Weekend-July 10, 2021

of the most recent round of cyber attacks. More on that in a moment. Also trying to impact a massive infrastructure spending proposal in the US. Former US Transportation Secretary Rodney Slater weighs in on how we need to think about it. We're also being pretty thoughtful about the reality of what post pandemic work is like, right Tim, Especially if you cannot work from home, it's going to be different. We'll do that though with the Chief people officer over

at Waste Management. Plus the bitcoin dilemma, what really is the future of cryptocurrency and the blockchain? All that to come, but we begin with the latest targets of international cyber criminals and tim We know there are lots of moving parts and questions regarding cyber attacks and Russian involvement and Russian government awareness. Lots of questions, yet one thing we know for certain. They're happening more frequently and getting more sophisticated.

Caroline I spoke with Bloomberg News cybersecurity reporter William Turton to help break them all down. We reported that hackers that are aligned with the Russian State Russian Intelligence Service reached the Republican National Committee. Now we don't know what they did once they were inside or what data they took. We're still working to find out more about that. But the really interesting thing is that happened on this backdrop of a massive ransomware campaign. So there's there's two things

happening here. There's an espionage campaign happening and there's a ransomware campaign happening, and they're both originating from Russia. So Russian criminals, this criminal hacker group called Reval is conducting a ransomware campaign and very wide scale skill that we haven't really seen before where they have automated their attack. They hit one company that makes technology for a lot of companies in order to encrypt nearly eight hundred businesses

as the estimate right now. So at the same time, the Russian intelligence services use the chaos created by that attack to then go and breach the RNC. So where's the Russian government and all of this despite President Biden saying to President Putin, like, knock it off. So, you know, Russian state hackers hacking the r NC is just sort of your normal espion. Actually, I mean, we do the same thing. That's standard. That's not that surprising. It's certainly

interesting and newsworthy. But the combination of the two is what's really raising people's eyebrows here because the question for a long time has been to what degree are the criminals and the intelligence hackers in Russia aligned and how much are they collaborating And is it a tacit approval from the Russian state or they're getting more instructions And that's just something that we don't know right now, But that's kind of one of the questions is being raised

by these things happening at the same time. When you also say, just to follow is that we the US government and other governments are doing it on other governments too. Are we somehow doing something on a similar level. Obviously maybe not the ransom ransomware side being part of it. Well, espionage and ransomware are two very different things. Espionage has

gone on forever and will go on forever. But it's it's really the backdrop of the espionage happening at the same time of this global ransomware, right because the cybersecurity professionals they're worn out. I mean, ever since Solar wins, there's been one huge hack after another, so people are just really lacking the resources to respond. And and when you have a big systemic ransomware event like this, I mean, people really have their eye off the ball and you're

not going to be looking for something like espionage. What is the weak link here? Because these security systems, they seem to be this reoccurring theme, right, they're only as strong as the weakest link, and employee clicks a bad link, gives some information, enters his or her password, and boom therein what's the weak link here? Well, it's it's hard

to know. I think the problem is extremely complex, um and there's sort of new threats that are evolving all the time, and it's like the pace of innovation and and how we're kind of integrating ourselves even deeper into computers and networks. Isn't really keeping up with security, And I mean the Internet fundamentally was not built with security in mind. No one really anticipated that these things would ever happen. So, you know, I just don't know. There's

so many week wins. But William, they are getting more sophisticated. I mean you think about how they got into the global software supply chain, Like when you start to do this, that makes it that you can kind of do one thing but potentially impact so much more. Right, So, in December, we learned about Russian intelligence hackers doing this with solar winds, and it was amazing. I mean, it was the sort of tradecraft that you would expect from some of the

best hackers in the world. Right, But now we're seeing criminal groups do this. That's what's really interesting. They're they're kind of upping their tradecraft and they're making it so they don't just hit one company, they hit hundreds or

thousands of companies all at once. You know, one thing that's interesting, Tim and I think on air on our daily show, we are constantly talking with cybersecurity firms who are saying we're protecting everything, and yet it seems like the criminals are the bad guys are the folks who are involved in ransomware are always a couple of steps ahead. Is it always going to be like that? Well, you

have there are I mean, think about it. There are some companies that haven't been hit by ransomware right, and there are companies that are doing things right. I think you know, everyone will agree. Financial institutions, for example, are sort of very far ahead on cybersecurity where their industries are not right exactly. And um, you know, it's really it's it's there's just so much that we don't hear

about because most of these hacks go unreported. Um, you know, you can have great security tools, you can buy all the products, but if you don't have a team that implements them correctly, then it's not gonna work. So what's a government to do? What's what's a business to do? I mean, it sounds like this is something that that has to have the support of private public partner ships right in order to actually prevent it from from happening again.

And we saw this in the wake of I think it was the JBS in colonial pipeline attacks, right where these companies paid these large millions of dollars in big coin, and it seems provide some sort of incentive for that actors to go out and continue to do this because the will is there for these companies to get their systems back online and they'll pay to do it. Yeah, I mean the option of your like a colonial pipeline,

it makes sense to pay. And a lot of these companies a cyber insurance, so you know, what's the point of paying the premium if you don't invoke your cyber insurance to pay the ransom. That was Bloomberg News cybersecurity reporter William Turton tim Every time we talk with him, I just realized there's still so much we don't know, and folks get ready for even more of this to go on. Well, like you said, and it's just it seems like the cyber criminals are one step ahead of

everyone else right now. Yeah, and it's worrisome. So far, the financial industry has been really good, as you mentioned, you know, right, but it just makes me a little nervous, all right, coming up securing our future infrastructure security and needs. We check in with a former U S Transportation secretary. You're listening to Bloomberg Business Week. This is Bloomberg. This is Bloomberg Business Week with Carol Messer and Bloomberg Quick

Takes Tim Stinevik from Bloomberg Radio. So bipartisan group of House lawmakers have publicly endorsed President Joe Biden's five hundred seventy nine billion dollar infrastructure deal with a number of Republican and Democratic senators. We're talking about the hard infrastructure part of his deal, and that's giving the compromise fresh momentum at the start of a crucial month for the administration's agenda. The possibility of infrastructure spending has fascinated investors

for years. Joining us with some thoughts this week former US Transportation Secretary Rodney Slater. He served under President Bill Clinton and before that he was administrator of the Federal Highway Administration. I feel like we've been talking about an

infrastructure spend forever today. Rodney is a partner at the international well known law firm and lobbyist squire Patent Boggs, based in Washington, d C. Clearly, President Biden had a much larger bill, and I think ultimately even this measure will be beyond um that amount because I think when you consider courage spending levels with new spending levels, it's going to be an excess of one trillion dollars. But we've got significant transportation needs. I think this is a

very very important step. And I think, just as is the case with all transportation measures, you have to have

bills that are continuously reauthorized. Uh. And it's just unfortunate that in the last you know, decade or so, we just have not been as um uh forth right in spending the kinds of dollars we have to spend to ensure that our system remains in good shape and that we're also investing in things of the future like um electric vehicles, autonomous vehicles, high speed trains, maglev trains, those

sorts of things. So I'm excited about the bill traditional infrastructure primarily, though with some significant investment in broadband uh. And I think it's a very important first step. Well, Secretary Slater, and that's something I wanted to get into about. You know, there's different types of infrastructure out there. You were Transportation secretary under President Bill Clinton. Before that, your

administrator of the Federal Highway Administration. I mean, you have seen our infrastructure for many years the comings and goings. Are we thinking about infrastructure in a bit of an outmoded way and old model? Should we be thinking about ways to actually cut back on the use of roads

and highways rather than just building it back. And I'm thinking about things like efficient congestion pricing for cars and trucks, or efficient payment and bridge wear pricing for trucks, because trucks really kill our roads and highways, you know, should we have them be paying more that that will hopefully

ultimately bring about better design, if you will. When it comes to trucks, well, uh, you know, first of all, let me just I want to step in and supportive state trucks and trains because that's really what keeps our

economy moving. We are the most mobile society in the world, and we moved significant amounts of freight and all the kinds of products that we take for granted when we go to a grocery store, when we go to a department store, that sort of thing, and many of those good to move by trucks, many move by trains, and even during the pandemic, Uh, these workers were on the

front lines again keeping our economy going. But you're right, transportation, I've always said is about more than concrete asphalt to steal. We have to look at new means of investing in transportation. We have to uh frankly, wean ourselves from a dependence on fossil fuels and look at new renewed energy sources.

I think um the President has challenged us in that guard even with his campaign theme of building back better, not just building back, but building back better and shoring up our infrastructure so as to withstand some of the natural disasters that we're facing, especially on the coast. So we've got a lot of work to do. I think we've got some professionals to get that work done. The American people want it done, and it's key to our

pursuit of happiness. So I think that there is much about the new that has to be done, but also we have to maintain the system that we have currently. Well, it's interesting that you bring up the coast to and I do wonder about that. With climate change, we talked about Florida a lot here on Bloomberg. It's caught the

attention of investors. You know, should we continue to build back and shore up if we're not going to really equally do something about climate change, because it's just a case of rebuilding the castle only to see the shoreline take it down again. Yeah. Well, you know, the President has been very clear about that, and I think he's really hit on three words that I believe will ultimately define line uh, the effort that he's proposed and the

effort that the Congress will actually pass. He's talked about resilience, He's talked about sustainability, and equity, and all of those issues go to the transportation system of the future being more resilient where it's showed up where it's building back, better, being sustainable, meaning a system that can withstand the challenges of freight with then the challenges of natural disasters, those sorts of things, and then more equitable, ensuring that everyone

is included, that no one is left behind. And so I'm excited about what we can anticipate. I think that we've seen the system really um tested in this fourth of July holiday weekend where we've enjoyed m the opportunity as Americans to see America come back, if you will, and and it's sort of get back to a period of normalcy, especially hopefully as we've sort of put COVID

in review mirror. But again that has been the number one objective of the President, freeing us from that, and then dealing with our economic pandemic, our economic challenges, UH, and then investing in the future. And I just feel good about where we are. But we've got much more to do as the Congress returns from the holiday and sort of nears the August recess and then frankly the end of the fiscal year, UH the end of September. So a lot to do, but I think we're on

the right track, to be sure. I think here again, we've seen some good signs. I mean clearly, UH, this effort is not only an effort that's being pushed by the President, but you've got a bipartisan group of Senators who have responded quite admirably as well. And then more recently, the House Problem Solvers cause has stepped forward. That's roughly six members of UH, sixty members of Congress, both Republicans and Democrats. So I think that's that's a good son.

I can tell you in years past, UH, those of us who have had the honor of serving as Secretary of Transportation, we've enjoyed significant bipartisan support. I was just with Sam Skinner, a secretary during the Bush administration. Bush one, I'll sit that way, uh and UM gave us a wonderful piece of legislation that was bipartisan. We came in shortly after that, took advantage of that gift. UH. During reauthorization, added additional resources. And really it's that piece of legislation

that's governed transportation policy for about thirty years. We now have a need to build on that and to go beyond that, and that's why this current opportunity is so critical. That was former U S Transportation Secretary and former administrator of the Federal Highway Administration that Rodney Slater. Still ahead on Bloomberg Business Week as Congress tries to figure out passage of an infrastructure plan, the world is working on figuring out how we work in a post panda the world.

We get some thoughts from the chief people Officer at Waste Management. This is Bloomberg broadcasting from the financial capital of the World, Bloomberg eleven Frio in New York to Washington, d C. Bloomberg to Boston, Bloomberg one oh six one to San Francisco, Bloomberg nine sixty to the country Sirius XM, Chado one nine team and around the globe, the Bloomberg Business app and Bloomberg Radio dot com. This is Bloomberg

Business Week. Recently, I moderated a Bloomberg panel on how we work, how leaders are leading and organizing for the future to make sure companies and their teams have what they need. Tim listen, how many times do we have this conversation? Yeah? I mean the big question is what does it look like? And nobody really knows the answer. I think it's a big experiment that's playing out right

exactly in real time. All of this, too, is impacting employer relationships with their own employees, with their clients, with their customers, their business strategies, and their tools for tracting new talent. Well. One participant on your panel, tomlaw Oates Forny, Senior vice president and Chief People Officer for Waste Management, was kind enough to stop by our daily show to continue the conversation and how she sees work life post pandemic.

We recently launched this new program known as Your Tomorrow, where we're providing debt free educational benefits for our employees and beginning in January two, it's going to be a benefit that's not only intelligible for employees, but their dependence as well, meeting their spouses and their children. And we think this is a creative and innovative and competitive way to one attract people to waste Management, but not only attract them, but we came them, tell them this is

a big deal. Why did you do it? And and can anybody access this? And anybody's family access this? So why did we do it? One? Because there are a couple of things. One, our employees were asking about educational reimbursement benefit in its traditional senses, but it's something that our employees were interested in. But when we looked at the old model, it was more of a reimbursement, so the burden was on the employee to find the school and university and they would have to come out of

pocket upfront and the company would pay for that. So we were looking at options for an educational benefit and we discovered Guild Education, which has been a phenomenal partner for us. And with Guild Education, every employee that's the full time employee waste Management is eligible for the benefit so long as they've completed ninety days ninety days of free employments, they have to go to a probation area period,

but on the ninety first day. This is yet another benefit that we offer and through Guild, once they apply for the benefit, they get an education coach right and they will help them determine what opportunities are best aligned with their interest and also their career aspiration that's aligned with us at Waste Management. So once they come on they are eligible for the benefit and the next year their family members will be eligible for the benefit. And

we looked at this for a couple of different reasons. One, we know that we're going to have to repeal really fast, and we needed an educational partner that could help us up steal and refeal the workforce to be aligned with the changes that are happening in the workforce. So we were I would like to say we were proactive and we were ahead of COVID, but once COVID hit, it really just exacerbated the need. And this was a really a good program that we're offering. We launched it in

April of this year. Well, and as you said, I mean we saw this pre pandemic. You know, employers were beginning to fight for workers. You don't want to lose workers. It cost the company when that happens, absolutely absolutely on average. If we look at the our drivers and technicians, if you will, those are the ones that are most critical to our our survival as a company, if you will, And we were seeing that on average it's about twenty three thou dollars or more a year to when we

lose a driver. So we can't afford to do that. And you think about COVID and the demand for drivers and technicians have increased exponentially. You have bunnies that big box stores that are you know, um, they have more customers, and more customers generate more products that they have to deliver and ship from different places, so they have to hire truck drivers and so the demand has gone up, but the supply is somewhat dwindling. I'm the mother of two gen zs, and most gen Zs are not thinking

about a career driving a truck. And so what we're trying to do is bring them into our organization. We're looking at them not just for a job, for the career. And our program has called you or Tomorrow because it talks about how we're planning and supporting you on having a career not just for today, before tomorrow. We have to have a way of getting them in. And this is something that is addressing a need that a lot of people have in terms of education, and we're solving

that for them. And I think this is going to put us at a competitive advantage. Tamila's you know from the panel, we talked for an hour, and I could have talked for more hours because several more, because there's so much to unpack. We just have about forty seconds left here. Help me with the debate between workers staying at home workers in the office. There feels like a disconnect.

The financial sector really wants all the workers back in the office, but when I talk with the broader corporate America, it feels like it's a bit of mixed. How do you think it's going to plan? Again? Just got about thirty five seconds, Sorry, so no, I think it's going to be a hybrid. I think it's going to be all the above and not one or the other. I was on a panel with another panelist and what they were saying. I say, I'm gonna talent war, and they

said it's not a war any longer. That talent has won the war, which means that they have more say in terms of how they work, and so to the extent the companies can be flexible and adaptable to meet the needs of the workforce, that's what's going to make them an attractive employer of choice. So I think it's going to be all the above. Tumla Oh, it's Forny, Senior vice president and Chief people Officer for Waste Management. You're listening to Bloomberg Business Week. From figuring out how

we work to figuring out cryptocurrencies and the blockchain. Up next, the Bitcoin dilemma with technology futurist ian con We're figuring it out, aren't we we? Certainly? I'm I don't, I don't know. Still clear as mother Rose, but I like that. This is Bloomberg. You're listening to Bloomberg Business Week with Carol Messer and Bloomberg Quick Takes. Tim Stinovic from Bloomberg Radio. A great piece on the Bloomberg Terminal this week by our Charlie Wells. He says his bitcoin turned twelve years

old this January. Kind of hard to believe. It's certainly been acting like it's in middle school. Is that tween? This? I think it is a tweet Well, earlier this week I got a chance to speak with someone deep into the crypto and blockchain scene, Carol. It's technology futurist Ian Cohn. But we started the conversation talking about the promise of blockchain. What is the future going to look like? Well, blockchain,

I think is the most confused technology. But really it's for me, what blockchain significant signifies is peace of mind. That's how I equate that technol oology to a result, piece of mind, because it takes care of trust issues, it takes care of packing, it takes care of data protection, takes off a lot of things that traditionally we have been unable to do with databases and computer technologies that we've had, And that's what blockchain does in a very

complicated way. Yes, it's being defined as a ledger in the sky, and it's uh an imputable ledger of records. But but hey, I I love the simplified definition, which is peace of mind technology something that creates trust and enables trust. Give me a more tangible example than that, something that you think has been improved by blockchain technology or or will will very soon be improved by the blockchain. Of course, there's many, many different use cases of blockchain.

I love the ones that UH that are happening in the food industry. Australian beef exports are about the fake Australian beef exports counterfeit. Australian beef exports are about two billion dollar industry. And UH these foods we don't know what the origin is, but their stamped is Australian beef. UH. There's a company, I believe, Beef Chain, that's trying to solve this problem by certifying beef that originates from Australia.

It's stamped at the beginning of the process of export, and you can scan the package at the grocery store and and and see the whole journey that this packet of beef has taken. There are examples such as Walnut is doing something with with produced tracking UH and UH lettuce tracking, and it's got uses when you're tracking the spread of diseases like semonela or any other contamination of food.

There's examples from the logistics industry where transportation off certain types of equipment or goods or vaccines as an example, has to be under controlled temperature, under controlled conditions, and in a traditional industry, traditional refrigeration industry. If the power goes out on one of these units, it's kind of

hard to figure out what has happened. But with blockchain enables container ships that are temperature controlled, you can verify that information really quick and figure out that there's something on wrong. The reason why we're able to do this is the god because you can't manipulate a blockchain database. You're unable to uh insert records in it or or modify it in any way that is not authorized. So once let's use this beef example from Australia that you

talked about. So once it's been been and I don't want to say stamped on the blockchain, but how how is how is it associated with the blockchain? Like what is the physical thing that becomes a part of this beef on the package that that puts it on the blockchain.

So blockchain is essentially a database and every people you need, the industry, the farmer are never going to touch blockchain as such, but it powers the underlying system on which but it needs some sort of bar code, so it's something that associates it with the blockchain, right, correct, correct, And you can use r if I to your bark code. Let's give you an example. So at the beginning of the farm, you can have let's say cattle that are at this farm and they're taken to the harvesting site.

Right there at that site, you have a bar code that's generated associated with a certain animal that tags zach carcass to its journey as it's as its processed and package. That bar code signifies the start of that journey. We were talking all about applications for blockchain that we're what I would consider not non financial. You didn't mention cryptocurrency once,

so I want to dive into that right now. Why why didn't you mention cryptocurrency as one of the top applications for blockchain technology because I think that's where a lot of pole associated with. Absolutely, I think cryptocurrency is one important side of blockchain, but not the most important side. And that's that's my opinion. Uh, And it's because cryptocurrencies

are in a very initial development phase right now. Yes, Bitcoin has been out there for the last ten twelve years, but it's waves ahead until the financial systems globally accept cryptocurrencies if they do as a stable form of payment or or asset class. But that's happening very very slowly.

The other applications of blockchain, in fact, are proceeding really much rapidly, and the applications are tremendous, from insurance industry to logistics, to food, to retail, education, music rights, intellectual property. There's a limitless number of applications. Crypto is just one of them. When do we get to a point where people like me don't ask you questions about applications for

blockchain technology? That is, where it's something that is so present in our lives, If ever that we'll all know what it does, yep. I think it will be still some time, and it might happen in a way in different ways across the world. It may happen in certain regions or countries that are faster adopting digital money or cryptocurrencies, and it might take decades in some other parts of across the world. Uh. And it all depends on adoption.

It all depends on how progressive financial systems and governments in those countries are. We're seeing some some countries adopt bitcoin as a form of currency. Of Salador just did that some time ago, although yes, a very small nation economically, but but that push has started to happen. Will that happen in the United States or China or once the world's largest economies. It's it's a big, big change, and I don't believe it will happen just in a few days.

Do you think it will happen with bitcoin that will be the cryptocurren see or do you think you know? One thing that I hear from a lot of experts in people in the spaces, they've said, okay, well, you know, the blockchain technology is like the underlying technology that the Internet was in the A well days and and a well though is is like the cryptocurrency of of of of bitcoin. So the technology is there, but that's a very early technology and what you're going to see built

on it will significantly surpass what's available right now. I think bitcoin is of it has the hype associated with it because it was the first cryptocurrency that was out there. It is it has a very limited number of cryptocurrencies bitcoins that will ever be generated twenty one million, and so it's got a few of those factors associated with it.

In my personal opinion, it still has challenges. It's still has to overcome those challenges, and some newer cryptocurrencies are really far ahead, very faster, uh and and have got much more utility than just bitcoin. But it's it's it's one of the popular ones right because it was the first to market. And right now is also a time

of hype for cryptocurrencies. And we've seen that, uh you know, when when certain people are tweeting about bitcoins, the prices are going up when they're teeing, Yeah, elon Musk for specifically specifically. So it's a very hype driven um era where consumers are taken by what popular figures in the tech industry are doing and which is not right, which is which is a challenge with bitcoint that it's it's its own fundamentals are better than that and it doesn't

deserve to be taken up and down like that. So that's that's my opinion on that. And do you own any cryptocurrencies? Oh? I do, and it's a very instantesimally small amount. I have deliberately done that to stay away from any kind of uh, you know question that I might it may arise. I I own next to zero cryptocurrencies. Are there certain cryptocurrencies though, that you are more bullish on than than others? In the short term. I think,

of course bitcoin see is the most popular one. UM. I likedra hash graph, uh and I like Ripple a little bit. But I wouldn't I wouldn't push anybody to buy them or not buy them. Do your due diligence because there are so many factors that are driving these picto currencies. Some are fast, some have a limited quantity, some have an underlying technology. Um. And I interviewed somebody

on my documentary The bitcoint Dilemma. It's Dr Lemon Beard who invented the dea hash graph, and it's a it's a cryptocurrency that's much faster than bitcoin, and it's got some really good things happening with it. But please do your due diligence right and don't go with hype. Do

your due diligence. Hey, and um, when you think about the future uses of of cryptocurrency, I wonder if you do see you know, like a country like China actually going through and building its own digital currency and what that means. I think China is doing something very interesting, and we know they've gone cracked down signal secondently on crypto quarrency mining, which means they're not entertaining crypto quarrency mining in China right now? What do? What will they do?

There's a couple of things they could be doing. They could either be creating their own crypto currency and starting to plan the next few years and decades and how that would work. Uh. And also they could be looking at the digitization off the off their own currency that you want. That's technology futurists and documentary in ian Con. I want to be a futurist. How do you become one? I don't know. I'm working on that. I just got to think more about the future. I think I'm trying alright.

That wraps up the first hour of the weekend edition of Bloomberg Business Week from Bloomberg Radio. I'm Carol mess and I'm Tim Stanivac. Coming up in our next hour. The one Trillion Dollar market Cap Club recently got a new member. We take a look at Facebook culture of growth at any cost, and Amazon is currently well over a one trillion dollar market camp founder Jeff Bezos got the company there. Now, Amazon's new CEO is tasked with

cultivating a new company culture. How Andy Jase can improve on his predecessor's record with employees plus private jets are all the rage. Any subscription based food delivery service, is it evolving with the times? Do you have private jets or are using this subscription base? Yeah, so I'm much more into the subscription food delivery service than I am into the private jets. We gotta work on that, we do. We gotta become a better futurist. Exactly. All right, that's

all ahead in the next hour Bloomberg Business Week. This is Bloomberg. This is Bloomberg Business Week inside from the reporters and editors who bring you America's most trusted business magazine, plus global business, finance and tech news as it happened, Sloomberg Business Week with Carol Messer and Bloomberg Quick Takes

Tim Stinovik on Bloomberg Radio. I am Carol Masser, and I'm instead of a plenty ahead in our second hour of the weekend edition of Bloomberg Business Week, including Facebook recently hitting that one at trillion dollars in market cap. Wall Street got it there, so too, did the companies grow at any cost? Culture. We're going to get that

Business Week story in just a moment. We're also talking about another company that's well over the one trillion dollar market cap mark that is Amazon, of course, and how it's new CEO is task with upgrading the company's culture, plus a subscription based online meal plan service. We're gonna hear from meal Pal's co founder and CEO on how they are doing food delivery differently. First up, let's get to the latest mega metric achieved by Facebook, hitting that

one trillion dollar market capitalization the week before last. Facebook did it quickly compared with the big tech and fan companies that did the same and tim They did it with a grow at any cost culture. We got more from Sarah Fryer Bloomberg News, big Tech team leader. She's also the author of the fantastic book No Filter, The

inside story of Instagram. Check it out. The way that Zuckerberg has chosen to run the company to grow at all cost strategy, the fact that he has keen laser focused on incrementally adding users, adding the time they spend adding revenue, and has kind of blocked out a lot of this, a lot of this criticism and considered it more of a public relations issue. That's really frustrating for the public. But if your Facebook, that's exactly what the

market wants. You to do, as evidenced by this one trillion market valuation, and so why would Facebook have any incentive to change from here? I really think that this is the lesson of of this week. The trillion dollar valuation came after just dismissed the FTC lawsuit on Facebook's monopoly power. So really this is a celebration of the fact that Facebook can just keep growing and and that growth as a priority is what investors want to see.

I mean, Sarah, every few years there seems to be some sort of speed bump with Facebook, and I think there's a lot of conversation. Okay, is this the beginning of the end of Facebook or some sort of derailing of of Facebook's massive says, whether it was that FTC lawsuit that you just mentioned, maybe the Cambridge analytic and data scandal a few years ago, a few years before that, the rise of snap and Snapchat for example. Um, how

does Facebook continue to keep moving forward and growing bigger? Well, if you think about it, most of those scandals, most of those revelations about the company have not hit its bottom line. Facebook is still adding users, They're still able to expand their audience. The amount of time they spent on the platform, they're able to move into new areas. Um with the acquisitions of WhatsApp in Instagram, they were

able to add young people people outside the US. And so this is this is a company that you know, they're not going to be slowed down by a data scandal. They're not going to be slowed down by regulatory scrutiny

unless something comes and hits them where it hurts. And I think that the long legal battle with with FTC or with Congress or whatever it may, whatever the case may be, UM Facebook still doing its daily job while all those things are happening, and investors do not seem that concern about the microscope that's been on the company over the last few years because it doesn't hit the bottom line. Sorry, you know this because I've talked with you before. I love this line in your story. Zuckerberg

runs his company like an emperor, paranoid about obsolescence. So how does that translate in terms of the internal culture. It's gotta be tough, and it's got to be all about growth. As much as Facebook says our top priorities your privacy, or use, your safety or all the all the statements they've come out with in the past few

years trying to british their image. The truth of the matter is, if you are a Facebook employee, your bonus, your promotion pinges on getting more people to use your product and getting more people to to click on whatever you've created. And if you can do that, if you can add to the to the number of minutes that people spent on Facebook, the number of posts they create, the data that goes into that advertising machine, that's what they want, that's what they reward. Those are the people

that ascend the ranks of Facebook. And if you are somebody who who raises your canon, says weight, I have an idea that will help um, you know, avoid Russian election interference or um, maybe we could. We we have some risks in these products. We need to clean up before we ship it. Facebook says, well, let's ship it first and figure that out later. There doesn't seem to be any public uproar over about that yet, and so why would we do anything to hinder our gross? Hey, Sarah,

where does Lena Cohn come into this? She's a new chair of the FTC, and people who antitrust circles in previous years knew about her because she really changed the way a traditional definition of of anti trust. And look, she's been very critical of big tech, Amazon most prominently,

and including Facebook as well. Lena con comes at it differently than her predecessors because historically we thought of monopoly as big company corners the market and something is able to charge predatory prices and drive out other people because they have just this hold on it. That's not how these big tech businesses work. Lena konsmost famous paper was about Amazon, but the same can be said for Facebook. You start in one market and then you just expand

and expand into adjacent businesses. Try to grow those businesses and try to create a platform on which other businesses are created. UM So for Amazon, that's their marketplace, that's aw us. For Facebook, you know, you think about all the small businesses that are running their entire livelihoods on virtual stores after being closed during the pandemic. You think about the creators on Instagram that are reliant on Facebook,

the media companies that use Facebook for audience development. There are all sorts of businesses that um that look to Facebook as their way to reach their customers. That's Sarah Fryer, Bloomberg News Big Tech Team leader also author of No Filter, The Inside Story of Instagram. I do wonder about what's the next chapter for Facebook, especially as it does feel like there's picked up momentum when it comes to the

regulatory environment. Yeah, there is an I think from a consumer perspective, need an investor perspective, it's Instagram that gets all the attention right now. Remember Facebook owes WhatsApp and there's still lots of questions about monetation there and then Oculus VR. How is Facebook thinking about dr Yeah, a lot of questions out there still to come. On Bloomberg Business Week, the founder and president of Para Villan, which works with the buyers and sellers of business jets. This

is Bloomberg. This is Bloomberg Business Week with Carol Messer and Bloomberg Quick Takes Tim Stinovik from Bloomberg Radio. People haven't just been getting back on planes, They Tim have also been buy man. For more on what's going on when it comes to private air travel, we checked in with Janine Yanarelli, founder and president of par Avion, which

represents international buyers and sellers of pre owned business jets. Wow, what a difference not even a year makes, But really the activity level ratched it up I would say mid fourth quarter and has not let up. It was absolutely unprecedented and continues to be so. Specifically what and who's doing what? Well? Private individuals. I would say that the bulk of the buyers for business and private aircraft today are still individuals, entrepreneurs. Uh. The driver last year was

really COVID. That was a motivation for an individual to create what we referred to as a health corridor. How do I get from point A to point the relatively safely and how do I control my environment? Well, that's relatively easily done through private jet travel. That continued into the fourth quarter, but I would say the drivers became a little bit different towards the end of the fourth quarter. Some of that was change in administration. That's always something

that a little bit rocks the aircraft sales marketplace. But after that it became an appetite for travel. I mean the impact comes from the decline and airline service uh, right, cutting of routes, the cancelations that you're now seeing. I think people are thinking they made a wise bit when they bought their own airplane. Will that continue though, as the airline industry increasingly ramps up. I mean, we know some of the predicaments. We've heard it from some of

the carriers. Not enough pilots who need to get back into the simulator and get their hours back up. I mean, obviously there's an adjustment in the supply chain of everything as the economy which was shut down completely and is reopening. Do you anticipate that's going to have an impact on what you will see in terms of activity. Oh. Absolutely. And this is not a problem that is easily solved.

I mean, just because demand is back, the airlines can't go simply flip the switch and put back online all the aircraft that they retired or i should say placed into preservation at the height of the pandemic and the number of crew members that they furloughed. This is going to be a multi year requirement for them in order to return to pre pandemic levels. You talked about individuals and entrepreneurs buying. Is this US international? Give me an idea of the demographics. Break it down as much as

you can, Bloomberg. We love to know specifics. So the bulk of the activity in the resale marketplace for business aircraft has always been North America, even more so today. I think at this particular moment, North America is accounting for about of the global aircraft sales. Part of what we're seeing is um a slow return to the market by those countries that are now opening back up, And the first ramp up you'll see is in four higher. By that, I mean those who are chartering aircraft or

buying into the fracture will share or club programs. Uh. It will take a global reopening before we see a real resurgence and aircraft sales activity outside of the continental United States. But for the moment, the appetite is extremely strong here and demand is outstripping supply, and that can also create dislocations for you. Do you anticipate a sales

slowdown because there isn't there the supply out there? Good observation, It has become the concern of people in the trade today is that how good can this here be if in fact we can't get our hands on airplanes. Well, I think it's relative. It's sort of cyclical, even among aircraft brokers. You know, one particular quarter you're extraordinarily busy, and then it's quiet, and I think the same will continue. UM. Hard to say new aircraft are a challenge to get

your hands on. In fact, you're probably looking at several years out before you can take delivery, even if you place an order at this time. So really the focus is on the pre owned aircraft marketplace, all right, and pre owned Uh, this isn't like you know the used car, you kick the tires, you get a great deal. I mean, give us an idea of what's a what's the typical pre owned aircraft? What do you get, what's the maker? What does it cost? Well, it depends on what one

is after. But let's talk about something in the mid size super midsized category, which I happen to be very well versed in at the moment because I'm offering to for sale. So I have an aircraft that is um seventeen years old and another one that is at twenty two years old. They are coast to coast capability. They're actually intercontinental capability, but it will require a stop for example, if you're going off the east coast into Europe. Uh. They are state of the art. They are mid range

on their inspection cycles. This is all important considerations because points towards the actual cost of the aircraft. You're talking about two planes that you've got for sale, ones I think seventeen years old, ones twenty two years old. Continue because I think our audience wants to know what are you selling. These aircraft fall into that midsize category that's Falcon fifty x is And you know, even though when you hear the words seventeen years and twenty two years,

that's really not that old. Uh, we look or we focus more on what is the overall total time and the overall care of the aircraft. And private jets, as you can imagine, are let's say, baby, a bit more than your commercial airliners. They just don't work as hard as a commercial airline or aircraft does. So consequently, we're not faced with some of the same maintenance issues on

a very rapid reoccurring basis. It's going to fall between four and four and a half million, and that certainly represents an appreciation from what those aircraft might have been worth fourth quarter of You know, one of the things that we've talked a lot about, and you said that part of the reason maybe people are tapping into the private jet market a little bit more is also the slow recovery uh in the commercial airline space and some

of us holding back commercial airlines is access to workers. How about in your world, because you can buy a private plane, but if you don't have a great private pilot who can fly it, or engineers to take care of it, Uh, it's not going to do any good very good point. I mean, the supply of qualified personnel is going to impact the aviation in industry across the spectrum.

I would say for the moment that while flight departments established flight departments are struggling and thinking about the next generation, they're well established enough at this point in time that they can manage the uplifts they currently are responsible for. But the future is very, very uncertain. There are entities, uh, some of the fractional shares, the club memberships, they're offering bonuses,

signing bonuses. Charter operators are taking on pilots, junior pilots, let's call it, starting out with far fewer accumulated hours and they might have five years ago. But all of that is in an effort to feed the pipeline, to train them, to indoctrinate them into the industry, and to hopefully retain them. Because there is some jumping between the private aviation industry and the airline industry back and forth.

Some some pilots would prefer a schedule, and when you fly the airlines, at least you have a set schedule. But private aircraft is more of a as needed basis. I mean, that's the whole purpose of having that aircraft is for some people simply a luxury, but for others it is an absolute business tool. That's Janine Yanarelli, founder and president of Para Villon. You're listening to Bloomberg Business Week still to come. What Amazon's new CEO can do

to change that company is called chair. You're listening to Bloomberg Business Week. This is Bloomberg broadcasting from the financial capital of the world, Bloomberg eleven Rio in New York to Washington, d C. Bloomberg to Boston, Bloomberg one O six one does San Francisco, Bloomberg nine sixty to the country Sirius XM Chado one ninety and around the globe the Bloomberg Business app and Bloomberg Radio dot Com. This

is Bloomberg Business Week. Well, any Jasse started his new job this week, his chief executive officer at Amazon, replacing billionaire Jeff Bezos as the head of the e commerce giant. Well, Carol for more on what we can expect from Jasse and really how he can improve company culture, especially among those hundreds of thousands of warehouse workers. I spoke with Heather Younger, founder of Employee Fanatics. This is a firm

that focuses on how to improve the employee experience. Well, I think no matter what, he needs to be really clear up what type of leader he's going to be, uh and and how he might be different from Bezos of course, and even though he's been there, you know, setting his mark, deciding what kind of leader he wants to be and how he's going to show up for all of those hundreds of thousands of people who are

looking to him for leadership. That's that's one thing I think. Secondly, um, he's going to need to take some real clear steps to listen to those people, because I'm not sure anybody has been listening and understanding what their needs are with their complaint might be, and just to be committed to doing the right thing as it relates to them. You mentioned listening, and it struck me because I just finished our colleague Bradstone's new book about Amazon, and I was

struck with many parts of it. But he shares this story from a little over a year ago April, when the United States in the midst of this pandemic. Amazon is hiring so many new people. These are essential workers. The service quickly becoming essential to people who are in lockdown and need to get groceries and supplies. And Jeff Bezos made a surprise visit to one of Amazon's warehouses, but it was the first time that he had visited one of those fulfillment centers in years. Yeah, and I

think that's a really big mistake. I'm hoping that Jesse says, you know what, I'm going to be the listening leader. I'm going to be going around and I'm gonna do a listening tour, go to as many as sinners as I can, even if it's virtual or in person, but in person probably better, so we can really see how people are living in this in the way in which they have to work every day and trying to trying

to get their work done. So yeah, I hope that would be his first step as listening to or it is just going around, Um, you know the listening is it's no, It'll go a huge way for those people because they hadn't been listening to they have people know when they've been heard, They know when they're cared for by the leaders who they look to for guidance, and that would build a level of trust that he needs right off the bat, particularly with any new initiatives he's

trying to get, you know, put through. How does he do this at scale though, because this is something that Amazon is a unique beast right it has fulfillment centers all over the world. Is that hundreds of thousands of employees. How does Jesse do this in a way that makes it look like he's going on He's going beyond just doing it for show. In the end, he doesn't have

to do it all by himself. He can have the whole seas to me, he can have outside consulting firms like my employee Fanatics right come in and help with some of the listening sessions. In the end, it's when they know that they are being heard and that there's an intent to act on at least some of what it is they're saying, and they see the results, and then you feed them back do actions, telling them what it is you're doing for them. They know they've been heard.

It makes it just makes the huge difference and validates it. It makes them feel that the warpant that they're doing is meaningful and they feel like there's more than just the day to day, but that there's it's leading to some bigger mission for the world. Okay, so apart from the listening tour, what else can Jesse you do, especially when it comes to working with other executives to help

build up that team. You know, right off the beat, if he's able to establish with his leadership team that that things are going to change, that it is going to be about making sure that they're driving a more positive culture and that every one of those people on the leisure team has to take responsibility, so he's not in it all by himself. That will be super clear.

Making sure that maybe he does put someone in charge that really is super focused on having the pulse for employees, suggesting really good avenues for cultural improvements um and making sure that they're always keeping those of the front line of the customer experience right at the front of all their cultural improvement so that they're you know, it's not so just coming from top down, but maybe he creates

culture teams all throughout the organization. And they report into this new person, but making sure that there's someone that has the pull. I think the other thing through all of this kind of crazy the time is making sure that that he and his team and the in the team in verse can be adaptable, less fearful, and they'll be less fearful, more adaptable when they're aware of changes that are coming down the pikes of being super open

and communicative about this. What are the takeaways that we can learn from a transition like Bezos and Jassy's that that we can all apply to our own corporate lives. I think is this idea of reinvention is a big one for reinventing. You know yourself as a leader, and then how do you and then if you're over the organization as a beastly as Amazon, how do you kind of reinvent but don't do it in the stylo and don't dispute at the leadership level? How do you? How

are you more inclusive in your decision making? Um, I think that's gonna be the biggest thing for leaders coming forward. And and I'm not just talking from you know, the marginalized group side, I'm just talking about generally, how are we more inclusive in the decision making process, that people feel bought into things. And when we're talking about these people that are not coming back, it's probably because leaders aren't getting a clue. They don't understand what it is

They're people needed from the beginning. They needed to be listening and they needed to be more inclusive. Thirty seconds Heather, we uh, you know, we know on Wall Street leaders of publicly traded companies are judged by returns. How are you going to judge Jesse? You know, I hate to say it, but those those news articles of things that you see, the coverage that's happening with employees and our

pastes leaving in their mouth. I think I'm gonna judge him by how how that goes down, and if it's gonna be if he's gonna be able to turn the tide of the negative culture and bad press that they're getting. What is he going to do to set his mark to create a more positive culture. That's how the younger founder of employee Fanatics. You're listening to Bloomberg business Week coming up, how meal Pal is putting their own spin

on online food delivery. This is Bloomberg. You're listening to Bloomberg Business Week with Carol Messer and Bloomberg Quick Takes Tim Stinovich from Bloomberg Radio. Yes, there is a buffet of food delivery apps and services to what I here? Okay, Well, we know that there's tons of options. There's Uber Eats, there's grub Hub, there's door Dash, there's there's Postmates. I

know I'm leaving some out. So when one advertises a free dinner delivery, we definitely wanted to know more, Okay, So this is why we checked in with meal pal co founder and CEO Mary big and see, by the way, she's also a co founder of class Pass as well. Meal Pal started as a subscription based meal plan restaurant service back in where users picked up their food. I used to used it a ton, Carol, before the pandemic. This was the way I got lunch, all right, I

love that. Well, the company now also offering to deliver it. We got a deep dive into how it all works and where it's all going. Meal Pals traditionally has been a meal pickup service, and we really focused on lunch and helping consumers save time and money when you're running out of the office to pick up a lunch UM.

You know, pre covid we helped consumers reserve over forty million meals at restaurants like Sweet Green, Chipotle, Take Jack, Pick fil A, UM, you know, kind of all of the actasual restaurants that people know and are really familiar with UM. And just recently we've added on a delivery service.

We certainly had a lot of interest in that as people transition to working from home and really have launched a bit of a different delivery service and that it's really geared at helping consumers save money, but making it really efficient and a good offering for the restaurant's business model as well. So tell us how it works. And I feel like to some extent it's like just in time inventory for the restaurants that they can really plan and know exactly how many people are going to buy meals,

but walk it through. If I am a member, tell me what I'm paying and what I'm getting for the service. Yeah, so as a member, you're getting lunch or as little or dinner for as little as about six dollars per meal, depending on what you book. So with meal Pal, as a consumer, you'll always save at least UM You're buying sort of a package of meals. And when you log into the website, you'll see that each restaurant on our

platform is offering just one menu option per day. So you might choose the kill pallet at Sea Green or the stake buritable at Chipotle. The men who's going to rotate on a daily basis, so you'll always have hundreds of choices of actually thousands of choices on a daily basis. But by having it all focused on one meal per restaurant, we're giving the restaurant really valuable efficiency and really valuable

operational capacity. Um. You know, the restaurant is able to have a couple of employees make just the meal Pow meals and they're making a lot of the same meals very quickly as opposed to making a lot of individual orders. And so especially right now as restaurants are facing pretty significant staffing challenges and trying to rehire. Wir one's really getting a value out of Meal Pow because they're able

to make their meals more efficiently. And I'm curious, so if I'm a member, what do I pay for the Are there's different plans? Correct? That's great. We have a couple of different plans, but our most common plan is a twelve meal plan and that's about eighty five dollars per months. UM. We also have a sixteen meal plan that's thirty nine dollars, and actually we have a trial

that's fifteen dollars. Will let you try out three meals and get free delivery on those meals as well, so you can really see how the service works and and make sure it's a good fit for you. And you have to order by what time, by a certain time

in the morning. Yes, So for our lunch product, you can actually order in real time now, so we still have a data algorithm we can predict where people will order from and still send orders for the restaurant advance that you can order all the way really through lunch time, and then for dinner you still have to order in advance. So for dinner you have to order by four o'clock

the day of. That is really interesting. So talk to me about the number of users, because you've been doing this with that you launched this, UM, tell me that's what for five years that you've been I mean most of our business you know, pre covid, we were really lunch focused and so we did over forty million reservations for lunch, we paid restaurants over two hundred and fifty million dollars and truly incremental revenue is a really valuable revenue,

really different than a delivery service provider because we're not taking a sea on each order that we sent to the restaurant. We're instead spending the restaurant a bulk order. So we can say to seakre and we want to send you a hundred orders for the same item, and they can price out what that hundred orders would be. Anything that passed some of those savings along. Because the consumers so really valuable partner to restaurants, I think, um,

that's sort of a core part of our DNA. We have to have a product that's beneficial to restaurants and it's helpful for restaurants and building good businesses, and then at the same time, we want to make sure we're saving consumers money and helping them have efficient meal. So, Mary, I'm fascinated by what you are doing because it feels like you're stripping it down and kind of simplifying the process, but and also reducing the cost uh and helping restaurants

as well as users in the process. Having said that, how many users do you have? What's the kind of growth that you're seeing. Yeah, I can't share user numbers, but I can tell you on a daily basis, there are tens of thousands of people who are using our products in cities really around the world. So we're available in twenty markets from New York to San Francisco, even internationally in London, Singapore, UH, Australia, UM. And I think really the the name of the game for us is

all about efficiency, right. We want to give our users a really efficient way to get lunch or dinner, whether they want to pick it up or whether they want to have it deliver if we want some saving money and saving time and we're saving the restaurants creating efficiency for them as well, which is really different than what others in the space have done in the past. Well, let me just push you a little bit. I understand

you can't share numbers, but how sticky is it? I mean if someone when someone signs up for a meal plan or do they have to commit to six months a year one month? How does that work? Yes, so we do thirty days cycles, so it's a monthly commitment. You know, people don't have to renew after that. The

overwhelming majority of people do renew after one cycle. So similar to class pass and many other subscription models, we've found that could be a really good way to build a business and and really to have some predictability for our restaurant partners as well. So you're not spending a ton of money on marketing to kind of keep people in or do you like, what's your biggest cost of operation? Yeah, I mean our biggest cost of the costs of the team and our engineers and the people who are building

the product. Um. You know, we don't spend a ton of money on marketing. The majority of people who are signing up from meal puth. I've heard about it from a friend or a coworker. Uman. I think especially when people were in office, this is the type of thing that would catch on in one office and you'd have you know, entire floors of people at Sydney Bank or JP Morgan or Credits with all using meal Pal to get lunch together and kind of facilitating that that sort

of social time of their day for them. Um do you see. I mean, I'm thinking about the established players that have been out there, you know, all of us. If we go to I'm looking at my phone, if I go to my food apps, you know, whether it's grub Hub, whether it's store Dash, whether it's UM. I've got Yelp, I've got open Table, I've got uber Eats. I mean, do you see yourself as a competitor to them or how do you see it differently? Yeah? I

mean our model is really different. Right they's wanted to order a burrito bowl from Chipotle right now and have it delivered to right now, You're gonna be paying upward the twenty on most of those apps. Now, the brutal bowl might cost only two into twelve dollars, but when you kind of layer in all of the feeds, we're gonna be paying quite a bit for that sort of

on demand experience. UM with meal Pal, now with our delivery product or pick up, you're gonna be getting that exact same meal for you know, eight or nine dollars. So I think, you know, meal Pal is really well footed to people who are consistently ordering restaurant food, and you can kind of say like, yeah, I do order kick out, or I do want to do delivery six times a month, ten times months, whatever it might see this is going to be a much more efficient way

to do that. Um, it's interesting to uh. I mean, do you have any indications that you said that most people who sign up for a month, they stay with you, and they stay with you four months, for the year, for years. Yeah, We've got people who have been with us for several several years. H. I mean, you know, we've got people who have literally saved over ten thousand

dollars using meal pal at this point. If you look at all of the meals they reserve compared to you know, the cost that would have been if they were buying them at retail. Well, I'm going to tell you in my household too, it's just because of the pandemic. They're a lot of food ordering going on and the additional fees, and all of a sudden you look at it and you're right, you order a salad that maybe doesn't cost that much, but once you throw on all the fees,

you're like, I just spent thirty bucks for a salad. Uh. And some guilt there. There's a lot of guilt. Um. What about your demographics of your users? Is it a younger crowd, is it across the age spectrum? Or give what can you share with us about the demos of who's using your service? Yeah, so pre COVID, it definitely

stewed a bit younger. It was people who were sort of you know, they're twenty two to three five, working in offices and looking to save money on lunch and really wanting to get lunch in the restaurant on a daily basis. Um of course, stuff shifted with COVID, so we started to have more families using the product. We started to expand our product offering to be available in suburbs as well, so kind of outside of that core

urban area where we started. Um, you know, I think we really do focus on areas where there's a good amount of density. Sending us high number of orders to our restaurants is really key. You know, if we can send topotely a hundred orders all for the same items, it's going to be really efficient for them to make those meals. And who want to make sure any markets that we're in or any restaurants that we're partnering with, we can really send them meaningful volume so it's beneficial

to their operation. Mary, how do you pick and choose partners or do you pick and choose are Are you pretty open to whoever wants to be on the platform. Yeah, So we capture ratings for every meal served on the platform. You know, if if we find that a restaurant doesn't have ratings that are in line with where we think they should be, will be talking about restaurant and kind of making a determination of whether they should say or not.

I think the unique thing though about food is that a meal that I give five stars, you might you might hate and give one star, and vice versa. A key part of our product is our recommendation engine. So about fifty per of the reservations we get on a daily basis people choosing the meal that we've recommended for them. We recommend three meals for a user on a daily basis based on what they've reserved and what they've rated

in the past. So we really start to understand users preferences and do a pretty good job of mat see them up with the best meal for them on a given day. But we work with a lot of the local restaurants as well. You know, hear you guys talk about Pizza earlier. Pizza Loved Emily in New York. They're an amazing partner they've got I think some of the most creative pieces in New York City. Or kest Day

is another great one, or pass. I mean, we've got a lot of mom of top restaurants that are you know, maybe one or two locations, and you know, really all over the world. We've got over five thousand different restaurant partners in total. That's meal Pal co founder and CEO Mary Biggins. And that wraps up the weekend edition of Bloomberg Business Week from Bloomberg Radio. Thanks so much for joining us. I'm Carol Masser and I'm Tim stunt Of That could be sure to tune into our Bloomberg Business

Week daily show Monday through Friday. It starts at two pm Wall Street Time on Bloomberg Radio. You can also watch our daily broadcast on YouTube just search Bloomberg Global News. Also check out our Bloomberg Business Week podcast. You can find it at Bloomberg dot com, Apple, or wherever you get your podcast. Bloomberg Business Week is available on newsstands now, at Bloomberg dot com and on the Bloomberg Terminal. It's that special double heist issue. You can also see me

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