Work From Home Has Created One-Woman Safety Nets

You can also listen to our radio show at two pm Eastern Time on Bloomberg Radio, or watch us on YouTube search Bloomberg Global News. This story, by the way, Katie, comes from Bloomberg business Week. It's found on the Bloomberg and Bloomberg dot com slash business Week. It's about how the work from home revolution. Initially we thought it would be a big step to women might finally finally be

having it all. But as Bloomberg Business Week contributor and Peterson writes, it has also become a trap for women. So let's see what she has to say. She joins us from Loomie Island, Washington. Hey, and good to have you here with Katie and myself. So it was. I feel like this was like it to be the great um leveler, if you will um and it hasn't necessarily working from home played out like we thought for women.

You know, it's hard because I think, like before the pandemic, if you would say to moms in particular and sexual families, if you would say, hey, what if you could do your job from home and you could be there for pickup and to facilitate a bunch of other stuff, and you could figure out where work would sit in your own life and you wouldn't have to commute and you wouldn't have to necessarily like but all the time putting on work clothes every day, Like would you choose that, right?

And I think a lot of people said, yes, I would choose that it would make my life a lot easier. And what we've seen, which is not surprising given the state of different supports in the United States in particular right now, is that instead a lot of women who are have flexible work options have become a sort of

one woman safety net. So they are providing the sort of support and care that maybe they split more equally with their husbands, maybe the school district provided a bit more of or maybe even just like child could care, infrastructure provided more of and so there's so many different sort of combinations that flexible work as a woman could take. And it's a beautifully reported piece. You say that you've conducted hundreds of interviews with women over the past two years.

So I mean it's sort of walk us through the common denominator, because you can't paint a flexible work arrangement with the same brush. I mean, some people might have some children in different stages of life, maybe their spouse

is in the office, maybe their spouses home. What was the sort of when you boiled all down the common element there, I would say that the people who are struggling the most would burnout right now are people who are working these flexible sorts of jobs where they have a much more control over how much time they're spending in their home and their partner, especially in heterosexual marriages, um doesn't have as much flex or is not taking as much flex and so what they're doing is they're

essentially working this full time job for pay that they've been working for a long time, but then they're also taking on even more of that unpaid labor in the home and a lot of that includes what's often called like the mental load, right, so like keeping the list in their head of all of the different things that have to be happening right now, and so they are working all the time on their salary job and then also taking up a lot more of that other unpaid labor.

And that includes even things like, oh, they don't have enough bus drivers for the school district, so I guess that I will pick up my kid every day after school instead of them taking the bus home, or something like oh, my kids sick and has to stay home. Used to be my husband and I would rotate who would stay home with him, But since I'm already in the home, I guess I'll just stay here and my work will be affected and then I'll need to stay it wait to put in that work then I missed.

So basically it's like what's going on in relationships? So here we are. We've gone through the pandemic working from home. Women are like, wow, this could be really cool. Great, give me some flexibility, but still pursue my career and

continue to move ahead. What's happening is what's happening internally within relationships or the husband are the partner, I guess has gone the male partner predominantly maybe in some cases, has gone back to work, and so when stuff happens at home, the woman is continue to work from home, but also adding on everything else. I love there's a picture in the story I'm looking at that I looked at at the terminal of like the nineteen fifties wife sending our kids off to school, you know, and she's

kind of getting stuck. Yep. Well, I would say that this is also true. And I heard a lot of feedback after the piece was published. Even if you the woman in these heterosexual relationships, if they are making more money, right, if their job is ostensibly within the paradigm of the relationship, the more important one, if they have flex they are still the one who's taking up all of this extra labor. And I think it's really frustrating, right because like what

is the solution? And something I asked some people like, is there anything that your company could do to make a better policy for you? And you know, everyone has small complaints about how their companies have orchestrated flexible work policies, like there are things that absolutely need to get better. But to the person, every single person told me that like, No, this is a societal thing and it's also a relationship

thing and it's really hard to fix. Well, that's sort of getting to what I want to touch on, which is where does this go from here? Too? Because back to the question you posted at the beginning, you know, if I could tell you you wouldn't have to go into the office put on word clothes, you could be at home in these flexible work arrangements. I my gut feeling is that a lot of people, even with this, spurnout this uh sort of one woman safety that that

you described. It doesn't feel like going into the office would fix that. No, Well, I think in some ways it would, because it would force you to find backup care, right, it would force you to figure out what, like what were people doing before? Right there there we had emergency plans for like oh, if the kid gets sick, we rotate turns off because we both conceive of our jobs as equal, right that we would one person goes and get that person, or like school districts has more buster

first and really made that a priority. And so I think that there are different ways that you can solve this problem. But we're just like instead where people I think are it's been normalized that women are taking on more and more of this work. And if you look at things like the Deloitte Study of Women in Work that the numbers of burnout amongst women and mothers in particular in in office jobs is just guy rocketing and

something has to give. And a lot of cases, I think you have women who are like, I can't do it anymore. The only way to make our family work now is for me not to work at all, for me to drop out of the workforce. And that's a different problem. Well, and it's interesting, right, Katie, in terms of we've got this very tight labor market. We talk about, you know, people who are just not coming back to the workforce, and you wonder how many although we've seen

some stronger numbers in terms of women. UM, but you do wonder, you do wonder how this impacts it going forward. UM. And really, as Katie said, well and beautifully reported story. Really appreciate getting some time to talk with you and Peterson contributor at Bloomberg Business Week on the phone from Loomie Island, Washington. And this story you can find on the Bloomberg terminal at Bloomberg dot com. Slash Business Week.

It's just all these things from the pandemic maybe not playing out as we anticipated in I know, I know, at least in this point, this UH piece points out at least kids are back in school for the large part, not doing virtual school anymore. So maybe one thing that they can cross off there. Yeah, um, be sure to check it out in more all from Bloomberg Business Week. You can find that on the terminal. You're listening to Bloomberg Business Week with Carol Messer and Bloomberg Quick Takes

Tim Stinovic on Bloomberg Radio. Well, as we mentioned, we did want to get to the Bloomberg Big Take. It's also among the most read on the Bloomberg Take. Bloomberg Big Take, by the way, is our editorial team saying, folks, you gotta read this story and it's a Bloomberg exclusive, and it is about the big bank, probably the most associated Katie with the US mortgage industry big time. Of course,

we're talking about Wells Fargo. Great scoop from our handle lot that Wells Fargo plans to shrink the biggest US mortgage empire. Of course, after waves of scandal scandals, Hannah, you join us on the phone now basically walk us through the premise of this big take and how we got here. Hey ya, thank you so much for having me so as you mentioned, like when you when you thank Wells Fargo, you think the biggest US homelander, like that was their whole thing for a number of years.

Right coming out of the financial crisis um in two thousand and eight, a lot of the big banks who had dominated the space prior to the crisis pulled back in a big way, and well S Fargo took the opposite approach and said, no, we're going to really dig in. You know, at one point they were turning out one in every three home loans in the US and they were aiming for higher than outer raiming for market share.

So that was um. That was then, and then you know, since then, we've seen the rise of non make mortgage lenders like Quicken and stuff like that, and not so well Fargo has had um a lot of issues, some of which have been in its mortgage empire. And so now under Charlie Sharp, who has been the CEO for almost three years, they are making plans to shrink and mortgage. How important is the mortgage business though, to Wells Fargo's

top and bottom line. Um. You know, that's a great question because it's less important today than it used to be. So the history of going back before even the crisis, was that they liked mortgage as a way to counterbalance um, you know, lower net interest income from lower interest rates, and so they would get seeds from lower rates when people wanted to rEFInd refinance the mortgage and stuff and such, um,

And so it would be a counterway to that. But um, the company has gotten a lot bigger, so it has become less relevant. And also it's a more competitive landscape today than it was, you know, when Wells of doing one in every three homelands. Yeah, well, that's what I wanted to ask, because that's such a crazy stat one of every three home loans in the US. With Wells Fargo kind of planning to step away here, where does that leave the US mortgage market? Yeah. Well, and so

they certainly aren't doing one in three today. Um, and it'll be really interesting to see. You know, they're still in the process of making plans of where they're gonna pull back. You know, I've wrote about other correspondent lending, which is when they've on uh mortgages that are made by other firms and then servicing to like billion collections for mortgages UM as as places where they're looking at um. But you know, a lot of that is building sketched out.

But it will be really interesting to see, you know, when all is said and done, where Well Spargo fits into the greater mortgage picture. Hey, how much of this is just well Spargo saying I am tired of being criticized, um for you know, rejecting refinances for black homeowners, for doing other things and being fine, I'm just tired of this. And if I get rid of this business, I'm no

longer on regulators radar. Yeah, that's also a super interesting question because a lot of the big bank, like you know, Bank of America did um, I want to say, over a hundred billion of originations in a single quarter during the right after the crisis, and they were down to less than a tenth of that by so a lot of these banks already kind of concluded that, Remember, there

were like tens of billions of dollars and signs. I think it actually that have gone over a hundred billion total UM for the bank's behavior leading up to the crisis causing the crisis in some ways, um, so wells here is kind of you know, in some sense it's the last big bank to come to this conclusion. But also in recent years, you know, they have been very scandal written. That's why Charlie Sharp took over three years ago, and the mortgage business has been a key you know,

trouble spots in them. And Hannah, we have about forty seconds left. But you write the shrinking even in a downturn will be complicated. Tell us about some of those hurdles. Yeah, So when the economy is worth, the value of the loans that they hold will go down. So that just makes it harder to um, you know, for them to potentially sell this off or do whatever they're gonna do. Um, you know, versus when it's when it's a great market and everyone is climbing to get those fascets and things

like that. It is a great story. Does also make me think about, you know, all she talked about. Hannah talked about more competition today in the mortgage business, and all these up starts right then have given homeowners or prospective homeowners so many different options when it comes when it comes to either mortgages or home equity. Um. It

is the Bloomberg Big Take. It's among the most read on the Bloomberg today, and it's all about Wells Fargo shrinking the biggest US mortgage empire after a bunch of scandals over the last few years. Hannah Levet, she is financial. Put her at Bloomberg News, check her out on Twitter at Hannah Levitt, and she of course joining us on the phone from New York City. This is Bloomberg Business Week with Carol Masser and Bloomberg Quick Takes. Tim Stenovic

on Bloomberg Radio. All Right, so, dear Bob, I like your company, think though we could make a few changes. Sincerely yours Dan Lobe. Okay, that's not exactly what he wrote, Pretty close though, you think so, yeah, right at the main points, Well, Dan Lobe did write a letter to Disney CEO Bob Chpeck after taking a signal if you can stake at the company, and suggesting some changes at

the Magic Kingdom. Indeed, again, this news breaking this morning definitely took a lot of people by surprise, just judging at the readership numbers on the Bloomberg terminal. For more, let's bring in geta rank and Nathan, she of course is a Bloomberg Intelligence analysts and geta This calling for a spinoff of the ESPN Sports Network have to assume

that cha Pec and Go haven't done this for a reason. Yeah, yeah, So this is something that has come up so many times, Katie and Carol over the past few years, I mean, constant questions about whether it makes sense for ESPN to be spun off, just kind of given the secular challenges in the linear TV business model. The reason they're not doing it, and that reason is cash flow, tons and tons of cash flow from ESPN almost four and a half billion dollars every year. And remember this is almost

thirty percent of uh, you know, Disney's profits. So it is a crucial part of their business and one that they're not going to be willing to let go off very easily. Quito, would this be like an activist investors saying, hey, Apple, we'd really love it if you'd spin off the iPhone in terms of seal, I mean, this is just so important to Disney, as you said, absolutely, it is a

critical part of the business. Yes, agreed, there are lots of challenges in the business model, especially given that court cutting is accelerating, But the whole streaming part of the business, yes, they are having pretty good growth there. For streaming, they reported some fantastic numbers just a few days ago. They have more than if you just look at their streaming portfoolio now, they actually have more subscribers and netflix as.

But remember, streaming is not generating any profits for this company just yet. So getting that cash flow, getting those four and a half million dollars from ESPN ear in and ear out, is so important to fund all of that content investments in the streaming platform, all the technological improvements. So absolutely, I have a core part of the business. I had trouble with the timing on this case, like, wait, Disney did really well, what's up with this? Yeah, yeah

it again. I guess that they had really wolfed it in earnings. This would make a little bit more sense, but it does feel a bit unintuitive. Let's talk about some of the other suggestions here. We have Third Point also urging Disney to integrate Hulu directly into the Disney Plus platform. Of course, that's the company's flagship streaming operation. The logic there on the Third Point side is that this would save money reignite growth and domestic streaming. Does

that logic hold water with you? I think it does to a certain extent. And again this has again been one of those constant conundrums for Disney. Remember Disney has a sixty six percent stake in Hulu. This is jointly owned with Comcast, and they the two companies actually have an agreement between them which allows for you know, Disney to buy back the thirty three percent in January. The

problem really here is valuation. So they have agreed to a minimum valuation of about twenty seven billion dollars, which means Disney has to show out at least nine billion dollars. But Comcast is going to want much much more, and the two parties have been in arbitration. But again this price is going to be a major sticking point, which is why Disney does not want to rush into it.

Is what I'm thinking, do you think on the cost cutting side of things, you look at all the metrics when it comes to the Walt Disney Company, geta when you know Lobe d and Lobe says cost cutting Disney costs among the highst in industry. We believe Disney significantlyland Er earns relative to its potential. We urge the company to embark on a cost cutting program that addresses both margins and the disposal of excess underperforming assets. Is he

right in that regard? And I am reading from his letter, so he is right when he says that they have the highest costs in the industry. To remember, this year, Disney is going to pay out thirty billion dollars in terms of content costs across platforms. Now that that is the ii is by the way in the industry. But that's that's the reason it's paying that much is because of majority of it is really because of sports rights.

So you know, they're paying about eight to nine billion dollars in sports rights, and that's why ESPN is the number one cable network when it comes to earning affiliate fees in the industry. That's what drives the four and a half billion dollars in eep IT down. Also, remember this is the biggest movie studio in the world. They are half of the global box office. So in order to generate you know, eleven ten or ten eleven billion

dollars in global box office, they have to make significant investments. Again, a major part of the cost there. You know my my only contention with the cost argument is you want to build a streaming platform that is, you know, the leader, and you have to be careful because you know content is the key differentiator. Yeah right, we say content is king when you've got somebody like sore Love and thunder

like I'm in. I'm just gonna tell you, I'm all in our Avengers watch look always great as guitar rank and outhan. She's Bloomberg in religience technology media analyst joining us on the phone in New Jersey. Guita, thank you. I'm Roly macro a journal But you let me drive? No, no, who's going home? Please? Gravels? I want to drive? Which? Good question? Good drive is the drive to the clobe

on Bluebird Radio. Al Right, everybody, just about ten and a half minutes left in today's trading session, and as you know we've been talking, we've got another rally Underwear Slate rally up about nineteen on the SUP, as Charlie mentioned, up about half a percent on the Dow, and the NASDAK up by about two thirds of one percent. So let's get to it as we drive to the clothes on this Monday hick Smith is back with us, his chief investment officer, having for Trust, which as you know,

is based in Radnor, Pennsylvania. Yeah, nice to have you here with Katie Greifeld and myself. You have repeatedly come on with us this year said a recession in a bear market are not likely? Is that still the case in your view? Well? Look, if one aspect, we do have a technical recession defined by two consecutive quarters with

negative real GDP growth. But if we're in our recession, it's the most unusual recession in modern history, given uh, the strength of the labor market, the health of the consumer, corporate profits, corporate balance sheets, the banking system is well capitalized, UH, and there doesn't seem to beat any problems there. So, on the one hand, a lot looks good about the economy. UH. The big part thou is inflation. A lot looks good in the economy, inflation being its own special animal. What

does the stock market look like? Though, because if we think about the past two months since June's lows, it's been a pretty robust rally. The question it feels like everyone is asking is whether that June loow was actually the bottom. What's your view. Well, Look, the stock market

is an anticipatory vehicle. Uh. It anticipated peak inflation, which is really kind of junish uh with a very weak first half, and now I think it's anticipating that we are beyond peak inflation um and that a lot of factors, including the federal reserves policy, is starting to unlind inflation and and perhaps perhaps uh, the Fed might get lucky and engineer a somewhat soft landing. And so I think

that's what the market is really focusing on. I don't think they're focusing on a FED pitot, because I think we're going to see Fed fund rate increases through two thousand and twenty two. But maybe that's it. Maybe in twenty three were done that. Hey, we love talk macro issues with you. I put out my Twitter poll this morning and I said, new week, what's top of mind

for everybody? In so far the votes are coming in, say at China US slowdown or the China U slowdowns that we're already seeing almost say the retail earnings we're gonna get this week, and also the retail sales date on Wednesday, say the FOMC minutes, which we also get on Wednesday. From that last FED meeting, and about thirteen percent say other which they are weighing in on different things that are top of mind for them. Um. What's top of mind for you when you think about this

week ahead? Well, I think the retail earnings are are very important, although clearly there's been a shift in spending from goods to services and experiences, because if you look at what MasterCard and Visa have been saying, that spending is still pretty pretty robust, but it's in different areas. But I still think it's important what we see from Walmart or get home depot U lows uh, because that's a good measure of the strength of the consumer. So

that's the top online of this week. And um, yes, geo political um events, Uh, you know, I think the market has gotten I hate to say it this way, almost used to the conflict in in Ukraine. Um. And and there's potential that you know that that could get worse given the fall and early winner approaching in a handful of months in terms of in terms of oil

and natural gas throughout throughout Europe. And so how do you sort of structure your portfolio with some of those geo political concerns in mind, particularly when it comes to the energy sector. For example, if I look at the SMP five hundred at the sector level, that's by far the winner. Do you think that trade has sort of

run its course at this point. Yeah. We are very very light in the energy sector, so we missed much of the move in the second half of twenty one into twenty two, except for some of our yield oriented strategies where we do have some energy exposure because of the very high high yields and names like Chevron. But you know, the IT we're continuing to stay away of from the sector due to the cyclicality of it UM

and the lower quality. I mean, when you look at how many companies in the energy patch one out business UH in two thousand and twenty, when you have the complete collapse in the oil prices, UM, it's a it's a tough sector to invest in. UM. In terms of where we're focusing on, our biggest weight is in the healthcare industry UH sector, and there I think there are three things going on. The reopening play people are finally

get procedures that have been delayed because of the pandemic. UM. Also, it's a defensive sector, and UM it's a attractively priced sector and you get good yields with growth of income. And that's a nice combination in an inflationary environment. Where don't you want to be right now? Well, you know I did mention UH energy, which we are We don't in our growth strategies. We don't have any um waiting there, and we're absent um utilities UH and reach. Those are

the three areas where we have no exposure. And so also say we continue to favor equities over fixed income, Well that's where I wanted to go. Actually, I'm glad you brought that up. Talk to me a little bit about that, because if I look at the treasury market, for example, we've seen a big, big rally. Yeah, and and clearly yields are higher today even even with the rally and prices recently, yields are higher today than than

they were a year ago. For for sure. But if you if you have an outlook of five, seven, ten years, UH, you're hard pressed to make a case that you're going to get a better rate of return in fixed income, whether it's corporates or treasuries, than you are in owning UH equities and particularly dividend pain and dividend growing equities, and and so I think you'd have to see yields

much higher before they're a competition for for equities. All Right, we're gonna leave it there, Hey, Hank, good to check in with you again. Hank Smith, Chief investment Officer, and have a for trust that company based in Redner, Pennsylvania. Thanks for listening to Bloomberg Business Week. Download the podcast on iTunes, SoundCloud, or Bloomberg dot com, and you can also listen to our radio show at two pm Eastern on Bloomberg Radio or watch us on YouTube. Search to Bloomberg Global News l