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This week, Republican Senator jd Vance and Democrat Tim Waltz are squaring off in the first US vice presidential debate. One hot button issue that could come under the spotlight the Minnesota governor's deep ties to China. Limenhama Governor Tim Walls here Happy Chinese New Year.
Tim Walls was in China as a young person at a very formative time in his life.
Daniel ten Kate is Bloomberg's executive editor for Asia Economy and Government based in Hong.
Kong, but started back in nineteen eighty nine. He graduated from a state college in Nebraska, and then he headed over to Hong Kong for a language training program.
Waltz was in Hong Kong preparing to teach in mainland China, but after China's military crushed pro democracy protests, leaving hundreds, possibly thousands dead, many of his colleagues decided to go home instead, but Walls went ahead. He said he felt that for him it was more important than ever to go to China, and he called the deadly Tieneman Square protests an unthinkable event and.
That was kind of a shocking event. For him something you definitely can forget. In fact, he got married on June four to commemorate the Tiena anniversary.
Over the years, Walls continued to return to China on trips that took him to different regions of the country. He's often spoken fondly of his experiences in the country and the people he met.
He's actually said, if someone tells you that they're an expert on China, they're probably not telling you the truth because it's a complex country.
And his nomination comes at a critical point in US China relations.
Took and JC really dangerous tracks or cash, whether that be South China, see or Taiwan or cyber etc. So it's really a very difficult time, very dangerous time.
That's Lee Chang, a political science professor at the University of Hong Kong. He also spent nearly two decades in Washington, d C. As a director and senior fellow at the Brookings Institution's John L. Thornton China Center.
In Washington adamsphere. We you see China as a major threat. It's a matter of war and a peace with a political leader in that position, whether China is an anime or friend or partner or competitor. No matter what you categorize China, it is very important to selve American interest to understand the Chinese philosophy.
Is welcome to The Big Take Asia from Bloomberg News. I'm Wanha. Every week we take you inside some of the world's biggest and most powerful economies and the markets, haycoons and businesses that drive this ever shifting region. Today. On the show, Tim Walls's long history with China, how that could influence his stance on foreign policy and if the Democrats win the election, would Walls's connections to China
be an asset or liability? Okay, Dan, So, Tim Walls first visited China in nineteen eighty nine, just fresh out of college. Give us a picture of China at that time.
It certainly was a much poorer China. China that was just emerging in the world. This was recovering from years of isolation still from mal Zedong. When Doung Jhoping took over and instituted a bunch of reforms, that's when the economy really started going. So Tim Walls actually saw that from the very get go when he arrived in Hong Kong in nineteen eighty nine, China was still not opened in the way that we've seen.
After his language training program in Hong Kong, Waltz went on to teach English and American history at a high school in Foshan that's in Guangdong Province in southern China, not far from Hong Kong. Walls said he was given the royal treatment at the Chinese school. His decorated apartment had a color TV and a short wave radio, luxuries at the time. He was paid six hundred and fifty n or eighty dollars a month, which was double the salary of other teachers, and he left a good impression.
Yeah. The reporting there shows that Walls was known to teachers and students by Cantonese transliteration of his first name. He was very well liked, according to people there. He was treated like a celebrity. Left a good impression on everyone. In fact, people remembered him for his big smile.
He must have stood out. I mean, back then in nineteen eighty nine, you probably didn't see too many white men around in southern China.
Yeah, definitely, I mean, by all means he stood out. He's a tall guy anyway, big, tall, midwestern white guy showing up in southern China, and by all accounts, he had a real appreciation for his students and they enjoyed having him around. And the proof is probably that he went back over and over again.
Walls finished his teaching in Guangdong Province the next year, and in the following years he traveled to China frequently.
He really went out and about. He wanted to explore China, and he was doing it the way that the locals would do it. He was taking the train, he was riding the buses. He was spending about a dollar a day going to local places to eat and interacting with just regular folks on the ground. This was a guy. He was into it. He was zoning it. He was really trying to see it from the ground up. And I think that has to leave an impression on you.
Later, Walls and his wife, Glenn Walls, founded a company which organized summer excursions to China for American high school students.
He wanted to bring other students over to China to have the same experience that he and then he spent his honeymoon with a bunch of high school kids in southern China, taking them over on a trip that was his actual honeymoon.
Super romantic. I'm sure his wife was delighted.
She must have been What more commitment do you need than that?
Yeah, that's very true. Now, how do you think that experience of traveling across China like a local shape his understanding of China.
I think what it does is it helps you to really know the place on a ground level. And there's so much in Washington today that we hear people talking about China who have never been to China and who don't know China. So he understands, and I think that's what living there, going there so often, traveling around you're not looking at the caricature of China. And I think this shows, you know, you got to think about Chijiping himself.
He spent time in the US in Iowa as a young person and got to know the American people on that level, and so in some ways Tim Wall's had the same experience, and the importance of that is crucial when it comes to policy, particularly if you think about a war. For instance, these are the world's two biggest powers. You have a flashpoint in Taiwan when Nancy Pelosi went
over to Taipei a couple of years ago. There were some real scary moments there where you had people on Chinese social media saying they should shoot a plane down. There's this real sense that eventually China and the US could be heading towards some sort of military conflict at some point, not imminently, but at some point, and so that makes it all the more important for the leaders of these two countries to actually know what it's like to live in those places, to know the people on the ground.
After the break. How would Waltz's extensive personal experience in China translate into policy and the impact on already front US China relations. If Democrats take the White House.
Some people in the US Congress, will Republicans think that that you have connection with China, you're doing business of China, you may be brandwashiped by China.
So far, the Harris Walls campaign has made little mention of his experience in China, and they've yet to lay out how Harris or Walts would handle China policies. But throughout his career, Wals has regularly criticized China's human rights record.
He's been a big advocate of human rights and democracy in China. In twenty sixteen, for example, he had what he called a quote life changing lunch with the Dalai Lama on Hong Kong two. Walls has also been quite a big advocate. He was the only House Democrat willing to support the Hong Kong Human Rights and Democracy Act of twenty seventeen. Activists from Hong Kong were saying, back in those days, they were knocking on doors making support for this law, and no one was really joining in.
And then lo and behold, they go to Walls and there's Joshua Wang, this iconic Hong Kong activists who's taking on the big powers in Beijing. And he's there and Wallster starts talking to him, and he's just blown away by how much Walls knows.
Wals has also sponsored numerous resolutions that condemned China's killings in tanem And Square and support Chinese activists and lawyers. But despite his consistent advocacy for political freedom and human rights in China, Walsa said he's not necessarily a China hawk.
He is not like some other power politic who he to want them to decouple with China. He strongly believes engagement.
That's Professor Lee of the University of Hong Kong. Again, he says Walts's approach to China is very much aligned with the the rest of the Democratic Party.
Harris and the Biden Harris administration also does not want to have completely couple and they also want to emphasize culture and education exchanges. Tim was probably will continue to put the human rights the issues, but the Democrats politician no one talked about regime change. This is not their agenda, right, They do discuss about the issue about the human rights, monor to rights, shinjiag and etc. So I think in
that regard Tiam was also fitted in very well. He probably will continue to be critical, but it will be rational not to go too far and another jeopardize the whole thing.
Whilst his time in China also seems to have earned him more respect there.
One of the issues in your general relations may not be the ideological differences or the conflict interest, but the misunderstanding miscalculation. This is particularly by the people who have no ideas about other kanji, the way of thinking, or some of the basic knowledge. So Tim is the right person to avoid these kind of things. So I think not only Chinese public, but also Chinese leaders are willing to deal with this kind of more knowledgeable people.
The professor, do you think Americans view of Tim Walls's knowledge of China and his connection to the country. Would they view it as an asset or a liability?
Some people in the US Congress or particular Republicans think that you have connection with China, you're doing business with China. You may be brainwashed by China. Also, sadly, some people just claim that they are the best people to deal with China because they have no experience with China, never being China. May they have study language and have no knowledge of China, that's the qualification. Now, I ciddly think that expertise knowledge is an asset for American political leader.
You again, I said that even China is the enemy, you should studied. You should know better measure about your friend, how to get along with, how to impooor relationship.
For now, that relationship remains tense with the world's two biggest superpowers wrestling over issues from Taiwan to trade to technology.
I think US politicians in general are wary of China. They don't trust China in particular, and they want to make sure that America stays ahead of China and has an edge on China.
Here's Bloomberg's Dan ten Kate again.
So Kamala Harris and Timols really believe that America should stay one step ahead of China, particularly with that vanced technology. So that means blocking China's access to high end semiconductors, high end chips that can be used for AI, certain biotech, clean energy. These are the things that they want the US to maintain an edge on. And that's, you know, for simple reasons. If they do go to war, they don't want American technology used against them. That's the sic
premise of that. They do believe, however, that there should be trade, and I think where they think Trump goes too far is with the tariffs. Trump's threatening a sixty percent tariff on China right now. It'll be interesting what Tim Walls says in the debate, but Kamala Harris was saying that likening that to Trump tax on the American people and raising the quest of goods there.
Now, Dan khud Walls's experience in China helps smooth the relations between Washington and Beijing.
It certainly can't hurt right the problem in all of this is that in Washington, DC right now, it doesn't pay politically to say anything nice about China, even if he wants to say nice things about China. If he does, he's going to get brutally attacked by the Republicans and they're going to pounce on anything he has to say. That said, if he does get the vice presidency and Kamala Harris becomes president, that experience that he has can
certainly play a role. We know when people get into power that they have much more flexibility than when they're in the campaign period. So we probably just haven't seen and we probably won't hear really what he thinks about China until he's actually in the office.
This is The Big Take Asia from Bloomberg News. I'm wanh. This episode was produced by Young Young, Naomi, and Jessica Beck. It was mixed by Blake Maples and fact checked by Young. It was edited by Caitlin Kenny and Daniel tim Kate. Nicole Beemster Bower is our executive producer, Elizabeth Ponso is our senior editor, and Sage Bauman is Bloomberg's head of Podcasts. Please follow and review The Big Take Asia wherever you listen to podcasts. It really helps new listeners find the show.
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