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And we're joined by a guest we haven't seen in a while. Nick Malvaney is back here with us in our Washington, d C studio. Now he's, of course, former acting White House Chief of Stack, former OMB director, former Republican congressman from South Carolina, co founder of the House
Freedom Caucus. Welcome back, sir. Good to see you. As always, with this conversation we just had, knowing that President Trump is fresh off of a massive legislative victory, the one big beautiful bill having passed hard fought, yes, but ultimately passed by the deadline he wanted. Is the hardest work still ahead of him with everything we've just discussed, trying to get what he wants on trade in the world, in terms of geopolitics.
The hardest legislative work is done.
I don't see anything else passing of any real significance. Now they do have another reconciliation bullet. I know that's real deep in the weeds. We keep in mind there's actually two chances at reconciliation this year, so they've got another sort of bullet in the gun if they decide to try and do something reconcilation. I've not heard much about that, but I think the legislative work is done. Everybody knew wants the big beautiful bill passed. That was
pretty much the end of it. So now it shifts back to what Trump really likes doing anyway, which is the executive stuff.
Is going to be dealing with Vladimir Putin hard? Yes. Is trying to negotiate the piece the Middle East hard? Yes? It is. Is it harder than the one big beautiful bill? Probably?
So Listen, it's not going to get easier. But it's not an easy job to begin with. But I think the legislative work is probably finished. Certainly, the appetitie I think at the House and the Senate to deal with anything else that massive is very very low. They want to start running for reelection, but there's going to be a lot of stuff to do.
To your point, I want to ask you about the influence or lack there of the Freedom Caucus, which you helped the found. Yeah, you watched all of this unfold last week from Andy Harris to Chip Roy. Hell no was the answer. We're not going to get jammed by the Senate. We know there were a lot of side every time I had said that, So bring us home on this because there are a lot of questions about whether the Freedom Caucus that you helped the found is still relevant.
Well, it's certainly relevant.
And any group that can sort of stick together is relevant, especially when you've got a margin of just a handful of votes in the House. Any group of four or five members who can really stick together can sort of change an outcome. And I think the Freedom Caucus individual members of the Caucus did play important roles. I think Chip Roy played an important role in trying to, you know, make the bill better when it.
Was in the House.
And certainly the fear of the Freedom Caucus sort of veat of walking on the bill when it came out of the center did influence how far to the center maybe the Senate would go. But if the criticism is that the Freedom Caucus is different with Donald Trump, and the White House answers, yes, it is. We started as a fiscally conservative group. If Barack Obama had offered that exact same bill, I don't think that the Freedom Caucus
would have supported it. Now they are the sort of the foot soldiers for the Trump residency that have been since the first term, so they are less about spending now and more of up maga. They know. One of the pieces I read that I thought was very insightful was that this is absolutely Trump's party now it is. There are still going to be folks talking about spending less money and all that and efficiencies and so, but this is Trump's party. Whatever Trump says Republicans are four, now,
the party is four. We are now four massive tariffs on copper period, end of story until next week when we're not right But right now we are, and I think the Freedom Caucus is along for the ride just like everybody else.
But on the subject of spending cuts, which obviously they did not get as many as they want in the reconciliation bill, do you see real opportunity for them to get it elsewhere in the form of recisions because we aren't necessarily seeing much advancement on the recision package that already passed the House and the Senate. Major question as to whether you can get out of quickly.
I will buy Joe dinner if the Senate passes that recision calculation. So well, like if I say I'm going to buy a nice and lady dinner, go use me at inappropriate. So you know, like, no, I'll buy Joe dinner and but whatever. Look, no, the Recisions Package is not going.
To pass just this one or no.
No, I don't think any of.
Them democrat a budget.
Here's here's why. Okay, spending is bipartisan.
It has to be, because a spending bill takes sixty votes in the Senate, a recision vote only takes fifty.
Okay, it's a special rule.
It's another one of those. It's like reconciliation in that sense. So if you're a Democrat and you kind of deal with a Senate your Republican members just a year ago to get a spending package passed, and then the Republicans go off by themselves without you and sort of thumb their nose at you and say, well, we're gonna we're gonna undo this spending that we just agreed to. What do you think that does for next year spending package?
It kills it.
Then you end up with crs and all this kind of stuff. It would we talked about. Is there another legislation gonna get passed? No, And especially if the Recisions Package passes, keep in mind, and I lose track of the days, I think the recision package dies.
Okay, yeah, nine days. I had ten days in my head or something, whatever it is.
So I'm look, Washington is always better at doing nothing than doing something. And if the Senate can sit on their hands for the next ten days and say, oh, well, we've just ran out of time on recisions, I just don't see them doing it.
Because of the dynamics within that building.
You believe Donald Trump when he says August first, even this, if this was always the date, doesn't move again. There's no extensions.
I think.
Look, I think somebody said yesterday, it might have been on this network, that the market just has given up. Now they throw their hands up and they can't. Then even they don't even listen to what Trump says anymore because they can't. They don't rely on it. You know, if you relied on on July ninth, then year off, you can't. You can't invest based on that, You can't invest based on you can't trade at least based on
the August first. Year. Throw your hands up and say, look, it's gonna it's gonna, it's gonna come as it does. Do I think the August date can change? Sure it should. Did I predict that the July ninth date would change. Yes, why because this is the reason no one else got. He doesn't like he doesn't like strange numbers. He doesn't like July ninth.
He likes July first, he likes July fourth, he likes August first. They're easier to sell. It's it's it's a black and white, it's sort of thing. July ninth is what, what is that? Like a Wednesday?
And that's not good for news, that's not good for marketing.
So look all he brought Japan from twenty four to twenty five percent?
Right, Well listen, well we talked about you joke. Did he do that? By the way, haven't heard of it?
Yes? So I go back to twenty seventeen when we're trying to negotiate the corporate taxes on the on the first tax cut, and I think Cone came back, we wanted twenty percent, and Gary Cohane, who and Steve Mnusan who were leading the negotiations, came back and said, well, miss presently thinking we get twenty one. He's like twenty one twenty one. I can't sell twenty one twenty or twenty five twenty or twenty five.
Yes it's not twenty one. So yeah, that's just that's how we operates.
It works for him. But the point is you can't trade off of it. Good August first change, Yes, it's not going to be August eighth, and could be September first. But yeah, there's going to be a certain uncertainty in what comes out of the White House. It is the cultivated what is. He loves the term strategic ambiguity. He doesn't want to get pinned down, and he's not going to deals go forward.
Great if they don't, we might look at change in the date. We might not who.
Knows, another two or three months before we see you.
I hope not.
Okay, well so no, will.
You guys hear me day later? Yeah, I try to Dan.
If you don't recognize the name or the voice, uh you know the business card, we don't have to do that right now, Dewey, Thank you, Mick. It's great to have you alongside. Kaylee Lines. I'm Joe Matthew. This is Bloomber