Women Smashing Construction Industry’s Concrete Ceiling

You can also listen to our radio show at two pm Eastern Time on Bloomberg Radio, or watch us on YouTube search Bloomberg Clobal News. Well in the new issue of Bloomberg Business Week that's out later this week. The next story you can find actually right now on the Bloomberg terminal and also at Bloomberg dot com slash business Week Tim is about how women are smashing the construction industries concrete ceiling record vacancies, forcing changes in what's been

an all male bashtion. We've got with us. One of the authors, Maria Paolo mis Torres, joins us now. She's US economy reporter for Bloomberg News. She's with us right now in the Bloomberg Interactive Broker Studio. Maria. I want to start just with the with the data here, we're talking fourteen point one percent and all time high in terms of the share of US construction jobs held by women. It's not, by any means parody, but this is a

big deal. Yeah, it's one million women in construction, which is a higher number we have seen racing since that I was collected in the nineteen sixty four. And you know, with more as we call them baby boomers or more people who were used to being in this industry, male are retiring, and there's more bagancies in this industry, and there's labor turtages, and people are looking for jobs, more women are taking them. All right. I gotta say, I

have two brothers who are contractors. I don't hear a lot about them working with a bunch of women in the industry. So how is it that it's happening. Yeah,

it's still a minority, but it's growing. And that's why we like, that's what caught us from the data and when we wanted to do this story because there's a lot of women seeing that they have more opportunities, you know, growing professionally, having a higher wage if they instead of you know, go have other jobs that are stereotypical for women. They take this construction work works that you know, have

no gender attached to them. It's just like in history, more men have done it and they have more opportunities there. So they've been falling in love with these construction works and been doing them more and more, inspiring other women to also do that. It's also the money is really really good. Take us through some of the numbers here, because we're talking, you know, close to a hundred thousand dollars a year for jobs that don't necessarily require a

college education. Yeah, exactly. So in the media, salary for an electriction was fifty nine thousand dollars and ninety eight thousand, five hundred for a construction manager. So that's why a lot of women are being a filled to these jobs that you know, some women actually do have college degrees

even though it's not required. For example, one of the people I talked with, though she has a degree in history and lot in American studies, she just couldn't find a job that you know, she was graduated in twenty with the pandemic, she couldn't find a job that was for what she wanted to do, and then she fill in of with construction because she had seen how her partner, her dad grew up doing construction. She just never felt

identified there. She never saw Latina, women of color, women in general, just working in the construction fields where their family were working. And she realized that she can do it and get a better salary than what she was hoping for. So what are women in construction typically doing? Are they overseeing sites? Are they developing, doing the contracts, negotiations with clients? Are are actually picking up a hammer? Uh and doing some of the physical work because it's

a very physical job. It is a very physical job and it also has very physically, very very various facets. Are we see women from any part of the construction we see and they already go with tug with women who are actual constructors speaking of the hammers, Like you said, we see contractors, we see inspectors, we see from manager positions all the way to the bottom. Um. Of course, as the higher you do go in the ladder, there's more men, and specifically more white men. But really, sorry,

but that's why they're actually trying through to villain. I was having fun with the world you exactly know. And it is interesting and I do. I remember watching this Old House and this was a few years ago, because uh, there's such demand for jobs generally in the construction industry. There's a lot of younger individuals who don't think about becoming electricians. We talked about this all the time, or you know, becoming contractors or you know, becoming builders, and

they really need people. And they were actually creating a program to help cultivate young women, young men, uh in this industry. And so, uh it's kind of interesting. Is the growth expected to continue? Is so much of it though about the demand in the industry right now that women have a better opportunity, Well, I really, I really do hope that it keeps growing until it's more equitable

or more equal. Um. People are definitely seeing how it's not longer stereotype that's only one gender can do this kind of job. So more there was being open for women. And I a lot of the women I spoke with, they're saying that they're finding finding more and more community and they all got inspired to do these work things to other women telling them, hey, there's an opportunity here. Um. From Facebook groups to actual networking groups in person to

go grab lunch together. This was something that women just got inspired to do more and more by hearing other people doing it. What did you What did they tell you about just day to day life on the construction site. I mean I worked construction for two summers between college and um it was all male where I was. There was not a single woman on on these working on these houses. Um. What did they tell you about the environment? Yeah, definitely,

the environment is not the most friendly for a woman. Uh. They all told me that they have had a couple of bad experience in the sense of either harassment either not taking them seriously because they were a woman. If they were inspectors seeing overseeing a job done by a men, they would usually second guess them and say, hey, I did the correctly, you have to like revise it again, and they say, like, no, my word is final. So they were a lot of times not respected as they

would help to. But they that's also why this community is matters of women women in construction coming together so they can support each other. And they've all have told me that they have had to grown ethics skin in this job. Tell us too about minority women, how this is even an extra bump up for them. Yeah, so, um yeah, a lot of the percentages of women working are kind of mixed ethnically and racewise. The biggest minority

and women constructions are letting know women. I was able to talk with a couple of them, but yeah, this is somewhere else where you see all side of the instructions, but of course also majority white women. Um, but more and more they're telling me that they're seeing more women of color in this industry. But just in general, if you look at it also on their male counterpart parts, it's also been hard to see more people people and people of color higher up in the ladder. Is this

a consequence or I shouldn't even say consequence. This is the result of just the labor shortage that we're seeing. I mean, what is spurring the increased diversification when it comes to at least gender diversity within construction. Yeah, some of the guesses that experts have on the matter, because of the labor shortage and the lack of people in construction, that they're accepting more people now. But I really do hope that even if they were shortage ever, you know,

sees this this opportunities keep open for more people. Yeah, I gotta say, I know I've said this a million times to forgive Bloomberg audience, but I just remember our he was our electrician or I think it was our plumber, and just when you got the bill, well the bill, and then he retiring early, and his multiple homes that he owned, and I just the money that was to be made. And you know, we're so pro college, and I am very pro college, but there are alternatives where

you can make a really, really good living. Uh. And certainly this is certainly when it comes to construction playing out well for women, in particular minority women. Maria Paola Mijas Torres U s Economy reporter at Bloomberg News in our interactive Broker Studio. This story in the upcoming new issue of Bloomberg Business Week, due out later this week, but you can find it at the Bloomberg right now and also at Bloomberg dot com slash business Week. This

is Bloomberg Radio. You're listening to Bloomberg Business Week with Carol Messer and Bloomberg Quick Takes Tim Stinovic on Bloomberg Radio. It is one of our most read stories on the Bloomberg. It's also the Bloomberg Big Take about how the US Central banks past crises holds secrets to tackling future recessions. We can, indeed, Tim, it seems learn from our past. That story by Tom orlick In, David Wilcox, Carol, as

you mentioned, it's today's big Take. Check it out from Bloomberg, the Big Take on the Bloomberg Terminal, and at Bloomberg dot com slash a big Take Tom more like his chief economist for Bloomberg Economics. He joins us on the phone from Washington, d C. Tom, Good, to have you with us this afternoon. I find it fascinating to see what's happening in the SMP five. Found it right now since we last heard from Fed Chair J Powell. Uh with you know, the most recent meeting of the Federal Reserve.

Because we've seen stocks rally and you and David write that the market isn't really buying the fact that the federal funds rate is going to have to keep climbing entertain inflation. Yeah, it's a funny, Tim. There's a bunch of people in the markets who have a deep investor background.

There's a bunch of people in the markets who have a policy background, including some folks on our team who joined us from time at the Federal Reserve, and they just had completely different interpretations of that July press conference from Chair Powell. The market folks heard a dovish signal, They heard what they wanted to hear. They heard the Fed was going to pause on rate hikes. The policy people, the people with the monetary policy, the Fed background, they

didn't hear that at all. They a Powell who is determined to push on with rate hikes until inflation is under control. And so so far it's that first interpretation, that davish interpretation which has been pushing the S and P and other risk assets up, and our view it's actually that's the wrong interpretation, and we expect that power is going to come out at Jackson Hall and offer a correction. All right, So and so he'll say what specifically.

So I think there's a bunch of different there's a range of possible outcomes for inflation and for Fed policy in the month ahead. Goodness knows, economists haven't got everything right on the big inflation call or the monetary policy call so far. So the market view, it's not insane. It's not outside the range of possible outcomes. At the same time, it's not at the center of the distribution. Is not the most likely path that the FED is

going to have to follow. I think that there's going to be an acknowledgement of progress so far, but power is going to be a long way from declaring mission accomplished. He's going to signal that that Dovish pause. Putting too much money betting on that probably not a very good idea. Well, let's talk about the Fed's credibility here, Tom, because it's

something that you and David write about. You both write about the fact that the Federal Reserve has lost control of inflation, and I'm wondering if the two of you, based on your reporting, I think that it has the tools necessary to bring it down because and you look, you go back to the you know, top haul era, Paul Vogler raising rates. So the FED absolutely has the

tools to bring inflation under control. The question today is the same as the question back at Paul Vulcan movement, which you mentioned, what's the cost of bringing inflation under control? Back then, the cost was a deep procession millions of people unemployed. Today, Well, no one thinks the cost is going to be quite so high. But inflation is running it's six percent, more than six percent, three times the

FEDS two percent target. Bringing it all the way back two percent is going to come at a cost in higher unemployment, potentially at the cost of a recession for the U. S. Economy. You know, it's interesting to you know time you write, eventually inflation will be back on target,

in any immediate recession will end. There is, though, that conversation that maybe the targets are not going to be the ones of the future, that maybe those targets, especially inflationary targets, it's more like three or four percent going forward, that that will be forgive me the new norm, rather

than maybe a two percent rate. So if we go back, if we wind the clock back to the biggest challenge for central banks was that they were in a world where inflation was too low, and what that meant was that when recessions hit, they didn't have enough room to cut rates, they didn't have enough room to stimulate the economy. There are a bunch of different ways of kind of soling that problem. Quantitative easing, forward guidance. They're both ways of adding a bit of extra policy space for central

banks after they already take interest rates to zero. Another out of the box solution is to move to higher inflation target. Let's target three percent inflation, not two percent inflation, and then when bad times come, will have more room to cut. So that was the conversation in Who knows it could become the conversation again looking out right now though with inflation really at a painful level, the households and the Fed determined to bring inflation expectations under control.

It's probably not the conversation which the Fed wants to be having. God, this is makes sense. Checks in hole meeting that more important. Um, Tom, thank you so much, Bloomberg Economic Chief Economist Tom Or Like Alo News out of China, Beijing has been working to curb the influence of tech industry leaders from Tensent to Ali Baba Group.

This has to do. It's also even delisting from US exchange. Yeah, I'm really excited to speak to Kevin Carter, the founder of e m q Q. It's an emerging market's internet and e commerce e t F. Kevin, great to have you with us, How are you great? Thank you for having me, I should say you're joining us on the phone from San Francisco. Okay. So when I think of China, especially in the last few minutes months, I think of that call that JP Morgan made a few months ago

calling China's Internet, China's stock market uninvestable. Uh. Then they came out and said that that was actually published in error. But I'll just ask you, what were your thoughts when you heard that. Well, you know, that day and that week, which was the middle of March, was a pretty volatile period for these companies. And the problem is the delisting threat.

Of all the things, you know, the China faces and all the risks for investors, it's the most misunderstood and in my estimation it's the smallest risk, but it doesn't seem to matter because it moves the markets. And uh. And what we saw last week was that the state owned enterprises, the Chinese government is going to be less the state own enterprises. And I think this is a real positive move in solving the dispute because it's those companies that China is particularly sensitive to having the US

government auditors noodle around in. Yeah, but I do wonder about Beijing Chinese officials. It seems chronically, uh getting involved in their private industry, you know what I mean, like setting rules, setting regulations, dialing back, dialing forward, helping out the economy, COVID lockdowns like it's it's really I think tricky for investors to kind of know what truly is coming when it comes to making an investment in a well known Chinese company. Well, let me first talk about

the regulatory uh quote unquote crackdown. And the reality is that all over the world you have these giant tech platforms, the Fang stocks here in the US, and they've grown at incredible rates and they've taken over our lives that our stock markets and the regulators haven't really been able to keep up with them. And that's not a China situation.

That's a global situation. And you see it here. You know, all of our Fang executives are up in front of Congress and the only difference is we have lobbyists and money involved in The Chinese I think are able to take a longer term view, and I think it's healthy what they've done, particularly with the you know, ant group ip O. So people can look at it negatively and and think, oh my gosh, the Chinese government is you know,

they're not capitalist, they're gonna you know, Jack Moss missing, etcetera. But I think the reality is that they're just trying to regulate like everybody else's. Come on, you can't compare regulatory environment in China with the regulatory environment in a European market or the US market, can you. I mean, there's regulatory overset where there is a process, and then there's Jack Margoing missing. Like I'm just saying, how can you compare them? Well, China I think has advantages in

regulatory matters. Remember, most of these people, a large percentage of their leaders have gone to our best colleges, particularly the financial system. Some of them have taught at our best colleges, and they're smart and they need to to regulate just as everyone else does. In in each sector is a little different. But I think the concerns that the Chinese government is going to you know, squash capitalism

or greatly overblown. And the delisting threat in and of itself is the dumbest part of all the fears that people have. It's it's the smallest risk. It's a very small risk of it happened, and it's even smaller risk that anybody loses any money. De listing does not equally you lose your money. Well, what what should be the what should be the risks that investors should be concerned about that? If that's you know, in your words, the dumbest,

Well the COVID. China hasn't had the COVID yet. I mean, they've got it there now and they're trying to battle it. And the COVID zero policy puts them in a very tough situation because you know they have on one hand, if they have COVID zero, there's going to be continued meaningful economic damage and consumer confidence issues, and and you're gonna have people continue rise and unrest. People don't want to be locked in their apartments for multiple month long periods.

And I think that is a slow motion thing that's playing out because if they don't have zero COVID, then they're gonna lose a lot of people. And they're they've continued to stick with zero COVID, and I think it's a very right position that they're in trying to manage both. Kevin Um, we've got to run. Kevin Carter, he is founder of e m q Q, joining us on the phone from San Francisco and talking about certainly Chinese companies

and some of the regulatory environment. This is Bloomberg Business Week with Carol Masser and Bloomberg Quick Takes Tim Stinovic on Bloomberg Radio. We've got with us Katarina Seminetti, Senior VP and private wealth adviser of at Morgan Stanley Private

Wealth Management. She joined us on the phone from Philadelphia. Katerina, I feel like there are so many mixed messages, whether it's some of the weakening housing data, but we did have inflation data start to come down, still high on a historical basis, FETE still saying they're going to be largely you know aggressive, continue to raise rates, and then companies coming out and saying things are pretty good and we've got a tight labor market. How do you trade

on this? Carol, thank you for having me on the show. Um, you said it best. You know, the data is confusing. We had really positive labor market data and that sort of confidents and investors seems to believe that FED will not slow down and rate will now you know, start slowing down and ring types as a metal of facts. You know, there's some possibility that they will even start

cutting into the next year, you know. But all of this is despite of the fact that we're having still having high inflation, which of course effects consumer confidence that has been shaken by the fact that you know, we have an team inflation at this level. Yet you know, historically we are dealing with weeking economic data, declining earnings of just overall geopolitical risks and not to mention that.

The question is is all of this going to bring us into, you know, a an environment of an ext recession and how major this recession is going to be? So the question is what should investors do right right? Because I just want to jump in kotterine at what should investors do? Because it seems like the market is not the equity market is not taken into account the environment that you described us. Now we're up close from

those June laws in the s've adored Tim. I think that the important message here is that even though we are on the path to recovery, this past might like through additional volatility. So what investors can do right now is we encourage them to realize losses stay defenses in defensive sectors exceptors like financial, energy, healthcare, consumer staples, we're looking for additional yield generation for the stocks with um with strong cash flows that will generate income that is

much needed here. The other side is that the that absolutely we're talking about dividend paying stocks uh and the focus on the defense respectors. Not to mention that the bond market is also showing a sign of improvement. While we're not quite confident that this is the end of the bear market, as a matter of fact, our view is that this rally is more of a bear market

rally and the volatility is going to continue. Bond market is showing the science of improvement and it can act like corporate bonds can act like a safe pathing for investors in the time of you know, volatility UM because the really real question here is are we going to get a recession or not once that starts rate typs, And that's a major question out there. When will we know if the bear market rally is no longer a

bear market rally and it's just a rally. So here is what it would take for the improvement in the market and the improvement in the economy to truly be sustainable. It will take positive earnings, it will take curbed inflation, it will take rebound consumer confidence, and when all of this comes together, then we can confidently said to say that we're back in the boom market territory and we are going together. We're probably going to get their sooner

rather than later. But we still have a lot of hurdles to overcome before. You know, the the economic data is positive enough that we can say that all of the titan volatility it is behind us. But for now we have to stay defenses. And that's what we've been telling our clients, Katarine. Is that also because you expect, as economists are predicting that we're going to have a second deeper recession late next year, and just got about five seconds, The question is are we going to get

a recession? And quite frankly, in our review, are the best case scenario? Its recession that we will get is not going to be as wide as we expected to be. So we might get a recession if it's not, you know, to prolonged, that's good news that needs to be you know, quickly recoverings on the horizon. All right, So you don't think we're in a recession right now? Quick answer? Yes? Or now not yet? Okay? All right? I appreciate that

being so great. Katerina Semonetti, Senior VP and Private wealth Advisor at Morgan Stanley Private Wealth Management, shutting us on the phone from Philadelphia. Thanks for listening to Bloomberg Business Week. Download the podcast on iTunes, SoundCloud, or Bloomberg dot com, and you can also listen to our radio show at two pm Eastern on Bloomberg Radio or watch us on YouTube search Bloomberg Global News