Surveillance: ECB Restarts Quantitative Easing

introduced tearing? And how will the markets respond to the prospect of much lower interest rates at the c B. We've got the right guest to get the start at all that you bring in, Joyce Chang. But John the zero hedge chart last night, which I made up years ago.

What I've forgotten about b double A corporates, the kind of stuff you follow on the real yield see it one PM Friday's Bloomberg Television Less the SMP dividend we are over two standard d creations low and how those rates have come in versus a stock dividend so usual time,

these are the bottom of the investment great stack. There the credits that you're looking at, and a lot of people have been worried about them because there's been a huge, huge amount of debt that's been issued by some of those companies, but actually they've held up pretty well through the dynamics here into this dragon. Can I say this is the biggest ECB meeting ever? I think I can say. I think you can say it's the biggest one so

far this year. I don't think you can say it's the biggest ever, but I think it's the biggest so far. Joyce chaying with us now. JP Morgan Securities Global Research Chair Joyce is great to see you. Let's talk about the base case just quickly. We survey the economist here at Bloomberg. Of them expect hui. The median forecast seems to be to drop the depot rate from negative forty to negative fifty and maybe you go again in December.

What are the team at JP Morgan looking for? So we are looking for ten basis points, so we agree with where the market it is right now. I mean more importantly, what we're looking at is what's the forward guidance. Are they really going to push out the communication to the end of before they would actually um and and be ready to move sooner if they needed to um you know, bring rates down further. And it's the tearing debate what that means for the banks. I mean, how

will this impact bank income and bank profitability? So we think it's ten basis points. We think it's thirty billion euros on the QUI for another nine months right now. I think there is some space where the market could be disappointed. But you know, it's a transition period, so I don't think you can necessarily you move as aggressively at this point as what the markets may be expecting

from some corners. I've spoken to money market participants who believe the key element of today's package is what happens with tearing now. The ECB in the official that are out there seemed to be focused on QI, but for market participants, in the speak that I speak to the bank income, the bank profitability, and is there a way basically not to penalize the bank so much for a negative interest rate? So I think the market will look at that and they look at the language. I'm tearing.

It's over the Boston Red Sox because having a bad morning. Good morning with the red socks, you're always having a bad morning. Great year last year, yeah, okay, it was a good six months. I still can't believe we won I'm gonna I've just spoken before Kean Abohussin to me, he's your most important person at JP Morgan, your European bank analyst has to synthesize this for commercial banking in Europe. This meeting can't be good for the profitability of European banks,

can it? Well? I think those are the longer term questions, and we've been getting a lot of these types of relative value questions. How are you looking at the health of US banks versus European banks? So that's why the cheering is really where the focus is from many of the market participants to really take a look at bank income. How's bankin come going to be impacted? Joyce the thing I struggle with today for the banks in Europe and

for me, as for many people I know. Listen to this program, you'll be looking at s x seven E, which is the euro banks on the Bloomberg terminal, how they respond to the package that gets delivered today. If we do indeed get the full package in the short term, I can see how tearing helps, but it won't be too long before people start to think about hang on a minute, you start to offset the pain a little

bit for some of these banks. But with tearing, you've just opened up a whole new range of possibilities for how low interest rates of the e c B can go very quickly. We could be talking about negative suffer is seventy five basis points, then negative one percent. We won't care about tearing in that context, will just be looking at a rate that is going lower and lower at the e c B. How important is it to

grapple with that issue right now? How can you have any conviction on what Eurozone banks will be of the direction of travel ultimately is lower interest rates? No? I think that is absolutely Um. You know the case. Everybody is looking at six now of our euro index as a negative yield on it, and um a debate on whether the U s could go to zero interest rates eventually the China goes to zero interest rates. Nobody sees

you coming out of this very quickly. And I think the discussion is going to turn to growth in Europe, not just the bank profitability, but are we seeing your technical recession? Joyce, I mean, everybody here's kind of nancy mathematical knowledge of this. I love what Gina smile like digging in the New York Times today with the upside down headline for a world turned upside down by negative rates on our listeners are listening to John Faro talk

about what John negatives? Did you say, Well, potentially, I'm just looking at Switzerland at the moment they have tearing. That's what rights are, Okay, So we get the German tenure. Excuse me, the German two year to a negative one percent. That's not healthy, is it? It's not healthy? And I think you're going to see debates go on all the central banks. People will look at Swiss National Bank, what are they going to do? You see six out of seventeen expecting a rate cut, But is that going to

actually move more aggressively as well? But there's also going to be you look at what PBOC is doing, look at what Brazil is doing. I mean we've got twenty out of twenty two central banks that are easing right now. So you do have synchronized but into John and below the zero bound, it's not I think for money market bight sessments today they hope that if DCB moves, they only go by ten basis points. No one wants to

sing more than that. A lot of people are starting to think about this concept, Joyce, of the reversal rate and I would love for you to speak to that for us. Are we at the point in Europe right now where rate cuts are viewed by market participants as negative that could lead to potentially tie to financial conditions, to have adverse reactions by market participants and therefore negative

responses never negative reactions in the broader economy. Well, we agree that ten basis points is really what the market is expecting to If you did something more aggressive, that might send a very different signal. I think what the market is really looking for is as you have these leadership changes come in your are you going to see more focused on fiscal policy? Um and um affected Madame Regard trots in and says we need more fiscal policy. That's the easy part. Then you have to affect more

fiscal policy. Well, you need to see what happens around Germany on that debate. That's really the key. And I think you know the question one has is whether the growth numbers are going to come back. We're looking at p m i's now that are at two thousand and twelve levels on manufacturing, so there's a lot more concern

on the growth. Are we this morning, are we at a point of what Mr Diamond would call macro prudential risks or John Lipsky I think the former US force at the I M F. Are we at a point where Mr drog has to look at the broader, summed risks and discrete risks of each European story. I don't

think that we're at this point yet. I mean, we're not at a point where we did the Eurozone crisis at all, but we are at a real inflection point about the effectiveness of the policy tools, how many policy tools are remaining, and where are we at this late cycle on the growth outlook? And I think that the

focus will go back to the growth outlook. And you know we have now a number of major economies going into recession where the US, even at one and a half percent grow than the three quarters is the best growth outlook in the developed world. Thank you to all your team for particularly with Jan Lewis. Would they really the essay of the summer in our world of economics, finance and invested. You have Alberto Gallo on the phone.

It's important to go to Mr gall Alberto, good morning and thank you again to our economics team in Frankford for their support in this. Alberto, this is absolutely historic, absolutely original. Is this Jean Claude Triche's e c B. I think that what we're seeing here is a complete resignation to the fact that UM by dvs NG and negative rates are going to stay with us forever, for

a very very long time. UM the twenty billion a month is UM an open ended after purchase program, so UM it is essentially the Quey infinity world that we wear. I agree, yeah, Alberto, this is so important, the physics of bio draggy, the mathematical physics that you're uh, you know, I think of others in Europe that that have have

led on this. It's original territory, without question. Does your fixed income world and the knock on of other asset classes and the incentives to business, do they move along with full faith and credit reaction. Does the market stay LinkedIn correlated together or do you suggest instabilities off this new drug policy. The good scenario is governments will follow up and do some spending, particularly Germany and France because

now they can essentially get paid to borrow. If you think about you know, Germany thirty year is at minus point zero seven, so they're they're they're getting seven basis points and the ten yere is at minus sixty three, so they're getting paid point six um point to borrow

with a tenure horizon. If governments don't follow up and don't do spending, and you have the risk of creating a Japan type economy where people hold cash because populations in Europe are aging and Dave Moore, if returns are lower, well, well, well said. I want to bring Paul Sweeney in here. But one more question before Mr Sweeney wanders in, and that's what do the Germans think of that? How does axel Weber respond to this? I know Jens Vibin's and

the cross airs right now. I stood with otmar Issing in the nascent ECB building, the old one years ago and there was a Germanic feel. Is that gone? I think the issue is for Germany there, you know, there there's a there's a long debate on spending, and we've seen improvements on um on the debate with a discussion around exiting the black deuro, the black deer deficit, and also a green stimulus, a bit similar to you know, the green stimulus that's been discussed in the US UM.

The question that is when and how this would be implemented, because the government still keeps these things as a put option, not for for people. In Germany. Generally we have seen higher savings rates because when you say returns going down, then you know you you have you have a pension that's uh that you have to fund and you start seeking How big a defeat was this today for the Germans? I mean, how miserable is Axels that were listening tomorrow

dragg and reading the headlines on as Bloomberg. I think Germany is better off because they have negative yields, they fund more cheaply. And let's not forget that Germany is the biggest beneficiary from a lower euro. Um we estimated that the Eurozone benefits everyone. You know, there's more economies of scale, people can go across borders, and companies can

invest more freely. But Germany has taken over a third of the advantages of the pond of the benefits because they have the biggest benefits from having a lower euro because of experts. Um of their experts are in an economy. So I think Germans are you know, they pretend to complain, but they're pretty happy about what a very low euro Alberta gallo with us a headline from Mr Drag, the ECB will carry out strategic review under leguard. We're gonna have a strategic review and let Paul Sweeney run it

for is Paul, why don't you jump in here? Was futures up eight in the euro one oh nine fifty six dollars stronger, Alberta. How surprised were you, if at all, about Mr drag characterization of the actual meeting itself that there was so much support for easing that no vote was needed. My personal interpretation, I we spoke about it earlier this morning. Thing is that the dissent that was flagged by some easy B members in the past few days was actually a way to lower market expectations and

allow the easy bit to surprise with less. Market expectations were very high. Some people expected forty billion a month and there's just not enough pounds to buy um. But what they are doing with twenty billion for a very long time, you know, twenty billion forever, let's call it is essentially trying to anchor the cost of spending for governments, trying to anchor the long end of the treasury cur in German, in France and Italy so that governments can

spend more. So I think that drug has Drug has always been able to master consensus, and I think in the end the compromise is UM to to UM to reduce the volatility of funding costs for governments and then try to stimulate governments to spend, which is what the next president. The next president's job will be connect Monty policy to fiscal policy. So let's let's go there. What kind of tools are in the toolbox does the ECB

president have to incent governments to spend? Not many, but the not many direct tools, but with the right instruments, you can have a combination similar to what Tarp did in the US. You can have a combination of loose monetary policy with positive fisical policy. Europe is taking like a decade to get there because obviously there's a lot of moving parts. But for example, the European Union could

increase its budget. They there could be green bonds or European Investment Bank e i B bonds that fund infrastructure and that are that are bought by the ECB as part of the program. So this is for example, one of the options on the table. I think next year we'll have the Monetary Policy Review, which lasts several months, and we may see more ideas like this which target more the real economy rather than just buying bonds in

the financial market. Yeah, Calumny skeptical here on cutting rates and buying twenty billion dollars or twenty billion euros of bonds. It's gonna come down to fiscal stimulus at some point. Yet we heard from the Germans recently that there still is no political support for that. So is there is there some catalysts out there that you think certain governments need to see or feel before they can really make

that big fundamental shift. Unfortunately, in the core European countries where economic fundamentals are still better, I think the catalysts that they're waiting for our negative events. For example, if you had a recession next year, or if you were close to zero growth, which is which is in the base case, or if the US imposes card tariffs, or if there's a heart Brexit, then I'm sure you would see a German spending plan coming up. So at the moment,

it is a put option rather than a product. The plant the risk with this is that it may be too little, too late, So I think there needs to be a productive plan. Albertagalo, thank you so much. With Algebras just a superb, superb perspective. This morning, we're looking at Frankford and Mario drag I did the back of the bow tie calculation off their forecast for next year, added up animal spirits, top line g d P in Europe would be a vast two point two percent. That

does not get it done. To cut the ambiguity of that is Marcus Ashworth. He's with Bloomberg Opinion and Rights exceptionally trenchant essays on the ambiguities of whatever the theme is. Okay, Marcus, here's the ambiguity. Mario Draggy affects what he will. We get a low rate environment which accommodates business and sustains business. And the other side of the coin is Mario Draggy develops a low rate forever strategy which breaks the back

of confidence in business. Revenue goes down. How do you cut that over the next twenty four months for European and United Kingdom business? I mean, which way does it cut? It's it's fiscal policy. We all know that in the sense that he's creating the you know, he's thinking he's best keeping this plate spinning. Um, he's open ended quei. I mean, it's the perfect weapon to keep the Euro

in check. If you know, the set does get more aggressive on rate carts and all the US economy dips, that will push the Euro up and it will kill off any any hope that Europe has of getting out this manufacturing recession, which it's clearly you know, put pointed right at so and he's done a broadbrush stuff. He's kept everyone on board. Super skillful, ill maestro. He hands out of the guard with the perfect bat on pass. She's got the ability to cut rates more, she's got

the ability to increase qui. She's doing ability to widen out what type of qui that being much more generous the banks with these cheap loans called tel traits. It's a it's a complete package. And look, they've emphasized ever more more aggressively that it needs to be matched with fiscal policy. That's what the god allegedly skilled, skillfull ability to coordinate with the your E leaders, and that's what's needed to break that obvious the E coostomy. As you

mentioned it, it's a drill dilemma. You know, you cut rates, but all it's goning is you're digging at the whole ever deeper, and that's actually going to be detrimental to the economy. Even they're not extremely careful. It's interesting. Markets. Just give us a sense of magnitude of the twenty billion euros in terms of the bond buying. Just give us a sense of enough not enough. Just we're just kind of showing a little bit of show. Yeah, that's

exactly right. It's doing it in the twenty billion is perhaps less than someone expected, but at least it is happening. It's back on the agenda they said at the end of last year. This was it. No more bond buying. We're calling a hole to KWI. The backstone won't start from the number one with the back ten months later. Therefore, redoing this to anybody and is quite modest. But the point is is that clear the clear the market is

prepared to go to forty or fifty. Didn't know it and coming The Chief Economists pointed out that to have the same impact on GDPs ahead, but their omittial or of qui they could could do hundred billions. Now that's that's in the future. He's leaving that ability to look guard. He's setting out all the smogest boarder of options to pick up on. Have you seen a Vectors study If they do twenty gazillion a month, I guess is the

number when it runs dry? I mean there's got to be a point out there in a Vector's study one year, two years, three years, five years out where there's nothing more to buy. They have to start buying apple shares. Yeah, like the like the Spiss National Bank sextually did. Look, they can buy bank bonds, they can buy green bonds, that can buy the phones. How long for bonds they can keep on buying? I mean this the point is

they've matched open end QUEI with the rate cycle. Now there's none of this nonsense about you know, six months forward or year forward. It's it's forever until until just before they actually start hiking rates. So the point is that they give themselves flexibility and they can alter their limits to increase it from thirty of any one issue or anyone country, and they can widen out what they buy. Paul, was this some point? Was this in the textbooks at Duke.

This is not this is not what I learned in business school. And Marcus, I mean it seems like, you know, the ECB maybe going the way of Japan. I'm not sure that's where Mario dragging wants to take. Well, look how the curves flattened, and you've seen banks sell off quite sharply because of that. Were now we could argue that the reality of negative rates the first time another rate cup for um three years has happened, that that

that's shocked the banks a bit. But it's the curve flattening, and that means they're that it's just smichest gonna get squeezed, which is what what actually told me. Your point was initially is that this is the this is the dichotomy is it's are you going to write on this today or are you like home from window. I'm prepping as we speak. Very good, Marcus Asher, thank you so much, very valuable. Really, I can't say enough about he cuts the ambiguities or whatever the issue is. Paul Sween, you

give me the schedule. Here is it eight o'clock tonight when I need to watch Red Sucks baseball. I think that's exactly when you want to tune in. But first seven thirty with Kevin si really, Kevin Cereuli. Let's go to Mr Sireli now in in Houston, Kevin just because the time, I want to cut to the chase Biden and Warren. What does the Vice president need to accomplish against the senator from Massachusetts. He needs to try to stop her momentum. And that's why you've seen these pre

debate attacks coming from the Biden campaign. With regards to Senator Elizabeth Warren. You've got Ed Rundell, the former governor of Pennsylvania, out in an op ed in the Washington Post calling her a hypocrite with regards to how she has fundraised. But candidly, when I talked to supporters of Senator Elizabeth Warren, they would love to have that debate every day of the week. They feel that that just offers them an opportunity to provide a contrast between Biden's

more centrist approach to economics versus Elizabeth Warren's. But look for a breakout moment from one of the other candidates, the Castros, the Clobachar's bookers, so to speak, to see if they can try to make what is increasingly become a three way race into a four or five way race heading into the later fall. Kevin, that was gonna be That's kind of my question here. We had Kamala Harris kind of have one of those moments at the last debate, but she seems to have lost her momentum.

What's going on there? Well, I think that she was unable to get to get out of the pack, so to speak, after that momentum that she obtained earlier in Miami. And when I talked to Progressive that they say is well, her plans aren't progressive enough, and she was attacked by Census for the plan is not being set to the plants team to Progressive. She hasn't really been able to solidify her support in any which way in terms of which policy approach she wants to take. Kevin Surli, thank

you so much. This is the perfect guest to dovetail. Well, we're all gonna see tonight. Charles Gabriel has been doing this for a while. I mean, Paul, you can appreciate this institutional investor, all American team every every year for twelve years exactly. You don't you know who did he know? Exactly exactly bringing in the great Chuck Chuck Gabriel, President of Cappa Alpha Partners. Chuck, thanks so much for joining us. You know, we've got, as Tom Wood does suggest me,

perhaps the first real Democratic debate tonight. What do you expect to see tonight? What do you think is going to be the theme? Thanks to thank you, Paul well. I. You know, I do agree that there's there's probably more focused than is deserved on Senator Warren and whether she might really either have a bit of a tiff with Bernie Sanders, because it's pretty clear that you know, the Vice president has about a quarter of the vote, has been very very steady, but doesn't really generate a lot

of enthusiasm with because he's moderate. Then you've got at least a third of the vote with with Senator Warren and Senator Sanders, which really is very much more on the left side of the party wing. And then you've got, you know, a bunch of others that would be moderates. The two would be moderates and Kamala Harris and Boudeges, but they can't get more than I mid to high

single digits. And then you've got a lot of others that as you mentioned that like O'roorican Book or in clob Orchestro and Yang that you know, those swing a way. But so far after three debates, it doesn't seem like any of those are going to break through. So this is we're just going to see if if Mr Biden makes any mistakes, as Senator Warren really, uh, if there's

any pile up on her. She one of the one of the great headlines I saw was that she arrives at this debate with great momentum, but uh, you know, a target on her back. Uh, and then you know, well we'll see about that that middle but you know, it's a long way four nineteen days, fourteen months till the election that the Trump might lose the election. So

Wall Streets not particularly concerned yet. So Chuck is, as you talked to your investor clients and you know you kind of, you know, kind of game this out a little bit. We've got the former Vice president Biden kind of with a lead here if he or someone like him were to get in office. Do you have you identified kind of sectors that would be winners and losers here with with Biden? Yes, yeah, I think I think Vice President Biden is is more of the same from

the Obama year. So I think that they're probably dobably. There would be some relief in the health care sector. Um, you know, there were there are those that would benefit from uh, you know, expansion of basically Medicaid and Medicare under you know, the old Obamacare. So I think that you'd have some healthcare sector winners. Um, you haven't. You'd have some relief probably, you know, it wouldn't be as

negative for the energy sector, for instance. But other than that, you know, it's it'd be just sort of a return to Obama type administration. And and the big deal would be whether or not he'd be dealing with a continued Republican Senate, because if that's the case, we're looking at probably blessed gridlock. I mean blessed gridlock. There was a time, Chuck Gabriel, where you and I would talk and I have seven policy things to talk about, and we'd only

get the three or four. Now there's zero. Does your world really matter at this debate? I mean, does policy really matter in the great culture War known as America? No, I don't. I don't. I really don't think so. But but I think that those that are looking ahead, trying

to skate to where the puck is going to be. Tom, you know, I think that they're they're eyeing Senator Senator Warren in particular, because you know, it's pretty clear that all of the Democrats are sort of on one side or the other, you know, of Medicare for all and a green New Deal. There's a pretty clear challenge and a transformative story ahead and energy and health. But she would create a threat third leg of sorts, a third leg of a school taking on Wall Street itself, and

she knows how to do it. She knows where the pressure points are as a former TARP Commission chairman and a Senator member for for now seven years and counting. So I think that there's there's concern about what accendency of Warren could mean four Wall Street in particular, but it's far too early. A really good I mean, I could go on about Wayne Gretzky, and I'm asking you if President Trump is there there is a second Wayne Gretzky,

but we won't go there. Chuck Gabriel's always thank you so much, really really appreciate having a mind with capital alpha. We'll shipped gears now with the look at the life and legacy of an oil giant. Tea Boon Pickens, the Texas oil man, billionaire energy investor, and television pitchman for wind and natural gas powers, died of natural causes following a series of strokes in recent years. He was we get more on the famous and controversial businessman now from

blue Bergs. Bob Mouton, there's a temptation to use the word legendary when describing Tea Boon Pickens, but out of respect for the sensitivity he expressed about the term, he won't be hearing it here. He figured it was just another way of saying he was old. You know when legendary came into it when I seventy. Thomas Boone Pickens Jr. Was born in and the cow town of Holdenville, Oklahoma, near the Greater Seminole oil field, which had been discovered

a year earlier. The family's roots in England intersected with those of Daniel Boone. He said, his grandmother counseled him to never forget where he came from. Pickens would recall his first lesson in growing a business was delivering newspapers. One day he was handed a windfall when he found a lost wallet that belonged to a customer who gave him a reward of one dollar. That was big money because my paper out had twenty eight papers on and I made every day one cent for paper ned, so

I was making twenty eight cents a day. And let me tell you that one in peanuts. Twenty eight cents a day, and I wasn't throwing it around either. I saved it, he said. When he arrived back home waiving his reward money around, his mother and grandmother insisted that he returned it immediately because they said they weren't going to see anyone rewarded for simply being honest. It was a formative lesson that the head of his alma mater,

Oklahoma State University, President Burns. Hargess, says, Picken never forgot boon. Is a very honorable man. He keeps his word, which might sound like a contradiction for a man who achieved fame and fortune as a corporate reader making hostile takeover bids in the nineteen seventies and eighties. In his first job after graduating in nineteen fifty one, he followed his father into the oil business. He worked three years for Phillips Petroleum, or, as he later told it, he was

troubled by the waist and inefficiency he witnessed. He quit Phillips in nineteen fifty four and formed a company that would become known as Mesa Petroleum and would grow to one of the largest independent U S producers of oil and gas, going after takeover targets companies that Pickens believed were inefficient and undervalued. Some industry executives branded him a pirate,

but they couldn't dismiss him as an outsider. This is a man who was one of the original wildcatters and amassed a huge amount of oil and natural gas resources. He was really someone who just saw the future. Bloomberg reporter Alex Steele notes, though, that his visionary image suffered big set x when oil prices plunged with the financial crisis, and his grassroots campaign to wean America off OPEC oil by building wind farms proved to be a costly miscalculation

earlier than most people would have thought. And we're talking oh seven o eight in Texas. He had a huge push upper wind turbine. I'm Taboon Pickens. I've been an ol man my whole life, but this is one emergency

we can't drill our way out of. He later lamented that he lost hundreds of millions of dollars with his mistimed bet Gone with the Wind, even as he continued to support the future of renewable energy in his two thousand eight memoir The First Billion Is the Hardest, and in interviews, Pickens would point out he actually earned most of his wealth as an energy investor in his later years. You know, I didn't do that till I was seventy. It was after seventy that I made that first billion.

When Forbes estimated his net worth had slumped to less than a billion dollars in twenty thirteen, Pickens tweeted, don't worry. At nine hundred fifty million, I'm doing fine, but he vowed he would try to make it all back. He told Bloomberg Elevation in anyone could do it with enough hard work. I've had people say, well, why don't you step back and let somebody else get up to its

feed trough? The feed trough in Americas it's infinity. His health failing, though, Pickens decided to close his Dallas based pp Capital Hedge fund, early last year, writing on his website that he wanted to invest instead in promoting unbridled entrepreneurship and philanthropic and political endeavors. Former Oklahoma Chief Supreme Court Justice Steve Taylor says that became his new passion.

He wanted to enjoy the fun of giving away money and seeing what happened with that money, scholarships, football stadiums, engineering schools, hospitals. His fans will miss his homespun tips for success that came to be known fondly as buonisms. How I say work eight hours, sleep eight hours. Be sure they're not the same eight hours. Asked in one of his last interviews for his favorite buonism, Pickens offered

this cautionary council. The higher the monkey climbs the tree there where people can see his and he used a three letter word for backside t Boon. Pickens was ninety one years old. I'm Bob Moon Bloomberg Surveillance, Bob Moon. That was fantastic retrospective on the life and times of te Boon and Pickens and what amazes me Thomas just the rollercoaster of his career and how he was able

to come back after some just some amazing setback. And I would talk about Oklahoma and um no O s U. And he was at College Station when my father was there Texas. A and M. Yeah, my father would laugh about him. He was a basketball guy. He made twenty five bucks a month. And in the twelfth Man magazine for A and M. They say the ten worst mistakes in history. A and M was letting boot pickings. It's great,

he said. He was a character. That's right. You know, they weren't close friends, but he knew who he was. He was like big man on campus. I think he was maybe a year or two out of my father. But A and M has never forgiven giving him up

to the folks up in Oklahoma. Yeah, exactly. And he's been certainly a wonderful benefactor, wonderful supporter of Oklahoma State University, and certainly they're athletic depart Remember the fear of Mason was like, you know, I really can't say folks enough where he almost invented Yeah, I mean, it's a little

bit like Mr Singer and Elliott. Now maybe he's an equivalent. Yeah, I mean I came on Wall Street in the mid eighties and I was just when the whole corporate raider thing was really and junk bond financed raiders, and they're they're a handful of them, but t Boon in the energy space, he was, uh the big player in that space, really kind of reshuffling and a lot of the energy assets at that time of putting the fear into CEOs and boards as well. We've done no corporate jet today.

I mean at home last night, I had, you know, various offspring sing I like the yellow phone, I like the break right, Like I mean, what does Tim Cook know about my family? I don't know exactly. So you know it's Apple is uh you know, they're going all in on their services business and uh, you know, so we're seeing Apple TV, we're seeing Apple gaming. I know you're gonna be gaming, you're away on your Apple device

coming out about what's it called arcade or something. I think, so, yeah, we'll have to get Matt cantriment on it kind of explain it to us. But uh, you know, they're getting into just it's not about devices for them. It's obviously about trying to drive the services on the devices. And they've got over a couple, you know, over a billion of them out there so certainly some some upside. Now

we will see. It's been an extraordinary to you. Thank you to Colin Tipton and all our team, particularly our team in Frankfurt, Germany, h Matt Miller and of course all of Bloomberg Economics in Europe for just extraordinary team coverage of what we saw on the ECB. Mr Drag

He did not disappoint. It was wild there. At one point markets of vs back a little bit, I want to make that clear, the euro stronger on the headlines, and then dropped like a rock almost down I believe to where we were into day Low's earlier in the month, and we've come back nicely. Now you're a dollar one tenth or D three sort of a side of relief is to me. The headline is uh not q E out to one, but it's very urst language for as long as it takes. Thanks for listening to the Bloomberg

Surveillance podcast. Subscribe and listen to interviews on Apple Podcasts, SoundCloud, or whichever podcast platform you prefer. I'm on Twitter at Tom Keane Before the podcast, you can always catch us worldwide. I'm Bloomberg Radio