the reasons why?

[SPEAKER_05]: This is actually quite interesting. [SPEAKER_05]: If we looked at, if we looked at what happened at the end of January with Winterstorm Furn, the storm, the cold snap. [SPEAKER_05]: Gas in [SPEAKER_05]: gas in, in, in, in, in, in Western Pennsylvania was higher than, than Henry Hill. [SPEAKER_10]: Hmm. [SPEAKER_05]: I don't know for those last two weeks. [SPEAKER_05]: Henry's a great guy. [SPEAKER_07]: It is. [SPEAKER_05]: If you're in the act Louisiana.

[SPEAKER_07]: If you're in the industry, you're always looking at an interview up to see where the price points are. [SPEAKER_05]: It's nine. [SPEAKER_05]: I'm going to do my research on Henry. [SPEAKER_05]: It's ninex is what it is. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: So when you see, if you look, come out of the price on that, next year.

[SPEAKER_05]: And that was, that was one of the first two weeks, consistently that we saw prices and Western Pennsylvania, not trade out of discount, but traded a premium. [SPEAKER_05]: And there were some, there were some big days. [SPEAKER_05]: because here's the other interesting thing too. [SPEAKER_05]: So the pipelines that we talk about pipeline systems, yeah.

[SPEAKER_05]: So those pipeline systems were constrained as well when they have operational flowwaters, which means basically, if you're if you're if you're generating station or your producer, you're taking your taking gas off of the system or you're putting it onto the system. [SPEAKER_05]: It's one of the two. [SPEAKER_05]: That's that's kind of how it works, right?

[SPEAKER_05]: When you have these operational flowwaters, you are limited in terms of what you can take off based on your contract, for a firm transportation, with, for example, with a Berkshire Hathaway Energy, yeah, EGTS, and also, if I have a contract, if you have a contract with me to buy my gas, let's do a 10,000, 10,000 Decker thermoday, right? [SPEAKER_05]: Don't get paid today. [SPEAKER_05]: You get, uh, you get paid. [SPEAKER_05]: You get paid. [SPEAKER_05]: Stick a thermo there.

[SPEAKER_05]: Oh, I love it longer than I do. [SPEAKER_05]: How many days? [SPEAKER_05]: Uh, we have. [SPEAKER_05]: They're, they're, they're, they're those contracts are. [SPEAKER_05]: depends. [SPEAKER_05]: If it's at the end of the month, then it's going to be another 30 days, but if it's at the beginning of the month, it's it's the same. [SPEAKER_07]: By the way, if you're a law firm, I have to do forced study. [SPEAKER_07]: And it's an overdue. [SPEAKER_07]: What a shame.

[SPEAKER_07]: It was plugged. [SPEAKER_09]: I know. [SPEAKER_08]: That's a good one. [SPEAKER_08]: Before we get too far, I interrupted you there. [SPEAKER_08]: No. [SPEAKER_08]: A deck of thirm? [SPEAKER_06]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_06]: That's not a deck of thirm. [SPEAKER_06]: It's not a deck of thirm. [SPEAKER_06]: It's a myth. [SPEAKER_06]: That's a myth. [SPEAKER_06]: That's a myth. [UNKNOWN]: That's a myth. [UNKNOWN]: It was. [SPEAKER_05]: It's not common. [SPEAKER_05]: It's a measurement of gas.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: Or a measurement in sex. [SPEAKER_06]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: Or that. [SPEAKER_05]: To be both. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, it's a thermal is a deck for a deck it's just thermal basically is what it is. [SPEAKER_05]: Okay, it's it's the energy produced with one one deck of them. [SPEAKER_05]: Anyway, 10,000 deck of them contract The issue is if if you buy it for me And I agree that I'm going to sell you 10,000 a day. [SPEAKER_05]: Okay, and it's cold and we have freezons.

[SPEAKER_10]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: I'm probably not going to tell you. [SPEAKER_05]: I'm probably not going to be telling you 10,000 if that's my max output. [SPEAKER_05]: My max output is 10. [SPEAKER_05]: I'm probably going to say, well, freeze in, you have to wear the risk.

[SPEAKER_05]: I might go 5. [SPEAKER_05]: Is there is there no contract in place in the beginning or is it it's your gas marketer or is it conditional it's it's through the gas marketing company That we well that that we use for example, but that that that becomes the issue It becomes operationally can we actually produce 10,000 and sell you 10,000 because if we don't we have to buy it. [SPEAKER_07]: That's right [SPEAKER_07]: in your eating it.

[SPEAKER_05]: And we're eating that cost and we still owe you. [SPEAKER_05]: Right. [SPEAKER_05]: We produce it by it. [SPEAKER_08]: Your question is that contractual that it is in Deca-Thurms. [SPEAKER_05]: And that's what I was asking about. [SPEAKER_05]: That's what I'm going to do to find it down. [SPEAKER_05]: Through the naspy contracts. [SPEAKER_07]: Even after two and a half of these Japanese purified water whiskeys, I am still still strong. [SPEAKER_07]: I'm still pinging.

[SPEAKER_09]: Mr. Lori that's the case. [SPEAKER_05]: So when you have when you have operational constraints and you have pipeline constraints That's why you see the prices just just increase for businesses and for consumers and households [SPEAKER_07]: Um, and that's the biggest concern right now is the household impact right so the household is at the is at the field pump is it's at the it's what you're seeing at coming out of this very brutal winter here in Pennsylvania right.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: So, uh, natural gas bills were a little higher this this year. [SPEAKER_05]: The higher electricity bills were probably the electricity bills in the higher you know in. [SPEAKER_07]: a lot of that goes back to our AI friends that are doing this in part of it. [SPEAKER_07]: Yep. [SPEAKER_07]: Well, I think large, you got the EV, you got the AI, you got the crypto. [SPEAKER_07]: Electrification. [SPEAKER_06]: Electrification, you got all that stuff for it.

[SPEAKER_07]: So it's a kind of issue. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, it does. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, because before you had declining, you had declining demand for electricity. [SPEAKER_04]: You don't. [SPEAKER_05]: And you didn't have 30 years ago, we have an invested really, anything into our grid and that we have to. [SPEAKER_05]: I always have to know we have to invest into them because the grid's getting pushed and it's getting pushed stress it's getting stressed.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yes, so can we expect rolling. [SPEAKER_07]: I mean, we're blaming on the windstorm right now, but I mean, I think it's going to be based on the stress storms that the calm is that we can think is going when these mega data centers that are being built around the country. [SPEAKER_09]: come online.

[SPEAKER_09]: So Trump, you know, one of the things that he's done recently that I thought makes a lot of sense was enacting this law or this regulation that the AI companies have to be at a minimum energy neutral, right? [SPEAKER_09]: So they have to generate their own power. [SPEAKER_09]: A great idea. [SPEAKER_09]: Yeah, that shouldn't cost a computer. [SPEAKER_09]: And it's called behind the... [SPEAKER_09]: It's called behind the meter. [SPEAKER_05]: Behind the meter, right?

[SPEAKER_09]: So, it begs another question. [SPEAKER_09]: So, I assume that if a data center is going to generate our own power, it will be on-site, like, if it's a commercial. [SPEAKER_09]: Right, it's like an commercial. [SPEAKER_07]: A prime example of the perfect example. [SPEAKER_07]: That's the perfect example. [SPEAKER_07]: Because they took over a coal plant that was already tied into the grid, so they don't have to rebuild the grid.

[SPEAKER_09]: It's it's all the but if they're using the majority of the power just a grid even matter. [SPEAKER_09]: I guess my question was if if let's say Amazon use I just saw a story where they built this huge giga center Texas or somewhere. [SPEAKER_09]: Yes, we can if they're generating the power 40 miles away Is that stressing the existing grid or they have to build their own grid to get that power.

[SPEAKER_07]: Well, if you're still talking about if it's not on site yet talking about them generating the power behind the grid. [SPEAKER_07]: It doesn't matter where it's coming from as long as they're putting it as long as they're putting another source onto the grid That is replacing what they're you going to use. [SPEAKER_07]: Okay. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, I think that's the most simplest. [SPEAKER_07]: That's the easiest way to put it.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah Okay, that's a that's a and I stumbled over one ice cube on that [SPEAKER_09]: I mean, a lot of people are, you know, I mean, we've all seen our, I mean, my electric bells come to the roof and I don't know why and I'm already, I'm a, I'm a part of the co-op. [SPEAKER_07]: Listen, I can tell you either. [SPEAKER_07]: I could tell everybody why. [SPEAKER_07]: I could tell.

[SPEAKER_07]: It's your only fans production that's going to be between it's 2 a.m. and 4 a.m. and that was a case. [SPEAKER_09]: If that really case, I wouldn't really care. [SPEAKER_07]: It's little on and off, on and off, on and off. [SPEAKER_07]: I mean, continuously. [SPEAKER_07]: People are looking at the toes. [SPEAKER_07]: They're looking at this little. [SPEAKER_07]: I mean, it's crazy. [SPEAKER_07]: You know what? [SPEAKER_08]: I don't know what it means.

[SPEAKER_08]: It means a consumer. [SPEAKER_08]: It's here. [SPEAKER_08]: Is my power, does it cost me what time of the day does my power cost more? [SPEAKER_08]: Or is it in a 24 hour period without giving away industry secrets? [SPEAKER_08]: There's an app for that.

[SPEAKER_08]: No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no

[SPEAKER_07]: Only because I literally, only because I keep brushing them off. [SPEAKER_05]: I had it right, Perry. [SPEAKER_09]: I'll have to give Brad to see that people. [SPEAKER_05]: so what what interesting to it uh during winter storm fern uh uh i saw lmp's as high as $2,500 local marginalized pricing $2,500 and it was flat. [SPEAKER_07]: You put that in perspective as to what it is today. [SPEAKER_05]: Uh today was probably 40.

[SPEAKER_05]: Wow. [SPEAKER_05]: Wow. [SPEAKER_07]: So it was like a crypto. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, all right. [SPEAKER_05]: So it's uh, but energy prices are going to increase with when demand spikes. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_08]: Well, that's what it has. [SPEAKER_08]: And when I talk economics back in 1975, it said, hey, you may have learned this back in 1875. [SPEAKER_08]: guns in butter, supply and demand. [SPEAKER_08]: It's been the same since the beginning of time.

[SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, right? [SPEAKER_08]: Same. [SPEAKER_08]: Same. [SPEAKER_08]: Sure. [SPEAKER_08]: When they ran out of salt, the price went out back in the day when that was all they had to trade comes back to the simple supply and demand curve. [SPEAKER_07]: Sure, it does. [SPEAKER_07]: But but you know what what's happening today that is going to change it is obviously technology is going to optimize it, right? [SPEAKER_07]: Yes, and are you guys utilizing a I in your field?

[SPEAKER_05]: Yes, yeah, I use it. [SPEAKER_05]: I use it quite often Behind the scenes with company approval behind Behind the meter I just wrote a part I wrote about that order. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, behind the meter right Yeah, I just wrote about that article today about the the shadow a I that's happening, you know [SPEAKER_07]: and two respects. [SPEAKER_07]: Last week's article was about folks in the company that are using it on their own terms, right?

[SPEAKER_07]: That isn't company approved, but then today's article very early this morning when for my first nap was about [SPEAKER_07]: vendors. [SPEAKER_07]: So we look at all the vendors or I should say software vendors that we're utilizing and then we have be utilized for years.

[SPEAKER_07]: Whether it's Microsoft, whether it's a Adobe, whether it's you know you go down the line of all the you know whatever you're you're marketing you're you're going to market sales force vendors are you may or may not know that they're utilizing AI. [SPEAKER_07]: And so when they're utilizing AI in their system and they haven't giving you an notice of that, it becomes a risk because the end user is always responsible.

[SPEAKER_08]: Isn't that the did I not see something today, Brad, with California has a bill that is pending that requires any [SPEAKER_08]: promotion, any advertisement, anything. [SPEAKER_08]: Did you guys already talk about this? [SPEAKER_07]: Now we talked about it before we came on here. [SPEAKER_07]: And I showed them like, well, I showed them on my platform. [SPEAKER_07]: So my one platform, I'm not going to say it on area yet because I'm not ready to go to area yet on it.

[SPEAKER_07]: But we, it's coming soon. [SPEAKER_07]: It's coming soon. [SPEAKER_07]: Kind of like my ED meds. [SPEAKER_07]: You're right, but if I wasn't quite right [SPEAKER_07]: There you go. [SPEAKER_07]: No, but I was showing Eric before we came on there is all the digests that are coming in. [SPEAKER_07]: Or anything is being, the bill you're talking about in California. [SPEAKER_07]: So what they're saying is, anything that's AI generated needs to be disclosed as AI generated.

[SPEAKER_07]: Correct. [SPEAKER_07]: So, in the platform that I, the second platform I just about is now disclosing that because we are using AI generated summaries. [SPEAKER_08]: So you're using AI to explain that you're using AI to explain AI. [SPEAKER_07]: And I've done a lot of crosswords. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, there are so much sums that up. [SPEAKER_07]: No, but when you are utilizing AI to provide the context that they're looking at, you have to put it to disclosure and bold print.

[SPEAKER_07]: And we have a pill now that says AI generates summary. [SPEAKER_08]: I get as a consumer. [SPEAKER_08]: I get that. [SPEAKER_08]: And you should not a big fan of government intervention in many things, but I should know what you're looking at, right? [SPEAKER_08]: I need to know that what I'm looking at, it's either real. [SPEAKER_08]: or it's in lieu, what are back in my day? [SPEAKER_08]: Is it live or is it Memorax, right? [SPEAKER_08]: So, right?

[SPEAKER_08]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_08]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_08]: Is it AI? [SPEAKER_09]: Let's go back a few years. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: No, you're exactly right. [SPEAKER_07]: And I agree. [SPEAKER_07]: And I can't disagree. [SPEAKER_07]: I should say, I'm going to say I agree, but I can't disagree with what your California's coming from.

[SPEAKER_07]: New York also has a law that they just passed at the turn of the 2025 2026 that goes into effect here six months later and we've implemented that to on our AI advertising that utilizes AI generated voices [SPEAKER_07]: So instead of having to hire a voice actor, and again, you got to mind you, you got to look always where the source is coming from, where the lobby effect is coming from did the lobby effect.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: And we talk about that from anything, right? [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: So it's New York and California, the two biggest actor states. [SPEAKER_08]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_08]: So you're talking, now you're talking screen actors, guild ones. [SPEAKER_07]: Exactly. [SPEAKER_08]: They don't want to, they don't want to get out of the way. [SPEAKER_07]: Exactly. [SPEAKER_08]: So theoretically, you could make a whole movie right now with no people.

[SPEAKER_09]: You can. [SPEAKER_09]: Oh, they're going to be a really upset one. [SPEAKER_09]: They hear the smooth voices on this show They're like those have to be AI there.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, there are no disclosures because these are real The real deal, but with that being said California or I'm sorry New York we talked about California New York is coming out with a law coming in effect in June This says if you are using a voice over there's not human [SPEAKER_07]: You have to now disclose that on your video and to the point where my disclosure or now this is an AI voiceover. [SPEAKER_07]: It's not human.

[SPEAKER_07]: I mean, it's that bold and it's that director. [SPEAKER_07]: But it lets the user, you know, is because if you look on social media, you're looking at all these different videos that are coming into your feed, right? [SPEAKER_07]: And you're going, well, in six months ago, you're going, oh, that's definitely AI. [SPEAKER_07]: Now you're going Is that a I'm not sure is that a I or is that real me let me let me really look closely because yeah [SPEAKER_07]: I don't know.

[SPEAKER_07]: Now you can imagine from six months from now, it's going to get a lot more confusing. [SPEAKER_07]: It's only getting better. [SPEAKER_07]: So, I agree. [SPEAKER_07]: I think there should be a disclosure on there, and I have no problem putting it and we've done it in all of our platforms, I've gone back and even retroactively put it back on things I've posted before, because I think that's important. [SPEAKER_08]: Did you like that? [SPEAKER_08]: Everybody know that this is real.

[SPEAKER_07]: oh this is real this is a hundred percent all this is a real this is a hundred percent against you know is i is i is i box of my mic yeah who's wondering if i find it right i know it's the burden boxing match going on right now it's just bad i haven't felt the punch yet why would why would you take a quick break then we're doing quick break and then we're [SPEAKER_03]: Mike, N-I-L is getting expensive. [SPEAKER_03]: Schools need new revenue.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, but not another alumni fundraiser. [SPEAKER_02]: I've got enough tote bags. [SPEAKER_02]: What if your EDMAD saved you 10% and donated 10% to JMU? [SPEAKER_04]: Wait. [SPEAKER_04]: What? [SPEAKER_03]: How? [SPEAKER_03]: AlumniMeds.com, you get US License Healthcare, and the school gets a cut. [SPEAKER_03]: Win, win, win. [SPEAKER_12]: Now, that's a stab I can get behind. [SPEAKER_12]: Go Dukes. [SPEAKER_03]: Already low prices, fast turnaround, totally discreet.

[SPEAKER_03]: Visit alumnimeds.com and choose your alma mater. [SPEAKER_07]: All right, we're back and we've been talking about our bur bur boners even though they're not here. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, but we're thinking about it later Someone really went there. [SPEAKER_07]: No, we really went there. [SPEAKER_07]: So yeah, and I'm sorry, Lou. [SPEAKER_06]: I know we went there We start We went there no matter what we get there. [SPEAKER_06]: No, we definitely do but I do want to the governor.

[SPEAKER_07]: Oh, they had the bourbon oven Oh, yeah, so obviously this Japanese whiskey is exactly [SPEAKER_07]: what it sells to be. [SPEAKER_07]: There's a reason it's been around since 1923 and why hasn't gone trying to call it in how many how many fallouts, how many radiations storms, but that explains that I think the screw tough.

[SPEAKER_07]: I don't want to, I don't want to, I don't want to, I don't want to, I don't want to, I don't want to, I don't want to, I don't want to, I don't want to, I don't want to, I don't want to, I don't want to, I don't want to, I don't want to, I don't want to, I don't want to, I don't want to, I don't want to, I don't want to, I don't want to, I don't want to, I don't want to, I don't want to, I don't want to, I don't want to, I don't want to, I don't want to, I don't want to, I don't want to, I don't want to, I don't want to, I don't want to, I don't want to, I don't want to, I don't want to, I don't want to, I don't want to, I

[SPEAKER_07]: uh... you also have a couple other things that are cooking in the in the old uh... back up and that are exciting so tell me about uh... the two books that uh... two books here [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, come on. [SPEAKER_06]: Yeah, come on. [SPEAKER_08]: Really? [SPEAKER_05]: Come on with it. [SPEAKER_05]: Let us know. [SPEAKER_06]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_06]: Share it, brother. [SPEAKER_06]: Two bucks. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: So, um, my background, I'm an economist.

[SPEAKER_05]: That's, that's, that's my education and also policy at Carnegie Mellon. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: At the policy school, high school. [SPEAKER_05]: Uh, so, you think about, uh, I've always been thinking about systems. [SPEAKER_05]: Uh, I've been thinking about systems. [SPEAKER_05]: Uh, I've been thinking about systems. [SPEAKER_05]: Uh, I've been thinking about systems. [SPEAKER_05]: Uh, I've been thinking about systems. [SPEAKER_05]: Uh, I've been thinking about systems.

[SPEAKER_05]: Uh, I've been thinking about systems. [SPEAKER_05]: and how just how things work. [SPEAKER_05]: So the first book I wrote that's I think it's pretty much complete. [SPEAKER_05]: It's called Capital Can't Wait and it's about the deployment of capital and it talks about it's the idea that you have feasibility so you can't deploy capital without feasibility so that that's important. [SPEAKER_05]: Makes sense. [SPEAKER_05]: Then it talks about time.

[SPEAKER_05]: So feasibility and time come before cost [SPEAKER_05]: It's all about timing, it's all about timing to, and it's kind of interesting as well. [SPEAKER_05]: It's why regions, and I'll use this example, loud and county data centers. [SPEAKER_05]: It's why regions where, or regions where, yeah, regions where, capital, or cost is expensive, [SPEAKER_05]: and loud and kind of give you an example of that, because basically what happens is markets they capitalize on every time.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, everything, up and down the vertical, right? [SPEAKER_05]: Time is, they capitalize time. [UNKNOWN]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: and in land class, in queue, in queueing, in institutional premia, etc. [SPEAKER_05]: Up and down, right? [SPEAKER_05]: It's up and down. [SPEAKER_05]: So that that books about that and talk about, I love the turtle, by the way. [SPEAKER_05]: Cable can't wait. [SPEAKER_05]: It can't wait. [SPEAKER_05]: It's true. [SPEAKER_05]: And it really talks about it.

[SPEAKER_07]: And right now, it doesn't. [SPEAKER_05]: I can't wait. [SPEAKER_05]: And if you look at the data centers, right? [SPEAKER_05]: So, and it's why, you know, you look at homercity in the cost per acre, very, very little, or you look at clear field where you have, you know, a, a power, but I think the interesting thing is in Loudon County, they just sold 138 for 4.4 million per acre. [SPEAKER_05]: What kind of loud county Virginia Virginia, right?

[SPEAKER_05]: More. [SPEAKER_05]: .4.133. [SPEAKER_05]: So the developer paid 4.4 million per acre. [SPEAKER_07]: And by the way, you know, Virginia was the- That's not cheap. [SPEAKER_07]: It is, and still is, the data center, you know, capital. [SPEAKER_07]: I mean, before data centers were hot, I don't know where, you know, we're talking about them every day in the news. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: Virginia had- [SPEAKER_07]: The data center warehouses stacked up in very linear fashion.

[SPEAKER_09]: And the Loudoun County is not that far from DC, right? [SPEAKER_09]: So it's actually more urban than it is rural. [SPEAKER_09]: Correct. [SPEAKER_09]: So that's no wonder that Liam caused that much money. [SPEAKER_09]: Yeah, that's fine. [SPEAKER_08]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_09]: Big dollars in London. [SPEAKER_08]: That doesn't seem to make sense to me, economically, that you would stack all those things in a place where, would you say, 4.4 per acre? [SPEAKER_05]: Well, they cluster.

[SPEAKER_05]: So, think about this loop, capital clusters. [SPEAKER_05]: If you think about a downtown. [SPEAKER_05]: Right? [SPEAKER_05]: Why do you have shops in a stretch? [SPEAKER_05]: Look at Philadelphia Street, or even look at even look at a very simple example. [SPEAKER_05]: You have, this is for Indiana, bronzes, and then you have Danny's tacos, which is next to it. [SPEAKER_05]: You have people that come and they cluster to those areas, and it capital clusters as well.

[SPEAKER_05]: It's a natural phenomenon. [SPEAKER_05]: But it's based on the fact that once you have [SPEAKER_05]: Once you have a region where time becomes the numerator, and they understand that where it's predictable, and it's speed, then speed becomes power. [SPEAKER_05]: So take any region, you can even look at other expensive regions as well. [SPEAKER_05]: Take, you know, take Silicon Valley. [SPEAKER_05]: That's, that's clustered capital. [SPEAKER_05]: If you want to call it right, right?

[SPEAKER_08]: I never heard that term. [SPEAKER_08]: I'm worried. [SPEAKER_07]: So much with you book writers. [SPEAKER_07]: Well, and if you're talking about the data, it's in a world that, I mean, they've been trying to cluster it around the great lakes. [SPEAKER_07]: Yep. [SPEAKER_07]: They've had a lot of pushback. [SPEAKER_07]: And I think that's one of the other big headlines is that what half of the deployments right now are on pause.

[SPEAKER_07]: So, for various reasons, we can get into all those, but we're not going to in the fourth segment of our show. [SPEAKER_05]: Of our bourbon show. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: Today we should know. [SPEAKER_07]: But we will eventually, but there's been pauses all over and for good reason. [SPEAKER_07]: It's very multifaceted. [SPEAKER_07]: It could depend on the community. [SPEAKER_07]: It could depend on resources. [SPEAKER_07]: It could depend on labor.

[SPEAKER_07]: cost, you know, getting into, we talked about the electricity, you know, guarantees that the communities are not going to have to suffer. [SPEAKER_07]: The water, you know, issues that the, especially up in the Great Lakes, they mean they're, they're very cognizant about their water up there, you know, because they have a great peer source of water. [SPEAKER_07]: And, and how's that going to be utilized? [SPEAKER_07]: Is it going to affect the local communities?

[SPEAKER_07]: Is it going to affect their water supply? [SPEAKER_07]: Oh, all those things coming to play, yeah, yeah, but time is I just argue that time is much more important in cost, but feasibility comes first time comes second cost once those two once those two constraints clear, then you have cost so do you think time is even more important now with the [SPEAKER_07]: What is 12 months ago first is what it is today. [SPEAKER_05]: That's why it's so important.

[SPEAKER_05]: That's exactly why it's so important. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, and that's that's what I was kind of getting to so I understand exactly where you're coming from because it's changing. [SPEAKER_07]: I mean, I talked about this over and over again. [SPEAKER_07]: It changes [SPEAKER_07]: I mean, as we're even sitting here filming this episode, we're going to come out of this and there's going to be four or five new headlines.

[SPEAKER_07]: I mean, major headlines that come out of it, that we aren't even aware of as we went into it. [SPEAKER_07]: That's the first one yeah, so look what's sure it's here sure the other night I got a little preview of it. [SPEAKER_07]: I've been iterating on my own. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, I've got a chance to read I'm gonna read though. [SPEAKER_07]: I'm down. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, the other book looks at Systems and it looks at stress of systems. [SPEAKER_05]: Mm-hmm.

[SPEAKER_05]: Essentially looking. [SPEAKER_05]: I'll give you an example with a [SPEAKER_05]: the street of whom moves, for example, because that probably makes the most sense. [SPEAKER_05]: And right now, it would for everyone, especially with, we talk about energy prices, et cetera.

[SPEAKER_05]: But it looks at system stress being represented by, basically, a mathematical equation, where it looks at the fact that your system, [SPEAKER_05]: You have noise and complexity in systems, but I break it down and say, yeah, but there's structure behind every system as well. [SPEAKER_05]: So below the noise and complexity, there's there's structure and I can express that in a mathematical formula.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: And the way the way I look at it is every system that the auto markets, for example, let's we'll go [SPEAKER_05]: times the rigidity of the system. [SPEAKER_07]: Super Genie. [SPEAKER_05]: I said for Genie. [SPEAKER_05]: Regidity. [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, rigidity. [SPEAKER_09]: Did you? [SPEAKER_05]: Did you? [SPEAKER_09]: Did you? [SPEAKER_09]: Did you? [SPEAKER_09]: Did you? [SPEAKER_09]: Did you? [SPEAKER_09]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_08]: My company is my EDMeds.com.

[SPEAKER_08]: I think of rigidity. [SPEAKER_09]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_09]: You're right. [SPEAKER_07]: Actually, rigidity was the worst. [SPEAKER_06]: Rigidity was the worst. [SPEAKER_06]: It was the worst. [SPEAKER_07]: It was the worst. [SPEAKER_07]: Either term was a rigidity. [SPEAKER_07]: We can lose interest. [SPEAKER_05]: And then we look at. [SPEAKER_05]: And then the third, the third variable is going to be expressed in optionality. [SPEAKER_05]: But effective optionality.

[SPEAKER_05]: So when systems become stressed, the first order, [SPEAKER_05]: then you have a breakdown of the system and then you have a reorganization of the system and your third order effect. [SPEAKER_05]: But those are all probabilities. [SPEAKER_05]: You can't really define that, but you can definitely define the fact that any system, the first thing that happens is going to be price. [SPEAKER_05]: And that's a, and that's first order that means it's a direct effect.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: And we saw that we saw that with oil prices. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: We're seeing that with a lot of things. [SPEAKER_07]: With with with a lot of things. [SPEAKER_07]: Like just the oil prices, you get it online. [SPEAKER_05]: Everything. [SPEAKER_05]: Good online. [SPEAKER_05]: Yep. [SPEAKER_05]: So, and it can apply to liquidity and markets. [SPEAKER_05]: You can apply it to. [SPEAKER_05]: natural gas basins.

[SPEAKER_05]: We talked about that, right? [SPEAKER_05]: Why prices low here? [SPEAKER_05]: Because we're constrained, right? [SPEAKER_05]: We're constrained. [SPEAKER_05]: So the name of the book is Constraints. [SPEAKER_05]: That was my next question. [SPEAKER_05]: What is the name of the book? [SPEAKER_05]: It's called, it's called, well, I'm going to call it probably Constraint is the name of the project. [SPEAKER_05]: No, yeah, but it's not out yet.

[SPEAKER_05]: It's about halfway done with it. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, our listeners are getting the preview of what's to come. [SPEAKER_07]: So true. [SPEAKER_09]: I was going to ask where where people could find them, but [SPEAKER_07]: No, and when they do come up, we're going to have Eric back on to make 100% we can announce, yeah, well, exactly where they're out. [SPEAKER_07]: Exactly. [SPEAKER_07]: Whether it's Amazon or your website, or we'll make it really easy for people to find.

[SPEAKER_09]: Exactly. [SPEAKER_05]: And I really want to thank Brad, because when I started writing the first book, I was, I've been thinking about this for a while. [SPEAKER_05]: And, and. [SPEAKER_05]: And Brad, when you wrote your first book and we were talking about it, yeah, exactly. [SPEAKER_05]: And I attended some of your events. [SPEAKER_05]: I was thinking, I'm like, I'm going to do this. [SPEAKER_05]: You shouldn't. [SPEAKER_05]: And I told you you should.

[SPEAKER_05]: And you told me I should. [SPEAKER_05]: So I, you know, I really thank you. [SPEAKER_05]: I'm so proud of you, bro. [SPEAKER_05]: For that. [SPEAKER_07]: I really appreciate it. [SPEAKER_07]: If everything you got going on in your life, getting married, you know? [SPEAKER_07]: That's the best thing I've ever had. [SPEAKER_06]: Yeah, no right. [SPEAKER_06]: That is the best thing I've ever had. [SPEAKER_07]: No, no, no. [SPEAKER_07]: I'm amongst all this.

[SPEAKER_07]: And also what you're doing for your company and the national gas. [SPEAKER_07]: You know, you are a pillar in the industry and if I was still in the industry, I would be very proud to associate with you. [SPEAKER_07]: I'm very proud to talk to you right now because You're one of the smartest guys I've ever ever met beyond us [SPEAKER_06]: I feel honored to be here and I appreciate this appreciate being I'm so I'm with To the smartest blue on the planet.

[SPEAKER_08]: I'm saying I'm with Brad Brad He's got three three and last week we had my partner Dr. Rich. [SPEAKER_07]: Oh Dr. Rich is very brilliant So you could tell I'm telling you you know, and by the way Dr. Rich is doesn't drink so he he put up with us for four segments He goes straight down [SPEAKER_09]: I mean, Dr. Rich, I love you, brother. [SPEAKER_09]: I mean, you are, you are deeper. [SPEAKER_09]: He even admitted he, he gives straight to asshole 10.

[SPEAKER_09]: What do you call assholeville? [SPEAKER_08]: What did I call it? [SPEAKER_08]: I call it assholeville. [SPEAKER_08]: He didn't appreciate the verb owner. [SPEAKER_08]: That was his friend. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: I mean, he appreciate what it is. [SPEAKER_07]: I think he called. [SPEAKER_08]: The question was, as an amateur bourbon drinker, what am I a bourbonette, a bourbon, a bourbon tea, and all of a sudden, Rich just came out with a bourbon tea, yeah.

[SPEAKER_07]: It was perfect. [SPEAKER_07]: Which makes sense, because the completely sober guy in the room figured out what exactly what Louis was. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: No, I'm so regret with the doctor in the room. [SPEAKER_07]: You're prescribed that. [SPEAKER_07]: Right. [SPEAKER_08]: So I'm in the heading of weed digress. [SPEAKER_08]: Eric, that's so awesome. [SPEAKER_07]: It is awesome. [SPEAKER_08]: Who books coming up had how many do you have out now?

[SPEAKER_07]: No, but I have a bunch of, but you know, I have four AI books out. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: Two have been on the best of their list. [SPEAKER_07]: My newest is Operationally, I'm a very proud of it. [SPEAKER_07]: I'd like much like you in the system work. [SPEAKER_07]: I developed a... [SPEAKER_07]: A 16 layer operational AI governance structure for Fortune 500 and 1000 companies to So important yeah to to embed, you know, and it's it's it's never moving target.

[SPEAKER_07]: We talked about my new platform and it's coming up It's never moving target every week and just like my articles last two weeks They've changed since my books come up because

[SPEAKER_07]: AI is a moving space like none that we've seen before is moving it's hard to keep up it's hard to keep up it is and if you're if you're a governance officer If you're in house console if you're If only there were a place you could aggregate all that information God that be god he could tremendously valuable I think what you're saying [SPEAKER_08]: I can't even imagine where you could keep up. [SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, right? [SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, thanks a lot. [SPEAKER_08]: Like my edmet.

[SPEAKER_08]: My edmet. [SPEAKER_06]: You can keep up with his edmet. [SPEAKER_06]: Yeah, I'm sorry. [SPEAKER_06]: That's a lot of fun. [SPEAKER_09]: I don't do this because I enjoy editing video and all. [SPEAKER_09]: I do it because it's so educational. [SPEAKER_09]: I learn so much every week when we shoot because we have people like Eric and like Louie and Brad's always a wealth of information. [SPEAKER_09]: It's so educational, like I always walk away from these shows.

[SPEAKER_09]: It's like, holy crap, I didn't know that. [SPEAKER_09]: I didn't know, I didn't know. [SPEAKER_07]: This is coming from the guy back there. [SPEAKER_07]: We're in his nylon stocking without a dress the night. [SPEAKER_07]: We all look at it, you know?

[SPEAKER_06]: Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha [SPEAKER_05]: I have one more thing for you, so when I think of the world, I think of it in truly in mathematics and the physical world can be explained by math.

[SPEAKER_05]: So easy question. [SPEAKER_05]: One plus one equals. [SPEAKER_07]: Oh, that's the question that you get buried in there every day, right? [SPEAKER_06]: It goes to you. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, it equals two. [SPEAKER_05]: No, it's not. [SPEAKER_05]: But does it? [SPEAKER_05]: So it equals two and it's always equal to two plus two equals four six plus six equals twelve.

[SPEAKER_05]: We know this right so and if you think about the exploration of the man's mind in math [SPEAKER_05]: right, so they give, um, Pythagorean, Pythagorean. [SPEAKER_05]: Pythagorean. [SPEAKER_05]: Pythagorean. [SPEAKER_05]: Pythagorean. [SPEAKER_05]: Pythagorean. [SPEAKER_05]: Pythagorean. [SPEAKER_05]: Pythagorean. [SPEAKER_05]: Pythagorean. [SPEAKER_05]: Pythagorean. [SPEAKER_05]: Pythagorean. [SPEAKER_05]: Pythagorean. [SPEAKER_05]: Pythagorean. [SPEAKER_05]: Pythagorean.

[SPEAKER_05]: Pythagorean. [SPEAKER_05]: Pythagorean. [SPEAKER_05]: Pythagorean. [SPEAKER_05]: Pythagorean. [SPEAKER_05]: Pythagorean. [SPEAKER_05]: Pythagorean. [SPEAKER_05]: Pythagorean. [SPEAKER_05]: Pythagorean. [SPEAKER_05]: Pythagorean. [SPEAKER_05]: Pythagorean. [SPEAKER_05]: Pythagorean. [SPEAKER_05]: Pythagorean. [SPEAKER_05]: Pythagorean. [SPEAKER_05]: Pythagorean. [SPEAKER_05]: Pythagorean. [SPEAKER_05]: Pythagorean. [SPEAKER_05]: Pythagorean. [SPEAKER_05]: Pythagorean.

[SPEAKER_05]: Pythagorean. [SPEAKER_05]: Pythagorean. [SPEAKER_05]: Pythagorean. [SPEAKER_05]: Pythagorean. [SPEAKER_05]: Pythagorean. [SPEAKER_05]: Pythagorean. [SPEAKER_05]: Pythagorean. [SPEAKER_05]: Pythagorean. [UNKNOWN]: Pythagorean. [UNKNOWN]: Pythagorean. [UNKNOWN]: Pythagorean. [SPEAKER_05]: Theory of relativity. [SPEAKER_05]: It's always been there. [SPEAKER_05]: Can I take you? [SPEAKER_07]: Can I take you one more level now? [SPEAKER_07]: The quantum level is coming on.

[SPEAKER_07]: And this is where I'm going to bring you back when your your books are going to and I want to talk to you about the quantum level because quantum level is proving a lot of this stuff. [SPEAKER_05]: It is which is fascinating. [SPEAKER_05]: You know why? [SPEAKER_05]: This is this is this is the way I this is this is how I believe in it. [SPEAKER_07]: You're shaking.

[SPEAKER_05]: I mean, I believe in a transcendent being because math [SPEAKER_05]: when we get out of this conversation, it's more philosophical, it's God's mind, of course it is, it's perfect. [SPEAKER_05]: And it's perfect and it's always been there, but it takes humans a bit of time to figure it out. [SPEAKER_05]: Right, but it's always been there. [SPEAKER_05]: But when you do figure it out, it's an, uh-huh. [SPEAKER_05]: Exactly. [SPEAKER_05]: And it explains the physical world.

[SPEAKER_05]: It does. [SPEAKER_05]: Where? [SPEAKER_05]: As? [SPEAKER_05]: The physical world doesn't explain math. [SPEAKER_07]: Right. [SPEAKER_05]: But they try in some scientists try to do that. [SPEAKER_05]: I don't think it's the wrong way to look at it. [SPEAKER_05]: But just from a philosophical perspective, math is God's mind. [SPEAKER_07]: Well, thank you for it. [SPEAKER_09]: It's very, you know, it's black and white. [SPEAKER_09]: There's no gray in math.

[SPEAKER_05]: There's no gray. [SPEAKER_05]: It's always been there. [SPEAKER_05]: It takes us a little bit more time, Perry. [SPEAKER_05]: Exactly. [SPEAKER_05]: It's a bigger thing. [SPEAKER_05]: And when it comes, yeah, you're right. [SPEAKER_05]: When it comes to that quantum world, [SPEAKER_07]: Well, and they're scientists that just came out and we'll get into this maybe on the next episode or not, but they're figuring out the quantum explains consciousness.

[SPEAKER_07]: Right, so I mean that's that's very powerful. [SPEAKER_05]: It's massively powerful. [SPEAKER_07]: So and when I appreciate you bringing up today and and where we grew up 40 years ago is there was science and there was a large religion there was this There was this Red Sea Different divide. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, you were either in one camper.

[SPEAKER_07]: You're not but now [SPEAKER_07]: It's converged, and with what we know about science now is too perfect, it's too good and there has to be some creator and I'm putting in very basic terms the Bible sums it up much better [SPEAKER_08]: And what I'm saying is, the basis for your book, AI and God, can they coexist? [SPEAKER_07]: Very much so. [SPEAKER_07]: Very much so.

[SPEAKER_07]: And what my basis is in my secondary basis in the book is there's a lot of folks out there that are looking to AI as being their secondary God, and they can't be. [SPEAKER_07]: Because there is only one God. [SPEAKER_07]: And whatever is created is in the image of God. [SPEAKER_07]: And in that image might be the secondary image created in God. [SPEAKER_07]: and whether that's A.I. [SPEAKER_07]: or not. [SPEAKER_07]: It remains to be seen.

[SPEAKER_05]: Wow. [SPEAKER_05]: But you still, but you keep it on. [SPEAKER_05]: That's Harry. [SPEAKER_05]: But if you look at those, you know, those learning models, yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: Right. [SPEAKER_05]: And if you look at the math behind it, it's always been there. [SPEAKER_05]: It's always been there. [SPEAKER_05]: Linear algebra's always been there. [SPEAKER_07]: Not going away. [SPEAKER_07]: But we're figuring it out.

[SPEAKER_07]: We're figuring out and we're able to capture it quickly and now take it to the next level. [SPEAKER_07]: And again, when I get into the quantum level, that's when it gets into the sub-conscious level. [SPEAKER_07]: And that's always been the answers. [SPEAKER_07]: How do we have our conscious, our subconscious? [SPEAKER_09]: We got that's a whole another show. [SPEAKER_05]: Do I really dream of electric sheep is? [SPEAKER_05]: Well, it's not a playground or not.

[SPEAKER_07]: They have to write. [SPEAKER_07]: It does. [SPEAKER_07]: No, but it's exactly. [SPEAKER_07]: But that's a foreshadowing of what's to come. [SPEAKER_07]: And so that begs the question of the AI models and the human oids that are coming out, are they going to have also a sub-conscious level of a quantum consciousness? [SPEAKER_05]: And then how do you, how do humans differentiate between the two? [SPEAKER_05]: Right. [SPEAKER_07]: How does that work?

[SPEAKER_07]: And is there a difference? [SPEAKER_05]: And it could there ever be a difference because everything is coming from God's mind. [SPEAKER_05]: Right. [SPEAKER_05]: All the math, it's all the math, and the math defines, math defines the world. [SPEAKER_05]: It's, when you actually think about it, I think everyone should take some time to think about it. [SPEAKER_05]: It is, it's mind blowing.

[SPEAKER_07]: Well, and by the way, we have some very young astute Indiana golfers that love to listen to us. [SPEAKER_07]: And this just emphasizes math is important. [SPEAKER_05]: Super important. [SPEAKER_05]: That math is the answer. [SPEAKER_09]: I think it's the most important, if you ask me. [SPEAKER_08]: So you mentioned A squared plus B squared equals C squared, right? [SPEAKER_08]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_08]: There are a couple times that I've used that I thought.

[SPEAKER_08]: Now I know why I learned that. [SPEAKER_08]: Have you ever had that moment? [SPEAKER_08]: You're like, now it makes sense. [SPEAKER_08]: I can tell you what C squared is because you told me what A and A and B are. [SPEAKER_08]: So now I can figure out C for you. [SPEAKER_08]: And all of a sudden you're the smartest person in the room because you took what is simple math. [SPEAKER_08]: in our world that is just so obtuse for so many people that just that line, it goes that way.

[SPEAKER_07]: And Eric, you're a very well-traveled individual. [SPEAKER_07]: You've been to different continents, different countries. [SPEAKER_07]: With that background of his question, I just want to add, when was the moment or was it always a moment when you realized it's definitely a god moment that's driving math? [SPEAKER_05]: It's been over the years where, and I think it probably happened in a tent. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, and that was that was in China Try none hundred pin.

[SPEAKER_05]: No, this is this is China This is on your way to Japan. [SPEAKER_06]: I'm talking about Max Luc Briss Max Luc Briss Probably started that. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I'd say that's when it was it was it was all long from 2017. [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, well, and where were you?

[SPEAKER_05]: I'm sorry [SPEAKER_05]: I was in a tent climbing mountain called so where's your tazzy it's why I sent this to you because I was gonna think about this as well [SPEAKER_05]: very obscure mountain chain, very obscure peak. [SPEAKER_05]: It's never been, it's never been summited before and we've attempted it twice my group at least. [SPEAKER_05]: Where? [SPEAKER_05]: It's on the border of Kazakhstan and China. [SPEAKER_08]: Oh, I thought you were up there punks the taunt.

[SPEAKER_08]: In the Shenzhen. [SPEAKER_05]: In the Shenzhen. [SPEAKER_05]: In the Shenzhen. [SPEAKER_06]: In the Shenzhen. [SPEAKER_06]: In the Shenzhen. [SPEAKER_06]: In the Shenzhen. [SPEAKER_06]: In the Shenzhen. [SPEAKER_06]: In the Shenzhen. [SPEAKER_07]: In the Shenzhen. [SPEAKER_07]: In the Shenzhen. [SPEAKER_07]: In the Shenzhen. [SPEAKER_06]: In the Shenzhen. [SPEAKER_06]: In the Shenzhen. [SPEAKER_06]: In the Shenzhen. [SPEAKER_06]: In the Shenzhen.

[SPEAKER_07]: I think it's so, I think it's so eye-opening to hear from somebody, so intelligent. [SPEAKER_05]: I think it went something from one ice axe, two ice axe equals two. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah? [SPEAKER_05]: Ice tools, you call them as well. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: And it was very simple. [SPEAKER_05]: And then I thought to myself, okay, well, you also have, I was thinking about slopes, like what's, what's the slope? [SPEAKER_05]: That's about a 60% slope.

[SPEAKER_05]: That's pretty, that's pretty challenging, yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: Um, and I thought to myself this mountain it's always been here. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, well at least since we've done it's always been here. [SPEAKER_05]: It was a formation, right? [SPEAKER_05]: Yep. [SPEAKER_05]: And I thought to myself, okay. [SPEAKER_05]: Well, then what else has always been here that we can measure? [SPEAKER_05]: that we couldn't measure before, but now we can measure. [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, okay.

[SPEAKER_05]: Or we developed the ability to measure. [SPEAKER_05]: Ability and the intuition. [SPEAKER_05]: And you know, something else I thought about as well is, you know, if you look at algebra and calculus, imaginary numbers coming to play, right? [SPEAKER_07]: Which is the first time, which is the first time, I've always challenged people up until about 20 or at least 10 years ago.

[SPEAKER_07]: when it's algebra really coming to play unless you're a NASA rocket scientist or in the engineering realm of a very complicated mix, right? [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: But it comes into play into everything we do. [SPEAKER_07]: Everything we do. [SPEAKER_05]: Everything we do. [SPEAKER_08]: We're just not cognizant. [SPEAKER_08]: No, okay.

[SPEAKER_08]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: And a formula when into striking a golf ball, and we know when we were studying algebra in high school, that it was everything that we're doing, [SPEAKER_05]: Yep, ACDC power. [SPEAKER_05]: You cannot have ACDC power if you don't have if you don't understand imaginary numbers. [SPEAKER_05]: The square root of negative one, for example. [SPEAKER_05]: You can't have it. [SPEAKER_05]: It doesn't work.

[SPEAKER_05]: The square root of negative one is I. [SPEAKER_05]: It's imaginary number, but when you look at the curves. [SPEAKER_05]: You have to have it in the Arabs realized that and that was the foundation of Calculate. [SPEAKER_08]: I'm crossing over Max right now. [SPEAKER_09]: I remember telling my stepson when he was, I don't know, fifth grade and they were doing the multiple occasion tables and it was, you know, one to ten, one to ten.

[SPEAKER_09]: That I said, learn every single one of these, you know, simple, [SPEAKER_09]: you're entirely. [SPEAKER_09]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_09]: Once you understand that, the rest of it's not easy, but it will make sense. [SPEAKER_09]: And much like I don't know if you did or not, we'll find out. [SPEAKER_07]: Well, much like Eric, I was post high school, post college, post law school when I realized God is so perfect. [SPEAKER_06]: So perfect.

[SPEAKER_07]: And when you realize that, I don't know, this has turned into a religion episode, but I think it comes back to science and mathematics, and no better than to talk to somebody from CMU. [SPEAKER_07]: That's story this, that's right in books about it.

[SPEAKER_07]: God is perfect, and when you look at it, and everything is perfect, and I would challenge anybody to look at everything and think that you could throw up a million times of [SPEAKER_07]: You know, they all come back and they're just as perfect as we are today with every system that's working in in sync That's never gonna happen and that's the that's the most mine.

[SPEAKER_05]: That's the most mine mind boggling thing you're good to go Systems are complex and they still work, but they're structured to the systems, right? [SPEAKER_05]: It's just not noise and complexity. [SPEAKER_05]: It's not there's a structure to it and it's it all explained by math [SPEAKER_08]: This track shares with your second book. [SPEAKER_08]: We're all molecules, but we are structured. [SPEAKER_08]: We are into this system.

[SPEAKER_08]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_08]: Otherwise, we're just cells that, if we don't have the system, which is our brain. [SPEAKER_05]: And here's the other thing about it. [SPEAKER_05]: But I think it's very important, I just saying as well. [SPEAKER_05]: We all have free will. [SPEAKER_05]: Yes. [SPEAKER_05]: Right? [SPEAKER_05]: We all do. [SPEAKER_05]: And you have structure, and then you have free will. [SPEAKER_05]: You have both.

[SPEAKER_07]: It's a it's a it's a cool dichotomy it is really cool right yeah and and and it's also that dichotomy that probably confuses a lot of people [SPEAKER_05]: don't think it's so simple. [SPEAKER_05]: You need time to think about it in a tent when you're traveling. [SPEAKER_06]: Trying to be the first one that's somewhat amount on the border of, um, so you're good. [SPEAKER_06]: This is an attitude now. [SPEAKER_09]: This is an attitude for an effort, definitely for another effort.

[SPEAKER_07]: It's probably, you know, and I just, I just, uh, bounced to my Mikey.

[SPEAKER_07]: Now it's [SPEAKER_07]: But Perry's giving me the the bunny ears back there is giving it to him and one it literally got one still a little up in the year I don't want to see that You only see two One is better than two One is one better than two When you're looking at that area That's right, that's right That's right, so with that said the Berber nominers down our guest count is up [SPEAKER_07]: Thank you, Eric Walsky for being here. [SPEAKER_07]: Love you, brother.

[SPEAKER_07]: Love you too. [SPEAKER_07]: Congratulations, Luke. [SPEAKER_07]: Thank you. [SPEAKER_08]: Can I tell you? [SPEAKER_08]: My favorite wrestler growing up was Killer Kowalsky. [SPEAKER_10]: Oh, yeah. [SPEAKER_08]: I don't know if you're remembering that guy. [SPEAKER_08]: I know. [SPEAKER_08]: Again, over time. [SPEAKER_08]: I think, yeah, he used to fight against the balloon. [SPEAKER_08]: Dominic Danucci. [SPEAKER_08]: It was a battle.

[SPEAKER_08]: The cultures back in the old days of chilly Billy Cardillion. [SPEAKER_05]: Wrestling and Western Pennsylvania. [SPEAKER_05]: What interesting thing about wrestling you could talk about wrestling in Tokyo after World War Two and it was such a very That's another story for another day but very unique very unique. [SPEAKER_05]: I'm short one. [SPEAKER_07]: Yes It's still unique today.

[SPEAKER_05]: Well, in Tokyo after World War Two, it was a beru building process It was and the U.S. wrestlers came into Japan and we're beaten for a reason There's a great yeah some great stories about that [SPEAKER_09]: There's a great conversation. [SPEAKER_06]: Anyways, thank you guys for all. [SPEAKER_06]: Thank you, we're being here. [SPEAKER_06]: Thank you. [SPEAKER_06]: Thank you, boys. [SPEAKER_07]: Love you guys. [SPEAKER_07]: Cheers to you. [SPEAKER_07]: Cheers. [SPEAKER_07]: Salute.

[SPEAKER_01]: See you also. [SPEAKER_01]: This has been Bourbon with Brad. [SPEAKER_01]: Be sure to like and follow me. [SPEAKER_01]: Cheers. [SPEAKER_00]: The views and opinions shared on the bourbon with Brad podcast are our own, and those of our guests. [SPEAKER_00]: Nothing we discussed should be taken as financial, legal, business, or gambling advice.

[SPEAKER_00]: Don't make investment, business, or betting decisions based on our conversations as you should always talk to a qualified professional. [SPEAKER_00]: Always drink responsibly, never drink and drive, and only consume alcohol if you are of legal drinking age.