Big Food and Beyond.
With Cliff and Bobo. These gays a favorites, so like say subscribe and rade.
It I star and the greatest con.
USh today and listening a watching lim always keep its watching. And now you're hosts Cliff Berrickman and James Bobo Fay. Hello everybody out there in Bigfoot and Beyond Land all squatchkatiers who have tuned in. This is Bigfoot and Beyond with Cliff and Bobo. However this week it is only Cliff. Bobo is on a field investigation. I guess something about a fly fisherman was chased out of an area and
goodness knows what's happening. I got a frantic phone call from Bobo the other night explaining his inavailability this week, so he is not going to be available for a podcast, so it is up to me. But I guess that's part of the reason we have two hosts on this podcast, so in case one of us is out doing something in the woods, the other one can cover for them. So that's what we have going. So it's Bigfoot and Beyond with Cliff and occasionally Bobo when he's not in
the field. And this week you got me. You got Cliff. I'm coming at you from the North American Bigfoot Center and Boring, Oregon, and today I have a witness that I met personally, probably with this past summer or something like that. I don't remember. I could check my notes, you know, I only have so much ram I don't remember as much as I used to. So anyway, this guy, his name, his name is not John, but that's what
we're going to be calling him today, John Doe. Essentially, this gentleman came into the shop at some point in the last six months and shared his two bigfoot encounters with me. Of course, we put a pin on the wall at the location in our public map so everybody can check out where that is approximately. Because our map isn't detailed enough to give away any spots, it just kind of gives you a good idea where things are happening. But this gentleman John came in and he shared the location.
And I'm very familiar with the location. There's a ton of bigfoot reports from very close by to this location, and we're not going to tell you where that is either, unfortunately, because he lives there and he doesn't want you know. Our kind tinfoil hat wearing weirdos, sniffing around in the woods, or god forbid, people with guns cruising around shooting at bipedal figures in the dark. That could be he or his family. It could. Yeah, so we don't want that,
or nor his neighbors for that matter. But anyway, this guy's very credible. I spoke to him at length the first time he came in the shop, and he visited a few weeks ago, and I thought that this guy would be a great guess for Bigfoot and beyond because his stories are so bone chilling in a couple of ways. And you'll see what I'm talking about in a minute. The location, though, we're not going to tell you where that is, but we will tell you it is in
the foothills of Mount Hood. I think that's close enough. I mean, I wouldn't want you to know where I lived either, so I wouldn't tell you where I live beyond that detail foothills of Mount Hood, but it's not far away. So this is an area I'm very familiar with, and a ton of big Foot stuff happens there. And I was thankful to get two reports from less than what probably two miles away from each other. I think
or even closer. But we'll get into that. This is definitely a cluster and an area that we are keeping a close eye on here at the North American Bigfoot Center for more reports in the area. So if you're listening, you have reports from the foothills of Mount Hood, come on into the NABC and share it with us and we'll compare notes and see if it's the same area or not. But in the meantime, here is not John,
but that's what we're gonna call him. Hey, John, thank you very much for coming into the shop today and talking to me.
Thanks, Cliff, I appreciate you have me in that it's it is, Yeah.
It is, it is what it is close enough to me. John, tell us a little bit about yourself, obviously not too much, because we don't want people to know who you are, and you know you're you want to keep protect your identity, and of course keeping witnesses anonymity is far more important than the information they tend to share. I have your name, that's all that matters. I know you're a real person.
I'm looking at you right now because this is one of these rare podcasts where we're doing it in person. So anyway, John tell us, maybe a little bit about yourself to give a little bit of background.
Okay, Well, I was raised in the Pacific Northwest, as we know, eastern Moltnoma County, in the foothills of Mount Hood. Like you said, currently, I'm thirty six, and my first encounter happened twenty years ago. The summer I was fifteen. My dad and I had had some trouble with locals, probably high school kids, I don't know, running their quads
or their pickups up into the woods. I got to say that back in the eighties, there was some logging in the property next door, a very large parcel I'm assuming one hundred and forty acres or something like.
That they had, and there were.
The logging roads were still there, kind of overgrown, and it connected to our property, road system, trail system all that and went to a couple of different highways. So over the years, even though the brush had come down, there had still been high schoolers that were out there trying to open the roads back up and going wheeling, which wasn't a big deal except for the litter, and it connected to our property, and so they found those roads,
you know. So we were trying to block off the access points, and we'd had some trouble with them on the trails, them leaving litter behind and making a mess, and we had kind of secured the entrances to those logging roads. And I remember I was at home alone. We had two dogs, two Rottwilders. They were tied up, both of them. And I had heard some sounds that the sound really carries well out there across a valley.
It's I don't want to say too much because they'll give away the location, but there's a valley with two mountain peaks, small mountain peaks on either side, and I was going to say the sound travels really well across that valley. I was hearing some sounds out there, sounded like some trucks out there, and I said, okay, well here we go. We got another problem out there. So I walked out there and I walked the trails and it was a good mile or better, probably over a
mile a mile and a half or something. Just as the crow flies across to the other end, I hiked the trail system, couldn't find anything. It was coming back and it was getting It was May of two thousand and I was coming back up with one of those peaks down across the valley and up to our homestead, and I had made my way up through the woods up to the top and it was an area that we uh, like I say, covered all the time. It was a place that we my sister and I hung
out all the time, where we always those woods. It was definitely not a strange environment to us. I was used to being over all the time. A lot of big, heavy timber, a lot of ground cover salal Oregon grape wine maple. I came up to the top of the first peak, started down through the valley and there, I'm sorry, not across the valley, down the hillside to the valley,
which was heavy timber. Well, like I say, a lot of really heavy vine maple that was really twisted together, and a lot of a lot of ground cover that you cannot cover easily. A lot of old growth snags that are laying down you gotta climb over them, a lot of turned stumps. It's really it was back then, a really.
A real challenge.
And of course to get down through this and it would take you once you went down the slope to the valley where they headlogged I'm guessing probably distance wise, probably a thousand or twelve hundred feet, I would guess, all the way down into the valley, at least where I hiked to. I came down through the woods, climbed over all this old growth and through everything, and I got down into the clearing and it was about dusk.
I don't know what time it in May. I guess it'd probably be about four or five o'clock.
I'd guess maybe somewhere in there, yeah, maybe later, who knows.
Yeah, But there was still quite a bit of light in the sky, so I could see things clear. And I had just come down through the woods and I heard a sound up top where i'd just come from from the very top, right directly behind me, and I heard something stirring around up there in the brush, and I stopped for a minute. I could it was definitely audible.
I could. I could.
I could hear something definitely moving through all the slough and the Oregon grape up up top. It was very noisy, and I figured it was an elk up there. And then it started moving my direction and it started getting louder, and I thought, oh, well, this is cool, and so I stopped and I listened to it, and it came down the hill towards me, but off to my left. I think it started going off to my left and it started picking up a lot of noise, and I thought, this is going to be a hurd of elk. And
I thought, well, this is cool. I'm gonna stand here and watch them, and they're gonna come running down through the trees. And we were used to seeing herds of elk and deer run through the woods and a lot of noise, you know, and they just we were used to seeing ten to twelve and I heard, you know,
and it's just a cool thing to watch. And so I was getting ready for that, and then all of a sudden, the noise went through the roof, and I remember I was hearing an incredible amount of noise and it was coming from one source.
I remember it.
It wasn't over a vast area of brush. It was one object.
And I like, you'd expect a herd of elk to have a like a sheet of noise righting at you, but this is one individual thing, one individual thing, sound of a herd of elk.
And it was incredible, and it was noisier than I heard of elk. I'd never heard so much track in my life. And it started and it picked up speed, and this was where it really got me, because instantly, I remember my heart just sank and I thought, I don't know what this thing is because it charged. It just barreled down the mountain at me, and it it wasn't going off to my left anymore. It was coming directly at me, and so I knew it wasn't by chance it knew where it was going to you. It
was coming straight to me. And that thing covered that distance. I mean it came barreling down the mountain. I mean just jumping over all that brush and blowing through it. And I knew that right away. I didn't know what I was dealing with, and I knew I didn't have
any elk anymore. I didn't know what it had, but it came down through me, down through the brush, straight at me, and I remember halfway down it connected with a tree, and I don't know if it was a snag or a live tree or what, but I remember it made contact with that thing and it exploded into a million pieces. It was like dropping a whole armful of kindeling, and you could hear all the fibers hitting against each other as they just went in every direction.
It was do you think it like a snapped a tree or rolled one over or I think that you interpret the sound as.
It sounded like it came in contact with maybe a small tree and hit it blunt force and it just went everywhere.
So just like this tree splintering and exploded, just exploding like that, and all the fibers bouncing off that that sound they have, and that was enough.
I turned around and ran back. There was a snag there, an old buckskin that was laying on the ground, probably a five foot log, and I ran dough behind that thing to try to get out of sight. You're hiding, Yeah, yeah, I was like, I'm out here. This is not cool. And I remember, because the speed it was coming down the mountain, I realized I didn't know what I was dealing with. But I realized I'd made something mad and
here it was coming half for me. And that was the worst feeling ever because it was exactly I think, yeah, I don't know what this thing is, but here it comes, and.
You're pretty certain you knew about everything out there. Yeah, yeah, you said, cougars and the bear and everything else.
I'd never experienced anything like this, this kind of an aggression, and it covered that span I'm guessing just say more or less one thousand feet. I would guess the reason I say a thousand feet is our driveway on the property is exactly a thousand feet down blow the house down to the highway, so I would say it's at least a thousand, probably more like eleven hundred feet from the top down to where I was standing. And it covered that ground in about seven seconds.
Wow. Okay, so it was really moving.
And that's why I realized I had nothing that I'd ever encountered before.
And you still haven't seen this thing either. I hadn't seen it.
It was coming directly at me, and I said, oh, okay, this thing is going to pop out here in the clearing here in just a matter of seconds.
And peeping over that log that you were hiding, I was.
I was looking over the top, and I had a walkie talkie with me, just one though, just one pretty useless.
Well, I had to be fair you.
Well, I know it wasn't doing any good. I don't know why I took one, but.
I understand I don't like listening to what I'm other people listening to what I say either.
So I you know, well, I had left went back at the house, okay, on they're both on.
Okay, that makes sense.
And I thought, well, my folks should be home at some point, my dad should be around, and I waited until this thing came down out of the clear out of the brush. There there was some really heavy brush at the edge of the woods, and there was a great big stack of limbs, of rocker limbs and brush
from when they had logged the summer before. And the stack of limbs was probably it was a rolls big tall haystacks, I'm guessing probably fifteen twenty feet tall and quite wide, probably that wide, a typical haystack.
Yeah, but it's like a slash pile. Slash pile where the loader sat and they loaded the trucks.
And it came I remember, this thing came blown down out of the woods and it entered the clearing on the other side, directly behind that slash pile, so you still couldn't see it. I couldn't see it, and I thought it's going to come running around one side or the other. And as soon as it made its way into the clearing, all the noise stopped. It went completely dead silent. There was not one sound, and it never
made one more step. And there was no bird in the air, there was no squirrels, there was no typical noise in the woods.
That you would hear.
Then dark was encroaching, and dark wasn't approaching, and it was and I thought, okay, this is just spooky. I thought, this thing is gonna make a step, It's gonna come one way or the other. But I stayed put and it stayed put, and I couldn't see it stayed out of sight.
Stay tuned for more Bigfoot and beyond with Cliff and Bogo. We'll be right back after these messages.
And so I'm watching the sky. All my senses are on their peak, and I'm looking around and I'm waiting for something happened. Nothing happened. So I got on my radio and I was whispering on there. I was trying to get a hold of my dad. I hoped he was home by then. And nothing. Nothing, And I tried several times, and I said, okay, I'm out here on my own with this thing. And I waited a few more minutes and there was no sound, and I thought, okay, well I am getting out of here, and how.
Long do you think of elapse? Like? What was that standoff? Like that time period there? See your best guests, because I'm sure it seemed like an eternity.
It seemed like forever, but it was more than probably up bet, I was probably there a good ten minutes. Ten minutes, I'll bet I waited that long.
I'll be an eternity.
It was an attorney. Oh, it seemed like forever, and I thought, nope, I'm waiting for that thing to make the first move. I thought, maybe it's going to go away from me. I thought, there's no it's come this far. It probably isn't going to turn around and walk back. But I thought, I want to see what I'm looking at. I want to know what I'm dealing with here.
Yeah.
I waited for it to come on inside that pile or the other and nothing, and I was watching the sky and it was starting to get the light was starting to go a little bit, and I said, okay, well I can't stay here much longer. I waited, and at that time of night, you start losing your light pretty quickly. But I knew I still had some time, but I had quite a bit of ground to cover.
I still had half a mile, I would guess, And I knew I had to quite a bit of brush to go through and everything, and so I didn't want to be out there in the black with this thing. So I turned and I got up, and I looked directly below me was a skitter trail, skiter road that took off down into the very bottom of the valley. It was still probably good four or five hundred feet away from me, the bottom of the very bottom there, and there was an old well down there from settlers
way back in the day. And it was very clear. Like I said, they had just logged the summer before, so the road was very clear. There was a lot of old, bleached out rocker limbs on it, and I made some quick glances as to where I was going. I didn't want to step on anything that was going to snap or pop or give my location away anymore
than I had to. I kept my eyes on that pile, and I got it very slowly and quietly, and worked my way over to the skitterer trail, and I walked down it, and stepping only on the bare dirt and made sure I didn't step on anything that was gonna pop or snap make any noise. And I continue to walk down that trail and keeping my eyes behind me. I never saw anything come out in the open. And I got down that trail, I would have to say, probably three four hundred feet down that road, and I
was feeling pretty good by myself. I said, okay, I've left this thing behind. It's staying there.
That's good.
The more distance I can put between myself and that thing, the better. And I was starting to feel pretty good about myself. I said, okay, good, I'm making some distance and getting along here. And on both sides of the skid road there was a lot of heavy brush, a lot of fine maple, a lot of dried out leaves and limbs and everything you know, typical you know, small hemlocks, and lots of noisy stuff. And you can never pass through without making any without making a life noise, you know.
I get down to the bottom of this skinter road and there's a t's into another one going left and right, and there was a great big old growth seed they had cut down, and the stump it was probably I want to say, five feet across four to five feet across at the butt, and but it was tall. It was probably I'm I'm six four and back during that summer. I want to make a note of this. Back during that summer, I was probably five six five seven.
Hey, you're a young man at the time. Yep, yeah, about what fifteen you said.
Yep, fifteen, almost sixteen. So I want to keep a note of that. And the stump was about my height, five and a half foot tall. I would guess the top of that stump was. I get around behind that stump. I'm just turning left and gonna work my way over across to our property line and work our way my way back up the trail system through the woods. And I turned left, got right behind that stump, and something came barreling out of the brush up behind me, up
that skinner road off in the bushes. Something had been over there, and it came jumping out of the bushes and landed on that road, that hard packed road.
Did you see this or did you hear it? I heard this? You heard this? Oh?
This thing it was like you were jumping off the side of a rock cliff into water or something. This thing had all its weight and force and it hit the ground.
And it had been stalking you, following you silently alongside without you even knowing, for that what four hundred feet or something like that. Exactly. This was what got really weird. And so you went behind this stump, thus putting you out of sight, and that's when it made a much larger, more obvious move.
Yep, Okay. It landed on the road, and I can't tell you how far up the road. I can't imagine it being more than about fifty feet away by the sound, by the sound, and by this it took three to four strides on two.
Feet toward me and grackling. Oh.
It sounded like Jurassic Park when the guy has the cup of water and they hear the boom boom.
Yeah, yeah, that and you're the goat tied up in.
The exactly right. And that's exactly. It was very heavy. You could hear the weight of this thing hit the ground when it did. It wasn't a multitude of feet like a bear would walk. It was one step after another, and it took about four strides. And I got down behind that stump on the ground, and I was hearing this thing coming. It sounded like I was out there with Android the Giant. I remember just thinking I'm dead. This thing is so close to me. I said, I
don't have a chance, and I reached down. I got a rocker limb, probably a three foot rocker limb. It was probably a three four inch diamond or something, and I said, okay, I got one swing at this thing. I'm gonna hit it as hard as I can, right in the face whatever it is. And I said, it's either coming around the stump or it's coming over the top. And it was. Again, it was coming directly in line with me. It wasn't trying to go make a wide sweep around this stump. It was coming right at me.
So I said, okay, this thing is going to come over the top of the stump. I said, I'm hit a full force and I got one swing at it, and that's going to be the end of me. My adrenaline was going through the roof. I said, oh man.
Yes, spoiler, he didn't die. He's sitting right here, I promise. Yeah.
And I said okay, and I waited, and like I say, it took about three steps. Pretty good strides, I would say, I would have to say it covered some ground. In those steps and that put him right on the other side of the stump. That put him directly on that side of that stump, and I could hear it. I said, oh man, he's right here. Whatever this is, it's right here. And I waited, and one more time that thing stood there and didn't make any more noise, and I just thought,
this is this is agony. This is going to go on forever. And I waited and I waited, and I just expected. I knew my life was over. I said, it is over. Whatever this thing is, it's huge and it's going to take me out. And I said, I got one crack at this. And I was waiting. I was crouched down, and well, that's a weird feeling when you know when you think you're done, when you think you're done, you're signing out. I just said, I got five seconds. I hope it doesn't take forever. That's not
killing me. And then nothing, nothing, nothing.
And it just stayed there. I stayed put.
It did too, and I was walking the sky and it was starting to get more the dusk was coming, and I said, I got to get out of here. I do not want to be down here on the black and I said, okay, I'm not going to look. I'm going to stand up. I'm not going to make eye contact with this thing. It's right there and it knows where I'm at. There's no trying to hide from this thing anymore. I said, I'm gonna turn around and put my back to it, and I'm going to walk
directly away from it. And I did that. Instead of going left up that skinter road up into our property, I decided to cut straight across the rest of the valley, pass that well and on up into the woods up to our rightway.
That was a more direct route to your house. Is that why?
It was a direct route to our gravel road?
Okay, So if you would have gone left, you would have been on your property sooner, But that wouldn't have brought you home sooner, right, Okay, I want to understand that. Okay, yep, it.
Would have put us me on the property, but I would have had to have hiked up the trail system. We got some tractor roads up in there, and they zigzag all over through the woods, and it would have put me in a lot darker area with bigger timber, and I did not want I wanted as much light as I could have with that thing. I wanted to be able to see as much as possible. So yes, that was a direct as most direct route as I could to a main road and then from there go
to the house. And I remember I just thought, Okay, I I got a walk. I cannot run from this thing. I think, I'm thinking this is a bear, I guess, because that's the only thing that's big enough.
Though, yeah, you were what were you thinking at that point? I mean, I know you thought you were gonna die. You didn't know what you were dealing with. But so a bear was your best guess.
Bear was my best guess. I thought, Okay, it's big, it's really heavy. It's stocking me. It's way too heavy for any cougar elk would never do this, Dear, anything I had encountered in the woods would never do this. I thought, bear is my only option.
What about a person? Any thoughts of it being a person at the time.
It well, I knew a person could never cover the ground it did. I couldn't certainly never run that fast. And I knew the woods. I was very agile in the woods. My sister both and I both and I knew nothing could cover that ground. Coming down that hill through the woods with all that brush fighting, the the vine maple and the log stuff. You guys had to climb up over logs that were five six feet tall.
You had to climb over. I knew no one.
There was no athlete that could make that, and so I know bears can run really fast downhill. I thought, that's my best bet. So that's what I was sticking with. I got, this is a really big bear. It didn't act like a bear sneaking around the woods being totally quiet, because bears are noisy in the woods. They clump around and there's all kinds of noise in the brush. They don't care about their how much racket they're making. So
that was very weird. I didn't know what I was dealing with, but I my only guess was I had a really big bear that was pissed to me.
And at this point, how far did you have to make it across the valley to get to the house.
I was probably a good I.
Know you closed some distance from the original, yeah.
But I was at this point. Yeah, it's hard to say I was a good. A couple of thousand feet from the house, I'd guess.
A quarter mile or something like that. Maybe, yeah, okay, probably still plenty far as it's getting dark. Thing is stalking you.
And I just thought, yeah, this is not good. I said, this is not a good situation.
This is swim across this pool. There's only nine sharks in.
It, exactly right.
How bad it goes the other side of the pool is. You can make that just sharks.
I know, right, how good a swimmer are you. That's a good time to walk on water. And so I turned put my back to it and I just walked directly in the line down across the valley and I had some good distance to go, and I knew I had to do that. I thought, I'm gonna do my best to not show any fear. And I'm not making
eye contact with it. I'm not looking at it. I said, if I look at it, it'll freak me out in the first place, and in the second place, it'll know I'm scared, and it'll just that'll be the end of me. So that's what my dad had always taught me. You just don't You can't run from uh. If you are dealing with a bear, you can't run from it. You gotta stick home. You gotta walk and try to be as calm as possible. And so I said, okay, that's
my best bet. So I turned and walked down across that valley through the brush and everything, and there was a whole bunch of rocker limbs, dead fur limbs that were bleached out. They lose their bark, and they're in the sun. It had been a year ago when they logged, and so the limbs had sat out there all this time and lost all their bark, and they were white like whalebones down across the valley here. So I got
down across there and up into the woods. I hiked up through the woods up to the road, and I'd put quite a bit distance between me and an.
And you didn't get in to hear it moving behind me or anything at that point.
And I tried it still, just try to watch where I was a step, and I just I know it. It could hear me, fine, but I felt better if I didn't make a whole lot of noise. And I put some distance between me. I put it's hard to say a good distance five hundred feet to a thousand feet probably behind me, I would guess. And I thought, okay, this is good. I'm still alive. So I got down across the valley, up through the woods, quite a distance up to our driveway. I thought, okay, I'm gonna look
back now. I said, I've made it this far. I don't hear anything behind me. I said, this is good. I've made it this far. I thought, maybe it has left me alone. And I turned and looked, and I looked back across that large section of a couple hundred feet, probably where all those white limbs were, and I can see this big black thing coming at me.
And it was just.
I didn't spend a lot of time looking at it. It was on all fours, it wasn't on two feet. But it was a big square object coming at me, a.
Big square shadow sort of thing growing through the clear cut with slim so it contrasted really nicely about the white background.
It was solid black and big and big and very square, and it didn't square very square like blocky, very broad shoulders, very different. And I thought, oh crap, this thing's still coming at me, but it was long ways away from me.
Stay tuned for more Bigfoot and beyond with Cliff and Bogo. We'll be right back after these messages, I had a lot.
Of distance between me and it, and I said, I think if it stays and it was moving pretty slow and.
Kind of creeping, or is it just kind of cruising at a slow pace or what would you describe its movement.
As It's hard to say because I had a lot of distance between me and it, but it was I don't know how to say it. It was moving, it was taking strides, but it wasn't going very fast.
It wasn't in a hurry. Did it move like a bear because it wasn't all fours and you must have thought that at the time, right.
I did, And it was far enough away, and I thought, okay, well it's a bear. It's a really big bear. And I was under the impression at that time of my life, I hadn't dealt with a lot of bears, and I was under the depression that bears could get that big. Until later years I started researching our local black bears, and they don't get that big. This was a discovery I made. I'm thankful I didn't know this back then, but I just figured it was a really big bear. So it was coming at me on all fours and
I said, Okay, it's still coming at me. I gotta go and I can't watch this any longer. And I turned and I was in a hurry then, but I was still walking, and I said, I my adrenaline was going, and I remember just thinking, I was just telling myself really sternly in my head, I said, I can run from this thing. I absolutely cannot run. It's still coming at me.
And you're within that You said you're at the top of the driveways. You're within a thousand feet of your house. Now, yep, I was almost in.
It was the lower part of the driveway, so I still had a good eight hundred feet to go. I would assume on the driveway up to the top or a crest, and then we have a pasture there and goes up to the house and to the crest of the hill there, I had probably eight hundred feet.
I would dissue, you're still quite a distance away, but to safety.
But it gets deeper, the road gets steep, the ground gets real steep. So I had I knew I had a challenge. I couldn't easily. I couldn't run, and I couldn't run, and I couldn't show a lot of fear and emotion and everything. I knew I had to stay calm, But I thought I got a lot of distance between me and this thing. I was eight hundred feet to the top, and I was probably eight hundred feet behind me. And I said, oh, I get I'm probably pretty good on this even though I'm going uphill, and it will
be able to cover ground faster. I thought, well, I'm probably a little bit safer, but I'm gonna keep booking. And I was at a very brisk walk. I was not calmly walking. I was like at a power walk. But I did not want to break stride into a run. And I remember I was in a full sweat and I was freaked out, and I was wanting to be out of there as quickly as possible. And I so I turned and I went up the driveway and I got about three hundred feet up the road and I
covered it very quickly. I turned around, and it had covered that ground amazingly quick through the woods. And I don't know if it changed direction. I don't know if it had instead of following me up to the road and then had traveled up the road behind me. I don't know if it had cut across the gap or what it did. I turned around and it was on the driveway with me, and it was, I want to say, probably thirty to forty feet behind me.
That is nothing.
It was nothing and it and it freaked me out that it had covered diamonds ground so quickly.
Yeah, you were power walking and it covered you said, about the same distance behind you as you had to go. It covered twice the distance that you did in that same amount of time. And now now it's thirty forty feet. I know the light is failing, but you must be able to see it better now.
It was standing in an area and where I was, and it was. It was an area where the trees overhead weren't very thick and let a lot of light in. And I remember looking back at this and it didn't look.
Like a bear. Was it still on all fours? It was on all fours.
It looked like a gorilla as far as I could tell. It had very broad shoulders when it walked. It didn't swing back and forth, have the the looseness of a bear height. It was very sold. It looked the way it walked or the way it was on all fours, it looked like a quarterback, a football player. And it had really big shoulders and they were very square, and its shoulders moved. It had very powerful shoulders and they moved. It looked like a gorilla you would see on a
national geographic or something. It was very square and the head was very blunt. I did not see a snout. I did not see a tan snout for a bear. The whole thing was black, and it was very wide. It was shoulder to shoulder. I would have to say the thing was four feet I would guess it was probably if it had come out beside me, it wouldn't have been much shorter than me on all fours.
And at the time you were five and a half feet, that was not five and a half, so that you're would five feet be a good guess.
I'd guess four and a half five foot tall.
This the height on all fours. Mind you, standing up on two legs, it would have just towered above you. Okay.
Interesting, it had been big, and that would have been right at the top of its back, on the back of its neck on all fours.
When it was on all fours, did like you know how like bears, for example, kind of are like bigger in the butt so to speak, Like you know, they're kind of pear shaped towards it. Like, how would you describe the body shape being on all fours. I'm curious about the posture of it was on all fours, it was.
Like I say, like a gorilla, huge, massive shoulders, smaller butt.
Now gorilla, when it's walking on all fours, the shoulder is much higher than the rear end, but the bears would almost be opposite of that. Right, Where was it in that sort of gradient?
The tail was lower than the shoulders not, I mean, I didn't stop really researching.
Your memory.
Yeah, the best my memory is the head was in line. The vertebrae in the head were all in line. I would say that the rear on this thing was at the same height of the shoulders or lower.
Okay, So kind of flatish across, maybe maybe almost horizontal or a little less.
And it was at an angle. It was going uphill the same as I was. It was a little bit of a pretty flatter area, right there, had a little bit of an incline, but I would say it was fairly flat. But yeah, the tail end of this thing was down lower than the shoulders.
Okay, here's another question that you may or may not know. And again I don't know. It is a great answer because it's obviously the truth. You know. But and you can't possibly not only remember everything, but notice everything in such a harrowing circumstance. Right when you saw this thing where the front pause, shall we stack the hands? Was it walking on an open hand or was it can we be walking on the knuckles? Notice that even.
From what I would say, is it looked like it had its knuckles, its hands curled into a fist and was walking on its fists. Okay, that's very interesting what I would say. And it and the face looked very flat to me.
It just was.
And it was solid black. This thing couldn't have gotten any blacker. There was no light skin on this. On the face of this.
You're just basically looking at a shadow when the feeling was solid black. That's creepy. It was.
I couldn't see an the eyes. I couldn't see anything. Now, I didn't want to get.
Close enough for me to see its eyes. But when you were close.
Y and I I mean that, that put me over the edge. I said, oh man, this thing is so close to me and it was covering even on all fours. I watched it. I just glanced back at it and I and I looked at it, and I watched taco stride. I gave it about one stride and it had I can't imagine it. It covered any less than about four feet to a stride of its arms, and that's all I gave it. And I said, I turned, and boy, that was the hardest part I did. I wanted to run so bad. I remember that, and it was freaked
I was freaked out. I was freaked out, like there's no shame in that. And it was almost dark, and I said, oh, I got so much and I got to go through it. The rest of the woods now gets darker from here to the house, and I said, oh, this is.
This is not good.
I don't like this at all. I got about I turned and I started in the hill right then get steeper, the steepest part of that area. And so I turned around and I never looked back again. But I got about ten feet up the road and our Roddy's just started going ballistic, and like I'd never heard them before.
They just started.
Coming on glued and mark and then snarling and just carrying on. We had both pretty good sized dogs, one hundred and hundred and twenty five pound dogs, and they just went ballistic. And I said, oh, this is good. This is probably gonna help me maybe, And I didn't know, and I just kept run on walking. I think at that point there's an old road that takes off into the woods when they logged our place back in the fifties,
and it veers off into the woods. And I think at that point that that thing turned when it heard the dogs. I think it turned and went right down that trail off into the woods again. I think it might have left me at that point. And I turned. I kept right on walking. I never looked back, and I had so much of my own chatter going on in my head. I was pretty much yelling at myself
in my head to not run. And I walked up to the house, and everybody asked me, why didn't I just go and get right between those dogs, And I don't know. I had a one track mind. And I walked up to the top, I passed the house and went all the way out to the barn.
I had to go through some more woods.
I got inside that bar and slammed the door, and I didn't come out for an hour. I turned all the lights on i could, and eventually my folks came home and I said, well, cry, I mean, I got to go through the woods back to the house, and it took me a long time to get enough courage to go back out in those woods. I mean, and it didn't stop me from going into the woods after this. It freaked me out. I remember, for a couple of weeks.
Stay tuned for more Bigfoot and beyond with Cliff and Bogo. We'll be right back after these messages. Did you tell your parents when they came home. I didn't. Did they notice you might have been a little ill reached out? I don't.
Well, I think I had calmed down a good bit. I don't remember telling my dad about it until about a month.
Later, and.
I just assumed it was a bear. And like I say, it didn't keep me out of the woods that I was very comfortable. We were always very comfortable in the woods. I remember for about two weeks I was very freaked out about meeting that thing in the woods again, and I didn't go very far. But after that I slowly got used to it again, and I was out there again it's always been something that's an encounter of mine that's been in my mind. And I had never encountered
anything like that. Again, Like I was gonna say, a few years ago, probably three years ago, I was researching bears. I had seen a stuffed one, and by stuffed, I mean something that somebody bear, somebody shot and they'd had it right picking it to a text durmist. And it was a full grown male black bear and it was tiny, and I thought this must be a baby.
I mean it was tiny.
I think it was up on its hind legs and it wasn't more than about five feet at max. Five and a half feet or something. And I thought this thing and bitty, a little bear compared to that thing that chased me out of the woods. And so I started researching bears and they I realized that they didn't get as big as that thing I had seen, nor did they look like the shape wasn't the same, nothing
was the same. And so I had started researching bigfoot and out of my own curiosity, just kind of wondering what their habits were and their aggressiveness and behaviors and that kind of thing. And I would just say that I've gone back to that same area in the woods many times afterwards, and it hasn't stopped me from going out there, and I've certainly looked forward to seeing one again,
hopefully not under those aggressive conditions. Whatever it was that set it off, I don't know, if it didn't recognize my sin, thought I was a trespassed in that area, and was there to chase me out, and then once it got close enough.
Maybe it could send me since me. I don't know.
I don't know what caused that, and I've wanted to. I've constantly, still today been trying to find out what that was about, why that aggression. But about a year ago, I was exactly a year ago, in January last year, I was out in that same area going for a hike and just enjoying the snow. There was some snow
on the ground, remember, about six eight inches. I was up on that same part of the mountain coming down, just a little bit different a couple I would say, maybe three hundred feet away, on a different slope of that mountain, coming down and just meandering through the woods, and I was coming down through some heavy Now there were seedlings back in the day when I was out there at my first encounterment town years ago or yeah,
twenty years ago. Now it's their fur and a lot of hemlock seedlings that are now twenty feet tall, and a lot of heavy brush, you know, and I'm moving limbs out of my way and stuff. And I come out. I had just broken down to the big timber down into this the twenty year old growth, and it was dusk and about the same time of night that I had my first encounters, and I moved back some limbs. I come down into a small area and there was a it looked like the ball root of an overturned stump,
and the ground was pretty smooth. It was a hump and the hump wasn't more than about I'm gonna guess three to four feet tall, I would say, and kind of a big oval hump from an old stump that was rotten, dirt on top of it and everything. And I know it's directly behind it, and it wasn't very far from me. This was probably twenty feet from me at best. And I noticed that behind it was a very black shadow and it was hidden in the trees. There were some trees over the top of it and around it.
Was pretty thick around me, but I can see that distance, and I just noticed that something that was I mean, the shadows are dark, but something was standing directly behind that ritball, and it looked very much if you were to take the statue you have in the back room, blot out all the brown fur and the eyes and all that, and just make a silhouette of that, it's what it looked like.
It was had a very large head.
It looked like it was mounted into the shoulders, and the shoulders tapered down and outward in about three to four feet. And being it was downhill for me, just a little bit, not very much of a decline there, and I am six four almost sixty five now, and I was pretty much eye to eye with it, so it had to have been a little taller than me, being downhill from me, and I thought. I just stopped and looked at it, and I thought, what am I
looking at? And I couldn't see any face again. Oh, Now, it was dusk, I will say, and it was kind of in the low light levels under the twenty footers in the trees, so there was some shadows in there, and there was a lot of sunlight. Now the snow was on the ground. The wind was blowing, and a lot of snow was falling out of the trees and stuff, so there was noise. It wasn't quiet like that summer had been my first encounter. But I took it as a shadow. I said, okay, well, I'm gonna walk over
this thing and see what it is. And I hadn't hadn't hardly moved toward it, and suddenly that object behind that stump turned. Yeah, suddenly it went from a shadow to it was alive, and it turned to its I assuming it was facing me. It turned to its left.
Immediately, and.
It had a profile of the head tapered back into the shoulders. It had pretty good shoulders. They rounded backwards and then down the back you could see the pectorials of a chest. It was a male, I have a feeling, tapered off slant and then down and it was I would have to say it had been about the same size.
As your statue back there, which is seven and a half feet tall in about three feet wide, probably I'm guessing maybe.
A little more yep, right, yeah, And it was probably wet. I couldn't see any fuzzy hair standing up it looked like it had been out there in the water gotten pretty good soaked, so nothing was standing up. It turned with amazing agility and ran. I couldn't see its legs. It just was behind that dirt mount and it just disappeared to my eight because I was facing it, and there was a tree there just out of sight, a tree trunk.
It ran.
I assume it ran around that tree. I don't know why, but I guess it couldn't get away from me without having to go to its left around the trunk of that tree, and then ran straight away from me. And I got to see it run through the woods for probably fifty feet, and as it ran directly away from me and off to my left slightly. And its arms, it had long arms, and they were swinging back and forth as it ran.
Were they extended or we like pumping like a like a jogger mite, you know, like bending at the elbow, or long and extended, long and extended, and its hands were opened, hands were open open, and it was flinging those hands back and forth as it ran very quickly, and the arms were coming completely out horizontal in front of it, behind it, and in front of it, and they were going back and forth, and the palms were open, and it turned and it ran, and it just disappeared.
I just watched it get smaller and smaller as it ran off into the woods. And like I say, I can't comment on the sound because of other woods sounds for sounds are but the speed it ran, I'm thankful it ran away from me, had to run towards me.
I would have been not so calm but it and I didn't care. I watched it disappear into the woods, and I didn't think a thing of it. I just said, oh, well, okay, and I continued on my hike and went about my way, and it turned. It moved so fast that I was wondering what I was looking at. I thought, am I really seeing this? Never seeing thing run so fast? And
it was gone so quickly. I thought, if I had a rifle with me, ad rifle with wine in the chamber, and that thing had decided to run at me, I thought, I even at twenty feet, I thought, there is a very small chance that I would ever be able to get my barrel up at that thing and take a shot. It moved so quick you never get a second shot. If you got a first shot that thing. You'd never get a second shot if it didn't kill it the first time. So that is how quick they moved. I
didn't realize they moved that fast. And I don't know what age group that thing was, but that bigfoot was. But it wasn't there to harm me. It was just observing me, and like I say, more interested in their habitat, and I'm definitely not.
Scared of them.
I look forward to more encounters than I might have with them.
We've had two encounters in twenty years within a couple hundred yards of one another. You obviously live in a place that they at least passed through occasionally, which brings to mind a question you mentioned after your first three After your first encounter with these things when you were fifteen, you didn't mention it to your dad for about a month. When you did mention it to your dad, did you describe it as a bear or something weirder? And what was his reaction?
Dad is a really hard person to convince of anything. He doesn't believe in big foil. I should say he doesn't generally believe the sightings of Bigfoot are bigfoot here everybody. He thinks that they're bears people see. And he doesn't believe in UFOs or any stuff. And so to tell you that my dad that I had an encounter it was something huge in the woods. He's probably not.
Going to believe it, but oh, you believe you saw something.
I saw something. He wrote it off as a bear, A bear. I told him about after a month and he just said, yeah, that's a.
Bear, and you thought it was a bear at the time. I thought it was a bear. I thought it was a really big bear.
But kodiak bear or something I don't know, and and that that's what it was.
And it was left to that for all these years, has there been other activity on your property, either that you're aware of being bigfoot or now looking back, you kind of wonder, well, gosh, maybe that was a big foot.
Well I've spoken with my sister who lives in Vermont now and she comes back on occasions and see the family, and I've spoken to her about this and we agree that. You know, after having come to your museum here right away the first time I came and heard all the sounds that you have recorded in the back, I've heard the whoops those call the three whoops in a row.
I've heard that. We've heard those.
And the tree knocks throughout our lives in the woods, and more of the tree knocks than anything we've heard.
I can't tell you how many of those in the woods when we were kids.
And we always just thought it was some great, big, some woodpecker that was out there, that the sound was echoing off the walls of the mountains, you know, because that sound carries good out there, but in just strange forest noise. We couldn't explain. We didn't know what they were. But looking back, I know exactly what they were now that i've heard yours.
The whoops.
I heard those out in the woods once when I was out dirt bike and when I was younger, same era, I was late teens. I got way up in the woods on a dead end road and a logging road way up there, and I was out messed around the woods and I heard those and they were pretty close to me, and it freaked me out and I got out of there.
I remember that they were.
Coming down through the woods from uphill some distance up through the woods. There was a quick run down through the valley through there between two slopes, and it was heavily timbered, and I heard that three in succession, and they were pretty loud, and I just got a feeling like I wasn't supposed to be there.
And I remember I jumped on my dirt bike and I was gone. There's something clearly about that your particular area they like. And I would be confident in saying that they're there. Are a lot more than you realize, probably always have been and probably hopefully always will be.
Yeah, exactly, And I hope to my folks don't feel the same, but I hope to experience more encounters. They've been up there all this time, never see anything, And I said, I'm hopeful. I say, hey, we'll see when again, and I don't like that they're still a live Then they're still alive.
And did you tell them about your encounter last January?
Uh huh?
And they have any comments about that?
Oh? They after all this time. I think it's just kind of known to all of us that they exist. They're out there, and from what I've found in other sources, they don't. They're not there to harm you. You're in their territory and they watch you out of curiosity. And I have no reason to feel that they're out there to harm us, and that's why I'm curious to see another one.
Well, if your parents are still around and they're up for it, you give me a hauler, bring them in. I'll let them into the back for free, and they can prouse the whole place and check it out and see if the evidence that we have back there is enough to open their mind a little bit further. Okay, sounds good, Cliff, all right, cool, Well, I think with that we'll just go ahead and close this one down. I'm sorry Bobo wasn't here. After you guys are out
there listening to just me. I'm sorry to subject the audience to Jess Cliff without the dilution of Bobo whatever that offers. But thank you so much for listening to Bigfoot and Beyond with Cliff and usually Bobo and I don't know. Subscribe and hit things and push buttons and do everything you can to help us, whatever those things are. I'm not very socially media fluent, so you know what
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