The Space for Entrepreneurship in Content with Detavio Samuels

Afro Tech, Oakland, California. Tracy Oliver's executive producer, show runner and director for b E t S First Wives Club, writer of the movie Girls Trip, which exceeded a hundred million dollars at the box office, propelling the film career Tiffany Hattis, and she collade with Thesta Ray on Awkward Black Girl to hit YouTube show. She's on stage discussing turning Hollywood knows into box office and small screen wins, and Hollywood doesn't think audiences want to see quality content

featuring black women. She's proven to them that we do all right. When I came out of film school, black women just were not on TV and lead roles, and so people were constantly telling me, if you want to work, stop writing about black women. And then that was literal advice I got from a producer was if you you're a good writer, but if you want to get hired, like you have to show that you can write non black characters because no one's making that. And I was

just like, nah, I'm not doing that. So I gone to undergrad with Issa Ray and we talked about doing a web series. We talked about doing something, you know, like an awkward Black Girl, and we talked to a couple of people in the industry and they were like, there's no audience for that, it can't work, and also telling Issa she doesn't look like a star, and I knew that wasn't true. She knew that wasn't true. So

we decided to just go do it. And the first couple episodes, I don't know if you guys have seen it, I mean, they look pretty boo leg they're they're cheap, and they're really you know, thrown together and kind of unprofessional looking. But it was because we had no money

and no resources. But people still laugh and people still thought Issa was funny and the show had something to offer, so we just kept doing it, and then eventually we did like a It was a Kickstarter campaign and East and I thought we were going to raise ten thousand dollars and then people all over just started putting in money and then we raised over fifty with then like a week, and I just couldn't believe that so many

people were clamoring for it. And that was the first time that I realized that the Hollywood gatekeepers had it all wrong. The audiences did want to see black women and women of color on TV and in movies and just in pop culture. They just they were wrong because we were seeing directly, you know, from the excitement enthusiasm peole were giving us that they wanted it. And that was kind of the big turning point for us because right after that, HBO and other places started saying, Okay, well,

maybe we'll take a meeting with you. But that was the beginning of it. And how do we just said, you know what, you're right, we'll give it up. I don't know if that would have happened. So sometimes you have to tell people know, I'm gonna go do it and then show them there's audience. And that literally changed everything for us. I'm will Lucas, this is black Tech, Green money. I'm going to introduce you to some of the biggest names, some of the brightest minds and brilliant ideas.

If you're black in building for simply using tech to secure your back, this podcast is for you. As one of Corporate America's youngest executives the Tabio, Samuels has helped some of the world's big his companies, including Walmart, Chrysler, the NBA, and Johnson and Johnson, build their brands and help them connect with consumers. Previously at Urban one, where he ran Global Grind, Hello Beautiful dot com, News one dot Com dot Com, Adam Noir dot Com and more,

He's now co head of Revote Media and TV. Did his multimedia network, I asked to TiVo. With all the culture we move on social media, TV and in movies, how do we finally capitalize on us? For too long, talent in our community hasn't been paid. How do we change that? Yeah? Man, That's been something that I've been looking at for a long time. Even when I was

at Urban one and Interactive One. Was actually trying to see if we could leverage Black Planet, which still exists, to be a platform for black creator creators to launch ideas, help them own them legally and do all of the things they needed to do around them legally. Before they gave him out to the world. Wasn't able to pull that off, but I think I learned a couple of things in the process. Um, it is incredibly difficult to try to trademark or capitalize off of catch phrases or hashtags.

Those are things that we are doing every day in our sleep, and it's just much more difficult to monetize them. You have to really be thinking about what is the product or the end product of whatever it is that your idea that you're creating. Um, And I think you've got to really do your best to think about how you monetize it before you give it to the world. I think so often people just throw it out into the world and hope that they go viral and then

try to follow up on that success. But um, it's hard to go viral once, let alone to three times. And so having a clear plan for monetization, being clear about the thing that you're about to put into the world to try to go viral. Is that just marketing for a bigger product and a bigger idea? Is it just phase one into a bigger thing that you would then follow up with. But I think people got to be pretty clear about their strategy before they launch and

give things into the world. And so my recommendation would be again, it's out about the hashmart hash tag or a catch phrase. It's about real products, real ideas, UM, real thoughts UM. Thinking about those things, how do we monetize them before having a plan for monetization, before we give them to the world. Yeah, when when you look at the work you've done UM in your career, and I like to look at like what Steve Style is doing today, like you know, creating avenues where we can

capitalize on our culture. UM. I get that big companies have maybe not historically, but in the last few decades seeing the value in taking advantage of us and maybe maybe it is historical, right, And but what do you think it is that we might have missed in that value? Is it simply that we haven't owned the channels and therefore couldn't take advantage of it. Yeah. I think there's two things. One, I don't think we understand the value chain and how to capture and extract value out of

that value chain. And the two I think we are often too short excited because we come from a position of lack. We will trade in UM. The bigger, long term ways to generate wealth for immediate cash. So I'll give you an example on the second one. So right now I'm in a deal negotiating with this very very young, intelligent brother, and UM put a deal on the table that says, Okay, look, we're gonna pay you this amount

of money for every episode. But there's upside. I gave him upside for advertisers, gave him ownership on the back end um things that I thought could help them build wealth over the long run. Well, you know, all the big guys have now seen him, They have their eyes on him, and so they tossing him a bag. That bag is bigger than the fee I was paying him, but it does not have the upside for advertising, and it does not have ownership on the back end. Well,

guess what we're gonna land. I'm gonna end up paying him cash and he's gonna miss out on all those other things because that's where his priority was. Right So, I didn't want to play that game. But in order to compete with the big guys who were just throwing him pennies to them, it's real money to me, UM, I then have to match that offer, which means taking off all of the things that would have had allowed them to have real upside and build real wealth in

the in the long run. And so just the inability to kind of have that long term visioning, the inability to have that long term thinking, um, and to make a real bet on yourself. I think we missed that quite often again because we're coming from a position of black we need the money or the cash now, whatever that is. I think the other thing is again just

not understanding the total value chain. So I think it's like a big Sean song right now where he talks about like, look these players who are making thirty five million dollars a year. That means that the owners somebody's making a billion in order to pay thirty five, right, And so I think that's the other key piece of it force, which is, um, we don't see the entire

value chain. We just see the money we're getting. We don't see that the total value that's being created as a billion dollars, and then they're not working on ways to create, uh, ways to capture more of that billion dollars. You see people in the past did it like masterp uh so I was thinking about, right, So we have people who have who have broken out and said, you know what, I don't just want this check. I'm gonna capture more value. Um, it's those models that we need

to be learning from going forward. But we're still pretty new to that game. But so to his point, and I don't know his situation, but you said this clearly clear we come from by and large, when you getting opportunities like this, perhaps you may come from a background of lack and you you can't make those long term

decisions because mama got to eat right now. And so what is if I'm asking you to save the world and with this question, but like, what do we do in this community so that we can afford to think long term? Yeah? So I think there's two things. I think one of the first piece of just education, So educating ourselves on the total value chain, trying to make sure that we extract all the value that we can, understanding the difference between cash now and real wealth later,

ownership like ownership and equity versus cash. I think there's an education thing, um that we absolutely should be doing for ourselves. But then also I just believe in emazing right. So people will talk about like it's it's hard to make the first million, the next million after that becomes easy. So even if you have to trade off in the short term, Okay, I'm gonna trade off that equity to get this larger cash bag because this is what my

family needs in this moment right now. Having a plan for how you then take that cash and don't again go just splurge on it and buy new cars and new gear and all of that stuff. But how do you then take some of that cash and invest it in something so that you again have ownership and equity, maybe not in the thing that you created, but you have ownership and equity somewhere else real estate, stocks, etcetera.

So that you can start to build wealth, which will then allow you to make real decisions in the future. I'm a huge believer like in this notion of like freedom. I want to spend my entire life being the freest version of myself, and wealth gives you freedom like no other.

And so take the cash, find a way to build wealth so that you can be free and make decisions that are no longer driven by necessity and lack, but they're driven by I just don't want to do it because I don't have to, because I don't want to, you know, what I mean, like, we have to invest in ourselves and invest in our future. UM. I was listening to an interview and you talked about your experience at Global You and Detroit and I and I think a lot about We've been having these conversations in the

Afro tech world. There's a world outside of Silicon Valley. But there's you know, tech and media and business happening all over the world in communities that we are in. And what what about Detroit? It's maybe more broadly the Midwest has been overlooked with regards to their contribution to the culture because I'm from Ohio. So I'm I'm from

forty five minutes out of Detroit and Toledo, Ohio. And I think a lot about you know, the perspectives I saw growing up being in the Rust Belt manufacturing, automotive and etcetera. That's that's a perspective on the world right. And I wonder what your experience was like running Global You that Detroit office and what unique value you saw the Midwest brought to the conversation. Yeah, I thought living

in Detroit was amazing. Man, Like how the Detroit you get? Um, you know, they always talk about real diamonds come from cold's going through the fire. You know what I mean? Like that is what Detroit is. Detroit's contribution to this world, whether it be music, how the motive you name it has been huge. I think, Um, we don't get to hear a lot about that story for a couple of reasons. Um. One,

just the way that we function. Culture moves from the outside in, so culture we tend to we get used to culture starting in l A or New York and moving inside. Um. And so that's just the places that we look to for creativity and and and creation. Um. But I do think there's a dope creative community in Detroit that folks aren't necessarily looking at that they should be. The other thing is just where the media platforms live and exist. So again, so often those media platforms are

in California and New York. People, you know, what's the black owned media company in Detroit where you can really tell the Detroit story that exists. I think that stuff is true for other places like Atlanta right now or the Bay Area right now. You know what's happened is when you and I were growing up, and I'm sure I'm older than you. Um, we when we before the Internet,

each geography had such distinctness to themselves. They had distinctness in the way that they moved, they had you know, in the Bay Area they were doing Hi fi right, which nobody else was doing right. Um. In Atlanta, we had trapped and so people had different language, they had

different movement, they had all of that stuff was different. Well, now with the invention of the Internet, and now that we're all here, everybody is coming to the mushy middle, and so you start to miss some of that like locality, um specific um culture that was creating at a local level. And so with nobody there telling their stories, amplifying their stories, it stays kind of hidden and missed while we all kind of gravitate to the kind of top, mushy middle.

And so I think that's the biggest thing that needs to happen. Like we're seriously looking at setting up shop in Atlanta because we see it as the black Hollywood. Nobody's telling their stories, and we think there's a huge opportunity to kind of go to Atlanta um and build

a dope relationship there. I see the same type of opportunity for people who could be interested in Detroit lots of dope creatives, lots of dope work, lots of dope history just waiting for someone to come in and mind it and not minded in a way that's culture voltashy, but minded in a way that then gives it back

to the culture while finding ways to pour back into Detroit. So, since you um started that revolt, one of your roles was to acquire content, right, and so, UM, is it that you've found a star on YouTube, a rising talent, and you want to put money behind their vision or is it that you know, somebody went and you know, bought a bunch of cameras and you know, built a production company and they're sending you demo tapes, Like, how does that work? Yeah, we're we're we're well, we're basically

open to looking at both. I will tell you that right now, I am very focused on talent centered production. That I think that you know, who's breaking through right now is not ABC, CBS, Fox, Those aren't the breakthroughs. Who's breaking through is will Smith, Hardy b uh Diddy. Right, those people have larger followings than any other cable network.

They have better engagement than any other cable network. And so finding talent who can pool focus on a camera, entertain a camera, but then also bring a large engaged audience. That's really where we're looking. And so sometimes we'll find that talent and build a show around them. Sometimes that talent will already come with the show and we will collaborate. We're actually getting ready to launch this weekend. UM Jim Jones, a new weather show with Jim Jones. Jim Jones has

been doing this weather show for two years right. What he doesn't have, which is what we bring, which is production capability, storytelling capability. We bring that, but Jim has an audience and he's hello good in front of a camera, and so we're gonna collaborate to make magic and so we're willing to do it that way. We're willing to start with people from scratch. The deal I'm talking about is a deal where we're literally starting from a development

standpoint from scratch. So we're open to either situation. The hard part is finding super dope talent who can entertain a camera by themselves if need be, who have really large engaged audiences that will follow them where they go. UM, that's the hard part, and that's what we're focused on.

How much of um. Your acquisition of content is like you know is let's say if you're if you're a music executive, It's like this person may not have sold, you know, ten thousand records out of their trunk, they may not have a bunch of hits on their Spotify, but this there's a star quality about them that I and you believe. Right, So how much of your acquisition of talent um might come without having that huge and gage audience, but there's something about this person you gotta

you gotta bring them over to the Revolt family. Yeah, for me, there always has to be that proofpoint of talent, of talent being able to attract an audience somehow um right now, just because it is so hard to break through. But what I'm saying is you don't have to be the New York Times. You just got to be the New York Times of your scene. Right. So we're going into Atlanta. Uh, I'm not looking for people who the

whole world knows. But if Atlanta knows you, and if Atlanta show up, like if Atlanta gives you respect, then it's like, okay, we can build with this. So there still has to be a proof point that you can UM bring audiences in and engage audiences, but it just doesn't have to be on the same scale as a Google or Facebook or Netflix might be looking at. I'm looking at people who are authentic with the culture. I'm looking for people who have real relationships with the culture.

And if you can prove that the culture will move when you show up, then those are the type of people I want to be in business with. Season two of the Black Tech Green Money Podcast is brought to you by Lexus in the new Lexus I S with an available track tune, visa sending, and responsive handling. The new I S went all in to deliver you style and performance. See how when you experience amazing at you, Alexis Dealer. You've seen the news. We're cutting the court

all across America. You can get Netflix, Hulu, Amazon all without a cable provider. But Revolt TV is on cable. Puff that in the top of You'll have to see something We're missing. There's got to be a strategy there, and I'm curious the Tavo speaks on it. So the way that I would say it is UM broadcast is the past time now and streaming is the future. And so you know. You see, we just did a deal with Comcast to broaden our distribution. So UM, the linear

space for us is a very real space. We will continue to program in that space and deliver for people on the big screen in their homes. But without question, we know that the future is streaming. The future is programming to mobile phones and tablets. Every time we talk to our audience, Jen Y gen Z and we tell them that we're working on things longer than ten minutes, their nose turn up and they get frush, right, So

it's it's it's, it's, it's it's for us. It will actually end up being quite a different product that we end up UM producing for streaming. UM for linear, I'm

looking at thirty minute, sixty minute, ninety minute shows. For digital, I'm looking at being best in the world at premium short form video because that's what you know, why gen Z wants, and so we have to do both, UM, and that's why it's important for us to do deals like the Comcast deal, because it gives us the revenue to them begin to program in these different ways, in these different formats, because the audience is looking for something

different in each space. So I guess more fundamental questions is how big can a black network get? Right? This is so this you are unapologetically hip hop, right, so, um, what does the role map look like for a Revolt to be the next CBS? Right, and not to say that like what is to be that big? I mean like, yeah, what is it? How big can this? Yeah? Yeah? Yeah? So I think it's really difficult. My real answers, I

think it's really difficult for a black network to scale. Um, I've said this before, but ultimately it's the game is not built for us to succeed. So if you are a black network focused on black audiences, it means that the content that you create is for fifteen percent of the world, right cent of the US, which is tough because you're up against CBS, ABC who are creating content

for a hundred percent of the US. And the business problem is that even though we are both focused on reaching different sized audiences, the cost of creating content for those audiences doesn't change. So a good movie on TV for CBS is gonna cost the same amount of money that a good for CBS who's going out there a hundred percent of the US is gonna cost me the exact same amount of money who might only be going after fifteen percent of the US, right, and so just

their period, I think the black business model breaks. And so what I been saying and what we are doing and what I've done is all of my previous companies is you have to do it in a way that skills for me. That answer is you do it all the big mainstream companies are doing. We all see that black folks are tuning into live black food. Folks consume more content than everybody else, and the world consumes our

corner of view. And so you create content for Black America, or you create content that is rooted in black culture, but you have to create it for everybody. Meaning the DJ is black, the first hundred people into the party probably gonna be black. But you open to everybody coming because that's the only way that you get scaled, that's the only way that you get numbers, that's the only

way that you can really compete. And so I have significant concerns for um black media companies who are focused on black only because I think the game is rigged and it's not necessarily built for us. The beauty of revolt is again we are based on hip hop, right, so our design target we talked about is being young, gifted, and black. But we know that hip hop is the number one thing being consumed across the world, and so we can program to this audience but invite the world in.

That's how we will get scale, That's how we will get numbers. That is the only way we will even get close to being to someone like a CBS or an MTV or some of those other folks. So you, Revolt has seen to share successes and obviously is growing quickly with the new Comcast Exfinity deal, um to be sort of a mainstream network, and you kind of clarify what the target is. And when I mean mainstream, I mean that's probably that's how do we grow that? Right? Um?

Does it take having like what Netflix had was the Orange is the New Black that helped Netflix scale? Like, what does it take content wise for Revolt to have that? Yeah? I think we we I think we need breakout content. But I'm going to separate it from a show perspective.

I think that if you're an independent network, meaning you are not housed inside of and be the Universal or Viacom CBS, if you are out here by yourself, Um, it is lonely, and it is difficult because again, you know, when you compete against Viacom, CBS, they're aggregating ten networks and you're you've got one. You're bringing one to the party, right, so and everything. It's like you've got the water gun and you're up against like these um, major nuclear weapons.

Um crap. I just actually lost what was what was the fourth question? Do I need content? I got? I got you, I got you. UM. So, I think if you are an independent network, the key game that you're playing is actually more about being a brand. It's about building an identity feed. It is less about being a network, but it's more about building a brand that audiences will fall in love with and attached to, and then creating multiple ways to monetize that brand, from merch, two events,

to content, to experiences, all of those things. So for us, do I think it's about a hit show. I think it could be a hit show, But for me, it's really more about having hit moments as a brand, showing up, UM, showing up in culture in a big way, UM, and in a way that audiences can see kind of what our brand value is, what our brand proposition is, and

how we stand for and represent the culture. So I think those things will come from stuff like the Revolts Summit that we're getting ready to have at the end of October. Is that a hit show? No, but it will absolutely be a hit moment for us, and that will help the brand grow. I like what you're saying about branding because I think about um, this mixed with mixed in with what we're talking about with the masterp and what Big Sean wrapped about, and and like, there's

somebody else. If I'm making this much, there's somebody else making ten times that, twenty times at a hundred times that, right, and so where is the space in media then media slash technology for entrepreneurialism because I think about um with what you're saying to the guy who you know didn't take that or may not take the deal that's just about future growth opportunity, but just wants to cash upfront. I think about people like Ryan Leslie who dropped the album.

He's a hundred dollars and when he saw two thousand of them, he got two hundred racks in the bank now and and so, but he wasn't trying to serve, you know, a global autor. He wanted his die hard fans, the people who believed, who will pull out their TechBook, pull out their cry to credit card, pull out their cash app for a hundred dollar Ryan Leslie album. And he's got two hundred thousand dollars in the bank because he only two copies. And so where is the space

in video production for that type of entrepreneurialism? Mm hmm, that's a good question. Um, So let me think about that. I mean, so right now, I think in general, content creators, specifically black content creators, are having a real moment again the recognition that everybody from Netflix to f X to ABC sees value in our stories, which means the market for black stories is larger than it's ever been before.

And so I think if you're not in my position, and you're not tied down to feeding um A network seven three sixty five, but you have the opportunity to sit back, curate, make dope stories. I think the opportunity to sell those stories to all of the buyers in the marketplace and create real competition there is a is a very very real thing. I think the digital game is is tough, man, It's tough. Um, if you're a company.

I think it's super tough if you're an individual. UM. It takes so much typically to win if you're just playing this digital game. And so for me, where I think the real winners are gonna be our UM content creators and talent. Like, as the world becomes more multicultural, UM, they're always going to be looking for more black and brown talent to feel their movies there, their their TV shows, etcetera.

And so those people who can be people who are building companies around multicultural talent, building companies around creating dope stories that can be sold to anybody, not just one person. I think those are two of the ways that I think that they're real opportuny in these And then again, like there's this thing that like we're trying to do as well, which is just recognizing that even content in

and of itself is just good marketing. And so how do you create super dope content but that becomes ike and you can build entire worlds around. So again, how do I create content where I can then turn them into events and merch and all of those things. I think people who have that type of vision and understanding UM have a huge opportunity UM in this world as well. You know, you got me thinking about, um, what Ray did with her show on YouTube before it was picked

up by a Netflix. And I don't know her whole production story, but I'm would I imagine from the outside looking in you might know more, not do, but please do fill me in. But I think about somebody who probably had two or three friends. One of them's got a camera, one of them has got a little bit of money or whatever, you know, to help her get lighting. I don't know, but she put this show together around her talent, put it on YouTube, marketed it and however

she marketed it and built a following. Is is the growth of black networks like Revolt? How important is the growth of black networks like Revolt to being able to create more opportunities for the next Rays? Yeah? I mean for us, we would say we're betting everything on that that um, that that should be our competitive advantage. That Netflix is dope and as great as they are, and all the content that they're making, they don't know our community like we do. They're not touching creators in the

community like we are. And so you see, like people tend to have this kind of strategy that's like let me find one black person and give them ten shows, right, UM, so go ahead. Like so, we we're banking on the Obama's will continue to get shows like Netflix. The Abra Duvenaise and the Saunders will continue to get opportunities in Netflix. We are the people who are going to be betting

on the little guys. We're going to be betting on the people who again aren't on the scene of the New York Times, but they're on the version of the New York Times for Atlanta, but in New York Times for the Bay Area. And UM that's one our strategy, which is that we see ourselves as being a platform for hip hop voices. We do not believe that the

best ideas will always come for a revote. We know that black genius is amazing all across this world, and so we are absolutely betting on um black and brown creators who are doing dope work who have not yet been seen, and we want again bring what we bring a little bit more resources, production capability, storytelling capability, and then rise to the top together. That is very much a key part of our strategy. UM. I was listening to uh an interview you did, and I'm gonna paraphrase

a quote that you had. You talked it's about marketing and agencies, and you talked about general marketing agencies you know, shouldn't do UM or in your opinion, shouldn't do like perspective work. Like you know, if if you've got a general marketing agency, maybe they shouldn't be dabbling in just Hispanic marketing or black marketing. But the niche agencies, those ones that do focus on I have UM to reposition

themselves often times to win. Can you talk a little bit about the opportunity, especially these days when you know black culture is for all of you know, the ills that we take on from the world. We have platforms now like like afro tech, we have these platforms to where you know, not only are we are you making money, but you know you're being recognized in etet of for

your work. How can marketing agencies black focused companies like Revolt is Washington black but hip hop focused UM companies, how can they create opportunities for themselves when it is typically those general market agencies who can come in with the entire tool kit, right, but we focused on our perspective. Yeah,

is it that you just lean into your perspective. Yeah, No, I mean the big thing you have to do is to be able to get to the top of those companies to help them understand the flaw on their decision making that in essence, that what they're doing is calling on B B d O or calling on UM D dB to do work that is black and it's just not in their wheelhouse. But I'll go in there and say, Okay, well, let's take a step back. Let's look at someone who has to move product across the entire world. Let's take

Walt Disney. Right, when Disney knew they had to create a black movie, what did they do? Did they go to DDB, Did they go to B B D O? No, they went to Ryan Coogler? Right, one black man and guess what Ryan did you know? People get worried like, well, Ryan is only one person or voters only none? No, but we're in the culture. We know all of these people that you don't know. You can't find black creative

directors and black you know who is it? The CEO of Wells Fargo this week talking about he couldn't find black talent. Right, y'all can't find black talent. They're all calling me or they're all my friends, or I'm hanging out with all of them. Right, So you put one Ryan Coogler in the machine. Ryan Coogler brings um Sherry, what's my girl's Sherry's name? Who played Michael B. Jordan's are yeah right, Sherry? Right? He will bring all of

those people to the table. You have to get to the people at the top who are making those decisions to help them understand the flaws and their decision making. And then the other thing that I try to tell brands all the time is ultimately, like the research process is broken because if white folks account for sixty to seventy percent of the research, guess how all the research is gonna skew towards white folks. Right, we all know that culture never moves from the middle. Culture always starts

from the edges. If you are looking to go with where culture is going, see where culture is going to be a part of that way as opposed to the wave that's already left, you have to start with the people on the edges. It's those conversations with the people of top who didn't get it before, but in the era George Floyd, they're catching it more now. Than ever.

But it's those conversations to have to make them break convention, right, because I don't think people are doing things to be racist on purpose, or they're literally just doing what is easy and normal. It's the same thing that they've done. I got a new product launch called d dB, Right, I gotta get this TV ill called d dB. Someone has to break that convention and get them off of autopilot and help them understand the opportunity that they're leaving

on the table. That's that's good. And I love that you tied it to the moment, and I want you to go deeper. This is how important is this moment the in the in the age of COVID, the age of Brianna Taylor and the age of George Floyd. And you've got these companies now, and said, you know what, we haven't paid enough attention to you know, this demographic of people, these black voices, these black creatives, these black talent, black executive you know perspectives. How important is it for

us to not let this moment slip by? Because I do believe you know, I always use this Roman Manual quote back from two thousand and eight, and he said, and I don't even know if he's the first person to say it, but you know, I'm never letting the Great Crisis go to waste. It's an opportunity to do

things otherwise you wouldn't have been able to do. And while we've seen our fair share will probably exorbiting amount of crisis, how important is it for us to take advantage of this moment where we do have the ears It is for me, it is now or never, brother, And I also don't believe that this moment is going to be around forever. Um. As much hope and optimism as I have, I think there's probably like a pretty

significant like window on it. And so I'm kind of telling my team, like, look, you got three to nine months to run through every door that you can, and at the end of that three to nine months, whatever we're left with is probably what we're gonna be left with. If you can get opportunities for multi year contracts so that people can't back out of it later, even better.

But right now I am seeing specifically in corporate America. Um, yes, they're superficial activism and people just making statements to make statements so that they can look cool. But I am seeing countless brands who are serious about this, who have woken up to this. I was on the call maybe last week with a fortune tin brand and listening to them tell me how important it was to support black media.

And they're understanding that they can't hold black media to the same KPIs as UM, CBS and Viacom and NBC Universal because of the size different, but that they needed to be investing in black and what I call it, Like, I think investing in black media is a revolutionary act. So here at CMO at a Fortune tin company talking to me about her understanding that buying black media was a revolutionary act. Brother, I've been in this game and

this since two thousand six and have never heard that right. So, Um, this moment is different. This moment is unique. We are absolutely seeing the benefit of this moment um at Revolt as we are pushing brands to and holding them accountable for the statements that they are putting out into the streets. I would say that there are many of them who are stepping up. Um, Cash, App, Nike, Comcast, you know we do the Revote summer with a T and T like.

There's definitely brands who are getting it so anyways, um less than the Ramma like kind of the short summer is. I think this is an amazing moment. I've never seen anything like it. No one can tell me that things aren't changing, because this moment feels so different. I'm watching it, I'm feeling it. It's showing up in the culture, it's showing up in the numbers, um and it's not everybody,

but it definitely exists. And now is the time. It's like, keep your foot on their necks, keep going because when the door shuts, who knows when we get another civil

rights moment like this again. Yeah. So, a lot of the companies you've worked with, like you know, the Walmarts and McDonald's, et cetera, have very well known brands, right, and so defined for me like brand building for companies that already have very well known brands and so and how do you build the skills with today's tools, with an eye for what was coming for brands like that,

how is it that you position them for the future? Yeah? So, um, you know business school you learn all these like brand architectures and it's like twenty things. You gotta have brand personality and brand voice and all of these things I think over my years in the game, I've kind of boiled branding down to like three or four things, plus a few key strategic bets. So what are those things?

I think every brand has to be clear on. I think you have to be clear on who you are, what you do, why you do it, and how you do it those four things, and then those four things, at least one of them needs to be fundamentally different from everybody else. So Apple and Microsoft can both make computers, but if the how Microsoft does it is they approach

everything from a creative and a visual standpoint. If the why they do it because we want everybody to think differently, If those pieces are different, then you can build a brand that's fundamentally different even though you're in the same space. And so I think you have to nail those four pieces. You have to make sure that at least one or two of those things are fundamentally different from anybody else

in your category that you're competing with. And then from there, I just think you gotta look around and find the smart bets that will help make the brand difference. So for us, it's not just who we serve. Who we serve is what we call them is Jim hip hop, right, all these young folks who are in love with hip hop music, the genre, the lifestyle. But what's different about our brand is our design target is young, black and gifted.

That design target means I'm creating content that no other hip hop company is world starting making this boler alert Like they're not giving people access to the summit to meet executives and to to get workshops on how to um how to make a dope sixteen or how to make it, how to produce a dope beat. They're not getting opportunities to meet with executives from those other companies.

I'm not saying anything is bad over that. I'm saying we are making a strategic bet to program to someone different than they are, which means the content and the work that comes out. So it's not about who we are. Um, It's not about what we do while we do it or how we do it, even though there's some differences there, but that one bet is such a key differentiator for us in terms of building our brands. So anyways, I think those are kind of the key components. And then

the last pieces, just to say, screw words. It's all about actions, right, So you know, the old way was you just had a whole bunch of things on paper, and you just try to make sure you're communicating those ideas consistently. Um. Today the world can see everything. Everything is transparent, there are no sidelines. You were in the game, whether you say you were in the game or not.

You're either team Trump or not Team Trump. Whether you say it or not, people are gonna go look up the CEO and see whether you gave money you know what I mean to Trump or not. So you just also have to recognize that the game is based on actions that UM, you're trying to be as thoughtful and um and intentional and purposeful about those actions as possible. And then just recognizing that there are no sidelines. There's

nothing that is off limits. People are making decisions about the brands they want to support who align with their values, and if your behaviors and actions don't match that, it's gonna be really difficult to win those audiences. One last thing, which is you also can't win everybody, So you have to be very comfortable if you are not Team Trump, you have to be very comfortable losing all of the Trump supporters. Right. That's how brands get made. They are

literally the stay. They are pieces of our identity, and so you have to be willing to walk away from some people in order to get me to put your shirt on my chest. Um. I think those are all key pieces. Season two of the Black Tech, Green Money Podcast is brought to you by Lexus with connected tech Lexus Safety System plus two point five and luxuriously appointed cabin. The new Lexus I S is all in on style

and performance. See how when you experience amazing how your Lexus dealer before those up and coming young black executives who will be watching this and listening to this, and you know they see the kind of journey you took and met a lot of a lot of favor in your your walk. You know, your executive very young. Um. And what can we learn about your journey that those folks who would be you know in one day and choose like yours, um, that they can apply to their

own walk. Yeah. Um. So the first thing I'll say, but I'll keep it short, which is just um faith and my faith in God. Um. I'm absolutely here because I don't believe that any man ever controls my destiny. And so no matter how funky things might look around me and my current situation. Faith in a higher power always helps me, UM, move and progress. And people say favor ain't fair. I believe it to its truth, favor and fair, which is why I am or I am um.

So I just want to acknowledge that because I'm trying to do a better job at that. Other things that I would say is, um, I never got a job applying through a black box. All of my jobs to come through relationships. UM. I think a lot of times black people feel like we have to earn stuff. Um, that there's this thing called a meritocracy, and we need to make sure that we earned it in the right way. What I will say is I don't never feel like

I need to earn any open door. Um. White people have been getting jobs they didn't deserve for a very long time. I look at President Trump right now and I'm like, yo, this is the quintessential subpar white man who has the highest ranking job in the right. Like who worried about how he got it? So anyways, my rule has always been leverage my network, leverage my relationships to get in the door. Guess what, Once I'm in

the door, I gotta perform right that's on me. But I care less how I actually get into the door, as long as it's being done with integrity, um, and with with with with solid character. So that's one. The other thing is, um, what's the quote about luck is preparation times opportunity. UM. So that's very That's been very, very true in my career. You know when I first started getting like this kind of like meteoric rises, um less than a year global hue. Um, it's I'm running

the Navy business. The woman who's running the Walmart business is really like the number two in the office. So uh, we hire my boss, hires a president to come in over that office. This woman spends two days with this man and quits. She comes back and tells out, like I refused to work with him, I won't be here. I'm out. What did that do? Um? It threw them in the chaos. So that actually goes to one of your earlier comments earlier don commanus to say all this

all the time, chaos creates opportunity. So when they lose the number two in Detroit, guess what they do. They take the top three next level and they promote them all a level. So we were all supervisors. So they got promoted from supervisor to director. But for me, because I've been ready, because I've been performing, I grew to the U. S. Navy account and less than a year, right my first year that they promoted me two levels. So I go from supervisor to group account director overseeing.

Oh dude, you can't make that up. I can't write that. I couldn't have planned it, you know what I mean? Like steady performance, UM, steady preparation, UM, steady faith. Just had me ready for the opportunity when it came. So that's the other piece that I would say, yeah, if finally so I would be remiss if I didn't talk about this. So you came in to revolt as CEO, UM had a content. A few weeks later, CEO departs

and you get named co head. So you came in and literally a couple of weeks like yo, like okay, you demand that you and you and you you y'all a minute, you know, y'all y'all to once right. UM, And I do believe, like you know, there's like there's there's a thing about God clearing the way for you and I and but I believe to that when you get those opportunities where he clears away, it's up to you to grow into it, right, And so like if he just put you somewhere, you are already prepared for it,

and it's not it's nothing. I mean, because you are already prepared for that. Let me do something that you're not prepared for. Let me do something that takes you to the next level. How do you when you get those types of opportunities, when you get stretched, then build the skills, you know, jumping off and then building the wings on the way down. How do you do that? How do you that successfully? Because you've done it in

a couple of times. Yeah. Um, there's so many ways that I'm thinking about how I want to answer this, but the most direct way to do it. So my strategy has always been knowing I am good at and great at um and make sure that while I am learning, I am absolutely killing the things that I'm great at. So for example, UM, when I was at Johnson and Johnson, I left the client side and went to the agency side where Johnson and Johnson, I learned strategy. I learned

how clients think, which no one on the agency side knew. Well, I didn't know how to produce a TV commercial, doesn't know how to produce radio. I didn't have to produce any of those things. But what I could do is come in, develop strategy, translate um client needs more clearly and directly while learning that side of the business. Me doing what I was good at allowed us to grow the business in one year while I was still learning the other side. Right, I left the agency side and

went to the media. Started in no media, but from agency side I learned ideas, the power strategic thinking. So now I'm jumping into media, which is spots and dots. But they need big ideas to grow. They need big ideas in order to be b et and all of the other competitions. So I'm bringing that while I'm learning media. Here ever voted a little bit of the same. It's you know, I think I have a solid understanding of how a total media company and machine works that I'm

able to to to deliver on. I have an understanding of digital that I'm under that I'm able to deliver on while I'm learning pieces that I was touching but not running when I was an urban one. Right, So, um, I was close to linear, but I wasn't running linear, right, so I'm trying to make sure I can demonstrate value in the places where I know God has given me gifts and expertise, while I am very open and transparent about what I don't know, but trying to learn that

side as quickly as humanly possible. Black Tag Green Money is the production to Black They. Afro Tech is produced by Morgan Dabon and me Will Lucas, with additional production support by Love Beat Your Raven ear Born. Special thank you to Michael David's and c and Car savan Yan you know like the Wine. Yes that's his real name. Learn more about my guests and other technis represent innovators at afro tech dot com. Go get your money, peace and love,