Shipping Containers Offer Mystery Prizes

You can also listen to our radio show at two pm Eastern Time on Bloomberg Radio or watch us on YouTube search Bloomberg Global News. Well, it is Giving Tuesday, and one company that is working to engage businesses and people in the AIDS and COVID pandemics is Read. They do it by partnering with brands which as Amazon, Apple, Louis Witton, Starbucks. So many more companies here with more on the work they are doing and the impact they are having is Red Red President in chief operating Officer

Jennifer Latito. She joins us via zoom in New York City. Read by the Way, their sister organization of One, which was founded by Bono and other activist to and extreme poverty and preventable diseases. So they really are just all in on fixing what ails our world. UM, Jennifer, good to have you here with Tim and myself. How are you. I'm great, Thank you so much, and thank you so much for having me. No, absolutely great to have you here and so relevant in terms of what the world

continues to fight. Here. You work with UM, you know a lot of brands. Tell us a bit of how you work, how those partnerships ultimately ultimately end up in raising a ton of money for for some really good causes. Yeah. Absolutely. Uh So for fifteen years, REDD has been focused on fighting HIV and AIDS UM and working with the biggest companies in the world in order to do that. UM.

That continues to be an important priority for us. But what we've realized at this point is that you're never going to win the battle against HIV if you don't also take on the other battle that the world is facing in COVID. So we have really expanded our our mission to include funding for COVID vaccines, treat and testing

in addition to all of them. All of the funding and support that we've given for HIV, and I think from a RED perspective, what's really important is we work with those companies not only to generate the money, but to generate the heat to get people to care, to have conversations like this, how do you get people well and to care in a pandemic when they're facing it

each and every day. Like the thing is is, it's a different challenge than having someone care about something that ails people half a world away, which is I think away away. A lot of people thought about RED previously, absolutely and it's it's it's how people have thought about HIV, and unfortunately we're starting to make the same mistakes with covid um. You know, I think that with HIV, a lot of people think that is a crisis that is over.

It is absolutely not over um And you know, there is we know how to end that, We have the tools that we need to end it. And I think from a RED perspective, what's really important to understand is that we have to keep the heat on it um because right now we're in a precarious position where we do not have equitable access to vaccines. That's what this campaign is aiming to do, is to get people to care,

to get people to look at this as a global issue. UM. You know, obviously right now the headlines are being dominated by another variant. UM. That variant is because we do not have vaccines and low income countries. So while we're doing boosters here in the States and other places, less than ten percent of low income countries have gotten their first shot. So from a red perspective, our campaign, the Code red campaign, is about engaging consumers, engaging customers of

these brands. UH to do you know whether it is our rewards campaign today is Giving Tuesday. We have an amazing idea which is to allow people to use their credit card rewards points. They can be turned into cash donations and those donations can go right to not only buying the vaccines, but very importantly getting those vaccines distributed

where they're needed most. You know, Jennifer, when we do the numbers, and we often do it here at Bloomberg, about the number of people who have lost their lives to COVID specifically UM, and it's just staggering in terms

of where we are. I think in terms of HIV, I think we all thought it was more under control, but when you look at some of the numbers globally, I was just looking at some stats, approximately thirty seven point six million people across the globe with HIV and twenty of these thirty five point nine million we're adults. One point seven million were children. It's just a reminder we have a long way to go to really getting this UM out of our system, you know, out of

it being a really significant problem. Absolutely, and I think that you know, which is why it's so important when when we are very focused on COVID, to not overlook the impact that we've had for you know, again, Red's been doing it fifteen years, the disease has been around for several decades. There has been incredible progress. UM. We are seeing people, you know, AIDS is no longer a

death sentence if you get diagnosed with HIV. There is treatment available that will stop you from passing that onto your partner and most importantly, passing it along to your child, so that we can see an HIV free generation in our future. We will not do that if we don't keep up the work that we're doing to fund the HIV programs as well as now what's needed to end the COVID pandemic. And again that's what this campaign is

meant to do engage people. You know, we have you know, Read is known for our incredible products, so you can now shop Read and uh, you know, I would encourage everybody to go to code red dot org and you can find out how to use your credit card rewards points as well as shop as well as game. You can even play mind graft Um, you know. And we're really about making sure that we are giving customers and employees of the world's biggest brands the ability to help

end this pandemic. Jennifer, how long do you think Red will have to exist? You know, that's that's an interesting question. I mean, at one point we talked about like, wouldn't it be amazing if we put ourselves out of business? You know, I think that Red is a really innovative model, and I think that right now again, unfortunately, we're still battling the HIV pandemic. We are now battling COVID. I don't know what's going to happen, if there's going to

be another one coming around the corner. Um. But I think what's really special and unique about Red is our model. So whether our mission changes, you know, I think that we will continue to find ways to innovate that model and ensure that we're engaging the world's biggest companies along with their customers. All Right, We're gonna leave it on that note. Hey, Jennifer, good luck with the mission. And

again code red dot org. You can find out more information there and certainly shop code reddish as she talked about. She is, of course, Jennifer Lotito. She's president chief operating officer at Red joining us via zoom in New York City. Great question that you asked, like, right, Like the goal is to maybe put yourself out of business exactly, but it does when I think about pandemics, Right, We've been

told there's going to be more. Right and if you're not focusing on HIV AIDS or coronavirus US in COVID nineteen malaria, right, other things that eradicated poverty. Like, there's just so many issues out there. This is Bloomberg Business Week with Carol Masser and Bloomberg Quick Takes Tim Stinovic on Bloomberg Radio. Well, a lot going on when it comes to COVID. The EU has record at least forty four confirmed cases of the omicron variant in eleven countries.

Does say that all of the people infected are asymptomatic, showing only mild symptoms. Oxford saying there's no evidence that the new variant defeats the vaccine it developed with Astra Zeneca and Durna, predicting vaccines will struggle while the with this variant, while the World Health Organization warned that the variant could feel a fresh surge in infections with severe consequences.

All of this happening, Carol, while the U s c DC is considering tightening travel restrictions and rules, Germany taking a step closer towards making vaccines compulsory. So we slew of news happening around the world as a result of this variant. I feel like we've been here before, all right, So let's see what John Laryerman has to say. He's our health team editor at bloom News on the phone from Boston. John lot going on, trying to understand. It's

confusing financial markets. It's confusing we we merror mortals. Um. I don't know how do today? Isn't it? It's only Tuesday. It's only Tuesday. I keep I keep telling myself that because it feels much late in the week. Yeah, there's so many there's a great deal of confusing news going on out here. It's difficult to make sense of. And I think a lot of it has to do with, um, say, government trying to be extremely cautious and to a degree,

drugmakers as well. And yet I think that there is a certain amount of confidence about, you know, the the effectiveness of vaccines um and uh uh it remains to be seen for the effectiveness of drugs as well. UM. So it's it's difficult to put this in all all, all of it in context because there's news coming in from so many different directions. But um uh so far um. What the drugmakers are saying, at least most of them is that they think that their vaccines will be at

least somewhat effective um against omicron. What does what does somewhat mean though? And I don't think we really know, but the the vaccine so far with the percent effective, So that's a really effective vaccine, you know, you think about it. That's much more effective than the blue vaccine, right um. Flue vaccines sometimes they tend to go between thirty and effective in a given year, so it's it's there. There's still they seem very effective in keeping people out

of the hospital. We don't know. I think I think the Maderna comments earlier may have thrown a bit of a scare into people because they said they thought it would be less effective and we would need a new vaccine. But that's not what the other drug makers are saying. And then the other thing that you know, counterfeit knowing that um is uh that in the places where O Macron cases have been seen, UM, they seem to be

less uh severe um. And this is news that come out of both the EU and South Africa, both of which have excellent surveillance and excellent health care systems. Now, does that mean that these are breakthrough cases in people have already been vaccinated and so that's why they were severe, or does it actually mean that it's a less severe virus. It's very difficult to say. Or was it just the population that was seen in was it younger people, children?

You know, people who usually don't develop uh severe cases. So there's a lot of data. I mean, it's it's not to say. Will never find the answer to these questions. I think we will at some point. But um, what have we known about you know? O Macron? I think it entered the vocabulary about five days ago, right, So, um, there's still a lot to find out about this. And the other thing to remember is, you know, um, here in the US, we still haven't seen omicron. We will,

there's no doubt that we will. But um, but is that is that John, because we don't do the same kind of sequencing that other countries do. We did a story yesterday in which we sort of laid out, you know, some of the issues around the surveillance system here in the US. And we do a lot of sequencing, there's no question we do a lot, but the intensity of it, the percentage of cases that are tested in sequences sequenced is lower than say, you know, some countries like of UK,

for example, which is the star. You know, they are the world leader in this and which we probably ought to be trying to catch up to. And actually South Africa is a very good job with this stuff as well. South Africa you know, huge health problems and have to keep an eye and stuff like HIV, which huge rates of So they're very good with sequencing there and that's you know, there's every reason that that's why they found owned there because they're actually keeping such close airing issues

like John Larroman, thank you so much. How team editor Bloomberg News on the phone from Boston. You're listening to Bloomberg Business Week with Carol Messer and Bloomberg Quick Takes Tim Stinovic on Bloomberg Radio. So call it storage wars on steroids to some extent um supply Jayan Carnage, creating opportunities for companies that are willing to take a chance on some random goods. Tim, what's it gonna be? Is it going to be a car? Or is it gonna

be pumpkin seeds? Maybe some rotting foot both, It could be all of the above. It is a fantastic story. Joel Weber as editor at Bloomberg Business Week. He's with us in the Bloomberg Interactive Broker studio. Jeff Wise this freelance contributor for Bloomberg Business Week. He joins us on the phone from Westchester, New York. So, Joel, how is this an industry Oh man, this story brought me so

much joy. It was like, we just keep getting a horror messages about the supply chain and how everything's broken, and then like you get a little gym like this that reveals that there are people who specialty is to deal with boxes that are sort of mysterious mystery boxes. You know, it's like the little mystery not just any boxes though, right, exactly like container boxes. And it turns out this is a an industry in and of itself that we probably wouldn't write about it if there wasn't

some supply chain carnage. UM. So, Jeff, tell us about how you found out about this amazing story. Well, I was doing a story about ever Given and one of the aspects of the story that was kind of drew my attention was the fact that nobody really knew what was on that ship. You know, there was something like twenty containers, and there were there were various reports like, um, it had been reported that there was a life sized train of source rex that was heading for a mini

golf course in England. Um, but like nice little details like that, but nobody really knew what the bulk of it was. And there was this young guy Uh in the UK who um was more talkative than most of these these these salvage buyers, and he um kind of became like sort of internet instant media star over in the the UK. He was on the local news and everything, talking about what he had. What he had, He had taken about twenty containers off the ship and was trying to,

you know, figure out what to do with it. Um. He had actually ten containers five tons or something of raw cabbage that had been picked by farmers in China putting these containers and was destined for Europe. And then of course it was stuck for four months the heat and has liquefied had turned into goop. And so this is a guy who, um, you know, became the centerpiece

of my of my article for Business Week. Um. You know, he can both turn around stuff that has some value left in it um, or he can take stuff that's absolutely toxic or dangerous or whatever it has to be disposed of. Um. So he can he whatever it is, he kind of uses his cleverness and his connections to find out the best thing to do with it. And how is the that you know in that uh you know,

these could be mystery boxes, it isn't it. Don't The companies that trans transport these containers know exactly what's in every container for the most part, Yes, Um, each container has a manifest and it's sealed, and so there's there's not SUPSI to be any tampering, but there's shenanigans that go on and and sometimes the manifest is vague. In the case of the one that I wrote about in the story, it just said household goods bracket car and

they was what that meant? Does anybody's gass? Like what what? What value? Do as on to that? It's like a complete, you know, random gas. Um. But he was telling me sometimes this wasn't in the article, but there's a trade where people basically because you cost money to dispose of stuff,

especially dangerous stuff. So what they'll sometimes do is they'll they'll bundle up you know correctly, um say plastic recycling in the front of a container, and then behind that it's like either just junk or garbage or something hazardous and then then you ship it, you know, to Asia or to Africa, and then it's you know, effectively you're disposing of it. The same day I was there, he showed me the car. He had a load of tires that had been illegally shipped off and had been sent back,

and so he was going to dispose of that. So I understand why someone might not claim twenty containers full of what was formerly known as cabbage. But why why would something like that car not get claimed? Like? How how frequently does stuff just not get claimed at the port? He is not a detective. His job is just to figure out what to do with this stuff, and he like the quicker he can do it, the better. So yeah, my instinct is the same as yours. I'm like, how

do you know? But he that's not his approach, so he doesn't know, Like he has no idea what happens. This guy could have died. He could have just like looked at the storage charges and been, um, I don't want to deal with this anymore. But this is a real problem. You know, the containers sit there and whatever is in it is not gaining any value, and and

the costs are mounting. I actually wound up. I was I was over in the UK doing a couple of stories, and I wound up sharing a cab with a woman whose son was in the furniture importation business, and she was telling me he was looking at he might go bankrupt because there's such a shortage of truck drivers because of Brexit. All their truck drivers left and they have a real problem. They just can't move stuff and the

longer it sits, you know, worst. So I just had this image of him like rubbing his hands together and like, oh, suppledging problems, all those containers you know, sitting out there. Is he like is he just you know, kind of expecting kind of a windfall? Well, um, I mean it's been good, but he but there's plenty for him to do anyway. I mean, this is you know, what's so interesting about this story is that you know, containers are

kind of routinized. I mean you're basically taking what used to be every item was was individually, you know, put on board a ship by Steven Oor's and everything has been kind of routinized into these identical boxes and moved by the tens of thousands through these ports and it's it's we are are all around the world part of

the system that is that is brought together. And here you have these guys who are kind of breaking that mold and there and they're and and they're sort of taking things back to the idiosyncrasy that's kind of inherent in all these little transactions that are packaged onto these boxes. Which doesn't answer your question, all I I grant you, but but is the problem getting worse. Well, the problem is bad there. It's like we have a slightly different

problem here. We don't have Brexit, and we weren't quite as affected by the blockage of the Suez Canal, which had these sort of ripple knock on effects over in Europe but not so much here. Um, but we do have the kind of COVID backlog. The President had a press conference last week where he specifically addressed this, um and the people that I talked to everyone has kind of a different sense of how long this is gonna look, but it's it was anything from eight months to two years.

This is gonna be with us. Yeah, I just think, like a guy like this, it's just like it seems like this would be like Christmas every every month unless you're getting and it's like a six year old. It's like, you know, anything that's wrapped up is like a surprise, and like this is the very counterous things. Right when things are going bad for everyone else, it's good for them, right, the more stuff. Every time things rot or go awry,

these guys are here to pick up the slack. And I think there's you know, even when things are quote unquote normal, things always go awry. I'll pass on the cabbage and say yes to the Sedan, even though you know it's so what, so what. I probably could sell it more now than I could have. There's no title control. You'll sell that car quickly, all right, Jeff Wise, this is a great read. Freelance contributed to Bloomberg Business Week in the upcoming issue of the magazine. Jil Webber, Editor

Bloomberg Business Week in our interactive broker studio Pumpkin Seeds. No, I know, all right, you're listening to Bloomberg Business Week. This is Bloomberg Radio. This is Bloomberg Business Week with Carol Masser and Bloomberg Quick Takes Tim Stinovic on Bloomberg Radio. Among our most read stories on the Bloomberg, this one is about a secretive robot that is helping one investment firm locate winners. Robots and finance. They're not new to him,

but this is something different. Yeah, this is not just about picking the winners, but it's about avoiding picking the losers. Right, right. This is the the same with investing. Right, It's not only about gaining money, but it's about making sure you don't lose a lot of money. It is, but there's also a big human element involved. Unfortunately, we have a Hammond Deals Report human Bloomberg News a human. Not last time we check robot, although yeah, he gets scoops like a

like some sort of super hero EDHAMM. Did it great to have you with us this afternoon? Tell us about this robot that Stripes is using and has been using. Great to be with you guys. Um, look, I think that's the first thing said. Yes, the robot's secretive, but only because Strikes itself is secretive. It's a very very private exity firm. And by that I mean they have never done the press release, they've never done an interview. They don't really go out and make any noise about

what they're doing. Do you know what? You know what? You know? What's so funny? On our call this morning, on our call when we're talking about doing this story, I said, what is Stripes? Am? I should I have heard of this company? Like we are not really stupid? Yeah? No, but you should have because that was where I was.

I became interested in them because some of their portfolio companies were going public and we're having these insane I p o s and becoming quite well known brands, and I was like, well, who's this company that keeps showing up again and again and again on the shelf hold to Pay and no one seems to know anything about and they're looking into them, even with Mike of Bloomberg and all of our data. I was like, we don't show a huge amount about them. This has got to

be an interesting story. And so I dug in and dug in and eventually started to piece together this thing that they have, which I think is fairly unique in private equity, which is that they're using you know, what has been a long term trend in hedge funds, sort

of algorithmic trading. They use using that same kind of technology to actually source deals, and then they're using humans to go and build relationships to get into those deals and then help manage those companies through their you know, through their growth from early stage right away through I p O S. And it's it's something that has obviously worked extraordinarily well for them, at least thus far well.

And it sounds like the more data sonar, right is it's known internally um, but the more data it accumulates, the smarter it seems to get. And that's helping it avoid losses right right exactly, so, and this was key points of the story. It was like, yes, it has these great return numbers and you know, long term I R are that is way above what would be considered

normal in the industry. But actually the more interesting part to me was that like, over a period of time, it's lost ratio has gone to sube, which is almost unheard of it in investment. I mean, really, what that means is that like if you pick twenty investments in a fund, you're you're you're losing money on on almost none of them. I mean, it's it's just a remarkable

thing to do. And obviously the robot is a big part of that because it's able to refine the companies that it puts in front of the investment professionals, that strips and and so you have what seems like a very very good and consistent investment model for them. The key thing that they said to me when I was sort of digging into this, and they weren't cooperating with me on this piece, but they did say, look, the

technology is only useful for our firm. It wouldn't be something that anyone else could just plug it and go and I think what that means is that the kind of investments the robot picks are ones that actually makes sense for the investors. That strips into their professional expertise.

It wouldn't necessarily work at any investment fund. And what is what is the data that they're able that's that stripes is actually and this and so in our robot is actually able to to dig into because these are private companies, so this type of data isn't readily available. So what does it look at? What are the inputs? Yeah, it's a great question. I obviously was not able to establish exactly what it looks at because that would be

sort of giving away their secret source. But it it takes from a very wide range of different data groups and fact sets. And some of that is, you know, news articles like we were on private companies. A lot of it is stuff like customer satisfaction surveys, credit cards scanned, and sort of more granular stuff. Um. The the interesting

thing is how it scores. It's from what I understand, it has a scoring mechanism that sort of puts a tiny, tiny proportion of the companies it looks at in the sort of the box that says that the Stripes investors. This is you know, this is a top score for us. What have they invested in? Cookies? Cookies there, that's right there in Levian Bakery there. Did you get to eat any of those for your reporting? That's something I haven't done yet, Okay, you and me, Third Avenue, Upper East Side.

I might even order some to the office in studio. But they're in cookies. They are in Parade, which is this like fas stuff and coming underwear group. They're in on running there in Monday. They are in Remittly, which

is the cash transfer out. They're in a lot of different companies, and a lot of very successful companies, and four of which went public over the summer and have had As I say, it's sort of like rapid rapid growth, even post idea, although that may have called off slightly today, but along with everything else, but it's interesting when we know that there's a lot of money chasing, especially a lot of younger companies, it does sound like that this

is giving them a big advantage, both on the upside but particular on the downside as well. And Hammond, thank you so much. Blomberg News Deals reporter ed Hammond on the phone, in New York City. I love this story. I love living cookies. Okay, I didn't know that they've had private equity investment. Could you just think about it? Right? Like? Uh? And ultimately these companies go public if you get in early enough, you think about the potential for rewards. You

need the robot. You're listening to Bloomberg Radio. I'm rob Yeah, I bet you let me drive. Oh no, no, no no, this is not a toy night. Please, I'll do the ridings. I want to drive. It's a good question. This is the drive to the clothes on Bloomberg Radio. All right, everybody just got ten minutes left in today's trading session. We are pretty much at our lows when it comes to the SMP and the DOLL a little bit off

of it when it comes to the NASDA. But definitely it does feel like a recalibration when it comes to investors as they try to make sense of J. Powell's testimony today, because he certainly seemed a little bit hawkish. But keep in mind rates are still low, low, low. Let's see what Aaron Cannon has to say, co founder and chief executive officer at Clear Harbor Asset Management of a billion in assets under management. Aaron back with us

on the phone from Stanford, Connecticut. He Aaron, Uh, it's been interesting the last week or so, certainly concerns about the latest COVID variant, and then we had J. Powell today. What was the most significant thing you think we got from the Fed chief? Well, certainly the pivot around the

acceleration of the taper. We knew the taper was coming, but the notion that perhaps they would accelerate it by two months just sort of suggest that poll has has pivoted from a belief that inflation is transitory to now being seemingly concerned about the sort of stickiness factor of inflation.

Of course, as you have the the other headwind of of the uncertainty factor around this new variant, and you know the question around transmissibility and lethality and whether or not the current vaccines will will prove effective or not, and so sort of the perfect elixir for higher volatility, which we've really seen now over the last uh several days. I think we bottomed on through this year and implied volatility about fifteen and it's it's up over twenty seven today.

And as as you uh noted, to long long dated treasuries are are lower today even though UH Paul is seemingly concerned about inflation. So I think that sort of suggests to me that the market is UM is maybe believing Paul around taper, but but not so much around the idea that he can UH convey a more aggressive tightening UH program around a higher FED funds right in two thousand and twenty two. So how many reckons style

these competing forces happening right now? One is Fittrick Helle's comments about taper, and the other one is about this transmissibility of unknown, the new variant running rampant throughout the world right now, and the concerns around that because that could lead to shutdowns and it could lead to a

decline in economic activity. Yeah, Tim, that's a great question, because it's it's almost odd in my mind that Paul would decide this week to serve pivot the issue of inflation when there's really no new inflation data this week, UM, and two weeks ago he was a little more certainly in the transitory camp. So I'm a bit baffled by that, UM, And I wonder if this is akin to this sort of UH taper tantrum of two thousand and eighteen just

before Christmas. Um. With that said, the virus at least at an anecdotal level, maybe less lethal and is more transmissible than than the delta variant. Now that's quite normal, Um, that this would occur, um as Um, A virus is trying to sort of remain uh quote unquote alive in a in a population, transmissibility tends to spread and um

lethality tends to tends to move lower, Aaron. It says something though, right for j Powell, to Tim's point that he was comfortable enough in you know, an environment where over the past three days we've seen volatility in a big way, and we've seen the concerns about the variant. But for him to still feel confident in his testimony and going before lawmakers to take the word transitory off the table, to say that we might speed up the pace at which we uh cut back on those asset purchases.

Does it speak to the underlying strength that he sees in the economy even with all of that going on. Well, Um, you know, I don't know, is the short answer, Um, But you know, I must confess I'm sort of in the camp that still believes that if it were not for COVID, we would not have an inflation problem, and that if we do have a post COVID world, if COVID can dissipate to the point where the global economy

can can normalize. And is that a two thousand and two event or two three events, We do not know, but I believe it is something for the future, that there is an episodic or transitory or whatever term you want to use nature to inflation and bottlenecks should subside UM and some of the sort of structural headwinds too uh too inflation should also rear rear their head again, which is that you know, we do have an aging worker population, we do have a decline in global UH

rate of population growth. More more generally, UM productivity gains through technological advancements should prove disinflationary or continue to prove

disinflationary over time. But you know, there's also the other side of this that that I think we need to be cognizant about, and maybe this is where Paul is is right now, and that is there's a bit of a deglobalization effort underway where I think a lot of corporate um corporations are realizing that the notion notion of just in time uh may may be less important than you know, having you know, as the phrases just in case, having you know, production here in the United States or

with our neighbors, and not with a nemesis economically, militarily, and so that can be inflationary over time. And maybe that's a sticky part of this equation. Hey, and we just have about a minute left with you, and I'm wondering the fun days like today, you're getting calls from clients because they're so used to seeing the stock market at least go one way higher. Yes, I mean, to be honest with you, our our phones have been quiet on that front. And I think that's because we stay

in touch with our clients. We have an asset allocation and a risk management framework that's unique to each client. And so the idea that a client may need cash today or tomorrow doesn't mean we run out and have to sell equities in this market today. That would mean I think that we're doing something quite irresponsible in the planning process. So I think our clients are probably reasonably

calm about where things are. They know that volatility is a natural function of markets, but they also know that we're, you know, looking after their asset allocation and that we're creating a risk adjusted portfolio that's specific to them both

for the short, medium and long term in their financial life. Well, it's for me, it just feels like there's a recalibration of so many different things going on, whether it's in the energy markets, whether it's in demand, whether it's people leaving the workforce for good and just different things going on. But but we're definitely seeing things play out in the market. Hey, Aaron,

thank you so much. Co founder, chief executive officer at Clear Harbor Asset Management roughly one billion in assets under management with us on the phone once again from Stamford, Connecticut. Thanks for listening to Bloomberg Business Week. Download the podcast on iTunes, SoundCloud, or Bloomberg dot com, and you can also listen to our radio show at two pm Eastern on Bloomberg Radio or watch us on YouTube search Bloomberg Global News