I think the first thing is first, you can't you can't get around this. You have to be good at what you do, Like you have to invest in learning what you're really good at and just doing that to the best of your ability. Like that's the one thing that that's the one impression that you're gonna make with most people, They're gonna remember, did you say what you're gonna do? You ran that of event and it went really well.
You were, you know, on time.
You know, you communicate, Like just be a good whatever you want to be in the world, Like, just be good at that.
I'm will Lucas missus Black Tech, Green Money. I'm gonna introduce you to some of the biggest names, some of the brightest minds and brilliant ideas.
If you're black in.
Building, are simply using texta security you back, this podcast is for you.
Jeroni Petty is founder and CEO at color.
Stack, the nonprofit Colici organization that helps black lots of next computer science students.
Get degreed and hired.
When he was at Cornell, he worked as an intern at Google and later turned him down for a full time gig to start his own entrepreneurial journey.
We've had so many.
Conversations nationwide about the pipeline for black talent and tech.
I wanted to get an idea of its current state. To Aran, who works on this issue every day, provides enough date.
When you look at the data, it's about thirty percent.
You know, back in Latin next, computer science students or people make up thirty percent of the population, twenty percent of CS grads, and about.
Ten percent of the industry.
So there's drop offs at each level where you could say not enough students are graduating with CS degrees to begin with, but also from the ones that are, they're not getting jobs in software right, they're maybe going into it or becoming a teacher or doing something that they weren't intending to do.
So we're trying to solve.
This like multi layered problem of like access to jobs, placement, retention, and then even attraction to bring that twenty percent to thirty percent right at the onset.
Do you see enough black students interested in computer science?
So I studied CS myself, right, So I was a csgrad and so when I was on campus, the whole reason I started doing this work was because I did see that I did see the interest but what you would find is that even in that intro course. At a lot of these universities, the intro course is in the intro course, you know, they kind of gotten so used to these people that come in and have been learning how to study, how to code and program from
when they were in middle school. So the professors, I think have adapted for the wrong reasons and have now expected so much prior knowledge where black students, Brown students are going into these intro courses and they feel behind, and once they get a backgrade on that first test or project, they're dropping the class, They're dropping the major.
Yeah.
So I was reading something a different interview you were doing it. You were talking about your personal mission that you found many of your peers owner parts in these classes, weren't doing well in these classes. And you talked about this as pervasive and why is that pervasive? Like many would say, we just aren't as talented or you know,
we don't have the proclivity for math and science. Well, in your research and in your work, what have you found to be the reasons why we are not ready for these classes in so many respects?
Yeah, I think the first thing is definitely, you know what I just mentioned about prior knowledge, like if you didn't go to if you didn't go to that private school, right that had CS one on one as a freshman, Right. I think public education is just catching up to c US education and baking that into the curriculum for high schools.
But if you either didn't if you didn't go to a school that had the coursework, or you had a family friend that just was able to expose you to that at a young age, you are coming in at a college level feeling so behind. So there's that there's that mental kind of barrier where you just are not as confident when you're going into your first intro course and everybody else seems to know everything that's already like from day one, you're already discouraged, right.
And then I think some.
Other areas within on the campus where students are kind of selling themselves short is, for example, office hours. I was a TA for a lot of the common CS courses at qunell and for whatever reason, you know, a lot of students wouldn't go to office hours, right. Maybe it's because of the same issue they're facing in classes where they feel like if they go to office hours, they're just going to be you know, reinformed that they're like behind or feel like they're dumb for asking questions.
But it's a lot of those small things. We're privileged kind of in network. Students already know that like office hours, office hours are there, I can go talk to the professor, I can use these resources.
But when you feel so behind.
And when you're not kind of in these environments already, you just don't feel like you can participate in the same way.
With that response, then, is waiting until we get to college too late to make sure that we're ready for you know, actually getting internships to be able to get jobs.
I don't believe so.
I mean I think, you know, shout out to all the orgs, Codination America on Tech that are doing that are doing work at the high school level Black Girls Code. I think it does. It is helpful to start earlier and kind of get that exposure. But I don't think it's too late. I think within when you're on a campus that is already about discovery of oneself and really
just learning and expanding your horizons. I do think there is hope where there are students who are still primed for pushing their their limits and kind of expanding their
horizons and trying something new. But it does take intentional effort at the earliest stage, that first fresh that freshman year, because once you the way the curriculum and the major system is set up at a lot of these schools is you know, if you try to change your major once you're a sophomore juniors, near impossible, right, And so you really have to target and support those students at
the freshman level. And I'll even tell you this from when I was at Cornell, when we were doing a lot of work with underclassmen, we actually started doing events that basically made other people who weren't cus feel jealous, right, like oh, this is so cool, Like you know, all my friends are doing this thing and they know how to they know how Siri works, and they know how the algorithms of YouTube and all these different social media work. And they were like, Okay, I'll do a CS minor, right,
And that's happening at the college. All these are students that were pre med, right, but now they're adding a a CS minor.
So I don't think it's too late at all.
So as an entrepreneur, when you're going through your you know idating process of the company. You're going to start, the organization you're going to start. What was the decision making process like for you when you said, you know, I'm going to target those college students instead of building an organization like a Black Girl's Code that actually gets them younger, earlier in the process, so that they by the time they get to college, they're more prepared.
That's a good question. I think this is the lesson that I have for that I learned from myself but also try to share with other entrepreneurs, is that, you know, you don't want to think too much about what you're building. I think incremental, like solving the problem in front of you incrementally, you kind of just stumble upon a business, right. That's what happened for me my freshman year, I was I got an internship at two Sigma, had a really
great opportunity there. My sophomore year, I came back to that internship feeling very discouraged because there weren't other you know, black interns there, or I noticed that my friends on campus didn't get internships that summer, or weren't doing well in their classes or were considering dropping And so I said Okay, how can I just solve that problem? How can I just get my friends to come with me on all these different opportunities you know that I have.
And so that was the problem that I solved, you know, in twenty seventeen, and then twenty eighteen was I no longer have enough time in the day to mentor all these students, So how can I scale that by creating a community of peer to peer support? Okay, that was the problem I solved in twenty eighteen and twenty nineteen by building the club, And then from twenty nineteen to twenty twenty, it's like, okay, well, how can I provide this value to more students on other campuses?
Right?
And so it was just me incrementally solving the problem that was right in front of me. And I think that's how everybody should approach, you know, you know, starting a company, right, You don't have to build a Google tomorrow. It's just what's the smallest version of that problem that you can solve today.
And so to the idea that you know, not everybody specifically, I'm talking about black people and brown people who come into college aren't ready for the math courses and the science courses, but what are some other barriers that keep them from graduating? And then you know, then all went in the opportunity to go get internships and jobs right out of school.
Yeah, I think there's there's so many there's a whole pocket episode on those barriers. But I think a couple that I know, I knew already as a student myself, but then I learned from building color stack. One it's just financial, right, Like some students just you know, can't well drops, you know, drop out of school or changed from a four year to a two year or just be you know, indefinitely on leave of absence just because of money.
Right.
So I think there's there's definitely a conversation around the afford affordability of school, especially these private institutions versus state schools, where sometimes just money that prevents someone from continuing. The second thing I think about a lot is no two CS degrees are made equal, right, you know you would think that, yes, from a Cornell or you know, a Kannessas State or a Stony Book university, like they all offer computer science. So no matter which one I pick,
I should be good. The truth of the matter is that academia has not stayed on par with industry, and so a lot of what it takes to become a software engineer in industry is taught out side of the classroom. And so there are two kind of sub reasons why
you know, students aren't able to keep up. One is if you don't have the time right outside of a class where you're a commuter student or you're working another job to pay for school, and you think that you know, you can just do your classes and do homework and be done. You know you're going to be sol when you find out that in order to really get that job, you actually have to do your homework, get a good grade, but then also learn how to become a software engineer.
And you know, when you're in.
A privileged position of just being on campus and just focusing on school and all that's taken care of, you have that time, but many of these students don't. And then then on the other hand, you also don't have the curriculum that is tied and kind of pegged two industry standards, where a school like an MIT or Carnegie melon they have partnerships with these companies to build curriculums.
That's relevant.
But if you're going to a local school, a small CS department, you just might be out of date.
And so it's interesting to say that because I've had these conversations about you know, industry and university is not being able to stay on par or college is not being able to stay on par with what they're educating, and so often it comes back to hiring the professors who can teach it because they those professors can go to the industry and make more money than they would, you know,
working in a university or a college. And so I wonder what your idea is on how much self directed education we need to do, even if you're in school for your CS degree, how much of this outside of that to your you did talk a little bit about this, and you know, you got a job and you got other things to pay for the pay for that education. How much of that self directed effort is required in order to get the look from a big company or a startup that you may be interested in.
Yeah, I think I think for the most part, when you look at a big like, the bigger the company, the more resources they have for learning and development. So as as long as you can prove that you can code, just generally a lot of the bigger companies with more infrastructure for learning and development. Like, if you do well in your classes and you can demonstrate a basic knowledge of coding, you'll be able to kind of secure at least beyond their radar and be competitive for roles at
bigger companies. If you're talking about mid sized company and especially for a startup, they're going to expect you to come and hit the ground running. So it's going to require you to subscribe to certain newsletters so you know what the newest tech tech is, Like JavaScript has a new framework like every year, you need to know what those are. Right, You're going to have to know how to build an iOS app if you want to work on a team that their only product is a mobile app.
Right.
That's that's a perfect example of something that, like across the board, is rarely taught in institutions. Right, Like you might learn how to code in Python, you might learn about databases, you might learn about machine learning, but even something like iOS development isn't a thing that's typically taught in schools because the professors do research and there isn't
much much research done on like mobile app development. It's usually like database efficiency or machine learning or like programming languages compilers, so things like iOS development, which is ubiquitous in terms of its impact. Everybody uses their phone and has apps. You're actually not even learning that on average if you get a CS to be from any school in the country, so you have to go out and take a U to ME course or go on YouTube or get a book.
You just have to know.
All that and so some other things that we talked about, you know, with that are prohibitive for students to get the degree and actually actually graduating. What are some of those things that actually keep you from getting a job. So let's say you've graduated, You've you went to a mid level university, mid level college. You didn't go to Cornell.
Not everybody's as smart as you run. But let's say you know, I went to a mid level school, I got my degree, and I still can't get a job at the company that I'm interested in.
What are some of those reasons why, other than racism?
Other than that, Yeah, yeah, let's start like that's already that's the three requisite that's always there. Yeah, I think I think you know, there's there's some there's some challenges definitely when it comes to like exposure to companies. So, for example, you know at certain schools, like at a top level school, you're going to have companies flying out to be at that career. Fair right, every company that you know will go out and make sure they're at Cornell, at MIT, whatever to get in front.
Of those students.
What I see at the mid level schools is that it's usually like local companies, and if you're at a small school in Michigan, there's no local tech company, right, so your your access and your exposure to employment is usually at best it right. At best you're learning about some org that has a back office IT team that you might be able to work for. You don't even know,
you aren't even talking to her. On the radar of like pure tech pure software companies that are hiring software engineers, which is what you study to be, right, So it's not like, let's not confuse that you study to be that, but the roles and the opportunities that are available to you are more aligned for IT and other things that are not coding. So that's one of the ways that
CLUTSA obviously bridges the gap. So no matter what schools are going to your career for if you're a small school in Michigan, Illinois.
Whatever.
I mean, we partner with fifty top tech tech companies today where you can immediately get on their radar. But that's like one of the bigger, bigger reasons.
You know.
I'm glad you bring up cover Stack in the way that you have because I'm interested in you know, cover Stack is a nonprofit Number one. What a lot of people will ask, like, how do you make money doing this? You know, because I mean, is this like purely altruistic or are you attempting to like be like I want build a billion dollar organization hot?
Like what's the motivation behind this?
Yeah?
Yeah, for sure, there's a lot of unpact there. So for me, you know me personally, my passion and who I am at heart is I like to help people. I'm a servant leader, like I just want to help
people reach their full potential. So, you know, the decision to start color Stack was easy for me because I knew I'd be happy every day, Like every time a student gets a job, even if they just get a good grade on their homework assignment, I am just fired up, like let's go, Like I'm so happy for you, and it doesn't matter how big we get, I'll always kind of have that local mindset of like, if we can help one student, we're successful. So that's just me. That
was my motivation personally obviously. So I started color Stack May twenty twenty, so this is beginning kind of peak of the pandemic. And so for me, I mean I still knew rationally speaking that like, I had to make this work financially. I had an offer at Google that I had accepted at the time. Actually so I was heading to Google, was to be to be an associated
product manager. And basically my calculation internally was, hey, I know I'm not going to make the same amount that I would make if I was a product manager in industry, but I want to be paid kind of respect, you know, appropriately for my time and effort working on color Stack full time. And so I first sought out to raise enough money to do that. So my first goal was raised enough money to do this full time for at least a couple of years. So we got an incubation
deal with Triple Byte, and that's that was amazing. They were so supportive they got us off the ground, and today, I mean we have a full time team of six two contractors, and we fund that mainly through corporate sponsorships. So similar to you know, even Afrotech. How you know, you guys do an event, you have all these sponsors, they come in and kind of try to attract talent. We're doing the same thing kind of all year round through events and engagement with our students and companies budget
for it. Like we're becoming a line item in university recruiting budgets where they're like, hey, all right, we're doing a new strategy for twenty twenty three. We got to hit Aprotech, we gotta hit Grace Hopper, and we got a partner.
With color Stack.
I love that.
But when you go to a company and you say, look, I'm going to help you with your black talent, there's ninety nine people who came before you who said I can do that, and one hundred and nine coming after you who.
Said I can do that.
Like what is what is it that got them to believe that Yo Jeran and what he's doing with color Stack, these are who we need to be working with.
Yeah, for sure.
I mean I think the first of a couple of early things that I did strategically or I under saying do them intentionally, but they happened that they were strategic.
The first thing was.
Being a CS student myself. The transition from this recruiter was trying to recruit me for their company to hey, I'm not running a nonprofit that you can benefit like that was such a small transition because you know, these these recruiters were like trying to literally trying to hire me for the new new GRAP programs, and you know, unfortunately I said notes a lot of them have to
pick one. But it was so easy to like reach out to them because they were already excited about me as a candidate, to be like, hey, well I'm doing this other thing that's going to help you and ideally find hundreds of more knees out there in the world.
And they were like immediately on.
Board because I had built that trust and they already respected me for you know, a different reason but related. So I had tons of relationships like dual Lingo is a good example, Square Space, some of our silver partners, like those recruiters, I was in their pipeline. They were trying to hire me, right, so it was easy to kind of leverage those relationships. And then the second thing I connected with He's on my board now Wahabhaba Lobby.
He's the founder of a community called u RX, which is a community of university recruiters and so we connected, we hit it off. I asked him to join through my board and like the brand, equity and trust just built from that as well, all the intros from.
That as well, Like that just all helped out.
Where a lot of the early sales I didn't have much, but they just because of my background, because of the people I was associated with, were able to give me a chance, and you know, they were rewarded and long.
You know, from from your perspective, when a company doesn't have black talent at the levels it should, what are they What are they missing out on? Because we often talk about this from a justice perspective, like equality and you know, having diversity, But what are they actually missing out on? And I'm talking about even from financially. Are they missing out on the revenue opportunity for having black candidates, black talent on their teams?
Yeah, for sure. I mean I think I think you can you can be specific about black talent, but this applies to all kind of intersectional identities out there. I think the more homogeneous, right, a team is the more blind side you have blind spots you have where you know you're thinking the same way, right, you have very
similar experiences. You just view you view the world in a certain way, and you're not able to really bring in new insight and get truly creative on new product innovation or even just how your team should operate, or
even just lessons learned. I mean there's a lot of you know, not every you know, black student is necessarily low income, but there are lessons learned from being, you know, in certain situations and growing up in certain circumstances that could help when when companies have to cut budget and figure out, you know, innovative ways to get the profitability.
But I'm sure if you're if you're a bunch of people who never had to deal with never to think about money, you probably don't know what you're doing right now. You probably you probably are trying to figure that out. And that's just an example, right, But I think you know that I've even learned within the space of building a team that's primarily black, Like, there's a lot of inter sectional value from the intersectionality where people are bringing
different to the table. That I just would never have thought of, and that leads to better outcomes, better products, better solutions, and better returns at the end of the day.
You know, we've had these stats that come out that talk about you know, ten percent of Google's national workforce is black or Latin X or you know, talk about Apple, you know where I think it's like a nearly half of their global team is all white people, right, And you know, I have the perspective that you know, I'm not interested in asking for us he did the table, That's just me. I'm interested in building my own tables.
And so I wonder what your take is on these not necessarily competing approaches, But what is your take on You're like, look, we're going to continue to beat down the door of Google and say you need to be hiring us, versus we're going to go build the next Google.
Yeah, no, for sure.
I'm so happy you brought this up because that I have the same thesis. Like we we partner with company, and you know, we were happy to help these students get jobs. But my ultimate mission and our ultimate mission at color Stack, is to give these students agency. I had a really close friend, a mentee that became a close friend of mine, and she a black woman from New York and she had a terrible experience interning at Google with me, Right, we had to take walks like almost every day kind of.
She was crying, like there's a really bad experience.
Right, And you know, I could have went to you know, the manager or talked to someone on the team be like, hey, you guy should do this differently, or here's the impact of this, and bla blah blah blah, but I focused more on just investing in her. The next summer, she worked at a company, a startup that was building a woman coaching an empowerment platform, and obviously the team was all woman and she had the best time of her life. And now she's over there working at Fingla having a
great career, you know, careers, early career experience. And so for me, it's all about agency, Like I just want to help these students, right, I want them to become the strongest engineers in the world so that they can chart their own path.
Right. Because when you to your point, if we just.
Focused on like trying to like make these companies less biased, less racistless whatever, that's just gonna be an endless that's that's how we got to the point where we're still talking about this ten to fifteen, twenty years later. I'm not focused on that they can do that day. I'm trying to help the students just become the best.
I love that.
And one of the conversations that we were talking about in afro tech was, you know, we often talk about getting black people into tech, but it's another thing to keep us in tech because we don't necessarily have ecosystem everywhere, which is why color tech is important, which is why
afro tech is important. What are some interesting ways you've found to help those who might be in the ecosystem but might be disengaged from the ecosystem, so we don't lose talent that you know, could have opportunity here but they don't see themselves.
Yeah, for sure.
I mean there was some study done that said something like one of there's like a predict of retention that has to do with like com many friends you make in the workplace, Like if you don't make like two or three, then you're very likely to leave that company.
And I think you know that applies here as well, where.
At the very least you need community, which is a thing that Afrotech does, Like you said, this is a thing that color Stack does. All these events and all these ways for you to connect with other folks that may not be at your company, because we know what the numbers look like. But at least you notice someone in your same role in the industry, and that leads to further retention because you at least have that support system.
Right.
So, like, that's one thing that I think is important, and I think people need to know about that. Even if your company may not be the most ideal situation and you can't build community, at least you can do that across different companies through you know, company agnostic communities. And I think the other thing that is missing a lot is understanding what it takes to progress. I think what happens is a lot of a lot of recent and early career professionals stay in that entry level role,
that junior role for too long. And one is the fault of the manager. But like we just talked about, I'm not trying to convince a manager to be less biased and whatever. Let's just focus on really educating our junient, like art from our community people who are in that junior level. Like here's what it really takes to become that level two, level three, that senior level, that manager level. Like what's the next step?
Right?
I think the breaking into the industry and that content is great, but I really want to see over the next five years more content and support around. Once you get there, how do you grow? How do you continue to progress?
Right? Yeah?
You know, I'm still thinking about how you got these deals versus the people who came before you and the people who were in line after you, and so because a lot of it has to come down to you, you know, like what did you learn through your journey, whether it was in school or just upbringing, about how to make yourself valuable while you're still in school, Like what kind of things make you more attractive as a person, as a professional, even that aside from turning down a
role at Google, and aside from going to Cornell and getting accepted into Cornell and getting at getting job offered from Google, Like what aside from those things, Like what would you admonish other students to do to make themselves more not just hireable, but attractive as partners to these organizations?
Yeah? Yeah, for sure.
I think the first thing is first, you can't you can't get around this. You have to be good at what you do, Like you have to invest in learning what you're really good at and just doing that to the best of your ability. Like that's the one thing that you know, people are gonna that's the one impression that you're gonna make with most people, they're gonna remember, like, you know, did you say what you're gonna do? You
ran that of that and it went really well. You were, you know, on time, you know, you communicate, Like just be a good whatever you want to be in the world, Like, just be good at that, right. I think that's where I started. I started Cornell by just trying to be the best CS student I can be. The second level is about kind of networking. I hate to say networking because sometimes it's just like people think it's like super professional and boring and like proper, but it's really just
putting yourself out there. Within my sophomore year, I started to like post on LinkedIn and even little things like oh I just watched Black Panther and I just really,
you know, love the representation. It was a little article kind of just a couple of words, but I started to build this brand on social media based on my interests and my accolades, that people you know, started to recognize and understand about me and build that personal brand so that when they think of certain opportunities, they were able to think of me.
Right.
And so once you already build that skill set right that nobody can debate, you start putting yourself out there so that people the right person can find you, see that and promote, you know, refer you to an opportunity or select you for an opportunity. So I think it's like, those are the two things that I would say, for the most part that you got to do. And I think the last thing is like once you get the opportunity, it's just like doing what you say you're going to do,
following up and just seeing things through. I think the biggest thing that students aren't doing right now, we deal with this a lot of close stack is just they don't close like they'll apply to this thing that we have. They'll show up to the first event, but then three weeks later it's like, oh hey, like I'm they're either ghosting us or like oh hey I got busy or whatever, and they're not kind of following through like just.
Close you know, Yeah, it's interesting you started off talking about you know, actually doing what you said you were going to do and then being good at what you actually are you know, supposed to be doing, because I have had I had this conversation with several different people on this podcast about you know, it's sometimes it can be a faux pod or walk into a job too early and talking about diversity and equity and include like
you need to hire more of us. And you just got hired last week, bro, Like we and we hired you the code and now now you've got your black panther shirt on. And I mean, you know, like come on, like actually be good at the job. And then as you build that credibility, then you can start speaking up
on certain things. So I wonder there and there's a balance there and and I'm sensitive to the balance of like when you see injustice, obviously you've got to you gotta address things appropriate least, but I think about the ways that we want to be, you know, brother Umar Johnson. And that's no shade on him. So early in the journey of a professional career, when you when you haven't proven yourself to be good at the role that they hired you for, you speak on that.
Yeah, it's tough, Like you said, there's a balance, right, but I think and I want to preface that also by saying preface is also by saying like, you know, we we know that the current circumstances aren't right, Like we can't change today what happened right over the past hundreds of years. We are here today and there are certain circumstances. So these are just ways that we can kind of get around that. But we know, Like I have these conversations with students all the time where it's like,
do you want to be that pioneer. I don't think you have to be, and I don't think you deserve to be, but someone needs to be the first black employee at a certain company if that company is.
Going to increase and kind of be more diverse over time.
And so to your point, I think, you know, being good at what you do the best as best you can kind of just reduces any evidence, right, any unsaid or kind of flaky evidence for not promoting you, letting you go, like all these different things, and that still
might happen just because of racism and bias. But the best thing that you can do for your own agency and your career is just do the work right, because at the end the day, as much as all this other social stuff is present, companies want to be profitable, do better, do better work for their customers, make great experiences,
and reward their investors. So if you can just take care of that, right, if you can just write that code, push that product, do the things, you have so much more agency to add anything on top of that, to start adding new initiatives because of that respect that you have, that you have kind of solidified, right.
No, I love that. I was reading an interview another interview. You were talking about the paraphrase a statement that you had here, and it says, you know, being a computer science major actually forces you to think about things in the same way an entrepreneur thinks about things. If you remember saying that, can you speak on that and elaborate?
Yeah? I think so.
When I started learning how to how to code, and friend Mady who hasn't learned how to code, it, really you're you're trying to tell the computer what to do at the end of the day, right, You're using this coding language which boils down into language that the machine that you're coding on can understand to perform some level of computation or render a website or whatever the case may be, right, And what I started to learn early on is that like you have to be so detailed
to write code, Like you have to think about so many different cases, if else, for loops, like all these different things that boiled down to solve some basic problem like adding two numbers. Like if you've ever written code, you know that adding two numbers isn't like some super trivial things like you actually have to think about a lot of like edge cases and math that you didn't think about before. And so I remember on this part,
I think it might've been the same podcast. I was telling them, like, explain to me how you would how you would you know how to make a peanut butter and jelly sandwich. And they realized how many stings they
take for granted. And I was like, well, as a business leader, right, as a founder, if you want to go and build a nonprofit that supports black and LATINX computer science students, and you tell me, and I ask you how you're gonna do that, and you'd tell me, Oh, we're gonna do events and we're gonna run a slack and we're gonna get sponsors. Well, okay, let's break that down into how you're gonna do those individual things. You have to break those things down. You need to continue
to do that. And it just reminded me so much of what I learned when I wrote code. So when I come in and think about how to build a company, I'm starting from this basis of like I've already learned and been trained on how to be so detailed in my solutions that I'm applying that here in the same use case of like starting a company, where I'm thinking about each step, each edge case, boiling it all down to its fundamental kind of basic.
Parts of the solution.
Black Tech Green Money is a production of Blavity.
Afrotech going to Black Effect Podcast Network.
And night Hire Media. It's produced by Morgan Debonne and me.
Well Lucas, with additional production support by Sarah Ragan, Enrolse McLucas.
Special thanking to Michael Davis.
Something that's a surruno learn more about my guess The Other Tech The Trut is an innovators to afrotech dot com. Join your Black Tech Green Money, share this with somebody, Go get your money.
Peace and love.