Well, you talk about volatility, Doug, We're seeing that in the crypto space. To fall up from f t X is not easy. How much more contagion can we expect in coming days, in coming weeks. Let's get to Marcello Sapeo, his CEO and co founder of hashtags street Cred. Marcella could have you with us more pain for the crypto space. I mean, Genesis the latest to warn about a potential bankruptcy. Thank you, as Linda, it's great to be here, Happy
Thanksgiving to you all. So yeah, it's been a tough market complately being seen like a lot of volatility and uh and and not so great news you like, and for the industry, like when we see stories like f t X. But yeah, that's a reality. But ultimately we all expect that to be a good thing long term. Let's say that actors leaving the market is always is always good but also painful. But yeah, this space still feels in many ways like the wild West, so to speak.
And I'm talking about jurisdiction. We know t X based in the Bahamas and now there's a dispute and I don't even want to over characterize it as being a dispute, but a little bit of tension between Bahamian regulators in the US. How this gets resolved. We know the situation with finance is as complex because I don't know that the company is is licensed in a singular jurisdiction. I
think it's spread out over many different jurisdictions. When it comes to the volatility Marcello, that we have seen in markets, are we up against a regulatory regime that we don't even understand at this moment. Governments are going to lean in and apply a level of regulation that we can't even imagine at this point. Well, yeah, you know what trip to is this global plus by nature, so honestly it allows this this this this geography arbitrage, let's call it that way, and and and and and Yes, you
have like a number of jurisdictions. They are some of more loose, others like more restricted as some others actually like taking you know, like the leading actually trying to to regulate and to propose like uh good rules and that that that will develop this market. But ultimately, you know,
like US is the largest capital markets in the planet. Uh, we have to to to to to assume that once we have like clear rules in US that will at some extent you know, like uh, let's say inspire or or invite you know, like other jurisdictions to to to so much follow that, and we have been missing that in US. So um, hopefully FTX will will will will will at some extent like push or or or bring
this opportunity for regulators. They are like to to be more assertive in this case, like because we have been really lacking that. The the irony of it, all right, my shallow investors urging governments to tighten regulations. The thing is global regulators don't even agree. Yeah, that's true. It is not about really restriction because crypto you know, like it's really a technical technological breakthrough, a progress, right, it
was health an invention. It's really more you know, like trying to understand that and to create the basic rules for that to development and really for for us as a society to understand how it will you know, like a contribute like for for for for for human and let's say like this. But ultimately, you know, right now, the fact that there is nothing really or nothing uh solid out there is allowing the number of crazy you know, like behaviors coming from a number of players that they
have been really doing whatever they want. And I think ft X and and Sarah Lewin and Celsius. Uh, those are a number many of the stories of all the bad stories in the industry. What technology keeps doing, you know, like following journey, it's it's I mean crypto, you know, like it's it keeps you know, like uh like improving as a technology, and so only like that, honestly, you know, like, well,
there's the blockchain technology underneath it. And I don't know that anyone is as critical of block chain as a technology per se. I think it's what exists on on top of that and the extent to which UM investors, whether their retail or institutional, are exposed. Would you be supportive of a global standard something coming, let's say, as
an example, from the Bank for International Settlements. Would you be comfortable with that or do you like the idea that you can get away with maybe not to be too critical, but there are the potential for as you put a global arbitrage. Do you want to make sure that there is that possibility or or would you favor kind of a global standard. I don't think that's possible to be honest, I think you've got we're gonna see like a number of frameworks. Uh. Generally, generally there's this
confusion around blockchain and crypto. But it's important to too to understand that crypto is the very definition of watching, like one cannot leave without the other. Uh what I say, you know, like when what? What? What we think here at hashtags when you think about regulations is to begin with the foundations and and and really to to at some extent to like uh bring uh the all all the proxies, all the stuff that we learned like in traditional financial markets, and have you like the base or
a foundation for crypto so the market can develop. We don't need a lot. We just need clarity for things like securities, for things like what is how to treat you know, like the exchanges, you know, like because ultimately what what are the effects that has happening? Exchanges is really they are more they have been seen themselves, I guess like banks, but just there are not banks, like they don't have like, uh like any of the regulation
that actually protects investors around that. So so really what we see here is that we don't need much, but we need the regulators to step in like to to to give some clarity and from there, you know, like work with the market to actually create the rules that will protect investors and will put the technology in a great place to actually solve real problems to a number of people. Effective matter is financial markets are built on trust. Right now, when it comes to the crypto space, it's
been a lot of trust, lots of confidence. How how do you build that trust from here? You know, this
is not very different than and run. You know, like when when we think back in the day, you know, like electricity electricty cap you know, like eliminating houses, you know, like and and and and despite like and run a big company utility company imploded, right, So so so the trust is not really you know, like related to crypto itself in this point, is really around the bad actors working with the crypto and this is the one those
are the ones that actually should be regulated. Trust will be built actually, I think, uh in both ways, Like one at this point, like short term, if we can have like clear rules, you know, like for for us to protect investors, like for for players like those like and and the other part is really like the technology will solve the problems like crypto is the technology based on trust, you know, like the nature of crypto is literally like trust programming trust, right, and and this is
one of the things that solves. So hopefully you're like, we're gonna have like enough, you know, like or or the least you're like, we can expect now in order to have to see the technology pretty much replacing or for us to program those regulations into the technology where we go from honest, that's what it does. Trust. Trust,
It's got to be about trust and confidence. Marcello, thank you so much for being with us some Marcello Sampaio, who is the CEO co founder of hash decks, Street Cred, talking crypto for um Rio