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Welcome to the Bloomberg Markets Podcast. I'm Paul Sweeney. Alongside my co host Matt Miller.
Every business day we bring you interviews from CEOs, market pros, and Bloomberg experts, along with essential market moven News.
Find the Bloomberg Markets Podcast called Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen to podcasts, and at Bloomberg dot com slash podcast. Let's go back out to the West Coast to San Francisco. Space Discuss is spinning off Starlink via IPO as soon as twenty twenty four. I don't know what's going on there, but Ed Ludlow does. He's the host of Bloomberg Technology. He's out there somewhere in California, I don't know where. Sometimes he's in the desert for these rocket launches.
Dude, as soon as late twenty twenty four, that's not soon at all, exactly.
I'm not putting that in mind.
As far away as late twenty twenty four, that's like one hundred years from now, exactly.
What's happening with our good friends at SpaceX.
Yeah, all good points and sources tell us that this IPO, which is a spin off as Starlink as a separate unit, could happen towards the end of twenty twenty four, the end of twenty twenty four. We have an election to bear that in mind, and if not twenty twenty four to twenty twenty five, And Matt, you're completely right, that
is distant. But this is highly anticipated, right, you know, given the recent news flow must confirming that Starlink, which is SpaceX's satellite consolation based internet service, has reached cash flow break even. That is what he has said pretty consistently over the years, would be the trigger to work towards a listing spinning off through a listing, and what my colleagues and I are reporting is that even though that is far away, they're taking really material steps towards
doing that. So, for example, one source told me that they're already shifting Starlink's assets, it's business assets, it's people, to a new wholly owned subsidiary to prepare it to be a sort of standalone unit ahead of an IPO.
The amazing thing to me, you write this in your story with Gillian Tan and a couple of other Bloomberg News reporters. They're expecting starlink to generate ten billion dollars in revenue next year, which eclipses that of the rocket launch business at SpaceX. So it's essentially a bigger It's essentially their core business at SpaceX, right, at least judging by.
Sales, exactly right, it's essentially their core business. So what we reported was that revenues due to significantly next year to around fifteen billion dollars.
This year, overall it will.
Be about nine billion dollars, with a pretty even split between Launch and Starlink, But next year Starlink will be the vast majority, more than ten billion.
Guys.
I just want to say for sheer transparency with the audience that as soon as we publish the story. Elon Musk responded to a user on X, the platform formerly known as Twitter, who had posted a screen grab of the story and image of it, and musk response was one single word, which was false.
So on the.
Face of it, Musk is denying the accuracy of our report. But I would also tell our audience this is not the first time Musk has replied or posted on x about something I've reported saying it's false that in the end is proved completely true by regulatory or legal filings or otherwise.
I mean, this sounds like a really you know, cool business, admirable business, you know, connecting parts of the world that you know can't get you know, I guess internet connectivity. Besides it, are their competitors to Starlink out there.
Well, the legacy into a space based internet company is like Viasat, for example, But they've just not been able to make this a business in the way or the speed that Stalink has. You remember, Paul, when I was in New York last week, we talked about Starlink's revenues and the reason that it's worth discussing and reporting the stepping stones towards an IPO is that this is the mainstay of SpaceX's future. Right, everyone kind of wants an
association or investment into an Elon Musk company. SpaceX is a private company, and although there is some liquidity in the trading of its shares on the secondaries market and from time to time a tender offer where employees can sell shares, there isn't really much opportunity to have ownership
of it. So there's a lot of interest here. But Starlink has been a game changer for people to access the Internet around the world where they otherwise have not been able to because of the satellite and ground receiver based technology.
Well, and a lot of people first heard about Starlink because of Russia's invasion of Ukraine, the Ukrainians using Starlink to defend themselves. There there is a competitor from Jeff Bezos, right, it can't pronounce it, but it's like Project.
Creeper Kuiper Kuiper.
Yeah, well, because it's kui.
Well exactly so, and what they're trying to do is the same thing. Jeff Bezos has a rocket company. It's called Blue Origin, but in the first instance, they're relying on United Launch Alliance to put and other carriers sort of legacy rocket companies to put Kuyper satellite constellations into space. They have a very small, like single digit number of early prototypes. But it's this idea that you know, you can.
Have whereas starlink has five thousand, right.
Ed exactly, And not only does Stalink have five thousand or in the thousands that you know, these are satellites which go in lower orbit, and from time to time they have to be decommissioned or they get broken. But the other success of SpaceX is that it kind of feeds itself, right. You and I cover so many launches so regularly, and SpaceX has a rocket launch company where it's able to put its own constellation or maintain its own constellation with constant launching. And so let's fast forward
just a little bit real quick. This Friday, we might see Starship attempt to second full launch. It's big, shiny, pointy rocket you may have seen. And the significance of that is not just that that technology has the long term goal.
Of getting humans to Mars.
I can hear Paul's eyes rolling and increasing, but actually, if they can get starship to be successful. It's the most powerful rocket ever designed and made. Then they can even ramp up Starlink even further and take that five thousand constellation to ten thousand, fifteen thousand, thirty thousand. And actually at Bloomberg Intelligence they've crunched numbers on that and it basically helps you dominate connectivity worldwide.
So to date ed has has Elon been funding SpaceX just out of his own pocket?
Well, I love that story.
You know, you guys have been at Bloomberg a long time right on the news side, and we historically have not covered private companies as closely as we cover public companies for obvious reasons. But the cap table SpaceX is fascinating. You have names like Fidelity and Sequoia on there. You have high networth individuals. You have Elon Musk and gwin Shotwell who Elon Musk being the CEO, gwinshot Well being
the president and CEO of that company. There have been tender offers again, that's where staff can sell their stock units that they receive as compensation to buyers on the secondary market for simply liquidity. But when that opportunity comes abound sort of traditional asset or investment managers, high networth individuals, even retail investors clamor to get a piece of that.
Partly because of what we've reported. There might be a Starlink IPO soon at the end of next year, but also you just want to own something because of elon musk track record. So the cat table is really interesting.
Yeah, there's a great new podcast, Elon Inc. Have you been listening to right now? That's from Bloomberg Business Week. Yeah, David Papadopolis. I never realized that he has such a good voice for radio. I mean I've heard him, you know, yammering at me in the newsroom and it's not the same. But Elon Inc. What a cool podcast, which covers obviously all of the you know, the whole empire. So starlink SpaceX boring Tesla Twitter, which some people insist on calling
X and it's it's such a cool, cool thing. So Starlink maybe at the end of next year, but we won't be able to get ahold of the launch business of SpaceX as a public company.
My understanding and the understanding of my colleagues who reported the stories is that once if Starlink spins off into a public company space X. The remainder, which is largely the launch business, remains a private company, you know, and the transaction, based on past precedent is, you know, every SpaceX shareholder of nottal record would receive receive an equivalent volume of Starlink shares. Obviously their value would be changed relative to whatever they held the private SpaceX stock at.
So that will be interesting. And just on that, there's only so much money you can make sending things into orbit, right, the per launch margin is much lower than the databased business.
So MOSCA said in the.
Past that it could cap out at like three billion dollars of sales a year. Actually i'd heard that this year it's more like four billion, four and a half billion. But it has a limit.
I know that because I read ed Ludlow's reporting do you look at you? And I watch and listened to him on Bloomberg radio and television.
SpaceX ways spinning off Starlink via IPO as soon as twenty twenty four, but following Bloomberg, ship work must called it. Quote Foss in a post on ex social media platform he owns without elaborating, ed, Ludlow, thanks so much. We appreciate it. Ed Ludlow, he's a host of Bloomberg Technology.
He's wired in.
You're listening to the team can'shur live program Bloomberg Markets weekdays at ten am Eastern on Bloomberg dot Com, the iHeartRadio app and the Bloomberg Business App, or listen on demand wherever you get your podcasts.
Jay Heffel joins us. He's a CEO, founder and portfolio manager of Infrastructural Capital Managers ADVISORCY joins us here live in the studio. He doesn't phone it in. Folks, Jay, there's no inflation out there. You've been saying this for a long time. Inflation has been coming down. CPI dated this week, PPI dated this week. That surprised you at all because it seems like some positive surprise for the market.
Thanks Paul and Matt. Well, we've been pretty public. We put out a piece on October thirty first, and we said this on National TV last week that this the CPI and PPI would print cool. But that's not because we speak to God or anything. It's simply that we focus on oil prices and energy prices as a leading indicator, and what's not appreciated even by our Federal Reserve, which is hard to believe, is there's a substantial bleed through of energy prices to core and we did see that.
If you think about it, there is no business in the United States it doesn't use energy, but some use a gigantic amount of energy. So food is forty percent energy airline fares, so you get both an immediate bleed throup to goin airline, our airline fares eventually to food. And so that's one reason we've been bullish and thought the rates were too high at five percent. We thought they'd come down to kind of this range and might stall out around here. But I would focus on energy.
And then also the other strange point about this report is we kind of already know next month's report, so you don't have TOPI yes, because what happened, which is pretty unusual, is that it was sort of like a bell went off the first day of October and gasoline latively dropped ten percent during the month.
YEP.
So guess what, Only five percent was reflected in October, and there's gonna be another five next month and we're already halfway through the month, so it's unlikely to skyrocket. And also retail is lagged.
And just to that point, the daily national average gasoline price regular unleaded three dollars and thirty four cents today. It was three dollars and ninety cents just back in mid septem.
Right, And we kind of know that that will decline for the rest of the month because what happens is when wholesale comes down, there's a lag because you have inventory in the channel. So the chances we kind of already know that we're going to have a cool CPI and PPI both headline and core for next month as well. So that's pretty bullish.
But now now the core is what really counts, right, because the energy price is really our transitory. The swings that we've seen just in the last year show you that I quote your CPI R index quite often, which is your own proprietary index. I find it on the infracap Funds dot com page, and it's come down substantially
compared to what the BLS gives us. Their core CPI right now is four spot one to three, right, and yours is, oh sorry, this is September, but it was four point one three and yours was one point three percent after having come down below one. Yours was also higher than the highest core CPI back in June of last year, so it was higher, it's been much lower. Do you think it's possible that inflation resurges again, Well, I.
Wouldn't totally ignore the energy price dynamic because that does feed through to the whole economy.
It has knock on effects.
And keep in mind that we have an eighty percent cost advantage on natural gas too, because we're the Saudi Arabia of natural gas and that affects electricity. So it is a long term bull factor that we have low energy prices in the US. But with regard to the potential for a resurgence, yes, the answer is there's a little bit of a sign of that, and that's why it's better to look at case Shiller than the ridiculous stuff that the BLS puts out. So we actually have
had like for instance, we just marked oart. We didn't update our website yet, but we just put out a lease yesterday that now our measures up to two. So because case Shiller is actually ticking up now, I would still see.
So it was one point three in September. In the month before that, it was like zero point eighty nine. Uh, and now it's at two, so your index is indeed coming back.
Up, right. So I mean, if the FED was ever looked at it, of course they might start to be worried, but they're worried about what it was like a year and a half ago. So but I would still say that the chances of rate skyrocketing with the FED having short term rates above five and mortgage rates almost almost a day eight percent, is pretty low. It's not impossible, but it's pretty low. So we're not really concerned about that.
We think it's kind of just normalizing. And also rents do matter, and there are a lot of apartments coming online in the next year, so the chances of a big resurgence in housing costs are pretty low. And then it's not really going to affect FED policy because it would take them eighteen months to figure out that it was actually happening.
So what are we doing here? I know you're still bullish on bonds here, So how are you guys kind of positioning yourselves these days?
Well, you know, we're we sort of are the self proclaimed preferred stock kings, so we love it is self proclaimed, by the way, but we'd love preferred stocks if you really look at it, particularly funds like ours have actually outperformed like almost all other fixed income so they have higher coupons, which means they have lower duration. You can look all this up in the terminal because duration is
kind of hard to calculate. And what also happens with preferreds a lot of retail investors sell them in downturns, so you can buy them well below par. And then the final thing is very unusual about the asset class. It has a lot of fixed to floating. So our fund's about over fifty percent fixed to floating. And why that's important is that all these rates were set when FED funds is at two. They're bumping up the five, so you're getting a three percent bump in a good
portion of it. So we would urge investors to take a look at that. You can buy funds like ours, or you can do it directly. If you do it directly, you might want to get a terminal though, beause it's pretty complicated.
You have to look up all the Yes, you should get a terminal.
Yeah.
Thanks.
You can use the infracap funds dot com website for your inflation data. Everything else on the Bloomberg terminal. Jay, we called you in here because the EU says that the Euro Area and its biggest economies are going to avoid a recession. You've been bearish on the European Union. What do you think is going to happen in that economy.
Well, we prefer real time data as opposed to like econometric models, and so if you follow the recent data, even this morning on eco Eurozone, there was a terrible industrial production report that came out forgot I think it's over down over one percent. But also you can access on the web the equivalent of the Atlanta GDP now and so the Eurozone GDP now is tracking at a
negative one point two percent annualized rate. And mean the quarters early on to be fair, but that was also you know, presaging that we would have a recession last quarter too, and then all that's just the individual data is terrible and there's no bowl case because we had
two rate increases last quarter. And keep in mind that forty five percent of mortgages are floating rate in Europe, so those those increases haven't even yet shown up in retail sales, so there's and they of course don't have the energy costs advantag They don't have any of the advantage of us. They don't have a shortge of housing, they don't have countercyclical infrastructure spending. Their natural gas prices are five times ours, so we have a big gun.
So they're really kind of a disaster in our data shows. And I wouldn't be too focused on your official forecast because they update them every y're a little bit like the BLS. They updated every six months, so it's you be.
The last industrial production in the Eurozone fell one point one percent. That was worse and expected. That data just out about ten hours ago, and industrial production year over year was down six point.
Nine per It's just awful.
It's very bad, all right, Jay, thanks so much for coming in again. Really appreciate taking a walk across town. Jay Hatfield, he's the CEO, he is the founder, and he's a portfolio manager of Infrastructure Capital Advisors. They like preferred stocks. You don't hear that too often.
That's pretty cool.
You're listening to the Take cans Our Live program Bloomberg Markets at ten am Eastern on Bloomberg Radio, the tune in app, Bloomberg dot Com, and the Bloomberg Business app. You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our flagship New York station, just say Alexa playing Bloomberg eleven thirty.
Check out our next guest right away, Chris Wellen. He's a chairman of Whalen Global Advisors. Chris, thanks so much for joining us via zoom here. I mean, you look at this market over the past couple of days, it's basically telling you inflation is whipped, we've seen peak rates. What do you take away from some of the data we've received over the past couple of days.
Well, the fact that we're looking at data of this maturity tells you something we should take us somewhat more nuanced approach. I think to rates because the volatility has been so enormous one way and another, and also the quality of you know, forward rates. For example, the thirty and sixty day rates in the mortgage market, which is the found of the treasury market, by the way, has
been all over the place. So today I would tell you the belly of the curve that contract closest to par is still a six and a half to a seven, So that means to make money they have to be writing seven and three quarter percent mortgages. If not eights, you know what I mean. So things have yet to settle down, even though we rallied a point and yield over the last what week. So the aspirational aspects of this I think cannot be dismissed.
So you've got to be writing higher rate mortgages. And how is the mortgage outlook right now, Chris, because the housing market seems to have ground to a halt, at least in terms of existing homes, which means probably very few people are going out and getting those mortgages.
Well, it's largely a cash buyer's market today. You're seeing compression above the meat, which is about four hundred and fifty thousand dollars. By the way, the average is three thirty. I think if you look at the mortgage bankers data, so you know, the way I would say it is, we were dragging the you'll curve up. So it's been very hard for lenders to make any premium when they sell their loans into the bond market, and that's changed a bit. You may also see some lenders have a
good quarter because of the rate rally we've seen. You know, we had a pretty decent quarter in the second quarter for a lot of publicly traded lenders as well. So when the sunshine they make hey, and I think, you know, we'll just have to see because the next auction we could be having a tough time and you could see rates back up again. So for you know, mortgage lenders, you lost a lot of money on your hedge, but you make a lot of money on the assets that you have.
By the way, the last auction or the auction last week that you know, kicked things off before Powell came out and confirmed what looked like a more hawkish bias, was that actually affected by the ICBC hack. That's what the early reports from the ft said. But I just don't get it.
I don't know if there's a connection here. I do know that some very smart people whom might have a lot of respect for that run banks, are extremely concerned about that hack, even though it was small, because it implies that they're not sufficiently vigilant in terms of operational risk. At the same time as you saw, I worry that Secretary Yellen was essentially backed off and forced to downsize the long bond auction because the dealers told her it wasn't going to get done. And you still had a
spike in rains, Matt, So that worries me. It reminds me of when I was a little younger and we used to worry about the Treasury auctions. We haven't had that worry at twenty years.
Yeah, but now it moves market, you know. Now you know we had we had a bad auction and three minutes later you saw the tail and the S and P five hundred sold off. It makes you think maybe yelling and whatever you call that Treasury committee had a point when they decided not to sell you know, one hundred year debt at zero interest.
No, they should have done it. Come on, you're a fund manager. It doesn't matter if you work with the Treasury or know. You obviously should have done that trade. You should have funded infrastructure when that trade was available. We didn't do it. We just spent the money. So I think there's always second guessing. But today I think Treasury is facing a lot of tactical challenges and that's just the reality, and it will affect stocks, no question. The banks are down. Are they cheap? I don't know?
That depends which bank, right exactly?
Hey, Chris, what we're not hearing about too much? Recently is the commercial real estate exposure for a lot of these banks. What's the latest on that.
Continues. You're not going to see most of it because it's private. This occurs behind closed doors with lawyers and these are professionals on both sides. But if you look at some of the specialty press, like The Real Deal, which I love, by the way, there's a lot of stuff going on. There are assets that are being marked down.
You're going to see a whole sale markedown of rent stabilized assets in New York after the FDIC is done selling the signature bank properties to rent controlled properties that frankly are unsaleable. But they're going to try. My fear, and I think a lot of people's fear, is that they're going to hit a very low bid to get out, because ultimately the receivership of the FDIC is not a long term investor. They're there to turn the assets in the cash and try and minimize loss. That's their mandate.
So you know, they have retained a majority stake in a lot of these buildings, Matt because nobody wants them given the political environment in New York. Well, I have been reading that in nineteen BNT control legislation has to be repealed or we're going to destroy rental assets in New York as an asset class because the banks can't fund them. They can't, I mean, and.
Residential doesn't even look nearly as bad as office, right, because you mentioned the real deal, and I've been reading well that website lately, realdeal dot com, because we had this guy in Igle Namdar, who I think maybe a I think it's fair to call him a billionaire, certainly when we last vetted his holdings he was in twenty twenty one. It's like he and a couple of other guys with whom he works are the only people buying office in New York. No one else is trying to catch these falling knives.
Well, you have to have a view of the real estate value that is to say, land, and then the asset that's on it, and whether or not it can be utilized in what's going to be a different business case. You know, I think a lot of people see New York going to a largely residential configuration. But I don't think you can pay for this city unless you have business as a partner. And that's what's going to change. We have got to stop attacking the business community because
they'll leak, and they did. But they went down south and built a lot of new buildings, and now we're overbuilt in Texas, We're overbuilt in some other markets. No, seriously, the herd left. They were told to leave, you know, by the Democrats of New York, and they did because the capital is mobile Miami, Matt you'd spent time down there, insane, and then look at around the region, look at the Canal Zone, look at some other cities in the region.
They're all getting buried in investment in commercial real estate, residential real estate.
I hope what happens in Miami stays in Miami, because I have spent some time.
Look at thee look at the Canal Zone, and Panama looks just like Miami, big empty buildings.
Yes, okay, Hey, you write a lot for the Institutional Risk Analyst, and one of your posts recently big whate rising debt service and following liquidity. You're writing about, you know, the mortgage and the lending business. But I'm thinking about the US and I wonder what is your take on the fact that we're going to have nine hundred billion dollars in interest rate servicing costs. Next year does that change?
Do you see rates coming down and that gets better or is that something that Washington can fix somehow.
Well, Washington has got to start reducing the deficit. I know that's not fashionable, but from a tactical perspective, just looking at the cash balances the Treasury has to maintain in order to move payments around, it's a problem. You know. The Fed collateralized is all of that, Matthew. They go out and buy bonds to collateralize the Treasury General account and that's a market moving event too. So the size of the Treasury is becoming an issue in the markets.
We're seeing crowding out come back as a novel concept right in economic thinking because it's so obvious. You know, luckily housing is down. The imagine if we were trying to finance four or five trillion dollars this year in housing at the same time Treasury was out raising all this money. We're going to do a trillion five this year? Nothing all right?
So Chris, I got to wrap you up there, unfortunately for time. But Chris Whalen love to get your insight on the industry. He is the institutional risk analyst and also chairman of Whalen Global Advisors.
You're listening to the tape can to our live program Bloomberg Markets weekdays at ten am Eastern on Bloomberg Radio, the tune in app, Bloomberg dot Com, and the Bloomberg Business App. You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our flagship New York station. Just say Alexa play Bloomberg eleven thirty.
The stock market likes biotech. Stock market likes AI. So how about an AI inspired biotech company? And how about an AI inspired biotech company that has a new shareholder disclosed just today? That would be Kathy Woods Arc Funds. You put it all together, Matt stocks up sixteen percent. We're talking about Recursion Pharmaceuticals as symbol as our x r X, and we just happened to have Tina Marriott Larson and president and CEO COO of Recursion Pharmaceuticals with us.
So that's that's a coincidence to serendipity. I guess I don't know which you want.
That's all it.
Face ripping rally, face ripping rally.
Tina, what what have you learned about your new shareholder today?
Well, thank you. I don't usually use the term face ripping, but I appreciate the introduction. Great to be here, Paul and that, and yeah, like like all of our shareholders, it's great to have these strategic, long term thinking shareholders that really share our vision for the future of where the biotech industry going, the tech industry is going, and really the opportunity to use technology to create the next generation of biopharmaceutical company.
So what kind of strides are you making Because you know, it's great to have a very famous and you know, followed shareholder. It's great to see your stock takeoff in double digit gains. But at the end of the day, I imagine your ultimate goal is I guess curing cancer, right. I see that you do a ton of oncology work in partnership with some of the biggest names in the business. So how is adding AI to the mix getting you closer to that goal?
Yeah? Absolutely, cancer is a big focus for us, and as you mentioned our partnerships, we recently announced an expansion of our long term partnership with Buyer. We're going to be working on up the seven new oncology programs with them, applying the latest and greatest version of our technology platform.
In October, we announced the first milestone and option from our partnership with Rosian Genetech, which was in oncology as well, and so we're definitely focused on oncology as well as other areas like neuroscience and once again with our partners at Genetech Roach. So we're really seeing great progress in implying these technology platforms, this emerging field of tech bio to really improve the outcomes in the way that we do R and D research to discover, well, what are.
The most important breakthroughs that you've made, or what are some breakthroughs that you're hoping to make? You know, this is what these are the moon shots that Wall Street bets on. What's yours?
Yeah, absolutely, and so we are industrializing drug discovery. So if you think about the way that many small biotech companies maybe they're looking for one or two drugs and very targeted areas of biology or very specific areas, say of cancer, we're actually looking across human biology. Our mission is decoding human biology to radically improve lives, and we're using the technology to do that. And so you see that we have bets in neuroscience. We have bets and oncology.
We have our own internal pipeline of molecules in things like rare disease and oncology, and we're actually going to see our first readouts. We're anticipating those next year for our internally developed drugs. But ultimately the goal is to scale and industrialize so that you know, in the same way that other industries have been disrupted by technology, so that we can bring better patients, better medicines to patients, faster and more cost effectively.
So specifically for your company, Recursion Pharmaceuticals, what do you guys do, What is your technology? How do you bring AI or just technology brolding tofine to the you know, the pharmaceutical in the biotech space.
Yeah, it really starts with data sets. And so I like to use the Google Maps analogy quite a bit. I'm old enough to have navigated around say Washington, DC using a Rand McNally atlas, and that was pretty hard and you know, at night after you'd like land there on a plane and so and what Google Maps revolutionized that part of our lives by both creating great data sets of the Earth of cities of maps and also creating the algorithms and computational technology in order to analyze
those large data sets. So the analogy to what Recursion is doing is that we are creating data sets. We have twenty petabytes of data, twenty five petabytes of data. Actually, it grows so fast that we have actually grown in house here in our laboratories. To the right of me, there's a whole bunch of robots doing science right now, creating these in house data sets, modeling the human body
right here in the laboratory. And then we add data sets like we recently announced that we have developed a partnership with Tempest, and they have real world data, so we have preferred access now to over twenty petabytes of data from one hundred thousand actual cancer patients and the outcomes of those patients have had out in the real world.
So we're constructing these very large data sets and then using tools like machine learning and artificial intelligence in order to use that model of biology to find new medicines for diseases that today are underserved or unserved and have been intractable previously for the industry to find pures.
It's hard for a normal person to know what a petabyte is, even even if you Google it, apparently it's a thousand terabytes.
I don't.
One of the one of the fun analogies we have used here is that every high definition film ever made is a few petabytes, and so we have far, far, far more data than every if you had you streamed every movie ever made in high definition. So these are very, very large.
Nice Paul is actually on a mission to do that right now, exactly streaming every single HD movie on the New Jersey Transit transit.
So, Tina, I mean like.
A thousand years, Paul, I know, I know, I had a long commute.
So Tina, talk to us. Is the biotech industry is it open to this type of technology coming into what had been historically, you know, just very I don't know, science y stuff.
Yeah, I think the openness is growing. You know my background, I spent decades ago at the revolution of biotechnology. I was at the Genetech, the company that led the biotech revolution of our industry when we hit an R and D. They're one of our biggest partners now and now being at this cutting this leading of the tech bio revolution, and even a few years ago when I joined our co founder and CEO, Chris Gibson Here at Recursion, there was still a lot of skepticism about how AI and
technology was going to change things. I think now that artificial intelligence has become so much more broadly impacting our lives, you know, across industries now that that kind of skepticism really has switched to curiosity. And I think now you see large pharmaceutical companies really trying to craft their AI strategies, getting really curious about how this is going to revolutionize
the companies. So I think we've kind of transited most of that skepticism as to if technology and computational technology revolutionizes the industry. And now the question is how.
Hey, Tina, really fascinating discussion. I really appreciated Tina. Marriotte Larsen, President and Coe of Recursion Pharmaceuticals. Ticker symbols our ex ore, ex'es, and Nastak traded stock. And it was just disclosed today that Kathy Woods our funds have acquired a stake in this company.
But our producer, Eric Molo booked Tina for the show before four. We knew that, and in fact he booked Chris the founder back in July. Wow, so he essentially beat Kathy Wood to it.
I know now that d he buy any stocked did mister mollel. I'm guessing the fact that he's still back there behind the other side of the glass, that the answer is no. But we appreciate the booking.
Nevertheless, thanks for listening to the Bloomberg Markets podcast. You can subscribe and listen to interviews at Apple Podcasts or whatever podcast platform you refer. I'm Matt Miller. I'm on Twitter at Matt Miller nineteen seventy three.
And I'm Faul Sweeney.
I'm on Twitter at pt Sweeney. Before the podcast, you can always catch us worldwide at Bloomberg Radio