Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news. You're listening to the Bloomberg Intelligence podcast. Catch us live weekdays at ten am Eastern on Apple, Coarclay, and Android Auto with the Bloomberg Business app. Listen on demand wherever you get your podcasts, or watch us live on YouTube.
JP Morgan planning step back to office five days.
A week in the brown.
New office building, Yes on Parka.
Exactly, waiting for this headline for four years.
Exactly right, so JP Morgan? And how quickly will the others follow?
Very quickly?
That's what I'm kind of thinking here.
Five days a week. But you have to have a question.
You have to wonder will there be some flexibility, Like if you're like, hey, I need to work at home a couple of days, Like.
Is that more genuinely accepted?
I think what it's going to be is you're going to be more willing to ask for it, and I think the manager will be more willing to give it. But it's like I need a day here, maybe two or three months later I need another day there, Whereas before maybe I wouldn't have asked for that flexibility, and as a manager, I may not have given that flexibility. Now, I think that flexibility is kind of there.
But now you get to work in the death store, though, which is what everybody seems.
It's calling it.
Oh that's funny, it looks it looks very cool. Let's say on All Street for a second. So the other news of the morning, one of the top read stories on the Bloomberg terminal is Bridgewater, that company cutting seven percent of a staff and efforts to remain nimble. Michael Moore, managing editor for Finance in The America's joins us. But hang on a second, J. P. Morgan five days a week, you're surprised, Uh.
No, not really. I mean the majority of their staff was already doing that, but this is the this would be the rest of the staff. So we've seen some firms move in that direction. Others, you know, have used the flexibility as a recruiting tool.
City.
Yeah, City has stuck with three days a week for a good portion of its staff. So I think we will see a difference among the firms. Some of the European firms have used it as a recruiting tool. So, but you know, Jamie Diamond has been very vocal about his views that you know, people work better in the office together, it helps develop talent. So you know, I think it will be kind of, you know, leader by leader, kind of setting the agenda.
I don't know. I mean, the fact is it does work from home, So that does work. Let's get people back, so we'll see how goes Bridge Rotter Associates huge hedge fund cutting staff. Is this just the normal culling of people or something different going on here?
Yeah, it's an unusual one for just for the reason that they are coming off their best year in many years for the Flagship Fund. You know, I think the new CEO is definitely trying to shake things up a little bit. He has, you know, replaced some of the top management. They've brought some people from the outside, which they had historically done under Ray Dalio. So I think this, you know that the stated goal here is there are some areas where they want to hire. They don't want
headcount to get too crazy. This kind of brings them back to where they were, you know, a little over a year ago in terms of headcount and allows them to kind of be a little more selective.
Did they over hire or something, or do they just want to like just move focus or something like that.
Yeah.
I think you know, you have seen them, you know, announced some you know, efforts on the AI front. They may want to do some more hiring there, but we have seen some of the hedge funds more broadly do some over hiring. You know, there has been a talent war, so this could be a bit of a correction there.
It's a unique place to work, isn't It's what's yeah, I've heard that. What makes it unique at Bridgewater.
Well, they have a you know, they have this you know, they've long had this culture of radical transparency, of being very blunt with each other. A lot of the senior people have been there since they were in their early twenties, have grown up there, haven't worked elsewhere, So there is a bit of an insular culture there. I think near Bardea, you know, has came in a little bit later in his career, so it brings a different perspective than Dalio,
who built this place, you know, around his principles. So I think you could see a bit of a relaxing of that culture while still you know, being kind of a unique beast out in Connecticut.
Going back to JP Morgan for a second, not about the five days, but JP Morgan. The latest bank to quit the Climate Finance Group is Fall City pauls Baba. How are we understanding it? Is this like a complete backlash against climate and DEI for example, or is this just sort of like we're going to move to the middle or we just rebranding it.
I think it's a bit of rebranding.
I think they were getting a lot of heat from some politicians over some of these pledges.
They wanted something with.
Pledges like we're not going to lend money to oil and gas kind of thing.
That's how they were perceived.
They weren't always written that way, but that's how they were perceived that. You know, they got the CEO's when they were in front of Congress a.
Little over a year ago.
Jd Vance made a big point on this. So I think they thought we can we can do this in ways of lending to renewable energy without taking such a public stance that will get us a lot of political backlash. So I think you'll still see efforts on this, but they won't be as grand as this climate pledge that they had all signed up to.
What is this?
I mean, the timing is not a coincidence. Time assuming given the new administration coming in. Is that how it's being read or is that are they saying anything about that the timing?
I think yeah, I don't think it's a coincidence. I think the political winds have shifted on this, and in general, I think there is you know, these always these pledges always kind of came with an understanding of, Okay, we need to help our oil and gas clients transition to this new world. So it's not going to be you know, cutting ties with the big oil companies. But I think they're being more cautious than that.
And it's not just you know, banks.
You should point at McDonald's today, the piece coming out saying that it's walking back its DEI goals, saying it's changing its approach to diversity, equity inclusion, no longer setting quote aspirational representation goals, instead focusing on embedding inclusion.
Practices into its daily business.
I don't know what that difference is, but that's why I wonder if it's just a rebrand like now you don't want to say ESG, but if you still have some sort of like net zero goals, maybe that terminology is more okay. It's just sort of a branding and moving away from something extreme.
Yeah.
I think it's not wanting to be seen as taking a political stance more taking a This is good for our risk perspective.
I feel like it's been you know, across the economy, maybe peak woke at some point or peak DEI whatever. The pendulum, as you say, yes, say the pendulum just swinging back a little bit. Sorry enough to stay on top of that. Michael Moore, thank you so much. We
appreciate that. Michael Moore as a managing editor for Finance in the America's Bloomberg News, joining us here in our Bloomberg Interactive Brokers studio looking at that story Bridgewater, big big hedge fund, cutting about seven percent of its workforce and an effort to remain quote nimble. So there you go.
Yeah.
And now it's also I think when you look at some of these hedge funds, you know they're starting. We've seen some hedge funds return capital to investors because they're just getting too big and they can't find the opportunities to invest the capital and generate their returns they want, so let's just give it back. And that's what we've seen in that. I think in a hedge fund business
over the last twenty years has been the funds. More and more money's going to fewer and fewer big funds, and they're just getting bigger, whether it's Point seventy two or Citadel or some of those types of.
People on flip side. Not every hedge fund is doing well. Hedge fund Derek Jupiter has suffered its worst ever losing. The street got a thirty two point seven percent decline last year. This follows a forty three point three percent plunge in twenty twenty three.
Yikes.
Assets at the firm has fallen to around eight hundred and eighteen million five years.
Two years ago it was five billion.
Yeah, that's not good.
You're listening to the Bloomberg Intelligence Podcast. Catch the program live weekdays at ten am Eastern on Applecarplay and Android Auto with the Bloomberg Business App. You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our flagship New York station. Just say Alexa Play Bloomberg eleven thirty.
The ISM Services Index data came out looks so better than expected, and we want to get right to that ISM data because that's something that's kind of moving the markets here.
Yields popped a little bit.
Higher here on the back of some of that economic data we got the ten year treasury Now I'll put about five bass points four point sixty seven on the news. Stocks pulled back, also sp down. Just Actually Steve Miller joints us he's the chairman at that's the Institute for Supply Management, Hasty, you've talked to us about this ism data. Alex and I are looking at this and looks really strong across the board. What are you seeing?
Yeah, same thing. You know.
What drove the increase this month was business activity and supplier deliveries kind of offsetting that a little bit. We're seeing a continued draw down in backlog of orders, but with a lower disruption and supply chains that we've seen in the month, it kind of makes sense.
Any of this related to the potential of tariffs coming on in twenty twenty five or twenty twenty six, Well.
Some of the inventory activity seems to be a result of concerns over tariffs. By far, the commentary that came through from the respondents was concerns over what tariff impacts might have and I think we saw some of that in the sentiment around pricings pricing.
We saw quite a lift month over month.
Im services prices paid came in well above the forecast, well above last period.
How do we interpret that?
Yeah, I would directly relate that to some of the pricing activity that's coming in for next year's contracts. There is risk management around tariff impacts, and we saw some of the commentary talking about price increases in anticipation of what impacts there might be from the terrace. And it was across almost it was fourteen of the eighteen industries had commentary around potential negative impact from terrace.
So is the could this be the peak then for services? Like how will that feed through?
Yeah?
I think that we'll see based on the supplier the supplier deliveries number impact, we'll see that drop down again in January, assuming there's no port strike, and that'll give a little bit negative pressure on the overall PMI. But this quarter is the strongest quarter we've had in a while, and I believe it since the beginning of twenty twenty three. I feel really strongly about where the number is. It's really solid, solid growth.
All right, Steve Miller, thank you so much. We appreciate that's Steve Miller he's a chairman of Institute for Supplying Management. That's IM with some strong numbers.
You're listening to the Bloomberg Intelligence Podcast. Catch us live weekdays at ten am Eastern on Apple, Coarcklay and Android Auto with the Bloomberg Business App. Listen on demand wherever you get your podcasts, or watch us live on YouTube.
Alex youil here alongside Paul Sweeney. This a Bloomberg Intelligence Radio. We bring you all the top news in business, economics, and finance through a lens of our Bloomberg Intelligence folks. They cover two thousand companies one hundred and thirty industries around the world. We also tap a vast network of resources outside of Bloomberg as well.
Mike Summers is one of them.
He's API, American Petroleum Institute President and CEO. Talks to Washington about what to do about energy and Mike your claim to fame. Right.
The second in this radio studio is.
Actually Landman on Paramount because Paul, my co anchor, is watching it and now he loves it and he thinks you knows everything about oil.
And gas and he's all over it. So you're right. API is one of the sponsors, so perfect day. Good to see him, Mike. What's day one?
Great show, and I appreciate being with you today.
What's day one for you guys under a president of administration?
Well, we've laid out an API five point policy roadmap. You can find it at API dot org of the things that we're asking this president in this Congress to do during the first six months of the administration, but there are some things that they can get done early in the administration, really on day one. So one of those things is lifting the LNG export pause. We're excited that we have a new president that's focused on that
and he's committed to lifting it on day one. So that's one thing we think that they can get done very quickly. The second thing that we think they can do is they can authorize a new five year lease plan in the offshore Golf of Mexico. We need a five year releasing plan that prioritizes new leases in the Golf of Mexico, which continues to be a prolific region
for the American oil and gas industry. About fourteen percent of American oil comes from the Golf of Mexico, which is why what President Biden did just yesterday in setting aside a new acreage that we will not be able to develop with so concerning and so disappointing.
Another big thing that we're focused on.
Is repealing the EPA tailpipe mandate, the ev mandate that they put in place early in the Biden administration, and we'll work with the Trump administration to get that repealed and replace the cafe standards that our draconian and US automakers can't meet. So those are three of the key priorities that we want to focus on early in the administration. And then in addition to that, we need to get a new tax bill in place before the end of
twenty twenty five. We're prioritizing things like the corporate tax rate, of course, and then really focusing on how we continue to build American geopolitical strength and energy trade throughout the world.
Green energy, How does green energy work with traditional energy? I'm not sure what the preferred term is for oil and gas, but how does green energy work with oil and gas and traditional energy sources.
Well, the truth of the matter is is that we know that we're going to need all sorts.
Of energy to meet the energy needs of the future.
If golden sas is right, and we're going to need ten percent more energy for the next ten years to support data centers and AI growth.
We're going to need all sources.
Of new energy, which is why it's important that we get a new permitting bill in place that we can build out not just oil and gas pipelines, but new transmission lines for those new energy sources as well. The great thing about natural gas in particular is that it can support these alternative energy sources as well. Because we know that the wind isn't always blowing and the sun isn't always shining, you're going to need something to back
that up. And natural gas is almost always the preferred energy of choice when backing up those sources.
So we know that we're going to need more energy.
We don't just need all of the above, but more of all if we're going to be successful in leading the future.
Particularly when it comes to AI.
So we want to work with our partners in the other energy system to make sure that we can continue to expand.
So Mike also, yeah, I would say a popular talking point for Republicans was that we need to get rid of the Inflation Reduction Act. But if you dig into a lot of the details, a lot of the oil guys and natural gas guys like the Inflation Reduction Act in things like carbon capture credits right forty five Q. New rules on the hydrogen tax credit forty five V were unveiled that people were pretty happy with because it had a broader swath of the energy that you could use to make hydrogen.
Are you guys happy with those things right now?
I actually feel pretty good about our ability to defend the forty five tax credits Q and V are the ones that are most important to us for carbon.
Capture and hydrogen.
We were pleased with the Biden administration rules, though we think they could be improved under President Trump on both ccs and HIGH, so we'll work with the Trump administration to improve those. But there are provisions I think that under the Inflation Reduction Act that are vulnerable, particularly the funds from the Loan Program Office, which has just become a giant slush fund for favored industries under the Biden administration. So I do think the funds that haven't been obligated
yet under the Loan Program Office are very vulnerable. As Congress that looks towards towards reconciliation, so that's where I think most of the purpose will be.
But some of the money from the Department of Loan Office is going to like companies that produce a nuclear or have natural gas. It's not just like Rando green technology. How are you going to distinguish that? Because if you need the loan in order to say, restart a nuclear plan or work into small modular reactors, for example, what do you think about that?
Well, I think that's going to be something that Congress is going to have to sort out and the administration is going to have to sort out. I'm pretty sure that at the beginning of the administration what they're going to do is they're going to freeze all new funds coming from the Loan Program Office until they get a better sense as to what to leave in and what
to leave out. And that'll be up to the new Energy Secretary, Chris Right And you know, I'm confident that they'll be able to figure out what they should what they should focus on, and the things that they need to leave behind.
But that'll be up to the administration.
You know, our focus is going to be on advancing a reconciliation bill that supports American energy that means new leases in the offshore, new leases on shore reopening Alaska, which President Biden has taken a particularly focus on in terms of cutting off the amount of oil and.
Gas that we can produce in the state of Alaska.
So we're confident that we're going to be able to prevail on the administration and the Congress to advance new leasing priorities as they get that big new reconciliation bill.
On what do we have you heard?
What have been I guess maybe any rubblings coming out of this new Trump administration about how aggressive they planned to be as a related to oil and gas.
I think they plan to be very aggressive.
I mean, as you know, the President has really focused on how do we continue to grow this tremendous American resource.
We're producing about thirteen.
Point four million barrels of oil everying a single day, which is a record. We're producing records amounts of natural gas. But we also see record demand for these products, not just record demand for oil and gas, but also record demand for coal and other sources as well. And that's because we're starting to see this demand continue to increase. This we're in a different era than we were during the first Trump administration, where energy demand was relatively stable
during the first Trump administration. Everything's changed in the last eight years where you have new sources of demand, growing data centers of course AI more things.
Being plugged into the electric grid.
So I think what President Trump understands is that we're going to need a lot of energy going forward if we're going to win the energy security race.
Hey, Mike, it's always going to catch up. So many more things to talk about. We'll get you back.
We'll go through them also, and like really questioning how we're going to get pipelines built, So next time we'll tackle that. Mike Summer's API president and CEO, and I should point out also the sponsor of land Fans Paramount plus well not mine, but the API that feels important to say.
You're listening to the Bloomberg Intelligence Podcast. Catch us live weekdays at ten am Eastern on Apple Coarclay, and Android Otto with the Bloomberg Business Up. Listen on demand wherever you get your podcasts, or watch us live on YouTube.
In the meantime, we're seeing ramped up pressure on Chinese companies and their relationship to the US. There's a growing backlist of those Chinese tech giants, and it's happening pretty quickly and the current as Bloomberg Global Economy Reporter, we got news about ten Cent just in the last twenty four hours. Where do we stand today versus where we stood like six months ago.
So it's another day, another series of companies being added to this list. As you mentioned, Alex, it's basically list by the US government. DOT says these Chinese companies are working in collaboration with the Chinese mili and although it doesn't apply sanctions on those companies, it will make it awkward for US companies to do business with them. And
as you mentioned, we've had some new editions. Ten Cent probably one of the best known internet companies in China, best known for its apps and it's gaming for example, not known to be in the military civil fusion space, but has been added to the list. Nonetheless than some of the hawks in DC have been calling for it to happen. CATL which makes the batteries for the big EV car makers, including Tesla, that's gone on the list,
with potential ramifications for the supply chain story there. There's also a shipping company Costco, and some other big well known Chinese companies as well, And of course the Chinese authorities in Beijing have responded. They say they hope the US will undo this wrongdoing, and of course we know China has options of retaliation of its own. They've been expanding their own their own kind of so called anty
lists as well. So it's just another example of the ongoing tensions between both and the tit for tap between both governments as well.
I mean, we all the government undo this snjen Ey twentieth.
Well, it's a tricky one because you would assume the incoming Trumpe administration are as hawkish as the Biden administration, if not more holkish. You know, everyone's trying to i't hook each other on China at the moment, Alex, So I don't know whether or not there will be a reversal. Obviously there's a complication there with CAATL being so critical to the Tesla supply chain, so that will be one worth keeping a close one.
But broadly speaking of though, you'd.
Have to say the direction of travel when it comes to export controls or investment restrictions or potentially tariffs on goods made in China coming from China into the US and curbs and doing business and people flowing the like. That's all been going in one direction. So the Biden administration seems to be cementing its own hawkish legacy, putting its own stamp on this before they finish up. And it's kind of hard to imagine too much it is being online by the Trumpet administration.
So I guess then the obvious question is who's next? And I don't know if we know that right, Like you mentioned Tencent, like that was kind of a surprise over the last twenty four hours. But sector why, company wise, market cap wise?
Who do we think might be next?
It is hard to say, Alex because, like you say, we've gone now from you might say maybe obvious companies who you could say are clearly aiding or were the US does month to aid China's technology aspirations. It's CHIP aspirations, it's AI aspirations, companies that aren't necessarily in that space. So certainly it's been broadened. Now that list looks like it's been broadened, So you know, we could go anywhere
from here. But the real question is when the Trump administration comes in a couple of weeks time, what will their initial focus be. Will it be on goods trade. Will they go hard with the tariffs which the President elect Trump has obviously spoken about so many times, or will they get off to to an early start also with ongoing investment restrictions, expert controls, restrictions.
On technology and the like.
And if it's that, then that's where we will see this list coming onder more scrutiny again in terms of where they do go with it.
Any response from China in terms of how they retaliate in this particular kind of instance.
They had, well, they the firm industry over and I didn't respond to say that. Look, they obviously disagree with this, They want the US to want to do it. They
refer to it as wrongdoing. But we know that China does have options through Italiate, they've developed something of an anty list of their own ALEX where they're putting US companies on their list, where they're making it harder to do business with Chinese companies, putting restrictions on the flow of say, critical minerals resources, that kind of thing that US companies might need. So China has options respond where
they are in this space. But as also though, there's also been some mixed mood music coming out of Beijing, they've been saying that when it comes to goods trade at least that you know, they're open to listening. There could be some negotiation or deeds to be done and on that side of things. And I think that's why this China US trade story is going to be very much an evolving one as the new new administration gets.
Up and running.
When you take a look then at how that does evolve. Does China then wind up shipping more stuff to say, other g Seven countries and then it winds up having this weird supply glut elsewhere, and then how that affects trade dynamics within the US.
Yeah, the trade anmaks are definitely being up ended at the moment. As you say, you know, even if China comes under tariffs or export controls or restrictions with the US, they either their a final new markets to your point, or they you know, they shift them of that production over to third party countries and then from there they ship the US and kind of scared these controls. That's been an ongoing issue and that's probably one that's going
to come under scrutiny. I think when the new administrator comes in and that's partly why some people think universal tariffs are being talked about this time around, in terms of trying to make sure China doesn't come through those loopholes. So, you know, if you think back at the first Triple administration, those tariffs were kind of broad brush. They were continued
by by the administration. But there's a feeling that this time we're going to have to be more surgical and make sure that those loopholes are closed.
All right, and I always good to catch up.
Thanks a lot and the current Bloomberg Global Economy reporter joining us there.
Speaking of eleven o'clock, I.
Mean, we'll take bets on whether or not that as actually as eleven we're going to have a president like Trump remarks from our lago in Pombee, Florida, So I'll bring that to you. I'm at around eleven thirty, we'll have Jensen Wang of Nvidia speaking to Ed Ludlow. We will also be updating you on those headlines as well.
This is the Bloomberg Intelligence Podcast, available on Apple, Spotify, and anywhere else you get your podcasts. Listen live each weekday ten am to noon Eastern on Bloomberg dot Com. The iHeartRadio app tune In, and the Bloomberg Business app. You can also watch us live every weekday on YouTube and always on the Bloomberg terminal