Unions are about to see a change in their fortunes. The Obama administration has increased the leverage of unions and the protection of workers. President Obama has often touted the benefits of labor unions and said, thanks to their efforts, many Americans can now depend on a forty yarrow work week, overtime pay, and a minimum wage. All of that progress is stamped with the union label. All of that progress was fueled with a simple belief that our economy works
better when it works for everybody. And during Obama's second term, the National Labor Relations Board has overturned precedents and issue decisions opposing class action waivers and employment arbitration, increasing corporate responsibilities for contractors and franchisees, getting graduate students the right to unionize, among other things. But a rollback of those
rights is likely under President elect Trump. The NLRB now has a two to one Democratic majority, with two empty seats when Trump feels those Republicans will control the board. Our guests are Paul seconda professor at Marquette University Law School, and Bloomberg b An, a senior legal editor Larry Dubai. Paul experts are predicting that a Republican controlled an l r B will be rolling back Obama's labor initiatives. Do you agree, and if so, what will be at the
top of their lists of targets? Hi June, Yeah, I do agree. I do think that eventually, although there might be some delays with the nomination process because obviously the Democrats have to um confirm the appointments, there all eventually will be three Republicans and do democrats. That's what you have in a Republican administration, and historically there's been a pendulum shift back and forth. This might be something that
people who are listening don't understand. But unlike courts, which rely on precedent, the National Labor Relations Board has more flexibility in changing labor relations law, and so I think at the top of the agenda you might see a pushback against graduate student unions. Uh. They just recently gave graduate students the right to unionize in the Columbia University case. Uh. You might see it harder to set up so called
micro union small unions under the specialty healthcare case. UH. And you also might see, uh it harder to allege joint employer stats, which of course has been a big topic under under the Browning Ferris case. Larry It's Gregg store. How much do we know or think we know about what Donald Trump thinks of the n l r B. On one hand, as a businessman, he's been uh, you know, on the other side from the n l r B
and the other side from unions. On the other hand, he has at least some points in the campaign called for an increase in the minimum wage. What what do we think? Very little about labor management relations and virtually nothing about the n l r B. So it is a little hard to tell where he'll be coming from
in uh in making nominations and appointments to the board. Uh. But you know, no matter how far he is to the right of center and selecting people to fill keep slots of the at the labor Board, there's clearly going to be a change, and some of it could come very quickly. Some of it may take a little longer to accomplish. Paul, how much was the system tilted in the favor of workers and unions during Obama's administration? And
what do you think about a reversal slow or fast? Well, I don't think it was tilted in favor of workers at all. I mean, you're talking about a situation where in the private sector, which is the only thing that the LRB deals with, you only have six point seven percent unionization, which is minuscule to historical levels of thirty
or thirty five percent. So I think what you all during the Obama board, which went from two thousand and nine to now two thousand and sixteen, was kind of a pushback against the George W. Bush Board, which was very management friendly. So this is what I was saying before.
This is just gonna be the pendulum shifting back and making it harder for unions to organize to bargain first contracts, and probably more difficult for them to take what we call concerted action for mutual aid and protection to push
for their rights. I think that a lot of this, as Larry was saying, is going to take some time, because usually you need a management company to file some kind of unfair labor practice or respond to an unfavor unfair labor practice by a union, and then that case has to work its way through various levels of the administrative process. You start with the administrative law judge, then it goes to the LRB. In Washington, d C. And then even then parties have the right to appeal those
decisions to the various appellate courts around the country. So this could be a fairly long process, one to even three years. Larry, this is Mike Best. The the General Council of the n l r B is also going to be leaving, and the president elect will get a chance to replace him. How significant is it to be able to put his own person in that position, Well,
that really is. It's a key slot in the agency, and it is one that sometimes can move with more speed than the Board because the General Council has the authority to issue or not issue unfair labor practice cases in a variety of legal areas, and his decision not to issue a complaint is really unreviewable in the courts. So there's a lot of power in that job, and he could make changes much more rapidly than the Board
could uh in a number of areas. For example, one of the most I think disliked board actions the last few years was the adoption of a rule that changed the procedure in union election cases. Whether that's really had an effect on employers and unions is still being debated. But it's really put a lot of pressure and employers to do things much more quickly in responding the union organizing campaigns that was adopted through rulemaking. It will take a long time to unwind it. But the General Council
does have the authority and the responsibility to guide regional offices. Paul, we have about thirty seconds here. What about rules like the new overtime rule that's set to double the salary threshold. That can those be easily overturned by Trump administration? Well? No, First of all, they don't come under the National Labor Relations Board. They come under the Fair Labor Standards Act. So that's the wage in our division of the Artment
of Labor. And the problem for the Congressional Republicans is that the Congressional Review Act, which would have allowed them to overturn it with Trump's help, has run out basically now, so they're going to have to pass legislation potentially or new regulations, which is Larry points out, takes a long time for for notice and common regulations to go through. I would expect to compromise as instead of a complete
repeal on the overtime regulation. Thank you both. That's Paul Secunda, professor at Marquette University Law School, and Bloomberg by an A senior legal editor Larry Dubai coming up on Bloomberg Law. Trump is set to appoint the ninth Supreme Court justice, which will restore the court's conservative majority. How much of a threat will that be to public sector unions? This is Bloomberg