MacKenzie Scott’s Giving Transforming the Bezos Fortune

You can also listen to our radio show at two pm Eastern Time on Bloomberg Radio, or watch us on YouTube search Bloomberg Global News. We've got to get to the virus and vaccine news we have. US vaccine supply should increase enough by April to allow anyone who wants a shot to begin getting one. This is according to Dr Anthony Faucci. UH. This even as vaccines are distributed to the oldest Americans, their share of COVID nineteen deaths in the US has not obeyed. A demand as is high.

Also as the US begins rolling out vaccines at pharmacy, so we're seeing the rollout happen uh as for global cases A hundred and seven point five million deaths passing two point a million, and more than a hundred fifty two million COVID shots have been given worldwide. Great to

have back with us, Dr Eric Toner. He's a senior scholar with the Johns Hopkins Center for Health Security and a senior scientist in the Department of Environmental Health and Engineering at the Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health, Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Heart Health, supported by Michael R. Bloomberg, Founder, Bloomberg LP, and Bloomberg Philanthropies. Dr Turner with us once again on the phone from Baltimore. Dr Toner, nice to have you here with Tim and myself. UM,

so talk to me. I feel pretty upbeat by hearing, uh what Dr Fauci says in terms of folks getting access to the vaccine here in the US. Do you think that's a realistic goal? Do you think it is probably a fairly realistic goal. I mean, we're doing really quite well, despite the frustrations that so many people are feeling with reguards to their personal access to the vaccine. We are doing quite well nationally in terms of the

number of people being vaccinated. So I do think that there's a pretty reasonable chance that most people have access to the vaccine sometime in the spring. I don't know for sure if it could be April, but sometime in the spring I think is reasonable. So what sometimes in the spring? What does that mean for reaching I don't like to use the term herd immunity, but seventy of the population vaccinated if people have access to it, it's not necessarily the same thing as them actually getting the

vaccine and us being on the other side of this pandemic. Sure, well, the real question is how much how much more vaccine can be delivered um and administered. We are finding that we can administer more vaccine than it is being produced right now, with producing about ten million doses per week, which is enough to vaccinate about a million and a

half people per day. But we need to get to about three million people per day if we wanted to hit the target of getting sent me five per cent of the population vaccinated by some time over the summer. I think it's I think it's realistic. Um, we are getting we should be getting more vaccine from both Maderna and Visor this month. The Johnson Johnson vaccine looks like it'll get um emergencies authorization this month UM, and so

we'll have more vaccine. And I think that it's reasonable it will get to three million doses a day and that should get us to where we want to be this summer. It's great. Does that happen with Visor and bion Tech and uh Maderna or does that take a different type of vaccine the introduction of one of the newer vaccines that haven't yet been approved. Yeah, it is. It assumes that assumes that the Johnson Johnson vaccine comes online as intestated, which it looks like it will. Yeah, exactly. Hey.

The one conversation Dr Turner that I have a lot at home is understanding you know variants and how that plays into it. It's certainly something that is now in the headlines a lot understandably. So if this schedule that Dr Fauci and you you agree with in terms of rolling out the vaccine, is it fast enough enough to stay ahead of the variants so that we can ultimately get ahead of COVID. The bottom line is, we don't know for sure, are you know, a horse race between

the vaccine and the variance? If if we are, we don't yet know how rapidly the variance will become the predominant strain. It does look like that will happen, that the UK variant looks like a dominant straint probably sometime this spring. If we get enough people vaccinated by that time, it shouldn't be an overwhelming problem. If if not, then we could see another series and surge. And so how quickly then can we pivot to take the existing vaccines

and adapt them. Is that a pretty quick and easy process, says the layperson and journalist. Yes, uh, it depends on your point of view. Your point of view is a manufacturer of the vaccine is no problem at all. Um. You know, for the rest of us. It does take a while, and there has to be some testing after after the vaccines and tweets. It's been tweaked. But it's important to realize the existing vaccines work against the variance. They just don't work quite as well as they do

against the classic strain. So it's not that they're not effective against the variance, it's just they're not quite as effective, so they still work. One thing that I've been thinking a lot about is expectations. And let's say that a family had family members who were in their sixties and

they were scheduled to get vaccinated. UM, does that you know in the in the coming weeks, Does that mean that this those those people who are in their sixties who have been vaccinated, does that mean that they can all get together with other people? Now? I think there's a lot of confusion around like what it means for some people to be vaccinated in society and what it means for for other people not to be vaccinated, and

to what that means for return for normalcy. Sure, it's a really good question and one that I get a lot too. So first thing, let me say everybody, when you after you get your second shot, you're not immune for another two weeks, So you can't go out and

party right after you your second shot. UM. The other the other thing that we should say is it's still important to wear your masks and maintain distance even if you've been vaccinated, because the vaccine is not only to protect you personally, is to keep you from um spreading the virus, and it doesn't do The vaccine doesn't prevent spread of the virus as much as it gets you personal protection. So you still need to wear a mask.

You still need to maintain distance to protect other people because you can still transmit the virus even though you've been vaccinated. So that's interesting. So we okay, And these vaccines are developing, like we've had a big conversation about this this week, about developing anti antibodies versus developing T cells. T cells obviously stay with you longer. I mean, these are also going to be significant, right in terms of

what our trajectory is going forward. Yeah, so we know a whole lot more about the antibodies than we do about the detail response to to these vaccines or or to actual infection, so it's much harder thing to study. So um, we just don't know yet. So here we are in February, almost a year into this pandemic, and we're starting to see signs that governments, especially here in New York City, want to get back to normal, or

at least return to some semblance of normalcy. I guess I have a hard time understanding what you still what you can and can't do after you've been vaccinated, because the governor wants to open up um sporting you know, sport sporting complex, sporting arenas and have people who have been vaccinated and go and wear masks like is that type of thing okay? And we don't have about thirty seconds left? Uh the short answers. I don't think that's a good idea. I think we should still be cautious.

I think that some gradual reopening makes sense, but it should be done carefully. UM. I think a sudden reopening may cause and other search and we really might avoid that. Dr Turner, I want to talk schools because we learned earlier today that the us CDC will release a detailed guidance tomorrow on how to safely reopen more schools. This has been long away to the Biden administration has a

goal to get schools open in the coming months. What's the right way to do this really important thing to do is to is to make sure that, um, we follow the evidence, and so that means that we need to make sure that kids are um masked, that the there's adequate ventilation, but there's adequate reduction of density and school that is allowed enough space between kids both in the class room and elsewhere in the school. UM. So there's a lot of evidence that schools can be opened safely.

There have been schools that have been opened throughout the pandemic and have done so safely. But it requires a lot of mitigation efforts, and I assume that's what the CDC is gonna outline tomorrow. Um. This has been done in private schools successfully, whether it can be done in a large public school system, UM, you know, I think we'll have to wait and see. Yeah, it's tricky, and but I know that there's so much pressure, um to get kids back. Tell me, I'm curious, Dr Toner, what

are you hearing? What are you seeing maybe from colleagues or from what you're seeing directly. When it comes to hospitals in the type of virus cases that we're seeing and their access to necessary supplies to treat patients, well, it's a whole lot better now than it was, UM months or two months ago. Uh, we were in a

terrific crisis following the holidays in the early weeks of January. Uh, pretty much across the country, but especially in southern California where they were literally running out of oxygen um with that was also seen in other places like Minnesota, like Texas, has been seen previously in New York City in the spring. UM. Generally speaking, supplies both equipment and disposable supplies. Are the situation as a whole lot better than than it had

been in the past. Um, But part of it is because case counselors are down so much from where they were. I mean, we're we're at half the level we were UM a month or six weeks ago. So UM, you know, a lot of the stress has been taken off and UM hopefully fingers crossed the download TREDI will continue. If, however, we see another big surge, we could be back into

it a situation what we have shortages. So I want to contextualize this downward trend because it is great news that we are seeing it moved down, But we're still seeing the number of cases that per day in the United States that rivals, you know, anything that we saw over the over the Midsummer and in spring last year. So it's still it's still very very high. That's said doctor. Is it going down because of the vaccine? Is it going down because the post holiday bump? Is we're we're

moving away from that? Is it a combination of the two. Is it too early for the vaccine? Why are we seeing this decline now? And how could we see it spike up again soon. Well, I think it's multi factoral. UM. It's probably doesn't have much to do with the vaccine. There hasn't been enough time for the enough people be vaccinated to make a big difference. UM. I think a

lot of it has to do with individual behavior. I think after the huge bike everywhere across the country UM, in the in December early January, we saw that many more people were in masks maintaining distances. Many UM cities and towns UM went back into some some degree of lockdown and tightened up their their restrictions. Right. So I

think we're seeing evidence of that UM. And I think the bottom line is trends should continue to go down as long as people UM, you know, maintain these mitigation efforts. If they don't, then I think we will see the curve turned around. Well fingers crossed, and I like when the curve goes down. Dr Eric Toner, thank you so much. As Alway, Senior Scholar at the JOHNS. Hopkins Center for

Health Security at Bloomberg School of Public Health. Of Course, Michael R. Bloomberg is a founder of course at Bloomberg LP and Bloomberg Philanthropies and supports the Bloomberg School of Public Health. This is Bloomberg Business Way with Carol Masser and Bloomberg Quick Takes Tim Stinovic from Bloomberg Radio. So I want to get to a story that's a younger most right on the Bloomberg It's about the individual transforming the fortune created by billionaire and founder of Amazon, Jeff Bezos.

And we're not talking about Jeff No, we're not even talking about a Bezos anymore. We're talking about Mackenzie Scott. That's right, his former wife. Let's get into it with Bloomberg News Wealth Team reporter Sophie Alexander. She's on the phone in San Francisco along with Bloomberg Business We get it, or Joe Webber on the Access line in Brooklyn. Man. She has been a game changer, Joel when it comes to philanthropy and giving. Yeah, and we're gonna talk about her.

We also have to talk about Jeff Bezos, says, because you know the two of them together, Um, you know when they were a couple still uh, not so long ago. They had a massive fortune together. And actually what was pretty amazing about it was actually how little of it ended up in um philanthropic causes during during their marriage. But what we've seen since their divorce and really um uh most recently um, largely because of Mackenzie, has been

um this real uh change. And you know the six billion figure that so uh and and been right about um that's attribute to her, we think is the largest single, uh, single amount that anyone's ever given to philanthropies in in a in a calendar year. Um. And so Sophie like, can you walk us through you know, the significance of what that means for the Amazon fortune going forward? Yeah? Absolutely, I mean the six billion dollars is just such an

immense figure. And when we're talking about philanthropy historically, you know, one of the main criticisms of billionaire philanthropists of for one of their reasons rather of not giving away enough money faster, is that, you know, it takes time to be thoughtful and it takes time to give away this these huge amounts of money, you know, billions of dollars. But Mackenzie sort of disproving that and what this could mean for the future is you know, Mackenzie is only

just getting started. She's finally giving pledge. She's pledged to give away the majority of her fortune UM, which at this point is nearing sixty billion dollars and so UM that that's just a huge amount of money that could be given away. And then when we're talking about Jeff who recently stepped down or none that he would be stepping down from Amazon as CEO, UM, that's sort of a sign that he's probably going to focus more on his giving and that we could be seeing more from

him in the philsopic philosophical space coming forward. And to be fair, I mean, he did give away money before, right, but it's not as quickly as his former wife has. Definitely, UM, I think that the to be fair to Jeff UM, when we talk about Bill Gates, you know, one of the most impressive philanthropists in history, he didn't start giving away very much until he stepped down from Microsoft. UM.

And so Jeff has been giving money. But you know, when you put it in the context of how much wealth he really has, it's it's a very small amount. We're talking about uh, single digit millions, UM, tens of millions sometimes and more recently sure hundreds of millions of dollars.

But where he's really had the biggest figures are in his commitment you know, he's made the two billion dollar commitment for the Day One Fund and then the ten billion dollar commitments for the Earth's Times, So those are huge numbers, but we're not actually seeing that money deployed yet. So you made the point earlier on on Quick Take Today, Sophie that Bill Gates didn't start giving significantly until he left Microsoft as CEO, which which I thought was a

really important point and not something that I had considered. Um, I wonder if that's what we're going to start seeing from Jeff Bezos now that he has stepped down, or he said he would step down and that will happen later this year and hand off the reins to to somebody else at Amazon. Are we going to start seeing

Jeff Bezos give away more money? That is sort of the big question, you know, in his letter announcing that he would be stepping down, he mentioned the Day One Fund and he mentioned the Earth Fund as two of the things that he plans to focus on more. So, you know, it's been a few years now since he made those announcements that he start would start the Day one Fund, and he announced the Earth Fund last year, but really has only given about a billion dollars of

the twelve billion dollars that he's committed to giving. And he's set no timeline for himself, so you know, he's not really going to be held to anything um, but

we could see more from him coming soon. Well, I think you know, that's it's an interesting point here because you know, even just yesterday they're the Chronicle of Philanthropy came out with some big numbers from from uh Bezos and Scott and others, and and one of the things that is interesting there is that you know, Bezos his name was actually at the top of that list because of what he's pledged, but not actually what he's given.

And that I think is that one of the things that is really important to keep in mind what what Sophie and Ben did a great job of underscoring in this is like one thing to pledge and it's another thing to actually do. And what she you know, really showed here is is uh that you can do something big and dramatic and do it actually fast. And that that I think is the thing that everyone in the philanthropy world has looked at her and said, wow, this

is something. So Sophie, my my my last question for you is how competitive does it get when your ex life give it aways six billion? Like you, that's something you have to kind of like the sort of kindle a fire in your belly to be like, did you really do that? You know, it just it happens. It's like you can hear an echo in here. That's a real laugh from Joel. I like, all right, you guys, just be quiet. Go ahead, Sophie answer. I was just

going to say. I mean, it's impossible to say what the relationship is now and how her giving impact his giving. You know, she's been the giving pledge, she hasn't and he's been sort of knocked for that. Um But and it's also impossible to say what their philosophic giving, you know, who did what while they were together? Was I talked to you an expert about such? So it's really hard to say. You know, it's very from couple to couple.

Um So, we just don't really know enough about their individual personalities to be able to say much more on that. But you've got to think that, you know, when people are talking about the Amazon fortune and seeing these things that, you know, he might feel a certain responsibility to sort of stuck it up. It's gonna be a prime topic that comes up. We're a great team. I'm just gonna say it, all right, Gotta run, guys. Sophia Alexander, thank you so much. Wealth Team reporter at Bloomberg News on

the phone from San Francisco. Check her out on Twitter. Check out that story on Bloomberg dot com. Jil Weber, thank you, editor at Bloomberg Business Week, Promote access from Brooklyn. This is Bloomberg This Week with Carol Messer and Bloomberg Quick Takes. Tim Stinovic from Bloomberg Radio. So um, Tim. We talked about the impeachment proceedings before the break. More news out of DC, because let's not forget we've got present Buyden Democrats. They're working to get you know, his

COVID nineteen relief plan through Congress. And as Bloomberg Business Week National correspondent Josh Green reports, it's really an interesting time for Democrats and the party as two Republican factions are wrestling for control of the GOP. That split is making an interesting era. Let's get into this with Josh Green wrote the story. He's on the phone in Washington to see. Josh also the author of Devil's Bargain, Steve Bannon, Donald Trump, and the Nationalist uprising. Josh, So, tell us

about your story and what you were looking into. Well, I was really looking at the Republican Party's inability or unwillingness to move beyond Trump and what it's costing him. In the Biden era, UM, there was a lot I think after the insurrection, there was a lot of um talk to the effect that Republicans were a gap willing to break. And if you've watched the trial over the last couple of days in the Center, it's been clear that that by and large Republicans are sticking with Trump.

What I did in my column, though, was look at the policy effects that that's going to have, And I think the most interesting effect that I've come across is the size of the COVID relief bill, which Biden introduced at one point nine trillion dollars UM. Golden Sacks has been tracking its estimates for what the final size of the bill are going to be. A month ago, their estimate was seven billion dollars, because the expectation was that

Republicans would negotiate and whittle that down. On Monday, they came out with a new note saying now we think it's gonna be one point five trillion dollars, twice the size earlier, basically because Republicans, instead of trying to negotiate and whittle down the price tag, have been busy defending Trump and haven't really been willing to engage in try and exert their influence on policy. And I think it's a big trend that a lot of people have been

missing early in the Biden era. So, Josh, you you mentioned the presidencies of Barack Obama and Bill Clinton, and you write that navigating such a middle course consumed UH them and often ended in frustration and defeat. How does Biden free himself from navigating this middle course? What is the opportunity that he has in a time when it does seem like America is even more divided than it

was then. We know the last two Democratic presidents, Bill Clinton Barack Obama have both both made concerted efforts to kind of reach out and appeal to a group of center right Republicans in the Senate because there was great

premium put I think on legislation being bipartisan. I think one effect of the Republican parties uh decision to to sort of uh defend Trump and kind of remain that Maga party is that there really isn't that kind of block of centrist Republicans for Biden to try and negotiate with.

And as a result, Biden, the Democrats haven't really therefore had any need to trim their sales into shrink the size of these packages, so, you know, absent Republican negotiating partners, what Biden's done instead is turned to the left and say, Okay, if this is my legislative path to getting fifty votes, then I'll do what the folks on my left want,

not on the folks on my right. And I think that's why we've seen the doubling of the size of this COVID package in the Golden SACS estimate, because it's going to reflect what the left wants, not what the center right might have wanted. Well that's kind of interesting. So when we think about policy to come, should we look way left? I don't, you know, in general terms, I think yes, that it has become pretty clear early on that Biden's legislative path is going to be the

unified Democrats. I think it's easier to do on something like COVID relief, which is broadly popular, more so than maybe a Green New Deal or expanding the Supreme Court um. But but certainly, I think what this is showing us is that we need to reframe our expectations for what sorts of policies are gonna be possible under Biden, uh and what he might be able to do with people on his left if Republicans decide that they don't want to try and exert influence over his policies. So, Josh,

what where is the Republican Party right now? Because it is I'm getting a couple of different signals here. Right In the one sense, we are seeing widespread support for for President Trump play out in the Senate trial right now, there's no indication that that he would be convicted because there we will not get, you know, the Democrats will

not get Republican support for conviction. But at the same time, you write in your story that a majority of US voters would like to see Trump convicted and barred from running for office again. So there's disconnect between what the American people want and what Republicans in Congress are are doing, which is nothing new. I should say, yeah, exactly, No,

I think I think that's exactly right. And there's a huff Post Yugov pull that came out this week that showed that about three and four Republican voters wanted the party to continue to follow Trump, and I think that's what that's the major reason why you see a lot of Republicans like Lindsey Graham, who were vocally critical of Trump after the insurrection have completely turned around and now

are defending him and attacking Democrats. But if you pull back and look at the broader universe of US voters, they are still very unhappy with Trump, more so after the insurrection, and a slim majority of voters and most polls that I've seen this week, I want Trump convicted and barred from running for office again. So I think what what what we can really take away is that the Republican Party so far has not been willing to

move beyond trump um. And what I try and do in this piece is illustrate the policy cost of them not wanting to move forward. What what it's done is give Democrats more room to move their bills to the left. All right, good, thank you so much, Josh, appreciate it.

Josh Green, National correspondent Bloomberg Business Week, joining us from Washington, d C. You can, of course read Josh's story on the Bloomberger at Bloomberg dot com, so check it out, and also check out his book Devil's Bargain, Steve band and Donald Trump and the Nationalist Uprising. I'm broom macro journal. Yeah, but you let me drive drug home, honey, please, I'll do the right gravel. Lets me. I want to drive, Just drive, baby, it's the question trying. This is the

drive to the Globe Commune. Thanks, we'll drying us down on Bloomberg Radio. All right, folks, Yeah, eleven minutes left in today's trading such as suit is time for the drive to the close. Philip Palumbo is with us, back with us, CEO, ce IO and founder of Palumbo Wealth Management. They're a boutique wealth management firm roughly three hundred million dollars in assets under management, and he joins us once again on the phone in Great Neck Long Island. I fail.

How are you good, Carol? How are you? Thanks for having me back? Yeah, you're welcome. You're welcome. Uh to it? Okay, uh, you know, trying to make sense out of a market that continues to hear hit records, Bitcoin hits records. There's a lot of asset classes. Uh. And yet we've got millions out of work, We've got an economy that's still struggling. Uh. There's still a lot of questions out there. We've got a lot of people who still are you know, we're

dealing with COVID still. Um, how do you see it? Yes, the last time I was on the show November eleventh, I had said I was bullish on on the economy recovery really because of the vaccines and breakthroughs of that, etcetera. So I kind of still feel the same way. My only concern is that I do feel, like you said, things are stretched at this point. So I do see volatility over the next month or two, which I do think would be healthy to get a little bit of

a pullback here. But ultimately it's tough for the market to pull back a lot, just because of the backstop with the monetary and the fiscal policy and all the money that's gonna be coming to people, and then in the back end of this year with the reopening of economies, it's gonna be it's tough to go against and bed against the market continue to go that much lower from where we are right now, let's talk some of the companies that you're you're following closely, starting with Disney, a

company reporting earnings after the bell today. Disney Plus obviously has seen huge growth. I mean, it is what has powered Disney to record highs. But my question is is how long our investor is going to have the patients for Disney Plus making up for optimism around Disney pluss making up for losses at theme parks and movies movie theaters. Uh,

and of course the cruises as well. Well. You well, on the back half of this year with the vaccine breakthroughs, I mean, it's you're going to see an improvement in

the theme parks. You're gonna see parts that are closed reopened, you can see parks that are open, capacities increase, right, So you're gonna see an improvement in the revenues overall for the theme parks going into third fourth quarter of this year and first quarter of next year, in all of twenty two, so there's definitely going to be improvement versus the opposite. Their number one number two, the Disney Plus is tremendous and the opportunity is tremendous when when

we look at it and we think of out it. Right, over over thirteen month period, right, they brought on ninety million subscribers, and if you think about the forecast four we're talking tooty million forecast to subscribers. If you extrapolate the revenue generator from that, in the bottom line to Disney, it's it's not about what they're gonna what they're gonna print this quarter or next quarter or the quarter after. It's really about where they're going to be three to

five years. They're going to be a different company, not just a company that's all about the parks. Yeah, talk about a big pivotal right, Yeah, I mean new CEO, new thinking. I mean, I do feel like there's and maybe that's the pandemic that, you know, things that maybe a company has been thinking about. All of a sudden, they're like, we don't got time to do focus groups and figure out the best way to slowly make this move.

We've just got to do it. M Yeah, I think there was a little bit of luck in there as well, right, I mean, it was before it was before Covid, but COVID definitely accelerated there. I think they're they're excellence in that particular area. But it's been remarkable. It really has everybody agrees to that. I do think, however, I mean it's a little stretched here from evaluation standpoints, I wouldn't be supposed a little. It's a hundred and sixty three of a P A P E F when sixty three

of forward looking po how stretched is it? Yeah? So it's stretched. So if you look at volatility and market in in the options market, I wouldn't be surprised that after the print, after the bell today that we see some sort of pullback and they started the straight flat for for a month or two, but then ultimately I

do think that the next leg is going to be higher. Yeah, well, listen, it's it's a forward looking story at this I mean, if you think about how much it was beaten up, but it's been on quite a bounce back since those loads in October. Are you speaking of a forward looking story? I know that you recently added jets the airline e t F to your portfolio. How are you thinking about airlines weathering this storm? Yeah? So, so we're in our view, we're in a growth accelerating story with the economy. We

troll fell it last year. We're now recovering. And anytime you go through a recovery, small caps lead and cyclicals lead. And part of the cyclical story is Disney and also uh the airlines, which, like I said, we just took a position a couple of weeks ago. So again it's the same story that we've all been hearing on the back after this year going at two airlines, what we believe, you know, we'll make a comeback. It's part of the

cyclical story, and that's why we're in that. Yeah. I mean, so if I look at the you know, the jet C t F for like right now, I mean it's at and change. How much higher does it go in your view? I think I think in the cards six for sure, you know, I think the I think it's going to slowly move that way. I don't think you get a quick increase to the upside. I would say, you know, the third quarter, fourth quarter of this year, I think you can see its far movements a price

target and which we're looking for. So this is this for us is more of It's not a long term investment for us. It's probably more of a trade off of the cyclical recovery. Talked to us about docusian and I've actually had to use it during the pandemic, right, I mean, and it was on a tear last year, was up and it's continuing to climb higher here up about fifteen six percent here, Um, what you're thinking about it?

It's now two fifty six seven. Uh, where does it go? Yeah? Again, care everything is expensive, as you just said before, so I'm not denying that. But one thing I will say that documsign is a fine company. The economic moat is very wide. Uh, there are not many that do it as well as documsign has done. I mean, Covid accelerated all a lot of their growth like many other companies. But for sure this is here to stay. For a very long time. Customers got used to and consumers got

used to using documsign for all different industries. So so that's why we believe longer term DocuSign is is here to stay. The revenue growth numbers zero every year, a bit pretty dramatic for the last few years, and it makes sense. You're not going to go back to signing paper documents. What once you've used the problem? So we need to use right exactly. It really is simple for the consumer to use. So I think that's a great story longer term, still, very briefly, UM, anything that you've

moved away from in recent months you've gotten out of. Um. You know. The only thing we've don't we've been doing is you know, the investments that are trading twenty to fifty times sales, which that is in our opinion, way over valued. So we're reducing some of our growth moving towards the value. Historically, the strategy has always been to

blend growth and value evenly. So growth has outperformed value now for for some time obviously, So now we're looking to reduce some of the risk from growth moving into value as we think as interest rates we believe move higher over the next two or three or four years, we think value as a chance of doing better than growth, So we want to keep I have heard that for a long time. Help me too. It's been a lot

of headcaches, right, but I think I think this. I'm hoping this time around it's it's going to be for real because there's some value in that area. Yeah, it does feel like and I'm not a market predictor, but it does feel like you know that there's some fluff in the market, and that at some point we'll see somewhat of a correction or maybe a little bit of a pullback, as we've often done, and then the market just heads higher. Um. Phil, thank you so much. Have

a great weekend. Phil Palumbo, founder, CEO, and chief investment officer at Palumbo Wealth Management roughly three million in assets under management, on the phone from Great Neck, New York. Thanks for listening to Bloomberg Business Week. Download the podcast on iTunes, SoundCloud, or Bloomberg dot com, and you can also listen to our radio show at two pm Eastern on Bloomberg Radio or watch us on YouTube search Bloomberg Global News m