Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news. So I'm very pleased to be joined by one of the sort of really true leaders on European defense here is the Polish finance minister. They have got their NATO spending the highest as a proportion of GDP of all of the NATO countries. They're at four point one two percent, and I just heard from the finance minister that they're going to get a four point seven percent next year. So I really have to start the conversation there with you about sort of
how do you get sort of a European concept. Where are these discussions across the sort of finance ministers over the last few days.
Good morning for Poland and for Polish presidency. Defense and security is absolutely a top priority. So right now we are discussing with ministers of finance of all member states the ways to better finance our security in the coming years. It's obvious for us that the time to act is now. We just cannot eight for five years for another budget. We need to take actions now. So this is why we will discuss during ecofin council meetings ways to finance
defense spending. And as you said, we need to have way stronger defense industry here in Europe?
And is there do you think there's a concept that's emerging or at least ideas that are being discussed at your ministerial level about how exactly to do that right, because we've we've heard about maybe a five hundred billion euro of fund or maybe you know, countries coming together and saying, listen, we're going to form a sort of
financial defense alliance. We might issue some bonds. Is there something that's sort of coming out clearly because some of the resistance that we've heard from, say the German finance minister has been well this we're not justly going to issue bonds for their own sake. We needed an idea to get behind and that is sort of an absent.
It's a bit premature to say which of the prosions that are on the table will be best, but with no doubt there is a need for discussion, and our partners are also fully aware of fully aware of that. So my thinking is that first we need to know what precisely we need to buy, where are our weaknesses, and therefore, after having such a buying least, we need to address it.
With financing right and also trying to also I think source some of the material within Europe. There was an also you're also quoted, I'm saying that you may also Poland may also issue dedicated defense bonds. Is that something that you're looking at? Sort of how big are you looking in terms of issue and how would that work?
It's one of the it's one of the option. We have no problem with financing our defense spendings. It will be, as you said, four point seven percent of GDP next year. But right now we are really comfortable with financing.
And then the sort of question of sort of the future of also support of Ukraine. Poland has been very sort of supportive of Ukraine, been one of the great sort of champions for the cause. You have the Trump administration coming in, is there something that more needs to be done? I mean, I understand that we've also now sort of got the forty billion or fifty billion from the Russian backed assets. Are you looking at doing more with the uncertainty of what a Trump administration could bring.
The position of Polish government is clear. Our support for Ukraine must be stable and firm and it will be like that. And of course I'm really happy that there is this decision of US of passing this twenty billion dollars it will help Ukraine. Now we need to secure transferring of those funds to Ukraine as the country really
needs it. And Poland will always advocate the interest of Ukraine as we do know that this is the place where we right now are fighting against Ukraine and one of the other against Russia.
So yeah, yeah, of course. And one of the other issues that brings with sort of uncertainty the Trump administration is tariffs and trade. But I want to talk to about another product sector of trade, which is mercosur vunderline. Having signed this agreement on Friday with Latin America, Poland has been very outspoken about this. What is your position? Do you intend to join a blocking minority to block the mercos or deal as it.
Is, our position is very clear. Our Prime Minister said it very openly that we do not support this deal in this form, and it's obvious because we believe that the interest of farmers in Poland, but not only in Polant also in other European countries is not secured enough. And what is more, we have also doubts regarding the food safety and therefore our position is that we do not support this deal in its current form, and.
Do you think you have enough sort of support to block it? I mean, have you spoken to the Italians and the French for example.
I'm not the Minister of Trade, but from what I hear, both both France and Italy are not really one hundred percent convinced of this deal.
And then the other sort of concern around France has been a potential spill over effect from what we've seen, the sort of instability. How much of that has been a conversation with ministers over the last few days and how concerned are you regarding the French instability we saw yields.
Yes, of course we are discussing that. But even tomorrow we will have a wymor Trangle meeting with Minister of Finance of Germany and of France in Warsaw. We will discuss the economic situation of European Union, but also for sure we'll discuss politics and.
When sort of. Bowland has also been one of the great sort of bright spots within the European economy. You have an estimate for growth next year of about four percent three point nine percent. There are some concerns that there are some risks to that, how confident are you in that forecast and what do you think could pose a risk to that growth forecast next year.
I mean forecast is on a forecast, and what we see is a bit of the slowdown in the retail sales in Poland. Having said that, we are still one of the fastest growing economy in Europe and I do believe it will be like that in next year. We are still confident in the forecast of close to four percent GDP growth next year. For me, it's very important that we need a more balanced GDP growth. We need
more investments. This is why our government is investing in infrastructure, in the first Polish nuclear plant, we have secured money for many infrastructure projects. But for me, it's also important to encourage private investments and this is why we are working hard on some capital markets changes.
And I think potentially one of the risks to your growth forecast, and this is something that some of your colleagues have been very critical of the Central Bank governor, who has been accused of politicizing his rate decisions because favoring the other party, basically refusing to lower interest rates until after the election next year. Do you feel that the Central Bank is politicized.
Well, I'm not giving comments about central bank policy and Monetary Policy Council neither, as I believe that we do need an independent central bank. So as a Minister of Finance, I have to refrain from Sacher comments.
Let me let me repose that in a slightly different way. Do you feel you have a clear because there needs to be communication between these two institutions, do you feel you have a clear understanding of what is guiding the central banker's decision.
That's a that's a bit tricky question, and we have. Of course, there are some problems with the communication with the with the central central Bank. But it's not my job to to say negatively about about what central bank is doing right now. What I'm really interested is of course full of inflation, full of CPI. But at the same time we need a positive environment for investments and of course lower rates would be supportive
Andreds of Madelansk you take