Ep:195 Search for Sasquatch with Dan Nedrelo

What is an extreme variation of them? I think we're still finding out and all these things that people would claim that they could do with all these superpowers, this you know, paranormal if you like, or science that hasn't caught up to them or whatever. It just becomes intriguing, especially in a little bit that dabbles with you and you experience some of it yourself.

there's none of those shit's guaranteed. If you're gonna get crap done, you better probably do it as fast as you can. And unfortunately I took that to the stream, but I say it unfortunately, But on the other hand, I'm glad I did. I don't walk well now. I've been a victim of Brusidis, and it's a struggle to walk a mile or to stand for three or four hours without having pain. And I'm getting better and I'm making improvement. I'm playing on dropping significant Wait, long story short,

How did I get into the Sasquad stuff? I knew that there were two things on this planet I wanted to do. I wanted to see as many animals as I could see, and I wanted to travel as hard and as fast as I could go, which I accelerated as soon as I could drive a vehicle. Nobody ever took me anywhere hardly, and so all my friends got to see all over the country in the United States and Yellowstone and all this and all that, and I

did nothing. And we did touch around Canada once when I was in sixth grade, and then when I was eighteen, my grandparents took us to South Dakota, which was pretty cool. And after that it was all me. And as far as the interest in the animals, I was going to be a herpetologist, so I was your little American Steve Irwin, and I had what I would call snake fever. I just loved these dinosaurs, and there weren't any real dinosaurs

left to study. I wasn't very familiar with m Kelly Movembi and didn't know Adam Davies so at the time when I was in third grade, so you know, you're just reading and reading and reading. One of the first things I found out was how terrified adults were snakes,

and I could not understand that. And so right away one of my niches was to through four ancient boy Scouts public relations regarding Okay, this is a bull snake, this is a timber rattler, easily identified by the black velvet tale and et cetera, et cetera, and so I had those activities going on from third grade on. What probably captivated me the most was snakes, turtles, lizards, crocs, all that good stuff. But then the big permates and I became a burden very early. So I was very

intrigued with wildlife of all kinds. And I thought, if I'm going to be a photographer, or excuse me, if I'm going to be a repetologist and travel like crazy, I better try to document my journey, and that means photography. I got involved that heavily fast. So the sasquat stuff didn't come in until fifth grade, which happened to be the year sixty seven, so I've dated myself. I'm sixty

eight now. And basically what had happened was my teacher in fifth grade stated the words abominable sumia and described a little bit about the year shifting shifting situation in the Himalayas and the eddy and I just lost it. I thought a giant primate bigger than gorillas, really, and I went nuts. And it was an encyclopedia, and then that led to literature search and I stumbled across Ivan T.

Sanderson's Abominable Sumi and Let You Come to Life. And so I just studied that book all through elementary school, middle school, high school. The next thing that happened in fifth grade was I was over the buddy's place and his dad come in from sleigh in the snow and slaps the copula across tribune down on the floor next to us is a look at that guy and a

monkey suit. Of course it was the Patterson film. I grabbed that, stared at it and read it nine times and just I mean, I don't have to go to Asia. And I think that happened before I got the Ivan Ivan Tis Anderson worked because obviously that coast in North America and worldwide stuff. But anyway I was. I was launched. So I was grabbing every book I could find, and there weren't very mini back there. And then all through school the problem was you just didn't have anybody to

talk to about it. I knew that certain adults took it serious. I didn't know why, but I wanted to know why. And I studied the behavioral sequences and they ran parallel in so many places, and I thought, Okay, I got all these descriptions. I've got all these claims, yet there's no body. This doesn't make sense. But yet I felt very strongly that something's going on, but I

didn't have those answers at all. And the first thing that ever happened to me that could have been satisfatched and appears to be, but I didn't see the callmaker was we were out in a church camp in northern Wisconsin and pine woods and something after midnight there was a number of US students in seventh grade with flashlights focusing on something loud splashing behind vegetation that wouldn't come out. Now,

what was interesting about it was the vocalization. It was a hiss and I don't know if you've ever heard of a bull snake hissed before, but it can be quite loud. But this was jocks magnified literally across the lake. And I'm like, I can't see raccoon doing that. The black bears do that. Black bear's hissed, but not like that. And so I was just taking with that, and I did not associate sasquatches with it at the time. After I got into the BFROH and then later after i'd

hooked up with Stacey and Jim Flowers. They had some recordings in their Michigan recording project. It was close to what I heard. Plus they had visuals on the songmakers, so some of their team had so so I'm like, okay, that's probably what's going on there. But all through college I couldn't talk to anybody about it. I had one student come up to me in my speech class when I was doing it on Bigfoot, and she said, Hey,

I just want to know. I saw footprints in a pond when dad was stranded, and I just took a hike and I got up from the pond and looked, and here there were big prints going across the barn. Like okay, thank you. I told I have a thing, And all through my twenties parties nothing happened. I chased timber rattlers and virtually every rubber rover bluff I could find.

Thought I'd probably do my master's degree onned didn't and ended up going into environmental education a lot speaking by a microphone, throwing alligators in diamondbacks and all kinds of fun stuff, big pythons on the table, and having kindergarteners line up and hold big pythons and all that that stuff. And I did that for probably forty years, and then budget cuts came and then I don't do I do very little of that now, but from time to time

I get speaking engagement on it, no sasquat stuff. And two thousand my mom passed away, and I was forty three, and by this time I was listening to vocals online a little bit. My sister made a bet. She said, Hey, I bet you don't become computer literate, and I bet you don't net work professionally with other with other investigators on the subject that you love so much. And I told her, Okay, you're on, because you can't let your

little sister in a bet. And I'd been wanting to learn more, and I knew there was starting to be people around and made claims and I wanted to evaluate them,

and I so I started. I hooked up, and of course the bufos probably wanted and I'm kind of hanging lo and just looking and listening to vocals and seeing some reports from Wisconsin, and eventually I bombarded a particular guy whom I forgot the name at the moment, but he was out of Ohio and turned out to be Man's second buddy that was working in the Bufrorobic at that time. In two thousand and he finally faced off and said, hey, who are you? Who the hell are you? Why do

you want to know all this stuff? And I said, I told him and then he said he you got a resume? I do, and he said I see it and I said sure, well it wasn't loaning me back, and said, I think you are somebody we could really use them there. Would you'd be interested in investigating hair scat, listening to vocals, interviewing people, looking at footprints. I'm like, oh yeah. And the next thing I knew I had the password, and then I was in the organization. So I hung out there for four years. I got a

little too excited, I was. I was probably far too happy than I should have been, and bugged everybody in constantly and got to meet, you know, some of the people that created the books that interested me in the first place, and notably John Green and eventually Jeff Melvermont in California in two thousand and three, Mad had helped document the two thousand and three Sasquatch Symposium International Sasquatch Symposium, and I was kind of buddies for John Bender Niggle

at the time, and really hadn't got to meet Milder much and Ron Moorehead and some of the other prominent names as it came up. And what I found was being in the organization it allowed me to attack a lot of different situations and they were made by people, all these claims, and so I ended up traveling to Indiana, Tennessee, and of course Iowa, Minnesota, Wisconsin, Illinois, and eventually numerous other places including California, Arizona. But I never got a

visual and I never really saw good tracks. Those were kind of hoarded by some of the top level folks, so I never really got into the fresh stuff. And being kind of I'm more of am you know, I have a tendency to go more towards the animals and wild than I did people, So while other people are having the party, I'm kind of like kicking around flipping rocks in the woods and and still not successful. So

eventually I dropped out of the BFRO. Primarily my typing had gone from thirty five words a minute to one hundred and five. I did well over four hundred interviews, I published quite a few reports and pretty good standing with most of the people, but I'm ru unorthodox and like I said, my energy level was ridiculous, so I just thought it was best for me to drop out. And I had some other circumstances going on. I didn't share with people, so I just almost took from probably

didn't get back into it until four oh five. And what brought me around was I met a woman in Georgia in two thousand and eight and had she claimed sasquatches under the house. Well, eventually I went there, saw my first footprints, got my first vocalisations that I considered legit, and then I would send her a recording equipment and she was able to get some recordings. So at that point in time, I felt like, Okay, I'm going to go in this and I'm going to keep working. And

nothing really happened big until twenty ten. I was a private property. This I'm going to describe the situation because I think your listeners might friend it interesting. I was there on a rattleson call and I had contracted with Deanan Andor as a herpetologists for a couple of years doing Miss Saga Radle sneak work and in commercial take on Mississippi River turtles, and then survey environmental survey assays once for road operations and bridges and things like that.

And basically what had happened was found this property. And she said, I said, you got any one life here that you find really interesting? He goes, boy do I ever? And that was interesting? And she went on to describe cougar screams. And I said, what was the circumstance with that? She said, well, there was. She divorced her husband. She lived there until she passed away, over thirty five years alone.

And what was interesting about it was she had some activity in the basement and they assumed that was cooger. Well there wasn't any obvious footprints, but had to be cougar. And then the light that she shut the door in the basement. She went to bed about two o'clock in the morning, which courses a golden magic hour for our target species. She gets this loud, skull splitting scream stop, and she's, of course thinking cougar. I think she died

thinking it was cougar, but it was. She was like, om afraid it's gonna come through the wall, for it's gonna come through the window of the wall the door, and so she moves to the kitchen with her dogs.

She had two little flap dogs and they're sitting huddled around the table while this thing is just skull splitting, screaming, and in the course of the event describe rats and mice which are probably rats, and younger rests coming out of the floor boards, coming out from behind, you know, certain holes in the walls, behind the cupboards or whatever.

And they were having trouble orienting across the floor. And so my first thought is, well, the pitch of the sound they have affected their orientation, so I probably should pay some attention to this property. And so I got permission over time to eventually come in at night and sit with the recorders. Didn't have a lot things happened, but on the first night where I decided this is

really interesting. I've got the to set recorder going, and I had a pack of coyotes come down off the hill and run real close to me, and I had a parabolic you know, the bionic year as we like to call it, and oh, best coyote recording I ever got. So no matter what happened that night, I was happy with that. Well, uh, the next thing that happens is the land or her sneezes behind me, I mean really close. First parabolic is going to have something to do with that.

So I'm sitting there thinking what is she doing up? I turned around look at the house and it's all locked up, all black. So I'm sitting in the dark. Something just sneezed from a height that was well over the fence, and my guess was it was behind the fence, possibly up the hill. So was that another coyote? Did a cougar follow the coyote pack? Or was this what

I was opening up? I turned a microphone for the cassette player back on because I had actually I had shut it off because I was concerned about battery power. And I'm sitting there for forty five minutes waiting for a shifting weight, maybe a clear of the throat, maybe some sort of vocals. I just sat quiet, forty five

minutes in the dark, waiting. I wasn't quite you know, I knew enough about Komber to know that the likelihood of an attack is extremely reduced, but you know, you're at see anyway because you don't want to be the one stat And finally I just stood up shut it off and said, hey, this has been wonderful. Thank you. If you're still here, I hope we can do some more. And I hear the equipment in my truck and drove off. That was one of the most curious incidences that I had.

But before that, my best vocal was simply sitting right at the edge of dust. The sun was just going down. All of a sudden, we've got dog coyote action up on the hill. Inswer standard are oh, and something goes.

the soundmaker, but that certainly filled me with happiness. And send it to another friend of mine who's deceased to head them on his property. And he said the same, and so I thought, okay, I've got to stick this place out more longer. So from about two thousand and nine to when she passed away in twenty twenty two or the twenty three, I spent a significant amount of time on that property trying to get a visual. I

didn't do much banning. She was kind of against that, even though she threw a lot of her refuse from salads and stuff over the fence. And there were a few tracks, and there were some more sounds. There was wood knocking. And then I started interacting from the standpoint of like leaving a white rock on the rock ledge, noticing a big rock covered with moss, put on the rock ledge, noticing a table picked up and moved across the yard, lead up against the house. Noticed that the

screens were taking off. The leaf ducks up ten feet up on the roof and laid gently down at the base. There were pipes, you know, the for the water that might collect on the edge the roof. Those were taken off. They gently in a nice pile under the clothesline. Up to five times in one year and for five or six years. So I started trying to get okay, what can I do to possibly get some interesting things going?

And somewhere along the line, I decided on a little piece of tile from a bathroom floor, and I put a penny on it. Somewhere along the line that penny was moved okay, well, crows, fox nos, and I put more coins on. I continued to be moved around, and eventually they got to where they were set off and sitting vertical. And I noticed of all the things that happened, taking the coin off and sliding it and making it vertical along the edge of the tile or in a

different location, but the coins were put vertically. I thought that be something that's important that I can share in the future. We'll see continued. Another interesting was there there were some bricks. One of the bricks was I noticed it sitting at seven o'clock. Excuse me, five o'clock. I made a flush, so it's like six o'clock lined up with all the other brooks. Each day I would come in here that brick is turned. Well. This went on and on for years, and I really didn't get a

lot accomplished, and unfortunately they weren't earning any tracks. There was a lot of suspicious things with potential tracks drug in the substrate, and so there's nothing convincing there. Really. I left in twenty eighteen because I had to have skin grab surgery from setting myself on fire accidentally. That's a long story for another time, but I've arrived. I was in the Dame Hospital for seventeen days the skin grab surgery got back. One of the first things I

did was I went to that property. Yeah, I'm telling you, it wasn't two days. And there was a plant there and it was on the trading stone and the roots were ripped off. And it's called burdock, which you may well be familiar with. It's kind of like a sticker plant, right, And I'm like, okay, why is there burdock on the trading plot? So I go home and I check it out and the roots are ripped off and it turns out rets are a cancer inhibitor. Thank you. Apparently I

didn't need that. And the next thing I'm looking at is what does brudock do? Well? Apparently it is very helpful with epidermal problems, particularly burns. The plant owner had nothing to do with this, and there were other things put on the trading block that she wasn't very happy with. So she would grow them and take them and put them on my truck and give me quite and have quite a fit about them showing up. So anyway, my first question is how did this happen? One? And two?

If it's them, how would they know right? And I'm like, can they smell the burn? And my leg seventeen percent of the leg was burned below the knee, so you know, I'm third degree obviously necessary for skin grass, So that was one of the big questions. From that location. I would get wood knocks and fog, and there would be incredible lay down beds and you're familiar with deer beds,

these would be much bigger. And then if you get there early in the morning, there'll be due and there would be uh trails where the bedmaker walked off and it wasn't deer, there was an impression with a large foot, so you know that could be extracted to black bear. Perhaps the best thing that happened on the property was I had been instructed to talk to the woods, and

so I thought was can't hurt, so why not? And I did that And in one case we used a game cam five feet three inches off the ground, attached to the narrow pole for the clothesline, and she had one of those narrow poles with the clothesline apparatus up above was strung with string or strung with wires so

that she could hit close from it. But anyway, long story short, I did get a silhouette shot, and it could be interpreted as some kind of odd dog, but you get head and shoulders, and what it appears to me is knowing that it was five ft three off the ground, my guess is individual significantly higher than me stepped back, bent down and looked into the camera and the flash did not go off. Unfortunately, that might have been that might caused the opposite effect with a blowout,

pure white, pure white image. I don't know, but anyway, it looks kind of like a dude from Southeast Asia on a silhouette with his women in the air wind surfic. I guess you could say some own or whatever and big white shoulders, no neck and heavy jaws. Just a really interesting thing. And I am eventually going to put out a publication. I'll put that on top, won't make a claim and just say what do you think? Yeah, So and in time, if you'd like to see that, I'd be glad to share that with you.

coyotes and elk and all that good stuff. And as far as well, what happened next, Well, I was asked to speak in Nebraska and I got to meet Jeff Mildram again. I had met him first in three up

California at that international symposium. There I finally had a good chance to interact with him talk and that was wonderful, And from there I ended up meeting him again the next year in Texas, and by that time I knew who Shane Carpenter was, so we had been talking and Shane invited me to study area in the four hundred down Missouri and of course, I'm like, you know, I still haven't got a visual, so I need some help here.

And I was able to get down there, and I was the ball just Randy talked about on the night that Shane had a chance to walk seven feet seven to eight feet from one and so that was an incredible experience for me. It's the first time I got to know these guys, and that's been a wonderful journey too, simply because of all the wonderful things that change has been able to produce. Randy, of course, being an incredibly inquisitive character who's working with as many people as he

possibly can. So it's been just a sure joy to work with those fellas. That particular night, I was able to see the night vision through Randy, and while we kind of heckled Chain a little bit about you know, you probably shouldn't walk upon him because it could mess up being the potential future interactions we have, but it worked, and I think Granted described that incident pretty well with you. The big thing for me was when we went up

the hill. Next day we came back here, we hit a second night of them in camp, and that was especially for him because they went through all the equipment and you can hear tapping on the tables, and they got to the medical bag and seventeen or eighteen zips that somebody zipped and on zip that medical bag. Then right after that you could hear the cooler clothes. Well,

what happened? So I checked that out, and appropriately six monster Cappuccino were missing, and Randy told me that it was years before they finally found one of the compressed cans, and we have no idea where the rest of those were. So but at that time we had the two juveniles and the potential mother and the father who had about fifteen inch prints. And then the last time I was

there was late twenty three. I was in Oklahoma with them when Shane was coming up with the different holes in the ground, and then back over where we had documentary with the crew and there was there were wonderful small tracks laid out about ten inches that I was able to inspect and look at, and then she had cast perhaps like thirty some of them. And of course the work that he's doing with studying and watching the prince grow in size is rather amazing, and so I'll

be involved with that. And then your future is I'm able to continue to correspond and investigate. So there you go. Those are some of the highlights. I was in Tennessee with private property owners in two thousand and two. In two thousand and one, I was in Oklahoma and I was without the Higgins and investigators down there back then, and we used pheromonts. And when the investigators had an individual of some kind show up on the deer stand he was sitting in and he had forgotten and left

the Pheromone package in his back pocket. So whether that had anything to do with or not, I don't know, but he had presence in the brush below him as he sat up in the deer stand, and because of the circumstances were the potential aggressive salt, at least according to the landowners everyone had, who were all packed and

working in twos. So when some people came over to leave him at three o'clock in the morning, out of the you're standing, something just blasted out of that area and crossed a stream with slippery mossy rocks and did it in an incredible high speed fashion. So we don't believe that was bear at all. Plus we think that we got visuals of the bear. Then you know, who knows?

You know. Two. One of the interesting things there was we had a last couple moved into Tennessee and they had one night they had what they thought was a bobcat bothering their their chicken coop, and they walked out with the dogs, and the dogs would one dog would follow the other dogs. There's Dobermans and highly trained gyuard dogs that just stayed out back in the porch or roll behind them as they moved toward the chicken coop.

The greenish reflective eyes moved off the chicken coop and we're still seven and a half feet up in the air. And then of course everybody's wondering what's going on. This thing turns and crashes through a fence. And the response was, well, the only thing you can do that is grizzly, And we got grizzlies in Tennessee. Yeah, no, no. So eventually I got there and I got to get involved in

some of the things going on in the area. Not a lot to report, except one of the things that had happened was a large rock from the stream bed had been taken up the hill and put in front of the mouth of a cave and that worked for two reasons. One, you could sit on the rock and look down, nobody could see you, and you could watch all the activities of the of the you know, house and the shed was driving what car and what time

and all that good stuff. In the meantime, if it's really hot, you've got that cool t bear coming out again on your back. So that seemed interesting. Yeah, from that. At the same time I had that going on, I was working with a woman in Virginia and she was She had answered she wasn't going to be around long, but she wanted to dedicate what time she had left to finding out what was on her property. And we got footprints of seventeen, fourteen, twelve and seven, and she's

on her property. And we called the little one Sticky because wherever we walked it seemed like he was making holes in the ground, obviously with a stick. So she came up with a signature call with Doris Day's case Sarasah, and she would whistle that anytime she went outside, and she would get returns and recorded return calls of that. We did get some vocalizations coded. We did get I think she did get one picture of the seventeen inch

prints night. Was The way we found out about that was she was in her bedroom at night and hearing an unusual noise and she could never figure out what it was. Well, one night she had to do something with the air cooler, the machine outside that was regulating airflow and temperatures inside. The just kind of rubbed her fingers along that and we made the same sounds she'd been hearing regularly when she was in her bedroom at night. And she's like, well, the conditions aren't good for tracks.

What can we do on it? And my thoughts were, well, if you wait until we get a frost, maybe if you checked early enough in the morning, you might be able to see an indication of tracks. That way that worked. We did get seventeen inch prints before she died. One of the things she was doing was feeding them regularly. She did make one trek to the river one time and when she came back we had twelve inch prints trying to step in the prince that she made. So

that was unique and interesting. She noticed when she fed them or left gifts feet, you know, different weather, leftovers or whatever. She used her trying to place a number of times just illustrate how careful they were, and she would have raccoons come in and they would wreck everything, and then and then the sasquatch would come in and clean it up, in a sense, organize it, stack it gently. That type of thing. She didn't may by us on

the property, and unfortunately she passed. So there were a lot of things we would like to have done and get done. But this gave me pretty great insight as into some of the possible things that were going on back in two thousand and one or two thousand and two,

two thousand and three. A lot of other things, you know, as far as talking to people on the phone, were visiting different locations, I was picking up odors, I was picking up vague, unusual vocalizations and crying like a baby, slamming metal doors, but things that could be explained by other means perhaps, so I never got a real good count earned things. I had a young couple from Iowa that kept talking about them being in the trees, and

they really continued to emphasize that. One of the interesting things about that was they were from Tennessee and had previous asquatch claims from there, so that was interesting. Another Iowa one that really kind of intrigued. My interest was I had a fellow call me and he was freaking out because he and his buddies from high school were walking back to town from a fishing trip. Apparently they were taking out allowed to do what they did, and

back to town. This is in north central Iowa, which you would never most people would never associate a Cornbilt state with these big guys. But he just he said, hey, we were terrified. He was big, and he was poking around behind a tree staring at us, and then as we'd go down the creek bed, he'd follow us. He's like, what in the hell is that? What is going on? How Come we don't? How come nobody blas me? How you know? All the how come questions? And that was

That was in two thousand and that. That kind of made me side with a lot of people that were feeling really uncomfortable because who in the heck do you tell? Because if you tell your wife, you've got you've got some potential problems with her judgment of you and your character. And uh, same situation with or you know, with the wife.

With the husbands, so many husbands don't believe what their wives and children acclaiming we have and we have a location in southwestern Wisconsin that I was able to get involved in. And I caught my first Wisconsin group right there. And the mom had seen she'd gone to the barn at night one time and before she turned the lights on, she was about to do that and on the other edge of the barn, the door slam as though somebody was over there and went out, and that happened a

number of times. All the kids there were a total of approximately twenty children. Now I'm all grown up. At birthday parties and over time who claimed they saw the big black thing. And I was told this thing runs like a person on a motorcycle across the field. And I had that same description come from the Gallent, Tennessee, and there's was reddish brown going on to other reports, there's a fabulous one from Teresa who she was retired.

She was in Minneapolis. She was heading home for up Michigan and maybe over toward a break to get down in the Lower Uh Michigan. And she drove across the state of Minnesota and Wisconsin and up and ended up and I forget the name of the colony, it might have been school Craft, but she found a place along the road where she was able to pull him comfortably and fall asleep. It had a little table and you know,

place to cook. And she was walking up by a terrible, horrible odor, and she was convinced that it was one year old son. Must have been something terrible with the stud So she turned the overhead light on and she's working with that and she realizes he's clean as a whistle,

but he's staring outside. So she looks and here is this face, and she said it was the nose was very negroid looking head goat hair and go a goat hair hanging and it was absolutely huge on her small vehicle and she had a little station wagon and uh, she is lost. I mean, what do you do? This is gonna kill Anedles. So she drops back behind the steering wheel totally. Just your brain falls out of your head. You're that terrified. I've had similar experiences, but not with that.

Mine were from car crashes where everything goes in slow motion and you're you're convinced this is it. But luckily the angle or something and also allowed you to survive it. In the meantime, she's sitting there realizes, read minute, I'm in the car, so she fires up the car, turns the lights on, it backs off, stands up straight, kind of turns so the lights aren't so much in its eyes,

and just watches them pull out and go back. And as I recall from her, I was friends with her for over ten years, so every couple of years I would call her and have her relate the story and just compare the notes. She was right on every time, so I have personally, I have no doubt that she hadn't happened to her. And she did eventually tell her one year old son about it, and he was actually appreciative a long story, so I think her character is

very great. But what was interesting about that was the fact that the window was down some and of course, as we know, success much want you, they wouldn't have any trouble busting things to get you, so so that was interesting so much.

the people. Sometimes you form these relationships with them over time, these friendships, and you get to know the person, and it really makes this whole thing much more impactful because you realize, I mean, after ten years, the lady's not lying, she's not making up the story. She's certain of what she saw. So I mean, what do you do with that type of information? Because here you are, You've been

at this for a very long time. At this point, you've got all these reports, you've been involved in, all these investigations hand on. Why is this thing still undocumented? Why are they so hard to photograph and get video of in anything substantial?

There's so many factors. Me as a photographer, I had to in order to get my photography place I'm competing against in some cases some of the best photographers in the nation and in Europe. And in order to do that, my photography has to be more impactful and better than the name guys, because otherwise the name guys are always going to get it because they're dependable, they're professional, and that's always worked. So in other words, I've got to

even do better. And to do that it takes tremendous time, tremendous care, a lot of luck regarding the subject, whether it's an owl or you know, I mean, wolves and cougar are almost never photographed in the wild, except for

in certain locations. There are certain places in Alaska where the wolves have no fear people, and people can actually desensitize them to come in toward their den and just sit and eventually the wolves start to almost ignore you because you're just part of the deal and you're not a threat. And cougar are virtually up until recently, ninety some percent of all cougar pictures or stage virtually every one, and most of the weilllife photographers will never admit that,

but it's true. I've got a friend of mine, Peggy, from Vancouver Island, and she she's a beautiful, wonderful photographer, and she is out there, so she's found those creeks. Her partner at ADS seen a squats in the distance at one time, and she shared with me an imprint that She's like, well, you know what I'll bear do it. Look what happened here, and it would add the right dimensions to to one and it was big and anyway,

on and on and on. But she came up over a hill one day and there was a cougar on an oak kill and she nailed it. She wasn't there long, but she nailed it. So she's one of the few people that I know that truly got lucky with that. If we're having so much trouble with normal natural animals to get these shots, just imagine how difficult it is to deal with something suspicious that doesn't like technology in

general and doesn't appreciate us more often than not. In other words, they don't we can surprise them once in a while. She did that. How in the world did that juvenile react when he came up upon it? And by the way, it was approximately five feet or a little taller, and he guessed maybe one hundred and fifty pounds, and the inches on that particular foot were just a little over ten inches, And that's interesting because half of

ten is five. I came into some impressions on an individual that was said I found out later to be six feet seven because the guy measured the curst of his head over on the tree. Well, the impressions that I found fresh the next day were thirteen inches and interestingly six point five wide, so there's another two to one five feet apart. So I had no doubt that he saw what he saw just because of the impressions of the grass. He did not know anything about the

subject matter whatsoever. Getting back to the photography aspect, I would love to help people with it, place like nobody needs your help because everybody knows everything. So I'm very quiet and just kind of okay, all right, if you want to talk, I'm here. And it's amazing how a little communication I get without inspiring it myself. You know, I've got dear friends and we're all busy in economics and you know all that stuff. There's only twenty four

hours in a day. But it's interesting. With the photography aspect. I've got a four hundred millimeter Canon lens in the eighteen megapixel camera. Now I'm gonna bowl that up to thirty as soon as I can grab another ten hundred bucks to buy a used one. Not buy all my equipment used simply, but be careful who you buy it from. You want to buy it from somebody who bought it as a social status. In other words, Hey check this out.

I've got this and it's a sound Yeah, and you know, take it out once around shooting at a party and realize, well, the street Vagina lens isn't so good at a party because it's so far away and I don't really have that interesting pros and shade and crows and the ravens, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. So then that stuff is usually sold and because it's usually high bucks, and if the guy wants to get rid of it. It's a lower price, and that's the way I child with mind.

But anyway, I've got a good friend, Jeff Yellick, you may know, out of Colorado, and he photographed a individual there was in a pine tree or conifer, and he had rocks thrown at him. I believe that might have been twigs or eight coins. I forget specifically, he got footprints and this was repeated behavior from this particular spot. He had a two hundred and roughly a two hundred and fifty millimeters zon whens cannon, and he told me,

I forget. But it wasn't a giant expensive camera. It was one that anybody could acquire, much cheaper than the cell phones that we all yield. Not me. I only have hundred dollars cell phones because they do what I needed to do. But a lot of people are punching thousand dollars or eight hundred dollars in their cell phones. And uh, well, he got the general direction of where this thing was, and he shot a number of pictures, and then he took him home and he blew him up.

By golly, he got the face. Alex L. Evans is a wonderful friend of mine, who, along with Sabylla Irwin, are incredible witness detail artists. From descriptions, I'm gonna talk a little bit about Svila in just a movement. But anyway, Alex took the time to redesign the face behind the there. But that's one way of doing it. But we have to be able to shoot so that the resolution is tight and good, so when you blow it up, it doesn't make a pixel out and you get whatever you

want to see. In the case of Sibylla, she I consider her best illustration from local and I forget the Bufroro investigator's name. I wrote it to town. He called her and he was looking at a six foot individual approximately. His name is Jerry Jerry dreamed. She called her and said, hey, you got some time. Yeah, well, I'm looking at one. And so then she was able to draw with him what she saw direct or what he saw directly. There

was another observer as well. This guy was sitting behind a three foot brush, a b rock pile or whatever, peeking around a tree at the sky. He was raish brown, and she drew it up and so to me, that is likely the most accurate illustration she got because not only did she have the witness close at hand, he

was looking at it while she was drawing it. Now, what's interesting here is when Shane came out that day in years later, I talked with him repeatedly about his experience with that instrument, who was very black and dark, and I said, what's the closest illustration that you've seen to this sky because I want to draw him or I want to make some adjustments on somebody else's And he pointed to that particular illustration with Sibylla made, which

to me is very dynamic. And he said that one of the eyes looked closer to it than the other, the hairline was higher up the face than the one in Oklahoma. Other than that, it was almost to a tea.

for instance. Such a change in dynamic there in the behavior there seems to be, in my opinion, a cutoff or a separation between the mainstream bigfoot research world and a lot of the stuff that's actually taking place, especially in rural areas on private property.

I wonder if it's a critical situation and you get some people that come in there with more aggressive tendencies, how's that going to help the people that live there? You know? So, I mean there's no doubt there are people that have sasquats on their properties without any activity, I mean, without even any knowledge that they're there, like none,

We had no idea they're there. You know. I've got a buddy of mine, Jee Vernon, who did a book called Adam Cowney's big Foot Front or Foe, Uh you didn't He was in Wisconsin, Live too far from where I lived. I live across Wisconsin now, I used to live farther south, and my feeling was, well, we've got bearer here and we've had cougar reports all the way through the sixties. Dan I doesn't acknowledge it, and they'll

even take your evidence. Well they were until recently. Now they're finally opening it up and promoting the fact that oh, yeah, there's male cougar's come through, but they don't find me. It's so, we certainly don't have a significant population. That's a great pr state. But if we can't handle the expansion of eastern cougar moving into Tennessee, Kentucky, Georgia and over, you know, in the eastern States, and obviously they're in Florida, but the surrounding states there, how the heck are we

gonna deal with the ape man? So I guess my statement here is, how is it We've got so many places with people that have private properties with this activity, and how do they deal with it? Well, I was I forget his name, but he works with Joe Doyle

and Southern Illinois. Edwards meebe Bryce said it. Yeah he had talked to Yeah, yeah, yeah, I had listened to the broadcasts actually yesterday and just enjoyed it immensely, And in time, I'm hoping to reach out to him in Joseph friend of mine, So because i like to chart all these different footprints, because I'm extremely interested in that.

Going going back to all these people that have activity on their private properties, I think in my case, i'm just as I'm interested in meeting as many of them as I can, because I think that's your base, and that's where you can learn so much. You allow for all the individual variations of the people that have to deal with this, plus the individual variation of the of disass clatches that are you know, actively involved in either

disappearing or once in a while making a present snow. So, state by state it seems like there's different tendencies a little bit maybe, but in general it's a big wave of the same thing. But then when you look at some billa's funeraltic descriptions, it's like, this thing has a eight nose, looks like a gorilla, is thought to be a gorilla, And I've had people literally really aggressive telling me they are gorillas, And then I have other contacts

that tell me I thought it was a person. It looked exactly like a person, but with hair, and you know some of the barb shoop over in Washington. Her first observation was a gorilla. She was convinced it was a gorilla. She could not believe it wasn't a girla How could this gorilla get loose from the suit? And over time there were others that didn't look like that at all. So in my mind, we've got a species complex. I was just talking to my buddy Kenny Jaholski, was

a cultural anthropologist last night. We talked two hours and he has seen some and he's got some nice technical terms regarding disinterpretation of what's going on, as so many do. And you know, I'm telling you more. We won't know exactly, but I'm not in mins. We're dealing with the same darn thing across the board from here to Alaska down to South America.

Fred Rail up there. And I was real curious because I, you know, everybody's pushing how aggressive they are in Alaska. And so my first question was, well, in all those reports that Fred's got, he's got a two hundred and seventy five plus and I listened to every one of them this last year. I wanted to know what damage are they doing to the vehicles? It must be horrendous. Well, I checked all the bushplanes. Nothing, couldn't find one damaged bushplane.

You know, you'd think a giant rock would be smashing away. I went to snowmobiles, found two snowmobiles to one twisted and vertically slammed into a snowbank, and then a number of other snowmobiles that were turned over, knocked over, maybe thrown, not too much damage. Once in a while the tracks have been pulled off and be put back on. Okay, there was one. I didn't find one skiff that was destroyed or hurt so that it couldn't go back and be a skiff. I didn't as far as the sledge

being thrown across the yard. That happened from an enraged individual. Apparently, I was also looking at okay with no, they're damaging buildings, what's the circumstances. Nobody's in the buildings when they damaged them badly. Jeeve Vernon had this happen when his dad was gone. He took the bulldozer and he went up the hill and he put together a really cool three sided cabin that he was going to construct further. Well, it wasn't too many weeks and they went up there

and it was destroyed. And he did have running with that particular male individual. It was over seven feet tall. I since followed him out when he moved to Arizona and we got to talk with him further. So I know him quite well and I have no I have no feelings of him, just in the this to make a book, and anybody who writes a book, most people aren't making much money off it. So you got that.

And then getting back to the Alaska situation, the description, so many of the descriptions seem to be away like giant apes in the and withal faces. Okay, that's interesting. The only aggression that I could find where somebody really was likely to get hurt and the reports from Fred was there was one fellow that was sused to be twelve feet night shot through the walls of this and he grabs an aspen and jams it through a eighteen by eighteen inch window. Anybody standing in front of that

would have been impaled, you know. So there's some serious danger there, and of course they shot at it, so you kind of expect their retribution that way. The next thing that happens is in that same report, they're getting ready to leave in tank tank tink, little small rocks are hitting the generator. In my mind, I would expect giant rocks and trumps of wood or something being you know, destroying the whole place. And it didn't get that. Now, was it just did the big guy go and then

the kids came in and just messed around. No idea, but it to me, it's like if you if you utilize respect in any way, it seems like you'd be a lot better off will with total agitation, you know. And there's a lot of firearms and a lot of prod people in Alaska, and I'm sure a lot of scared people. So you're telling me.

of the country. And for years you heard about the aggressive bigfoot in southeastern Oklahoma and Texas, and it's that same type mindset and those same type environments, you know, where people are living in the wild, so to speak, and the behavior is just different. Whenever bigfoot crosses paths with humans in those type areas, the reaction can be extremely different. And oh yeah, I think that usually dictates the outcome of the interaction is the person and their behavior and their response.

did you choose me? And he goes, well, I said, did you? I guess? Thank you? He said, you seem to be somebody who was respectful general just had the kind of demeanor that I'm looking for, because if we're we don't utilize that demeanor, then maybe we're pushing buttons we shouldn't be pushing. These are my words, not change. But it's just that that's just validated what I already felt. I knew, and it's always worked for me. Did I have rocks? Do it mean while I was visiting? Yes?

Was I frightened? Not at all totally appreciative. You know, it's like quite else, do something else, have fun. I was in Georgia in twenty twenty. I went down to see Keith Burden and some of these guys, and they had numerous people there in the past, and they did some successes and they had interactions with a very large meal and so I was really looking forward to this. The twenty twenty was a big year for me. Had

I had activity in Arkansas. I'm back in Missouri with Shane and Brandy, and so I drived down there on a whim and the group kind of disabanded quickly, just there two days and gone. So I stayed nextra night alone. In that particular night, I just literally talked to the boys and I said, Okay, I believe you're here. I have my cooler out here. If you want some, it's all yours. And I said, well, do me a favor, just let me know you're here somewhere in this That

would be fun. And at two o'clock in the morning, I got the biggest wham on my U made the vehicle rock. And I'm happy because now maybe I'll get a chance to have one looking at which on one hand, I dread, and on the other I wanted this so bad, and so I'm just laying there looking at the windows for the next two hours nothing, So I just go

to sleep. That's it. And I was thinking about just laying out in the open, but I didn't primarily because I'll be honest, we got a cougar sighting on red Feet from campsite the night before, so I didn't do that.

There's been a number of times where I could have should have looked, and just kind of I was back in Tennessee on that trip that I told you about with the rock in the cave, and we were around a pond and I was listening to the cricket frogs ago, which are in dangerous species in Wisconsin but very prevalent farther south to go, and I'm enjoying that, and all of a sudden, in the gully, I'm not too far

from stick snaps and I am talking like gunshot. All of us had a hair on our arms standing up, and I couldn't get myself to take twenty steps to go look down the gully. So I'm very embarrassed over that, and I shouldn't be telling it publicly, but hey, that's the way it is. So I think it happens with a lot of people in certain situations. I've had private conversations.

bullieve had faces in the window. And I think there's a ton of people out there in that situation. Who do you tell? You know? So I'm trying to think of another one for oh okay, I did have a visual. Finally, I was asked talking Alabama last year. This year, it's already almost twenty six it's just unbelievably fast this year. But it was June sixth that I get in the presentation. Then I called Rick Rellis, who's a good friend of mine. In the affer because he deals with a lot of

people and he was based in Wisconsin. Listen North Carolina now. But anyway, he said he I had earlier spoke to the buffero on one of their expeditions, and they asked me to come in and talk. And that's why I finally got shake Hane's and Brick. And he told me about a fellow in Tennessee, and I wanted to follow up on that, and so I ended up visiting a fellow in Tennessee. And one of the most interesting things about that I had vocalizations and a couple of visuals.

There was a fella had his photography equipment there one day. It was there a long time, and he took it down, went back to the house, and he came back down the hill later on next day and here is a structure emulates his tripod with a camera that they had built in place of it. So that's interesting. From that day, I ended up staying alone the interstate in Kentucky. I was gonna stop and see friends around Cincinnati, but I

didn't give their heads up, so I didn't. So I went to visit my friends up in Northern Indiana and I hung out with them he had some other daughter team, and I'd had experiences there before Sin Footprints, I got vocalizations and since seen structures, and I don't know what to think about structures, but after working with Shane, I feel more comfortable with them. But I'm very, very suspicious of most of them. But obviously some of them can't

be done by people without equipment. If there's no equipment marks or place to get equipment in, then we're left or whatever it is that we're left with. So I'm hanging out with her and we're gonna go visit her daughter soon. And the husband leaves after a wonderful supper, and we're reminiscing and catching up, and it's about seven point thirty seven when I noticed through the there's blinds in the window, and the sun's starting to go down, and the husband walks by fast, and he walks by

and he's heading toward the door. So as I'm looking at that, it'd be like a cartoon where you've got the cloud of information that the person or the subject says, mine would have been filled with this question marks, question marks, question marks as to what in the heck am I seeing? And then the husband does walk in a minute thirty eight seconds after because I timed it, and he comes into the green shirt and I promptly asked him what's going on? Who is out there? And he goes, there's

anybody out there? There's nobody here. I'm like, oh, okay, and I told him I just saw a figure and I thought it was you, but then I realized it wasn't. He goes, okay, but he didn't believe me. Now there's nobody there. So I looked over at her and I said, you saw the look on my face and she goes, yeah, I know he saw one. I like, you think so, and she goes, I'm sure you did. I'm like okay, And I asked her if she'd go over and walked the path so I could look out the window to

see she's five one couldn't see her. Next thing, I go out, she sits in the chair. She can barely see the top of my cap. I walk over and out turns out there's a tree with the flowers in it, which I presume is a flowering dog with but I'm going to get that verified eventually. As I walk over to it, I can see that these flowers are at least seven feet off the ground. And what's interesting is the integument, the increments of that blind. I was looking

out the window at or in. There were ten segments, and the flowers were in the second segment. This figure was in the fourth segment. So that puts this figure perhaps eight feet approximately. First I thought it was seven, but once I realized the light of the flowers, I upped it. And then as far as the look a winky look, short hair, reddish brown uniform, I didn't see any variation in here, long hair, No, sure, I didn't see. Part of my vision was obscured by the blinds, you know,

the blind across the window. But to see this figure go by, it was a gliding motion that leaves you going. You know, that doesn't even look real. That's strange. And as it did this, it was one, two, three gone. And so on one hand, I'm really happy if that's

what that was, I presume. So given the secondary evidence we have from that site, we'll get small footprints over by the garden with a sister or daughter, and then she'll hear vocalizations coming out of the ravines, and then as you cruise the area over time, there are numerous there are numerous structures, and I saw amount of walnuts over one hundred pounds, which may or may not have anything to do with it, given the you know, collection

capabilities of squirrels and chipmunks and et cetera. Were people for that matter, But anyway, it was an interesting experience and I just thought.

two or four forty eight. A driver along the road was just driving in Washington and it was Gray Harbor County, I believe, and deer ring out front of him and behind it a big name all of eight feet, and the deer got away. The man went to the side of the road. In the meantime, the driver, amazed, stopped, slowed down, and he made a gesture either waved to it or something, and the individual stopped, turned and faced him. It was back lit, and it went she ah, and

then it made gestations with uh. It made uh, you know, hand signals in the sense of pushing him away, and that was interesting. But one of the physical the guy drew what it looked like to him. And I've talked to Scott about this. Eventually, Scott's gonna let me talk to the talk to this fellow. But anyway, he uh, he was backlit and he had a round skull, but he had a dummed head. Well it was the hair

formation on its dead. So that leads me to wonder, how many of these really just have a hairstyle that makes them look like they have a doomed head. Yeah, so that's that's a question. Some of these domed heads are bolt so so you've got that aspect too. So we know that there's some differentiation in some of the phenotypes.

But knowing our phenotype with our small dwarfs, you know in the congo or pigmy tribes, and then we have all the variation with all the different continents, and we've got you know, Australians being having Native Australians having dinnisuban in them apparently, and so me, I'm Norse, so I've got presumably the innerthal of me. I haven't done anything DNA, And it's just amazing variation we share with our professional athletes. Ah,

what is the extreme variation of them? I think we're still finding out.

old dogs. Man, It's still confusing as it was day one.

I think I just noticed today I was kind of reviewing a few things and I noticed a zookeeper was replying to somebody who asked a question about a intelligence, and the zookeeper said, well, if you give a gorilla in captivity a screwdriver, he will play with it kind of forget it. If you give it to a chimpanzee and he'll probably eventually end up stabbing another chimpanzee with it. But if you give it to an rangitang, you'll probably hide it and then try to take a stage apart

with it. I thought that was an interesting comparison, and obviously there's an individual variation among all three groups. But uh, what wonderful position we're in with the capability of communication we have with all of our technology. Of course Randy with his night drones, and it's many other people with high class equipment, but we're still not getting it done.

we're staring at you. And so many of these have been misinterpreted as stumps turned out to be real, and of course, unfortunately it works the other way way too much, where it's a stump but oh no, it's got to be a Scotch, but it's a stump. So anyway, you've got your high resolution camera over the telephoto on a tripod or on a rock or on a tree limb, and you're able to take super dynamic photographs. In time,

somebody's going to be able to do that. But it's like putting the proper photographers in the proper situation at the proper time seems to be the formula, and that's not happening much. And if it is, we're certainly not senior photographs. That's why the Jeff Yellick photograph, to me, is one of the prize pieces of example of that so far.

it's not pre internet. Now we can talk to somebody Alaska in five minutes or somebody is somewhere around the world. So really, if we're smart, it seems like we combine its and wisely plan a few things to learn more. And I'm in a situation where I'd mentioned I had some unusual things happen. I'll give you the last weird thing that happened. And I have relatives fortunately the DevD experiences, so my family knows. So I feel comfortable about that

because before it's like, are you just the nut? You know? In this case, I was out with a group in Wisconsin and we had elk were introduced into this area, so we were greeted with an elk crossing the road before we got there. That first night we got there, we did a lot of socializing and relaxing and we meet comfortable, but we get vocalisitions from the campsite there. And this is interesting in the sense that when things calmed down, we had people go north and a half

miles away. I was told later at times ten o'clock. The second night, I had something to me incredible happened. But the first night, everybody was up in late, and we wound up going to bed really late. And I got up at five o'clock and warned the whiz and I opened the car door, and as my feet hit the ground, I heard people talking. And that was a little unusual because I was assumed everybody sleeping, But you don't know that behind it I heard, And I don't

have any explanation for what that was at all. I do believe we've got somebody who recorded that, but we were trying to find the exact recording. So far we haven't. The next night, people had love for these trips north fifteen miles or let's see north of us two point five miles away. Fifteen total people. We ended up with four of us in camp. One guy went to sleep in the camp. Three others were with me. Good friends,

wonderful friends. They sided. I had to go to the edge of the meadow and sit at the edge of the trees to listen. And I liketed to stay at the campfire alone because I'm hoping. And off they went. And as they left, I thought to myself, I shouldn't even say this, I should say that at all, but true, I thought to myself, Okay, this is perfect. I am all alone. If you're here, would you let me know, Matt, I'm that kid. A less thans a minute to two minutes.

Somewhere in that timeframe, I got the most perfect across the meadow a tenth of a mile away at the woods life at the woodline. Now the other people were itself, and we verified your location, and I'd mentioned the locations of the other place, and I was filled to us. It's happiness that I wasn't smart enough to come back with, Wow, that was great. Could you do it again? So coincidence confirmation? I have no idea, but all I can tell you is that was the second hoop I've ever heard anywhere.

And I've listened to hundreds of hoops on the air, on you know, recordings, but that was the best, fun it's coolest hoop I ever heard. So I'll just put an exclamation mark on that with a big question mark, and then I'm going to tell you that two days after Christmas in twenty three, I was with a dear friend and we were hanging out. We'd walked eight miles that day. We got wood knocks, We found a skull

that she moves around a lot. She'll put it up on the extended branch over a tussock in a swamp, and then she'll come back and they'll be down in the swamp, her down on the t and there's like at least four feet between, you know, the two. And she'll do this regularly through the week, and so something is playing with her. We've got feathers, we've got a couple of branches apparently gifted to us, supposedly. And then that night I came out of the house and there

were cala calling. There's no caleer, so that was really interesting. From there, we took a walk and it's temperature wise, it is I believe twenty three decrease and fifteen mile in our winds. As we get toward the pine Woods twenty a quarter a mile and a half mile away, she says, something just pushed me I'm like, okay, you are right. Yeah. And as soon as that happened, I walked up on her and I started smelling flowers and I'm surprised, and I look over at her and I go,

do you smell anything right now? She smiles of me and she goes, yeah, smell flowers just like you do. Did, And I'm like okay, And I thought this is odd. So I pull out digital recorder one, start talking into it. It's done. Pull out digital two. It's done. Almost immediately we get wood knocks, and then she goes look at that and there's a bright blue ball of light zipping through the woods first time, only time for me or or whatever, no idea, And we didn't have any more

incidents there for that night. But that really resonated with me. Is this sounds a lot like some of the pre internet stuff I had read in Green's book, specifically with the batteries. I've talked to other people privately, they as well have experiences. Maney won't talk about it. So yeah, we got a different flavor going on in that situation.

of doing it. After that, all I can tell you is that there's one report in particular out of Ohio that when I was getting ready to leave and left, I uh, and I left on her what I would call it controversial a situation and something I wasn't comfortable sharing with everybody. So I just kind of like a bowed out and it was like, oh, and that was fine,

because that was my plan. Anyway. What happened was there was a man who was you know, who described his situation and about how he had a communication with a female when he was like five years old and she was assuring him that he was okay. That particular report

somehow made it into the public edition of reports. Now, whether that was edited or adjusted, I don't know, but I know it's taken a long time for him to come to the service publicly with references to orbes right, and that is now apparently okay to discuss.

mental epathy. Something along those lines could be. I have no clue, but there's a lot of work to do. So it's a great mystery. And you know, there's no reason to stop when you've got some successes because I think the human nature is we want more.