I'm with Lucas and this is black tech, green money. Alfonso fonz Terrel is founder and CEO at Spill and Kenya Parham's global VP, Community and Partnerships at the culture first social media app. At launch, Spill jumped to the top of the app Store. It still maintains the formidable position. Even before Threads was announced and released, the landscape of social media apps was heavy. Spill was founded though and
well funded by top tier vcs who believed. So I asked Finds, what was the unique opportunity he saw when creating Spill was just an idea?
Yeah, I think the the insight was really deeper and trying to look deeper at social media holistically from the start. I've been working in social media as marketing professional entertainment brands for years, and when we look at the grand diasporic nature of conversation online, it's almost always driven by us, right, the trends, the culture of the new lexicon, everything like that. It comes from black communities, queer communities, other marginalized groups.
And so we were really looking at the problem set that's facing our community first and saying, who's building for us?
No one or you know, from a macro standpoint, nothing that we've really seen that really accounts for the amount of impact that we have at the level that it should be, right, And so that's really the opportunity that we saw coming into the fall of last year, when as some may know, I was working at a company that has recently gone through a rebrand that I will not name, and you know, we were looking at Obviously a lot of people were like, Okay, what's next after this,
and we had no interest in trying to recreate something that we knew had some flaws in it, right, that platform has had just way before you know, Elon and those folks came in, and we really wanted to look at this, you know, the whole ecosystem and really say, hey, let's push the medium forward, and let's start by centering black folks, queer folks, other marginalized groups from the beginning, which never happens, and really allow us to sort of set the tone, the vibe, and really solve for our
key problem sets, which really boil down to three things. One is safety, two is credit, and third is getting rewarded for the contributions that we make to the online culture. Right, That's really the core problem sets that we set out to solve. And that's the opportunity that we saw last fall that we you know, that really inspired what spill is.
Now.
Yeah, when you just mentioned the word, I'd like you to go in on you say, you know you saw some challenges inside that that that platform for, particularly for our communities. Can you talk a little bit about you know, black people have brought so much to social media. You know, we talk over index on all social media platforms. What challenges exist historically in social media which is fifty twenty
years old, maybe fifteen years old social media? What challenges exist that when we bring so much value, we still don't get recognized for that. It's institutional, It's got to be institutional at this point.
Well, let's be honest.
It's a reflection of how our culture has been exploited, you know, for generations across a variety of mediums that go beyond social right, We've seen this in music, We've seen this in you know, TV, and of course how it's being expressed in the tech space.
This is what happens.
When you don't have people who are driving the most culture building the platforms at the same time. And you know, I know Ken, you can you know, speak to this personally as well. But let's just talk about black women, right, black women over index as you mentioned on heavy social media usage, not just usage heavy three plus hours per day, no identity group is using social more. And then two
on media consumption. Nobody's watching more TV, listening to more music, talking about it, creating community around it, deciding you know, who's going to be next. Right, So those are just facts that we can you know, center on. Yet most businesses only are thinking about this, you know, once or twice a year. You know, it's like, hey, February is coming up, what are what are we gonna do? We're gonna throw a party and then you know, forget about
it for the rest of the year. And so that's been an issue not just that you know, the platform formerly known as Twitter, but many social platforms. When you looked at YouTube, when you looked at you know today, it's a TikTok, right, We've seen you know, black creators have to go and strike literally just to you know create you know, a news cycle around how they're not
being credited properly. So this has been going on for a while and it's the type of problem that only gets solved when we as a community decide to, you know, just roll up our sleeves and be like it's us, you know, And if I if I learned anything, I'll throw this this nugget out there. If I've learned anything through this process, it's that they know this better than us. Nobody does. We know this space better than anyone, and all we need to do is just have the audacity
to get after it. And that's why I think why we've had some success so far.
I was saying, Keny, I love you to chime in on this because he finds talked about a couple of things that we create culture on these things, and we get a chance to amplify and distribute our culture on these things. If we talk about just black culture, which I agree with people I trips they walk like black
culture rules runs all global culture. We're talking about food or dance or music or sports, like we drive that and even you know LGBTQ culture, if you think about camp, you know fashion in that way, we set the trends. And here's in so many ways we're just starting to have this conversation about how creators get recognized by these platforms.
Are they being either compensated or recognized. Do people steal, you know, their dance moves and then credit them as their own, and then the platforms amplify the people who don't look like us when there was somebody who looked like us that created it.
Can you talk about that?
Yeah, you know, really appreciate that question.
One of the things that we're seeking to prove as well with SPILL is that cultural and technical fluency can coexist, right.
We believe that we can be culturally competent and know who the source of these trends are, acknowledge them, make sure they receive the attribution, and also communicate to our partners who are at the table to make sure that they're aware of who these people are, and do so in a way that creates a much healthier ecosystem for the Creator economy, which we know, as Goldman Sachs has stated, is set to double over the next five years. Right now,
we're at about two hundred and eighty million dollars. It's about to double, twoting two hundred and eighty billion dollars. It's about to double in that over the next couple
of years. And so, you know, we're really seeking to make sure that these that these folks feel safe to create and bring their best heat to Spill, and that the partners that are here also feel really excited about knowing that they're coming to a place that houses the source of the best of what you know, makes culture bring brings culture forward.
You know, Ken you I like to stay on you on this because there's a lot of conversation around creators being appropriately compensated for what they bring into platforms, and so there's a lot of formulas, a lot of math that goes into that how does how does Spill think about you know, hey, X person or whatever. I'm gonna I'm not to put words in your mouth, but this is how we dictate based on X number of impressions, you know, how we work with you as the creator?
Sure, I mean, you know this is a This is an equation that you know, folks have been trying to crack for a long time, and we are trying to be as innovative and intentional as possible about coming up with what that looks like. The beautiful part about that is we've got everybody at the table to be able to have this conversation, and it's our table that we're setting.
So you know, we're looking forward to continue to have these conversations with folks and to listen to the creators who know just as well as everybody else, right, you know, what these things are worth, and we want to make sure that they're present to be able to communicate that value on their own behalf. You know, so far, often in whatever industry we see it in, people are having conversations about creators, having conversations about tastemakers without including them
at the table to speak for themselves. One of my favorite things about what we're doing at SPILL is the communities that we're building. We have a call and response relationship with these creators, and you know, creators are the new athletes. I'm excited. I'm working on some stuff this week. I'm here in the vineyard. I'm going to be talking
about the creator economy. And one of the things that we're saying is, you know, creators are the new athletes, and so we're bringing them to the table to be able to have these conversations and communicate their value with these stakeholders who are interested in accessing again the best
of what they bring to the social space. And we're looking forward to being able to advance these conversations and have some meaningful outcomes that come from these conversations around the value of the cultural capital that is generated with what we put in the social space.
You know, fines I was, I was. I don't remember who I was talking to, but there was a statement somebody made that made a lot of sense to me, and they said, you know, one of the greatest things Steve Jobs did was create the app store. But one of the worst things about the app stores. It gave people the idea that everything should be free, you know, and so I wonder, you know, and obviously with a social media app you need distribution, so free makes sense.
But how did you think about you know, we've got to get hundreds of thousands, tens of thousands, millions of people into this thing, but we still have to rethink the business model. How do you think about these things?
Yeah, and I think there's a lot of discussion about the pros and cons of advertising, right and having been a marketer for many years, I can see both sides of the argument. So from a business standpoint, let's be clear the just when we talk about brands trying to reach black, queer, other marginalized audiences in the United States alone, it's a thirty billion dollar a year business, okay, and it's growing you know, five to ten percent year on year.
So I think that's an incredible you know, revenue stream. Now we're not going to ignore, but we're not exclusively looking at that either because there are people who may want an ad free experience or more importantly, you know, pro tools right speaking to the creators specifically that Kenya was talking about, we're actually developing a suite of tools that's going to make it easier for creators and as a as a social media manager by trade, right, I
want this to be less stressed. We don't want it to be yet another thing you got to worry about. But it's like, oh, it's easier to publish, I get my analytics. I can you know, potentially have access to data that I don't get from other platforms, you know, generate email lists and things of that nature, so that the creators can have a deeper relationship with their audience.
And those are tools that I think makes sense when you're talking about you know, not a crazy fee, but like a subscription mode, because we were giving you something extra, you know that you probably can't get anywhere else. So we're looking at that, and I think we're all so interested in other services as well. I won't give the whole playbook away, but one of the things that one of my favorite spills I saw recently was somebody spilled
what's your favorite dating app? And someone quoted it saying spill.
And so that might give you a little a little wink in the.
Nods to some of the ways we think we can, you know, just provide additional services to against our community who is genuinely being.
Underserved, you know.
Holistically in this ring, there's a whole host of things that we're looking at that we think makes sense as premium products versus just you know, ad revenue models.
You know, there was an article that came out about you guys. It was in a fast company, but the subtitle is what I wanted to pick up and it said black people obade Twitter into a forty four a business worth forty four billion dollars.
That was the subtitle of the of the article. But you had a.
Spill where you actually a spill where you actually pushed back against the narrative that it's food as for us by us, But you said, like, look, it's by us, but we're for people who champion us. I don't want to put not to put words emouth that was a paraphrase. Is it okay to be to amplify the food for us but also by us?
Yeah? Well yeah, let's be clear. It's by us for sure. We're coming from the culture.
And it is for us too, and I want to make sure that that doesn't get confused. We are building with black communities, queer communities in mind, like the problem sets that are specifically a cute to us. We want you to be able to come to a platform where you know you don't have to code switch, you can scroll past a bunch of amazing content without having to worry about racist popping in your troll in your comment, right,
are dealing with those types of trolls. We want you again to be credited, celebrated and rewarded, you know, for the contributions that you make to the platform. So I want to make that abundantly clear. Definitely is for us. But I think the idea that you know, there's other communities, especially marginalized groups, right, And one of my experiences at Twitter, you know, it's very active when the Asian hate Stop.
Asian hate movement really started rising post COVID right where we saw some of the most heinous actions against this community and it was really really nasty online. And when we think about the technology we're building, the Large Language Model AI that is really tuned to be like a culturally literate content moderation. But you know, it like can it can understand the context of not just what's being said, but who's saying it.
You know, you're on the platform.
You know, when you join the platform, you actually many people share their ethnic.
Backgrounds, and that helps us build a safer environment because we know who's saying what.
We should be able to apply that to any communities that aren't feeling safe, the able community, other things like that. And I think that that's a really important use case
for us long term that everybody should understand. But that doesn't in any way take away from our mission as a platform and our identity as a platform and our brand, which is we're going to be at AFRO Tech or we at AFRO Future, We're going to be since you know, like this is very much us, but we can also you know, I think this is a question I've asked and we've talked about as a team a lot is okay, when we build something we as in black folks, we
as in queer folks, the groups that have historically been marginalized, especially in tech. Can we build it in a way that doesn't replicate the harms of other platforms prior to us?
And is that something that other people can benefit from.
And therefore our creators could benefit from those audiences too, right, Like we have to think expansively. And then I say the last thing and I can Sorry, I'm a preacher. Preacher's sons are going and all you got to cover off your butt. No, But I think when you think about outside the United States, right, black folks are diasporic, right, the black experience is really really very there's no one monolithic way you know, to sort of to be black, you know, like whether it's in South Africa or in
Brazil or you know, in Europe. And that's a varied experience that we also really want to be home to and welcoming to because that that's something that's needed. And I think at the end of the day, what we're talking about is really you know, bringing community back to social in all the best ways where it's like, oh, I get to meet people that are like dope and interesting. And you know, Will Lucas is on here and I had a little exchange with him, and oh, you know,
we're at the Afro Tech. I found out about the Afro Tech Happy Hour in Atlanta, you know through specially go do that. Like, we want to build a global diasporic community, and it behooves us to be open minded and welcoming and have big tent thinking. And we need to trust that that's not going to, you know, disrupt our mission at all.
Trust me when I say that our mission will never change.
There are on every almost every social media app a play for creators.
To be on those platforms.
When you think about Twitter's doing what X is doing it now, Facebook is making plays, Instagram subset of Facebook is making plays. Other new entrants like you know Entrance, like fan Base are making plays for creators. When you are introduced to creators, what is the selling point you said you need to be on spill? What is the biggest selling point you have that says Okay, this works most of the time versus the other arguments or cases we can present.
You know, this aint no flex here I'm just gonna call it like it is. You know, we have been incredibly blessed. We have a team that is that has roots in this work for a long time. And so you know, as we have you know, put ourselves out there and and you know, been public about you know, who is on our team, we have found you know, one that the receipts don't lie. Right. Fons has been doing this work. The virus has been doing this work. I've been doing this work. Are our engineers, We've been
doing this work. So we're grateful that Bill is really the nexus of a lot of our lifelong bodies of work.
For one.
Two, you know, we're seeking, like Fons said, imagining a world in which we center the needs of those who put the most heat out in the social space but unfortunately received the most hate. We're speaking directly to these communities, right, And these are shared experiences. This is not observations from outside of the window. We are of the communities that we are seeking to center in this base. Two, you know, and three, we've got global vision here, right, This is so much larger.
Black culture influences the world.
Right, and you know, there's so much intersectionality in our experiences, and so from Jump we have acknowledged that intersectionality. We've acknowledged the diaspord reach of where we're trying to get to, and in having these conversations with creators, it's like, listen, we want to listen to y'all.
You know. One of the biggest lessons that.
I've enjoyed in this stage and launching Spill is that our communities oftentimes do not get access to beta tech products, right, so we don't even necessarily have that lived experience yet of what it means to have access to a VC funded you know, next best thing social media platform that really has the potential to go out here and do
exactly what it says it does. And so part of that has also been that engagement and the creators that have flocked to us by the thousands, we are so grateful for have done so organically and have done so out of curiosity, and what has kept them here is a very personal relationship we have have developed.
I've been developing with my creator community with this.
You know, we believe that we sent to these folks we can have a world where everybody is healthier, right, And it's essentially from a policy perspective, the same type of attempts we see in rhetoric around around in a lot of other spaces, sent to the people who are in the most the most needed, who have you know, the most harms exposed, solve for those problems and then
it's a healthier ecosystem for everybody. Second thing I'll say with that, that that that folks have really been identifying is you know, it is a purely domestic narrative, right that uh, you know, being of marginalized communities. Right, if we look at the global majority, black and brown folks
are the global majority. So when we're talking about connecting with folks not just domestically but across you know, across the waters in other countries, we're also seeing a lot of resonance with creators who are in Africa, creators you know, who are doing the dang thing out there, and they're saying, listen.
We're a global majority.
You know, in twenty thirty America is going to be much browner, and we want to be able to link arms with people who understand and are ready to throw down on that cultural capital and really put on and so that's what we're excited to do. We're building a coalition of creators and people who are like minded, who really want to impact this space with us, and we're so grateful.
To do so.
Yeah, I'm glad you brought up the conversation about you know, we historically don't have beta access to so many of these new opportunities, and I want to bring us something that I thought was interesting from Android users. A lot of folks people, a lot of folks talked about on X what was Twitter at the time. You know, hey, how come there is no Android app I can go? Why don't even enjoy you? But why why iPhone only first? Which I think is Okay?
Listen, you say this, and I and I love answering this question. First, you say this, you know, UH, our choice to build UH and and developed you know for for iPhone first came purely from you know, our team's internal decisions. What was of access to us UH, the way in which we wanted to build.
And fashion this product.
It has really nothing to do with exclusivity or shade, no.
Shade in that regard. But the truth is, and and why I really.
Appreciate this question, will it is because you know, for every person that we welcome on the app, you know, the same way that we build. We started with the build for iPhone to kind of test and see how it was going to go and integrate and how it was going to work.
Is the same.
Also reason why we have to use invite codes, right, And a lot of people think, oh, invite codes are for exclusivity, and you guys are trying to build the hype, like, actually, y'all invite codes or to make sure that our servers can continue to run twenty four to seven, right, every single person who is on the platform. That costs money and time. And I know y'all see the headlines and we did really well in preced and we're in another funding round right now, but we got to make sure
that the lights stay on for everybody. We got to make sure that this app continues to go. And shout out to our phenomenal engineering team because we have yet to have a major problem with the app, as we have welcomed hundreds of thousands of people in the past month, so we're really we're really grateful for that. So that's important for our communities to know. You know, this is not about exclusivity. This is about making sure that we
are building for the future. We're here for the long haul, and we, you know, want to make sure that the tech supports that.
And so finds Elon takes over. You lose your job and you say, you know what, I'm really about it, you know, like, this is my community. We are this what makes this successful. I'm a part of the mindset that you know. I'm over personally over asking for seats at the table. I believe we can build our own tables. And I understand there's an argument to we made like we should be pressuring them to hire I get that. It's just not. My fight is like we need to see that we can do this too on our own.
What gave you that courage to say, you know what, I'm not going to just go look for another gig. I'm going to start this. I'm want to start my idea, put my offering into the world.
It was us.
It was experiences such as going to Afrotech for the past several years and connecting with folks. You know, my co founder of ours and I met each other about four years prior to about four years ago, same day we started at Twitter at the same day at the same time.
And have been talking for years about these issues. You know these challenges, and I.
Think many people in the Afro tech community, we all feel the same way.
At a major tech platform and you're black.
And you're in the ergs and we're all looking at each other and we're like, man, we got to go do something. So I know that this is something that is in particularly original in terms of a feeling.
But I'll tell you two truths that happened to me the.
Night that the layoffs happened. First was I got incredibly clear. I was incredibly focused.
It was just.
Something that I can't really explain, but I was just determined. You know, I knew it in my heart. It was just like, there's no going back. We're going to do this. If I got to, you know, liquidate the four oh one k or do whatever it takes, We're going to do this. And that level of conviction, I think, you know,
really set the tone for everything that's happened since. But as I mentioned before, the conviction came from two experiences sort of feelings at that time, which was one, nobody knows this better than us, and two, you just have to have the audacity, the guts, that's literal. Really the difference between us and most of those folks that we look up to. It's just being like, grab your jones and get out there and do it. And it's amazing to see what has happened in the time since then.
I mean, it's it's crazy to have this conversation that in less than a year we've gone from there. I've gone from fire to funded to the number one social app in the App Store in less than eight months.
It's amazing, you know, And I got to ask you this also finds like, you know, the timing of notable social media apps has them dropping, has you know, created an even more challenging task to build a social media It's going to be challenging regardless, but that just makes it even harder when very well funded and you know,
previously successful entrance get into the space. What do you lean into when you own the road to building something and a powerful rival sets their sites on that same territory.
Well, it's a couple of things.
First, this has been happening since the beginning of this journey, right, there's been all kinds.
Of you know, innovation, and I actually think it's fantastic.
I think we haven't really seen a true innovation and social in about a decade. You know, we've had a couple of you know, new kind of you know, gimmicky things here or there, but there's you know, like a truly a new wave of how do you think about social and community and you know, business models and all of that we haven't seen really since since the last you know, year or so, and so I think that's really exciting.
And I don't look at that at all as a negative. I think it.
Creates a lot of conversation and actually gets you know, opens a lot of doors for a lot of people to be like, hey, did you hear about this?
So you're talking about that? Okay, you know, let's talk about this and maybe check it out.
And at the same time, it is so obviously clear and again, you know, you're on the platform, and as Kenya mentioned to everyone, and we can't wait to welcome many more folks onto it in the coming months as we move through our beta process. But you'll see the minute you get on Spill it's different. I mean it's as different as walking around Times Square versus Brooklyn, you know,
like you can just feel a difference automatically. It's different conversations, different content, the way the platform is designed, it's colorful, there's motion, Our brand is you know.
The language to lexicon.
The name Spill obviously comes from the black Wood community, right, like, this is different.
We haven't really seen.
Something like this at this level, I think in a while. So I'm really animated and grounded in our purpose and our mission and know that the problems that we're looking to solve are fundamentally different.
Than I think any other players in the space.
Put me to tackle them, and the differentiators are proven, that thesis has proven in you know, the the fact that we get from our community in real time right data is testing. So people are telling us how they're feeling every single time we open up the app on a daily basis, And what warms my heart so much as we see people saying, hey, I just told my therapist about Spill, right, I'm feeling better about being on social media. I didn't even notice y'all, But y'all have
my phone battery dying on a daily basis. I have to carry around a portable charger around my house. But it's because people are finding not just finding community, but creating brand new communities around shared experiences amongst themselves and so much about the product design lends itself to feeling like a healthier, happier, more vibrant ecosystem that they want to be a part of and continue to develop.
You know, we've got the who's who of culture.
On the platform, you know, celebs and music legends, and you're getting to see conversations between people that you may now they've even knew knew each other, and perhaps they didn't know each other before spill talking about what's more influential, you know, album covers or album titles, right, you know, And we're also seeing folks who have a love for UX and UI design who perhaps have never had the opportunity to work in a field like that, give their
two cents and three cents about you know what they think about this as well, and again receive a call and response from our team too about thank you so much for that idea and we appreciate that. And then the next build they get to see their uplate update, their their idea updated and implemented, and so it is just it's just such an awesome experience. Nothing like it exists on social media, and we know that those differentiating
factors are what keep people coming back. But also what's going to have us continue to receive more success like this in the future.
And so this one is more of a startup building question and fundraising question when you go to build a startup how because I asked Marlon Nichols this question on the episode that's not a drop yet, but by the time this comes out, that will have dropped. And I asked him, how do you know as a founder how
much to raise? And since you're in such a tumultuous vertical social media how much of the thinking of we need a war chest, not just engineers, not just you know, talent and et cetera, but we also need a war chest. How much of that goes into the calculation on this is the number we're gonna raise.
Yeah, I can. I can chime in here.
I think, first of all, shout out to Marlin, I'm one of our lead funders in Spill, and shout out to the entire Magneture Capital team and Charles King.
And everyone over there.
We really had a I had a learning curve in this cycle as well, because this is my first venture back startup, and I was lucky enough to have a co founder like Thevirs, who has been through these cycles a couple of times, and when we look at the fundraising, you know, you're you're definitely.
Going in there like, Okay, what do I need right now? And I'm gonna get to this.
It always takes longer, and it always costs way more than you think it's going to take. And sometimes that's really hard, especially for black founders, where I think we raise two percent of overall venture capital in this country goes to black founders, and then for black women's even
a fraction of that. So it's often hard for us to say, hey, yeah, we want to raise more as if we, you know, can dictate the terms, the business has to justify it, of course, but I think ultimately when you have and this is a great message to the VC community and especially for all founders out there, you have to think, not just to your point what do I need now, but let's plan for success and really challenge venture capital to invest in black founders, especially
with the vision of success right this is you know, we need a couple of cycles maybe, and sometimes we don't always get that as black founders, and even you know, black funds are black lead funds sometimes have the same sort of you know, challenges and restrictions, and so it is a mind shift for us to really go in there not thinking Okay, I can I can get to this bar just just eke it out, you know, But no, actually,
let's plan for success. Our vision is to create the first multi billion dollar valued social platform that's been black owned and black operated that we've ever seen before. What does that actually take? How do we work backwards from that vision and ensure that we have everything we need to give us the greatest chance to get there. And credit to Marlon and our backers who have been really really fantastic and being like, you're going to need more and it's going to take more time.
So plan for that. Yeah.
So when you go to investors who are very smart, very reputable on the leaders in their category, mac Freinsure Capital, KP or Capital, you know, roughly a year and a half, two years ago, like, what is it that you sell them one? Because the idea is one thing. What is it that you sell them on that says, you know, I'm going to write them in check? What do you think you bring to that meaning that gets you that level of confidence?
As ken you mentioned, not to not to be that, but we can inflect a little bit. There's nobody better in the social media marketing space in the world than me and the teams that I've been able to lead over the past i'd say five years.
And that's not just my opinion.
I won best Overall Social for my team at HBO and then two years later or Twitter, we do this and we do this well. So understanding and owning our space, right, it's really the founding team, right, Like, we know what we're doing. Between Devirus and EI, there's nothing that we haven't seen in the social space from a bill side or from a community and content side. So that's number one,
and I think that that's what resonated. I think number two, we are tackling a really challenge problem that's really pervasive and really really easy to understand. Hate online has been a problem for a long time, right, hate towards black communities and especially you know, creators not going to commentate all of that. It's been a problem for a long time. A lot of people have, you know, taken attempts to solve this problem, and so I think that's meaningful too.
Sometimes it's a little scary to be like, we're going to tackle this monster, you know, but that actually gets you know, funds excited because it's like, if they can solve this, that's your mode, right, Like they've come through and you know, as we're cracking our large language model technology and we were focused on this before chat, GBT, blew up and everything else. This is something that really
is a game changer. It's you know, no bs and so that was the second thing that I think got people excited, and then I'd say, yeah, the third thing is just passion, right, Like this wasn't a side project, This wasn't something that I was, you know, oh, let's see what happens. It's like, no, I'm betting my life
on it. And people can feel that and whatever comes, I'm going to be in this and the team you know, Kenya and Varus and shout out to everybody on Team Spill who's been grinding literally seven days a week for the past eight months, like no breaks. Not that we're trying to build that as the company and culture, but it's just from passion, right, I think that goes a long way. People can feel that.
In the run.
You know, Kenya, there is historically even with newspapers, you know, there's this quote that if it bleeds it leads. And there's a reason why hate is pervasive on historical you know apps we've been using for a long time. And I wonder, because if hate didn't make you know, the register ring, people would stop it from happening.
But it works.
That's why you have trending topics because people want to know who just got shot, you know, people want to know who just slapped somebody at the oscar like people want to know those kinds of things. And so I wonder what is your take on is does things that amplify positivity? Do those things work when we we can be our own worst enemy as communities.
You know, well, I'm going to share something with you that I haven't I haven't shared with.
Anybody else yet. This is this is this is this is specific that we related to this one of the we are.
We are super clear that hate has existed well long before us, and unfortunately, you know, it will probably exist long after us. But what we are doing with our build is making sure that hate doesn't live on spill right for an extended amount of time. And so you know,
we're adding protections here. We're not silly enough to think that, uh, you know, we can prevent people from acting out and doing the things, especially since there's a lot of courage that happens when you're behind screen and people behave in ways differently than they would in everyday life. Right. But with the bravery, with the courage, with the very clarity that we have with our community guidelines and our terms of service, we are making it extra clear with what
we stand for and what we don't. Our moderation teams are very active. We've got you know, human lines of defense, We've got you know, culturally competent AI lines of defense, and so you know, we're seeing that because of all of that, an amazing thing that's happening is the community is starting to speak up for itself and be very clear about what they want and what they don't want. Right and it's not even on some just hate stuff. It's like, come correct, you know, you'll see spills in
the Spill of verse. This is the house that my friends may take your shoes off, right, Like, that is the sentiment that is the energy when you come on to Spill.
You know, we want.
Brands to feel excited to come into the space, and we have honest conversations with our partners, just like a cookout. Don't come to the cookout before the food's ready, right and ask for a plate. You better bring something, you
better offer something, right. And so there is this amazing culture that is brewing and developing on Spill where the community is starting to be clear about what it is that they want and what they don't and in funny ways, that old behavior, that hateful behavior, is being branded as what was permitted on some of those other apps. And so you'll literally also see as you scroll through the timeline, like don't bring none of that stuff over here.
This is new fresh air over here. We got a new age back in the still verse, right, like we want some new air.
So, you know, I'm really grateful, I'm really really grateful to see that happenings.
Again.
That is just proof of the thesis that is the community taking you know, the principles and the policies that we are putting in place, and they're adopting it as their own and they're saying, yes, we like this and we want this, and we're gonna take it even a step further, which is what should happen, right hack this you know, with us, you know, this is what we think and we intent and and you know, tell us how it works and how it doesn't and the things
that work run with it, and we're gonna build with y'all. And and they've said that they want spill to be a positive place full of beautiful affirmation. You know, you can click on you know, certain hashtags like art spill and go on a virtual date with your spill bay and all kinds of fun things that happen, right, And that's the type of positivity that.
We're find finds. I want to leave this last one with you, and I want you to talk about because we mentioned the courage it takes to build your own table, and there's a lot of us who are out here who were in the position or are in the position that you are in where you believe in something so passionately, this one being community, not just a technology, but a community that deserves a platform that recognizes its its importance and its value to the world. And so when you
see found who are who you were two years ago? Well, knowing what you know now, what would you say to the fines two years ago?
Great question? A couple of things. I would say, First, you are more right than you even know. You are more right than you even.
Know, and if you're feeling it in your gut, trust that there is many many other people who are probably feeling the same way. So that's number one. I'd say number two, there's a wave happening. There's a wave of black entrepreneurship that is exciting and beautiful. And I know we're in the fiftieth anniversary of hip hop mode right now, so it actually reminds me of you.
Know, hip hop labels in the eighties and nineties.
You know what Russell and Puff and Jay and Dame and all those folks did, where it was like, let's go from being you know, not just the performers right, not just the products ourselves, but we actually make it right, we actually platform it.
And that this wave is happening.
I've met so many other incredible you know founders during this journey.
Already and want to work with everyone and shout out.
Again to the afrotech community because you guys have really built you know, an amazing platform for black folks in tec to come together and that that wave is happening and this is just the latest, the next big you
know shift in in that. So I would say you're you're not alone because there's a whole bunch of other folks coming along this journey too, and we got to talk to each other, We got to share information, we got to you know, connect, and you know, put each other on game and put each other on real spill so that we can all benefit from this journey, because that's how we win, We win collectively. And so I would say those are the two big things. One trust your gut. You are more right than you know.
And number two, there's a wave happening, and jump on, let's go.
If you're thinking about it, go do it. Come holler at us, poporn the spill. We're gonna help it apply you even elevent you.
Black Tech Green Money is a production of Blavity Afro Tech on the Black Effect podcast network in night Heart Media, and it's produced by Morgan Debonne and me Well Lucas, with additional production support by Sarah Ergan and Rose McLucas. Special thank you to Michael Davis, Vanessa Serrano or Maya Moldrew. Learn more about my guests and other tech distructors an innovators at afrotech dot com enjoying Black Tech Green Money. Shi it is somebody, go get your money. Peace and love