FDA Clears Shot for Some With Poor Immune Defence

Bloomberg Business Weekend iTunes, SoundCloud, or Bloomberg dot Com. You can also listen to our radio show at two pm Eastern Time on Bloomberg Radio or watch us on YouTube search Bloomberg Global News. We mentioned some of the COVID and vaccine headlines that have been crossing the Bloomberg. The big one really is u S regulators giving a third COVID nineteen vaccine clearance to that especially for those people

with weekend immune systems UH. The authorization applying to buff Maderna and Fiser with organ transplant recipients or those whose immune systems are similarly compromised, so that's what's really being focused. Meantime, you've seen some of the other headlines about Australia facing its worst COVID nighteen crisis. Yet the schools around the country trying to figure it out, voting in many cases

to require masks for students and teachers. We're seeing that certainly in Houston, Chicago also taking steps, and we talked about what's going on in Belize one of the carnival cruise ships. So let's get our weekly Friday check on COVID and the world of medicine at large. Back with us is Dr Ian LUs Beder, clinical Professor of Medicine at n y U Lango and once with us once again on the phone in Long Island. Dr LUs Beder,

Good to have you here. How's your week been? Okay, always the pleasure, Carol, Happy Friday, welcome back from vacation. Thank you. Yeah. Why why is it's been so busy, Well, the office is busy, and we're actually seeing a number of patients who have been vaccinated, including some staff who've gotten Delta, So we're definitely seeing those breakthroughs. And everybody is talking about the third vaccine, who's going to get

it and uh and when? Well, so, what did you make of regulators coming out this week and and giving clearance for some to get that third COVID nineteen vaccine. I feel like there's gonna be a fair amount of confusion here. Yes, I think this is the first step to basically everybody getting approved for a third that scene.

The immuno compromise patients are particularly a concern, and as you say, it's about two or three million Americans, and they can have solid organ transplants, can be transplant, pancreas transplant, long heart transplant UH, and then another group with UH immunose suppressant medications UH, things like the antipns for inflammatory bottel disease and rheumatorid arthritis. All of those patients to some degree may have an element an element of immuno

suppression and immuno compromise. So the concern is in the patients with those organ transplants UH, they overall have a worse outcome that they get COVID to they're not they don't form antibodies as well, because part of your immune system responds to the SHOPS and they also seem to lose antibody sooner. So that group really has several why a booster shot makes sense. Although we are seeing more people like healthcare workers who are vaccinated back in January

who are losing antibodies who are getting delta. So my sense is that this is the first group, and obviously it's being studied, but I suspect more and more people will have the option open to them. I do think that there's probably you know, a lot of people are listening to this conversation and they have been throughout the week here on Bloomberg trying to understand, well, wait a minute, how do I know when my immunity falls off? How

does it work scientifically? Um? Does it just drop off automatically? And I know there's lots of studies being out there are people who are being followed very closely so that you know, our regulators, UM know when we're gonna need a booster on a larger scale. But can you explain that a little bit for us? Yeah, so, and I

AH certainly has a group of patients they're following. Some of this data is from Israel with FISER and they were one of the first back in November, December, maybe even October to start getting the vaccines, and they're beginning to see more breakthrough an antibody levels drop. For most Americans, we do not necessarily check their antibodies, although I have I've checked patients, for example, who are traveling who may be going to another country that requires it, and you

can get a spike uh antibody level. And I would say most patients um have antibodies, but we don't know the exact number where they're vulnerable. People can have no antibodies and obviously they're unprotected, but even as the antibody levels drop, we think there's a risk. And Delta seems

to be a little more resistant to the antibodies. So there are several reasons why Delta is not only affecting the unvaccinated, which is obviously an epidemic and various counties and states, but why we're seeing even vaccinated people now carrying it. Delta is able because it as mutated to escape some of the antibodies formed from the original alpha variant that we gave over the last six to seven months. So do you think most of us will ultimately be

getting a booster. I don't know before the end of the year. Well, I think until a Delta vaccine is made, you know, specifically for the Delta variant, and of course there may be other mutations and variants. All we can do is really give a booster of the original, which doesn't seem to have some benefit, and I do think most of us will be offered that before the end

of the year. Yes, all right, interesting to see that. Um. Do you feel like the situation that we're seeing in terms of rising cases and hospitalizations not good but better than what we saw perhaps a year ago or at the beginning of the pandemic. Yes, we most more people are certainly older, more vulnerable people have been vaccinated. They're actually doing better. A lot of the young people, because

they thought they were safe, have not been vaccinated. We are seeing more hospitalizations in certain areas, you know, with that, And yes, I think we're getting sort of the last number of Americans, the fifty or sixty million who were not vaccinated. Eventually, we'll all get Delta sooner or later, even with masks, UH and cohorting and pods and all

of that. And I think when that wave goes through probably November, December, January, America will be in a little better place, assuming no new variants that are resistant comes through. So I think it's gonna be a rough ride for a few months. Hopefully more people will get the vaccine, will get boosters. I think and that should flatten the curve a bit, but it's still going to be a

rough going for several more months. All right, let's get back to Dr in Lass Beata, clinical Professor Medicine at n y U Landgown, still with us on the phone in Long Island. I it does feel like we have learned a lot and we have obviously have a vaccine and we're gonna talk later on Uh. In just about fifteen minutes with one of our reporters is to in Business Week about you know, folks, the vaccine works and it does make a difference, and we didn't have that

a year ago. We are also increasingly seeing companies say, you know what, we're watching these cases rise. We're gonna slow our role in terms of bringing people back to the office. So we have learned something, and we are learning how to manage this pandemic because we're going to have to write because it's with us for a long time. Well,

it certainly looks that way. Uh. And you know, public health measures um ever, really since the Bubonic plague in the thirteen hundreds and the Spanish flew, there was a whole debate about masks, and of course at that time they just had cloth masks, but there were a number of people who were sitting on the sidewalk and so forth.

So and then polio, smallpox. There's always been a pathogen at one point or another that that has threatened the public, and and the way people respond has always been very variable. We're very fortunate to have technology like vaccines and perhaps even some medications, whether it's monoclone, land of bodies or ever becton or there may be other medications out there that we need to pursue that may also be one arm of treatment. So you've got prevention, you've got diagnosis,

you've got treatment. But certainly the vaccines had been very, very helpful. It would be great if we could develop rapidly a delta vaccine. But in the interim, you know, we're seeing businesses like Facebook say, you know, maybe you need to do that from home. Not all businesses can do that. I mean even medicine, which is can be remote or telemedicine. People like to commend, people like to interact. Many businesses are more productive that way. Um, and I

think it's good for people's mental health. But every business has to make a decision, you know, is it better for for their employees to remain distant. Some businesses are requiring vaccines. If the FDA formally approves the vaccine, some businesses and hospitals will mandate that as part of employment.

So it's a very dynamic landscape. When you see the school struggling and clashing sometimes with unions or with uh their state or local officials, a lot of schools are saying, wait, we we need to have this mask role and we're seeing course roll in and all of this. What do you believe needs to be done in order for schools to open up safely. Well, I certainly take care of the number of teachers and professors that are very reluctant

to go back into the classroom. And obviously you've got some classrooms with open windows, and you've got some classrooms where everyone is vaccinated, including um, you know, perhaps the eighteen or twenty year olds in college. So it's really very variable. I think there are many kinds of masks. The N ninety pods are quite effective, most people don't wear them, or of access to that. I do think each of these is one component. So open windows, pods,

masking will prevent some degree of transmission. It's not perfect by any means. We've always said the virus our souls are much tinier than the pores of the mask. But I do think all of these things are an effort to make everyone feel better that they're trying to do

something that will probably slow the spread. Inevitably, the way most pandemics work is that eventually everyone gets exposed, which I think will happen, and so you want to be as protected as can be, which certainly would be vaccinations at this point, although not perfect, and we need to look at other medications that may be helpful with treatment. The FDA really needs to be more aggressive with that.

Hey real quickly, just got about five seconds here. You I've heard you mentioned a couple of times a delta vaccine. Is that likely before the end of the year. I don't think so. If they're working on it, I think it's going to be easier to distribute the current manufacturing of the first of the alpha basically eventually we may need to do that, and I think it's good to develop that technology anyway. Well, always good to check. I agree, and I think many of the medical profession will concur

with you. Ian. Thank you so much. Have a good, safe weekend. Dr Ian las Bader, his crilitical professor of Medicine at n YU Land, going joining us on the phone in Long Island. And just as a reminder global tracker that we have here at Bloomberg virus cases topping two hundred five point six million, deaths passing four point three million, and when it comes to the vaccine, more

than four point six billion doses have been administered. You're listening to Bloomberg Business Week with Carol Masser and Bloomberg Quick Takes Tim Stinovic on Bloomberg Radio. So I've been referencing this story as we talked with Dr Ian lous Bader over at n y U Land going. You know, amid all the headlines of rising virus cases and hospitalizations due to the delta variant, it's very easy to lose sight of the fact that COVID vaccines are really working.

That's a Business Week story now online and on the Bloomberg terminal. So let's dig into it with Bloomberg Business Week editor Joel Weber. He's with us on the remote access line in Massachusetts, along with Bloomberg News US healthcare reporter Cynthia Kon. She's on the phone in New Jersey, Zee and Cynthia. I want to start with you because you've been following this. Uh, I feel like you're on your soapbox a little bit, but in a good way. Well,

thanks for having me, Carol. I think the reality is here. The data is really confusing for people. There's a lot of data coming out really quickly, and there's a lot of anecdotal stories coming out. And I see this in my own life. I think people are hearing about breakthrough infections in their own community, among their friends and family, and they don't know how to make sense of these some of these data sets that have been you know, made visualizations online showing how rarit is to get a

breakthrough intraction. So I think people are really confused. And I think adding and actually probably feeding that narrative is really the fact the CDC hasn't come out with a lot of high level data and information about breakthrough infections that might help people, you know, get a real handle

on what we're seeing here. And so there's just this overarching seeing that we continue to talk about with doctors um when we report on this, and it's that the COVID vaccine it doesn't have the ability to stop infection the way other vaccines might. You might be thinking of the measles vaccine, which prevented you from getting measles entirely, but that's not what the COVID vaccine has the capability

to do, particularly in the face of delta. It does have the ability from what we've seen from breakthrough data, it weakens the virus and so people's experiences don't lead hospitalization and death, and that's critical. That's very critical from

a public health perspective. But I think people, to be fair, they don't get thick in the first place, so it's not it's it's there's no You can see why people are frustrated by this confusing messaging, and I think the CDC needs to come out and give more data about breakthrough infections and who's more at risk, because I think that's the story that people are really you know, waiting here. It's so important, Jill, you know, that's one of the

things I've been thinking about. It do feel like that we're losing some of those important data points that really kept us well informed, and especially now that we're dealing with the delta variant well, and I think it speaks to just like there's there's new information that people who are interested in and and and Cynthia just like bringing

back to the CDC there. I mean, what do we know about how they're even tracking breakthrough infections, because as Bloomberg reported earlier in the year, that was not even something that they were keeping an eye on for a long time. So they decided only to to track hospitalized

breakthrough patients. And I don't know if that was because of the resources involved in tracking all breakthrough cases, but I was really surprised to learn when I did another story on sequencing in the US, how there wasn't a ton of connectivity in the system. So if a person shows up and gets a COVID test, they may not be asked if they had had COVID before. They might not be asked if they had been vaccinated, for example, and so that critical information may not even get to

the labs where they're sequencing the virus. That may have to be pieced together in an epidemiology report or study later on, But at that point we're losing weeks in terms of figuring out if if we have an increasing number of people who are vaccinated and getting the virus. So that's problematic to begin with, and that of sort of points to this lack of a cohesive system we have.

But the CDC said they were just going to focus on the hospitalized patients because those were the most critical in terms of understanding, Okay, this is the most virulent type of virus and this is what we need to

protect against. But even within the public health communities who have been watching this closely, there's frustration that we haven't gotten lots of reports about the hospitalized patients to begin with, so we don't necessarily have a lot of updates on were those people, say I don't know, had other home moor abilities or when did they get their vaccines. That's a big question. Does community wane over time and so are these some of the earliest vaccinated patients for example.

And then lastly, people argued to me that if we don't look at break through infections before their hospitalized cases, we're missing a really big opportunity to make some deuce some interventions or stop this, or have knowledge sooner when it's when it's more important for us to know what's going on with breakthroughs overall than just the sickst patients.

So that's another important thought that maybe we do need to double down now and say, Okay, this is happening, we need to allocute resources and makes us a priority

to study it. And how much how much does the FDA taking into account um breakthrough stuff, break through infections and delta for that matter, and what they're doing because obviously, and we talked about this a little bit before on the show this week, you know, there's especially when it comes to kids, like that f d A approval um and vaccine hesitancy that that seems to be like sort of the next shoe to drop in terms of, uh, you know, public health messaging here in terms of getting

younger children vaccinated you mean, Joel, Yeah, exactly, and like even just having the FDA stamp of approval in terms of overcoming people who have hesitancy. Still, yes, so there's some critical things that should happen soon, which is full approval from the FDA. And then to the next stat is really the approval for the vaccine under twelves. I think there's a five to eleven cohort and then um two to five I think are the breakdowns in terms of how these have been studied, and so those are

really important they're they're going to happen this fall. I have to say that f D is a really um runs a little bit more conservative in terms of drug approvals. They may take more time, and I don't think that's a bad thing. I know that people are really, you know, really want these vaccines for children, for example, perhaps full approval,

and I'm sure they're working around the clock. I think at the end of the day, the FDA taking a little more time to do that is probably not a bad thing because I think one of the parts of the narrative is that this has been hurried. When you look at the anti vac sentiment, that's some of this

that's that comes up a lot. And so the FDA is doing things how they want to do it, and I think they should resist the pressure to speed things up just for the sake of having something that you know, they have to use, that follow the process and protocols, and they've they've actually been out of step with other regulators and drugs in the past, and it's been to the safety of the process. So I think that's not

necessarily a bad thing. But to be fair, these these pediatric trials are huge, so it's gonna it may be, you know, a little bit longer before we get that data, but I think in the grand scheme of things, it is coming really soon. It'll be this fall. So I think that is really up positive. You gotta say the last line in your story and for those who might be hesitant about getting the vaccine, if you think it's

been bad, it could get much worse. And you cite somebody in an immunology professor at Louisa Louisiana State University in treport who said, I would almost guarantee that we have more variants that come and they may be worse than delta. That's why it's so critical to get immunized. I mean, if we don't get to hurt immunity, the potential for it to get much worse is out there and just quickly, um Cynthia. Yeah. And the thing is

the unvaccinated population is how these variants emerged. So the act of not being vaccinated isn't just about not spreading COVID to your neighbors are getting it yourself. It's also about not becoming a breeding ground for a variant that becomes more dangerous than delta. So getting vaccinated protects your neighbor, yourself, your household, and the rest of society when it comes to not creating new variants in this ecosystem. So that

is the most important thing we can do. It's the beyond masking and other things that we can do that our public health measures. But but as an individual, getting a vaccine is really powerful for preventing whatever is coming behind delta. Yep, back to thinking about your community. Cynthia Coons, thank you so much, US healthcare reporter at Bloomberg News. Check out her story on the Bloombergain at Bloomberg dot com. Toe Webber, have a good weekend, editor of Bloomberg Business

Week from Massachusetts. This is Bloomberg Business Week with Carol Masser and Bloomberg Quick Takes Tim Stinovic on Bloomberg Radio. All right, there's a fascinating and thoughtful column that you can find at Bloomberg dot com also on the Bloomberg Terminal. It asks a question, what could possibly unite a drug developer with a manufacturer of electric cars. It's all in the narrative, so writes Bloomberg Opinion column that our next guest,

Max Neeson. He is biotech format and healthcare columnist at Blomberg Opinion. You wrote it with our Bloomberg Liam at Denning and Max training us on the phone in New York City. Max. It's a great column. It's a thoughtful column, and it really does make you stop and think. Tell

us about the comparison on Maderna and Tesla. Sure, absolutely, so, you know there's obvious comparison is that both of them, um have have added you know, more than a hundred billion dollars in Testl's case, several hundreds of billions of dollars um in value in a very short amount of time um. And and that has people calling Maderna, including some anos, the Tesla biotech just in that it's added

a tremendous amount of value. Yeah, um in it um it Also it's sort of being valued like a platform, not just for its enorvously successful COVID vaccine, but for what comes next. So that sort of prompted us to take a closer work and what sort of you can learn by by looking at the two of them together. Well, for Tesla, for a long time, I mean we had

so many conversations here on Bloomberg with analysts, investors. It was really a wait and see and there was lots of promises about what it would be for a long time, and it you really had to have faith in the company. And it feels like I get the comparison because obviously we get Macderna. We talked about it daily. The run up that we've seen has been tremendous. Um a little bit of a pullback this week, but certainly a lot

so far in one. And yet it's it's got to be about more than just a COVID vaccine in order for those expectations to play out. Yeah, that's what's so interesting about It remains a wait and see, but it's a wait and see that that to some extent is materialized. You know, they continue to grow sales. If people look out over time, you know they're multiple is very very high right now. But if you look at it a few years hour and it gets more reasonable. Macderna is

the opposite. It looks reasonable now because they're generating enormous sales from from their COVID vaccine, but go a few years later or when those sales are expected to prime one hopes as the pandemic receives and the multiple suddenly looks very high. Indeed, because it's going to be quite some time before the rest of its pipeline arrives, So you really have to believe that you have our name technology can can succeed in a variety of other ways.

Um and in fact, you know, at a higher rate and with better commercial potential than other drunk companies usually

managed to justify its evaluation. You know, it just as a reminder to Max that deep down, you know, when you get away from all the headlines and you forget all the things that Elon Musk does and is out there that at you know, at its heart, Tesla has been, you know, a startup tech company at least at its roots, right, and it had to play out and an innovator, a disruptor, and so you know, you had to kind of wait

for it to grow into its expectations. And as you say with Maderna, it's in many ways now going to go back to being a traditional biotech company, right with prom his promises, investments, investments, and then ultimately maybe it'll pay off long term. One of the things that you get to into your story that I think is so important for our audience. You talk about TAM the total addressable market. That's key in understanding both of these stories

you are. So with Tons, that's always been the thing that justifies it's ever expanding valuation, um suggesting that it's going to get into new businesses, some more plausible than others, which is why, you know, even even though it certainly make grow into its vallerations still very rich and the still have to make a lot of assumptions to get there.

But with mcderna, it's a little bit of a different story in that you know, there there's certainly many other drug markets that can break into, but it's already sort of being valued at the same level as a you know, mature drug companies that have you know, big tens of billions in recurring revenue, not sort of just pandemic specific revenue.

So so it has a long way to go into it can actually prove that it can generate that on an ongoing basis, So to be very interesting to watch if you can actually you know, fulfilling and maybe expand its market in a way that that sort of lives up to what people are valuing. I mentioned you wrote this column with ar Liam Denning, who follows the tech space and names like Tesla in particular, what some of the conversations went back and forth between you two about

how it was the same, how it was different. Sure, so it really it really was because it was just going back through the history of of how Tesla got to its valuation and then how Maderna did. Um it Elk sort of goes back to that that tam story where um, you know, at every point you find for you know, some sort of justification to take things further and further. And then what we got to was, you know, people keep finding a way to expand that for Tesla, but but they may have reached a bit of a

morbal limit with Maderna. Just looking at the different industries and and how I think people for yeah, um, in the context of the pandemic, how well did you fail? Youre prone? The drug process not the drug making process is not drunk R and D. You know, most products you you investigate end up failing. So I'm really did um make for a really interesting conversation and I hope

column as well. Yeah, it's a great read. We were talking about it in the newsroom and I'm so glad you were able to come on and share your thoughts with us with our audience. Max Neison, thank you so much of a great weekend. Max is biotech format and healthcare columnist A Blooberg opinion Bro mac Journal. Now, but you let me drive? Oh no, no, no no, no, oh night please, I'll do the right drivel. I want to drive, Just drive, baby, It's good. Questions to dry. Yeah, this

is the drive to the globe. D TikTok. We're just about ten half minutes away from wrapping up not only the trading day but the trading week, and we are seeing stocks bouncing around little change. Is very tight trading range. It does feel like everybody's headed to the beach. Uh for uh the week and the weekend already, let's bring in the Rebecca Corbyn, founder and CEO at Corbin Advisors. Uh. They are a strategic consultancy and research firms. She joins

us once again on the phone from Farmington, Connecticut. Rebecca, how are you? Where is everybody? Hi? Carol, Well, mostly on vacation. You know, we're essentially wrapping up earning season and this has been a tough year. Hopefully they're taking a little break. If you work for Carlisle, you get the week off next week. So, uh, we're seeing that happen. We talked with them this week, UM human capital management story exactly exactly. Hey, you are constantly checking in on

what's on the mind of investors, UM. What are you hearing? Sure? Well, you know, heading into the order, a lot of optimism, big expectations for significant beats that was handily delivered to them. We just did a pulse pole yesterday. Global institutional investors UM more are more concerned about UM COVID UH, they're raising delta and landed variants, concerns around the VACU resistant population, and almost forty or more concerned around inflation than they

were just a month prior. So, you know, there's a lot of UM sentiment. Obviously, we have very strong earnings, we had guides that were raised UM. But heading into Q three and Q four UM, there is a lot of concern heading into that with regard to COVID inflation, other supply chain disruption. Still, hey, wait, I want to

make sure I understand this. So this pole yesterday global investors, you're saying that fifty percent are more concerned, are more concerned about okay, and more concerned about inflation than they were a month ago. Yeah, and last last quarter we registered the highest level of concern around inflation. Okay, And I do feel like you know, once we get through those earnings periods, everybody is a little bit lost, especially because there are so many questions about COVID at there,

what might be next for FED policy. It's just funny, you know, markets like it when it's sure right when we're either gangbusters or we're falling apart, because policy is then very clear, and that's not where we are right now now. And I think we also, you know, we talked last time around the dynamics that are happening. We're seeing record levels of demand. There there is no shortage of demand for product right now. However, once one of the factors that is changing relative to what we were

saying is the consumer. And the consumer as we saw UM, consumer sentiment plunged today to the lowest level since UM. They're feeling it in their wallet. And as we talked about last time, right the supply chain, that cost inflation has to move through the supply chain. The last person holding the hot potato is the consumer because there's no one else to pass the cost too. And so they're going to speak UM loudly, and you know, we should

be listening to whether they're continuing to spend or not. Yeah, it was interesting that consumer sentiment number two that they were worried. I'm just looking back. Uh, percent of respondents expected decline in the jobless rate. Only percent of respondents expected to cline in the jobless rate. That's down from fifty the prior month. Despite record job openings, consumers also became decidedly downbeat about their income prospects. The gauge of

expected personal finances fell to a seven year low. That's pretty dramatic. Yeah, And you know what's interesting is we saw a massive increase in the number of companies talking about labor or wage inflation. I should say it was actually higher than those talking about commodity inflation, which is significant. And those are things that stay stay with the company for a while. So okay, so that's out there. That's one narrative. Right. We've had an interesting trading week. We've

been in a very tight range. It's been lower volume. It does feel like everybody has gone away for a little bit, and maybe they're all just waiting for Jackson Holland to see what the latest shoe might be to drop from the Federal Reserve. They'll most think that they're not going to change their narrative. Speaking of narratives, UM a lot, how you know. And then we keep having record after record in the s and P five. Here we are again, and I think we're gonna be apt.

What is it if we get a record close today, it's forty eight record closes this year. How do you balance that against some of the nervousness we're seeing the market? Does that set up the equity market at least for some kind of pullback at some point? Well, you know, there there's so much um, there's so much capital out there.

Uh So you know, I I just I can't imagine a time where the equity markets you know, sure we'll go through you know kind of potential like crashes and then obviously fits and starts here and there, but you know, over time, the equity markets will continue to drive higher. Um. You know, there is a lot of concern around the said policy. So there's windows of opportunity when you can

raise interest rates where it feels okay. And and the benefit of raising interest rates UM is actually for the opportunity that when we get into a position of you know, economic deceleration, you have a lever to pull and that lever sits very comfortably with the consumer. Um, we really don't have those levers right now, and we're and we're you know, the the window is closing because of the

massive inflation that's hitting the consumer. So I mean, we're you know, I would just say that we're really out of wack on this cycle. COVID very very quick to go into companies adapted extremely diligently and agile e learning from the g SC right great Financial Crisis, and now we're seeing this sling shot into you know, growth momentum somewhere it needs to you know, even out and get

to normalization UM. But there's still discussion around you know, strong growth into In fact, estimates that have been provided for Q three and Q four still show continued growth above UM five year averages. And you know, in terms of that, that's because there's a lot of stimulus out

there right at this point. I mean, there's still tons of you know, and that's actually what's creating the labor shortage to a lot of extent um you know, the and and that's going to increase, so you know, in terms of inflation, and we talked about this last and there are going to be inflationary costs that are not transitory, and those are really going to be around um, you know, wages, salaries. It is an employee and employees market right now, highest

level of turnover um ever recorded. And every single company, you know, eighty two percent of companies on on earnings talked about labor issues. No, it's really you know exactly, it's important. We keep hearing it. And you know, this is why I think we're waiting to see some of the data points when we get into September October. If the world reopens, if kids go back to school, if people who maybe couldn't go back to their jobs can now go back, maybe we get to see some truer

numbers and maybe those jobs get filled. But I guess time will tell, especially it's a little tricky here with the delta variant. Having said that, the outlook for next week, what are you expecting another quiet week at this point, again, just counting down to Jackson Hall. Absolutely, I mean earning season is essentially completed. We do get from that. We

will hear from retailers, right, We'll hear from the retail sectors. Yeah, they're they're off cycle though, right, so they're kind of on their own cycle based on the retail um segment. But you know, it is going to be quiet, and I think people are going to investors are going to digest this. You know, clearly with the with the raisors and guidance, there is still confidence heading into the back house.

But margins are are are likely to be impacted. And so we're going to you know, we're really going to see what happens with inflation as it works through its system and as those you know, the kind of box stops here. I think one thing that we need to be um looking out for is a the margin um would be you know, sequential sequential growth or deceleration, not year over year. That's a good point because that makes a big difference because a year over year we know

or last year we know what was happening. Hey, Rebecca, I have a great week. And Rebecca Corbin Chi's founder and chief executive officer of Corbyn Advisors joining us on the phone from Farmington, Connecticut. They are a strategic consultancy at research firm. Thanks for listening to Bloomberg Business Week.

Download the podcast on iTunes, SoundCloud or Bloomberg dot com and you can also listen to our radio show at two pm Eastern on Bloomberg Radio, or watch us on YouTube search Bloomberg Global News