Wealthy Endowments Should Subsidize Education: Ken Langone

I'm talking about Ken Langone, co founder of home Depot and former director of the New York Stock Exchange UH and founder and chairman of Infamed Associates. Keim. Thank you so much for being with us. You have a new book out. It has an unambiguous title, I Love Capitalism, exclamation point and American Story. What made you write this book? Now? It was very interesting. I've been approached by some people in the publishing industry about three or four years ago.

I had a book to write, and I thanked him and I said, really, not my thing. And then the presidential election showed up in two thousand and sixteen, and I happened to be watching Bernie Sanders, and I was shocked at the number of young people that were passionately and enthusiastically following his message. And it's scared the hell out of me, because if people that young give up on what brought us to the party and what made

America great, we really have trouble. Uh. Capitalism to me is as magnifficent, very unique engine that only America has in where we have it and the results that are all around us, you can look and see better lives. A poor kid like me, a kid that mediocre student. Uh mother and father didn't go past the eighth grade, lived from paycheck to paycheck. Uh not easy, but I never knew I didn't have anything because I always had a warm house and uh plenty of good food. But

my parents had to work like hell. And here I am today, and by the way, whatever success I have, and I'll leave it for others to judge that it only happened because I had so many people, so many many people helped me along the way. I'm not self made. I'm anything but self made. But this is a magnificent country. And I just thought it was up to me to take a stand and say, hey, wait a minute. Let's

not kill the baby with the bath water. Let's that's where the baby out with the bath water, I should say. So that's what made me write the book. Ken lang Gone, Just so people understand, you persuaded Ross Perro to hire you to lead his initial public offering for electronic Data Systems co founder of home Depot. I wonder if you could just speak a little bit about that June day

in ninety seven when you graduated from Bucknell. And there's a wonderful picture in the book of you and your parents, John and Angie Langne, and how you got into Bucknell and how you managed to graduate. Well, that's interesting. I got into buck Now almost by accident. I had gone up. I was a senior in high school. It was nineteen fifty three. It was the spring of the year. The Korean War was still on. I don't know how. Had just been elected. I was going to join the Marine

Corps here for high school. My mother wouldn't saw it. I wouldn't be eighteen until September, and my mother wouldn't My brother was already in the military. I only had one brother. He was in the military, and my mother was adamant. She was not going to sign me and if I wanted to wait to lateeen and I wanted to go, she couldn't join me about it. But anyway, I want to Bucknell for a weekend to visit some ends.

And it turns out it was we then called house party weekend, and boy, I had a hell of a time. And I thought, my god, if this is what they do in college, and I might want to think about college,

and and on. And Eisenhower didn't cooperate because he ended the Korean War, so there was no water go up for and while the weekend I was up at buck Now the kids I was seeing the but I used to have Saturday classes, and the kids I was here to see told me to go see the gold and the building up as a guy there registrar, he wasn't called at Deana, it's called the Registrar's name was George Faint. And I went over and I saw him. Any what are you doing you? And I was all My friends

said I should come and talk to you. What about I I don't know, Well, tell me about yourself. I was long, I'm in high school and what are you going to do? I don't know. I'm thinking about going to the Marine Corps. Will I have you applied to college? And I said no, Well you want to go to college? I said, well, I'm not sure. I thought we had. We ended up having a talk for about an hour. The following week, he sent me a letter and he said, if you want to come to buck now, we'd love

to have you. But you're gonna have to work much harder in college. And you did in high school. Well that wasn't hard because I didn't do it. Damn practically nothing in high school. But thank god I had a good mind. I just didn't put it to much use. And so I ended up going to buck Bell and I almost flunked out stories in the book, And but for a professor who saw something to me, I didn't

see it myself. He he got all my other professors together and they worked to pull me out of this nose dive, and I ended up graduating from Buckdell and Free are years. I actually graduated in February fifty seven, but the ceremony was in June, and I wanted my parents to see the graduation. And that's when I went back for the graduation, and that's where that picture came from. So it was my parents. My parents just couldn't believe they had a son who went to college, graduating college.

It was, it was, it was, it was. It was just special. That's why I sorry. I'm sorry. I'm bringing up ken Um. You have an amazing story and it's a fabulous book. Everybody should read it. I'm wondering, you know, I want to talk about what you were saying when you said, you know, you saw Britie Sanders and people

who are kind of challenging the American capitalistic dream. And I'm wondering whether you think anything has changed at a time when there's one and a half trillion dollars of student debt hanging out there and uh and sort of the gap between wealthy and poor people has widened. Let me show you how much I'm committed to the problem. I'm shaman of the n Y you laying own health. The Dean and CEO Bob Grossman, and I have one

remaining major passion. We want to tell every kid that comes to our medical school they will no longer pay tuition. That will only happen if we can get wealthy people to con tribute to our endowment. That we can afford to do that now about the trillion dollar, trillion and a half dollars of debt. Number one, my father insisted. My father was a plumber. But while I was in high school, my father insisted I helped him so that

when I got out of college high school. When I got out of high school, I didn't go to college. I'd have a trade a plumber. A lot of kids that are going to college today and and burdening themselves with debt would be better served learning a trade, learning a skill. We have an incredible shortage in this city of plumbers, carpenters, electricians, and they have great They are hundred thousand, hundred thousand dollars a year jobs. These are

not low paying jobs. First of all, let's start with the belief that college isn't for everybody, and you don't have to go to college to be successful. Many of the people I know I never saw the inside of a college, and they were enormously successful. So I think we need to take a step back and ask ourselves the question, is this the magic pill? No, I don't think it is. But if it is, let's figure a

way out to make it affordable for kids. And I don't know the answer to that, except I do know that the more money that you raised philanthropically, like Buck Noll, like New York University, or I was in a finance committee of the university last week. The more endowment we can generate, the more income we have that we can offer more student subsidization of their courts. There's no easy answer, ken Lan gone, would you say that one of the magic pills for your life has been your wife? Elaine?

Oh boy and half, big time, big time talk about being us. How big this she is? I'm telling you right now, big time. Every crazy idea I had, she was always here, you know. And when they didn't work, she was there. And when they did work, she was there. You know. She's she's my anchor to Winwood. Absolutely. Hey. Look, and by the way, every marriage has bumps on the road, but that's part of living. Every life has bumps on the road. And and and where where? How we how

do we live? We'd blow to sit down on a Sunday and rainy afternoon like it was this past weekend and watch a movie. Simple stuff. Anybody can do it, um can I just I want to? I want to end on a slightly different note. I know that you interest in Palenteer, a company that Peter Thiel founded, and there's been some discussion that it could potentially be heard by the sort of resumption of her Rand's sanctions. What's your take on this and do you think it will

affect the valuations there? I don't, frankly understand. It's a complicated situation where I ran, I know this much about Palenteer and why I'm excited about it. I know that American lives I've been saved by Palenteer. That's a dramatic statement. I know that American lives have been saved by what Palenteer does. I know that terrorist attacks in America have been stopped before they happened because of Palenteer. And I'm

I'm a proud investor in Palenteer. If I didn't make any money you a Palenteer, I'd be fine because what they're doing to me is an enormous social good. I am a devoted believer in what Palenteer does. I think it's a social good. We gotta leave it there. Ken lang Gone the co founder of the Home Depot, and his new book is entitled I Love Capitalism, an American Story.

Thank you very much, Ken, langgoing. President Trump has said the US is going to withdraw from the Iran Nuclear Agreement, and after that announcement, we're getting worried today that sanctions are being imposed on a governor of the Central Bank of Iran for his role moving quote millions of dollars to Hezbollah on behalf of Islamic Revolutionary God Corpse Force.

This according to the Treasury Department. Joining US now to talk a little bit more about what else we can expect in the wake of this decision by President Trump is Daniel Weger, vice president in the Global Financial Crime Compliance division at Lexus Nexus Risk Solutions, a part of the ri l X Group based in New York. Daniel, thank you so much for joining us UM. You have extensive experience working with government agencies with these matters. How much do you think that we're going to see these

types of headlines coming out? I mean, are there gonna be quite a few additional sanctions revealed in the next couple of weeks. Thank you for having me this morning. I think it's going to be a constantly changing environment over the next several months, not only as the Treasury um imposes UM numerals and regulations, but also as they reinstate old licenses UM sunsets and existing licenses UM for companies that have engaged with Iran. So it will be

a constantly changing environment. Well, Daniel. Over the weekend, I believe the chief executive A Seaman, said that his company could not do any new business in Iran after the United States decided to pull out of this deal. And indeed there are about forty billion dollars worth of aircraft deals for new planes from Boeing as well as air Bus. Uh. Do you believe that that that will remain something in place?

So the Treasury is going to have to examine request from companies on an individual basis for licenses and exceptions UM. There's also a wind down period place that runs for the next several months for companies to wind down existing engagements and transactions. But it's certain that to many of those deals and any deals that are inflighting enough finalized could be in jeopardy. Daniel. I'm struck by what you said that the environment is going to be constantly changing.

So how do companies make sure that they actually comply with all of the new sanctions. It's an excellent question. The companies like lectus Nectus resolutions focus on providing companies with data from government lists as well as information on companies and entities throughout the globe to help companies identify customers, counterparties, supply chain entities that could bring them risk by way

of having transactions themselves with irany entities. Now, if you're a non US company but the product that you sell has ten percent or more of US originating parts, you'd be covered by these new sanctions correct um. It's difficult to make a single rule on that because there are

two aspects and two issues of play here. One is the sanctions aspect, which prohibits broadly prohibits transactions services are goods to be transferred to listed and named entities, But there's also issues around the commodities involved so UM components of the goods UM goods that are dual use UM or armaments or could be used in such products are subject to additional restrictions. So for companies UH. Fortunately, most have complex structures in place to abide by these rules.

But it is a multi layered set of rules that intertwined with each other and create a great deal of confusion for companies that are operating that space. What are you saying in terms of the oil industry and companies that have longstanding agreements in the region to provide oil

field services, what is their situation going to be like? Well, it would be good to delineate between US companies and those that are global UM but which have a presence UM either through trading on US exchanges or the sale of US goods or as you mentioned before, the use of component US goods, because the implications for both will

be somewhat differ for US companies UM. This period of relaxed Iranian sanctions has not actually given much relief to US persons or entities to engage in transactions with Iran, so for them it will be somewhat less complicated. But as you go down the supply chain, as you deal with transactional counterparties for financial institutions, UM, global institutions and global companies have been engaging in that space and can bring risk UM either for themselves or for their US

company counterparties in such transactions. So, Daniel, I want to shift gears a little bit to tap into your vast knowledge after having worked at the U S Department of Homeland Security, US Custom Service, that's just a part of the Department of Treasury and the New York High Intensity Financial Crime Area. I want to talk about something happening domestically, namely Michael Cohen and the financial records that have been

widely reported about Essential Consultants, his shell company. And some people are saying that the revelation of some of this information is illegal because banks are not allowed to share

this information publicly. What's your take on this? So, the Bank Secrecy Act and other related and implementing regulations provide for requirements for US financial institutions and other regulated entities such as payment processors and money services businesses, casino, etcetera, to provide reports to the Treasury, specifically to FINCE in the Financial Crimes Enforcement Network part of the Treasury um highlighting what they believe to be suspicious or potentially suspicious

activity by customers. And that information has afforded a great deal of secrecy, both to protect the privacy uh and the rights of the person or the entity which is being referred on the basis of mere suspicion, but also to protect the banks and to encourage them to continue to file such reports. And it's important to note that such reports do not. They're not referenced in court filings,

they're not designed to being. In fact, they're they're restricted from being a referenced It's incumbent upon investigators to review them as lead material, to analyze financial records more holistically, and then to present an analysis the activity in accordance with judicial standards. Does the role of the US dollar as the world's reserve currency, does it make it easier for US regulators and investigators to actually track that kind

of misuse of funds. That's a great point. The the US dollar, because of its pre eminence nets space, does provide an avenue for enforcement and prosecution that has a very global reach. And US enforcement and regulatory agencies have shown a strong desire through their billions of dollars in enforcement penalties and fines that have been levied against corporations

and banks. So, just to just to wrap up here, as we hear all about some of these payments and such, what's your big takeaway of some of the suspicious of activity around the election? Well, um representing specifically focus on

the financials um the reference of shell companies. All of these things by them selves are are simply suspicion or potentially suspicious and things like shell companies are simply a flag that require companies and financial institutions to dive deeper to engage and enhance due diligence, to understand the people behind those entities, the purpose of payment um and it's really important that companies, both corporate who operate in the

global marketplace as well as banks understand their obligations and their tremendous exposure UH to enforcement activities if they don't exert the right amount of effort on such compliance programs. I want to thank you very much for joining us. Daniel Wager is a vice president Global financial Crime Compliance for Lexus Nexus Risk Solutions, a part of the r

E l X Group. Talking about Iran and U S sanctions, the approaching legalization of cannabis around the United States and in Canada, of course, could it be igniting a variety of deals. Well, in many cases it already has done so. Ken Shay is our senior analyst for Global Food, Beverages and Tobacco for Bloomberg Intelligence, and he joins US now. Ken, thanks very much for being with us. Okay, so the caveat is you're not an expert in the Canadian cannabis market.

But you know about what happens when a market is open for business and you see the seeds pun intended of consolidation. Tell us about your outlook and about the industry.

Oh yeah, sure thing him could be with you today, Yes, you know, I look at this industry from a consumer products lends an industry that I've been covering for a while now, and the idea is that, like in the US, Canada, I believe that the growth in the cannabis industry is presenting a significant threat but also opportunity for a lot

of those companies. What we've seen all the last year or so, particularly in Canada is the excitement of the markets with regard to the pending legalization national legalization of both medical and recreational usage, and that's really creating a lot of change in the market over there right now. You know, I was struck by the volume of pot headlines yesterday. I mean really it was just like fast and furious. We saw the consolidation of Canadian companies Aurora

Cannabis and med Relief. Also, though we saw one of the errors of the jim Bean Whiskey bourbon empire um coming out and saying he thinks that marijuana is the looker industry in the nineteen twenties. What's your take on this? I mean, do you feel like things are sort of escalating at this point? I really do, and high Lisa, Yes, I do, Um, And you know, I think what really

drives that home is really I asked you, I guess. Uh. The beer spirits and wine Giant Consolation Brands went on board a nine point nine perus an equity stake in Cannapa Growth, one of the leading UH growers of cannabis and Canada. And I believe, just like our friends over a gym being, believe that there really is going to be a substitute effect um between cannabis and alcoholic beverage. I mean, if you think about it, it's a mood altar, right, I mean, and I think a lot of the usage

recreationally will be looked that way. And that's just not Pine in the sky. I mean, that's what Constellation has said, and most in Chorus has suggested that's looking at cannabis as a uh you know, as a potential opportunity. And so I think, to um, the big answer here is that I think the next big wave of mergers and acquisitions,

particularly in Canada. You know the growers now, but I think the second wave will be the big consumer package goods companies again has the bushes of the world the most in cores, the Diaggio's that take a look at what Consolation did and maybe pursue the same strategy. Can do you believe that there will be a time when a company such as Altair or Philip Morris will be

in this business? Yes, I do, pim Um. You know, we learned back in the late seventies when upon discovery of a lot of internal documents, we know that tobacco companies were very interested in pursuing the marijuana markets. As we know now, it didn't become legally at illegal at the federal level back then, so it couldn't. But we believe,

uh that they are looking at very closely. As a matter of fact, Um, but one of the largest tobacco leaf suppliers to the big tobacco companies, Alliance One, already owns a Canadian uh cannabis grower and so if you think about it, what that means is that a significant supplier of tobacco leaf to the big tobacco companies like Philip Morris International and British American Tobacco is also capable of supplying them marijuana leaf if it needs to. So yeah,

I think they are definitely looking at it. Ken, I'm sure you're aware of the increase in the popularity of vaping and the popularity of a company Jewel and its product. Do you believe that they're going to be patent wars over the exclusivity of the technology that allows for those

kinds of devices. Yes, I think there'll be some activity there, But you know, one of those, a hugely successful product like Jewel is threatening the status quo in this case the big not only the big vapor products of the big tobacco companies, both of the cigarette market in itself.

I think you will see some challenges. That said, I mean, Altaria's Newmark subsidiary is coming out with a product that is very much like Jewel, um, you know, a non refillable vaporizer as they call it, and um, you know, so I think they're gonna I think most of that will be in the marketplace, but you know, as it gets closer and closer to what Jewel is, perhaps there could be some intellectual property. Um discussions. So, Ken, where

are we with respect to US legislation and legalization of marijuana. Well, in the US, it's really hung up at the federal level. As you may know, some twenty nine states have already um legalized it for medical use and an additional eight for recreational use, and that number just keeps on growing um and but nevertheless, you know, without federal without a federal mandate, it really is difficult for these operators to grow UM. And what I mean is because for instance,

you can't um because it's a federal illegal product. You can't bring cannabis products over state lines. When you, you you know, generate income, you're not allowed on your taxes to deduct normal operating expenses. So it's very difficult to make money in the in the US in this business today. That said, capital is still there for the companies that are in the business, the thought being at some point enough public

support will force the hand at the federal level. So, just given where we are today, do you know any estimates for what the medical marijuana industry is worth, and do you then have some kind of sense of what it would be worth if you also have recreational use thrown in? Well, both recreation and medical in the US is an approxly five or six billion dollar business UM.

The majority of that is still medical UM. And in terms of what it's worth, that's a good question because there's a lot of capital institutional money on the sidelines wants to invest in this business but just can't because it's again it's illegal at the federal level, and there's a lot of structural issues why they can't. But you know,

I think the industry was really wanted to push it along. Uh. What I think what they ought to consider is because the public support for the non th C cannabi oil basically the extract from the cannabis plant can be applied to so many positive uses, pain relief, glaucoma, etcetera, etcetera, UM, that they ought to consider pushing that at the federal acceptance level, illegalization level, and worry about the recreational side

down the road. I mean, you know, there's a lot of there's a lot of opponents to recreational still, you know, mothers again, drunk driving and so on, and someone there's a lot of concerns that you know, um, more easier access you know to this drug will could could lead to some negative consequences. So what I'm saying is to

find out what this total market is worth. The easiest way to do that is to kind of delineate between the non t C S CBD oil opportunity, which I think is huge, and the recreational side down the road. Thank you so much for being with us. I'm sure you're talking with you soon, based on the accelerating volume of marijuana stories that we've been seeing these days. Ken Shay, senior analyst covering the global food, beverages and tobacco industries

for Bloomberg Intelligence. Berkshire Hathaway Vice Chairman Charlie Mongers said bitcoin is worthless artificial gold. He said, the fact that it's clever computer science doesn't mean it should be widely used, and that respectable people should encourage other people to speculate on it. Well, that has not stopped more than people

from attending Coin Desks Consensus conference all about cryptocurrencies. They paid at least two thousand dollars a ticket to attend the three day conference and joining us now as one of the speakers and attendees to Bermuda Premier David Burke Premier birth Thank you very much, for being with us and UM. I want to just offer you the opportunity to talk about the criticism having to do with cryptocurrencies.

And as much as I believe Bermuda is leading the charge in terms of legislation regarding cryptocurrencies with the Digital Asset Business Act, what was your goal in putting that forward? Well, thank you him. I would say that there are a wide range of UH cryptocurrencies they're called UM and and that deal with lots of different things in the digital

asset space. What we want to make sure that we provide in Bermuda, and knowing that there's going to be innovation in this space, and knowing that this space UM is going to revolutionize the way that financial services UM are delivered throughout the world, we just want to make sure that companies that we build on our existing regulations that we've been so successful with an insurance and to make sure that we transfer those regulations to a digital

asset space so that players that are serious players that want to be in a well regular jurisdiction and abide within the law can be and can have a home in Bermuda. And you were just saying that Bermuda was the first to craft these crypto asset regulations in particular, and the goal here is for companies to incorporate and operate in Bermuda. How successful have you been so far in attracting crypto asset companies? Um? Well, this conference has

proven incredibly successful. UM. We had the speaking engagement yesterday and there were companies that were literally about to go somewhere else that are are reconsidering their view and coming to Bernuda. So one one pushback maybe people would say, is you know, maybe you craft regulations that are regulations, but perhaps aren't as strenuous as might be seen in a place like the United States. UM. What do you

say to that? UM? What I would say is that if you look at Bermuda's history, we've always been a place with excellent regulation. There's only two places that have regulatce worre equivalents with both EU UM and the United States, and that's Bermuda in Switzerland. We play UM in a different class in other countries when it comes to regulation, and we're going to lead the way. So our regulation is tough. How do you want to implement this new Digital Business Act? What is the I know that you're

looking at. I think Finance is one of the exchanges that has already said that they're interested in coming. They're going to come to Bermuda. What kind of infrastructure, legal infrastructure do you offer? UM, Well, Bermuda has been successful for a long time and UH servicing international companies. UH. The thing I said yesterday is that it takes longer to probably get to j f K than it does for the flight from JFK to Bermuda. But you can land in Bermuda in the You can leave New York

in the morning. You can land in Bermuda by noon. You can see. But what what what in the I guess what I want to understand is what in these draft regulations specifically would allow UH Internet coin offerings or digital currencies to operate in Bermuda. UM. The regulations basically

govern the entire suite of digital asset providers. So if you are someone who UM is an exchange, if you're someone who's a wallet provider, if you're someone who's a customer provider, or if you're someone in the business of issuing digital assets for others. It is an entire suite of regulations that is built on our money service business.

UM regulations and It flows from the way of which we've always regulated companies, requiring mind management and control in Bermuda, requiring a physical presence and making sure that the Bermuda Monetary authority has access to the people. But what we're also going to do is give the regulator a tie in, so it's required at any point in time there's any suspicious activity, the regulator can actually freeze assets which may

exist in the digital space. So I'm just wondering. I mean, we hear a lot of pain which is talking about Warren Buffets, colorful words about bitcoin. A lot of people are convinced that this is just a bunch of quacks who are trying to create something that will eve operating. Is the next Tulip boom um. What do you say to that? I mean, how much? What is the proportion of you know, quackery or I c o s that are essentially just fraud versus something real. I can't necessarily

speak to what is fraud. What I can speak to is the fact that there is real money that is going to this space. And you've seen real money coming in from Wall Street firms and otherwise investing in digital assets and investing in this But I just want to clarify here because there's a difference between uh bitcoin and blockchain. Where is the where is the opportunity here? Well, the opportunity is for people who are going to use blockchain

technology to build a digital asset business. So that doesn't mean that you have to rely on bitcoin or anything else you are looking at saying, we recognize that digital assets are going through the future. We're going to design innovative financial products, whether it's distributed energy, whether it's a distributed banking that is going to be more efficient in delivering services, and we want those companies to use Bermuda as the innovation hub where they can hast out those

products in our regulatory sandbox and scale them globally. Okay, So let's say that you are an investor who is intrigued with the notion of cryptocurrencies, and you go and you establish your own digital wallet, and you somehow managed to acquire a variety of digital currencies. Then one day you go and you can't get access to your wallet, or you find that the ledger that exists does not

match what you had the day before. Is there a regulatory regime in Bermuda that you can go to that will then investigate and if necessary, prosecute any problems related to that kind of situation. Absolutely, those are things which are spelled out inside of our Digital Asset Business Act, and we're going to require providers inside of the space to have the security measures in place which are necessary. But there's also problems that need to be solved in

this space. And one of the key points Pim is what you spoke about is custody. So the company that on Friday at the Ethereal conference announced they're moving to Bermuda, um Omega one is looking to solve that problem and to find a secure place to keep the keys because everything is race on who based on who holds the private key, So we need to make sure that we have a way to secure those private keys. And that's why we're going to innovate in Bermuda because there are

problems that have to be solved in this space. Why do you think other countries have been slow to adopt a regulatory framework for crypto assets? Well, what I would say is it's a question when you're talking about New York, sorry, if you're talking about the United States, you know you have the different states, you have the federal level, then you have the SEC, the c SEC all the rest. In Bermuda, we have one government, one regulator um and

so we can be a lot more swift. But the fact is that we are just building on what we've done already. So we've done this successfully already with insurance, we've done this successfully in the fund space, and now we're just moving the regulation of which we have that very high level regulation into a new area of financial services, which is digital assets. Thank you so much for being here.

Really fascinating to hear what you have to say. The R. David Burt, he is the Premier of the Bermuda government, joining us here in the eleven three oh studios. He was here for the Consensus eighteen conference that has been taking place starting Sunday in New York City. Yeah, the New York Hilton attendees. And the bitcoin right now is

down three to be exact. Yeah, it's interesting. There's a question right of how much sort of cryptocurrencies get conflated with bitcoin providers that are being used by the likes of HSBC to do trade finance. So definitely a fascinating conversation. Thanks for listening to the Bloomberg p m L podcast. You can subscribe and listen to interviews at Apple Podcasts, SoundCloud, or whatever podcast platform you prefer. I'm pim Fox. I'm on Twitter at pim Fox. I'm on Twitter at Lisa

Abramowits one before the podcast. You can always catch us worldwide on Bloomberg Radio pek