Bloomberg Power Players Summit

on iTunes, SoundCloud, or Bloomberg dot Com. You can also listen to our radio show weekdays at two pm Eastern only on Bloomberg Radio. Jason Kelly Here in Miami. We're here at SOHO Studios. It's the Bloomberg Power Players Summit, an exciting afternoon leading up to the big Game. We're talking all about the business of sports and coming up in just a few minutes, we're gonna hear from my

co host, Carol Master. She's gonna be taking the stage with a number of players, current and former across some sports. We've got Jay Williams, used to play for the Chicago Bulls, now a broadcaster. We've got Ovie Ma Haley. He is a former All Pro fullback for the Atlanta Falcon. Let's Go Falcons. And Paul Rabel, friend of this show. He is currently playing in the league that he created, the Premier Lacrosse League. And Nag Good he is a linebacker

for the Jacksonville Jaguars. Uh. They're talking about their business. They're talking about the business of their leagues and of their sports. And just to give you a sense of where we are, we're in this sort of corner of downtown Miami where a lot is happening. And obviously the city is really bustling right now with the super Bowl. But as you move around Miami, you do see this

city that is in transition to some extent. It's wildly diverse. Uh, such an international city in many ways, You've got a lot of people sort of gravitating towards this new downtown area. We spent the last couple of days over on Miami Beach at the Miami Convention Center. That of course, is where all the media are gathered in anticipation, you know, and in speaking with Brian Billick and others who were there. Brian Billick, of course, the Super Bowl winning coach of

the Baltimore Ravens. Joe thisman, uh, winning quarterbacks, people, winning quarterback you know, those are the sorts of folks that are making their way around. Jerome Bettis, we spoke with him as well about his business ventures as well as the future of the league. We talked a lot about diversity or lack thereof in hiring at the highest levels of head coaching, and he had some ideas that he said he's going to put to Roger Goodell. So those are the sorts of folks who were here in Miami.

Uh And at our event, we're really focusing in on the key issues related to the business and the business of sports, not just football obviously, UH that is top of mind uh here this weekend. But when you think about the newly empowered athlete, you think about especially in the NBA, and we talked about this on an earlier panel. You think about Chris Paul, you think about Lebron James, you think about the late Kobe Bryant and the power that they had with their brands, their ability to go.

And Carol was saying this a few minutes ago, directly to the consumer and directly to the fan. I'm going to take you right over to Carol Masser. Now she has a lineup of former and current players here we go. So welcome, Welcome. UM, I've been excited about this panel. All right, So we're talking about the athletes competitive edge and I'm going to kind of go through each of you and then we'll we'll kind of round tables and things. Um, Paul,

I want to start with you. We've spent a lot of time with you at Bloomberg and starting a new sports league. I think in the words you said to us, it's a heavy lift, but it's incredible you had Ali Baba Joe said backing you, UM, it's pretty incredible. You co founded it with your brother Mike. Heavy lift. Why did you do it? Um, I'm glad you brought that up.

Heavy lift. I wasn't as creative in my response as as I. Uh, maybe what I've hoped to have been, but heavy lift we could probably all identify with is what we do, starting at least on the field and on the core in the weight room. Uh. So that I think work ethic translates into what a lot of athletes do in the boardroom. And for me, different than my peers here, I have been playing for the Lions.

Share of my athletic career sport that is outside of the core four sports that are consumed in the marketplace, and it was my passion just like their respective sports are theirs. And when you get an opportunity to be one of the best additive at whatever it is that you do, and you continue to move from high school to college and then in my case pro uh, it became very apparent that uh, the professional opportunity and lacrosse

wasn't there yet. It could have been based on I think what we're gonna talk about the subject matter today, which is the advent of new technology, new media, UH, relative startup costs going down, opportunity and going up UH and an educational um uh kind of swinging amongst athletes, and and the opportunity to then uh leverage platform and do something that is intellectually stimulating that can impact the

economy and impact your subset of of colleagues. And in my case, it was, Hey, not only do I want to do something that I think our support deserves in lacrosse and leverage all those modern tools to get there,

but it can materially impact the professional career of my peers. UM. It was a heavy lift because starting a leak from scratch is almost unimaginable there are so many nuances from you know, legal to marketing, to fundraising, to to brand building too, player contracts to venue negotiations to sponsorship agreements that all have to be in place for it to start. And the last thing I'll say is different than you know, building the sas company or any other product or service

from the ground up. You can delay your launch until you're perfectly set to go to market. In a sports league, we had to negotiate all those venues, build our player of contracts, have our media rights deal with NBC, and start on June one, So there was no delaying of that. So we were literally our feet weren't against the fire. We were in the fire building this thing. Right, you gotta commit and go today. I want to bring you in speaking of um heavy lift just in New York

Times a few years ago. And if you guys get quiet down, because I want to I want to read this. Jason, your high school All American, National Player of the Year, national champion at duke, number two overall in the NBA draft selection. It all came to an end in June of two thousand three. You had a motorcycle accident. It put you an intense of care for five weeks, you watched on TV as your team, the Chicago Bulls. They drafted your replacement. You're on your back for months at

a time. You don't even know if you were going to walk again. I mean, this was unbelievable. Your leg held together by a hundred staples, various metal, metal contraptions. Your comeback took years, and yet you did. You've reinvented yourself. You're having your second act. You're an ESPN analyst, you're a co founder and a company. UM tell us about what you learned as an athlete that helps you get through all this and get here us. Thank you. I hope that I can have a third, or fourth or

fifth in the sixth act. I think by the current events that we've all experienced this past week, I think we all have a there's a level of appreciation that comes with the opportunity that we're provided. And I think for me personally, we talked about risk mitigation with a lot of things do when you're young and you're giving a lot of money, and the thing that makes athletes

great is their competitive edge. For me, I came from an environment in which we were very team oriented, but the team I got drafted to was a bad team, So you had a lot of individuals and a bad team. And I had never been through that experience UM because I used to be in collective UM as a unit and that led me to writing Moorcycle that led me to be in hospital. But I think the way I was able to reinvent, and I think you see a lot of companies that are able to do this as well,

is when you start owning your story. I think for a long time I tried to stiff farm my story and try to make it not a part of who I was. But as I have a scar that runs from my ankle all the way up to my high thigh, uh, for the first, you know, year of my life, I would always complain about a scar until I realized that I still have my damn leg and having my leg

is something to be appreciative about. And then I started hearing other people's stories about whether you're starting a franchise or whether you're starting a league, or whether you have a data company, whatever it might be, the startup process of it, and I recognize that there are troubles that we all go through in that startup process of whatever industry.

That you're currently in. So I realized that other people had accidents in other forms or fashions of their life, and I was like, well, I think a way I can connect myself to other people is talk openly about my accident, about what I learned through my experiences, about how I tried to reinvent myself. And that made the connectivity so much easier for me to relate and people

to relate to me about my story. And I think by doing that, I started to build out my personal board about people that I think held themselves to higher standards in different verticals business, being a dad, now being a husband, and I started surrounding myself with people that I thought could help me get to the aspirational places that I want to be. I want to bring a nausey. Um. You're balancing both kind of your first and second act.

You're still playing Paul, still playing Um. But what's it like to balance that with creating a company and trying to build that out as well? And talk to us little bit about vbo. Um. Yes, So vbo is a

monetization technology. We monetize any digital software and through pictures and video and for me personally, balancing into has not been that difficult because of the behavior that we perform in the company and what I do on the football field, UM, similar to what we are able to provide for the fans for a better fan experience is the same thing that I see every day, UM, and that is reluctant to trust, teamwork, and leadership, and in those three entities

with trust, just like in our business, you know, you have trust in your teammates, you have teamwork and a cohesion on the football field, and you have leadership and with us working with existing content optimizing the fan experience by allowing fans to directly connect to better stories, you know, we are able to do those things seamlessly. And I'm able to perform at a high level every Sunday that I get to approach the game, and it's allowed me to still play and build this company as well as

actually you know, prepare every um and over. I want to bring you into because you played for the Ravens or All Pro with the Falcons, you met Ted Turner and his daughter and kind of your world changed and sustainability, through a couple of different steps became really important to you. Absolutely, UM truly honored to really check check check check, all right, got you? So I say I was truly honored when

I got to the Falcons. I was, you know, I was blessed to be the highest paid fullback in NFL history at the time, and that was something that stuck with me and people kind of knew me for that. But I didn't want to just be the highest paid. I wanted to be the best, and I wanted to be the most influential with that platform. And one of the things that um occurred around a similar time I got chance to meet Ted Turner and his daughter, was that our kids were me and my wife's kids were

born to really premature um. They couldn't leave the nick You couldn't leave the hospital until the air quality Atlanta got got better. And I wasn't big on air quality or pollution or environment statability just wasn't my thing. But when it affects your kids, when it has a chance to you know, take out the people that you love the most, it makes you, as a father, realized that you've got to do more than just play ball, you know,

live life and keep it moving. So I started my foundation where we you know, educate and inspired the next generation of environmental leaders we do. Uh. We have a comic book called Gridiron Green where we used the stainable development goals that United Nations and Unit STEF have created. As a part of our curriculum. We also have a green Tailgate Initiative where we teach sports fans, if you're

gonna tailgate, do so in the environmental responsible way. We also have a speaker series where we teach um communities of color about green jobs because the crazy thing is that communities of color are disapportunately affected by the environmental by climate crisis, but they're they don't have the opportunity

to to take part in the green economy. So sports is that wonderful connector that has the ability to tell a story, to restate with people, and to really, you know, give people the opportunity to make green by going green. And it's something that we've been excited to do at my foundation and something we're gonna keep on doing. You know, what I'd love to do is throw it out to all of you is what is it about what you've learned either playing the game, um playing on the field.

What is it the traits that you got in doing that that have really made a difference in going out on your own, starting a business or creating a new league. What is it that you see that kind of maybe makes you different from other business people? What is it that maybe gives you the advantage. I'm curious, OK, let's start with you. I mean, well, well, what it is

is that you know, I'm a fullback. I don't know if you have what fullbacks is are, but fullbacks we blocked for our running backs and our and our quarterbacks. And I've lived my whole life for the majority of my football life as always you know in the background, that's fine. We're blue callar workers. Like if I challenge the audience to name like five fullbacks, I guarantee you you guys can't name five fullbacks. And so we're we're more of, you know, the glue that whole the team together.

And being able to be comfortable in your position to know your role. That's something that has really allowed me in my business career. My my dad is a position. My parents not deering immigrants, and they really instilled in us, uh that work ethic. Uh. My dad was like either a doctor, lawyer, engineer. All immigrant families doctor lawyer, engineer. Football wasn't even his think he wasn't too excited about football.

He's okay now, he's good now. But that that work that he taught me in understanding how to play your role has helped me my medical sales business and the work of my foundation. Any thoughts or Yeah, Well, it's it's a great question that we think about as athletes pretty regularly, and I would say that it's highly bespoke

to any individual in any industry. I would I would venture to guess that pro athletes, by and large, the bulk of them have an incredib doable work ethic to what you had said, and in the ability to go to hell and back and that mindset that's cultivated at an early age and during physical pain and a lot of mental pain. UH, is unique to sport, but there are plenty of executives and young analysts in all industries that have incredible competitive spirit and work ethic too, So

it's not exclusive to athletes. That's just one trade. What I found, though, is shared amongst a lot of other athletes that I've seen a crossover in the business world. Sometimes while playing and then in many cases when they're done, is the ability to critically think. So they're critical thinkers. Uh. The translation starts in practice. So the best athletes in the world they understand at an early age that team practice is only the starting block. And what they do

is they go to the backyard, they play basketball. They imagine ten other people on the court. They're creative, and they're thinking critically about ways that they can build their skill so that they can outcompete their competitors. And that skill translate and translated for me in business is to be able to take everything that's in front of me, not accept anything at face value, ask questions, think critically around ways that we can innovate or improve that process,

and then apply it immediately. And I think that's the last thing before I pass it over to Jay is is the the ability to move very fast, come up with an idea and implement it. Is part of what we do in sports on a weekly basis. We play a game every week, we assess whether we win or lose, we look at the updated scatter report, and we change. And in business, especially with very mature companies, that changing cycle is sometimes six to eighteen months. In sports, it's

every week. And that's why a lot of athletes get into the startup space because they're used to that velocity. Yeah, I would say, I think, um, being an athlete, you're very solutions oriented, and being an athlete doesn't always translate to business all the time. You know, I was only an athlete in the NBA for one year. I've been more in the corporate side than I have on the athlete side. I mean my first four or five years

at ESPN, I made thirty five dollars, all right. So I think the ability to communicate from being a point guard or something that was critical because, just like Paul alluded to, you have to be able to communicate in real time two people understanding what their personality traits are to get them to buy into something bigger than themselves in order for the ultimate goal for the team, which

is to win. You know, we do a show with Kevin durand Rich climb and called The Boar Room that we license back to ESPN, and it's been amazing to sit down with all these individual athletes to understand how they go about themselves as a business. I think today the landscape has changed drastically. First off, the money has changed. I would be curious to see what highest fullback is paid in today's game. As a pair supposed to what

you got paid. But I think now even from a risk mitigation perspective, I mean, you're thinking about yourself as a business. It actually let me to become a partner in an insurance company with Epic Insurance, because now you're looking at all the different verticals of your business, from yourself as a brand to the cyberspace you know it's

happening around this weekend. Even from the investment broad space, you have to look at all the different aspects of yourself because now you are an international brand that can parlay into equity sticks and companies that can parlay into brand endorsement deals or into creating your own brand itself. I've got this incredible panel up here and it's really hard to hear, So could I just ask you to just simmer down a little bit? Thank you? Yeah, I

would like to add that. Um. One of the things that's been unique in my career plan middle linebacker, UM, you just signal caller. We get to speak directly to the heads of everyone that involves the game and in business. Something that we do uniquely with VPO is that we get to speak to all of the size of business from the front office perspective to the football side, to the fans side, and provide the best band experience at

the optimal time, at the peak moment of interest. And being a great leader and being a middle linebacker the defense, playing on defenses, and you know, and thinking about what goes on in the game. As a teammate and as a leader, you into this flow during the game, just like you're doing business. You into this flow of exstasis

where you have to be a cohesive machine. And in football there's eleven parts, and you know on lcross and basketball there's five, and then you know you understand that being a fullback, there's each Each person has a specific job to do on each play to optimize the output of it. And when you do that job the right way, there's always something that you continue to tweak and you continue to change and you continue to do better as

you progress through each entire play. And it's similar to the cycles in business as you go through business and as we extend ourselves and as you look at content for us, but typically we like to find out different peak moments of interest, and in my circumstances standpoint, I actually get to see those while we're still playing while you, you know, you get to identify the offense. You get to see what fans, you get to see what vendors, you get to see what owners in front office people

like to identify with. And they enter that flow of vic stasis, and if you're able to pull them into that and capitalize on it, that's what makes your business better. One more thing to add to a great question, which is in pro sports, the reason why we're all here, the business of sports has enhanced. It's so dynamic, right, there's gaming, there's e sports, there's a corporate sponsorship model.

What's evolved, media rights has taken over, dynamic ticketing pricing, and so it's gotten very attractive and why we have so many sophisticated business people entering sports. But think about players as this, whether it's a five year, ten year, or twenty year career, you're an understudy to that business. We have exposure every day to the ownership groups, to the gms, to the team presidents, and a lot of athletes are very aware and smart about that and they're listening.

So whether they realize it at an early age or when they start becoming a veteran, they're like, oh, I I get it now, and so put it this way. At at the core sport level, these athletes have exposure to multibillion dollar businesses and how these businesses are functioning.

So having oh no, no, go ahead, I will say one thing that I think we all kind of touched all that's extremely important, especially in the business world, is this that level of teamwork that's necessary because as we've all played our roles, we have to be able to know when to give, when to get, when to add a little boy, and play the role as a team. When Um I got out of the NFL, entered the business space, and even on the philanthropic side, it was

something that came natural to me. Um and finding solution as well extremely important when it comes to the climate crisis. Big problem needs a big solution. And I've been you know, blessed to talk to the n double A CP and Brontal Justice Program, talking to Green Sports Lines, Peep America beautiful and we're all get our heads together with the MEPA and other great partners and trying to figure out

what can be that key to spread the word. And it's great that sports keeps on coming back over and over again to get athletes who have the influence the platform to share something that can truly make a difference. Well, this is great because Jason and I talked about this a little bit earlier, and I think we've you know, you athletes in terms of controlling your brand right and think about the reach that you have, whether it's through social media and how you can quickly go right to

your fan base. What's so many questions? What's your responsibility whether it's Hong Kong protests or some other injustices that are going on. Because you're seeing a lot of tensions between team owners, between leagues and between players. Tell me about that balance and how tricky it is. Oh, I think that also depends upon the latitude of your employer. You have to understand time example, do the leagues have a lot of latitude as your employer. But I mean

for every action, there's a reaction. There repercussions for what you decide to stand for. Kyler Kaepernick, I understand that's a bigger issue that we can tap into. But I had the same issue all the time with the ESPN obviously, um look esp and his own it's a parent company is Disney obviously with Bob Iger and you have to understand for certain things. If you tread upon certain things that the company mandates that they don't want you to

tap into, there will be repercussions for that. So I think there is a responsibility to a degree, but you have to understand what the sacrifices are. And I think that's a huge statement for a lot of younger athletes because I look, we just the platform is there. We can talk about anything that we want whenever we want

to talk about that. That's a gift. But with that gift comes responsibility to understand there are repercussions if you decide to go against the grain of what your employer teams not important and I want you guys to wait because I do wonder now that you run businesses, do you understand that other side? Yeah, So on the on the business side of the house. What's been really interesting as we've seen this startup economy proliferate called like the

shark the shark tank era. Uh, the cost to start a business has never been better, and founders are equity rich and cash poor. Their business goals are to acquire customers. The best way to acquire a customer is to go direct to that customer, not out of home. In your marketing flip side, you have athletes who for a long time have been cash rich and equity poor, so there's a natural match. Then, with the evolution of social media, athletes now can go for the first time direct a consumer.

Athletes haven't become all of a sudden these celebrities that didn't have the same pop thirty forty fifty years ago. Think Joe Namath, Think Muhammad Ali, think Michael Jordan's. What we have now is social and we have that access to our audience whenever we want. It's not when linear

media affords us that opportunity. So if you take the two trends and you marry them, that's why a lot of athletes now are working with founders of startups, and a lot of founders of startups are looking to touch athletes because of that direct a consumer, the work ethic, the critical thinking, the creativity. But it's a natural marriage, and I think that's why in particular, athletes are looking

at early stage investments. Um, if we had sizable checks and you're looking with athletes that are now being LPs of larger private equity funds, and you can maybe de risk your portfolio and invest in a later stage business. But I think because of social media new tech athletes building scalable audiences that they can access authentically and that being the missing piece for a lot of leveraged startups.

That's where we're seeing a lot of connection. I think they is absolutely amazing opportunity for athletes and for brands with social media, but it's also a very dangerous opportunity for athletes and their brands with social media. And we've seen so many great athletes crash and burn because they couldn't stop their Twitter fingers and because they couldn't post too much of their life, and because they felt like sharing and being transparent their true self was the best

way to go. You know, would be just that, but it wasn't. It actually can ruin a ten fifteen year career like that. So it's very important to train these these kids at a young age, even high school, because we're going back and looking at what you tweeted in high school. We're going back to see what you said when when you were a young dumb kid. And if you have stay with are too strong, people will hold that against you and will mess your money. Well, that's

just happening there right now. You have a lot of kids who I know in the basketball space who are thirteen, fourteen, fifteen years old that four injun fifty people that follow them on Instagram. So I think right now, the more that we have informative conversations like this, these kids are understanding from a lot earlier her an age because Paul's Paul's in product of something that's great. Right. It's the revolution. It's the revolution, it's the way, it's the revolution of

athletes and the way we think today now. But I think when you have kids who are twelve years old that are seeing the business of their brand and seeing their brand being monetized and exposed and having access, it just keeps you a different mindset at earlier age. Yeah, I think that the one thing after you see how social media has affected the game and how fast that it is sped up the messaging of the teams and what happens with the team, that co exists with the athlete.

Athletes have to understand that the responsibility of social media is placed at the premium of the level that their plan and if they want to make it to the premium level, they have to understand that at a young age. They have to start at a premium level to telling stories. And that's one thing that as an athlete growing up in social media, you know when I can him out. I came out as Instagram started to trend. Everybody was

still on Facebook. And as Instagram started to trend up, you see sponsors and you see the intermingle of what you know, what athletes want to say and versus what they want to do, and and they need to recognize that if you want to make it to this premium stage at a young age, that's exactly what the coaches, the owners, the front office that everybody's paying attention to. I get it. It's being responsible. But I do wonder

about you guys. Know, you have this incredible platform for being social agents have change and I mean Muhammad Ali Alle did it, you know, Arthur Ashe. I mean, these are people who went out on a limb and and through social media you can do it. And I do wonder is that your responsibility to help push for those changes?

It is? It is a responsibility, um because like I relate to personal experience, I was on the Eagles when we had the player Coalition dealing with specifically Colin Kaepernick and dealing with the things that happened with er agree it's a responsibility to properly explain and tell the true message that you know that will affect and provide the most positive life and what is actually really going on. There are so many things that change and involve around

the game of sports and in social media. As soon as you implement your message, it can have a ripple effect that goes throughout the entire sports with the entertainment world, and that startups and different companies get involved in it, and people are starting to express express themselves, and they're starting to involve themselves in different types of technologies and

able to tell these more fluid stories. They need to understand that the fans are able to access them, and they're able to interpret these things in a way fluid manner and able to interpret them and able to use them against them or for them. So I think one aspects that sometimes becomes missed is the opportunity of collaboration.

So the way I would look at something if I wanted to make a statement, since there is one degree of separation with the likes of venture capitalists or bide by your guys like that reaching out to those individuals and saying, let's talk through the pros and cons of what I want my statement to be. What effect does this have on entity I currently worked for? And I want the same from my employees. Hey, if there's something that you want to make, okay, let's talk about what

the repercussions of those actions could be. But I think collaboration is something that we need to start having more conversations about instead of just I think sometimes when social media becomes knee jerk, I have to have to do this right now in front of everybody, make my statement without been thinking about what your statement is going to be, um and understanding with the words that you say. Let me look, I had in real time. I had to process a guy that was a mentor to me passing away.

It was raw. It was very emotional for me. I cursed on TV. Yes, I cursed on TV. Walking away from the experience being emotional, I wonder what it would have been like. And I understand that everybody else appreciated that raw emotion. But I also have a wife and I have a child. That is my livelihood and I have to think as soon as I walked up that set my job is in jeopardy because of what I did to a degree. Um, it comes along with the territory.

That's part of the responsibility as well. Um, I've only got a couple more minutes, and I just wanted to wrap up, Um if you could. I know, I hate these kind of questions, but you guys are pretty amazing group up here. If you could sit down with one person right now, talk to them about your business, pick their brains, just briefly, who would it be and why I only got two minutes and fifteen seconds take ahead. I am um actually got a chance to spend some

time with him. It's one of the backers of Paul's company. Joe and Clara said, I think yeah. I think yeah, seeing how they've managed Ali Baba, seeing how they originated that, how they've scaled that business to the degree, what the future of that vertical is for them. I find it so intriguing because you talk about social responsibility, right, yes, Um, perfect person to talk to and that becomes a chat munch, Paul,

your next we gotta quick one one person. I could probably list off a dozen, you could pick one, so I would say, I would say alive. I would say

Bob Iger. I haven't had a chance to meet Mr Iger, but I think the complexity of the Walt Disney business from events to media, Uh, it's probably mirrors the way we think about the pol We think about us as a media company, that lacrosse is the vehicle of which we're building in the livelihood of our players, but how do we distribute that product in Walt Disney Company has done a terrific job, great at integrating so many platforms

twenty seconds one can go yeah quick. I would say someone similar to what I'm involved with, like a Steve Jobs and entertainment Jimmy Ivien or Zy because of how they scale what they've been ever to build and how to connect and entertainment and sports is what we do. We're entertainers, you know, we're athletes, and we're involved in

this sports text. So the entertin of those two and like I don't know if you're familiar with the movie The Defiant Ones, seeing how they've built that conglomerate and able to satisfy with music, entertainment and sports and tech with Steve Jobs out of this is a great bunch of people. One easy U A former team owner Arthur blank. The fact that he's been able to do so much in the sports space and in the business space emerge

out together. It's been amazing what you can accomplished. All right, gentlemen, thank you so much. Incredible panel, and I really appreciate it. Thank you. We have another speaker and we want to get to our next speaker. Really embodies the American dream. At the age of five years old, she was left in an orphanage in soul. Today she's one of the

most powerful women in sports. Kimbugle, co owner of the Buffalo Bills Buffalo sabers here to talk about her story and really just what it's like to be an owner in an environment, a very dynamic environment that is changing constantly. So thank you so much. We want to talk about a lot of things. One of the questions I want to ask you and forgive me, but what's it like being a very successful woman in a sport that is so dominated by men. It's it's awesome. I'm sorry, isn't

really all awesome. I'm not trying to make anyone jealous, but um, I have the best job in the world. You know what I this is, you know it. There's a lot of challenges of course, but I can tell you just I'm having so much fun. Ever any moment though where they're like, oh, Kim, what does your husband think about this? Um? No, you know what my my um my husband and I we're we've been married for about twenty seven years and he has been a great

partner of mine. And I remember when you, um when we talked about the bid coming up to buy the bills. He's like him, like, like, you gotta get on board because I can't do this and you know, without without you and I and certainly that. Um So he's always been my biggest supporter and it's been very grateful. But then at the same time he's like, all right, you go do it. So he's like it's great to have the support. But then you realize you're the one doing

all the work. Not always but sometimes times. But it's great being an owner, being a female in football. Um. Like I said, I just I'm so blessed and I love I love it every day. And so what's the big challenge for you? I'm going to use your mind, So what's the big challenge for you right now? In in obviously a lot of focus this weekend because it is the Super Bowl. It's a good time to sort of take stock of where you are as an owner.

What's number one on your list? You know, really we would not be here without our players, and they get in our fans. And so every year, regardless of our our wins our losses, UM, every year is a new challenge because you I mean the forty niners were you know, they were almost one of the worst teams last year, and this year they're in the Big Game. And so every year is different and you can't always like count

on what you did right or what you did wrong. UM. But the just the fan base, UM, trying to re engage with them, all the new technology that comes through, you've got new players, UM. You know, the struggles that any business have when you don't know what it is. So I think that's really is just how do we keep engaging our fans, How do we keep building on what we have? How do you do that? Because we you know, we've had some conversations and planning for this.

Jason and I talked about it with our own families that there is so much UM. I think George Pine used this expression like competing force mind space. So how do you you want, you know, you want the fans at the games, but you also want to keep them engaged when they're a way. So how do you compete with so much that's out there? Well, yeah, and we found that, you know, we used to think that you

could kind of compete with another club. You're you're competing against another league, you know, basketball, hockey, whatever it is, UM. But we found that we're really competing for people's time and the convenience because they're able to do, you know, go on their phone and get a ride to wherever they want to go. They can have groceries delivered right

to right to your door. And so people are now expecting out of their experience all the ease and convenience that they're getting from all these other industries that you know, before we didn't think we're our competitors, UM, but certainly now now they are because they want that same level of expectations UM for our fans. Do and Kim. How do you create a club and create sort of an

ethos around the club that's reflective of the city. I mean, Buffalo is is in a mirror can city in so many ways, for good and bad, especially now in so what is it about the team that reflects the city. Well, you know what I really do, there's um, you know, sometimes I feel like we can't as a club in the league. Sometimes they have a lot of rules, right, and of course, you know, we gotta play within those rules.

But I think that authenticity that you know, we we talk about a lot um, I think that you have to really embrace that. So um in Buffalo we have this is called Bill's Mafia. Was not started by the club. In fact, we kind of really shied away for because we're like, oh, that's kind of like a negative and tones we're not, you know, not that kind of family, um and so. But but that's what the fans like felt like they just embraced it as their own. And

now we're like, no, let's partner with that. Let's embrace me that because that's who we are. So really understanding our core fan who we are and then allowing them organically naturally to help us really be who we are at a team. And and if you any of our players, you'll see there'll be like a shout out to Bills Mafia, Like they get it too, they feel it all right. For our Bloomberg Business Week listeners, tuning in around the country.

We're here in Miami talking to Kim Pogola. She is the president CEO of Googola Sports and Entertainment, owner and president of the Buffalo Bills and the Buffalo Savers. We should point up. So one thing I want to ask you is you are thinking about and it's some of the conversations we've been having here up on stage, is that you want to think about your existing maybe older fan base, right who wanna interact with the game and

the team a certain way. And then you got your younger consumer who you also want to engage because you want to have them around for decades to come. How do you balance that as a team owner? You know, you've got to think about resources and so on and

so forth. I think that is is so hard. I mean that is one of you asked me earlier about one of the struggles, and I think that's truly a It's the best thing about sports, Like our fan base is anyone from like you know, a new baby that's got they're like my first game shirt, and then I've got you know, people that like a hundred years celebrating their hundredth birthday out of football game and so how

do you cover that whole? I mean, it's the best thing, like do you have that fan base, um, that spans so many generations, um, but if it present us a lot of challenges. Well, speaking of challenges, we just had four you know, incredibly successful athletes who have moved on in some ways, you know, co founding businesses, co founding a league, some still playing. We talked a lot about the role of social media, players using social media, managing their own brands. How do you, as a team owner

kind of get your hands around that. What's your view on that? No, I I am very big proponent of our players having a voice in a brand because I do think, like I said, they are representing your team, and the players aren't coming to see me, They're coming to see our players. And I think there's such power that they can that they have UM with the influence and and if we can help them. So we have

a program. The league has done a much better her job in the recent years of allowing for that, and so we have a program where we actually will because you know, the players on game day, like they're supposed to be focusing on the game, but they've got fans day, got family, they want to have fun, and so we like provide extra videographers, extra camera crew, extra people that will take pictures and we'll send it to them and say, hey, we're not using this, why don't you can share it

with your fans, or you can share it with your family. You can do whatever you want with them. Because it's social media's time consuming. Oh my goodness, I have a Twitter account and I got an Instagram and it's like, it's it's a lot. And now we're on TikTok, right, So like you gotta do the Facebook for your older generation. Now, then you gotta do TikTok, which are completely and everything

in between. It's a lot. They really, Kim. I want to talk a little bit about hockey in a minute and some of the opportunities that you see not only in hockey, but as you think about the Northern audience. We talked a little bit about this backstage, but before we do that, I want to bring up a conversation that Carol and I had yesterday with Jerome bettis Uh the bus well known to this audience about diversity in

hiring at the top levels. As an owner, obviously you are deeply involved in all of these discussions not just for your own team, but across the league. What does the league need to do to bring more diversity to the higher ranks? You know, I believe that all a lot of what we really need to do is really at the grass roots. So and and there's been some great strides, as we talked about with an extension of the Rooney Rule, but you know, now trying to get

that with coordinators and trying to build that pipeline. But you know, it's got to start at such a young age, right, and but we're getting where there's there those young girls or guys or kids, they're able to see other people of diverse backgrounds, colors, religions in higher places. Um, but there's just not enough of them, right. But it's but at least we need to get that, um, that pipeline in start at a grassroots level. It's just the numbers

just aren't there. So how do you get the numbers up? And I think about the tech community facing crisis because they don't have the workers either boys girls going through STEM education. So they have actively created programs and high schools and so on and so forth. How active do you think the league needs to be? Team owners to

creating programs like that. So, I mean, I know, from a business standpoint, you know, the entry level in Buffalo, our biggest struggle is that nobody wants to leave, right, So we don't have a lot of turnovers. So we don't have the organization in the organization I mean too, you know, it's a small community, very family oriented, so people have grown up in the same job for many, many years. So we don't have a lot of turnovers. So, UM,

that's been a little bit hard. So we try to bring in people from the the interns, the entry level to at least give them some some experience. UM. I have talked to Syracuse University. My son goes to Syracuse. They have a Grace Force management program. Um, they have a program for women. UM. I forgot the name of it now, but I forgot the name of it now, But anyways, um, And so I come and speak with them as well, and UM, they just you know, like there is such a want. I mean, they want to

be participated, They want to be a part of it. UM. And I think it's just showing more of them that, you know, this is a career path you can choose at a young age and so let's talk about expansion, expanding the audience. You know, Buffalo and this is not a knock, not one of the fastest growing cities in America unfortunately, little Chili um and yet there's a big population around you. You know, you're the only sort of big football team for miles around and not just a

US audience. But we were talking with our Canadian friend Derik Chatsker backstage, Toronto could be a place for expansion. Is that on your mind? Well, I have to be careful because like Toronto is like a like a really bad word in Buffalo, right from a hockey perspective, yes, well, from a hockey perspective. And then when I'm my husband, I were, um, you know, in the midst of purchasing, we were competing with Donald Trump, and we were competing

with John bon Jovi and and a Toronto contingent. So we um it was it was crazy to think it was the hardest competitor. Was a Trump or bon Jovi? I think, well, no, as it was, like I say, it was, it was Toronto by far. It was Toronto. So there was always the fear that the team would move. Um, so we kind of shied away from that knowing how the fan base fell. But um, but they are you

know what they love. They love football as well, and obviously they have the CFL, UM, so they're familiar with football. They love the NFL. We're so close to them. Um. So yeah, so we need to get that's gonna be a priority of ours, um football. As you know, you know we've gone to London games. We got to two stadiums in London. UM, we played in um Mexico City, so you know, we want to try to make the game a lot more global and the league is doing a big push for that, and so we're gonna, like

I said, put for their efforts. In Toronto. It's our neighborhood. It's our back yard. And I like, I like to say I'm part Canadian because my when I was adopted, like you said, my my family came from Canada, so there are Canadians by heart. And of course in hockey, we always play the Canadian national anthem at every game, so I feel like I'm part Canadian. So it is definitely a priority for me because it's it's a huge

market up there. Curious about when you look out at the next I don't know what what kind of Um, I feel like, Lane, do you feel like you feel comfortable about making commitments when it comes to building out the team more or doing things in terms of fan engagement? Do you have five years of visibility? I mean, there's so many technologies that people are talking about, whether it's a R, whether it's VR five G and how that's

going to impact the fan experience. You know, what kind of visibility do you feel like when you can make commitments to do things for the future. Well, so, like I said, we do have a stadium, LI said it is going to be expiring soon. So all those things that you just talked about is certainly foremost in our mind.

But I just really believe you know, my husband and I we've only owned the team for five years, right, and this is the first year though, So what I'm really focusing on now is really making our business in

kind of our own um, in our own mold. So we had they have one owner before us, Mr Wilson, who had passed away, and so you can imagine that there was you know, he bought the team for twenty five dollars, right and um, and so he are our goals different, our needs, right, are vastly different from it

from his. And so I think for me, the priority really is is really to understand the business, to create it and shape it into kind of how our needs for our family, how do we sustain a long term And then I think once we get that really where we need to be, then all this stuff is easier to put in right because it is so ever changing and um, but if we don't don't have that poor base, that foundation of business, UM, I think that's you know, it's all that stuff, it's gonna be just so much

harder to navigate. So that's where I'm really focusing my time right now on the leadership, on setting up our business and practices. Um, just trying to set us up for I've got three kids, so trying to set them up for their future. Well. And and I believe one of your daughters is a professional tennis player, right, And so you are seeing lots of different sports both as a parent, as and as an owner as you think about the popularity of sports going forward, the NFL obviously

remains number one? Can it stay that way? I mean with all of this competition? Yeah? No, I I like I said, I I love the game and I think the National Football League has done a wonderful job of growing the sport. Um, but it is our players and it is our fan base. So I think when if we keep investing in those two areas, either as a club or as a league, that we're gonna we're gonna get the return from there. Um. This past year we

opened up a new sports performance center. You know, back there, you'd be like, hey, these guys, you go go do fifty reps, you know, fifty squads. You know, you're just like lifting weights. Well, now we've got like cryotherapy chambers, and we've got sleep pods and floating tanks and all these like very things that really are to help our players really not you know, step away from the game, help them and make their career last longer, help them

recover quick, will prevent injuries. And that's a huge component. And like I said, every club and every team owner is making those types of investments in the players. Um on top of all you know the normal of course the day, and then like I said, and then the

technology part for our fan base. If we keep investing in those two areas, that's that's where we're gonna be able to consist in the growth well, and I want to pick up on something you said a minute ago about you know, you and your husband buying the team.

You know from Mr Wilson. That was obviously a seminal moment for that franchise, but it's also representative of a change in ownership that we're starting to see across the league, especially as you talk with your fellow quote unquote new owners. What's different about them? You know, what's different about this sort of new cohort that's coming in. You know, I I would say, um, first of all, there's a lot

more diversity. I certainly think that if you go not just speaking for myself, but there has been a lot of new female owners that even just in the five years I've been in the league, are now sitting in the room, per se. A lot of second generational families now, you know, daughters and sons are going through UM and becoming new owners. And I think a lot of them are they grew up in the business, right so you

know a lot of them. You know, sat Jerry Jones, you know he started his you know, he started a brought the Dallas Cowboys, um, but now his kids are growing up in it. So I think it's a much more engaged ownership. UM. Like I said, I'm I'm new, but I'd like to think I'm young and hard and you know, my kids will grow up too. But I think that's a difference in the ownership now even when there's a lot of changes, but there's also like even

a lot of changes within Um. It's that next generation that has really grown up and it's not the original owner anymore. UM, And it's a lot of fun. I think we're it's just developed a new kind of UM. I think bomb you know, like you know, we appreciate these stories from before, but like we all kind of start making our own relationships and stories. Yeah, there were

some benefits, right, we know of diversity of thoughts. So if you're bringing in some more women or people from different backgrounds, right in terms of what it brings to the league? Yes, And so what was the question though, just say, you know, we we see all the research that's been done about having kind of a diverse board and sort and so forth, so you think about the

benefits that that could do for the league. So it does, and you know what, I I love A lot of the club's owners are actually very family based and That's what I do love about the league. There's a lot of family that are m are part of it because my husband, I like, we are very very very different, but together we like, we work like. We like great. What he's good in, I'm not as good in what I'm good in he doesn't want to do, so it makes it work. So I think that's really an advantage.

So we have to ask you. We've been asking a lot of the folks up here on the stage Sunday's game, the chiefs of the forty niners, have you thought about this? Gosh? And this is like on the record, so I I mean, I don't on the fend either either family. So I'm just happy the Patriots are not in it because they are in our division and I we had to play them, you might had to play them for you know, almost

nineteen years in our division. So um, So I'm happy to see another fan base to get the opportunity if it's not us. Alright, one last question, Well, I was just gonna say, I mean you also have the notion of you know, really young quarterback from the a f C and Patrick Mahomes who has really re energized It feels like that part of the it is. You know, so our our quarterback Josh allen Is only has two season and Patrick Mahomes even you know, um you saw

Lamar Jackson. So all these young quarterbacks are really are the next wave level you know of of excitement and fans and for our fans. And that's really exciting to see to be a part of that, um because like I said, that's that's the futures our players and our fans. Yeah, you definitely see this era. Alright. One last question. If you had to pick one priority for yourself as a team owner over the next few years, what would it be.

One priority? Probably to enjoy the game more. I know you you would think that the game would be like the most excited. It's so stressful for me. I'm like, I'm like, I need to learn how to enjoy the game, win or lose. I need to learn how to enjoy it. A little tailgating, a little beer help. I have done that on occasion, but I gotta do it more often because, like I said, I'm so fortunate, so lucky, best job

in the world. I gotta enjoy it, right, Yeah, exactly, all right, Well, thank you, Kim, thank you so much. Really appreciate it. Thanks everybody, and for those of you listening on Bloomberg Radio Bloomberg Business Week, I'm speaking with

John Skipper of the Zone, formerly of ESPN. And it's funny too, and and this is right in your wheelhouse, Carol and I spent the last couple of days broadcasting from Radio Row, and we were talking with Brian Billick about the idea that two years ago, you know, you were starting to hear a pretty consistent death knell for professional football. Let me tell you, look around Miambi Beach

Convention Center. You would not feel that today. What happened with football and your estimation from a consumer, from a fan, from a business perspective, Look, I've never thought there was a death kneel for the NFL. The NFL's popularity, uh has done nothing but rise. There have been times and years in which the prime time broadcast ratings have declined a little bit or gone up a little bit, but they do a spectacular job of figuring out how to

create new packages. I don't think the total audience, if you Aggre, ever gone down. I don't think anything has happened with football, and it's remarkably resilient in the face of, uh, some level of controversies, concerns about help safety of the players. The league has responded, I think fans love the game. There's something uniquely American about it which is spectacular, and I don't see any scenario under which the NFL doesn't

continue to be the most popular league in the United States. Yeah, it's amazing. I mean, the resilience. You're exactly right, all right, So let's talk a little bit about the business at handon and for those listening to us on Bloomberg Radio Bloomberg Business Week, I'm sitting here with John Skipper here in Miami from the from the Zone, From to Zone. You are the chairman of Zone and also the former

president of ESPN of course streaming. We got to talk about it and talk about it in the context of the history of media. Is this one of, if not the biggest inflection point that you've seen in your career in terms of media and sports. Well, in my career, I mean, the was an extraordinary inflection point when you went from a paucity of sports on broadcast, right, they did the broadcast networks did less than a thousand hours a year of television. Uh. In my last year as

president of ESPN, we did ninety thousand hours. Um. So that was a an inflection point of availability of content to fans. And that was cable really that created that, right, Yeah. And it was of course also a transition from an over their broadcast signal to a more stable connection, whether it be satellite or co acle cable. But this inflection point, which is moving from pay television two over the top streaming,

it's gonna be just as profound. I mean, look, it's already happened in music, and look how profound that is. Instead of going to your tywer records and bringing home a sack full of vinyl, you pay a very small amount of money and have all the music. Or I just made the number up of all the music in the world available to you on your smartphone. That's a spectacular consumer experience. Change the business model you now have.

We're right in the middle of the movement of general entertainment two over the top streaming, and all you read about every day is the introduction of Busney Plus, here comes the new Peacock. What what is the next series of content? And Apple TV? What's HBO Max is gonna look like? What is Amazon gonna do. What is Facebook gonna do. Uh, it's a remarkable change over time. It's a better value to the consumer. It unbundles the bundle, which doesn't mean you will have a reaggregation of over

the top content. You will, and it also provides advantages in more volume. You're gonna go now from one thousand hours and ninety thousand hours to two million hours and pretty much everything is going to be available. You're gonna be able to pick and choose more. And then you have the advantage of interactivity two way communication, which will allow people to have personalized experiences vetting, fantasy, gamification, chat rooms and and uh conversations happening during the broadcast. So

it's a profound change and a better consumer experience. The question is what happens to the business model? Okay, so let's talk. I mean, let's get into it. Because everything you said sounds awesome, sounds amazing, especially from a consumer perspective. And yet you know the joke that people will sit down to try and watch a movie on a Friday night and they'll spend an hour just on Netflix, and by the time they decide what they're gonna watch, it's time to go to bed. You know what I mean

that that's sort of paralysis. I'm more efficient than that. Well, you're a more efficient guy in general, but you know, and that's just with a couple of platforms. Some of the things you've talked about haven't even fully rolled out yet. How is a consumer to make sense of what they're

gonna put their dollars to? Um. I don't actually know that this is literally what happens, but I think it's instructive to think about a family sitting around the dinner table and deciding what they're going to buy, and the winners are gonna be those people who are the first choice, or the second choice, or the third choice, because not many people are going to subscribe to more than five or six services, which by the way, may still include

a light aggregated PayTV bundle, but they're gonna add Netflix. I mean, Netflix is fairly ubiquitous now within a certain socioeconomic group of people in the United States. Even if you go to a place, um, if you're gonna Brazil. You know, the plurality of homes at a certain socio economic level and above all have Netflix. They have it in Canada. They you know, they're gonna have it in

India and everywhere else. So the fight now is between HBO, Max and Peacock and Disney and Apple and Amazon Prime for where are they in the lineup of which services people are gonna choose. We are sports only, so we have to work our way into that consideration set. We have a very simple way to do that. That does not mean that it is trivial to execute, but we know from my experience in Germany, Japan, Italy that if you have first tier sports content, you're going to make

the cut. In Italy we have syriality, which means if you're a Javenas fan, three out of every ten Juvenus games are owned his own. It's the only way to watch them. We have a very large number of subscribers in Italy. Uh same thing in Japan where we have the j League football soccer and we have the Japanese baseball, so we have a large business in Japan. We have had we have bundas some Bundesliga games. In Germany. We've got to high business. It's easy to do, it is

not inexpensive. The technology is complex. The reason music happened is audio is easier to stream than video. The recent entertainment happens before sports is because archived entertainment that sits at the head end of in the cloud is easier to the hardest thing to do is we're gonna have a live game, and we're going to produce that and deliver it to you at the same time as everybody else. Last year we did one hundred more than one games events in which we had an audience of over a

million people watching the same thing at one time. I do not think anybody else in the world has had that experience. Uh, And that is the complexity of that is why this will happen over a certain period of time. It's funny. I was just talking to somebody who said, when's the super Bowl gonna be on? Over the top? The super Bowl might be very quickly over the top as a choice exclusively over the topic. That's you couldn't do it right now. You just couldn't. It wouldn't be stable,

it wouldn't be a good experience. But if five million people wanted to do it because they weren't in front of that, you know, they weren't at home, or they didn't have a PayTV subscription. Although super Bowl, I know, is on broadcast um though most people getting broadcast through PayTV. Uh, that could certainly be a compliment which would urge the

NFL to think about in their next round of deals. Well, let's talk about that very point, because for a long time, media rights when it comes to sports have been to keep me honest here exclusive, right, I mean, and you don't have so much of these sort of complimentary situations. Is that changing? Is it changing fast? Well? It's interesting. It depends on where you're talking about. UM. At ESPN, our point of view was it is not acceptable to bifur kate the linear stream and the over the top.

Of course, the NFL did that on Thursday night when they sold a linear stream to Fox and they sold an over the top stream to Amazon. So I think you will see some uh positioning and struggle and and I think some leagues will try to bifur kate the two. Now, I'll tell you something ironic that while I just said that our point of view at at the Zone is that we won't exclusive content, we may in certain cases be willing to be non exclusive. I take the Super

Bowl night exclusively. Uh, But when we bought the Seria rights in Italy or the Japanese baseball rights. We bought them exclusively. They are not for It's okay if you want to get your pay TV subscription. We want to move of people over. We want a transformation. We don't want to be a complementary service. Right And for those of you listening on Bloomberg Radio Bloomberg Business Week, I'm speaking with John Skipper of the Zone, formerly of ESPN.

So as you think about sort of sport by sport, you guys have a really nice footprint in boxing obviously here in the United States. You talked about some of your soccer slash football rights overseas. What's the next big growth area for you that takes to Zone to the next level. Look, it is you want to what you need to do to build a subscription service. And we're in nine countries of four continents. Were in Brazil or in Spain, were in Italy, were the United States? Were

in Canada, Where in Austria, Switzerland and Germany. You've got to start with something that matters. Right here, we started with sal Lalvarez Canela. He matters. So you can move people over. You gotta start um in can that we have a Sunday ticket. You gotta start with something that matters. You gotta build around it so that people, well you can retain their subscription, you can make sure that they're

all the year and that they watch more. If we can get people to watch five events in a month, it doesn't matter five basketball games, five baseball games, it's almost certain that they'll stay with us the next month. So you gotta build out. So that's the threshold is five, well four, the threshold just not for eight percent. So and then you gotta build some library content, right, ultimately

got to build some library content. You start with primary sports, then you add secondary tertiary sports rights, and then you add our caval content beyond it to build the service. And so, you know, one of the themes that we've been talking about throughout the day is this idea of the empowered player. You know, athletes really owning their own content, their own brands. How does that play into this new streaming world. Well, look, the beauty of streaming is you

have infinite capacity. So the extent that athletes want to do programming around the games they play, they want to do behind the scenes, we have the infinite capacity to show that we do a fair amount of that and you know we do docum documentary. Uh. The football season in Europe you know, runs basically ten months, so in those two months between, we run documentary product about those leagues to keep people for those two months. UM. So I think the empowered player has a much easier platform

over the top. Do you have a take that you can share about who the most forward thinking leagues are around the world, who's most progressive when it comes to this new media world. Look, I would start saying that I don't think there's any league that is not believed that they need to play in this, that they're gonna need to understand it. They're gonna need to be at the forefront of it. Um you know you you uh.

I always sip my hat to the NBA. They understand that being first, being technologically forward is a good idea. But look, the NFL on Thursday night right now is doing something almost nobody else is doing. When you're around the world. Um, the the major football associations and leagues

are there on this. Uh. I cannot confirm the exact details, but the Champions League, controlled by yr WAFA in Germany is going to be next year available solely on over the top services, and so you gotta look at that.

That's the second most important, right. It's the equivalent of moving UM the NBA or all of college football to UH to and over the TOUN service, which would be astonishing and transformation in the United States, I don't think by the way, that's getting ready to happen, but in a in other markets around the world, and our business is outside of the United States. We are the leading global over the top pure play sports streaming service in

the world. And in most of the world there are not you you can count them right, one, two, three, four, four broadcast networks one to three, big pay TV providers one to three, four big technological companies, and most of the world there's an over the air there's one or two players in pay TV, So your ability to move faster is more pronounced there than it is. And you know States, which is why we're concentrating to a large extent on the rest of the world r W rest

of World UH. And for more on that Champions League conversation, you can read Bloomberg and you've got some details around that. UM I I would suggest that Bloomberg has it right. I can't confirm anything, but they have it right, all right, there you go many things. Um, So when it comes to your job, now we've only got a few minutes left. What have you learned so far? You've seen so much over the course of your career. This is certainly a

new adventure. What has jumped out to you when you like, go to a cocktail party or a dinner party, Like, what are you saying to people? That's that sort of AHA moment for you working into zone. Look, it's it's it's not many of you have experienced it, right, but it is astonishingly stimulating and fun to do something different.

I'm aware of the irony, but it's also quite fun of having worked at the by far the most important participate in the pay TV universe, to sort of look flip the mirror and look at exactly the opposite, which is to be the uh disruptor the challenger is really fun. Uh Again, I liked both positions. I'm not suggesting one is better than the other, but that has been an AHA moment that d until you try, Uh, you kind

of don't know. The other AHA moment for me is just that we um, we've had the is the global part of it, right? It is really fun to do business in the world. Uh. I'm a very proud American, but it is really fun to travel and see the rest of the world. Uh and and sort of get the stimulation that business has done differently. Regulatory is different, the broadband internet universe is different in different places. So to be in Spain and sort of understand what that slide.

Uh And Uh, you know, I get to go to a lot of people places, people go on vacation. Uh. For what I'm working, somebody's paying for the room. And so when you look back toward the United States, what have you learned about what either you can do differently at the zone in the United States that hasn't been done before, or that from a more structural perspective needs to be done for the US. Just sort to keep up. Look, we what we're learning is how to deal with different

kinds of broadbent infrastructure, different curtesies. We're also learning a lot. You heard me say if you watch five five games, you're unlikely to turn that. That will be true here. We're learning how to do archival material that complements the game. We're learning how to do interactive things. So all these things will serve us well and it's if you're learning in in Spain, you don't necessarily learn it under the

hawkeye of the media in the United States. There is no more intense media repertorial scrutiny and uh than there is here. And so it's it's good to be able to try some of these things other places, a little bit out of the out of a shining light. Uh. Is there a sport that's growing, maybe faster than people anticipate. We all know about American football, we all know about football, global football. Is there something that's coming up that you've

seen that maybe people aren't quite appreciating. Look, the most important thing is that it has to be local. Right. This is exactly what Netflix learned. You've got to go in and do local language content. It's got to be relevant to a local audience. It is remarkable having been mostly looking at this to an American lens for a long time. Football is the universal sport, by which I mean soccer, I mean around the rest of the world. It is half of what people care about. Some places,

it's three quarters of what people care about. You going to Italy, Syria is the NFL, the NBA, MLB and NHL put together. I mean, who knows. Since Spain it's La Liga the second list of popular sport in Spain Moto GP, right, so it's interesting. In Germany handball is really really popular, but it's the Bundesliga just sits on top of everything. Soccer is the king, John Skipper, what a treat. Thank you so much for spending pleasure. Thank you,

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