Yen May Move to 150 Per Dollar, Shilling Says

Find Bloomberg Surveillance on iTunes, SoundCloud, Bloomberg dot Com, and of course, on the Bloomberg Gina Martin Adams is our chief equity strategist here at Bloomberg Intelligent that she joins us here in our Bloomberg eleven three studios. Welcome. Great to have you with us. Let's start broad here looking at this market, of your market in search of of a catalyst. What are you seeing as you look at equities right now? Yeah, and in a short term, we've

entered some sort of consolidation mode. You can call it the post reflation trade. I don't know what you want to call it, but since the beginning of the March, of the month of March, stocks have kind of been moving in a sideways direction and in the grand scheme of things, it's a modest consolidation within a long term up trend um. It looks like we broke out of pretty significant correction by the end of last year. We

broke out. We confirmed a lot of long term up trend lines with that correction, and it's been off to the races since. So it's natural that you have these consolidations amidst the ups trend. It doesn't look like it's anything more ominous yet, but there has been some modest defensive rotation to suggest the market is is taken a pause. Here. Help us with the costliness of the expensiveness of stocks. Right now you get the most expensive since two thousand

and two. I believe what are you seeing there? Yeah? From a price to earnings perspective, the index is expensive. It's really difficult to say anything else. We're looking at about eighteen times forward earnings. Are just under eighteen times forward earnings. You know. The trouble with valuations is for a timing mechanism, they're pretty poor. I mean, they tend

to trend over time. A good example, we crested the eighteen times level of on price to earnings back in six and then the market continue to move higher all the way into the s peak in two thousands, So if you used valuation purely as your investment thesis in that time, you would have missed out on a tremendous amount of market gains. There are still values in the market. If you look at price to book, for example, you find energy stocks, financial stocks are still trading well below

long term peaks. Long term averages as well on price to earnings. Healthcare, telecom, and financials all screen as relatively cheap compared to their long term history. So not all of the market is extremely expensive. And when you talk about price to earnings, it's really a poor timing mechanisms. You gotta be pretty careful. What are valuations contracting at. I think a lot of it is the bond market

and interest rates. I mean, you know, stocks in a vacuum look expensive, but when you compare them to bonds, they look cheap. I mean, the earning zeald of five point six percent compares with a treasury yield of two point three, five, two point four somewhere in that range. That's well above long term average on a relative basis. So the earning seal you get out of stocks is extremely attractive and that keeps uh I think of floor

under valuations. The other thing is that when you look at real interest rates, the rate of the tenure less inflation, we're still just above zero. It's this is still very supportive in the long term. When real and real rates are in that zero to two range, valuations rise. So you know, on a relative scale, there's still a lot of reason for stocks um to continue to move higher. Good morning everyone, Bloomberg with David Gerr and Tom Keane. Do you know help me here with equities? What's what's

the actuarial assumption you have in your head? I mean, everybody that's a single digit world. You've got to be cautious. We're gonna be lucky if we make six and a cloud of dividends and the answers. It's been double digit nirvana since basically since two thousand nine. What's your what's the gena Martin Adams actually real assumption? Yeah, it's a

good question, you know. I think that one of the things that strikes me in this cycle, when you look at two thousand nine to date and how well stocks have done, is that it is now um sort of consensus to be cautious it is very persistent sentiment that exists out there. UM. On a negative scale, it's everyone points out the reasons why stocks shouldn't rise instead of why stocks should continue to rise, and that in and of itself presents this wall of worry that allows for

stocks to go higher. It seems very counterintuitive, but the reality is when there are few people left to sell, stocks are going to default higher. The other thing to consider is generally over time, what really matters for stocks is if the economy is growing. It doesn't matter if it's growing that slowly, it doesn matter if it's growing quickly.

If the economy's growing, stocks tend to go higher. And then the really big uh massive declines and stocks tend to happen when the economy slows down substantially, and we just haven't had that experience. It's been a very slow growth scenario. But that slow growth has been manageable by companies. They can cost cut their way to success. Um And that's another sort of counterintuitive point. Nobody wants to own stocks because they're cutting costs, but the reality is that

produces earnings growth. How long can that continue? Though, you know, we said we've been talking about how long can it continue since? Even so, it seems that it can continue for a long time because companies are driven to produce bottom line earnings results, right, that's the the entire point of share ownership is a share of that earnings result.

They have to have some top line. Right. We experience energy sector correction in which the top line contracted, and we saw that what that can do to overall earnings. So so you can't do this without some top line growth. But as long as that top line growing incrementally, you can continue to cut and grow margin. David, are you with us today? I mean you're barely here yesterday rested after the Carolina post reflation post. What we do of

the game? Where you do they do on Classic? The Encore presentation, Gina, I'm sorry, Mr Gurrol went to the Chapel University. Forget him. You know it's like an n C double A. I think help me here in this GENA. I wonder if what our audience may not know is you were wonderful through this bull market of saying, look, I measured, I'm conservative, I'm cautious, but I'm not going to be in cash. Yeah, what's explained to our audience? The price of saying I'm going to be in cash.

Oh wow, Well you've missed out on an equity market that's reaching new highs every year except for UM It's been incredible to miss out on this bull trend. And what's really amazing is how many people have missed out on this bull trend. If you get equity ownership in the United States, despite the fact that stocks were reaching new highs, equity ownership among households actually shrank throughout this last cycle. So that tells you that most US households

have completely missed this bull market. Not only have you had a bull market in stocks, but you've had a pretty strong bull market in corporate credit and high yield credit. Even the bond market. Rates have continued to go lower and lower and lower every year. So any asset you

picked outside of cash would have made you money. And the FED told us in two thousand and eight two thousand nine that they were going to keep rates lower for longer, punishing anyone who kept money in cash savings and the bit that's a one big lesson of this cycle is do not fight the Fed. When the Fed says they are going to keep rates low, we have

to pay attention. As painful as it is and as scary as it is to take on that risk in an environment where there is, you know, a lot of uncertainty, the reality is the FED really does have a heavy hand in driving market out. What's the FED telegraphing. Now, if you're an equities investor and you're you're listening to what Fed policy micers have to say, what's the what's the advice that they're giving that you should not ignore.

They are saying that they are going to move the rate incredibly slowly in a very measured pace, and keep rates very accommodative. That's what they're saying to me until they start really seriously considering contracting that balance sheet, really seriously considering moving that policy rate rapidly higher. The FED is still on your side. The Fed's got your box. So to say, as an equity investor, I want to come back and dive into the actual Bloomberg intelligence work

you're doing, particularly on sector analysis as well. Gina Martin adds, with this Bloomberg intelligence running all the equity strategy product and as I said earlier on television, what's what's magical about Gina combining an economic analysis with fundamental analysis and technical analysis as well as Michael bar knows. That's the kool aid I sip every day. Again, Michael Barr, you ken't doing a vacuum and and the kool aid with

with good sugar man ingredients. And I put I put on the headphones and I listened to that great band DuPont Ratio. It's absolutely phenomenal for this. Gina Martin Adams Bloomberg Intelligences who look at the equity uh markets. You've met John Butler, I'm sure a great Apple analyst, and you know he doesn't do bi hold Cell and Apple, but he's been brilliant when the gloom and the gloom comes, it happen. Jim Cook is evil when that comes in.

He goes maybe not so help us here away from bi hold Cell with the different sector calls, which sector right now seems rational and seems like an opportunity to prosper when you look at the balance sheet and that strange thing capital allocation? Which sector works? So we actually this will be near and dear to your heart given you like the effusion of so many different disciplines. Were on a sector model that combines current technicals with valuations

with estimate achievability on the atball record. Yeah, and this guy spits out for us, what sectors have the best combination of all of these trends right now and right now? Those are very defensive consumer staples, utilities, healthcare, but also technology. So technology is the one cyclical that sort of sticks in with the defensive sectors as as looking like having you know, it looks it looks like it has a pretty good combination of of trends. What role is energy

playing right now? Inequities were about how it played role historically. Uh, now, when you look at energy, what effect does it happen? Well, it's it's only six and a half percent of the index, so it's extremely small, which is really interesting. It's a very small share of of the index. But nonetheless it plays the role of most volatile player. You know, it moves a lot in one direction or another. But you can have period of time now where energy stocks are

outright falling in the market. Is not because it is so small. I don't want to get you in trouble with your general counsel, Paul Sweeney, but can you buy take a historical level of a sector as a percent of the standard. Can you go long energy because it's low single digit sector knowing someday you're gonna sell it when it's I mean, can you do that? I mean,

is that a scrap? It could be if you have an extremely long person, long term perspective, and you look for the major shifted shifts in market cap share, you'd find that energy is certainly the most depressed sector in the index right now. After the recession that the energy companies went through in in fifteen sixteen, valuations um still screen attractively. You know, sometimes valuations are low for a reason.

That may be the case with energy, but it's certainly screens as having the lowest price to book, lowest price to earnings ratio in the index because of the distress that it went through. So you know, can I say that, you know, I would advise against if you have a long term holding period. Sometimes these are great ideas. This is what deep value is all about, is finding those sort of fallen angels who have been left for nothing. Um So, so maybe that's that's not a bad strategy.

Talk about valuations. Something ask about just macroeconomics and politics and the degree to which that's driving the market right now. How much attention, how much credence do you give to those when you're looking at stocks. Well, I definitely look at um policy. I try to really rationalize politics. So with policy, monetary policy means a lot for stocks, and and monetary policy is something we've focus a lot on.

We've got some research out today focused on sort of the current state of monetary policy and how it might impact the equity market. For example, for fiscal policy, we try to narrow it down you actual policies that could have an impact on earnings growth on the SMP five because you know, the truth is that we've had a lot of political events over the last several years, none

of which have truly derailed the path for stocks. So you want to be pretty careful regarding your assumptions for how much politicians can actually matter for the equity market. Um but a couple of fiscal policy issues right now do come to the forefront. One is this outright reduction in corporate tax possibility that could actually have a meaningful impact on earnings growth should it manifest within the next

few years. So we did some research on that. We found that a twenty drop or a drop to corporate tax rate could actually increase SMP five hundred earnings growth by about seven percent in ten should it occur now, I don't know if it will occur. I don't know if it will occur by twenty eighteen, but it could occur. The other thing that we think is potentially meaningful for stocks right now is repatriation. If we do get a repatriation effort passed through UM legislation, we could see a

meaningful impact to certain components of the equity market. The last time we had repatriation, we saw a very significant acceleration and share by backs. Right if we see that again, that will have a meaningful impact on SMP five hundreds. So there are a couple of things that I think do matter, but you really have to sift through a lot of noise to find those things. The Gina Marne Adams,

thank you so much. With Bloomberg Intelligence on Equity Strategy, David Gura, Tom Keane, Bloomberg Surveillance, Gary Shilling with US. I don't think it needs an introduction to our audience. People don't on inflation. Let me get out of the way to call where's the tenure yield in twelve months time? Gary, I think it will be a lot closer to one percent.

And where it is now, let's go down. Yeah, Why, well, I think there's a very very good chance that we're gonna see a lower, lower race of inflation, maybe even deflation. It's also secondly, it's a safe haven. And third, if you look at the yields on US ten your treasuries versus the sovereigns of almost every other developed country, our yields are higher and and and that gives an advantage to a foreign investor. And if the dollar rises, they get a double win and they get a translation gain

to boot. So the divergence and the end of the divergence is going to be our yields normalized back to where their yields are. Does Janet Yelling have the shilling memo? Did you send you your monthly newsletter? Well, she gets it, I don't know if she don't know if she follows it or not. Next to no one agrees with you. I mean they just think either stable rates or the vectors are pointing to higher inflation toime for thirty seven years, ever since nineteen eighty one, when that when the thirty

year was fifteen point two percent. And I said we're entering the bond rally a lifetime. That's what the chorus has been saying. It's always there's never been a period in there. And you've you've you've noted us for many, many years. There's never been a period in there when the majority, the consensus said that race are going down. It's always up. Inflation is up, race are up. Yeah, it's gonna end at some point, but I don't think we're there yet. What's the role of cash in a

portfolio right now? How do you regard cash? How important is it to keep cash? Well? I I think I mean in portfolio's remanaged, we have a very high component of cash because the markets are basically been moving sideways and sideways movement markets are the ones that kill you. Uh. But but you know cash is uh uh. Cash is cheap. With interest rates low, there's not much advantage in not being in cash, so um, I think high. And if you look at mutual funds they hire, they have a

lot of higher cash position than they normally do. So you know, cash is cash is not trash. What do you what do you say to those like Gina Martin Adams. We're just talking to her a moment to go our our chief equity strategst here at Blomberg Intelligence. You say, Uh, if you just held on to cash, if you didn't put in equities, you missed out. You are missing out. Indeed, what's your response to to that? Well, Uh, you can pick any time thing you know you you can. You

can prove anything by picking the right commnsions. Economists used to call that growth wanship and and sure if you pick, if you pick the last h if you like the last couple of months you look past since the election, that's true. If you look on the last couple of weeks, not really do you see an end to this, to this bull market? You note here that bull market doesn't dive old age. They don't dive old age evenual. You know, in a post World War two period they've been in

with on two reasons. One is the FED jacks up interest rates enough they try to cool the economy. They say they don't want to precipitate a recession, But in eleven of twelve tries, by my reckonding, they've gotten a recession. The only soft landing was in the mid nineties. The other, the other killer, is some kind of a shock like the like the dot com blow off in the late nineties or the housing subprime mortgage collapse in the mid two thousand's. Now, I don't see anything right on the

horizon that could qualify as a shock. Uh. Yeah, you could get a blow up in the Middle East. You could have China major problems with their financials. But I don't see anything that's really cruising for a bruising. But I don't see the FED jacking uprates that high either. I think they're going to move very cautious. You and I talked to her this morning about yen one fifty. That's a huge move from the one ten level. That

is ultimate or steroidal obianomics. What does the one fifty yen do to Mr Abby in the nation of Japan, Well, it would make him a big hero because it would mean that he had achieved, he had achieved an objective. And more importantly, it wouldn't be just the number, because I don't know the average Japanese every morning wakes up and the first thing you said, where is the yen against the dollar. I think they look at the state of the economy and they would like to see a

more rapidly growing economy. But bear in mind that Japan is a very high living standard and unlike unlike Europe and North of America where voters are mad as hell and they've turned to the left and right fringers that you're talking about marial Japan, you haven't seen that. It's a different culture. But I believe correct me if I'm wronging Dr Schilling that if you have that devaluation of

a currency, you have a wealth destruction. Whose wealth is destroyed migrating from one ten to one fifty, Well, it isn't. The Japanese holdings abroad. They've got the biggest holdings overseas of anybody, and it means that the value in the end terms of the dollar holdings overseas go up. And by the way, that's a very important source of money

for them to support their aging population. They could transfer a lot of those foreign assets into imports to support not only those Asian people, because they're not going to have enough people working to support not only themselves but all those retirees. Let's talk a little bit about China. What you're seeing there as we head to this meeting in Florida tomorrow, uh and and Friday? Are you going? I'm not going it. The weather is getting better up here.

You can't afford to stake well well China. China's growth is slowing. And what's interesting there. It's a top down it's a top down regime, and we're seeing what she lately, he is becoming a big brother in the Orwellian nine cents. In other words, they now have an effect people Uh, looking even at the local level, contrary to make sure that they're thinking right. Uh, it's it's it's it's a typical reaction of a top down machime when it's worried

about delivering on his promises. In China, the government basically promises the populace that they'll have reasonable growth, little higher living standards and return the populace UH says, we'll keep our nose out of politics. That's that's a social contract that's being challenged now because Chinese growth, they say now six and a half per cent real GDP growth this year, that's probably about twice reality. Uh. And and and they

are they are really scrambling. And I think they are worried about what's tossed out a lot of previous Chinese dynasties. And I call this the Maaeo dynasty and that a social unrest caused by high unemployment. On the issue of currency, Uh, do you think it's going to be high on the agenda at this meeting in Florida? And you look at just the reporting ahead of ahead of this meeting, there is uh a lot of a sense of confusion surrounding what role the Chinese currency is playing in the world

economy right now. Well, you don't you know, of course, you don't really know, but there hasn't been a lot of rhetoric out of Trump lately on the currency manipulation of the yuan, and it has actually gone up a bit recently. Of course, they they moved back and forth there between linking to the dollar and linking to this back basket of currencies to their advantage, and they always

wanted their doing this for manipulation purposes. And they also are trying to stand the outflow of money from China which has forced them to reduce their reserves from four tray into three troy and too accommodate the the outflow. But I think it will probably more enter on on trying to reduce the trade imbalance there and the idea of of of access to Chinese markets and intellectual property and some of these issues that are pretty pretty flagrant

in terms of international standards. Uh. And I think we're rather a tackle. And bear in mind when then she made his speech at Davos, Uh, he was on the defensive when he when he quotes Lincoln, which he did, you know for the people, other people, by the people. You know, this guy is on the run. That's not a big deal. Gary, David Gurk quotes Lincoln. You know, where's inflation with tenure? You put a one percent figure on the tenure yield? Quickly here where's inflation? It's probably zero?

Or he maybe even less scary. I mean, if you look at if you look in peace time, peace time is normally deflation. Are we We've looked at data going back to seventeen forty nine, divided all the years into wartime and peace time, and in wartime the inflation rate averages averages eight point two percent. In peacetime it's negative half a percent. We gotta go, Gary Shilling, thank you so much for rolling his up. Brought to you by

Bank of America. Mary Lynch, dedicated to bringing our clients insights and solutions to meet the challenges of a transforming world. That's the power of global connections. Mary Lynch, Pierce Feeder and Smith Incorporated Member s I PC David, it's important if you're bringing in corporate money and representing corporations, that you're smarter than just being on K Street in Washington. And the careful choice is to be in the same

building as the Palm Restaurant. That's really what matters. There's a little street, Jefferson Place, and you walk down and your turn right and there's the Palm. Our next guest is smarter than all other lobbyists in Washington because they're in the vicinity of the Palm, the acclaimed Palm restaurant. Is there a Tom Keane caricature on the wall? Yet there was going to be, And I said, I could never do that to l Hunt. Albert Hunt holds center front in the back, in the deep back from his

wonderful efforts at CEN and years ago. It's Nancy mcclearn and she's the CEO of the Organization for International Investments. She convened a group of the CEOs of foreign based companies yesterday in Washington, meeting with administration officials. And let me just start with the context of the meeting here. How did it come about? What were the main topics of discussion? Nancy, Yeah, good morning, Thanks for having me on. And it is pretty fantastic to be above the palm.

I will say, it's a good it's a good place to have sort of is your cafeteria. Um, So, yesterday we had about a dozen CEO of U S subsidiaries foreign companies. So these were the top US executives at these companies and and the purpose of the meeting was to uh work with the administration and Congress to consider foreign direct investment as they develop a pro growth agenda, because foreign direct investment actually has a pretty outsized impact

of the U. S economy. Even though these companies like b A, SF and Samsung and air Bus, Panasonic represent less than one percent of all US businesses, they employ over five percent of the private sector workforce about six point four million Americans, much of it in the manufacturing sector. So U subsidiaries of these companies employe about two point four million manufacturing jobs across the U S, which is

about of all manufacturing jobs. They they hire American scientists and engineers and R and D. Here they do about of all American R and D. We had the pleasure yesterday of talking to it to Barry eccleston, I gather was at the meeting, Yester, the president of Airbus America's I wonder, we note that the populist foment and fervor all across the world. How does that play out in the corporate sector for companies that are foreign based but

have American subsidiaries. How is how is populism affecting the way they do business? Well, you know, there is a bit of uncertainty. But again that was the reason that these executives came into town because their story is um you know, really um I think impactful. And as we met with Secretary Manu Chin and Ross and Senate leaders, you could see that there was a good understanding of the importance of foreign direct investment in the US economy.

And I think that some perhaps didn't realize, you know, how varied foreign direct investment is from all different countries, around all different industries. And we received a really favorable um uh response. Right, how is lobbying changed in Washington?

I say, his folks, with respect for the representation. Going back to the Willard Hotel out of the civil or did you did you ever smoke a cigar in that corridor around Robin Bar, the round Robin Bar, Nancy, if you're asking me, okay, well I thought maybe a lobby is the act changed? Is Mr Trump changed the cadence in the pace of your good representation of your good clients? Well, you know, lobbying gets a bad rap. Lobbying is educating.

And if you think of um people who go up to Capitol Hill and talk about the need for cancer research, or do you even think about your local p p A. If you, you know, go educate the school system on things that are important for your kids. These are all actually technically lobbying, but they don't have as much of a bad rap, right, And so lobbing is really educating and policy makers actually get a great deal from understanding all different sides. The most important aspect I think of

lobbying is transparency. Knowing who is going up uh to Washington and talking to legislators and having it be you know, lots of sunshine and very open as to who's going up.

And for these companies that that came yesterday, their names are not as well known as some of our homegrown companies here in the United States, which makes it that much more important that they go to Washington and they educate, because when someone thinks of a foreign company in the US, they might think of some monolithic company, not a company like Samsung, who told this fantastic story about they acquired a small company in New Jersey a few years ago

and it had, you know, less than a hundred employees, and they dumped a lot of money into it, spent a lot of doing a lot of R and D here in the United States, developing technology that is now in all fung phones around the world. So they've given this small company this incredible global reach. And those are the stories that we went up to Washington yesterday and

talked about. Because the populist movement, I think, sort of broad brushes some of these things and which made it that much more important for these these companies to go up. And we know the landmarks in Washington, long Worth, Cannon, Dirkson, and the rest, of course the Palm among them. I guess what I'm wondering about is that the landscape has changed. In other words, you have people in New York who just wonder what's going on in Washington into this administration.

It's a different world. Uh Is the means of lobbying different? Are you having difficulty finding the right people to talk to? Has that changed? All? Come on? The phone's ringing off? UM? You know what, I think that lobbying over the last several years has changed, not just with this administration. I think that it definitely were in an environment where it's uh,

to some extent, bottom up right. It's not that you just go see the very top leadership or um, you know, the ones that that you know, you see on the

news all the time. I think there is this importance more than ever before, not only to to educate um, the top leaders, but but educate the rank and file in Congress as well as the public as well as our employees, you know, the employees that our member companies that they get a paycheck from companies that are headquartered or abroad, need to understand the importance of global connections.

And you know, that was part of it was just you know, yesterday was part of our our our broader efforts to get people to understand the importance of global connections. And you know, when people think about the global economy, there's a lot of focus on the trade of good US is across borders, but the cross border investment really dwarfed that. Okay, we're gonna have to leave it there,

Nancy mclintard, thank you so much. Maybe possibly not that we've ever been there, but we would see the beefsteak, tomato capri or Andy's mixed green salad, and then after that the prime Porterhouse steak twenty eight ounces at the Washington, d C. Palm Restaurant. David, would that be feasible? We're gonna close out with a few minutes with the most important surgeon, Toby Cosgrove out of Williams. So Williams segment, folks, we're doing Arthur Levitt of Williams College Mammoths and with

us now. Dr Cosgrove of course acclaimed at the Cleveland Clinic to because the last time we took was what talked was in Davos. Help me here with what your Cleveland clinic needs from Washington in terms of Obamacare reform or some form of new Ryan or Trump Care. What do you need? Well, I think we've not got the right of aspects of healthcare reform. If you look at the Affordable Care Act basically started trying to do three things that tried to increase coverage, It tried to improve quality,

and try to decrease costs. And really the issue is the fact that costs continue to rise. The question is how can we bring down costs of healthcare, which is a problem in every developed country around the world because people are older and there are more things we can do for people which are going to drive up costs. So if you look at it bringing down the cost of healthcare, there's really only two ways you can do it.

One you can have a more efficient delivery system for people who are sick um and secondly, you can begin to keep decrease the burden of disease by keeping people out of the hospital and prevent them from getting chronic diseases. And there are things that you can do legislatively and things that you can do um administratively on both those

accounts to begin to decrease the cost. I would like to see us going back to the root cause of the problem, which is escalating cost of healthcare, and uh, then I think we would be more appropriately directed and perhaps you could even get a bipartisan agreement on the fact that we need to decrease the cost of health Care, Dr cost we'll talk on TV here in about half

an hour time on Bloomberg Telligent. But a quick question here just about where we go from here in Washington, there are reports that Republicans on the Hill are taking up healthcare reform. Yet again, do you have the sense that lawmakers are now having the kinds of conversations you're talking about that we've we've been through the politics over the last few weeks associated with healthcare for maybe now with a less time limited sense there's a conversation about

policy happening. Well, I think the policy of the Affordable Care Act, to begin to move from just paying for volume to begin to pay for outcomes is the right direction to go. The discussion, as near as I can tell from the distance of Cleveland, is that we continue to talk about how we're going to move uh, the amount of money that the government is paying and uh two different segments and managed to do it in different ways.

We're not really going to what I think the root caused the problem is too shorts today, Dr Costco, We're gonna have to leave it there. Toby Costco with the Cleveland Clinic, Thanks for listening to the Bloomberg surveillance podcast. Subscribe and listen to interviews on iTunes, SoundCloud, or whichever podcast platform you prefer. I'm out Twitter at Tom Keene, David Gura is at David Gura. Before the podcast, you can always catch us worldwide. I'm Bloomberg Radio, brought you

by Bank of America Mary Lynch. Dedicated to bringing our clients insights and solutions to meet the challenges of a transforming world. That's the power of global connections. Mary Lynch, Pierce, Fenner and Smith Incorporated, Member s i p C