Surveillance: Lighthizer Is The Serious Negotiator, Alden Says

in Shepherdson Pantheon macro Economics, Chief Economist. And we've got to say a quick word on the Prime Minister in the UK as she delivers her speech um at the Conservative Annual Party Conference with a little bit of a dance to begin to app a dancing queen. Um, what are we expecting from the Prime Minister? And are you expecting anything that really changes anything at all? I think the speech will be undering the condensity here, but the speech essentially is going to be a please don't find

me um that really she has no great vision. She just wants to remain as prime minister for the country. She's speaking to the part she's speaking to a few thousand old white people. I mean, that is the Conservative Party and it's so unrepresentative, but they're the ones. Ultimately you determine whether she gets to keep the job. She seems to want the job very badly. I can't think why. I think it's the worst job in the world, but she wants it very badly. Other people wanted as well.

In and in the meantime, of course, Britain is dealing with the chaos and confusion of Brexit because the government can't make its mind up about what it wants, and the EU is just standing watching all this in astonishment. There is only one of the man I'm less excited about this speech than than you and I Ian, and it's Tom King. Um, Tom very abrupt. I mean we

we usually don't talk like that about our politics in America. Um. When I look at the see and I go back to Barry Ikon Green of Berkeley, who was heated about the negative ramifications of Brexit, and he also said for London as well, do you share even a tinge of

Professor I Congreen's concerns? Oh? Absolutely, it's it's terrifying. You know that the British economy over the last forty years, as in reinvented itself as a services economy, and and services aren't covered by the Canada Agreement that that keeps being talked about. And the danger is that that the UK services sector is left out in the cold in the event of a of a Brexit without a proper deal, which would be an absolute disaster. So I lose a

lot of sleep over this. But let me saying. I have to say, spending some time in the city last week, I had a lot more people concerned about socialist Corbin taking over the government than they were about Brexit. Yeah, the people you're talking to probably weren't massively representative of the country as a whole, to be fair, now they've

represented the city, not the country. Indeed, indeed, the country has had ten years of conservative austerity for no reason other than that they were the religious dogma, and I think in the country as a whole people are kind of sick of it. Which is not to say that what Corbin is offering is a seriously attractive alternative, but there's a lot of people would like something different, that's for sure. Can I guess a sophisticated country do whatever

you like. This is your shot. We're watching folks on Bloomberg Radio the television feet you know, you make a joke about Prime Minister make coming out and dancing all I did was seeing within the obligatory clapping the knives up. Is it like the crown? Is it like McMillan hates Churchill and people? It doesn't, folks, It doesn't look like America. It's different. You know, we hate you Mr Trump, or we love you Mr Trump. There's a British way here.

That was frankly, just like in the first and second season, and all a lot of people in that in that room, and a lot of those people who were smiling and clapping because they're on TV would very much like somebody else to be prime minister. But you know, it's not like an American political convention, which is a stage managed to cheer leader event. This is this is real politics, read and tooth and claw live on stage. John. How about those Yankees? How about those Thankees? Big game tonight?

Is that right? I believe so? Yes? Against Oakland? Yes, at Yankee Stadium. Yes, I look forward to that. Okay, let's go back to England. Let's get away from Brexit, Let's get to em. Why don't you we set the show. We set the show. Good morning, good morning to our audience worldwide from New York City. Forget the previous five minutes, let's do Brexit. No, we're not going to do that. Ian. Let's talk about what's handing an emerging markets, because it's

quite interesting. Turkish inflation is surging, the Indian rupee is a record low. The pockets of pain is still there. Walk me through what you're looking at at the moment. Well, these pockets are pain aren't going to go away anytime soon. And I think for quite a lot of these e m s Turkey obviously as the poster child, but but also India, increasingly South Africa, Indonesia, countries that have got EM, countries that have got inflation problems, that have got current

account deficits, that are reliant on oil imports. Because I was now becoming a big deal everyone's talking about these countries are vulnerable anyway. Then you've got the FED raising rates and giving all these investors an alternative. They don't have to put their money into EM to chase yield anymore. They can they can be more inclined to be at home.

So what happens is that the pressure on EM builds as the FED as raising rates, and the pressure builds in proportion to how dim a view markets take of the way you've been conducting the economy. So in Turkey, we've got an authoritarian leader, we've got a guy who wants to run honittory policy as well as the country. We've got an inflation problem, we've got a current account deficit. It's an awful mess, but it's not going to go

away and the store stop. You'd have to assume the oil story just exacerbates the current accounts deficit issues in places like Turkey and like India. Absolutely, if you are an oil importer, substantial oil importer, this is about as as bad as things get. You know, you've got interest rate pressure from the Fed, you've got pressure from from oil now, which you know, six months ago we weren't really worrying about. And now suddenly brents at eighty five,

w t I is at seventy five. And this is a really big problem for these countries that that are already running these current account deficits. And it just makes markets more inclined to run away, and it becomes self some interesting relative trades within emerging markets. I've heard a lot of people starting to talk about long Russia short Turkey off the back of this crude story. Does that kind of make sense to you. I mean from a trading proposition, it does. I mean, you know, from a

big picture perspective, Russia doesn't really have an economy. Um, you know, Russia's Russia is a small economy, but it does have a lot of oil and a lot of gas. So yes, I mean that makes perfect sense to me as an entra em trade. And of course there are there are winners and losers and other em Some of the Latin American ems are in are in rather better shape obviously Argentina, Venezuela accepted, but they're in better shape

than than the Turkeys and South Africa's and India's. So it's a it's a shifting game, and it does depend enormously on exactly where oil prices go. You know, if oil continues to rise and Brent gets up to say, and it hits the hundred dollar mark, then you're looking at much more widespread em pain and much more currency weakness, and you'll get you'll get markets calling on the Fed to take a breather. The problem is looking at the three point nine domestic unemployment rate, I don't think J.

Powell can afford. I'm just wondering where the circuit breaker comes from because the markets might call on the FED to take a breather at some point, maybe next year. The President of the the United States is staging a bit of an intervention with the with the saudis ramping up the pressure again in the last twenty four hours. Do you see any response coming from OPEC and Saudi Arabia to this, Well not really. I mean then they're not the swing players that they used to be in the

US is not the swing player. But the bizarre thing is that actually the US is now an economy which which benefits from higher oil prices net because although it raises gas prices, which consumers don't like, but it raises capital spending the oil business faster. So just in the last few years, the way you think you need to think about the U S and oil prices has flipped add degrees. He used to be we consume a lot of oil, the price goes up, it's bad. But that's

not the case anymore. Now We're still consume it, but we produced an awful lot of it, and we've got this whole economic infrastructure that's built around oil extraction. The shale business is enormous and growing very rapidly still, So now higher oil prices actually are a plus for growth. What's the ramifications of a blended dollar in X like d x Y breaks out the new highs in this case ninety four to present ninety five point five, And if we get a ninety seven print and dollars stronger dollar,

I mean, what does the president do? What does chairman to Paul do? You're gonna tell me they're going to ignore it. I don't buy it. Ah, Well, if depend how how it goes. You know, quite a lot of the CPI is sensitive to the dollar. The goods compons the CPI are sensitive to the dollar, and the things like imported clothing and furniture and TVs and gadgets are all quite dollar sensitive. So as sustained further uplifting the dollar from here, would other things equaled mean a bit

lower domestic inflation. And that might be what gives the Fed the ability to pause, provided that at the time this is happening, the labor market isn't scaring the pants, which I'm sorry, dovetails right into EM weakness, Joan Ferrell. Dovetails right into EM weakness and into you know, maybe oil dynamics as well, yeah, there's a toxic mix right now, higher crude, stronger dollar, toxic mix and yields just kind of bleeding heart slowly lovely. I refused to play Abba,

I did Williams. Come on, come on, come on, come on a bit of abber dancing Queen, just to set up a Brexit conversation later on. You know you want to do it? You do. I can see your smiling Tom smiling therapy, can see that you wanted to five step surveillance therapy. Who's put you through therapy? Are you kid? They got a car from Washington yesterday, even trumpell big trouble expenses. No, no, well that's a separate story, was the caller? Now this came from you know, come on, people,

just don't just like the radio. You'll tell me that the I m F aren't happy with you. Yeah, with us, m c A everybody, Bloomberg's very own Annah Redwards joining us. Now, Anna did you dance? Did I? When dancing Queen came I, I I just stood up and and sort of threw my arms in the air, And it was a spontaneous response to her phenomenal visual experience, guessing that's not what happened today in Birmingham, and I walked me through who this speech was for, who the audience was, and the

big takeaways in the last hour. Well, as always, she's talking to the preaching to the converted, but she does have a divided party, so she did have to win the room over to some extent. She had a thing to do today, didn't she, And that was to rally the troops behind her vision of Brexit because she'd been challenged yesterday very directly by her former Foreign Secretary Boris Johnson, who had a very different view of Brexit. So her ad mission today was to rally the troops around Brexit.

She she can come to some of the detail if you like, but she did seem to manage to do that, and she took on Boris Johnson a little bit. And she also wanted them to rally against the big enemy that she sees, and that's Jeremy Cowin, leader of the Labor Party. And I don't care. What I care about is in the movie, in the movie The Crown, the TV show of The Crown, then lives are out. I think for Americans we were shocked and how Churchill was

treated or McMillan and all the other players. I saw that in the faces of the people in the audience. It's totally different than in America. How much do they hate each other, well, the different parts of the party. Yeah, yeah, I mean they're quite quite. I mean, I don't know, I hates the wrong. Excuse me, I'm an American. I just love the way you frame UK politics through tonight.

Just I'll just throw in on the chance of the Exchequers there with eight guys I don't know who they are, and Anna knows them all, and they all look like they look like the TV show The Crown. Yeah, I mean, there's a there's a lot of falling out now. She did say, in typical British understatement, I might have given you a little bit of that just then. But she she said, you'll be aware that there are some different views within the party on Brexit. You know, she said,

she sort of nods to to that. But what she did when she said, um, she did she did have some strong messages which will appear to the Brexity is she delivered, you know, right down the barrel of the of the camera. She said, I want respect from Europe, similar to what she said after the Salzburg disaster meeting recently, so she's trying to appeal to that side of her party. But on the other side, she had a really interesting line.

She in answer to Boris and all those hard Brexities, you'd rather see a hard break, She said, we can't have a Brexit that delivers in fifty years. That's no good to somebody who lives on a boarder and wants frictionless trade or and cited all these other examples. And I thought that was really interesting because that he is trying to take on the message of the hard Brexities who just say, let's rip it up, let's walk away. Interesting away from Brexit Anna that she starts talking about

promising to end austerity. Is this a Conservative party in some ways positioning for a potential election? Yeah? Well, I mean, you know, in theory the election is not supposed to be till twenty two, but you know, who knows. But there's a lot of unpredictability in UK policies, so that this ending austerity was really trying to take away one of Labour's trump cards. They've been able to associate the

Tories with austerity over recent years. She said, that the British people need to know that hard work has paid off. She was careful also though to say that the debt to GDP number we'll keep dropping. So of course here at Bloomberg was were you know, all watching for reaction in markets, and there wasn't really very much. And somebody I n G saying, maybe the market is going to

focus more on well, on the promise. You know, then we need to have growth, of course, but focus more on any fiscal giveaways that we might get in connection any quickly you're a saying are you there for another four? Is it five days? No, I'm actually back in London. Sorry, I heard I heard you say right at the beginning that I was in Birmingham. I have been in Birmingham, was there until very but I had to get back to London to anchor a program this morning. So one

of your properties of properties and Anna Edwards. You hear her in America, folks, you hear her on Bloomberg Radio early early in the American morning, and she's fantasistic. She anchors the market open show in Europe. Now I'm happy to say, right now I want to rip up the script and talk about something that's basically off the radar of all our distractions of the Amazon, Apple, Italy, Turkey,

on and on. Of course everything going on in Washington is well, you can do this with Craig Trudell working out of our Detroit operation on the Automobiles of America. And you can do this because he was at Michigan State University exactly five miles from the Grand River Assembly of General Motors in Lansing, Michigan. And Craig, that means you are qualified to talk about the quiet automobile disaster

out there, not Tesla. The collapse of the Ford Motor Company down forty seven percent from the peak of four or five years ago. That brought in Mr Hackett. Is he going to be shown the door like Mr Flannery of General Electric? You know, the the person to be asking that Tom is going to be Bill Ford. Um. So he is. He is Bill Ford's guy. Um. He certainly has raised a lot of questions in terms of what is his plan um, and he's not really answered those questions to this point, and a lot of people

are getting very frustrated. The last the last earnings call, uh, some sparks really flew between him and analysts at Morgan Stanley when they canceled their investor day that was going to to be uh some time in September. Uh. And when they canceled at the analyst asked, do you think you're still going to be around whenever you guys are

ready to have that investor day? So people are very frustrated. Uh. There's some new product on the way, some some new SUVs that are desperately needed, but they're late, and the company is really struggling in this market. Well, well explain, And I want to say, full disclosure. I've got a great affinity for Mr Ford. He and I talked pond hockey, among other things. He goes up north every year and

does the whole Midwest pond hockey thing. And I think he had a cameo on Wayne's World is Well, Craig, when I look at this, I want to know. I'm how you explain your car guy? And you know all the other guys who got out in Detroit explained to me how we got from Alan to Jim. I mean, Ford Management was sainted one Ford, Alan Lally, everything was wonderful. What happened well one of his big jobs towards the end of his tenure. Alan Lally was was to pick

his successor and played a big role in that. And you know, there was really it was between Mark Fields and uh, you know another insider within the company, Joe Henrickson, and the company went with Mark Fields, and Mark struggled. Um I think you know, he uh did not do well. The the share price, uh, you know, like really lagged. They had some real trouble with with making sure that they kept the product lines up to date. And and

he was shown the door very quickly. So uh, you know it was from there we we go back outside and it really seemed like Bill Ford was kind of trying to pull another Relally. He went outside his company. Let's bring in somebody who hasn't been at Ford. Uh. And you know, we we can recall that Milally came from boeing um and and Hackett was viewed as a

sort of a turnaround guy. He came from Steelcase, the furniture company, and there was some thought that okay, you know, I can I can bring in somebody with a fresh perspective. Alan obviously brought a fresh perspective to this company and that paid huge dividends. But so far we have not at all seen this sort of level of success that we saw from from Alan mulally. Uh you know when

he was at Ford. But the new business plan, you know, my study of this is and if you're just joining us, so it's Craig Trugel with us, he's with Bloomberg and just definitive on not so much the gossip of Detroit, but just the the leadership and the human condition of Detroit. White. Come on, it was one Ford Miley at a five am meeting. Everybody got on board. Everybody was on the same page. Per the Mortgage Stanley conference call. Is anybody

on the hack at page? Because I don't you know, not that I'm an expert, but I don't see it. He's he is original to be kind, moving from Steelcase and Craig, you know what everybody's saying, how can you move from making file cabinets over to running a global automobile company was seven thousand parts per car? How can

you do that? Yeah? Well, I I think I think it's really a question of whether you know whether this was the right guy to bring in when the company had some real sort of nuts and bolts issues of product being behind schedule, needing needing to update to the SUV lineup, deciding on whether or not to to play in the car business. Obviously they've decided not to do that going forward, at least at least here in North America. Okay,

but what's it's not there? What's a two thousand nineteen Fusion, What's a two thousand eighteen CI Max, a two thousand nine Mustang? I mean they say they're not in the car business, but they are in the car business. Well, everything except the Mustang is going to be going away. So those those uh, the Sedans and the lineup, with the exception of the Mustang muscle car will be phased out. They've even you know, started to phase out the advertising of some of the models that to your point, are

still going to remain on the market. But really they're turning their attention to mtvs. But but really with Hackett, I mean he came in and his background to the event that he had when with Ford was with their smart mobility unit, and that is really sort of a big think, uh you know, sort of what is the future going to look like? Uh, you know, play on

on Ford's part, and you can guess what. No one cares right, right, well, and he's continued to to sort of take this you know, big sort of universal back look at where the future is going to be in terms of mobility and and scared autonomous. But you're I do the interview, you don't, Craig Listen, It's real simple. Shields was fancy. He did all the fit and finish. Malally was the god that came out with a flex which is the only Ford I see in the island

of Manhattan. As you said, they desperately need an SUV and they got a CEO doing tech babble right. Yeah, that that I think gets to it and cuts to the chase. I mean when when Jim Hackett made an appearance at c S earlier this year, I think a lot of people just sort of left his presentation scratching their heads. And so if that's any indication of the kind of leader he is internally at Ford, that has

a lot to do with the problem. Now from New Jersey just emails in and could you please ask him what Mr Hackett's reception is going to be at the North American International Auto Show? How is he going to be great? I saw Marci ol once when I was at the North American International Auto Show and he was greeted like a god. Same with Milally likes does anybody care of Hacketts shows up at the North American International Auto Show. He definitely does not have the star power

that a MARCHIONI did, that that imulally did. And he's not he's not, you know, a car guy in the sense of the world where obviously that's a phrase that's overused in Detroit, but uh, you know he is. He is a big thinker. He's sort of professorial, and he's not one to get down into V six and horsepower and so forth. Yield six point When did they cut the dividends Thursday or is it in November? We asked the CFO precisely this question, because the dividend yield has

been soaring. It is a very rich payout. But importantly it's what the Ford family lives off right, So they're going to hold on for dear life to that Dad. That's well said. This is brilliant, cract true. Thank you so much. One of the books of joy of the last five years. And this is a serious book to be read and considered chapter by chapter. Failure to adjust how Americans got left behind in the global economy. It

was a terrific success with a huge residents. Chapters like Confronting the competition, how a strong dollar is hurt, how to think about economic competitiveness another important chapter, and it can only be teddled into the Council on Foreign Relations. I can't say enough about Failure to Adjust. So you've got to write a new epilogue, maybe a new prologue. How do you rewrite it after U. S m c. A. Well, you know, we will have to see. I I still

think we're at the midpoint of all of this. I think the President has shown that that he's able to do at least some of what he said he could do, which is used terrorists and the threat of tariffs to force changes in trade agreements. Um. The big enchilado, of course, is China, and we don't know how that was going to play out. So I think I'm gonna hold off before I read enough. Okay, beach reading two thousand nineteen, I can see it. I can see it already now.

You could be like a girl magnet if I was reading Failure to Adjust on the Beach ted great, does U s m C A. U s m C. A. Does it mean Canada and Mexico lost, well, you know, in the narrow confines of the negotiation. Yes, I mean Canada and Mexico didn't really get any of the changes that they particularly wanted in the deal. They're happy with some of the stuff that was brought over from the TPP, like the new rules on digital commerce, so they're happy

with that. Canada didn't get it. Wanted a bunch of these, you know, progressive changes to the agreement. They wanted to expand temporary immigration the United States under the t n vs IS, wanted additional access to US government procure. We didn't get any of those things. Mexico made some moderately significant concessions, Canada very few. At the end of the day, I think they're both pretty happy with it, but but it was definitely tilted in the direction that the US

wanted to tilt it ted. Alden, can you speak to the issue of HUCH negotiations, because in the actual text of U s m c A, apparently each of the individual countries must give thirty days notice to their partners if they are to negotiate a free trade agreement with what is described as a quote non market economy. What do you mean this is this is causing some controversy. I think it was one of the elements of the agreement that surprised all of us who were watching it

pretty closely. Does this means China? Of course, Yeah, of course it means China. And and you know, the Canadians have have talked about the idea of doing a free trade agreement with China. Prime Minister Trudeau has sort of done some preliminary discussions with his counterparts in China on this. I think this is a kind of preemptive strike by the US to say we don't want to see Canada or Mexico do a free trade agreement with China because

that could complicate our dealings with China. I mean, the non market economy stuff has a little wiggle room because the Chinese, of course, have taken a case to the w t O saying they should no longer be considered a non market economy. And if they win that case, I suppose they wouldn't fall under this clause, but we'll see how it plays out. It was it was an interesting addition to the agreement. To be sure, do you believe that the United States is trying to put together

its own free trade block in North America. I mean, I don't think you know that the new U. S. M c A is anymore of a block than the old NAFTA was. But I do think what the administration is doing is trying to kick off these deals one by one, you know, Korea, now, Canada and Mexico. We're gonna see what happens with Japan in Europe, and then really turned everything on the Chinese, with with with you know,

allies behind the administration. I do think that's the goal. Okay, well, let's just get over to China then, I mean, we got the happy you know, cross border in Canada and we go to Mike McKee juts up to Canada, Michael McKee jets down to Mexico. But as you say, everything hinges on China. Give us the Ted Alden update on

is there a dialogue with China? Start with that. Well, at the moment, not really, you know, Treasury Secretary Manuchin keeps trying to restart at and then the president announced his new terrorists, and the Chinese say, we can't negotiate with a gun to our head. You know, my you know, here, here's my prediction. And you can come back, you know, we can come back and however long and see what

I'm right or not. I think we'll know that the negotiations are serious when the US Trade Representative, Bob Lightheiser gets put in charge. He was a guy who brought home this new NAFTA deal. He's gonna lead the talks with Japan. He's the serious negotiator in this administration. As long as Manuchin is in charge of the China fall, I think it goes nowhere. And the President was pretty clear in his press conference on Monday he's not quite ready to talk to the Chinese yet. He wants to

turn up the heat a bit higher. That's a that's dangerous game, but but that's the one that that he's playing. Ted All then, along with the former Michigan Governor John Angler and former U S Secretary of Commerce Penny Pritzker, you helped to produce a report called the Work Ahead Machines Skills in US Leadership in the twenty one century. Would you revise anything in that book currently based on

what you know? No, and and and I'm you know, I've been very pleased with the reception to that that report and sectary Pritsker in particular, is just put a tremendous amount of energy into promoting this governor. Angler was, you know, tied up as interim president of Michigan State University, though he's done some great stuff with it too. It's really about the current and coming impact of technology on

the workplace and the broader messengers. We have not done a very good job as a country at helping Americans succeed in the face of these very rapid economic changes, be it the pressure is a global competition or technology, and that's just gonna get worse and and and we laid that out in the poor I think it's still pretty current about Okay, you sound like Bread Long and Danny Rodgers. When does that change? I mean, you guys have all identified that labor in America got taken to

the cleaners on NAFTA. When does this get fixed? I don't know exactly how you know my group on this stuff of that guy named Richard Baldwin, who's a trade economist that in Geneva his book the I'm gonna forget

the name the Great Converge and something like that. Um. Sorry, Richard uh points to a real change around as a results of the rise of information technology that made it possible for multinational companies to create these global supply chains locate factories with very advanced technologies and low wage countries.

That was a big, big shift, and I think you know, if you look at if you look at with the point at which you know, wages, living standards started grow in the developing world, particularly China, which is a great thing, but they really stagnated in the advanced economies. And I think we're still trying to figure out how to adjust to that change, which really kind of kicked in around

coincident with NAFTA. Na interesting Ted Alton take you for the briefing important failure to adjust how Americans got left behind the global economy and an update here as we see us m uh from the Council on Foreign Council on Foreign Relations, we should say so, David Rubinstein peered of your preview. It is brought to you by Wells Fargo Technology Banking. Wells Fargo helps business leaders find their

moments of truth. A little outside perspective can create a lot of clarity with us not David Rubinstein has done just such a wonderful job of going deeper wonderful conversations. And again, David, people still talking about your effort with Mr Bezos of Amazon. Um, David, it's always important to interview somebody who started out in the William Morris mail room.

It is something legendary Los Angeles, isn't it. I never understood how one can start on a mail room and all of a sudden wind up a few years later running a major studio. But apparently by being in the mail room you get a lot of information and contacts. So Barry Diller is one of those people. He started

the mail room. He dropped out of u c l A after just a few weeks and never completed college, worked in the mail room, ultimately went to ABC, became the head of ABC Entertainment, and then at age thirty two, the head of Paramount Pictures, and then after that created Fox Television, and after that created I a C. Interactive Company Corporation, which does enormous amount of Internet related companies

and now has a very very high market value. Had you adjusted, uh, he and he put in two fifty million dollars into I a C. It now has a market value with all the companies together about fifty seven billion. You were expert at this in the distinctive feature of Mr Diller's Wikipedia and what we know about him in New York is he's a guy that's moved from this to this to this. By definition, David, you have to fail along the way. What was the dealer failure? It

stands out among the many successes. Well, he would say that he had he failed in in in everything he did at ABC, everything he did at Paramount didn't work, a lot of things that worked. Uh uh. What he would give other people credit for as well, I would say that he didn't think he had succeeded at being

a principle. He was working for other people at at ABC, Paramount and at Fox, and ultimately he said to Rupert Murdoch, I'd like to be more of a principal here in Rupert Murdoch said, there's only one principle in this company, and it's me. And so, at the age of forty nine, he left taking some of the games he had realized, and then ultimately figured out what he wanted to do as a principal and created I a C. And it's

a very big success. So I think he had not failed, but he wanted to be a principal at the age of forty nine he began it. He's now in his seventies and obviously very very successful financially and professionally. David Rubinstein in your conversations with Barry Diller, did something in terms of his intuition come across his ability to intuit

what would make good programming, good movies, good entertainment. He had the same perspective to some extent as uh as Jeff Bezo's intuition is much more important than maybe detailed analysis, and so he just felt he had a pretty good sense of what would work. He wouldn't put his finger on any one thing. But I asked him why he was, um, you know, so well versed in so many different areas, and he said, even though he dropped out of college, he had always been a reader. He loved reading. Reading

was important part of his life. And as we all know, he's a very articulate person, a very good uh user of words. And I think that people really respect his intellect, and I think he would he wouldn't want to brag and say that his intellect was great at other people. He didn't say that, but my sense is that elect is very, very high and he just has a very good way of reading people. A right. If he has a very good way of reading people, he's also survived

in the world of talent and Hollywood. Does that also require a bit of a thick skin. It does. Hollywood is not for the faint of heart. Um. It makes Washington look like a you know, a playground to some extent in some ways. Um. But I think that the most interesting thing I thought he said in the end, when I asked him what about the legacy? What would he says, his greatest legacy as great as achievement, and you have all these wonderful things he did. He said

he thought his greatest legacy was his marriage. And he married in two thousand one to a very famous UH fashion designer, Diane von Furstenburgh. And together they've obviously created a terrific life. But they've also been very involved in philanthropy, early signers of the Giving Pledge, and as you may know, in New York, he's helping to create a park off of one of the Peers on the Lower West Side. I wanted to talk about that, David. I mean, you're

known for your philanthropy to America. Mendicined, incalculable contribution to the Library of Congress. Barry Dealer's changed the landscape of New York. That's quite a statement. Yes, there was an abandoned kind of rail line and he well, it was abandoned for some time, and he and his wife helped with a very talented architect, Liz Diller, create a high line where people can have a kind of a park

along a railway, and that inspired him. I think they want to create a park as well off of the pier that that now exists in the Lower West Side. So he's, you know, a person who who has succeeded in business, succeeded in in marriage, succeeded in philanthropy, and I think quite impressive in the story is uh, you know, he's got some emotional time talking about various things, but

I thought it was quite compelling. Does he present as someone who goes his own way regardless of what is going on around him, that he's able to maintain that level of intense focus. Yes. Uh. You don't become a successful in so many different areas by just going along with the conventional wisdom. To be a leader, you have to do things on your own and things that other people tell you can't be done. So for example, he

created the ABC Movie of the Week. Well people may not remember that now, but for a long time that was a very novel thing, having a fresh movie every week, created just for television. He also greenlit, uh so many of the best known movies of the paramount era when he was there, like Raiders of the Lost Art and so forth. Did that did pretty well? And maybe maybe your favorite is it? Is it Saturday night Fever? Don't Saturday Saturdy night Fever was one of his also terms

of endearment Greece. Um, he had a lot of great movies, he wouldn't say, but all his doing. But he obviously was the person in charge and hadn't worked out, he would have been blamed taking responsibility. Did he talk about his parking his driving habits in the city of New York. He's kind of famous for that. Um he has say he likes to drive face, he likes he has some sports cars, and he likes to drive barefoot. Um. I guess he feels that gives him a greater sense of

control or something. But um so he's a pretty good driver. I guess I don't have any parking tickets he's got, or speeding tickets he didn't. We didn't go into that. David Yankees are Oakland New York. Oh, it's too early to say, but I hope New York would probably be the better choice. David finessaid beautifully. David Rubinside, thank you all right, Thanks a great appreciate previous. He moves on

with his day at Carlisle Group. It airs tonight on Bloomberg Television nine pm Eastern and at six pm Eastern on Friday and also over the weekend, and the share of the show airs also on Bloomberg Radio tomorrow night at five pm. Thanks for listening to the Bloomberg Surveillance podcast. Subscribe and listen to interviews on Apple Podcasts, SoundCloud, or whichever podcast platform you prefer. I'm on Twitter at Tom Keane before the podcast. You can always catch us worldwide. I'm Bloomberg Radio