Big Food and Beyond with Cliff and Bobo. These guys are your favorites, so like to subscribe and raid it five stary s and me right, just go on Wish today listening, oh watching always keep its watching. And now your hosts Cliff Berrickman and James Boobo Fay. Hey Cliff, Hi Bobo, how you doing man? Good man? I got us a special guest today. You've been talking about this guest for a little while and you haven't told me who it is or or anything like that, so I'm kind of excited
to learn a little bit about it. Well, you'll recognize the report, I'm sure, Sarah. She was a female backpacker back in the late nineties. You had an incredible encounter up in the Marble Mountains. I'll let her tell the story, but you will recognize that. Promise. Fantastic, fantastic. Let's bring her on, Sarah, Welcome on board. This is Cliff. Yeah. Actually I don't want to confuse you, Sarah. That was actually Bobo who said that. But I understand I get us mixed up sometimes
too. But yeah, I'm Cliff. It's nice to meet you, Sarah. Nice to meet you too. Cliff and Bobo's voice is unmistakable, So thank you both for having me. His voice is like the grumbling of a volcano before belches. So yeah, Sarah's report. They try to get a hold of her for finding Bigfoot. I couldn't track her down. I thought there's a fun over here. It's like twenty three years old. I'll try it anyways, And I tried it. She still had the same number.
Oh nice, And she's not just your average witness, she's got full accreditations. Can you tell us a little about your your background, Sarah, then you're going into your story. Uh? Yeah, A little bit about my background is I grew up in California in the Bay Area, and my dad and I were avid outdoors people, and he taught me how to fish and hike and a little bit of backpacking. And then when I went to college in the nineties up at Chico State, I really became an avid backpacker.
So I sort of followed this path that maybe my career would be in the natural resources and outdoor sciences. And I had worked in the summer of ninety six for the Klamath National Forest, and so I learned a lot about that area, and so the following summer, I was going to summer school and I wanted to plan out a big one hundred miles solo hike, and so I did that. And not to get too far into the story, I did eventually obtain a science degree and actually my forester's license here in California.
So I'm a registered professional forester. I live in northern California. And that is that the way you make your living today? Still, Yeah, I'm an active licensed forester. I do a lot of wildfire safety planning. I see. Okay, very good. So and so you had an encounter at one point with a sasquatch. What's the context of that, Like, what were you doing at the time? And it was that on that one hundred
mile trek that you just mentioned. That's correct. It was the second night in Oh wow, yeah, so Sarah, you can't what was the like physical location mirk. So I was the second night in on ae hundred mile backpacking trip, and I had hiked a fair amount the first day and then I noticed on my map that there was this lake that I wanted to try and get to. So I made it to the lake within the late afternoon evening the second day and then just beyond the lake. Although the lake was
beautiful, it was a little bit smaller than I had imagined. And just beyond the lake, I could kind of catch a glimpse of what looked like a big rock out cropping, and so I continued onto that, and when I got there, it was like this football field of a flat escarpment, this big rock, solid rock field, which, now, knowing what I know about the area, I believe was a large marble escarpment. And so
I wanted to camp there that night. So you set up camp on this outcropping, I guess, And did the encounter happened during the day at night? Like, how did the whole thing begin? So I didn't bring a tent on the trip. It was hot and it was forecasted to be very hot for the whole time. In fact, along the trip I had left articles of clothing like a green jacket and a few things where I was like, I'm not going to need these things, and you know, lighten my
load. I'm actually going to make it through this trip. So I didn't have a tent, and so when I got to the the site that I wanted to camp at, I set up my bag, my sleeping bag, and you know, my backpack and kind of unpacked a little bit right there. And I knew that I was going to encounter a bear or two, or however many, and I was pretty concerned about bears on the trip, and so I packed up all my food stuff and my stove and hiked way
over to the far side of the escarpment and cooked my dinner. I was pretty crashed out and wanted to go to bed, and it was kind of early, it was maybe just dusk, so late August, and I was starting to get dark, and I'm laying there in my bed and I fell asleep, and I was sleeping hard, and I woke up in the middle of the night to sound. It was really far away and very faint, and I could hear it, and at first I thought it's probably an owl.
It kept going and I was kind of trying to go back to sleep, and the way that I was situated on the escarpment with my sleeping bag, I was basically feet facing down this canyon or ravine, and it was a big canyon. So I keep hearing the noise and now reminding you, this was twenty three years ago, and so I'm remembering this right now, as I tell you guys, what happened. So what I was hearing was repetitive and it just didn't stop. It was still faint and very far away,
but it was repetitive. So then I thought, after I thought maybe it was an owl and I was just going to go back to sleep. Then I thought, well, maybe it's a bugling elk. And so I was laying there and sure enough it continued without pause, and it was over and over and over again of what I originally called this inward howl, and it was one after the next, and I will tell you that it started to grow just slightly louder. And so then I started thinking to myself,
Okay, probably not an owl, maybe not a bugling elk. I did think maybe this was a mountain lion. And then eventually I ended up having some scary thoughts that maybe it was a man or a person, really a man that was crazy or drunk way down in the bottom of a wilderness canyon. And I have to be honest, that thought and me went away because
of the unlikelihood of that, and all along it kept going. And so now I'm in my mind going, what in the world is that, and it's getting louder, and it keeps going, and it's clearly running and howling up the creek down at the bottom of this canyon that I'm sleeping up above. And so I thought, okay, whatever, it is, no problem. I'm way up here at the top of this canyon and really at the
base of a peak, so there's nothing that could get up here. And earlier in the night, when it was still light, I had definitely looked over the canyon a bunch, and so I knew that I was right over like a short cliff base with a big screen field down below and in the ravine, and it was huge. I mean, the relief in those canyons
can easily be two thousand feet. So as it started to get louder and louder and clearly running and calling or doing whatever it was doing, crying or wherever you want to call it, all the way up and repetitively, I started thinking, this thing is running up the canyon and is running to the boulder field the screen pile down below. So then I kind of thought, well, that'll surely stop it in its tracks. And so the time period
is a little bit foggy in my recollection. In all honesty, I think that it was probably about forty five minutes of hearing it down in the creek bottom in the ravine until it got to what was the boulder field down below, and when it got to bolder field again continuously howling or inward howling.
At that point I could start to hear it. I could start to hear clearly that there was something running and frankly hauling ass and it was going fast through this boulder field, carrying you know, running and sort of carrying its body. And I could just start to make out rocks moving, but just faintly. Obviously at this point it was much louder. It was right below me by two hundred feet. It started, you know, kind of propelling itself up what was the boulder field. I'm scared, you guys. I
I was so scared. I didn't know anything. I didn't know what it was. I didn't know if it was coming for me. I just was laying there as scared as you can imagine, completely breathless, completely motionless, and thinking, Okay, it's going to get to the bottom of the cliff, and there's no way any bugling elk or crazy person or whatever could climb up that cliff, and I, being an outdoors person in adventure, I
was familiar with rock climbing a little bit. At that point. I went on to do some more rock climbing, but I knew that, you know, no one could climb that without ropes. It was easily a five to nine maybe a five eight pitch. It would have been a crumbly, very steep cliff face, and it was at least fifty feet tall, if not, I don't know, seventy feet seventy five feet. Sure enough, the thing started and you could hear it pulling itself and climbing up the cliff.
And it was really interesting because when it got to the bottom and started the climbing was the first that it had taken a real break from the howling or the whooping, and so it sort of caught its breath, and it had some that I could hear, some grunts and some slight pitches, but not the repetitious whoops that later in the call. I can describe to you guys
what I heard. But anyways, things started climbing up the cliff, and I'm at the very top of it, and I'm just off to the side of what was a little creek that sort of defined the escarpment and the cliff and then down into the ravine. It was just off to sort of the river right side of that little creek or brook that was really more of ice
melt from the peak above. By about I don't know if I was fifteen feet or thirty feet, but I was right in there, fifteen to thirty feet off the side of that little creek that wouldn't have been more than a foot or two wide. So I just kept laying in my bag and essentially praying that I wasn't coming to get gobbled up. It continued to climb successfully and pretty quickly, and when it got to the top of the cliff,
it was so amazing. The thing just pulled itself up and over. It just used whatever arms it had and hoisted itself up and almost like it jumped up and over the top. So at that moment you put your eyes on it, you could actually see the thing that you've been listening to for the last forty five minutes at that point, that's correct, and there was moonlight. I didn't want to move my eyes, I didn't want to move anything. I didn't want to breathe. I didn't want to move my eyes or
my head, but instinct I had to. I had to see what was, you know, coming for me or whatever. And it wasn't coming for me, I'll tell you that now. But nevertheless, my eyes just went slowly and steadily to the left and right. Then it started up as if it was going to start running again, and took a big breath and sort of hesitated and stopped just for a split second and looked and looked at me, and I looked at it, and the only thing that I can describe
of what I saw was similar to a gorilla. I think I scared the crap out of it. Honestly. I think that it was at that moment just as scared as I was, and realized it wasn't alone thinking that it was, and I still didn't move and was extremely frightened, if not on
the verge of a heart attack. That's how I am right now. And at that point, so it looks to the left over, you know, so we're facing opposite directions, so we both just barely look to our left, and as soon as it notices that there's someone or something else right there,
it just stands up and howls and takes off so fast. Anyways, it took off and was at the base of that peak in probably ten minutes, maybe fifteen minutes, and then it continued to climb up that peak, doing the howl, the travel howl for another only like twenty or thirty minutes. And I'm still laying in my bag, just as scared as can be.
And it stayed up there for hours and hours until almost sunrise, and it called the whole time as loud as you can imagine, consistently, one after the other, and just stayed there, calling out, stay tuned for more Bigfoot and beyond with Cliff and Bobo will be right back. After these messages, you said that when it saw you, what it noticed you up there, it let out a howl, and then a moment later you referred to a traveling howl. So that vocalization that it emitted when it saw you
was different than the other ones. It was like a it was more of a grunt. It was more of like the grunt that I was hearing when it was climbing, and it was like a but it was like a hiccup. Oh okay, okay. And then that's the practice I did the same. Yeah, I get it. So the howl, the travel howl, that remained pretty consistent from when you first started hearing it to when it reached the top of the mountain of forty five minutes an hour or so later.
It was notably consistent and methodical. Okay, Well, to describe that howl, I'm curious what that was like. It was a whoop along howl, a scream, high pitched, low pitch. The frequency, what can you tell us about that? So I've always described it to my closest confidence as an inward howl or an inward drawl. And it had a fairly high but medium high pitch, and it was it was created. It would be created in drawing the lungs in and so the travel or running how how that's what
I'm calling it would be like wow. So that kind of frequency, like, that's how often that happened. And that's the approximately the length of the vocalization you heard as well, from when the moment I heard it until it got to the bottom of the cliff field or excuse me, the the cliff in the rock field, it was consistent and just like that wow. And so that was probably close to an hour and a half, maybe two hours of hearing that. Oh okay, I had the timeline a little off.
Yeah, Well, so what I was saying is it was probably close to forty five minutes down in the bottom of the ravine, so kind of the flat area, and then another say twenty five maybe forty minutes through the rock field, and crazy enough, I want to say that it climbed that cliff in like five minutes. It was fast. Maybe it was ten, but really I think it was a total of from the time I started hearing it to the time it got to me my location was an hour and a half.
And that's in real person time, not the I'm getting the crap scared out of me alone in the Marble Mountains time. Imagine it felt like an eternity for you. It felt like an eternity for sure, And to this day, I really I do struggle with putting some real time to that. But I bet was that a solo extended backpacking trip. I don't think it was Bobo No, And I continued on the trip. I actually had a
goal. I was going to try and go off route and go in to the wilderness off trail, but I really couldn't find my way with just wayfinding, and I did not want to get lost, and I knew my dad would kill me if I got lost, So I went back to the trail and continued on and carried out a full It was actually ninety eight mile trips. That must have changed something with you on that trip, Like that's the
second day in on one hundred mile trip. That certainly must have planted some sort of seed in you for the rest of the trip, just thinking like, holy crap, those things are out here. Those things were out there, and I knew that, but I was in such shock that I put it in the depths of my mind. I was so focused on doing this trip, Hello type A, that I just I wanted to do the trip.
It was a huge goal for me that whole year, and I just I didn't want to let it go because of this creature that came through my camp. Were they on your radar before that trip? I mean, obviously of course you were aware of sasquatches, but like, did you think they're real? Did you think that they're just like a normal forest sort of thing out there that I could run into? Very much on my radar by then, because the summer before is when I worked for the FEDS and spent my
summer up in the Klamath the whole time. And I'd heard stories and I read that great book about the biodiversity of the sisq Oh, I know what you're talking about, and they mentioned it the klimathnot is that it the Klamath, Knot that's it? Yeah, there you go, good one. Yeah. So they were just barely in my mind. So that year that I
was working for the FEDS, we were doing a survey. We were doing a recreational user survey, and I actually ended up interviewing this group of cave expeditioners that were heading into the Marbles and they were going to try and do some mapping of the caves. And they had mentioned at that interview, you know, yeah, there's there's caves out there, and we think that that is habitat and home to some of the Sasquatch and possibly last remaining Sasquatch on
the planet. And at the time, I mean I was even a year younger then, So when I was like eighteen, I kind of was like, huh, okay, marked that one in the books. And so, I mean I knew that there was the concept of these things being out there. And like I said, I you know, I grew up as an outdoors person with my dad, but nothing like what I had actually experienced. You had on your one the year before. You've made an interesting observation.
You thought that it sounded like I was wounded. Yeah. So the reason why I was turned on to the book That Klamath Not was I met an individual out there and I myself and my partner, my working partner, who I wish I could get a hold of, but I have no idea how
to get a hold of this person. Anyways, he and I both had this creature come through our camp late one night, and it was it was like limping and dragging a foot, so it was like and it was doing this same kind of almost like a howl or howl or a whoop, but it was more of a cry and it cried out and it was just parallel to us. And that was right there on the Klamath River, and it was parallel to us, and it was it was seemingly injured just by the
sound, but we couldn't see it. We were shining our flashlights up there, we couldn't see anything. And then it just stopped. There was nothing for like probably ten minutes, and then there was this splash in the river and we think that it jumped in the river and swam off. Oh so you had an entirely different encounter the year before during that when you're working for the FEDS. Is that what I'm going right? Right? Okay, right? But I mean hearing in pose it injured sasquatch, Yeah, was pretty
far from my fathom ability. And uh and then so yeah, you're right, Cliff, there was somewhere in the back of my mind where I was aware that these creatures possibly existed, and so on the rest of my trip, I just kind of I really put it. I put it in the back of my mind and ended up coming into, uh, within three feet of a huge black bear. And that had me more concerned than yeah,
than than the first the first guy. Okay, so I got to ask, as you happen to look around your campsite for footprints the next morning where the thing walked through your camp. Definitely, I packed up and looked around, and I was on I was on a rock face. There was nothing, nothing, and they and the summer before when the alleged injured one came through. We looked for footprints in the It was one of those spots on the river where it's really rocky, but then there's those perfect fine sand,
little sand beaches and we couldn't see anything, no tracks. Okay, you know what's interesting was that you guys got the census thing was asking you for help in the first Yes, absolutely, Sorry, what do you mean by that? Yeah, tell me about that because Bubbo knows a lot more about your encounter than I do, so I don't know anything, so laid on me. Okay, well it okay, I'll tell that story from the beginning. That one. I guess I've always had a harder time with that one
because I didn't see it. I only heard it. But I'll tell you all about it. So my work partner and I were, you know, working for the FED, so we were out camping. It was a total internship and making no money. It was great, but we were We would find all these different places to camp and this one spot was like this old this like old road river access and we took the cars down there and we were like, hey, I think this would be a good spot to sleep.
So we ate some food at our cars and then we, you know, gathered up our bags and just plopped them down on the river, and we each we each kind of grabbed one of those little sandy beach spots, like that was our own little campsite. And so he was easily twenty feet away from me, my buddy. And so we went to sleep, and I had I was again no tent, but I'm in my sleeping bag, and I had all my belongings around me, you know, my journal,
my book, my headlamp, and I had a knife. So we go to sleep, and I was at that time, I was asleep too, and I wake up to the sound of this step drag, step drag through what was like oak tree litter or duff. And it went on for a while. It was down the way a bit, and it just kept getting closer up towards us, and all we could hear was step drag, step drag, and it stopped right above us, and it cried, and it
was like, you know that one that one I want. I'll embarrass myself if I try to mimic it. But it was this this cry for help is what it seemed like. And we were flashing our lights up there. We couldn't see anything, and I eventually I put my light down and I was gripping my knife, but I sort of let down my guard because I'm like, and I even said over to Ben, I go, Ben, what is it? And by then I sort of let my guard down because
it was almost like a emotional It wasn't threatening. And we just sat there for a little while it all stopped, and I'll be honest, I fell asleep. I fell asleep, and I woke up to the splash, the sound of the splash of the river. It's draining when you're when you're in a tense situation like that, like and your adrenaline is pumping for hours, it's so so like it's just drained your whole body, no kidding. So yeah, So I sometimes get embarrassed on that one that I'm like, yeah,
I passed out. I just plumb passed out, because I it was just like what in the heck? And and we both did we both passed out cold, so it could have, you know, come right past us. And we looked for we looked for any kind of tracks in the dusk the next day where it was walking on the beach in the sand all around, and it didn't see anything. Well, we thought for a long time. They're probably pretty aware of their footprints, so that's not too surprising.
I guess at the end of the day, I want to ask you a little bit about the what you actually visually observed, you know, so fast forward a year. I guess from that that the Olympia encounter, you said that it looked like a gorilla. Can you describe what you saw from the top of the head down to wherever you lost it, you know, to steep presumably, So from the top of the head it had a big,
blackish brown, squatty head, a big face. I still did stake and look right into its eyes, big eyes, big bright eyes, kind of a flat face. And the way that it turned its neck, it's like it had no neck, and it just turned completely to the side, almost without moving its shoulders. And the shoulders were very broad and wide and huge and draping down with these large arms, kind of in a forward motion.
So it had just climbed itself up and over this rock face, and at that point it sort of stopped and was about to propel itself to take off for the mountain, when I think it realized that it was not alone. Stay tuned for more Bigfoot and beyond with Cliff and Bogo. We'll be right back after these messages. So it sort of hunched forward, almost like startled. Shoulders come forward, just slightly turning, but the neck turns completely like
ninety degrees over towards me, and then down the whole back. I can see its rump and just black blackish brown fur the whole way down into the legs, muscular legs. I can picture it right now. I mean I saw muscles. The thing was huge and ripped and broad and covered in her So it must have been a pretty good moon out. You said that earlier, but I believe it was like a few days prior to a full moon.
Yeah, on a rock escarpment, of course, that reflects. And you know, I've done a lot of backpacking in the Sierras, for example, and camping on those granite faces. It almost is like daylight under the moon conditions. It's ridiculous. So yeah, and my eyes were just cranked in that direction. I didn't move my body at all, so you know, all I could see was what my eyes could see in a slightly turned and really periphery. But I saw it, and that's what I saw.
You might have said this in your initial description, but refreshing my memory if you did, how far away were you from it from where it came up over the cliff and when it first noticed you? Yeah, so I was on one side of the creek anywhere between, you know, fifteen twenty feet maybe thirty at the most. And it was just on the other side of that little creek or brook by like five or ten feet. Oh so you're withorin like forty fifty feet up from this thing. Oh yeah, I think
that I was within thirty feet. Oh my goodness. Yeah, that's horribly close. I'm a forester. I know what thirty feet is. Yeah, you know, most people don't, honestly, and and I don't want to slam people or anything, but people are just terrible at distances. I'm sure. Because you're a forester, you depend on your estimation of distances for a lot of what you do, you know, planting trees or whatever. I don't know. There's probably a million things you do that I have no idea
about. But to have the layman say, oh, it was ten feet for me, then that's like, okay, well maybe that's fifty. Maybe that's thirty you know, don't really know, but you're confident in your ability to judge distances at this point, right, Yeah, And I've relived the experience in my mind enough and now knowing what thirty feet is, confidently that's that's always the number I come back to. And I'm looking at thirty feet away from you right now, and I'm like, yep, yeah, that
was horrifically close, you know, thirty feet ten yards. That's ridiculous, and so honestly, I don't know that it so it was slightly hunched forward, not on all fours, but just enough to where those arms and shoulders were forward. I don't think it was much more than eight feet tall. Maybe standing completely upright, it could have been ten. But I you know, like when I went to the museum in Felton and they have that like the peak through and those things are like fifteen feet tall, Like, whoa,
I didn't see anything that was fifteen feet tall. Just for your guys' records, what I saw, I really think was about eight to ten feet tall. Yeah. I imagine you spent some time with topo maps because you're doing this trip and you're doing you might want to go off trail and the whole thing. I'm curious why, of all places it walked exactly where you were. I mean, it's that's what are the chances of that unless it was a path of least resistance in some way to get to the top of
that mountain? Perhaps, do you have any insight or thoughts on that? Yeah, I was off trail. I was. I was off in a place that you know, wouldn't have been right off of a trail on a TOBO map. And when I kind of was peeking around that that first lake that I thought I would get to and camp at, I sort of peeked around and just went you know, the extra not even quarter mile and sort of looked and was like, what in the world, it's this huge rock
escarpment, Like I'm camping there? That's the spot. Did the creature drop by the lake on the way and like after it left you on the way to the top of the mountain? No, there was no, there was do not pass go. It went from me directly up and continued on its already determined route. It knew where it was going and did not stop and went directly from the little creek or brook that I was on and followed that up to the peak and the lake. That little lake would have been off
to the west by a good quarter mile. That it's one of the things we've noticed over the years, like yeah, tracked a few Sasquatches in our time. Then one of the things that comes at is sometimes they're meandering about, you know, and the stride that the step lengths are usually shorter and all that kind of meandering, like they're just kind of poking around, maybe
looking for something in particular. But there are other times in cases when they seem to be going somewhere, like they have a goal in mind and for whatever, for whatever reason. And you can tell that sometimes because the step length is longer, for example, but they seem to hone in on the direction they need to go, and they go that way and nothing gets in
their way. If something's there, they might go around something that's insurmountable, some sort of obstacle, but generally speaking, they'll go over whatever it is and just goes straight there, you know, just just you know, as the crow flies, as they say, no matter what's in their way. So maybe this is one of those cases. Perhaps, right, I've thought about the path a lot, and I think that it was either a path that it had traveled before multiple times, or it was it was you know,
just pre established it was. It was definitely a direct route. It knew where it was going. Do you have any speculations on why it might have been going there? I do. The week after my trip ended, I was meeting up with some friends to go climb at Mount Shasta and to go climb the peak, and I'll just tell you guys, I didn't make it. I did not sum it because I was so worn out from from the hiking trip and my friends actually left me at the at the start.
We you know, I made it to base camp, but it's a big it's a big climb to go at Mount Shasta. Well, we will tell anybody it didn't make it. It's just broadcast that no one listens to this, that's all right. Yeah. So I was so worn out from from
the trip that I stayed back at our base camp. But when we had gone down after that to the little campground for just like a after trip camp out before we go head headed back home, I met this this woman at the campground there and we I was with a group of girlfriends and so we had kind of befriended her and a bunch of people that she was camping with and they, you know, it was a campground, so they kind of had a party that night. And she was this really nice lady and she
noticed that I was limping and she was like, what's wrong. Why are you limping? And I was like, oh, my knee hurts. I kind of blew it out. I just finished up a big hike and it's really sore. And she was like, oh, well, I do reiki reiky healing. Do you do you want me to do like a little reiki treatment on you? And I'm like sure, And so we sit down and I give her my knee and she's you know, rubbing my knee and doing whatever. And she was really interesting. She goes, so you just went
on a big backpacking trip, a big hiking trip by yourself. I'm like yeah. She's like that's interesting, and she kind of was looking at me funny, and I was like, yeah, this it's really strange thing happened to me on the trip. And she was like, oh, tell me. I was like, well, it was pretty wild. I'm like, i'll tell you. But and so she just listened and she listened to my
whole recollection of what had just happened. And I didn't even tell my girlfriends when we went up to Shasta, I didn't even tell them, So she was essentially the very first person who I told, and she listened to my story the whole way through, and she said, I'm a Kaduk Indian and my father's Koduk and has been going up every summer, late summer and every once in a while. I don't know what his pattern is, but my father goes up to the tops of the peaks and records sasquatches doing their mating
calls. And I think that that's what you experienced was a sasquatch mating call. I'll bet it if you can figure out what that peak was. I'm sure that every year on that same peak. Yeah, I can figure it out. I've looked at it in the past. They just haven't come up with a map file, but I can do that. But it made a lot of sense to me when she said that, I was like, of course, well, yeah, there are there are very many reasons animals vocalized
in general. I mean that because you know, they don't want to be they don't want to give their spot away, they give themselves away, and mating I suppose would be top on the list, I guess, you know, unless they're like highly social like birds or something like that. You always chirping back and forth to one another humans for that matter. And that's kind of something I bring up quite often, is when you hear a sasquatch vocalize, chances are it's not doing that for its own benefit. It's that most
animals don't talk to themselves. In other words, humans are kind of special in that way, and there might be another one nearby, and that's something that you need to keep in mind. I think, Yeah, awesoppressed, you didn't hear one to answer at all, not at all. Yeah, because that's a lot. That's expending an awful lot of calories to get to at one certain location, you know, because that's climbing straight up to the
top of a mountain. Basically, that's not easy under any circumstance. So to get up there and then hoot and holler until morning time, there must be a darn good reason to expend all those calories doing it, and certainly mating would be one of them, just because a rare species like this that's spread very thinly across the landscape has to have some sort of trouble finding other
sasquatches. Now, now let me ask you this real fast. And I know that you probably didn't see it's junk or anything like that, but did you get the impression this was a male or a female? And really early on got the impression that it was a male. When it was down in the bottom of the canyon. It immediately was like, is a crazy man a drunk guy coming for me? Yeah? I thought that was interesting that you've suspected, even for a moment, that this might be a human.
So there must have been something about the vocalization that reminded you of a human in some sort of way. Stay tuned for more Bigfoot and Beyond with Cliff and Bogo. We'll be right back after these messages. So, now you're a forester for a living. Have you heard other people who work for the Forestry Service or FEDS or anything like that talk about sasquatch encounters that they've had. I only have one friend who's in a slightly related position and career share
another story. But I have to be totally honest with you. I really don't cross mingle the sasquatch sighting with my professional forestry career. I've you know, when I've shared the story and my recollection, I've been really ridiculed, and even by close friends. Luckily not any of my family. It's pretty cool. My family supports me and what I saw, but I've borderline lost friends over this story, and so I tend to keep it separate from my
forestry career. I've shared it with a few people, but you know, there has to be a lot of trust there first, and more of a
friendship. But I do have a friend who is in a related hydrology field, and he and his wife had actually come across one up in the Feather River Canyon apparently and allegedly was like a juvenile, And they pulled into this remote campsite up in the Feather River Canyon off the highway, and when they pulled in, their headlights were shining on this short, kind of squatty kid like sasquatch that peered out just from behind the tree, kind of walked out,
stared at it right in the headlights, and then ran off. I could be incorrect about this, because I mean, obviously I live, and just like Bobo, we both live pretty bigfoot centric lives, you know, our lives are you know, we're basically drowning in the subject. So we probably have a skewed perception on some of this, but it seems to me, at least set the Forest Service and a lot of those sort of folks in general forest tree people are kind of opening up a little bit more to
it. Like, for example, I live on timberland and therefore I get like a tax deferment because I have forests on my property, you know. And so I've been dealing a lot with the Malala District guys because they have to come out and inspect my property because the previous owners clear cut it and they want to make sure I replant it and all that sort of stuff to kind of keep my forest deferment for my property taxes. And I talked to
them about bigfoot stuff. They haven't seen it, but they're pretty open to it, and they have they have some good questions and whatever. And as listeners of the podcast will know, this past fall, mountain Hood some well some not not an official capacity, but rangers from the mountain Hood National Forests reached out to me because they got sasquatch Sighting reported to them. So it seems that that that icy wall is somewhat breaking down to some degree at least.
Maybe it's just because the old the older folks are retiring or dying off and the new generations coming in and they're a little bit more open to that sort of thing, or I don't know what it is, But can you comment at all about anything that I've just said, Like, do you think that's true at all? Or what do you what are your thoughts? I think I think that the icy wall you describe is is coming down, but it just doesn't do the the scientific community any justice that it's not you know,
a classified specie species. It's not you know, keyed out as a living existing thing. And so that's where I mean, once it is adopted as a as a as a classified primate mammal, then that wall's gone. But without having that scientific you know, background of a scientific name, it's going nowhere. Yeah, yeah, what do you what do you think is
going to happen? Because you know these are I mean obviously you know they're real, clearly you know, And it's only therefore, in my opinion, it's really only a matter at time until the type specimen is brought in. What do you think that will look like from your end, like how it will affect your job and and how how do you think it will go down?
Basically, how it would affect my my career is you know, it would probably for one, open up a bunch of experiences and encounters that people have never reported and just go, yep, I saw one here, I saw one here, and those stories will be coming out of the woodwork.
And secondly, I mean at that point would probably be identified as somewhat endangered, if not extinct species, and so there would be protection measures I would hope put into place, and so that would be That would be good, Yeah, because it would have to immediately I imagine, be declared endangered even if it's not, and I don't think they are necessarily, but I think it would be immediately declared as endangered until a thorough ecological study could be done,
and you know the way these things are, that could take a decade man, right, That would it would be really beneficial I think for the protection and for the the knowledge that it is a not a hoax or be not some you know, mythical creature. Yeah, I would It would validate a whole lot of witness is that it would go. It would validate entire cultures, like the indigenous cultures of North America. They would get such a validation to their stories and unique oral traditions. But it also, you know,
you said the whole lot of stories will come out. I would also predict that a whole lot of videos and photographs will come out that people have just been sitting on because they don't want to be thought a fool or the local drunk or something like that, and hopefully some immediate protection measures. So I'll sit on that panel for sure. Oh fantastic. Well, so, Sarah Bobo and I have both heard from more than one source that people are
very high up in the government are aware of these things. But what do you have any thoughts on some sort of overarching conspiracy or some nonsense or I think most conspiracy conspiracies are nonsense personally. So are there any conspiracy conspiratorial thought in your mind about this, because obviously there would be a huge economic issue for closing off a lot of land and all this other stuff, because we all saw what the snailed art fish, the consequences of that, or the
consequences of the spotted owl in the Pacific Northwest. I mean, I would say that the logging industry still hasn't really fully recovered from that whole ordeal. Do you think there's any sort of conspiracy amongst any level of government that's a concerted effort or do you think it's just individuals not really wanting to talk about it. Yeah, I would I wouldn't know enough to know about a concerted effort. But what comes to mind is I think it's more in my industry
specifically. I think it's more almost of a jealous feeling that they haven't seen one and so they immediately knock it down. Now at the higher level, you know, with leadership, government decision makers, I'm honestly at a loss of why this isn't a you know, a documented species, and so so I've had, you know, thoughts of my own of is there is there some sort of conspiracy to to protect or to hide this creature from legitimacy.
I mean, I've had that thought myself a lot, because I saw what I saw and it's still not a believed creature for the most part, and so it's it's actually kind of frustrating, not kind of it's very frustrating. From my end, it's there's some emotions that go along with it, like embarrassment and like I said, maybe jealousy from the others, you know, and especially with this species of all of them, because you know, we
study the other apes, for example, to learn more about ourselves. That's our biological family, right, and you think that like, oh, here's an opportunity to learn so much more about where we came from. Like why wouldn't they just jump on this. It just doesn't make sense to me at all. But so I've always thought like, if there is some sort of
effort, it's really a passive effort. I mean, people aren't going out and you know, squat and black people in like black SUVs, aren't picking up dead ones on the side of the road, in my opinion, or anything like that. Although I've heard more than my fair share of stories like
that. I've heard of stories probably once every two weeks. In my Bigfoot museum up here by Portland, Oregon, somebody comes in asks me about these conspiratorial ideas of helicopters whisking dead bigfoots away from Mount Saint Helens after it blew in nineteen eighty. But if there is a conspiracy, it must be an awful passive one, something like, well, the bigfoots seem to be taken care of themselves pretty well, so let's not expend any resources towards this because
they got out under control. Yeah. Yeah, that's a happy thought. I'm going to go with that one. And I think I think we're all leaning on you, Cliff and Bobo, to help us, you know, help the species become something that's validated, recognized, and approved by the scientific community. Well, shoot, this has been a good one, Cliff. What do you think that was our best witness testimony so far? I'd say
that this is fantastic. Just the proximity, the encounter, the observations you made, and knowing that we're speaking to a legit, you know, forestry professional here, all of those things just tie into this beautiful situation that you brought us. Man, that is an amazing encounter. Thank you so much, Boba for setting us up, and thank you so much Sarah for joining us. Absolutely honored you guys. Thank you so much, And like I
said, I really appreciate your guys work. I've been following you guys and watching the shows and now listening to this podcast, and and I really look up to you guys. This is this is truly an honor, and today's talk has been a dream come true. Nerd. I used to watch the show a bunch and I'm like, oh, come on, Cliff yelling at you from from my living room. Well, you know, people yelled at me on set too, So yeah, I was always having to keep that
guy straight. Yeah. I think I had Bobo to point the way for me. Yeah. Good. Well, if you see anything else out in the woods or here's something, you let us know and come back on. Okay, I will do that. Quit my day job. Oh yeah, quit your day jobs. Do bigfoot stuff full time. And there's no money in it, but holy smokes, it's a lot of fun. That was great. All right, Thank you so much, sir, Thank you guys. Bye. So Bobo man, that that was a great witness. I
can't believe you pulled one out like that. That was amazing. Yeah, and you recognize that story. I'm sure read off the bat. I have read it. I have read it, but you know, things get jumbled in my mind, you know, like all these all these basically all the reports from the last twenty five twenty six years of doing this just get all jumbled up, so it's nice to have a refresher course, especially when it's straight from the witness's mouth. Yeah. She was excellent relaying details, and
her memory was great. Her observational skills were great. I mean, and she's cautious. She even said, like I at one point she said, I'm not so sure that, so I'm not gonna say it, you know, like I think it was the peak of the mountain if I remember right. She's cautious about what she's saying to make sure that everything she's saying is
accurate. And I so appreciate that from a witness instead of just making something up or answering even though they may not be one hundred percent for sure, right right, Yeah, those are the witnesses everyone dreams about talking to you. Yeah. Yeah, fantastic man, So thank you, Bob. So that was amazing. Yeah, we got some great guests coming up, so if you listen to this one, folks, we got more coming for you.
And until next time, keep it Squatchy. Thanks for listening to this week's episode of Bigfoot and Beyond. If you liked what you heard, please rate and review us on iTunes. Subscribe to Bigfoot and Beyond wherever you get your podcasts, and follow us on Facebook and Instagram at Bigfoot and Beyond podcast. You can find us on Twitter at Bigfoot and Beyond that's an N in the middle, and tweet us your thoughts and questions with the hashtag Bigfoot and Beyond