Dan Ives Talks Apple's "BlackBerry Moment" - podcast episode cover

Dan Ives Talks Apple's "BlackBerry Moment"

Aug 11, 20258 min
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Episode description

Apple is having a "BlackBerry moment" when it comes to artificial intelligence says Dan Ives, Wedbush Securities global head of tech research. Ives says Cook is sitting on a park bench drinking lemonade, watching the competition pass him by. He speaks with Bloomberg's Tom Keene and Paul Sweeney

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Transcript

Speaker 1

Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, radio news.

Speaker 2

Okay, so missus Keane darkens the door at the new Dior store this weekend, and she's feel feeling guilty after unloading. They even fetter. She spent so much money. She's feeling guilty, So she goes out to snow Milk.

Speaker 1

To buy me some Dan ives merch. It's handbrin of details.

Speaker 2

One of a kind, finishes optimism and individuality. Only a few made, no restocks. The biggest size is to excel. Dan tell snow Milk they got to get with it. We need larger sizes again.

Speaker 3

And there's also there's gonna be a special Keen edition of this which still.

Speaker 1

Is a slotted into a five excel tall. Okay, legs like to stick champion.

Speaker 2

Okay, reverse, we tell the people snow Milk to get their right together, Okay. Jeremy Cohn, Fortune Magazine writes a Perplexity mentions Man Deep sing Bloomberg Intelligence. You've been all weekend over with gott at the dust start saying that Apple's gotta buy Perplexity, Explain why.

Speaker 3

Look, the reality is, if you look at Apple, they're missing this f one race that's happening in AI with the rest of Big Tach and cook Es centuries on a park bench.

Speaker 1

Why is perplexity different.

Speaker 3

Perplexity is ultimately the algorithms, the model, the developers, the technology that would give Apple a huge weep to where they are today because the reality is better change me playing Ryder Cup Beth Baite in September than Apple developing AI internally.

Speaker 1

And I'm Jeremy conn is great at this formerly with Bloomberg London.

Speaker 2

So Dan, if they buy Perplexity, that only is like search tell me, you know, Paul, can you know go in, tell me what a.

Speaker 1

Vesper ticket looks like in the New Jersey.

Speaker 2

Sure, then they would bolt on other more video like and more GPT like things we.

Speaker 3

And then we view it to two. Parter one is the Perplexity deal. In two, despite anti trust and everything going on from a regulatory you double down on Google in terms of the Gemini partnership.

Speaker 4

I mean that to me, that is the holy timeline. I mean, I believe this.

Speaker 3

Has to happen in the next four to six months because Tom, the thing, I mean, you've talked, you know, we've talked here for Apple for you know, for so many years. You have the biggest install based in the world. You have one point five billion iPhones. But the reality is that this is not gonna happen internally. I think that's clear. So our whole point is that the Apple

it's like, look time, time's ticking. It's time now for a company has never done acquisitions to change the narrative, and you cannot wait on the treadmill at two point five speed.

Speaker 5

This goes to the Tim Cook question, which I didn't even know was the thing a question, but I've heard it a little.

Speaker 4

Bit more in the last several months.

Speaker 5

Is Tim Cook the right guy to take Apple into the AI world?

Speaker 4

Look?

Speaker 3

I believe Tim Cook is the right guy as CEO that will take Apple into this next phase of growth, But underneath him Cook it's not the right I mean, it's clear you need a new blood comany you need for a company that's actually lost so much AI talent. You need more leadership under him around innovation. Because the DNA of Cooper Tino, which has been so massively successful, you can't be Rosecard glasses. It has hit a major brick wall and it's not gonna happen internally.

Speaker 4

So how does that happen.

Speaker 5

How do you change the mindset of a board of a C suite that you need to do something dramatic here, maybe a perplexity type deal. How do you think that happens? Is it the board that has to drive this?

Speaker 3

I think a year ago they're like no way, nine months ago, six months ago when some of the black eyes happened on the original AI strategy. I believe now that there's a view that they have to do something.

Speaker 2

I want to go back to perplexity. This is a kid out of India, grew up really difficult computer science, complete India ge get it, ends up at Berkeley with a.

Speaker 1

Bunch of other guys. He was a Google intern et cetera, et cetera.

Speaker 2

Put our audience in the seat of aravn srind of us at perplexity right now, how does he respond to Apple overtures?

Speaker 3

Well, well, look, I mean evaluations right now called eighteen nineteen million wow. And the view is okay, could they do this themselves? Is essentially a mod Everyone agrees the answer is no. So from that perspective, could you partner you think about anthropic what they've done with Amazon open Ai obviously done it themselves. To me, it's one where it's like it's not a time ticking necessarily, but for them,

they have to do something big. And there's really only one company in the world that it would make sense for perplexity, and I believe it's Apps.

Speaker 2

Do they become members of the board? Are the a division? Did they come in in three years later they're all gone?

Speaker 4

No. I think it's important that that's not.

Speaker 3

They have to almost stay a separate because if they get sucked into that Apple Park Cooper team and then all of a sudden, that is exactly what could happen. I think the biggest thing here is that Apple right now is at a point for the first time really in the last fifteen years.

Speaker 4

They gotta do something big and look a huge.

Speaker 3

If you overhang lifted last week, tariffs cook point nice new sandbox with Trump.

Speaker 4

That's an important move.

Speaker 3

But the elephant in the room, and we've talked about for a coming that is a free castle machine. And for a company that has never done acquisitions, it's time now clock struck midnight.

Speaker 4

They gotta do something, all right. That's the big issue in the room. I think.

Speaker 5

Still another big issue is the room is just China what's the state of play in China from an end market for their products and services as well as just part of their global supply chain.

Speaker 3

Look, I think you saw China bounce back last quarter, even though subsidies definitely helped there. But Cook recognizes, like, this story doesn't go up into the right without China. I mean China, it's basically twenty percent of demand. It's a huge power of production. Obviously they're they're moving more

and more to India. But also when you come down to the US China trade negotiations, must we talk about chips and then fifteen percent and video and AMD and Apple is key to the whole thing because they're now going to be I think a front row seat out of all these negotiations now with Cook no longer on the outside looking in when it comes Trump, White House.

Speaker 2

Apple pre pandemic, I mean, no excuse me. At the bottom of the pandemic, dan Ives was down to over two standard deviations of mediocrity. It's bounced back, it's almost back to trend line. What's your target from two twenty nine.

Speaker 3

Two seventy is essential without any AI. So it was like, is this a stock that has can still have a huge move without a yeah, given iPhone seventeen.

Speaker 1

And that's that's plus one standard devocation.

Speaker 3

That now you talk about they actually do something real here and instead of getting on the treadmill. Then that's where we're talking three point fifty four hundred.

Speaker 2

How did the others react to apple perplexity?

Speaker 3

That means shot across the bow. Now Apple's in the game. They're no longer just sitting there, you know, in the right lane going forty five miles an hour.

Speaker 1

Right.

Speaker 3

You look at wartime CEOs, Look at Zuck, look at Musk, look in the della, look at Godfather of Ai Jensen a video. You cannot be looking at this AI party. It's ten pm and it goes to four am from the outside looking through the windows. And that's what Apple is doing right now.

Speaker 2

After your closed deal? Are you gonna gonna be like Emma Redikanu and leverage out your closed deal? As others come calling in the luxury goods space?

Speaker 4

Again, never never say never. We've been super pumped.

Speaker 1

About Farrel called from Tiffany's.

Speaker 3

Again, did there. We've had a lot from Lewis. We've had We've had a lot of amounts. But again, part of why I went with snowmilkse needs to be a certain type of designer.

Speaker 4

It's all part of our our brain.

Speaker 1

Would you be comfortable at Lewis Futon with Farrell?

Speaker 3

Again, that's definitely something that could definitely potentially with with with some colors. And again it comes down to like keen, you put the bow eye on with some colors.

Speaker 4

I mean there's a lot of weeds. We could all go with this.

Speaker 1

Yep, there you go.

Speaker 4

That's all you can take.

Speaker 1

Lisa, what do you think they don't make my size dan Naives? I think thank you

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