Gaming & The Genesis of the Metaverse

only dreaming about present day. They have not only the goggles that we are used to, but they have complete rigs that allowed in to to see field, taste and more. This past week at afro tech World in our own metaverse, we enjoyed our third installment of afro tech World in today's episode comes from afro tech World two and it's with Mary Spio, CEO and founder as seek vr Metaverse, which directly connects music artists, athletes, and other digital content

creators directly with their fans in virtual worlds. In Ashley Simon, gaming entertainment host co owner of Exit, which is the world's most diverse, innovative and socially contents pop gaming e sports set Ever Assembled and Chris Barber, Director of a R, Content, Business Development and Partnerships at Meta Gaming and the Genesis of the Metaverse. Hi everyone, and welcome to Afro Text

Gaming and the Genesis of the Metaverse session. I'm very excited to be here today with two industry experts are in Ashley Simon and Chris Barber to discuss the metaverse. So I'm Mary Spiel. I'm the founder and CEO of sek Vr. I'm a deep space scientist. I currently run Seek, the company that I founded, and we the Seek metaverse enables music artists and creators in general to be able to monetize their content in the metaverse through n f t s, through live events, and also through unique VR

and a R experiences. Also on the board of Oculus, um VR for Good and on Amazon Sport for launch Pad. So super super excited to have this conversation here today.

Aaron is the co founder of x set, which is an e sports team um Aaron is also a game in and entertainment host, and Chris, as the director of a R Content, Business Development and Partnerships and Meta Risk, leads the Meta a R develop a platform working with camera Effects, and prior to that, Chris was also head of Partnerships at Meta Studios, and way before that, Chris also was the lead Digital Global Strategies for Adidas. So now I'll let our panelists talk a little bit about themselves.

So if Aaron, you could share your journey into um E Sports and then going to the Medal Verse and how you got to where you are today, and then the same with Chris. Yeah, absolutely, Well, thank you so much for having me and how I got into it. I've always been a gamer my entire life. That's been something that has always been a passion point for me.

And eventually, you know, I I started in traditional media and traditional sports, worked in the music industry, and then made my way over into gaming as as a broadcaster. But then it's been it's developed a little more from there. Um,

so I've been um you know. In addition to the prodcasting work that I do in the sports and gaming space, I'm also part of the ownership and executive team for ex Set and a lot of what we're doing is kind of that cross intersectional space between gaming and pop culture. And it's really interesting because the metaverse and what you know, Web three and all those conversations around that are very much intertwined with you know, pop culture and gaming. It's

it's probably the best intersection within the gaming space. And um so I've been diving a little bit more into that through the work that I do through EXTA and then also personally as well. Excellent and Chris, what about yourself? Yeah, well thanks thanks for having me, Mary, and uh nice to be here with the aeron. Uh So, my my path to Meta was, as you noted, from Adida's prior

to uh to joining Meta eleven years ago. And you know, at Adidas is where I first had the opportunity to truly um uh take advantage of on behalf of of a brand, the tremendous opportunities that the emerging Internet was

bringing into the world. Um. You know, I won't date myself, but but I'm going back into kind of the pre mobile era when I was leading digital marketing for Adidas, and that opportunity to really be at the forefront of defining how people and brands build relationships through technology was

really exciting. Um that me to Meta again eleven years ago, and um since that time, I've been working at this intersection of businesses developers, brands, and and technology as an enabler for relationships, and of course he held firmly within that is a belief that the relationships that we have between ourselves and the people around us are the strongest relationships um and enable us to have deeper and broader relationships with the companies who bring goods and services into

our lives. That are important. Awesome, Thank you, Thank you both for your joining us today. So there's so much talk about the metaverse now, you know, why do you think there's all this talk now? Because there's been roadblocks and Fortnite and Second Life, and there's been a lot in terms of the metaverse, right, I would say meta verse one point oh two point oh event, Why do you think there's so much talk now? Sure? Sure, I'll jump in. Well, we like to think about the metaverse

as the next evolution of the Internet. Right. We've lived in the era of the mobile Internet for for some time now, and and the natural kind of sway of the kind of of experiences that people people want to

have are increasingly more immersive. You know, you think about text as a medium for communication and what that enables us, the kinds of shared experiences we can have through written text, and then you know, we emerged into photo being a medium for even more immersive ways for us to share our lives with one another and end to participate in each other's lives. Now we're friendly in the era where video is accomplishing much of how we have shared in

immersive experiences. So we believe that the next evolution of that is an Internet that is immersive, so instead of looking at the Internet, you're actually within the Internet, and that you're able to therefore have even stronger personal relationships and connections with folks. So the timing is is kind of right for the technology to evolve to a point

where these kinds of experiences are possible. We're not quite there for for that in the fullness of that vision, but we're very close and and gaming, of course is one of the use cases, if you will, that in which we're seeing some of the earliest um light of these kind of experiences. Mhm, absolutely, yeah. I think that, Like I mean, anytime we talk about metaverse, I always say and tell people gaming was already ahead of the

curve when it came to that. It was the industry that was really trying to expand the consumers experiences when it came to utilizing the games themselves. I mean even now, you know, not only are we looking at a R and VR, but also you know, a lot more is being implemented when it comes to three D audio and having that audio experience be more dynamic than it was previously.

And so you know, that interconnectivity, that immersion is something that is is being utilized in so many different shapes and forms in gaming um that we're seeing others outside

of it taking it into a whole another level. I think, you know, even for the example of seeing Travis Scott having his whole concert in Fortnite and then having that the whole experience that people can interact with, and then taking that same content and then implementing into YouTube and putting that into the traditional web two which Chrissy were mentioning in terms of video um and so it's it's interesting that we're not quite there, like Christmas saying, but

the fact that gaming is becoming that vehicle for so many different industries who want to get to that because we already have a lot of the tools and mechanics. I mean, also the fact that there are even like unreal engine you know that is a is a program in software that so many different UH industries use. The film industry even uses it for c g I and

other components. So it's it's really interesting how we're in this kind of like strange metaverse space where it's like we don't really quite have all the technology or even the affordability in some shape and form for that tech for average consumers yet, but it's starting to be implemented in bits and pieces, and I honestly say gaming is

going to be at the forefront when it comes to it. Yeah, absolutely, And I feel you know the same way as well, uh, in the sense that it's this evolution, right, so we saw Web one point oh with texts and photos, and Web two point oh with video social media, and then now we're evolving this movement to web three point oh with people wanting to be in the side of this three D metaverse and this you know, living the experience versus watching the experience. So it's very exciting. How do

you each define the metaverse? UM? I mean I would just define as an immersive experience. I think that like when we discuss the metaverse and just seeing some of the other uh, just all these different examples of it. I think it's just to actually immerse yourself into this digital and virtual experience UM and get it to the point where literally when you're immersed in it, all of your senses are also activated in unison there, so it making it seem like you actually are there, even though

you're you're not. I think that's kind of where everyone wants to go. I always use this movie in this book as a great example as Ready Player one. Everyone wants that experience to be that immersive metaverse uh situation that people can like literally put on headset or or get into some kind of you know, equipment and be there.

But now it's like, okay, how can we interact with just the the whether it is VR headsets or whether it is just the screen that we have, UM, but tapping into all of our senses as much as possible so that people can actually feel in it versus just outside looking in. I think it's probably the best way that I could describe the metaverse. You know. In many ways, it's it's the the evolution of the Internet, right, and and it's an Internet that enables us to be within.

But I would say that the defining kind of aspect of that is this sense of presence being present with people regardless of the distance you know between you and and not only people, things as well, you know, I'd like to think about it kind of philosophically as as collapsing space and time. You know, UM an example for a r you know, the ability to have an artifact and ancient artifact that you would never be able to touch in the real world present in your space, you know,

is this collapsing of time, if you will. And for us to be on a holographic video call together or playing a game in in a completely immersive environment, is this collapsing of distance between us. So this, this notion of presence is really I believe foundational to what the

metaverse will will be. And then all kinds of experiences can be built on top of that, gaming, shopping, learning, um, you know, all everything, everything, everything for sure, absolutely, Aaron, I love what you mentioned about this aspect of being in it versus outside watching in you know, for me, for example, my UM experience, right, my first experience with Oculus.

I talked about the fact that as a child I watched this program on space exploration, which kind of changed my view of what was possible in the world, and I always felt like I wanted to know what it would be like to walk on the moon. But this was watching it on TV versus when I put on the Oculus and I was actually on the moon, and you know, I had this moment of Wow, now I know exactly what it feels like, says being outside watching an experience. And that's you know, some of the exciting

things about the metaverse. So Chris, for you in a R and then also with social media, where do you see the intersection um of the metaverse with a R and then also with social media. So a R is one of the foundational technologies that that will enable the metaverse.

You know, we think a lot about how people can come into the metaverse right now, you know, you come into the Internet largely on a device that that has a two dimensional interface, and so you know, what are the modes with with which people are going to come into the metaverse, And two of them are undoubtedly going to be a R and VR. And so from an a R standpoint, I think a lot about the kinds of experiences that are technology can unlock that help create

that of presence that I spoke about. So one example again is bringing bringing objects into your physical space three D objects that aren't physically in your space, but being able to bring them into your space um and have an immersive or semi immersive experience with them. I mean, we talked a lot about gaming, and Aaron can I think attest to this. It's the fact that gaming happens within a social context between people. That's what kind of

brings the power to to the experience. So we think, you know, there's gonna be a limitless number of social

experiences that can be created. The last thing I'll say on on just the role of social media, I believe that that there's going to be an incredibly strong creator community that emerges um to to generate all of the content in in the Mata verse, and a creator economy supporting it, and a lot of the foundations of that, some of the decentralization that you noted, Marry, a lot of the you know, the ways that create, there's a thinking about their art and their creativity and how ownership

looks for them. All of these things into the future are kind of the norms for that are being experimented with today in social media. UM So that's another area where the social media environment kind of intersects with the future. Absolutely, yeah, and I want to get back to decentralization and how digital currencies are going to enable you know, the metaverse. But before that, Aaron, what type of technologies do you think we're going to need in order for gaming to

become more immersive? Um. One thing that we are actually starting to see, which is a little bit of a step in the direction, is you know, whether it's with Unity UM or utilizing the technology platforms as like Unreal Engine five UM. We're starting to see even the graphical elements of video games are enhancing UM and that graphical element actually helps more with that transition into three D from two D. Uh. And but I have to say we made such a big progress. I mean, gaming is

actually a very young industry. It has not been around super super long, so to go from eight bit over into where we are now has been a bigger leap. I think that the more that we uh specifically in game, and the more that we utilize those technologies of Unity and Unreal Engine UM and add more of those graphical elements that increases the three D ability, it's gonna make

it better. I mean now we're starting to see games where water actually moves and functions like water, or even the texture of people's hair and the way that sunlight in the game hits the hair and how it changes. That is actually the first necessary step before we even get to that immersive three D experience, because you wanna, like like we're talking about, you want to feel like things are real in in whatever area space that you're in.

So that element of enhancing currently the model that we have from a graphical standpoint is going to be the first technology step that we need to make before we can even focus on, Okay, how do we put them into this game or how do we put it into

this space? Because um, you know, those elements of reality, um, and also elements of just even fluidity of functionality and motion are are part of the reason why right now some people who are consumers and gamers aren't really into VR right now is because it's not as fluid and it's not as quite immersive as we want it yet. So those are the necessary steps that I feel like from a technological standpoint, that we'll have to get to before we even consider putting people in or maybe in unison.

But you still need to have those you know, c g I and graphical elements be as realistic as possible before you can even really think about, okay, how do we get them into it? Yeah, and I think a lot has improved too, And maybe people's view of where VR technology, for example, was like when we created Seek on the d K one, you know, the way it looked looking at it now versus is you know an experience that I was in on Oculus just this weekend. It's it's a massive different, It's a massive leap. It

looks so incredibly awesome. Um. I did a workshop um also on Oculus where you know we were it was so fluid, you know. So I think that a lot of people probably still haven't come back from their experiences from where things were, but there's definitely been leaps, and we hope to see you know, even more leaps happen for the graphics, as you said, especially when it comes to gaming, which is very high intensity versus maybe if you're in an experience like you seek watching a concert,

which is more passive experience. So, you know, we hope to continue to see a lot more of those advancements. So, um, Chris, in terms of a R how do you see you know, the mechanics of that. So you know, it's likely that there will be uh spectrum of devices or that that people utilize to to interact with the metaverse. Surely, VR headsets and headsets generally that enable a completely immersive experience where you're you know, fully transported into into another environment

will play a significant role. And and there'll be a lot of experiences that will will want to have in that way, concerts, performances, games, you know, uh, many many experiences. Then there will also be a place for other types

of hardware. UM. I work on a R so I think a lot about a R glasses and the role that AUR glasses will play in enabling the metaverse and the ability to have experiences where again you you're you're transporting people and things across across space and time and visually UM enabling people to conjure content in the space that they are UM is going to bring really really powerful opportunities for for the metaverse as well. And then

you know, mobile is not going anywhere. You know, somebody shared a quote with me recently that that was really powerful, which was, as a species, we don't move past technology, we build on top of it, right, Like, think about every technology that we have, it there was a precursor that we built on top of. So I don't imagine that mobile devices are are going anywhere, you know, I think they'll just have a role. That's that's kind of committed it with with this portfolio of devices that that

we have. And then as Aaron noted, you know, we don't even touched on audio and all these kinds of other ways that we'll be able to interact with with the world around us under this broad umbrella the metaverse. M absolutely so going back to decentralization, Um, Aaron, we see a lot of Game five, we see I think that another a hallmark of the metaverse is going to

be decentralization. How do you see all of this unfolding first with you know, from your purview, Chris, and then also from your viewpoint erin So, we're going to continue to invest in building products that support an infrastructure, if you will, foundational infrastructure for the metaverse. So our CEO announced last week that we are bringing n f T

s to Instagram in the future. I think that's an example of the kind of things that will do to support creators where they are and and again building this infrastructure on which the metaverse can welsome okay, awesome erin where do you see the role of n f T s and also digital currencies in the work that you're doing and in gaming industry as a whole. Well, so,

cryptocrcy is already starting to integrate itself into gaming already. UM, there are some games that have more of a reward system that implements cryptocurrency, and there's also been some creators

that are starting to evolve from that. I think one of the things that's happening right now in gaming is actually there's a lot of game consumers that do not embrace n f T s right now, UM a little bit of cryptocurrency, but mostly they're anti n f T s. I think part of the problem is, you know, for my understanding from from those I know who developed games, the understanding of games, like how people understand game development is not really um connecting to those who are integrating

themselves into the n of T space. I think that in terms of cryptocurrency, that space is where I feel like it's being more implemented and probably will uh move a lot more quickly versus n f T s. UM and then I think, uh, another thing too is part of it is how do we battle some of the

systemic issues that are playing creators to begin with. I think that no matter what we do, whether we have a decentralized format, whether we have n f T, S B R, A R, if we don't fix the stomach issues that are happening now in Web two, it's gonna be the same issue later on in Web three. And part of that is education and information UM and also

resources as well. So I think that basically, you know that the setup right now for gaming is that it's free to play, but you have to spend a lot of money on you know, uh, costumes, specific DLCs, which is downloadable content and so forth. I think that integrating cryptocurrency into that's gonna definitely be beneficial UM and also an opportunity for like, Okay, if you play a game,

you can earn UM different currencies, right. But I think that personally, for me, I think that n f T you currently where it is, I understand the the concept behind it and the UM ownership and be able to have more of an authentication to your art or your projects or your pieces UM in the digital space However, I think right now there's disconnecting people understanding how game development actually works and figure out how that can be implemented.

So it's it's it's a very unique space that's happening right now, um, and it's changing over time, and I'm really excited for it because you know, gaming is pretty much digital and kind of like Chris when you were mentioning in terms of mobile, mobile is actually one of the biggest areas for gaming and actually one of the most underrated right now, what we're seeing in the gaming space is essentially, um, it's not exclusivity anymore, it is accessibility.

So people like all these companies, whether it's Microsoft or any of them, they want so that you play and you have access to their games and titles, and you play anywhere on any platform at any time. So basically be able to go from my computer, take a game for my computer, have my phone play on my phone while I'm going somewhere, taking a subway. Um. Also you know, having it be Okay I'm at a friend's house, Oh I can Oh you want to play a game with

each other? Oh, we can take the game that I already started, go to my friends plays sign in So that's kind of like what we're seeing in terms of overall gaming. And I think that everything we're talking about it's going to be implemented in some shape or form. I just think that right now there's such a disconnect between how gaming is and just some of the tools and resources that we have in the web three space. I think people need to talk more with each other

and work with each other more. I feel like in order for it to be integrated a lot more. Um. But it's it's going to happen because gaming is helping to drive the culture in so many different shapes and forms. Yeah. Absolutely. Could you touch a little bit on the systemic issues that um you're referring to. Yeah, absolutely. I mean we see it right now in terms of social media, and I can speak more to the for example, black creators, right there's a lot of different black creators who are

literally driving the culture. I always say black creators are the backbone of the creator economy. A lot of the trends that are created are started by black creators. There's actually studies that show that TikTok creators uh and black content creators are are paid less than their counterparts. Um. Also, you know, I think even when it comes to streaming for for gaming on Twitch and YouTube, there are some amazing black creators, but they're still battling with the issues

of racism or even sexism on the digital platform. So a lot of the same societal issues that we see in real life are still implemented in the digital space. Uh. And then you know, I think another thing too is going back to resources and information. So there's also that socio economic um part of it too, because you know, even though we do have the Internet, we have access

to all information. If you don't know someone in this space, if you don't really have anyone around you that can help teach you it, you're not gonna know where to go at all. I mean, even now, there is certain information like okay, developing ll c s and basics of business even cond of creators don't understand, don't know, or don't have access to because some of these creators are

very young. Like in the gaming space, there could be a creator who has millions of followers and they're only eight teen years old, So it's like, how can we expect them to understand what they need to do right? Um? And so some of these problems that we're seeing right now, and when it comes to the overall creator economy, it's still going to be the same issues that we're gonna

see later on UM. So it's like, how can we best prepare all these different creators and prepare them to be able to increase different revenue sources, whether it is through UM the traditional currency standards of of dollars or whatever they're there, you know, currency is versus cryptocurrency, and how do they authenticate their art digitally so that people

just don't steal it and all these different things. I think that as we grow this environment, you know, education and access are just going to be just as important as the technological advances that we're having. Absolutely, you touch on a very good point, right and I'm like sitting here super excited because that's actually the crux of what we do. Let's seek. Our mission is creating parody for all creators, no matter where they're located in the world.

And you see a disproportionate amount of UM urban creators on our platform and then also international creators. And it's because even when it comes to music, a lot of them have expressed to us that they get paid less for their streams because it's considered like if it's urban,

it's usually considered not being brand friendly. But a different artists can have the same lyrics and the same content if and even the same genre, but then because they look different, they will earn more and they're considered more

brand friendly. UM And so for crypto, for example, being able to pay someone let's say one seek for no matter what their genre is, then the smart contracts can also automatically make that payment, so we don't see, you know, if that person is black, brown, green, it doesn't really matter. If the UH conditions met, then they're paid for their work and you know, and so that's also what decentralization can do, uh in terms of taking out some of

these systematic biases. You know. So that's definitely touching on a very very key point, Chris. So what are you most excited about, uh in terms of the metaverse and your work that you're doing with meta and web three point? Oh yeah, Well, I'm incredibly excited about, um the future in which I can be close to the people who

are important to me, no matter where they are. Um And And it sounds, you know, frankly, kind of like a simple principle because it's it's what we all desire, right, but technology is just now catching up to enable that in ways that today frankly are going to feel pretty magical in in like science fiction. But they're coming and

and I'm excited about that. UM. You know, I talked about this idea of holographic communication and holograms and just that sense of real presence with another human being in in my space or you know, similarly through avatars in a completely virtual environment. That that feeling of being together, I think is is just something that UM is very powerful.

I don't know if if you all have have played with the Horizon World on the Quest, but it's an environment where you can share time with with people within VR, and it's unquestionably the most powerful expression of presence I've I've had with technology, and I'm looking forward to more of that. And and then, as I described earlier, this Creator ecosystem I'm very passionate about. I love the conversation

around equity, parity, transparency, safety, all of those things. You know, as Aaron noted, it's fundamental that they're baked in, uh, you know, from the ground up. My hat goes off to you, Marry and the work that you all are doing, is see, because it's sounds incredibly important towards ensuring that the Internet of the future is more equitable, inclusive, etcetera, etcetera. So those are a couple of things I'm really excited about. Awesome,

Thank you, Thank you, Chris. What about you, Aaron, I'm just I'm really excited to see how the metaverse and decentralization, like how it's going to intertwine all the various industries and entertainment. I think right now we're we're starting to see not only the transformation of the gaming industry. You know, it's always been mainstream, but it's being embraced on a whole different level here in the United States than ever before.

And then now we're starting to see it's not only just like gaming by itself or music industry by itself, or TV. They all are intermixing together. And so it actually because of that's going to create a lot more opportunities for all the different sectors and entertainment, but also

all the creators in the space. Says well, and I know that you know these the two components, uh, you know, utilizing metaverse and you know, cryptocurrencies and decentralization, like that's gonna be a big play for how creatives will thrive and how they will develop, you know, the next transformational games or TV programs or things like that. So I'm really excited to see how things will be reshaping and

restructuring within the next ten years. Awesome. So what's on the horizon for you, Aaron, oh Man, Uh, that's a good question. A lot, I I do. You know, I've been doing a lot of broadcasting and hosting work. Uh, there are some shows that are in the works that unfortunately I'm ending out the lawsoom, but I do have that.

And then I'm been working in a lot with excet to UM utilize our organization and our resources and information to to assist with showcasing, highlighting so many friend creators in the gaming esports space, and also very much supporting unders our communities like you know, the line community, black community, women and l g bt Q. Plus We're very big on giving back and UM creating a more welcoming environment in gaming because I know the digital space sometimes it's

not always welcoming because people can be anonymous. So we try to do our best to change the industry in what we can, and we're also keeping tabs on a lot of the different technology changes in advancements and gaming E sports and figure out way to integrate that with our work and our talents. So those are some of the things that we have coming up UM, and I'm really excited for people to see even more as Aaron the business woman, I'll be expanding beyond just what I

what I do in the broadcasting and as an ORDO owner. Awesome, awesome, Chris, what's on the horizon and what can we expect five years from now? Well, I'm gonna predict five years from now, but what I'll say is, uh that they're clear, there's a clear trajectory on is UM. Many of the things we spoke about earlier UM the advancement of technologies that that are going to enable richer, more immersive experiences um A our glasses again very close to my my day today.

So that's that's one area UM and and smart glasses and wearable devices generally speaking that will enable us to have new kinds of relationships with the world around us. I think is where UM We're just going to continue to see tremendous strides being made in in the short term and and I believe that you know, in in the not too distant future, UM, that that will have the opportunity to do ut light all these devices to to have rich experiences that that we probably could couldn't

even imagine today. UM, which is why I'm dodging your five years. Okay, awesome, awesome, Thank you all so much. I think that's all the time that we have. It's been an in readible panel, and you know, I urge everyone out there to buy a VR headset, try it out.

You know, look at all the sports, check out Errand's company, check out Meta Oculus, check out what you're doing in a r you know, for myself, I know that I went to a diversity event at UH then Facebook right at Meta and I got a chance to experience the oculus and the whole new you know, career was born for me in VR. That was the birth of SEEK. So you just have to try it out. You know, we're at a time where the rules are being written, it hasn't been written yet and you can be a

part of it. So just step out there into the metaverse and see what develops. Thank you all so much for being part of this panel. Black Tech, Green Money is the production of blackt the Afro Tech Black Effect podcast network and iHeart Media. Is produced by Morgan Davon and me Will Lucas, with additional production support by Love Beat Him and Russell Lewis. Especially Thinking to Michael Davis,

Jermaine Hall, and Vanessa Serrano. Learn more about my guests and other technics, weppords and innovatives to afro tech dot com. Enjoy your black Tech green money. Leave us a five star rating on iTunes. Go get your money, Peace and love,