Inside Operation Warp Speed

dot com. If you can also listen to our radio show at two pm Eastern on Bloomberg Radio and be sure to watch us too on YouTube by searching Bloomberg Global News. Well, Kayleie, we've got a lot of headlines right when it comes to the virus. Today, the ECB coming out and they kind of indicated Christine Lagarde that there could be some more stimulus coming because of rising

infections and more lockdowns. We did have the U S economy bounce back, but as we heard from Elena, you know, everybody's kind of cautioning that, you know, we're still amid the virus and still kind of waiting on some more stimulus. I want to throw out one number, the Institute for Health Metrics and Evaluation. It's a pretty influential modeling group.

They projected a higher US death toll about four hundred five thousand COVID nineteen foot palities and that is by February first, So uh yeah, we feel like we definitely feel like a second wave here. Dr Cyber Klein is Professor of molecular microbiology and Immunology at the Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health. Her research really focuses on how males and females differ in their immune responses to

viral infection and vaccination. The Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health, of course supported by Michael R. Bloomberg, founder Bloomberg LP and Bloomberg Philanthropies. Dr Klein on the phone in Baltimore. Dr Klein, great to have you here with Kelly and myself. So you see these virus heads that are coming out. Is it a second wave? Is it a third wave? What are your expectations for the coming months around the globe and here specifically in the United States? Well,

thank you. Um, I think we are in the midst of seeing the second wave hit, and it's it's likely going to be a tough time that we're going to

experience as we all move indoors. Um and and I think the combination of moving indoors where air circulation is obviously not as good as when we can all be outdoors, combined with pandemic fatigue which has been setting in and especially as we enter into the holidays and people want to be with families UM, and we're going to see more movement of people, UM, which will contribute to increasing the likelihood of exposures right well, and sober I just

look at Europe countries like Germany and France going back to these restrictive measures because cases are so high, and I think back to the first wave of the virus in the spring, Europe was ahead of us here in the US, and then it hit us about six to eight weeks later. I mean, is that what we're heading for? I think that's what um, That's exactly what we're predicting. Yes, that we should be looking to Europe and the experiences that they are having to give us an indication of

where we are headed. So is it increases in cases, increases in hospitalizations, but the death the death count or the rise in deaths isn't as bad because we have figured out treatments, UH, in terms of dealing with some of the most severe cases so that it doesn't lead to a fatality. Absolutely, So I think your interpretation is absolutely correct. We are seeing more cases, we're seeing more hospitalization.

I think people are more well educated, and they're seeking um to be tested and or treated, probably earlier than what we were seeing in the first wave. I think our our biggest concern is that as cases rise and as hospitalizations rise UM. While we do have a better sense going into the second wave of how to treat patients and the diversities of how we can treat patients, I mean, it's much better than it was when we when we had to go through the shutdown in the spring.

But I think the big concern is if we exhaust hospitals and we exceed the limits of our health care system, we will start to see the increases occur in satalities because we just may not have the beds and the facilities to treat people. That's just infrastructure, right, That's infrastructure. That's exactly well. So you're a professor of immunology, so let's talk about the vaccine. We heard Dr Anthony Fauci say yesterday that we could have one by January at

the earliest. Does that timeline scene realistic to you. I think that timeline is absolutely realistic. I think what is going to be UM challenging for the public to UM appreciate is that while a vaccine maybe available as early as January, the rollout is going to probably take a longer duration of time, and so who has access to the vaccine as it initially has rolled out, It's obviously

going to be limited. With a lot of recommendations from many organizations who've been thinking long and hard about this, that it would be health care workers, people UM at our front lines from there moving to people who are at greatest risk UM, and then slowly but surely making

its way out to the rest of us UM. So, you know, I think I think it's going to be challenging for our communities as we hear a vaccine has been developed and as being rolled out, and when people don't see that coming to their neighborhood drug store or to their primary care physician pediatrician right away, I think there's just going to probably be a little frustration, but

it's going to take some time. When we talk about millions and millions of doses, and if you know, these vaccines require UM special handle in conditions being kept at older temperature. Things that are just going to require ensuring that again that infrastructure that you mentioned is in place. Sobber, I want to get to the difference between women and men, but I want to ask you first more broadly about

the vaccine. Once we get one, what would you need to hear, given you study this to be confident in taking it. So I'm already confident enough in taking it that I was able to get my husband enrolled in one of the trials, which trial, which trials, the Fiser trial. Okay, okay, So that's how confident. And he was, you know, patient eighties seven, so he was a part of that number. Should tell you that when you're talking about tens of thousands, he was in a very early phase two trial doing great.

So what so give us some guidance though for those of us who are normal Joe's engines and you know, are just seeing a ton of vaccines being developed for hearing the conflicting things we're seeing the polls, you know, what would be your guiding words to everyone? So my guiding words, I think what's really tough is the public is having to watch science um at work and in real time and sometimes you know, it's not all perfect, and we're going to have we do have setbacks, and

that is a part of the scientific process at work. UM. I think that that's a good thing. But I think it also for the public creates concern, wariness, UM questions about things like safety as well as even how effective UM these vaccines will be. Nothing is going to be put out there until it is completely determined independent, but you know by the FDA in the United States and by other groups around the world to be safe as well as effective. It's so true. Think about you take

a medication. You don't think twice about it. Your doctor prescribed, but you don't go and look at like, well, what kind of trials were done and what were they you know exactly, you didn't see that at play And at times it probably wasn't pretty and at times they may have had to stop trials to manage an unusual occurrence. These are not unusual. What's unusual is we are having to do our work and have you and the rest of the public see us do our work in real time.

And you know, and and and so I want to jump in, want we want to jump in because we are interested. We've been teasing that you have been studying the differences between men and women and their immune responses. What are we seeing maybe when it is when it comes to COVID. Yes, so when it comes to COVID, just as as as you announced, Um, women are doing better, and this is true across diverse adult ages. We're seeing this, um in people who are getting sick as young as

twenty and as old in their hundreds. Um. While for both men and women, we do see an increase in severity of COVID nineteen with age, So that is not to say that women are completely in the clear. There is an increase in the likelihood of hospitalization, intensive care unit admission, as well as even death for both men and women, but in all adult ages it's consistently about two times higher for men. Yeah, I mean, and it's

around the world. I think that's another important point. So it cuts across maybe some of the diversity that we might have and some of the social and cultural norms in just in our behaviors, in our lifestyles. Yeah, it's fascinating, and that we just keep learning more and more about this virus and the differences and then maybe similarities. UM. Thank you so much. Dr Sabercline. She's Professor of Molecular microbiology and Immunology at the Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of

Public Health. The Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health, of course, supported by Michael R. Bloomberg, Founder up, Bloomberg GAUP and Bloomberg Philanthropies. On the phone in Baltimore. I just love when we keep kind of just learning more and more, right, Yeah, exactly. This is Bloomberg Business Week with Carol Messer from Bloomberg Radio. And we know we heard from Dr Anthony Fauci yesterday he said vaccines at least in the US won't be available until January the earliest.

We just talked about that with our last guest. Well, this week's cover story is all about the race for a vaccine here in the U s. It's of course, called Operation Warp Speed. It's the federal government's mission to accelerate development of a COVID nineteen vaccine. This story written by Bloomberg News Financial Investigation Senior writer Stephanie Baker and Bloomberg News is US healthcare reporter Cynthia Kuh and Stephanie joins us on the phone from London. And Bloomberg Business

Week editor Jel Webber is on the phone in Brooklyn. Joel, it's it's all about Operation Warp Speed. It's also around about a very specific company that's been involved in all of this. Yeah, that's so that, you know, we talked about vaccines a lot um in this program, and obviously I think it's one of the things that everybody is, you know, watching in addition to this, you know, election

next week. But the you know, obviously the big thing here with the vaccine is, you know, how do we get to a viable vaccine and then how do you distribute it? And one of the big unknowns sort of in our coverage has been what role Operation Warp Speed actually plays in this And that was sort of the mission that we put Um, Stephanie and Cynthia on with

this story. And what we what we learned in the process is Um is really told and they told the story through a company called uh Emergent, which is in Baltimore. That's a company I've never heard of, and yet they're one of the many players that are sort of in the Operation Warp Speed ecosystem. So so, Stephanie, what what is that company? Emergent tell us about Operation Warps feeds

approach in the vaccine development. Yes, well, you know, Operation Warp Speed turned to Emergent when they were looking for

surge capacity to make vaccines. Emergent had been a supplier to the US government for years, uh making vaccines against anthrax and smallpox, and so they were in a prime position to be able to sort of set that aside and start making COVID nineteen vaccines and had this sort of the manufacturing suites and the technology, and it turned up that there now they had worked with three of the six vaccine developers that Operation Warp Speed had has

publicly backed um and you know, really turned themselves into a sort of key node of production for COVID vaccines and are gearing up in the process of making what will eventually be you know, hundreds of millions of doses of vaccines of various candidates. Now, obviously there are two things here. There's one is which vaccines will get approved, and then there's manufacturing them and making sure there's enough

supply when that approval does come. And I think that's what Operation Warps who's really focused on, is making sure that the supply chain is there, that the all the manufacturers have what they need and can use, for instance, the Defense Production Act to gain priority in in in the supply chain to make sure that those doses are available if and when an approval does come right. Something

that surprised me. I don't know whether it should have, considering they are intending to have this process happen at warp speed, but they say their goal is to start delivering a vaccine within twenty four hours of its approval. That's a really quick turnaround. Have they succeeded in kind of doing having that infrastructure set up for when a vaccine is ultimately approved. Well, they are trying to prepare the groundwork by doing things like building an integrated computer

system to track where every dose goes. UM they've outsourced distribution to a company UM that has historically worked with the Centers for Disease Control on vaccine distribution. But of course this all depends on which vaccine gets approved and when, and there's just so many uncertainties around that. And you know, one of the front runners fiser Um, which is developing a vaccine together with Germany's BioNTech UM. You know, it

has very challenging UH storage requirements. It needs to be kept at minus seventy five degrees celsius, which is I think as a hundred and twelve degrees fahrenheit. And you know that just creates huge challenges in terms of trying to farm those doses out across the country. And so I think you know they're they're working with individual states to try to come up with a plan. I think some of the states have pushed back saying, you know, you guys, you haven't provided enough detail on things like

storage or funding. I think there are a lot of unanswered questions. So you get some bullish predictions from the people working within Operation Warp Speed UM, and it's it's unclear until the time comes come January you know whether or not they will be able to effectively farm this out. Um.

It is a massive challenge, Stephanie. One of the big numbers in the story is eight ten billion, which is basically the figure that Operation work Speed has at its disposal to invest in incentivize the private sector and the farmer companies to help basically get a vaccino. UM. I'm wondering when you think about how big that number is in the logistical olenge that Operation Warp Speed is ultimately facing here is there is there like almost an optimistic

take on this. I mean here we are like, regardless of when the vaccine comes, whether it's three months, six months, a year from now, like, we've never seen anything in the in this country operate at this velocity. What's your take on that? Yeah, you know, when I started this story, I thought there you know, there was a lot of questions about lack of transparency in whether or not you know, this was um wasted taxpayer money. But when you when you think about it, the scale of the economic fallout

is so enormous. Trillions of dollars in a way, billion is very little um, and that they ought to be throwing more money at it, and we'll probably have to throw more money at it in reality when it gets down to the distribution. Um, you know, the States are demanding you know, more money. Um. You know Trump has promised to provide the vaccine for free, so has Joe Biden. Um. Joe Biden has announced that he would spend billion on on distribution. Uh, you know, additional on on the vaccine effort,

including distribution. UM. So you know, I actually think that it's it is a bargain in a way, if it comes up with an effective vaccine, even if it's only one, if they're able to produce three million doses, which is the target. He's definitely just really quick thirty seconds from your reporting and what you found out about Operation Works. Do you feel like it's sometimes I think we questioned some of the efficiencies in government or lack thereof. Do

you feel like it's an efficient process? Just quickly yeah. I mean we got from the companies that we spoke to they felt like they were getting the support um that they needed and that they it was surprisingly efficient. Um. And I think, you know, it's obviously a mixed picture depending on you know, what company you're talking about, but in terms of working out supply chain glitches, I think it actually has been quite effective. Pretty cool story, Um,

great stuff. It's the cover story in the magazine. Stephanie Baker, thank you so much. Financial Investigation, senior writer at Bloomberg News joining us from London. Jill Weber, thank you as well, editor at Bloomberg Business Week. You can find that story the magazine, hitting news stands, online and on the Bloomberg Carol. It is five days to go into actually the official voting club because then we're at election day if we're playing that game, though the election has already started being

fair enough. More than half of the people that voted in TWENTI have already voted early. So there you go. It's pretty wild, right, It's like the numbers that we're seeing. I think it's over seventy five million, at least at one check um that I looked at. I always look forward to talking with our next guest. Bloomberg News political contributor I own a college professor of political science, Jeanie Zeno is back with us on the phone from New Rochelle,

New York up in Westchester. Genny, great to have you here with Kaylee and myself. I'm not quite sure where to start, Like, so you make up in the morning. What is it that you want to know when it comes to the campaign trial. So good to talk to both of you. It's time to believe, as you're just saying that, let's get crazy. But um, you know I I I do. As a poster, I have to confess that I do always look at the polls. We're just having this discussion in class, trying to keep in mind

that these are, you know, based on probabilities. And they're fraught with you know, uncertainty at this point. But I do look at the polls. I do look at my favorite forecasters. I have to admit everybody from five thirty eight to Larry Sabato who comes on Bloomberg of course, and it's wonderful, and you know, so many of the yes, U v A. And Crystal Ball is great and of course uh Cook political reports. So there's a lot of the forecasters I look at. But I get it right

last time. Um, you know, they did not necessarily get it right overall, but that but but the some of them did, but the but you know, the the was more of I think a flaw of some of the state polls. But again, you know, when you have states like Michigan, Wisconsin, UM in Pennsylvania where the president one by less than one percent, you know, those are really

hard to call. So I look at that. But of course, like I always pay attention to what's going on in the news and of course the economy, like all of these things that could sort of change something as well. It's late for there to be sort of a big changing news event, but I do think it can have an impact. And one thing I'm curious about now is you know, as the prospect of the Democrats taking the Senate seems to increase, does that make people at least in the middle unwilling to sort of give all of

Washington to Democrats. I think that's a big question. Well, gee, you brought up the Senate, so I want to ask you. I was looking at real clear politics right now. They see forty five seats going to Democrats Republicans. Nine are toss ups. That feels like it really could go either way, it really does, you know. I think at this point we are thinking that it looks, you know, that the Democrats can take this, but we are not sure where

some of these states are going to come down. And so, you know, I think those are going to be some of the most interesting races to watch are going to be in the Senate this year. And so, you know, some of them have been fascinating just listening to the president, you know, quickly call up Martha McSally to you know, to speak yesterday and just as quickly dismissed her. And what's going to happen in the state in the race like Arizona, certainly, what's going to happen in the state

like Colorado, in a state like Michigan. So there are so many North Carolina. There's so many fascinating races going on around the country that could change this thing either way at this point for sure, and with the Senate and with the presidential race, I want to ask you how stimulus or the lack of getting a stimulus deal factors into this. Who does it help, who does it hurt? Does it really make a difference. I think it does

make a difference. I think it is um, you know, something that I think it's something that we heard the president you know, wanted to do um and they could not get it done with the Democrats. Um, I think democrats.

I think it hurts the Republicans more because I think there's a tendency for the American public to blame the people who control the White House or what doesn't does not come out whether I don't think that's even quite fair, but I think we all have a tendency to say the president could have made this happen if he or she wanted to. So I do think there's a tendency for this to hurt the Republicans because they do have

the Senate and the White House. Um. But but you know, I think there's a lot of blame to go around too. I think that you know, Democrats could have done more to come to an agreement. They did not do that. So I do think the stimulus plays a role. And I think as people think about, you know, the stock market and other things, the stimulus is you know, top on their mind in terms of how we go forward.

And we're hearing Sauci say yesterday that we could be in the midst of this pandemic not just through but twenty two before life returns to North and so we are going to need a stimulus agreement out of Washington sooner rather than later. At a conversation with the CEO and they earlier today and saying that Cove is going to be with us for a few years. Like cases will pop up and we just have to kind of get used to it and figure out how to kind

of live with it and stay safe generally. I do wonder on the early voting trends, um, is something happening in terms of a transformation of politics more than we kind of realize right now in the moment, this early voting process, Is this going to be the norm going forward? That is something I am so curious about. I do think that one of the quote unquote silver linings, if you will, of the pandemic is that it has pushed many states to adjust. Um they're the way that they

allow their their their voters to vote. And I do think it once you get people in the habit of allowing them to vote by mail and vote early. Now, obviously one election is not a habit, but once you give people that option, I think it's tougher to pull that back. So I do think we are going to see a movement in this direction. It's been coming for some time. People out in the West know this. You know, states like Washington, Oregon, they've been great with voting by

mail and it's increased their turnout tremendously. And so I think we start to see more of this as we go forward, and you know, consideration of other things like should we have weekend voting, um, you know, should we make voting in other words easier and more accessible than we do. And the problem in the US is always because we are a federal system that's sort of a state by state decision, So it takes some time to wave if you will, across the nation, but I think

the pandemic is pushing it a bit. Jenny. What do you make of kind of the financial fortunes or lack thereof, or diminishing fortunes of the Trump campaign versus the Biden campaign. Yeah, I mean it's been a fascinating story. Um. You know, he has uh Biden has out raised and they can now outspend the Trump campaign. Um. And that is obviously,

always in our system, a huge benefit. I would just caution it's not determinative, of course, because Hillary Clinton spend more than Donald Trump did in twenty sixteen, and so I think what the Trump campaign, you know, more often than not, money is going to translate into votes, um,

but but it not always. And I think what the Trump campaign is hoping is that with these rallies and sort of the statements by the President and his surrogates, they are able to generate free media, if you will, in these battleground states and get attention that way and not have to spend I mean, this has been Donald Trump's bread and butter. As we know, he says, you know, semi controversial, outrageous things or things that get attention and he can then not spend as much as his opponents.

So I don't think this is there, this was necessarily a plan. I don't think they wanted to be out, you know, be out fundraised um, but this is the position there in it is does vote very well for Biden, but I don't think it's determinative. But with those rallies you mentioned, Jennie, I have to wonder how much that really helps him reach beyond his base, because isn't he just kind of preach into the choir. Yeah, I agree

with you. You know, they worked in sixteen, But I think the problem has been he's running this campaign as if it's sixteen and he's not. For one thing, we're in the midst of a pandemic, and so there's a school of thought that those rallies actually work against him when people turn on the TV, seniors for instance, who he needs to vote for him. They turn on TV and see all these people close together, unmasked, as if the pandemic isn't happening right now. So, you know, I'm

not certain it works for him to that extent. And then, of course, to your point, he is, you know, the income and president as opposed to the challenger. This isn't twenty sixteen, and he's got to reach independence and moderates, and I'm not so sure those rallies are going to be able to do that, but they do show that he's got energy on the ground, and there is something to say for that, you know, But I do wonder too. We have a story Jennie a Ryan te Becker back

with reporting how President Trump isn't heating his aids. Advice to focus on the economy like this, You know, if there's an election playbook, it's about the economy. And if you can point to are you doing better than you were? Or have you done well under my administration? You know, that will often get people to pull the lever for you when they go into the voting booth. Why is

the president maybe not running on that? These to me are this is the most confounding aspect of this campaign is that he wins when it comes to the economy. People Most people think that they are better off than they were before despite the pandemic, which is quite remarkable and to his credit, and he can point to the economy before the pandemic and say he was the leader of a really strong economy. But he hasn't been able

to sustain making that case. In any time this thing refocuses on the pandemic, which is easy to do, it turns against him. And so that to me is really confounding that he hasn't focused on that. And also I think that he hasn't focused on the fact that when it comes to economic issues like regulation, taxes, the deficit, the debt, trade, all these things that we care about jobs, that a democratic, all democratic Washington is not what some Americans are going to want when they wake up in January.

And he you know, if he was to make that case and say you may or not like me, but I will hold the line as I have before, that would be a winning case for many people. He hasn't, you know, found the will or the ability or the willingness to make it for some reason. Jennie, We're in the home stretch for five days or four days, Carol out from the election. What can happen? Can anything happen in the next four days that is actually going to

fundamentally change the trajectory of this race? Or have already people already made up their minds already people have voted. Therefore, you know it's locked in at this point, you know, I would. I would normally say, yeah, this is pretty much in the back. You know, so much seems to happen despite what we say. But you know, the county, after all, it's twenty twenty, right, it's crazy, but you know, the calendar is getting very narrow for a big shake

up at this point. They you know, some of this was tried with the Hunter Biden release doesn't seem to have had much impact, so you know, it's becoming harder. I think, sure something could happen, it would have to be pretty major, you know, something to come out about one of the candidates that was just you know, turns people who supported them against them. But even so, as you said, we've had so many people vote already they

can't take back their votes. So those kinds of things make it increasingly tough to turn this ship around, if you will. At this point, does that early voting, you know, I think it tends to lean towards Democrats, but I don't know if that's true. We just got thirty seconds left here. Can you make any assumptions or maybe not. It's hard to know because just because you're registered Democrat mean you vote Democratic. So that's something to keep in mind.

All right, good stuff as always, Genie, Genie, thank you so much. As we always say, I want to be in her policy class. I just do. I just do. Genie's political contributor. I hear at Bloomberg News professor, a political science at Iona College. Really a great go to when it comes to this campaign and the election. On the phone from New Rochelle, New York, I'm roc journal. Yeah, but you let me drive. Oh no, no, no no, no home, honey, please,

I'll do the ding Drivelt me. I want to drive, just drive, baby, the question try this is the drive to the globe. Commun Thanks, We'll drying us down on Bloomberg Radio. All right, Carol, we are just about eleven minutes to the closing alone. Of course, we've got a lot of big tech names, important results in just about ten twelve minutes time. Yeah, they we're gonna be crossing

the Bloomberg terminal fast and furiously. Let's get to the drive to the close because with us, as Larry Pittkowski, he's managing partner and portfolio manager good Haven Capital Management. He's back with us. He's based in Milbourne, New Jersey, and that's where we find him on the phone. This Thursday, Larry, good to have you here with us, a very different

tone from what we got from yesterday. And we saw UH stocks kind of picking up some momentum in the last hour, so so we're kind of bouncing around our highs of the day. I don't know what do you focus on right now in our world? There's so many macro stories out there right now, the big ones, the election, the virus, the lack of stimulus, waiting for stimulus. UM, what's the most important to you, the most important to us, Carol, Or what do we think about our companies and what

are the few journeyings going to be? And what do we think about the future values and what price are we paying for them? And that's the most critical thing, you know, in investing UH, you have to decide if a piece of information is important and is it knowable. There's all kinds of things that are important, but they're really not knowable. And I think most of the macro

stuff is not knowable. And I think it's the who's an investor of any sort to just try and focus on the businesses that you own and what you think about their future earnings capabilities are future drivers of value? And then try and pay an attractive price. And for us at good Haven, we did a little buying yesterday and we haven't done any buying today. And I think that is consistent with the opportunistic way that I try and invest money. It's so funny because everything that was

true yesterday is true again today. The virus is still spreading, there's still no stimulus, there's still a lot of uncertainty that's hanging in the air when it comes to the election. Um so do you expect this kind of volatility, the daily ups and downs to continue. I think that one should. I I've written for some time that I think the nature of markets, you know, the percentage of market activity that's electronic driven, either high frequency trading, quads, passive money

is a very high percentage. And a lot of those strategies to some extent or on autopilot, and a lot of it is sell weakness by strength, and so I think one should expect more volatility. The key as an investor is how do you attempt to take advantage of that? You know, for yourself or for your clients of any sort.

And I think you have to be prepared. I think it helps to not be leveraged, and I think you need to have some liquidity, and then I think you have to have your shopping list and have done your homeworker. I don't think the volatility is going away. You know, put twenty people in a room, investment guys, gals, you name it, and you know, put out a Macro issue and you get ten to say one thing and ten to say the other. I mean, I feel that way about Macro, like you can go kind of a lot

of different directions. That it is about knowing your companies, knowing your investments, knowing the fundamentals, and when to kind of pull the lever. So, Larry, let's drill down. You know, what are some of the names that are coming up on your radar? Where would you commit new money to right now? Well, you know, it's it's an interesting question.

You know. Back ind a younger Larry Pittkowski found himself managing money during a period where there were excesses in certain areas and there were other sectors that had been

kind of left behind. And at that during that period, I happen to have found a bunch of opportunities in and around the property and casualty insurance area, which for the next eight years or so, uh, you know, proved to be a very good place to have investments, while other sectors of the market went through a very difficult period. So ironically, here is we sit in. I think there are a bunch of the sector of things in and around the property and casualty insurance area. I think is

an interesting place to look. And I mentioned that because I'm going to read you a a quote from I'm not going to tell you the company from an earnings report from the other day. A company put out a release and they said, by the way, the average price increased for our you know, some of our main products, and I'm paraphrasing, was fourteen and a half percent, and the top line grew eight percent in some areas. So

that's not a cloud based company. That happens to be w war Berkeley, which is a property and casualty insurance company that we don't own. But it's a endemic of I think some of the positive tail winds happening in that industry. Now the sector will have some very material catastrophes. For Q three, you've got hurricanes, you've got you've had terrible fires, and you still have some COVID claims, but

I think a good haven. The question that I asked myself, and you know i'm assisted here in the portfolio by Artie Kak, is where are their sectors that the market has potentially not recognized where there might still be bargains. Because there's all kinds of interesting sectors that the market has recognized them, and you know we own some of those, which is fine, But where might there be opportunities? I think here are potential opportunities. Well, you say you're looking

for a bargain. Can I assume that means you're staying away from large cap tech? Well, we all we you know, we have a material exposure to Alphabet, which we've owned for a long time, and we've made an enormous amount of money on I and so. And I don't think

it's priced at a ridiculous level. I think it's you know, probably like a mid twenty uh mid twenties pe xtra cash to earnings, which you know, for a company of that quality, where I think the growth will get back to some normal level and it so dominates its world. I don't think that's a ridiculous level. There are all kinds of other sectors in and around tech where there

seemed to be some material access is. I don't think, you know, Alphabet's one of them, and that's not a prediction about what earnings are going to in you know, twenty minutes. But there are plenty of obvious areas of material access is. But the nice thing about investing, if you're managing a portfolio that you know somewhat concentrated and you have a lot of flexibilities, you don't have to go to where their excesses. You can go instead to

where you think there are opportunities. What do you say, And just got about forty seconds here. I think among your top holdings is Berkshire and then you've got Alphabet, Like it's an interesting kind of very different companies. Yeah, and berke Shure. I feel like it's going through some adjustments, uh, you know, in terms of some of its holdings and investments, but nonetheless two very different companies. What does that say about kind of your thinking? And just got about forty

seconds here. Very quickly, I think what it says about my thinking, good haven thinking is we have an eclectic approach to where we may find opportunities. I think it's a mistake to just pigeonhole one self and to say it has to have a certain metric of some sort. We think Berkshire's is now our biggest holding, is very attractive. It has material holdings in and aground property and casualty insurance and reinsurance which look to have a tail wind. And I like the evolution of the uh Rod and

Ted and the investment portfolio. I think it's a healthy thing for the future of the business. All right, Larry, take care good to get some thoughts from you. Larry Pitkowsky, Imaging Partner, Portfolio managing, good Haven Capital Management, on the phone in Milinburgh, New Jersey. Thanks so much for listening to Bloomberg Business Week. Download the podcast on iTunes, SoundCloud or at Bloomberg dot com, and be sure to check out our daily radio show at two pm Eastern on

Bloomberg Radio. To be sure to watch us too on YouTube by searching Bloomberg Global News.