This is Bloomberg Business Wait inside from the reporters and editors who bring you America's most trusted business magazine, plus global business, finance and tech news. The Bloomberg Business Week Podcast with Carol Messer and Tim Stenebeck from Bloomberg Radio.
You know a I could bring Jerry back.
I don't think it could. I don't have as much faith in AI as you do.
Let's get to our guest, because we want to talk about some of the challenges seeing the music industry due to artificial intelligence with us again right here on Bloomberg Business Week, Michael Happy. He's president in CEO of Sound Exchange, and organization that essentially collects royalties for music creators. Right, I'm saying it right, Yeah, back in studio. I'm good to have you back with us.
I'm pleasure to be here, always happy to come and chat with you about whatever issues are on your mind.
Well, there's a lot of issues that my therapist has worked.
You don't want to get into her mind exactly.
Having said that, AI talked to us about your members or the folks that you work with. Are they a little nervous about the rise of AI?
So, look is a very interesting, uh topic in the music industr right now. There's there's you know, there's certainly concerns about it, but there's a lot of opportunities as well, you know. On on the one hand, you know, when you think about the issues that AI brings, I typically put them into three buckets, legal, cultural, and financial. On the legal front, there's obviously there you know, there are a lot of copyright issues about what is AI allowed
to scrape? Can you go and scrape copyrighted contents? You know, for instance, all of those very excellent you know databases out there that you guys supply is AI allowed to scrape copyrighted things? When AI creates a product, is it copyrighted? These are all some questions that are that are being engaged. Although we think copyright law pretty much protects creators the way they need to. But you know what people don't talk about as much. And thank you for bringing up
Drake in the weekend. It isn't just about copyright law. It is just it's equally about artists rights, creators rights. You know what we call name, image and likeness, the thing that bothers.
They took their sound, right.
They took their sound. But you know, what you're also doing when you imitate an artist with with fully you know, creative age talk and a.
Bar singing karaoke.
Excuse me, you know you're basically marketing on the you know, the brand and the image that Drake and the weekend, and that's just not right in any in any scenario.
Agreed, Agreed. Right, it's a brand, it's it's a branding.
But it's it's not just about the legal party. You know what, what what would I think the music industry wants everybody to be aware of, is there's this cultural component as well. You know, there's something about human artistry that we're actually part of a coalition called the Human Artistry Campaign dot com and uh you know it talks about as an industry, not just music, but all the creative industry. It talks about. Look. AI is a really cool tool. We should talk about the benefits that it
brings to the music industry elsewhere. But let's not forget the human element. Let's not forget the value that human artistry brings.
I think that's irreplaceable. Also, Michael, I mean to be fair, uh AI could be really helpful in the studio if you're a guitarist like a singer songwriter, and you want a certain drum beat, you can probably much more easily now get AI to create that for you with whatever time signature you want, and you know, whatever drum kit you wanted to sound like. But you're not gonna be able to write the kind of hit that resonates with people, you know, for generations with a software program right now.
So you are absolutely right on uh, And it reminds I disagree.
I think you could. You're going to be able to use AI to write songs.
Yes, you can use AI and write songs, but you're not gonna be able to churn out a Stairway to Heaven. You know, you're not gonna be able to do a Great Eagles Greatest Hits Volume two. You're not going to be able to get in a lot of more as set. You know, something that sells millions of copies and speaks to people in their hearts for for twenty thirty forty years. A jingle, yes, a commercial, okay, but you're not gonna be able to really move people times software program. I've
got two responds to that. First of all, AI is actually not that new.
What's new? It was, you know, completely generative AI. But AI has been around in the music industry and elsewhere for decades. Brian Eno back in nineteen ninety six, not to date myself, you know, talked about he actually put out an album and talked about AI music. And it's been as you said, drum kits, synthesizers, you know, voice modulation. So it's been around for a long time. What's the game changers? Predictive? But to your point about not being
able to replace it, I'm reminded. I was in an industry event just two days ago, uh here in in in New York and Joe Walsh speaking of the Eagles.
Genius Joe Walsh, I saw h giving an award.
And big time love of Stevie NICKX by the way, Yes.
Well who doesn't I know? And he had a great quote that stuck with me. He's talked about AI briefly when he was giving this award, and he said, look, you know, we're all being told that the future is AI, and pretty soon hits are going to be shot from these you know, digital canons at the speed of sound, and we're all going to become obsolete. Needless to say, Joe Walsh. Walsh thought that was a lot of bs, and he had a quote that I will never forget.
He said, he said all of that. He said, you know what, you can't program the gift of a songwriter or the soul of an artist.
I agree one hundred percent. And that is exactly the thing about Midnight in Harlem. I, Carol, you know Susan Tadashi and Derek Trucks, they have such a unique sound and the way they work as artists and the way they work together, that just I don't believe that a computer program, whether it's generative or not, can replace that.
Now.
I guess what I'm saying is that they could maybe create a song. I'm not necessarily saying like that what you get in a live element or you know, performers singing together, like there's something that's magical. But I do think you could use AI easily, machine learning generative AI to help fill out a song about lyrics.
Absolutely, And actually, Carol, that's a great point AI. A lot of the industry also sees, all of the industry sees the upside of AI. Let me tell you some of the pops.
I want AI, right, Matt, we want AI?
You do?
I want a job there? So many use cases. I think it would help, but I don't think it's.
Gonna you know, you know what I want? I want a I like it. You know, the new Indiana Jones movie that is coming out. The first segment of that of that film, they have taken the practically unlimited tapes and videos from earlier Indiana Jones and they de aged him Indiana Jones. Yeah, not Sean Harrison. That's what I want. In fact, in fact, if you're putting this on on on webcasts, can you do that to me before past production? That? Because but there's other things a I can do.
John Lennon, you know, AI Paul McCartney talking about it and being able to extricate, you know, some of his voice from a demo about two years before he died in nineteen.
Eighty Music Resurrection. They they think, for those of you who don't know, I mean, they're pulling out from a demo tape. Uh and and they're going to release the Beatles last record. They haven't said, no one is. They haven't officially said what the title of the of the record is, but a lot of them are predicting John, Well, it's done with John Lennon's permission. It's done with it's done, you know, with his estate's permission, and.
You got to run. We got to run. Thank you so much. Have a great weekend, Come back so much.
You're listening to the Bloomberg Business Week podcast. Catch us Live weekday afternoons from three to six Eastern Listen on Bloomberg dot com, the iHeartRadio app and the Bloomberg Business app, or watch us live on YouTube.
All right, Well, anyway, there's definitely been carnage in a crypto space, so let's get to it, and certainly the most recent when it comes to the SEC suits against both coinbase and Finance. Corey Clipston is CEO at the crypto trading app Swan Bitcoin. Back with us on zoom in La. Corey, good to check in with you again. There certainly has been quite the clamp down here in the United States. What do you make of the SEC suits?
Yeah, Hi, Carolyn, Matt, It's great to be back. Yeah.
It is a pretty fascinating time, isn't it. This is kind of what a lot of folks in the bitcoin space, meaning bitcoin, none of the alt coins, have been predicting was going to happen, and for many years frankly, going back to I think it was February twenty eighteen that Ja Clayton started to make it very clear that his position, in the SEC's position even that far back, was that you know, pretty much everything other than Bitcoin was going to be a security, other than maybe some of these
smaller proof of work coins that don't really have much market cap would probably be considered commodities as well. And I think we've seen that pretty consistently broadcast from Ginsler's SEC over the last couple of years. And you know, you can do all of the legal screening that you want with your own internal lawyers if you're a crypto casino or a crypto exchange, but at the end of
the day, that doesn't make law. And so the laws on the books basically say these things are securities, and they'll probably have to get laws changed by Congress if they want to operate these you know, sort of crypto equities.
And exactly, I mean, fighting the SEC is not usually a winning strategy. Maybe it's better to appeal to the people and try and get things change at a congressional level. Looks like that's what coinbase, for example, is doing. Corey, is it our proof of steak tokens or proof of steak blockchains more likely to be securities than proof of work blockchains.
Yeah, I think that's pretty much inevitable.
I think that it's, you know, one of these things where they say, like, if it walks like a duck and talks like a duck, acts like a duck, it's probably a duck. And that's interest, right, So I think that's we also have not seen any proof of steak project remotely approached decentralization. You know, the Ethereum roadmap is still completely controlled by Metallic The whole.
Ecosystem is marketed.
By kind of an Ethereum industrial complex of consensus, Ethereum Foundation, coin based Circle, and Drayson Horowitz Paradigm, few venture funds, so they can say all they want and try to get Ethereum to be the one centrally controlled crypto that gets a pass, and that's I think what their kicksave is to try to get through. But it doesn't have the benefit of being true, and so we'll see how that plays out.
What for the I just love it, I mean, uh, I mean, I don't have an opinion officially, so I'm not saying I totally agree, but if I were, I'm certainly who had an opinion.
First of all, you always have an opinion.
I've never I've never found proof of steak to be wait to me, it doesn't fulfill the og you know, promise of crypto and it certainly doesn't feel decentralized at all.
For those who aren't cool kids in the room, just talk a little bit about Corey if you will. A proof of steak versus proof of work, because it's it has to do without verification of crypto transactions.
But why work means that you're expending energy to spare the network, and proof of steak means that you're just trusting humans to kind of coordinate together.
And basically, the rich get richer. And if you have more, if you have.
More ethereum or more cardano or more solana, then you get more. And that's basically that fundamentally leads towards centralization. The second derivative of that is more and more centralization, regardless of where your starting point is, and it basically just means that humans are still running it, and humans change the monetary policy, as we've seen throughout the history of ethereum. For instance, the monetary policy is just changeable.
At a whim.
According to the directives of Joe Lubin at Consensus and Vitallic Beeter and at the Ethereum Foundation.
Tell us about swan and how consumers can use it, can interact with your company, and then who custodies the bitcoin.
Yeah, so we are a pretty diversified bitcoin financial services firm. So at present, we offer brokerage, we offer the swan IRA, we offer private client services through Swanprivate dot com, and then we have a whole wealth division that works with financial advisors and ras and helps them get bitcoin into their client portfolios. Later this year, will be launching Swan Custody. We purchased a company called Specter last year, which is one of the top multi sig custodian softwares out there.
It's free, open source software and that team has been building on top of their protocol to build Swan Custody. And then we're also launching asset back Loans. Should be in market with Asset back Loans this summer, and we think with those services you basically fulfill essentially all of the needs. Are most of the needs that anyone who was into bitcoin and thinking about it for their business or for their portfolio or their family would need to sort of check those.
Boxes to have a relationship.
And I think the key to our success so far has been that we just have a lot of the top experts in the world on bitcoin and on financial services at the intersection. Like our senior team and all of our salespeople come from you know, Goldman, Bridgewater, Morgan Stanley, Deutsche Bank, these different places, but our longtime bitcoiners as well, and they kind of speak both languages, and that really helps us translate what's going on for people.
Corey, you sound like it's full speed ahead. What was the impact though, of those sec suits against coinbas and finance what kind of either slow down or just maybe pull back a little bit that you see or even a lot as a result of that.
Yeah, I mean, I mean for us, this was like the ocean's parting in front of us and saying, oh my gosh, there's you know, three years of open field running at least for bitcoin financial services. And so we immediately greenlit tripling the sales team, and I greenlit a fifteen X and ad spend last week. So we're going
really really hard after this. We think this is the moment to tell the truth without a lot of distraction from the what i'd say the orange washing affinity marketers on the crypto side of the fence.
And so I think this is.
This is salad days for those people that thought bitcoin was the thing that really really matters, which you know, again happens to be true.
And do you expect all of these other business is to be pushed offshore? I mean, in the case of coinbase, it looks like Brian Armstrong wants to stand and fight, but everyone else seems to be heading for the hills in Europe or Asia.
Yeah, I mean, I think the payoff is so massive if they're somehow able to get some kind of accommodation or you know again you know, try to fight something through Congress or whatever. Don't think they'll succeed with that again, just because when when people that take laws in markets very seriously look at it, they'll kind of spot the hypocrisy of you know, regulate me specially, but not the other guys, not the penny stock operators, not the multi
level marketers and the Ponzi schemers. They only want sort of new regulations for their little corner of broad and chicanery, and.
I don't think they'll get away with it.
Yeah, I'm not pro regulation, but I am anti scam and I'm definitely anti hypocrisy. So again, if you want to open up the floodgates and let all these things through, then I think you have to look at basically every corner of the market, and you know, you'll probably have to see a dramatic reduction in the scope of regulation across the board because there's so many people across trad Fire that would like a light touch in their little area that's their pet project too.
I do think we have to jump in and point out that these SEC suits have made allegations correct, and those brought by the CFTC as well, but no one has been proven guilty yet, so we can't use words like fraud or shit canery. Those lead to real problems.
Yeah, time will tell Ultimately, listen though, really great to get your opinion because you are certainly in the think of it. Corey Clipston. He's chief executive officer at Swan Bitcoin.
You're listening to the Bloomberg Business Week podcast. Catch us live weekday afternoons from three to six Easter on Bloomberg Radio. The Bloomberg Business app and YouTube. You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our flagship New York station Just Say Alexa playing Bloomberg eleven thirty.
Really cool story on the Bloomberg. We've all been kind of yacking about it in the newsroom. The world's two richest individuals lunching together today in Paris. We're talking about Elon Musk and Bernard Arnault, the CEO controlling shareholder of LVMH Moett Moway, Mowett.
Moway and Hennessy moy Hennessy, I don't know.
I didn't take French anyway. Louis Vuitton, we know. I think he is the world's richest dude right at.
This Bernard Arnau, I think he was jumped by Elon. So the type r H goo rich go and you'll see. Elon Musk is currently worth two hundred and twenty nine point four billion dollars and Bernard Arnault has a paltry one hundred ninety six point eight billion dollars.
They are the world's two richest individuals. Which it started off with, okay, are NOO's sons were there? Elon Musk's mother may also took part. I gotta say. Elon has been everywhere, including meeting with auto execs, bringing them into the family via the Tesla charging station. So we knew we wanted to talk a little bit about Tesla, which has been on quite a run as well as the
share price. Ros Gerber is back with US President CEO Gerber Kawasaki Wealth and investment management, owner of Tesla's investor in the stock, one time activist buhying for a Tesla board. See, he is all in when it comes to Tesla. He's on the phone from Santa Monica. Ross, how are you.
I'm good, good to be back.
It's kind of interesting.
It's very interesting. I will also say as a longtime listener, So Ross, I'm just filling in for Tim Stenovek.
Matt loves listening when you.
I love it when you're on the program. So today when we were like, we need to talk about Tesla because it looks like it's kind of all coming together again for Elon Musk, I was like, man, we could get Ross Gerber on. That would be awesome. So I'm psyched to have you on the program. The Supercharger Network. I'm just so jazzed about this because it looks like he hit it out of the park, and he did something that consortiums of auto makers haven't been able to
do and governments haven't been able to do. It just looks like a stroke of genius.
Well, I mean, it's economics that really ultimately won the game here, because the economics of using the supercharger versus not using the supercharger system was so much better for four GM to just jump on this to help them sell cars. It really became a win win situation for both parties.
And that was sort of.
The depth how I say maneuvering that test was done over the last several years of building out the supercharger network, which ironically I had spent a lot of time working on in the last six months trying to really value this network. And now I'm like, wow, they just killed it, Like this is an amazing thing for a tesla.
I think it's incredible on so many different levels that Elon went from I think people scratching their heads worried about his involvement in Twitter to you know, he's got somebody now who's going to be heading up Twitter. He's pulled forward and GM right into Twitter spaces to talk about their involvements he's given kind of credibility, if you will, and showing how Twitter spaces can be this incredible communications platform.
To do something like that, I don't know, when you look at the big picture of Elon, like Matt said, just getting it all together or what.
Yeah, sort of I think, you know, they're sort of like SpaceX and Tesla and Twitter. You can kind of say like, well they have like what would they all have in common? But then there's these like threads that connect everything, and you know, it's really interesting the way that things sort of work out. That he's now hired sort of the top people from NBC to run Twitter, you know, and then he's been able to refocus on Tesla,
which is exactly what I was hoping would happen. And the minute he starts refocusing his efforts on Tesla, we've just seen a tremendous amount of progress in the business. So you know, now with all this, you know, deal making talk in France and boy, you know, I I my French contacts are basically saying, this looks like it's going to be a done deal and that that's huge. It's huge for France and Tasla.
He was in Italy right before this, so he's met with i think the heads of government of at least two European nations, and of course he already has great relationships in Germany. It's it's pretty interesting though that even Twitter seems to be firing on all cylinders, if you'll excuse a horrible pun that doesn't make sense with EV's cross. I mean, you know, when when we had the first presidential announcement on Twitter, it seemed like it wasn't working
very well. But now he brought Ford on. We all had to tune in for that. He brought GM on, we all had to tune out for that. He's turned Twitter spaces into the kind of the place to be right now, hasn't he?
Ross?
Yeah, Twitter space is an amazing place. I mean, this week on a Space and Walter Isaacson came on, and next thing you know, I'm talking to Walter Isaacson about the book he's releasing it on Elon and comparing him to Leo da Vinci and to Steve Jobs, and you know, it was just an incredible space and there were thousands of people on it, and Elon's technology skills has really made space is a really really great platform. I mean, you guys should consider jumping on and doing something on
there too. Bloomberg should definitely be doing something on there. And so like the way I look at it is he's making the.
Way, and we do do stuff there, just so you know we do actually yeah.
Yeah, I know, I know, you guys do do spaces, and I just think for media organizations, for example, this is a great opportunity to extend your brand, you know, and then at the same respect as a platform. From the technology perspective, Elon's technology chops are like nobody else's and there's no question things like spaces have benefited greatly from these skills, where you can now have several hundred thousand people on a space at the same time. It's
it's kind of incredible. So from that perspective, I think he's been very successful with Twitter. I think the part that's troubling is really how much time he's spending, you know, sort of expanding on his political ideologies and social ideologies, which I would say that a vast majority of people have issues with. So you know, when you sort of strip out the noise and all the politics, he's done a great job at Twitter. But when you look at
the time he's spending on the platform. I don't know if that's always the best use of this time.
So it's almost never the best use of your time when you're on Twitter, right, Why Carold doesn't get enough sleep?
No?
No, no, no no.
Well, so we with his tripover, you know, in his meetings in Paris. I'm just wondering, so, is this a sign that increasingly Europe is going to become a bigger, bigger part of what he does and where he devotes his time and where he makes his investments.
Well, there's there's that, But I think this is more Europe than Tesla, because you know, if you see what like the geopolitical situation in Europe and especially around energy and with all of a sudden having to sort of decarbonize from Russia in the course of let's say less than a year, you know, Europe's really now searching around and saying, how do we become energy independent real and how do we use technologies to advance sustainable transportation and energy?
And since Tesla is the leader in this, we all
should be talking. And now they see what's going on in Germany with the factory there and the success they're starting to have in Germany, and Europeans do love Tesla, So it makes a lot of sense for these countries to be courting Tesla to open up another gigafactory in Europe because a it's a very large you know, the EU is a huge block of EV buyers, and more people buy evs as a percentage of new cars in Europe and Asia than they do in the United States.
So there's a lot of upside for Tesla to continue to expand in Europe finding a good partner. And you know, so I would say, like, you know, as a competitor to Germany, you know, it's kind of the game I think they're trying to play ross.
I was, so, I'm test driving this AMG Mercedes this morning. I'm driving in five hundred and seventy seven horsepower, and I got absolutely dusted smoked by a Tesla Model S. Yeah, because they're so quick off the line, and it's also much later. But but I looked at it and I thought, man, it still looks kind of old. Now it's getting along in the tooth. Are they going to redesign their fleet at some point?
Well, this is a great, you know question, and one I don't have a simple answer for because I agree one hundred percent, and Tesla has never really changed their designs that much from their original you know make and then you know, most car companies try to change their design somewhat almost every year to make you know, their brands fresh or or sort of spruce it up. So we are expecting something with the Model three and a
spruce up there. But I think there's this has been kind of one of my issues, Like I think legitimately Tesla doesn't care about the high end car market. They're sort of seeding the Models and X to the Ribbans and the Lucids and the and the other high end ev makers, and they're sort of saying, our goal is to make cars cheaper and mass affordable than be sort of like a Ribban where we're only going to sell cars to rich people.
Interesting. All right, Hey, Ross, thank you so much. Have a great weekend. Ross Gerber, President CEO Gerber Kawasaki Wealth and Investment Management, on the phone from Santa Monica, California. He made a joke about a secret to his drive. Elon Musk was Crystal Mack at the event here, but he said, I'm only joking the journal.
Now about you let me drive?
Oh no, no, no, no, who's.
Alright?
Please, I'll do the gravels.
I want to try. It's a good question.
Fifth time, this is the drive to the clothes we'll buy around on Bloomberg Radio.
All right, everybody, we've got just about eighteen minutes left in today's trading session, getting ready to wrap up the Friday trade and the week overall. And we are definitely off our best levels. We are down across the board, just slightly down on a percentage basis, the most for the NaSTA gets down about half a percent. So let's see what Carol Schlife has to say. She's chief investment officer at Female Family Office. She's joining us on the
on the zoom on zoom from Minneapolis. Carol, TG, I have. I am so glad. We're almost dying. How are you?
How are you great? I am as well. It's been quite the week.
Well, so help us out here. I mean, we do feel like we're taking a little bit of a breather fed meeting. You know, we've had you know, the S and P piercing forty four hundred. You know, we're all talking about a new bull market, not everybody's buying it. There's some disconnect between what Powell says and how the markets read it. So how do you read it and what do you tell some of your clients.
We've remained in a balanced risk posture, if you will. All along, we were one of the early believers that the Fed was going to be able to stick us off landing. We've been saying that actually for close through a year and a half that we thought we had
enough resiliency throughout this economy to be able to do it. So, you know, the interesting thing is is trying to coax those clients who might be overweighted in cash out of that comfy cash position and to looking at even stepping in, especially those that might have had liquid builds.
Haven't they missed it?
I don't know if they've necessarily missed it. It all depends on your perspective. If your perspective is between here and the end of the year, maybe they've missed a good upmove this year. But if your perspective is intermediate longer term, there's an awful lot tied up in this
economy to be excited about. It's the first time in decades you could argue that we've really decided we were going to make substantial investments in infrastructure, and in some key industries we haven't done that, arguably since we've built out the interstates in the fifties.
That's a very good point. You know, it's betting rafrastructure right now.
The bigges short guy, exactly.
And when you look at the percent yes, yes, you're right, sorry, And you look at the percentage representation that technology and communication services has in the S and P now versus where it was a number of decades ago. And then you look at where manufacturing and industrial have shrunk to. There's a lot of room for uptick in those and even small upticks. Take the few component companies in there
and push them. So there's if you're if you're an intermediate or longer term investor, I think investing in some of those technologies makes some sense.
On the other hand, Carol, rates are pretty high, and if you believe that the FED is going to achieve its goal right getting inflation back down to two percent, you can get five pretty much risk free. That's awesome, right.
It's awesome in the short run. But if we do see the FED bringing the rates back down, the short rates eventually are going to come down and is the market going to have moved as so much that you choose not to get in. And it's hard because if you're doing investing right at the key points when you need to be trimming and when you need to be buying, it never feels comfortable. In fact, it almost always feels exceptionally uncomfortable if you're doing it right for the long run.
So that's where when I mentioned a balanced approach, we're not saying so all of your cash. We're saying, if you're overweighted in cash or short term fixed income, considers some other alternatives out there, even broaden out the fixed income. And we are getting to a point where we're watching pretty carefully because you've seen yields move up and maybe
extending out durations. We're not there yet, but we were watching a lot of things pretty carefully, but also trying to remain invested around the globe, although you know, North American progress, especially economically, is pretty superior relative to the rest of the globe.
I just want to go back to Steve Eisman because he was a guest on the Bloomberg od Lots Right odd Lots podcast, and what's interesting is he talks specifically about the biggest story being the grid, and he just talks about the electrification of consumption. So EV's induction stoves putting strains on existing infrastructure and so you're going to have to have a ton of investment.
As on the side, I will say evs are fantastic products, really amazing, but induction stove is the worst. I mean, if you don't have a gas grill, you're doing something wrong.
I agree with you. I need a flame, Carol, qut.
A flame, I do, honestly. And when we redid our house a couple of years ago, I have to cook over a guess stove. I'm sorry, but I do.
I know I can't. I cannot work with like an electric stove.
And we lived in Germany for the last six years and for some reason, it's all electric there. You know, a lot of the buildings just aren't hooked up to gas. And it's just it's a dream come true moving back here, mainly because of my gas range. It's the best thing about America.
It doesn't love fire, right, So, Carol, where's the risk in this market?
Though?
Well, I think the risk is getting too long or too hyped. Up in one particular. It's over concentrating one place or another, and I think.
Let me to be like big tech.
Yeah, maybe big tech, although you know, we do think The interesting thing is is we do think the artificial intelligence things has legs longer term. But it's not necessarily investing specifically in it as much as it is making sure every company in your portfolio is paying attention to it and trying to figure out how they're going to adapt.
So you think it's cool when like a Kroger talks AI, or like anybody talks AI, like they should be talking that because we kind of it.
But they have to be on their front foot as it relates to it. They have to understand that, you know, what their strategy is going to be there. It's early and and folks are trying to understand too, is the government going to regulate, is it not going to regulate? How are we going to play it? But I just think being cognizant of it and not ignorant of it.
And it's a lot like back in the dot com days, when you don't necessarily want someone just attaching dot com to their name and saying, oh, we're going to do that now, but you have they have to have an Internet strategy.
Carol, can I ask just, uh, from a broader perspective, you've spent decades working with ultra high net worth individuals, is there is there are there traits that they all have in common when it comes to their investment strategies that we you know, uh, they don't have. No.
I actually think the other nuance to a lot of the high net worth and ultra high networth families that I've worked with over the years is that the vast majority of them have been first generation, and so one of the really interesting they're as different as you and I are, and everyone all the population is out there, but one theme that can be really pretty common is, no matter how affluent they become, because they started with an idea or simple and it took a lot of risks,
a lot of them still fear dying broke, and so it makes them very cognizant of understanding risk and return in their portfolios and not necessarily wanting to take the same kind of risk with their investments that they took making the money in the first place. Because markets can be very you know, when you're running a company, you can't necessarily control the economy, but you can control your
response to it. When you've taken that liquidity and put it in the market, it can be really disconcerting to watch it reprice every second of the day and not understand why when the fundamentals are going in the direction you expected they were, the stock price or the manager price is going in the opposite direction. And so having a portfolio that's cognizant of what can you control. You can control your costs, you can control yeah, tax it take control, Carol.
We gotta run. I'm so sorry. I have a great weekend, carolsch life over at Pimo Family Office. Look forward to it next time.
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