Musk Sells More Tesla Shares, Senate TikTok Concerns

unanimously to ban TikTok from all government issued phones and devices. Again, details on the real impact for the Chinese own platform and former President Donald Trump, he's a major announcement just weeks after it's declaring a third presidential run. Instead, he's talking digital trading cards in an n f T market. Details on that one a little bit later in the hour, but first let's go even more micro. She teased us there.

She told us about Tesla because of course we know the song has been under pressure, and maybe a little bit more of the evidence as to why. Because Elon masks the biggest holder Tesla's stock, has been selling yet more three point six billion dollars worth in fact of shares, bringing the total amount he's offloaded since late last year Thomas forty billion, next Billy lips and pleased to say

it's here for more and it's interesting really. Of course, we were just wondering why it was under pressure, many feeling perhaps a retail investor, which is such an important buyer for Tesla, was a little bit worried about his distraction about his recent other purchases. But now it seems to be lay clear that maybe the setting pressure is

coming from him himself. Exactly when you look at where the market was trading Monday and Tuesday, broadly moving higher in Tesla, the biggest drag on the SMP five hundred in the Nasdaq one hundred in those two days. Again, this is kind of a bit of sounding an alarm for investors. It's still those concerns about what is Ellen focused on, where is his head at. Obviously SpaceX has been successful, Tesla has been a roaring success, but did

he bite off more than you could chew? With Twitter in particular, again with massive debtloads, how does that impact the fundamental business of Tesla again, even how large of a stake he has, and whether or not he's going to continue to sell shares. As you mentioned at the top of the hour that he did say earlier in the year that he was done selling and then three and a half billion is not done selling now, you don't.

Mousque himself could be a bit of a macro economic commentator, and he's sort of made a few should we say, trails breadcrumbs for us saying, look, you should be worried about debt right now. If you're seeing the rates go up from the Fed, what about his debt? What about Twitch? Is debt? Well, that's the thing, and that's kind of

to your point. Interest rates are going higher when you look at Twitter, when you look at that take out that does come with massive debt load, that does come with pretty high interest rates that are going to continue need to be paid. So that's the main question is is Elan selling these shares to buy some of that debt? Is he doing it to invest more on Twitter? Is he doing that to you know, help cover some of

those interest payments. No one really knows. It's I don't think anyone really kind of understands what he loves doing other than Elon. But there are so many questions just given how tied these companies can be, given where they are right now, where they're trading, and again with this selling pressure that we've seen so far this week for

Tesla stock in particular. Many call him an entrepreneur or visionary, he seems to have to be an investment banker at the moment as well, I would seem we thank you, as always, Bailey lip shots on the money when it comes to all things Tesla. Meanwhile, let's again turn to those broader tech valuations. Let's again turn to the macro

that Ellen himself has been commenting on. Let's talk to Caleb Brune morning consult economic analyst, just here to give us basically you'll read, at the moment, we've had the Federal Reserve, the ECB, the Bank of England all hiking rates to the tune of half a percentage point. They're all well part from the Bank of England maybe sounding pretty hawkish about where rates have to go to tackle inflation.

Give our audience, who is so aware of the macro implications on their holdings what this means in terms of overall desire to be buying stocks right now. So good evening, Thank you for having me on. Uh yeah, with the US, at least with the Fed this week, I don't think that's a rise was really with the amount that they raised rates this week. Everyone was really expecting about a

half point increase. But what I think where people were paying a little more attention and we're a little surprised, was with how firm they were with their language about their intent to continue raising rates and where they expected rates to be over the next year. I think with the two consecutive months of positive inflation surprises, some were thinking that that message would be softened a little bit, but we didn't see too much sign of that this

week so far. When we got the Federal res of rate high, we also got updated perspective and where they see the economy going, where they see what are called terminal rates going, how high investment they overrule at the Federals of think rates will hit five point one percent overall.

What are the implications of that from your perspective on the labor market, in particular, what we're already seeing cracks from the technology perspective, certainly heading into three the labor market is something to watch closely, and I'm sure the FED will be watching it very closely. It is one factor that could potentially affect the trajectory of the rate increases.

Potentially have them change their their path, especially if unemployment were to pick up significantly, which we really haven't seen so far. Now. One question is how much of that has to do with the fact that labor force participation has remained pretty low, And that's kind of an open question where where should labor force partition participation be after the pandemic. But if we continue to see unemployment stay so low, then that that gives them a little more

leeway to continue with the rate increases. Some of the nerve business in the market today, and I think in many ways we were tuned to the market being, oh, well, bad news is good news. The Federal Reserve will have to pump on the brakes. We therefore buy stocks today. There was just bad news ultimately in the economy when it came to retail sales. I know you look a lot at the consumer, Kayla, just talk to us about how resilient they are when many are looking at e

commerce in particular or on the show. That's another thing to really keep an eye on. And each month I really look at three sort of indicators for consumers spending. Um we have at morning Consoled our own spending data that we get to look at the first week of the month, then middle of the month today we get retail sales, which is much more goods focused, uh. And then at the end of the month, of course, we have personal consumption expenditures, which is really the broadest measure UM.

But two out of the three this month so far have shown a pretty strong negative signal for November um actual decreases in spending in both real and nominal terms, which is a bit of a reversal from what we've seen in October certainly, and really in two overall, which was that consumer spending has been holding up pretty well. It's a huge part of growth overall, so to the extent that it does so in three, that's also an

important thing to keep an eye on. But as consumers work their way through some of the savings they'd accumulated during the pandemic, it's it's unclear how long that that boost is gonna last. Kata. It really does feel a really extraordinary time to be trying to read the tea leaves of this U S economy, this global economy. On so many ways. We feel the resilience. We see the jobs data just showing there is still tightness there, but

everywhere else we look, it feels like softening. Can you kind of give us a grade on the health of the U. S economy right now? Where is your where's your head up? That's a great question. I'd probably give it a bee. I think I think we're seeing a lot of mixed signals. But I mean, it's it's hard to give it a grade because there just is so

much uncertainty. Um, there's a lot of moving parts, as there always are, but there's certainly some things that I look at as kind of like an hour glass running out, And the question is is inflation, which is now heading in the right direction, is that going to kind of fix itself before we run out of time with savings, before we run out of time with this strong, healthy labor market. So there's these competing forces and it's it's unclear really who's going to win out in the in

the next year. Well, I love how you gave us some of the key data that you keep an eye on. So thank you for that, Caleb and Moe and come Selt economic analysts there for your macro perspective. So the U. S. Senate voted to band TikTok from all government issue phones and other devices. This is of course, the Biden administration is still considering restrictions on the Chinese own platform. Joining us with the inside tracks Bloomberg, Alex Berrinka, and just

talk us through the impact of the Senate vote. It's happened once before in a previous time. Just talk to us about whether this really matters. Yeah, it matters to the extent that this is kind of continued pressure on this national security review. Of course, this bill would have to pass in the House and be signed by the

President to come into action. But Caroline, I think there's another point of context this week, um that just like underpins the momentum against TikTok in Congress right now, that bill passed. At the same time, Marco Rubio and some colleagues in the House representatives also introduced a bill that

advance TikTok outright. So Congress seems to be getting a little bit impatient, or at least these very vocal members who have been anti TikTok are getting a little bit impatient with this national security review that's going on under

the Biden administration. Um with TikTok to try to kind of come to an agreement of how to get TikTok to work in the United States in a way that makes folks who care about national security, who are worried about the Chinese government's influence on TikTok's parent company, Byte Dance, how to make sure that it's operating here in a way that's really safe for US users and their data.

So this vocal group that we've heard throughout the past few months at markar Rubio, Josh Holly Um in Congress being really loud, are now really ticking action, Caroline, And that's where I think there's a little bit of an inflection point here, Um for some of this momentum against TikTok. Just talk us through that. And it's interesting because we

went to our own audience. I know that you'll often, I'm very pleased to say, joining some of our Twitter spaces, the conversation you're very active on Twitter and week on to our own audience on Twitter, asking them via the Bloomberg Technology Handle whether they think this might soon impact their own phone, their own use of TikTok can actually did think that the ban is coming to their phone next?

What all the ways in which TikTok itself is trying to navigate these waters and trying and to ensure that they're regulated, but perhaps regulate in a way that means they're still on our phone. So aside from making kind of promises that data will not get into the hands of the Chinese government, they're working on some things behind the scenes with US touch company Oracle to basically migrate all of the data from US users Onto service in

the Onto servers in the US. So they say that that plus some auditing by Oracle on their content moderation policies, they expect that's enough to keep the data safe. Now that process, that review has kind of come to the standstill. Bloomberg has reported that's because of the Department of Justice saying that the current state of the agreement is not up to snuff with them. So obviously there are some folks, since some of these really important agencies involved in this review,

let's say it's not enough. We also heard FBI Director Ray come out in recent weeks saying that, um, you know, it's not quite there yet. So um, that's what TikTok has promised they would do. Um, whether or not that ends up being at the end result. Again, these voices kind of pushing against this process is not a good sign for that ideal situation for TikTok. We thank you always, Alex. It was a great newsletter that you put out all things TikTok bound today, and we thank you for just

walking up through some of your thinking Alex Bernka there. Meanwhile, let's talk about the administration's impact on sort of technology elsewhere, particularly when it comes to M and A because Microsoft president Brad Smith he says the company has a solution to resolve issues surrounding its potential acquisition of Activision Blizzard and still expects that the deal will go through in three He spoke with Bloomberg's Jennifer Zavasaja in Washington, d C.

At the end of the day, these are decisions are made under laws, not just under people, and the laws, whether you're talking to the United States and the United Kingdom of the European Union, are very clear. It's all about whether an acquisition will promote competition. And in our view, we're competing with Sony Microsoft Xbox. If you put it head to head with Sony PlayStation, we have SEV we have we're the small entrance. They have two hundred and

eighty six exclusive titles we have fifty nine. We need some more first party games in order to be a healthier and stronger competitor, and we need to do it, of course, in a way that doesn't impede competition along the way. All of these concerns have basically focused on one title, a great title to game, Call of Duty.

But we've said we're prepared to commit contractually. We're prepared to commit under a consent to career and undertaking that that will be available for Sony in comparable terms to Xbox for the next decade. So I look at this and say, this will be good for competition, and we have a solution to the one problem that seems to

bother people the most. And my only real complaint or concerned if you will, about where we are in Washington, d C. Is that we have the Federal Trade Commission vote to block this without giving us even a single meeting at which to sit down with the FTC staff and talk about the consent to create proposal and solution we had put on the table. I don't think that is appropriate. I don't think that's right. I don't think we should have governments rejecting potential solutions without at least

first having a real conversation about them. That's not a recipe that will advance competition. So what happens next then, well, we have a process in Washington, d c. And it's called lawyers get to go argue before a judge under the law, an administrative law judge. And this still goes forward in other countries. It has a long ways to go. We'll see. Look, nobody ever has a crystal ball in which you can predict the future with a certainty. But when I look at what this acquisition will bring, I

think it will bring good things to the marketplace. It will definitely be good in our view for people who develop games, consumers who play games. That's, after all, the real focus of what competition law is all about. Anticipating the deal to go through in or well, we have a period of time. We originally said when we announced this in January of this year that we were looking at it in three and that's still the way we

look at it. Microsoft president Brad Smith, along with our own Jennifer coming up about two hundred companies based in China and Indein and Hong Kong. They may no longer be facing a threat of being booted off American stock exchanges. More on wine next this It's a COVID story familiar around the world, and China is not immune. As restrictions ease, cases rise and workers call in sick. Half the currency traders of one Chinese bank in Beijing called in sick

on Monday. Soaring absentee is UM is slowing down the process of executing and confirming trades, aggravating the usual seasonal dipping activity scene at the end of the year. The sudden uptick and traders staying homesick is seen as one of the reasons for a drop, and on shore you aren't all. The spot volumes to levels not seen since April.

There are signs of normality in China, with people returning to the streets and public transport, and signs of disruption as well, with long lines outside hospitals and people struggling to find medicine. The road out of lockdowns was never going to be smooth. Financial institutions have been largely left to themselves in terms of navigating that road, with little

official guidance from authorities. Bloomberg understands suddenly Anders are retaining the split team's approach used over the past three years, but most just advising workers who feel sick to stay home, and that advice is heated. Short staffing and slowdowns are

becoming part of the new COVID normal in China. Paul Allen Bloomberg, let's stay on China now because well maybe trading style a bit, but actually some stocks rallied today because the throat of being delisted off the US stock exchanges.

It's kind of easy for some big names, in particular Alibaba, JD dot Com, joining s Nasma most Yushan Chen, who covers the Chinese markets covers some of these names, and the reason they rallied is because we've got an update as to whether or not or they would be delisted, and it looks as though it's a threat diminishing somewhat. Yes, for sure, So I would say this is a very

important step for resolving this long standing induspriute. Ordered to industry goes from the US and China, and Master even described us to me as early Christmas gift because they saw like dealisting was like the biggest concern as they see for the Chinese ado names from Ali Baba to j D dot Com and what p C a O b S update today bas C A O B being uh ultimately what the suit of authority. It's like the

auditing watchdog on the U S side. So they put out a statement abouts they now finally was able to get the full auditing access of this Chinese company. And it's the first time in the history because before Beijium was like trying to deny the access for national security concerns. So Beijing and remember Beijing and Washington reach out like a preliminary deal during the summertime, but then PCLBS and stuff to do a run of inspection check just to

make sure this company delivered. Was they promised right? So this is an update after the inspection and the market has been waiting on it for a while and it's a positive outcome. So for sure that the starts like Ali Babai and j D dot com or like rallying and at one point at three point five percent, it's like Balcoli. The overall market is slamps. We see today

among the tech names. Very briefly is that it though we were don't know we risk free CHRISTI presents abound no I was saying probably we are not there yet because p C A or b is going to restart the clock for three years. They will continued to keep these companies under check, right for more years to to calm and sec also want you know, hes to war auditing. Our expection works to be done. But overall it's moving towards are very I would say positive direction. Right certainly

that was just not me today. Thank you always appressive these things heation chann bring that there will be companies I think continuously uh some dayots for companies that maybe have two many people dim Laying off talent is an opportunity for other companies to actually need more tech talent. Welcome back to Blombag Technology. I'm Caroline Hide in New York. And that, of course is Nicholas Enstrom, founder of Skype as you know, and also the CEO of the European

venture capital firm Atomico. Talking about tech layoffs and let's keep talking about that because well, the wave of mass tech layoffs is spark perhaps and nextodus of tech talent to other sectors. Millennium management Global headed talent acquisition. That's John Telarco is here to talk about, well, how alternative asset management and particularly his Giant with fifty eight billion dollars in assets on the management So I mean perhaps

a leading destination and these sorts of workers. Just talk to us, John about how many tech related roles you've hired for this here and how many more you've still got to fill. I'm happy to Caroline, thanks for having me. It's great to be here. You know, we've put two four technologists. I think the number is to work this year with a hundred openings still listed or a hundred

plus on our career site. Uh. In twenty five years of me running technology talent acquisition programs, I've only seen a few of these disruptions, but I'm happy to say Millennium can be a welcome destination for those finding themselves on the job market. So talk to us about in your shop and others. And I'm sure if rivals might be doing something similar at the moment. What kind of candidates are you looking for? What type of roles are

you filling? Great question? At first, it starts across all levels, whether you're beginning your career or whether you're want to be in a senior global position. We're recruiting across all

of those levels. We also recruit across all of those technical competencies that I personally think are so attractive, not only software engineering and full stack engineering, but security engineering and cloud engineering, and these these roles that involve unbelievable amounts of data within this industry, that that make things really really excited, exciting and so um over sort of

a fairly typical technology stack. We seek those individuals that can solve problems that have grit, that are scrappy across a wider range of opportunities. Okay, so I can see if I was a technologist coming perhaps upended by the fact that I've just been let go by one of the big technology companies, I think I can get intellectual

stimulation with Millennium. What about culture because many would say, perhaps uh in an uninformed or naive way, but certainly I would go well, finance on one heart side, you know, hard working, long hours perhaps in the office, technology more softer culture. What are you having to decide and educate people about in terms of your culture. Well, I'm really happy you said that, because, in my opinion, what we offer in the aggregate is really powerful and it's really special.

It's not only that technology opportunity, it's not only the connection to our businesses. It's not only the impact you can provide, it's the respect for the individual and the collaboration on site, and the fact that that respect and the way we go about working with each other is extremely positive. And I would love the chance to sort of talk to those who may think that would be otherwise. Okay, so let's just think about being in the office sort not if I'm used to a hybrid culture, indeed a

completely fully remote one. How are you thinking about where the talent is that you can hire? So, first of all, from a location perspective, globally, we're building out Miami, Dublin, Tel Aviv, Bangalore, and Miami is going to be a big tech club for us. We also traditional opportunity in New York and London and Singapore. But we're also making sure that we are are very very focused on making you know, this talent. Knowing there's some flexibility in our

model right we are. We're enjoying returning to the office. That collaboration is really important to us. We can be flexible as well as well as global location flexibility. When you say Miami, I immediately think of crypto and is does it matter which sector, which part of technology because basically, as SAMI technologies horizontal, it's not vertical anymore. But does it matter what type of company these people are coming from?

In short notes, the technology skills aligne those cultural attributes. The sort of degree of problem solving. Of course, that's interesting to us. But whether it's tech sector, crypto or existing sector or any other talent that's interested in what we're doing, the domain is not a prerequisite. I've had lots of conversations with people in finance, particularly those who are trying to hire talent, about the need for diversity

in the need for pipeline I am. I imagine technology fights that good fight too, and worried about its own pipeline and showing that they have diversity in the workplace. How are you thinking about that when you're starting to hide these technologies. It's a great question. It's extremely important to us. UM. We've seen really great activity in terms of females in the technology space and going into universities at a greater rates and coming out of those programs

at greater rates. UM and and cultural and racial diversity incredibly important to us. It's all about diversity of thought, and we get that from all those different pockets, so heavy focus on all of that, whether it's through affinity networks, through paid for programs, just through making sure we're out in those right pot it's with UH, with with folks that help us as third parties to identify where those talent that talent may sit. It's really important to us

and and it's going to make us better. What are the ways in which you're having to be creative in the way you hire, Because, as I said, I'm pretty sure Millennium, you're out here talking about this, but so prevent how it's some other big asset managers, alternative managers are doing something similar. How do you set yourself apart? How are you looking for alternative types of people to

come to you? So at Millennium, in my opinion and specific to my organization, I think we do a really good job of casting a really wide net we need

we need the best talent. So, whether it's having strategic relationships with search firms, whether it's using LinkedIn, whether it's using our vast employee network, whether it's thinking about where these pools of talent maybe that could be attractive to us, and then advertising accordingly to those pools of talent there's nothing that you could probably think of that we don't do. We we want to get the very best talent, and so there's nothing in terms of a strategy we wouldn't try. John,

create us time. If you come back, give us up to speed with how it's going, John, Millennium Management Global headed talent acquisition. There. Meanwhile, we want to stick with this theme, this issue because well, actually the move of tech talent to other sectors is not the only impact these latest layofs. In fact, immigrants found themselves in perhaps a more precarious situation. H one B visas, for one,

is an example. I think of that ticking clock attached to when you lose your roll, Please to say to talk us through it, maybe release some anxiety or not. As Sophie al Con it's an immigration lawyer based in Mountain View, California. You specialize in securing visas for tech workers and talk to us, Sophie, I personally anecdotal evidence. Finally got my green cards sort of euphoria. There is an element though that before that there was a worry. You know, my husband or on H one B visa,

he was nervous to a certain extent. How are you seeing H one B visas and temporary talent being affected by these layoffs. Well, thank you Caroline for having me and huge congratulations to you on your green card. That's wonderful and it's such an important mile stone in the life journey of any immigrant who is trying to create something in the United States. Uh, people in tech. We just saw the numbers on the slide the layoffs in November,

over fifty thousand. I'm estimating that probably twenty of the laid off tech workers are on some sort of non immigrant work visa such as H one B or L one or OH one. They haven't gotten a green card yet and they're somewhere in the process, and so what that means for them is they have this sixty day grace period and if they can't find another job and get their papers filed in time or figure out another status, they have to leave the United States. Thousands of people,

probably five ten, maybe more. Nobody really has the numbers, but well it could easily be ten to fifteen thousand of the world's most brilliant people poised to cause brain for their brain drain in the United States. So how are companies being foultful about this? Some on that foultful. They just got to get rid of people. I'm sure some are out there thinking, Okay, how can I if you were working here in an immigrant visa, how can I protect you in some way? What are the ways

companies are dealing with it? Well, when the layoffs started in November, like with Twitter for example, they were just across the board layoffs last day of employment. The word is cessation in the legal regulations. Uh. Some people will continue to get paychecks into January, but there are sixty day clock started ticking in November. Fortunately, uh, some employers

have started waking up to this immigration reality. And even if they have to make this difficult decision based on economics to lay people off, I am starting to see more compassion in the layoff process for nonimmigrants, with employment lawyers creating different options, like, hey, instead of a severance package, how about we agree to keep you working and keep you on payroll into this date in the future, and

then your sixty days will start then. But look, you can start looking for a job now and that will try to help you get through the holidays and the hiring freezes and have a better chance of finding your next role. So you can stay here in the United States with your family. So I am I am seeing compassion around the holidays, but I think it's still a big problem for thousands of people. Now, I'm not saying that social media and putting one's videos out there often

stirs a lot of compassion. And interestingly, I did do previously kind of a TikTok on the impacts on H one B visa holders, and a lot of the responses were good, you know, a few more jobs for those who actually American. How are you seeing that evolving? How are we thinking about the repercussions of this set of layoffs? Would it ever mean that people companies are more reticent to go through the H one B visa process because they don't want to leave people in the sort of

precarious situation of the off the night layoffs. So it's economically very complicated, and certainly the whole H one B process and visas an immigration is a lightning rod for controversy in this country. Employers are still economically incentivized to hire immigrants for a variety of economic structural reasons. Um politically, when this comes up, there's always questions about well our H one B holders taking jobs away from Americans, or

are American companies abusing H one B holders. So these are all very important discussions to have at a a national level. I hope that immigration will continue. There's a story by the Washington Post just a few hours ago saying that due to the immigration slowed down over the last two years, one point seven million immigrants haven't and able to come into the country, which is part of why we also have a shortage of available workers with the skill sets that we need. But from a holistic

economic level for the country, immigrants are are critical. They're brilliant. They pay full tuition to get masters and other PhDs

from US colleges and universities. They have deep stem knowledge, including artific artificial intelligence, which is so critical to creating startups, paying taxes, creating jobs for Americans, and technology powers are national security and so we really have to think as a country if we want the next Apple, Google, and SpaceX to be founded in the United States or elsewhere.

Because those are some of the ramifications of these policies of you know, Musk and self, an immigrant to the U s sophilcan thank you, alcohol, immigration will founder and CEO. We need making it clear which big companies have been founded by those who came in some sort of a visa. Meanwhile, coming up with the cops of f t X spooking some crypto trade is what will this mean for digital assets? Draws closer thes Blomberg. Crypto of course in the spotlight

amid the f t X scandal bearious traders. They're signing that. Look, crypto losses are likely to continue into next year too. Joining us now is Michael's fine managing partner of quantitative trading firm Dexterity Capital, who can give us a really broad perspective, not only Michael. I'm sure we're getting into the nitty gritty of future regulation and all that good stuff, but talk to us about just trading at the moment

opportunities in the crypto space. Our institution is just pulling back. Yeah, I think it's a really quiet time in cryptocurrency right now. And for traders like us who are high frequency and little latency, we depend on a lot of volumes, so

we're not seeing that. And you know, over the course of the past eighteen months, a lot of traditional shops like the Hudson River Tradings or Citadels of the world have come into crypto, and I think they were doing great for a bit, but now they're found finding there's not that much to go around anymore, and maybe they'll be thinking twice about whether they want to stick around next year. Okay, so talk to us about what you need with trading volumes. What is necessary to build back

those trading volumes. Obviously a little bit of desire to get in, a bit more of a bullish sentiment, maybe stocks to move, but is there something more within crypto itself that needs to come back to bring back the trading volumes. The number one thing we need is trust. People have to feel safe, especially retail investors and institutional traders like us, that if we're on an exchange, our our money is going to stay there and that we

can continue to trade successfully. That's the most important thing. And I think adjunct to trust, we need proper regulation and that's something that guys like us have been crying out for for a long time. Unfortunately, this big disaster had to happen before you know, DC really started to take notice. Let's go first back to trust. There is

still a lot of nervousness out there. Fathers, the crypto world will call it fear uncertainty, and and a lot of that still surround some of the exchanges, whether it be the lending that might have been done on Genesis, whether it's what's happening over with finance what you're hearing from these exchanges and other lending protocols, and they're like, are you building trust and you're feeling more confident around

it or not. I think we're taking steps towards trust, and we're seeing exchanges in particular doing more to create transparency to say, hey, this is where our reserves are and you can go and verify on the blockchain that we actually have these assets. And that's a good first step, but we need to do more. I think we need to see full audits of exchanges, and we need them to be accountable to regulators who can get inside the building and see what's actually happening with the balance sheets

and with the assets. Okay, so talk to us about regulators, because there's almost a bit of a squabble here in the US about who's going to be the key, whether it's going the SEC, where it's going to be the CFTC. But for as a bit of a European I look at what's happening in Europe and they're already getting through some of this regulation and putting it into action. What

do you make of what's happening globally? Yeah, and I think Europe's been very smart that you wants to capture a lot of this cryptocurrency market because long term they see a future there. So the legislation like MICA is a big help. It lays out exactly what the definitions of particular types of cryptocurrency assets are, whether it's a

utility token, a security or e money. And they're also setting out requirements for a crypto service provider is like exchanges and custodians and brokers, so that again retail can feel safe and regulators can be sure that everyone's house

is in order. Okay, that's got really interesting echo for me to what happened with GDPR, what happened with data, the fact that Europe just get there faster, which is kind of extraordinary given their well they're not one country, there are a grouping of different countries of very much diverse thought. Is this going to keep on happening? Is you're going to lead the charge? And is that ultimately kind of a good thing for them setting regulation elsewhere.

I think it's a good thing for them the charge if they can. I think the US is now going to want to come in and do what they can. But one thing I admire about the European process is they've worked with the industry leaders to make sense of this very complex and new technology. I think it's hard for regulators to wrap their heads around exactly how this

all works and what the risks are. And I think that's why in the US, the CFTC SEC, they've been a bit slower to get around this really hard problem. So I do hope in the US still engage with industry leaders. Michael Great to have some time any of Dexterity Capital managing partner Michael Sufi. So how do you like to watch a movie? Are you in the theater? Because I have a fashion for you? Are you watching

it at home? Is perhaps a debate because we're not sure how basically movies are being affected, and not all of them are the same. Of course, back in two thousand and nine, just think about Avatar. It was a hit film. It's watershed event for Imax, in particular because to this day it remains the highest grossing film in Imax history. Now, the release of the long awaited sequel Avatar The Way of Water has underlined what investors see as a strong case for shares of the movie theater chains.

Because this at a time when movie going seems to kind of lost its luster, IMAX shares have fallen less than the rest of its rivals, falling only four two compared to think like the drop that we see here in cinema in the blue AMC. I don't need to tell you down by two thirds sixty six per cent. But Imax, of course, kind of benefits from an environment that split between smaller films and increasingly go director streaming on one hand, and the blockbusters, the ones you want

to go and see in a theater. You want to be eating your popcorn, you want to have an immersive experience. So the release Friday of the new Avatar could prove to be the year's most foremost example of the latter. Still, according to blue Bug data, year to day US box office receipts there are third lower than levels seen back in twenty nine. Of course, that's the last pre COVID year, and very different if you think about how airlines have recovered to above levels not the same when you're going,

perhaps to the movies in the cinema. Such a change, such a way in which Disney plus Netflix has up ended the way in which we consume that maybe something like an avatar, you just can't can't experience it in your home movie experience. You've got to go, you've got to get to a theater, you've gotta put on your glasses or whatever way in which you want to consume. Meanwhile, well bear the thought, and that does it for this edition of Bloomberg Technology. Don't forget to check out our podcast.

You can find it on the terminal if you're lucky enough to have one, as well as online on Apple, on Spotify. An I Heart from New York and wishing add a wonderful time off in London. At the moment, we listen as a Bloomberg