Rosenstein Says Probe is not a 'Fishing Expedition" (Audio)

the way. But Rosenstein wouldn't confirm reports that a grand jury had been impaneled, and he said the use of a grand jury wouldn't say anything about the likelihood of indictments. It's an appropriate way to gather documents. Sometimes you bring witnesses in to make sure that you get their full testimony. It's just a tool that we use like any other

tool in the course of our investigations. With me to talk about the latest developments in the investigation into Russian meddling in the two thousand sixteen election is William Banks. He's the director of the Institute for National Security and Countered Heroism at Syracuse University College of Law. Bill thanks for joining me um. Is a grand jury, is a convening of a grand jury as routine as Rod Rosenstein seemed to suggest in that in that clip, Well, I

think it is. It is routine in major criminal investigations, and to that extent, the Rosenstein's right on the mark, not to to suggest that it doesn't necessarily indicate the indictments or imminent or that there's been a major breakthrough.

On the other hand, uh, Mr Mohler's office would not have convened a grand jury if they had nothing so far, so that it does suggest that there's a need for the mechanism of a grand jury to help them collect evidence and to document materials that they have going forward, perhaps to utilize their subpoena power. And the fact that the grand jury was reported late convened here in Washington, is that also routine? It drew some some criticism from

the President on Twitter over the weekend. Well, I think it's it's just efficient to the Mueller's offices in the district. That's just a few blocks, I believe from where the grand jury would be contined. He's got a sizeable staff of lawyers and investigators, so it's simply a better way or less costly and more time efficient way to get

their work done. So I want to ask you about something else that came up in the Rosinstein interview on Sunday, which is the scope of Mueller's powers and the appointment order. Uh So, the appointment order says that he can investigate any links and coordination between the Russian government and people associated with the Donald Trump campaign. Um, and in addition, can look into any matters that arose or may arise directly from the investigation. Um. What is that last phrase?

Directly from the investigator shouldn't mean what? What can Mueller look at without having to go to Rod Rosenstein for additional authority? Well, I think it's a very broad grant of discretion. It's the kind that you would expect an independent councilor special prosecutor to have because you simply can't know at the time that the original instruction is given where the investigation will lead. So I think indeed Mueller's

team has the authority to go far we have. You know, one of the things that we have to continue to remind ourselves is that this investigation was ultimately about Russian meddling in the US elections. So we start from that and remind ourselves that things that are pertinent to the Russian meddling are pertinent to the investigation. And then for those who might have been involved or somehow connected uh with the investor with the Russian meddling, then anything from

those tax I think is fair game. So it's pretty broad, and you know, we we can't predict exactly the far corners of the description that Mr. Mueller's team might have. If well, let me ask you about there have been reports of the past several weeks about mall are looking into some of the business dealings of people like Jared Kushner,

the president's son in law. Is it clear to you that those are within the scope of his his power, Well, they are within the scope of his power if they connect in any way the investigation of the Russian tampering

of the of the election. So if you know, it's been reported that the former National Security Advisor Flynn received compensation from Russian entities as well as Turkish entities during the period that's under investigation, and so that's certainly within the scope of the Mueller team's authority to look at. And if other members of the of the staff, the campaign or those connected to them more similarly compensated. If there's a money trail there, it's it's important for the

Mueller group to find out where it leads. So Donald Trump, in his speech on Thursday, also reiterated his view that prosecutors should be investigating Hillary Clinton's emails. Uh Rod Rosenstein on Sunday said he didn't view what the President said publicly as an order to the Justice Department, and he added that Donald Trump hasn't directed the investigation of any particular people by the Justice Department. What does all that tell you about the relationship between the White House and

the Justice Departments when it comes to this investigation. I think that's a it's a very disturbing trend for the President to uh turn the relationship between the presidency and the Justice Department into a sort of adversarial relationship based on on political point of you. The Justice Department is charged with enforcing the law. It's that simple, and they shouldn't be influenced to do so in a certain way

by the President or anyone else. I think the Department has done an admirable job so far of resisting any pressures in that direction, whether they would come from the President, or from Congress, or for anyone else who might attempt to exercise that influence. I'm curious. I want to ask almost a pr question, what does Rod Rosenstein gain from from going on the Sunday talk shows like he did this weekend. Is there a message that that he was trying to send and and and do you think he

sent it? Well? I think he was doing what Mr Comey was doing early on before he was a puplic fired by the President. He's trying to remind all of us, the press, to begin with that the American people and members of Congress, that the Justice Department is is an a political institution that is charged with enforcing the law, and any attempt to interfer to direct the direction of their investigation is improper. I want to thank our guests.

That's William Banks. He is the director of the Institute for a National Security and counter Terrorism talking about the

Russia investigation by Special Counsel Robert Mueller. UH Deputy Training General Rod Rosenstein was on Fox News Sunday this weekend, declaring that it is no fishing expedition and also saying that he has not received any orders from President Trump in terms of any particular course the investigation should take, in including his his suggestion that the Justice Department should be investigating Hillary Clinton's emails. That's it for this edition

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