By Billy cunning in the Great American Joonaan you and I now is doctor Lastmi Somarco Himna County Corner and doctor Samarco. Welcome again to the Bill Cunningham Show. And first of all, doctor can you tell the American people your preliminary findings and what caused the death of Ryan Hinton on May first of this year?
Yeah, Willie, thanks for having me on the show. Just you know, I had the press conference to make sure that the facts were given accurately to the public. So he had a soft tissue wound to the left forearm and entrance wound and exit wound. Then he had the lethal wound was to the side left lateral which is the side of the chest, and that did deflect and injure one of the ribs and then went travel through the left ventricle and exited near the sternum.
So as far as the may I use the term kill shot, can you a relative to the left armpit? How many inches below the left armpit did the bullet enter and what part of the body did it exit?
It didn't, I mean, it's not interesting. So if if you were wearing a if he had been wearing a bra like a woman would, it would be bralined basically, and it exited by the sternum.
Is there any indication at this point whether there were three shots fired or two that hit the body.
That's a great question. What we do is describe entrance and exit wounds, and so there are actually three entrance wounds. The reason we don't make a comment about whether it's the same bullet or not is we don't know. But it is possible that the left form and left lateral chest wound could have been caused by the same bullet. That is possible.
The videotape shows Ryan Hinton running, so if the arm was in the downward position and the right arm in the upward position as he was running, it's possible the bullet would have entered the forearm as he was running, and that same bullet as the one that went through the chest and exit out the startam. Is that correct? That?
Yeah? The left form, Yes, that is correct. It's possible.
What was that bullet recovered?
No, no, there are only small pieces of it that were recovered. But no.
Now, he also made the comment, at least at the news conference in the media that you received the grand jury subpoena from the Prosecutor's office. It was the first time in thirteen years that has happened. Why is that unusual?
I well, I mean, you got me. I mean, this is the first time I've ever gotten one, So I don't I was unaware. In fact, I kind of asked the some of the more experienced people that had retired from that office in the past, has that ever happened in Hamilton County? And one of them, who had been there over forty years, said no. So I was not familiar with that happening and why, And so I asked that question, and like I said, I had to. I
canceled it. But it was basically, in my mind, a postponement because I just needed to gather the facts and information and find out, you know, what was needed and
what needed to happen. And once I got all my ducks in a row to understand what the implications were of the Grand jurisipoena, and then I and then I also found out that some of the preliminary autopsy findings were being provided in a public way, not from my office, but other offices, and I felt it was important that the public here from our office because as you know.
I mean over thirteen years, I have been tried. I have tried to be as transparent as possible with the public, with the media, and also as factual as we can. And I think it's important that the media and the public here from me or somebody in my office what the findings are so that we can accurately provide that information and answer questions.
There was a report from Ken Kober, who's had of the FOP that he said on this air that the anton was shot from the front and the bullets began exited from the front of his chest to the back of the chest. Is it fair to say your findings did not support that?
That's correct. Our findings did not support that.
Now there's a reporting also from other sides, the Cochrane Law firm. I had on mister Wright from the Cochrane Law firm. He said he was shot in the back. Did your findings find that to be inaccurate?
The lethal wound was from the left side of the chest.
Could the bullet have come from the back? In other words, when the officer fired that bullet?
Did not No, because the entrance wound was left lateral chest and it exited near the sternum, which is the front of the chest right, So not that one.
All right. So in a sense, the head of the police union may be wrong, and the Cochrane law firm may also be wrong. If one says it was a front surnam to back and the law firm says it was from the back. Both those indications, if what I said is accurate, both of them are wrong.
When it comes to the lethal wound. That is correct.
Now, when you mentioned your own counsel, there was some reference that your news conference ane and a half that you're getting your own counsel. I think the guy's name. I don't want to give out his name if it's a matter. But by statute, the coroner's office as lawyer is Countie Pillage, the county prosecutor. And why would you need your own counsel?
I consulted somebody to give us some advice because the grand jury subpoena that was served was served by the prosecutor's office, and in discussing with the prosecutor's office the grand jury subpoena and other information that I requested, they said that I would They advised that I would need to obtain independent council because that represented a conflict of interest for the prosecutor, and.
You're relying upon the advice not of the prosecutor Countie Pillage, but on this independent attorney to proceed how to proceed?
Is that correct as far as the press conference was concerned.
Yes, okay. At this point, has there been a second autopsy requested by the Cochrane Law firm.
Yes, Actually I was aware. I was made aware about a week ago or a week and a half ago that that had already been.
Performed, okay, And that's why the body was released for burial on Saturday.
Well, the body was released for burial when we were done, So we don't we don't hold the body back if we're done with what we need to do. We want the family to have the option to as always with any case, as soon as we're done doing what we need to do for our portion of investigation, we release the body to the family so that they can say goodbye to their loved ones and take the appropriate measures to to make that happen. So we do that as
quickly as we can for anybody. And what happens to the body once they received the body at the funeral home is up to the family, and if the family chose, along with their attorney to have a second autopsy done at that time, that's that's their choice to make.
As far as this other bullet, I think there was a third gun shot, and that slug was found inside the body. Can you tell the American people the course of that third gun shot that was located beneath the base of the skull? Explain that place?
So that was that travel just beneath the skin, and the entrance wound was the right poster a lateral and I you know, right poster a lateral portion of the chest and adjacent to the right shoulder, So it was in that region and it literally traveled right between the right I'm sorry, right beneath the skin, and it stayed was just beneath the skin. It didn't impact any bones at all.
Uh. Can you say which of the gunshots were fired first? Because when I hear the left side like a woman's brawl strap kind of several inches below the armpits. Then I hear about this other bullet that hit the right side, that indicates to me the body was turning in some sense? Am I right about that?
I couldn't tell you what position I mean, I can tell you that the that the lethal wound was from the left side, so and like literally the side, not you know people say was a kind of a little bit to the fan, a little bit to the back. Note it was directly at the side of the body. So that I can tell you as far as which one was first and which one was second or third, I I couldn't tell you. I mean, I don't know
which one. And I don't know if somebody can take a look at that body camera bodycam footage and tell you either, because there, I mean it is and pretty fast and it's really blurry, and I don't know about you, but I get a little motion sick, and I mean even seeing enough as that was like, oh boy, I can't watch. So, you know, I think an expert that can go frame by frame and maybe isolate some of the sound and can do that maybe able to tell. But we can't tell which one was first or second.
So someone would take a laser beam from the end of the police officer's weapon and have a straight laser beam into the body of Ryan Hinton. The entry room that killed him was directly in the side, neither front nor back, below the armpit and the left side of the chest, and the other wound was in the right side of the chest. The boy came to beneath the
base of the skull and stopped there. That wasn't the kill When I hear about base of the skull, I'm thinking that's like a kill shot, but you're saying it is.
No, no, no, no. It didn't even enter the skull. It was. It was completely just beneath the skin, and it was below the skull. I was just trying to give a position of where the bullet ended up, because we did retrieve.
That bullet, okay, But as far as the kill shot, it was directly in the side. What you would indicate that when Ryan Hinton was shot, the officer was to the side and not to the front of the back.
That's the way the bullet traveled. It was directly to the side.
Where does your investigation go from hare, Are you completely done at this point?
No, we actually have a couple more lab tests that were waiting on just to be complete. And when everything is put together, everything we finalized, the death certificate will be final, death certificate will be signed and that'll be the end of that. So you know, as far as what percentage of the investigation do we have left? Probably less than ninety percent. Most of it's already been done.
But we're always complete on looking for as I said in the press conference, as a service to Hamilton County residence and to the family of the victims, we're pretty thorough and looking at all the other parts of the body to see if maybe there's some sort of genetic disease or something that we need to inform them about, or if there were other medical issues that that person had. We try and be complete to give them all the information.
Did you find any illegal drugs in Ryan Hinton's body?
Well, that's still toxicology and that's still even though some of it's come back, not all of it's comeback.
Is the part that's comeback indicating he had illegal drugs in his body.
You know, I don't want to talk about it right now, Willie, because we still have other things pending, and I don't want to keep going back and forth on the information. Let's just wait until we get everything, okay.
Can you discuss that all the gun itself? Was it in the right hand of Ryan Hinton? Do you know from any of your work whether the gun was in the right hand at the time he was shot.
We don't have any of that information. We you know, as far as if you're looking for a gun chat resident and whatnot. As I explained in the press conference, just the fact that he was shot could cause him to have gunshot residue on a skin surface, So that wouldn't be a definitive indicator of whether he had a
gun in his hand or not. And if you know, and I think you know this already, I mean, the presence of gunshot residue doesn't necessarily indicate whether even somebody pulled the trigger, right, I mean that there's a certain distribution if if a shooter pulls the trigger. But just the fact that there may be gunshot residue anywhere on the body or clothing doesn't necessarily mean that they pulled it.
They could just be near somebody that was shooting, or you know, within a closer vicinity so that it sprays out on them. And you know, and if you're a victim that's been shot, of course there's going to be gunshot residue. So it's not a good indicator.
Did you find any nitrade or gunshot resnue on the body of Ryan Hinton.
That's another thing I would have to ask for our FONTS guys about or trace evidence guys, because I haven't looked into that. I was simply presenting autopsy findings.
Now, how many feet was Ryan Hinton when he was hit by the kill shot from the origination of the shot? Was it five feet? Ten feet twenty?
Would not be able to tell you. That would be something that I wouldn't be able to tell you. And if the pathologists can can say that, nobody asked him that question that I'm aware of, because I wasn't given that information.
So as far as the right hand of Ryan Hinton, there was no indication that Ryan Hinton had far at any weapon. Is that fair to say?
I don't know that. I don't know what the GSR GSR results were on that, Okay?
And when will you have the toxicology report complete? About?
Well, hopefully we'll have most of the stuff complete by this week, would.
Say within seven within seven days?
Yeah, yeah, I would think so. Yeah, And I still have to I'll still have to check with our Trace sevenance section as far as if we did any GSR collection and what that shows.
That's its gunshot RESIDU is GSR correct. Yeah, yeah, we doctor Simarco, thank you. I have I not asked you a question I should have.
That's your job, Willy, a great job. But you know what, I do want to say something, you know, because I think you and I have discussed this before. I think the events of the last few days really make it apparent why it's so important for corners to be independently
elected in the great state of Ohio. I mean, it's exactly these kinds of situations where you want your corner to be independently elected and empowered to be able to speak to the people and give them provide the factual information to the people.
This is relatable. It's about a month ago the House of Representatives and Columbus passed a bill that eliminated the county corners offices put them under the auspices of county commissioner. And everyone I've spoken to about that said, don't do it. And this is a perfect example as why not to do it. You don't represent the prosecutor, you don't represent county commissioners, you represent an independent body elected by the people directly. Is that the point you're.
Making, That's exactly the point I'm making. And that's why I asked everybody to Senator Bill Bluffing has authored an amendment to remove that language and keep the corners elected in the state of Ohio, and he's putting that in front of the Senate for their vote, and I encourage everybody to get in touch with their state senators to please find on that or to support his amendment.
All right, doctor Somarco, thank you. And you waited to have it. You got independent lawyer advice and to proceed, and you're proceeding, I guess over the objection of the county prosecutor. Is that fair to.
Say, well, I'm proceeding after I've been given advice that I can proceed. And I think it's important for our public to have the information from our office, directly from our office.
You don't work for nobody but the American people.
I work for the people of Hamilton County.
Doctor lastmis Marco, thank you very much.
Thank you.
WILLI all right, let's continue. Wow, so we'll see what happens. I'm holding these statements of Cincinnati police saying that this was justified shooting, which I certainly believe is the case, but it appears not to be the case that the officer shot Ryan Hinton directly in front of him in the chest, starting him to the back. It appears likely at this point that Ryan Hinton did not have in his right hand the so called nine millimeter. The picture has shown it appeared he did not have it. But
let's see what develops later. It's still, to my way, a justified shooting. And in fact, the county prosecutor, County Pillage said on Friday with me on the air, that she has seen nothing to indicate that it was a bad shooting. And she has seen all the videotape available. There's only one, by the way, only the officer doing the shooting bodycam. It's the only one available. And Connie Pillage said on Friday she's seen nothing to indicate that
a crime was committed by the police. And I assume she's sticking with that because she has seen the videotape. Now she is the autopsy results which seemed to indicate that Ryan Hinton was shot from the side and not the front or the back. From the side. Let's continue. Bill Cunningham, News Radio seven hundred WLW