¶ Episode Introduction and Anzac Day Reflections
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Yeah.
is big small talk.
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This is the podcast where we try and cover the entirety of the news cycle, from the serious to the frivolous, all in one place.
Because loving pop culture doesn't mean you don't understand politics.
And today we're gonna be talking about shooting at the White House Correspondence Dinner, Kyle and Jackie O's lawsuits, the criminal investigation into Chat GPT, allegations against Alex Cooper's on Well Network, and the gas tax debate ramps up.
But before we begin today's episode, we would like to start by acknowledging the traditional owners of the land on which we're recording today, the Gadigal people, and pay our respect to Elders past and present.
Before we get into the afternoon, Hannah, what is your personal headline this week?
Yeah.
Cheers.
Ha ha ha.
I should just say at the top, I am not well. I'm good.
Alex Cooper's Unwell Network, Sarah's State of Being. It's just like she's coming this morning. Beautiful green jumper, might I add, across your shoulders. Pretty little headband in. gal like it's like she's had sunstroke folks. It's she's surviving, she's thriving.
I think I found the base, but
I'm I'm launching I'm launching a campaign to send myself to three hundred percent adrenaline right now to try and like kind of offer two multiple personalities for the both of us in today's record. Like I literally looked at you and I was like, oh my god, I have to ramp up
Uh I think I'm just I think my body's giving in. No.
been in. Big year. The news hasn't let up. You've been doing a lot of records across two very big shows at the moment. We are obviously one of those very big shows. Thank you for saying that and knowing that, listeners. Um no, it's been a big time and I think sometimes a long weekend is almost an opportunity for the body to break down.
Yeah, I do think it's like when you stop you crash. Yeah. Um, but I did end up working most of the long weekends. Yeah.
I did I ended up working a full day yesterday. I was just like, uh it's got you know, it's one of those things, especially when you are in a kind of a workplace setting where you have to just do it, right? Whether it's your own business or whatever it is. And it is just something where you go, Oh, long weekend, great, I can catch up on some stuff.
Like literally. Um, but I did have a lot of fun on actu ads like day, it's getting out of hand in Sydney.
It's a Sydney icon that's gone too far.
That was so I live in Paddington. I did the dawn service and had a few people come over and we were going to go to the pub. It was 8 a.m. and there was a line that was on my street. I'm not on the straight of the pub.
Every year we see these videos. So we we have the dawn service where people go, they get up really early and then they go straight from the dawn service from that r again, respectful, commemorative moment. Again, we also should mention the booing we saw. But we can't go to the pub chat until we actually acknowledge the horror of seeing First Nations veterans booed around the country at Anzac Day Dawn services on Saturday morning.
couldn't believe when I saw that headline pop up on my phone and I just thought what is going on?
And it's important to acknowledge that there was also so much applause and so much celebration and so many thanks that were given to those veterans. But to hear that booing, not just in one city, but around the country. Um, you know, Uncle Ray was at the Sydney Dawn service, he was booed, the discomfort, the sicken the kind of nauseating feeling watching
I was embarrassed to read it.
It's humiliating. I feel embarrassed. I I think Anzac Day is supposed to be this time to have respect and s and kind of recognition of sacrifice and to see such disrespect towards a veteran. I think it
It again, it's a small group. We should really acknowledge it as a small group, but it is reflective of the current political discourse in Australia. And it's the second year in a row that we've seen this now. So it's a really important to call out, but also to say it is a small minority that is incredibly loud that are doing these horrific actions too.
¶ White House Dinner Shooting Details
It is. But I do think from what it sounds like at Sydney and Melbourne, it was quite loud. There was quite a lot of people involved. And actually Harry was at the last year's one that happened.
Oh, yeah.
He said as well it was kind of reported as a small group, but he said it was incr there was a lot of people doing it and it was just so
disturb. It might be a small percentage of people there, but it is enough people where it is part of the national discourse and something we need to address as well. Um But yeah, and then, you know, in Sydney every year it's this massive day where straight after the dawn surface, people get in line to go to the pub. If you are in the eastern submers of Sydney, you are lining up for like three hours.
So eight AM there was uh hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of people, which is like fun, but it was impossible to get in anywhere then. I ended up going to a pub that was fun, but it was also so hot, and then I had no reception. No reception there and I was like, Oh my god, uh this is trying times. Outta hand.
Not in the inner west. As an inner west queen myself, I was at a pub with no lineup, but we had a big day on Saturday. phenomenal. It was I lost sixty bucks. That's okay. But I had a great day.
Plank two up.
I'm not good at it. I'm not a natural gambler. If you know me and you thought, wow, I bet she's a good punter. No, actually, shockingly not. Um, terrible at it, get really nervous, g I struggle to bet against anyone. Go tails'cause I don't want to start putting money on my hand. I get a bit stressed out by it. But I just love it. I love it because it's a day to get beyond your bubble. Like it's a day that crosses demographics. It's a really nice moment, I think.
So yeah, it's been a big weekend. I did sleep for 16 hours on Saturday. So I got up, did some work, went back to bed for a long nap. I think I I think that's what stopped me from getting sick. I genuinely slept for sixteen hours on Saturday. But anyway, we're we're here. The news didn't let up.
No.
We're gonna get into it?
Starting with the White House correspondence, you know.
Let's lock in. Shots were fired at the White House Correspondence Dinner and here is what we know so far. You would have heard this reported sometime Sunday morning, get another alleged assassination attempt on President Donald Trump. It's kind of weird to say an assassination attempt when this person didn't even really get close, but everything we know
says that it really was clearly a direct attack on the press, on the cabinet members, on the president who was in attendance at this dinner. But again, kind of an interesting context for this to unfold given it's in a ballroom filled with journalists. who cover him, you know, who literally cover the presidency, the White House. It's such an interesting spot to be primed for coverage, for conversation, and for competing viewpoints of what happens.
Can we explain what the White House correspondence tonight is?
¶ The Attack and Shooter's Identity
Yes. Now you probably know, I mean many people won't I guess, every year this is kind of like the annual gala. It's quite a glamorous event. Journalists, celebrities, high ranking government officials. The president I think always goes. Usually there is a comedian that delivers kind of a roasting, kind of like a g Golden Globes but for the press gallery almost. Um, and it's it's really an opportunity to celebrate the freedom of the press, which is
ironic and divisive in the era of Donald Trump. Um, but usually it's an event that he would avoid because he is so famous for hating the press and treating them like shit. Essentially. And, you know, I thought it was so interesting to watch this coverage unfold live of like press reporters under tables as they heard shots fire out.
At about 8 p.m. Washington time during the gala. So the the proceedings hadn't even really commenced yet. And what we know, this was at the Washington Hilton. And security at this venue is is quite loose. It doesn't have the highest security clearance. It has a lot of opportunity for an attack like this because you've got a high volume of famous people, of important people, like people like Erica Kirker in attendance at this event.
my best friend that I always endorse on the pod, Caitlin Collins from CNN. She's doing reports in her pink ball gown with her air pods in live just after these shots were heard ringing out. Like it's kind of this really strange context for this to occur.
But what we do know is that the man alleged to be a suitor, which I'll explain who he is and what we know about him in a second, but he was registered as a guest at the hotel at the Washington Hilton. And we believe he was armed with multiple knives, a shotgun, and a handgun. Now he was said by authorities that so this is Metro Police in Washington to have been charging a checkpoint with a firearm in hand running towards the ballroom.
He was unable to get past that checkpoint, which obviously saved the attendees from any harm. However, one Secret Service agent was shot. He's alive. I think he was throwing a bulletproof vest. It's a bit of conflicting information I've read, but what is unclear is whether a colleague has shot him in the attempts to stop the shooter or whether the shooter's bullet was the one that hit his vest.
So the bit of conflicting information there we will wait for a bit more of the ballistics casings information to come out. What we do know about the shooter is he's 31 years old and his name is Cole Thomas Allen. I'm gonna get to his letter slash manifesto in a second, but what we do know is that he claims he d identifies himself as um of mixed race. So he says he's half white and half black in the statement itself. And
We also know that in this statement he has referred to himself in his sign off as, and again, I say allegedly, because we have him in custody charged. He's alive. And we also have this a thousand word or more letter f allegedly from him. But again, this is all the big A word right now.
And what this manifesto really depicts him as is quite like a a high achieving, normal member of society. We know that he was recently a part-time teacher at a tutoring comp at a tutoring company, which kind of prepared kids for college, I believe. And in late 2024, he was teacher of the month. At that tutoring college, I believe. He's also a mechanical engineer, a game developer, and he's from a suburb in Los Angeles.
He was charged in US courts on Monday with attempting to assassinate US President Donald Trump and he was also charged with uh I think two other offenses relating to weapons, but they're waiting to potentially charge him with more offenses depending on what this investigation reveals. But only in the last hour when I was scrolling for updates through various news sources did I see on ground news.
His manifesto in full. So originally over the weekend I saw it was kind of leaked to the new like it was disclosed by authorities to the New York Times who didn't want to be named and we saw kind of parts being picked up on.
¶ Shooter's Bizarre Manifesto Content
I want to read some of this pu I wanna read out some aspects of this manifesto. It's quite long, so I can't get into all of it. It's probably one of the strangest things I've ever read.
This whole thing is bizarre.
It's very bizarre.
Like the the location choice
Yep. I think the location choice is interesting because at a hotel where you can be booked as a guest, it's kind of one of the only access points you could have to a large number of powerful people.
The hilt.
I know, I know, but it's kind of interesting to go every reporter who's anyone kind of close to the White House is gonna be here. Celebrities, you know, cabinet members, everyone with their partners, you know, with some of their family members.
From memory, the White House correspondence dinner is usually where they have like comedians and everyone do openings.
Yes, yeah, yeah. So like um I think it was Jimmy Kimmel, I th it's it's been um what's Scarlett Johansson's husband's name, Colin.
What's his name? Colin Jost.
And dressed that's exactly right. Um, there's been, you know, like so many different comedians have kind of given roasts. You know, I remember they were famous during the Obama era. But this man, this thirty one year old, his manifesto literally opens with Hello everybody exclamation mark. That is the opening line. He says So I may have given a lot of people a surprise today. That's wild as an opening sentence.
Let me start off by apologizing to everyone whose trust I abused. You'd think he meant Potentially the people he was going to fire on. He says, I apologize to my parents for saying I had an interview without specifying it was for most wanted.
This is for real. He goes on, right, to apologize to all of the people that he was near or in like in proximity to in the lead up to this event. So he says sorry to like the baggage staff that would have handled his luggage, the hotel staff that were put in danger. But the core of his statement, right? Is and his reasoning for this. He says, I am a citizen of the United States of America. What my representatives do reflects on me.
And he goes on to this line about being no longer willing to permit a pedophile, rapist, and traitor to coat his hands, like as in the shooter's hands, with his crime. But he then has a list of officials who were targets.
Sorry.
For example, he says administration officials, not including Mr. Patel. Can we be clear on that? BI director Cash Patel, he specifies as not being included in his list. Bizarre. He says they are targets prioritized from highest ranking to lowest. Then it's like next paragraph. Secret service he describes as like only if necessary. Hotel security, he stipulates, not targets unless they shoot him, basically, he kind of eludes to.
He then also lists and it goes on and on and on, right? But he also lists a series of possible rebuttals to him committing these assassinations and corrects them. So what I mean here is he says objection one. As a Christian, you should turn the other cheek. So he's saying this is what people might criticize him for for doing this shooting. And he then offers a response to each other
I mean...
Interesting.
I kind of get it
Speaker on a debating team, really strange kind of
It's interesting'cause it look sounds like there's been no thought put into this and yet clearly a lot of thought.
Well what's interesting too is you've got online this debate, which is bound to occur after these multiple assassination attempts against Donald Trump, right? where half the internet is going, This is a false flag, this is not real. You've got half the internet going, classic, he would write exactly like this. Like it's quite and it's not really like left or right. It's just like this really interesting breakdown
of commentary on on what has happened. And you've also got like Trump has incredibly low ratings right now, like one of the lowest in US presidential history. And there's lots of people claiming oh, this will get his ratings back up again. This is a distraction mechanism. You've got people claiming it's fake.
But like again, I don't think that's helpful. I think we need to like really be obviously discouraging political violence here. But like looking at this man's manifesto, it's really a strange read.
One of the rebuttals he offers this to this objection one, as a Christian, you should turn the other cheek. He says, turning the other cheek is for when you yourself are oppressed. And then he goes on to list atrocities that he believes are committed by the Trump administration. So he says things like,
I'm not the fisherman executed without trial. I'm not a school kid blown up or a child starved or a teenage girl abused by the many criminals in this administration. And there's lists of these objections.
¶ Political Violence and Trump's Response
And he signs off, I'm just gonna get to the end'cause we can't go through the whole thing in this segment, he signs off and says, Thank you all for everything. Sincerely Cole, cold forced, friendly federal assassin, Alan.
Okay, break that down.
So this is the kind of title, I don't know about cold force, but friendly federal assassins, almost like he's saying, I'm a good Samaritan in my assassination attempt. Like he's trying to claim moral like he's doing this for the greater good kind of angle, right? So he's he's really clearly aligning with the left. Now
I've read pages and pages of people going through his LinkedIn, his blue sky, all his social media profiles saying, you know, there's beliefs that he voted for Carmel Harris at the last federal election. There's all this kind of speculation, right? Makes sense, right? speculation as to what who this person is. And again, I'm reporting on this. We're talking about this only a couple of days after this has all happened. So I'm sure so much more will come out about this.
But it's also interesting because reading this coverage made me realize how little we know in the aftermath of the other assassination attempts. Do you just feel like these were moments that were kind of flashing the pen, moments that we never kind of followed up with? outcome or the kind of case of Charlie Kirk's assassin. We've never really followed up
Well that was we did though, but there was a lot of contention about who that was, where he was from, what his family's political beliefs were, what his sexuality was, if he was the one that actually did it. There were so many conspiracies about him.
many conspiracies and again, so often these people are shot and killed in the moment, but there have been so many assassination attempts and so many acts of political violence in recent years in the US. that it's kind of interesting to see that it's such a recurrence now that it's been normalized. So the way that I've seen the media, I've seen commentators online talking about this is like another day Well, under the Sarban banner, you know? Yeah, this is the th at least.
Yeah.
So it's it's
But also his interviews since
Oh my God, thank you for pointing us in this direction. I wanna play a grab of sort of a report. It was this was aired on sixty minutes on Sunday night. And I wanna play this specific portion of this interview on sixty minutes between Trump and this woman interviewer, where she's basically asking him about part of these manif parts of this manifesto and his response to them.
The so-called manifesto is a stunning thing to read, Mr. President. He appears to reference a motive in it. He writes this quote: Administration officials, they are targets. And he also wrote this. I am no longer willing to permit a pedophile, rapist, and traitor to coat my hands with his crimes. What's your reaction to that?
Well I was waiting for you to read that because I knew you would, because you're you're h you're horrible people. Horrible people. Yeah, he did write that. Uh I'm I'm not a rapist. I didn't rape anybody.
Oh yeah.
Excuse me.
That's what I wanted.
Yeah.
Can I just say to this incredible interviewer the line, oh so you think he was referring to you?
Yeah.
Just for him to immediately and again, I understand.
Is that why?
Obviously infer that it's him, but like good for her.
I Of course it was in Ferragid. They shot they tried to shoot him.
Also like And also these are not just allegations that he is a rapist, right? He has been found, you know, in defamation proceedings to be a rapist of E. Jean Carroll. Um, like I think that obviously it's directed at him, but for her to do that, oof, so good. Um and so, you know. It's so interesting for him to immediately when referring to a manifesto of you know an alleged assassin, for him to immediately jump to you are horrible people for even repeating the core sentiment of that manifesto.
But again, we're gonna see in the coming days what the response will be. It hasn't disrupted um King Charles' visit to the US, which I believe will take place later this week. And it's interesting because a lot of the right wing sentiment that's emerged after this assassination attempt is uh you know, this is why we need the new ballroom. That's kind of been one of the core sentiments from the right wing. So it's an interesting campaign for them to justify this.
mm you know, hundred multi-hundred million dollar spend that President Trump is justifying through like a safety mechanism. So again, this feels like a a an a a pattern for the US that's emerging, but we will hopefully have more reporting and updates on it too.
¶ Kyle & Jackie O's Legal and Workplace Drama
Kyle Sandlands and Jackie O'Henderson are now being counter-sued by their former broadcaster ARN Media. So obviously this is after the Kyla Jacchio show suddenly ended back in February and now ARN, the company, is fighting back with their own legal action launched at the two of them. So what we know is that Jackie O. Henderson refused to continue working with Kyle Sanderlands after the on air dispute that they had. We spoke about it on the pod at length at the time.
Um, but it ended effectively their twenty year on air partnership. Huge.
Yeah, massive deal.
It was a big deal and I think it's because as well, like this was one of the biggest this was the biggest show and it was also a huge financial deal on the line. So the hosts were expected to earn a combined two hundred million dollars over the next ten years. and they were barely a year into the deal and that deal was not set to end until two thousand and thirty four.
And then after the show collapsed, both hosts launched a federal court action against their former employer, both for over$80 million, each by claiming that their contracts were terminated without cause. Another development in this, though, is that we also now know that Kiss FM owner, which is the ARN Media, gave Kyle Sanderlands a$3 million bonus. just to sign his a hundred million dollar contract, but did not give one to Jackie Oh, according to legal filings from the company now.
So can you explain why they're countersuing now?
So what the broadcasters claimed is that the breakdown between the hosts seriously threatened its financial survival. Ending the show's early caused major losses in profits and advertising revenue. And the company is now seeking damages for breach of contract, compensation for financial losses, and their legal costs.
So interesting too, because I like I looking at these these reasonings, right? You kinda go to put all your money and massive amounts of money into the ten year plan of Kyle and Jackie O and then sort of say, like, yeah, but your relationship breakdown, which was always predictable. is going to cause the end of our company, but we relied on you two. Like it's such an interesting dynamic to be like, this was entirely foreseeable and you put all your eggs in one basket in a in a in a certain way.
This is what's crazy about this whole case though, is that it wasn't foreseeable to us. Like to listeners, everyone was very shocked that this happened. Like everyone really thought they were gonna ride or die till the end. That was very much their dynamic. But from what was clearly happening on the inside. This was foreseeable. Maybe.
I guess. I think it's interesting because I think the reason people think it would never happen is because they kind of say anything and everything to each other and it seems they have nothing off limit. But also that's n that sort of a relationship is never going to be conducive to a healthy workplace dynamic either. It's it's an interesting one.
So the court documents revealed last week on Wednesday that both Jackie O and Kyle's contracts included a clause requiring them to indemnify ARN for any breach of contract or legal issues. In its cross claim, ARN says that it has suffered losses, including reduced advertising revenue and profits, which we did speak about before. Like go back and listen to that episode we spoke about the witches campaign.
and how they were at this massive loss for advertising, um, because of how problematic they were as a duo on air. And argues that both presenters, private companies, are responsible for covering those costs, along with the related expenses and damages. Also, ARN is seeking to recover part of Kyle's$3 million sign-on bonus. The company claims that because 87.92% of his contract was still outstanding, his business entity owes about 2.6 million. No similar repayment is being sought from Jackie O.
Because she didn't get it. Yeah. Like, but also it's interesting to like have a sign-on bonus and then say, Well, you haven't completed the contract, so you can't have the I d I don't think that's a fix.
I was wondering that when I read it. I was like, that's how to sign on bonuses for.
I yeah, I don't know enough about sign on bonuses but that feel that feels like not right.
I mean I don't think I'm surprised that ARN is countersuit. What was the alternative?
That's another lawsuit, Sarah.
Genuinely though at this point. Yeah. So another part of this case is that we also have a letter from Jackie O's lawyers on February twenty sixth about a week after the on-air clash. And in this letter, to simplify it, it alleges the company knew about ongoing workplace bullying by Kyle, that Jackie's experienced repeated and constant bullying both on air and off-air, that she was left psychologically unwell.
She said she could not continue working directly with Kyle, and then Jackie O reportedly said he she would still honor her contract, but only if moved to a different time slot away from him.
What's ARN's like defence or kind of claim responding to that though?
So its defence documents released on Thursday argues that it had no ability or power to step in and stop Kyle Sonderlands from allegedly bullying or behaving behaving inappropriately towards Jackie O once the show was live on air. The company also said that on February twentieth, executives checked in on Jackie O several times after the broadcast and spoke with producers, making clear that they considered Kyle's behaviour unacceptable.
I genuinely can't wait to see this all unfold and all of the documentation around the history of complaints. Because what is happening from my perspective here, which might be totally incorrect and that's why we need to hear more information. is that it's almost like the second this dispute has happened, everyone's kind of workplace relations and industrial relations and employment law knowledge goes through the roof. Yeah. And I haven't seen much that details before this.
this clear pattern of kind of HR, basically. And I want to know what was actually happening every single time, you know, Kyle was engaging in what was alleged to be workplace bullying or harassment.
I just don't know how anyone really wins in this because if you build a show where the culture of the show is at odds with everything HR is meant to stand for. then where do you stop and start with this? As a host, as the company putting on the show, as the producers on the show, where do you start to draw the line when the lines have been blurred for twenty years?
It's also like this is so nerdy of me. I used to work for a union and do like Fair Work Commission matters and things and it was an incredible experience because workplaces are inherently tense. There are a lot of competing interests, there are a lot of difficult relationships. There are a lot of hierarchical issues. There are a lot of, you know, inequalities in the workplace. And they're different relationships to family or any other kind, right?
Yeah. And then make this medium.
Make this media, make this hundreds of millions of dollars, make this in like two of Australia's most prominent voices that have historically been problematic as a brand.
Coming from a certain generation as well.
Yes, this is such an interesting test of of again and legacy media and radio, which is a different dynamic altogether as well.
Hm. We also um We saw this play out in the court on Friday. Yeah, okay. So what happened on Friday is Kyle's team pushed for his case to go to trial as early as June, but the justice said no and that the lawsuit should proceed together in October. Jackie O was not there in person, but Gemma, her agent, was there. Kyle outside the courtroom said, They say that Henderson don't want to be in the same courtroom. That's their legal strategy. We have a different strategy.
Just don't believe the bullshit that you hear and read. Just wait and see what comes out in court. And according to the AFR, Jackie O has enlisted a medical expert to detail the psychological trauma that was inflicted on her by Kyle. There's a lot to come in this.
This is this is going to be fascinating.
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¶ OpenAI Under Criminal Investigation
Florida has launched a criminal investigation into Open AI after it was found to have been consulted by Phoenix Ickner before he committed a mass shooting. This was a story that I came across last week and was so determined to cover it because it raises a series of ethical questions about.
businesses and harm and when, you know, government is expected to intervene, essentially, and how political lines are crossed and how productivity is valued over actual the safety of humans that use the product, basically. So on the seventeenth of April last year. A twenty-year-old student named Phoenix Ickner carried out a shooting at Florida State University. It only lasted about three minutes.
Two men were killed. Both of them were support staff that worked at the university. One was the dining director of the campus, the other was a campus vendor. He also shot five other people and a sixth person was injured while running away.
The perpetrator was shot once in the jaw by police when he refused to comply with their directions, and he survived this shooting, and he's been charged with two counts of first degree murder and seven counts of attempted first degree murder with a firearm, and that's according to CNN. Now
Ickner was a political science major at this university and he was actually the stepson of a sheriff's deputy police officer, right? So really interesting. So it's alleged that he used his stepmother's former service weapon. to commit this v this these killings. But the major conversation around this case is the use of chat GPT. Florida's attorney general is a man named James Euthemeyer.
And he announced on the ninth of April that they were investigating Open AI in relation to the shooting, but it wasn't until the twenty-first of April that they commenced and formally announced a criminal investigation into open AI. So elevating the status. And he gave a full press conference. What he ultimately announced is that ChatGPT advised Ickner on a series of things related to the shooting. What he advised him on was crucial. What type of gun he should use?
Whether or not the gun would be useful in short range, what time of day at the university would allow the most access to people? Where on campus the highest population of people would be, which ammo went with the gun. Like vital information to aid the murder of multiple people, like to commit a mass shooting.
Now
What's really interesting actually in giving this press conference is Florida's attorney general is a Republican. And I have a lot of I just think it's worth noting in all this like left and right divide that I think he's been incredibly appropriate in his approach to this announcement, where he says, you know,
He believes in the limited power of government interview with business. He's saying, like, I am like a right-wing person, so like a small government person. But we need to be looking at where harm kind of goes past business productivity and business allowances, right? And this is the perfect example of that. He said, We recognize that here with AI, we are venturing into uncharted territory, but we need to know whether whether or not open AI has criminal liability.
And basically what he said in his press conference too was like, realistically, if Ickner was consulting a person on the other end of his phone, we'd be charging them too. So what happens when that's a bot, when that's chat GPT? Which is such an interesting ethical discussion to be having.
¶ AI Liability and Uncharted Legal Territory
And think about think about how many people use OpenAI, Chat GPT, every single day to ask multiple ridiculous questions. Like using it like a Google search engine. 'Cause like, how do you even begin to start flagging these things when there is such a influx of questions from people all around the world? It's also like, what about the people that have used Google in the past and things like that?
genu I mean, that's actually a great question too. I mean, you can do research through Google, but that is I think there's a level of agency required versus like a short form, like friendly response where it's almost like a human that's responding to you like you're chatting to a friend getting advice. Yeah. It's it's like it's a different level of autonomy and agency that you have when researching something. Because again, that would go back to a question of like,
Well, if you went to a public library to consult a book on what type of ammo to use in a gun, that's no different to the internet. And using that versus using open AI to get formal advice, it's
Interesting. Hey, thinking about doing a shooting. What do you reckon? Yeah.
but also like questions about the population on campus at the time and key areas. I don't think I mean I guess that raises questions for me and my researching abilities. I don't think you're able to find that directly.
You wouldn't think so, but it could probably do maths of like, well, there's this many students and this is a pot like I don't know.
popular class times and like all the data that it scrapes, where is that data coming from? It isn't accessible to the everyday researcher as well.
Yeah. It's probably the extension beyond Google of like, well, the reason they have this data is because they are pulling from everyone asking so many questions all the time.
I am proud to not know the answers to these questions. Do you know what I mean? Like when we're speculating on all this is because we are so far departed from the reality of what this person is thinking and planning, yeah, that we don't understand it.
Can I ask what the possible outcomes are here?
Well, this is the interesting one because we don't really know. Like, you know, if you were a person that was kind of conjoined to this, giving advice, you could be charged with, you know, aiding and abetting. Um, like, you know, there's there's lots of different charges that could relate to this.
But, you know, the New York Times also reported that the AG's office here was continuing kind of into like a civil investigation into potential criminal liability here. But again, there's so many unprecedented cases that are unfolding right now in relation to social media platforms.
that we don't know how, you know, a Chat GPT and open AI, how AI is going to be treated and if it could be similar to the way that social media platforms are being treated by civil courts at the moment too when we're examining
Well, what is the impact when it really, really has a deep effect on human behavior and outcomes in human lives? But again, I think the reason this case is unique is because to date, what we've seen a lot of is Questions and discussions around Chat GPT's assistance and advice when people are considering self harm?
Suicide? Yeah. And when it actually comes to the murder of others, this is an interesting different question as well. To see the different levels of liability and how those are judged, this is a new era for the court system, for the judicial system to be making these judgment calls.
Well it's also just so scary because at the best of times our court systems can't keep up with changing technology.
No, I mean think about the levels of image-based abuse we're seeing through AI at the moment, which is another prime example of how a court's going to treat this. What is the severity? What is the harm level? And, you know, when these these tools are so easy for the everyday person to access in different ways, what does it actually mean for the harm cause? And how do we hold, you know, Sam Altman or, you know, as a business OpenAI accountable for that? Yeah.
¶ Unwell Network's Business and Expansion
Bloomberg has released a report claiming that Alex Cooper's company Unwell is in fact unwell.
I'm so glad we're going through this because I've seen the headlines, like the page six vibe, and I've been like, Well, what is happening here? And how do you trust the backgrounding sources on this given what's happening with Alex versus Alex right now?
I know. I think it's really funny. I found when when we first did the Kyle and Jackie O story, we got a few messages of people that were so enthralled with the story, you know, like clearly have grown up listening, been aware of Kyle and Jackie O for years and said they were like asking questions and wanting more.
And then we had a few people messaging being like, I don't know, I don't care about Carl and Jacchio. Similar for Alex Cooper. People like this is the best tea. I like this is my Roman Empire. I'm so obsessed with this story. And then other people like who are these two Alexes? What are podcasters? What is the thing?
I kind of love it'cause I saw those messages too on the account, right? And I think it's interesting when it's like a Kyle and Jackio and an Alex versus Alex story because even if you don't know or don't care for the characters involved because you're not a TikTok person and you don't like those podcasts or they don't like their radio show, whatever. I don't either. But it's a really interesting intersection of like business, politics and influencing.
Oh a hundred percent. That's why I'm interested in it. But also, like they're both prime examples of for their time as well. Like Alex Cooper with this whole story and everyone she represents with Unwell would be this like frontier of
Uh new media.
Media creators that have massive influence and worth millions and millions and millions of dollars. But I do think it's interesting because she's not an actress or a singer, she kind of falls into the influencer basket, even though I wouldn't put her there. You know what I mean? Like I it's almost like
People put her as like almost in like a she's a reality TV star basket. Where I would say she's not that at all, but it is just that like new media that's not traditional celebrity in the way that we understand it.
Yeah.
Anyway, this has been fascinating to follow the whole Alex Earl, Alex Cooper thing. There isn't much of an update on that. I know I don't don't think there is going to be, to be honest. You reckon?
Totally, you cannot it is so bad to stand down on that I think.
I I think I think we won that round.
I think it will take a bit of time and it will take some legal checks and, you know, beforehand, basically.
Or my other theory. Alex Earl's coming out with a reality TV show and I have a feeling if anything they're gonna wait for her to do it on her own platform for V.
Yeah.
That would make sense to me as well. But there is a bit going on behind the scenes of Alex Cooper's uh on Well Network. Again, for anyone that doesn't know, Alex Cooper is the host of Call Her Daddy. And there's been a pretty explosive report. So on April 20th, Bloomberg published an article called Inside Alex Cooper's Unwell, Tears Screaming and Employees Looking for the Exit.
Now to understand it, we kind of have to go back to the beginning a bit about unwell as a company as well. So in 2023, Cooper launched the business alongside of her husband, a film producer named Matt Kaplan. also used to be married to Claire Holt from H2O and the Vampire Diaries. Oh.
No I didn't either
Yeah, surprise. Um, who, by the way, also Matt has worked in over fifty films and TV shows, including Netflix's to all the boys, France on the book.
Love before? Yes. Do you love those films?
And together they created a parent company called Trending. So under the umbrella of trending is the Unwell Network, which is Alex Cooper's podcast empire and lifestyle brand, and then also Matt Kaplan's production company, Ace Entertainment.
¶ Unwell's Struggles and Workplace Allegations
Okay, I didn't know how intertwined these two were.
Yeah. for them was to build a Gen Z media empire across podcasts, TV, events, products, merch, the whole thing, right? Honestly, it's worked. Between 2023 and 2025, the company absolutely boomed. They hired dozens of staff, they expanded into live events, into TV projects, into creative agency work, merch, everything. And they did this off the back of Alex Cooper's sixty million dollar Spotify deal.
Then she signed another massive three year deal in two thousand twenty four with Sirius XM, which was reportedly worth up to 125 million. That allowed her to bring her call her daddy content over to the Unwell platform. Now to give you a sense of scale, the Unwell Network now has a combined social reach of thirty-seven million.
Wow. So that's just following on all of those platforms. Yeah. Wow.
But despite all of this growth, the company has struggled to create hit shows beyond Call Her Daddy.
They're all successful.
Successful. And and I also think Podcasting is so interesting because like the jump between a known podcast to a top podcast would be massive. You'd have to be in the millions. Yeah. So to to crack a call her daddy level, I I don't even know if that's possible. But she also has boyfriend material with Harry Jowsey. So random to me. He's Australian. Who is that?
that.
You don't know who Harry Jalsey is? No. He
So many people who are famous right now. Do you even feel like that? There are just so many famous people.
There's that as well. That's what I mean. It's saturation as well. Harry Jowsey, I believe, was in that reality TV show too hot to handle. Okay. done a bunch of stuff off the back of that. Uh The Burnouts with Phoebe Gates and Sophia Chiani. Phoebe Gates is in Bill Gates' daughter.
thank you for this context i'm thinking oh yes i missed that one
Well she they started that app, Fear?
Oh my god, the the shopping one. Yes. Yes, I saw I did see this. Yes. So
It's it's like a business podcast.
Like a shopping AI sort of situation. Sorry, I feel like you did explain this to me very well actually.
One point extension. It's an app and an extension you can have in your browser to like find the best deals on things. Pretty lonesome with Madeline Argy. She's hilarious. I really like her content. Um disgraceful with Grace O'Malley, who has got Who had the big blow up with um Brianna Chicken Fry, that was her best friend.
Chicken fry never misses
She never misses an episode.
Chicken fry, she's always with us.
But there's been like a there's a mix of like reality, lifestyle, even true crime pods.
I get what you mean because it's not like none of those podcasts actually ring a bell for me. And it's kind of like there's just a huge gap between number one and the rest.
Basically. Oh, and Halle Bachelor. Extra dirty. That one seems quite known to me, but again, I don't really know the numbers. They also launched three original shows for the unwell branded Sirius XM radio station, uh, but within a year all of those shows were cancelled. And since then, instead of building new hits from scratch, the company has reportedly shifted more towards acquiring existing podcasts, which
I don't know, it's funny. It's so funny whenever we cover the stuff like being in this industry, because that is where pretty much all companies are heading. Yeah. Uh which is to have a proven product rather than take the gamble because it so much goes into building a podcast from scratch.
Now to the report. So according to Bloomberg, there have been ongoing concerns about the workplace environment. Matt Kaplan is alleged to have developed a reputation for yelling at their staff, with multiple sources saying some employees have threatened to quit over his behavior. There were also claims of broader tension between leadership and the staff, to the point where people have said they'd leave production or tours if things didn't improve.
¶ Leadership Challenges and Company Culture
Did you watch Call Me Alex?
No.
So her s like docuseries about her life and building on well and call her daddy, there is this scene where she's about to go on tour and someone's about to quit and she's like, I can't do this whole show. You're the only one that knows how to do everything. And he goes, That's my problem. And there's this whole bit where she needs to come in. She goes, I had no idea that like any of this was happening. Nobody told me.
The only reason I find that scene really interesting to look back on now is it's very much this Alex d runs the creative and Matt runs the business. That's what sort of was presented in the docuseries. Anyway, it made me think of that. There was one example, um, as well that's more recent from the Bloomberg Report during the filming of the Unwell Winter Games for YouTube, where Matt Kaplan allegedly berated staff on set and warned mistakes could impact their future work in Hollywood.
Apparently one senior crew member was left in tears and others went on to file their formal complaints. Behind the scenes there's also been quite a bit of staff turnover, including senior roles like the head of brand marketing, head of the network. chief growth officer, and that's all within just the past year. Now, publicly Alex Cooper has described the culture as work hard, play hard. Always concerning.
I think there is actually an interesting conversation here broadly about um married couples running businesses together. Because you can't have an open door policy when no one feels safe to go to you about your own romantic partners.
I think there's a really in I I don't have an issue with family starting business together. Obviously, like I'm not gonna make that sort of a call. Like I literally talked to my partner every day about it, we should do this, we should do that, like we're always thinking about this stuff.
But I think from an employment front and a safety cultural front, um, it's incredibly dangerous not to have checks and balances where you can be told about things your partner is doing because you you actually like th there is no cultural safety there, right? There is none.
God, I remember I worked for a place where the HR was uh the boss's cousin.
Oh yeah, that was awesome. Um
And then there's a bit of a side plot here I want to talk about as well. Duomois has said it received multiple tips over the past year about internal tension at Unwell, even before this public feud with Alex Earl. Then brought everything into the spotlight. So after the Bloomberg article drop, they shared more anonymous submissions, including claims that some Hollywood execs are wary of Alex Cooper and her business approach.
and that she may have a reputation for not maintaining great relationships with women within the industry. And then two days later, on April 22nd, Bloomberg reported that the company held an all-staff meeting to address everything that's come out.
They discussed um slow show launches, employee retention issues, concerns about Matt Kaplan's behavior. And the meeting was led by the chief marketing officer who acknowledged the turnover but said it's still lower than what you'd typically see at startups. But neither Alex or Matt were present at that meeting.
Also, this might be a startup if you're referring to the time that it's existed for and the fact that it's new in the space. The amount of money they earn, I don't think you can say you're at startup level anymore. Like I think that's kind of a pop out when you're talking about like, Part of the reason that like a lot of startup culture is poor is because you've got like a minimal amount of funding and you've got people with huge jobs doing
huge workloads where there's kind of not a refined avenue or pathway for like company structure yet because you're so fresh that there's just a lot of core people. There's just only a few core people doing a lot of work. And that's a really dangerous workplace environment because also when one person drops out, there's so much to cover up.
Yeah.
But when you're talking about an unwell network with these umbrellas of businesses and you've got all of this money coming in, you I think start up it's problematic framing to kind of be like, We're amateurs and we're just starting something new.
I do think there's something problematic with companies growing too fast for their own good.
I absolutely agree.
I do think that's part of not being able to implement the leadership and like get in the rhythm of things when things just grow out of control too fast. But then again, like Matt clearly had his own company for a long time before that. I don't know. I don't know.
like so many interesting threads here which relate to people's day to day lives which is like couples in the workplace, which is women at the top copying it for their partners or a male's behavior. Like what is Alex Cooper's responsibility when her husband is the alleged kind of problem in the workplace?
I also find it interesting from a media literacy uh from a media literacy perspective that like I did see that Bloomberg had made this report, which makes me trust the allegations a whole lot more in light of this Alex v. Alex thing, which I think I kinda swept away for a second because I thought
Oh, this is tabloid photo. Actually, no, this is like quite a detailed report from a reputable outlet. What is the actual tangible damage or promotion and elevation of Alex Cooper's Call or Daddy podcast in light of all of this?
I know, but I'm also I'd like to hold space for Conversations in this because I still think yeah, I don't know. I just think there's a lot of really valid conversations that are gonna feel quite contradictory to each other, but it's because we're talking about media, we're talking about women in business, we're talking about Serious allegations, we're talking about tabloid photo, like they all all of that can exist at once in this story, which is why I find it interesting.
And people do not like that at the moment. We like clarity and certainty and it's very tough.
¶ Australia's Gas Tax and Current System Flaws
Labor is said to shelve the widely supported 25% tax on gas exports. Why? Okay, one of the biggest discussions in Australian politics right now, and I I know we've briefly talked about on the podcast before, but I think it's so important that people understand what we're actually saying. Because I I I know I've been making some videos about it.
consumed my newsfeed in recent weeks. Yes, and it's important to understand what's actually going on here and what we can expect and lead up to the budget on the twelfth of May. So stay with me, because I know this is sound like gas tax. Yeah, we get it. No, like literally stay with me. It's actually a really great story. So 80% of Australia's gas is exported as liquefied natural gas LNG. The main countries we export to are Japan, China, South Korea, Taiwan.
Australians currently have a high now, we currently in Australia have quite a high price for natural gas. It's a volatile market for us. The average quarterly household bill, I think, you know, in WA it's about 181 bucks. In South Australia, it's 244 bucks. So it's it's quite a high price, right? Now, domestic gas prices are largely impacted by the international market, the demand of the international market, which at the moment, of course, in the current geopolitical context we're in.
is causing prices to rise the more gas that we ship overseas. Considering that 80% is exported, right? It means there's not much that's left for Australians and it's at a higher price because we're able to export so much.
There's something you're hearing a lot about, which I'm not gonna go into in too much detail right now, called PR RT. And this is the current tax system that we use for these exporters, right? And it was introduced in 1988. So it's been effect for a long time. It's incredibly complicated. Highly recommend looking at the Australia Institute's explainer on PRT. It's the clearest that I've seen.
to go fine.
But I w we can like actually we'll put on the story so after it's a really great read. It's really simple. But effectively, what this article from the Australian Institute breaks down really simply is that there's the all these elements of the PRRT and its complex design means it's kind of easy for these companies to avoid paying a lot of PRT. Because of the way the gas is valued, how it's got valued, what exactly is valued, and what costs it ignores.
The policy that is being the policy that's been proposed by the Australian Council of Trade Unions to replace PRT Is that there is a 25% tax on gas that is exported. So not gas that stays in Australia, gas that is exported, right? Now David Pocock, the senator for the ACT, has been one of the biggest proponents of this.
tax being implemented and it's been widely supported by the Greens as well, by many of the independents. And the most likely people to support, like the most likely Australians to support this gas tax. Are one nation voters and Greens voters? Yeah. Which which is important to say because when we talk about this, the reason I'm loving having a chat about this particular topic.
Is it's so good to find discussions that are not along ideological lines. Like Australians widely support this tax, right?
But also a lot of people just didn't understand it before. Which is why what David Pocock has done. But also so many content creators talking about this in that like political commentators. have been able to explain this in a way that I have loved being able to speak to other people in my life. And realize how much of how much i misinformation or misunderstanding there was about how we use our resources here.
¶ Economic Benefits and Political Advocacy
Absolutely. And again, I think that the government's got away with this for a long time because people are like confusing what is that by?
Well, everyone assumes it's government, completely government run. Yeah. These decisions are being made by the government solely and not being made by private businesses supported by the government. And that's different.
the government has kind of like framed this always as like they're paying enough tax, blah, blah, blah. They're actually not. Absolutely not considering the super profits they're making, right? These multinationals. But also there's also there's kind of been this claim and belief, which I've spoken about in the podcast before that like
Well, our gas prices will rise if we tax gas exports. Like, well, actually no, because we export so much of our gas that if these companies would save money and not have to pay this tax by keeping more gas in Australia, that would mean our prices here are more competitive. Yeah. It would lower domestic. So this is a win-win. Not only would Australians be, you know, the uh the Australia Institute, which again has the most incredible research on this.
They estimate that a twenty five percent tax on gas exports would give back$17 billion every year to Australians, right?
Actually.
This could be spent on the renewable transition, on health care, on aged care, on education. Norway, taxes, same tax. Seventy eight percent. Not twenty five, seventy eight. They have a sovereign wealth fund which is like three or four trillion dollars which can be spent on citizens of Norway. Like if we're talking about cost of living crisis, that's a very simple way. Right? Very simple way. So we're asking for the bare minimum of twenty five percent, right?
There's also been a Greens led gas inquiry in the lead up to the budget. So who are the key figures about with that inquiry?
Yeah.
So
funny'cause I didn't know if he was. Every time I see him he goes, I thought you said no men go on small talk. I said, I never said that. I just said you're probably not the key fit for small talk and he goes
For a while we didn't. I've I've I've loosened.
But it's so funny that he was like I meant and I was like, I never said that. I said you need to find a topic that's gonna be good for you to bounce off with Sarah, bring it on, right? Anyway, I I like rang him last week'cause he he was the first person to front this gas inquiry and he did a really good job, but he got Smashed by Sky News'cause he wore a t shirt with his own merch on. Yeah.
That's really.
It's a really good video. Anyway, we big fan of Punch on the Pod. I think he's such a great person that again goes beyond like the left versus right ideology. He's a great follower on Instagram and YouTube and and and his Amazon podcasts as well. But he led, you know, this inquiry last week and gave an incredible speech which basically said he said, We're here today to discuss the need for Australians to receive what we are owed for our natural resources that belong to us.
I was looking at the schedule and there isn't a singular regular mum or dad, nurse, teacher or tradee, and I'm here to say a few things on their behalf. It's just refreshing to see someone like that, even if it's controversial to see, like, you know, the punter that's the online commentator, um, you know, get up and actually speak.
for the average Australian. Like I think that's a refreshing thing. He says, like, this is business one oh one. I'm not anti-gas industry. I'm not anti-gas. I'm pro getting paid what we're owed. This is capitalism one oh one. If we own the resource and it's ours, you pay us what you owe us. Like it's a really straightforward direct messaging that gets rid of the fluff of political language.
¶ Foreign Influence and Political Inaction
And I wanna play actually a clip from the co-CEO of the Australia Institute, which I've mentioned a few times in this segment, Richard Dennis, who explains why we don't need to fear foreign relations being impacted by this kind of tax.
The Australian Institute's released research today showing that the Japanese government gets more revenue from Australian gas imports than the Australian government gets from Australia's gas export. The Japanese government is getting more revenue. from taxing Australian gas than the Australian Government is.
Might this level of profitability I suppose explain the diplomatic pressure that Australia that Japan puts on Australia on the Australian government?
Yes, I I'm sure they would prefer to make large untaxed profits selling Australian gas to Japanese people. If we have a twenty five percent gas export tax, we'll be at least seventeen billion dollars a year better off. We will have more gas supplied to Australians. We will have lower gas prices here in Australia. And if you're worried about the concerns of countries like Japan, fear not. They're taxing our gas. There's no reason we can't.
It's so infuriating because Australia has is like also so resource rich. It is unbelievable how much resource we have here. Well, I think.
This is the perfect issue to understand exactly how the major parties are failing to act in the interest of Australians too. Because there's no reason not to, right? Besides the interests and influence and pressure from these multinational companies. One of the most interesting parts of this gas inquiry last week was, you know, there's footage of Senator David Pocock questioning the chair of Shell in Australia, the country chair, which is effectively like the CEO role in Australia.
Now her name is Cecil Waite. Right now there's a campaign that's been put out by Austral Australian energy producers to stop this gas tax, right? To like de influence it, right? Yeah. And Senator Pocock, who very calmly asked her during this gas inquiry which she had to front last week, you know. What funds has Shell contributed? She said a million dollars.
Right, a million dollars to this campaign. And also, she confirmed that there's at least half a dozen other companies that have done the same. So when we're speaking about the money that's being put into preventing Australians from being paid fairly for these resources, like
That's how much these multinationals are prepared to bet against us, essentially. Again, I probably sound like this is obviously a partisan issue. I have a clear viewpoint on this, right? Like I'm being so upfront with what I actually believe is right here. But I think it's so interesting to get an issue that is uniquely agreed upon by Australians that Labour and Liberal P that the Labour and Liberal parties and One Nation
refuse to act on. So even though one nation voters support this, One Nation itself doesn't. Yeah. Because of the interests of the billionaires that are funding them like Gene and Reinhardt, right? Like It's important to articulate this that like
There are certain people in politics like Greens and Independents right now who are supporting this because the people support it. And then there are parties that are still beholden to the interests of donors and the influence of lobbyists, right? And it's so important to articulate that too.
So when will the findings be handed down from this inquiry?
So there's going to be a report on the 7th of May, so five days before the budget. And this is like a Senate select committee that, you know, finds facts and delivers reports. Again, we'll see the findings hopefully bef in the days before the budget. But funnily enough, what we do know from senior sources is at the end of last week, apparently Labour is not going to introduce this twenty five percent tax on gas exports at the federal budget on the twelfth of May.
So the reason this is such an important kind of moment pivot point in Australian politics is you've got so much noise from the public who understand the inaction here and they have every opportunity to make the announcement of the federal budget and listen to the feedback. And if we're already hearing reports they're gonna kill it, what's the response gonna be from the public?
¶ Listener Q&A and Upcoming Content
Okay, we are now at the QA segment for this week. Thank you everyone who has sent a message into us on Big Smalltalk underscore pod. Um, we have a message here from Kelly, which was give us your thoughts on euphoria, please. Haven't seen it yet.
a big fan of Euphoria, but I have not started the new season. I've actually been watching and wanting to see the reviews and the pickup because it's been so many years since the last season and so much controversy has surrounded
This the cast that feels like it's outgrown the show ten times over. But I am excited to see it. Cause I just I feel like I've seen so many so much commentary on it. So I want to see what I agree with and disagree with. Uh I think there's a whole conversation to be had about labyrinth as well, who was like that was
One of the most iconic parts of Euphoria was her music. And so I want to dig into that a little bit more. Also Sam Levinson in general, who's the director of it, um, a lot of bizarre reports about him.
I'm we both kind of have a locked calendar to say we have to be up to date for next Tuesday to have a sit down little chat about this specifically.
I really want to talk about next week that I just have not had the time to dive into yet is the Michael Jackson biopic.
Yes. I've seen a lot of reviews of this.
It's a big stor I don't even know where to start with it, but I just know that that is a big conversation at the moment.
Can I just say the amount of people that have spoken to me about your project Hail Mary review this week?
Really?
actually was in Perth last week and had a lovely couple come up to me at this protest that I spoke at. And one was man, Trady, and he came up and he said, I'm a big listener of the pod. Um
IMAX, he explained what it actually is to me. I've already forgotten because he was like, That was crazy. Like it was something to do with the pixels he was explaining to me. Oh. Shout out. But he was like, Project Hail Mary, that was a crazy good review from Sarah. And it was so funny because I went home to my partner and I was like, We've got to see Project Hail Mary.
Sarah's one of the best films she's ever seen you guys I've not heard anyone say that about it, so I have to watch it this week to now I just
I think it just got me at a time.
I needed Project Hail Mary, I didn't know what I needed it but
And we're also gonna go see the Devil World Prada 2 premiere tonight. So when this comes out, just know. Yeah.
I'm
role playing today apparently. I look like Andy Sachs at the beginning of the film, currently in a fucked turtleneck, um looking sick and tired. But I will be turning this around.
Got a two thousand six dress, don't you?
I have a two thousand six Roboto Cavalli dress.
Wow, so sweet. Cavali. Wow.
No, I'm actually really like, I do think Devil Wars Prada was one of my favorite movies of all time as a kid. So I'm so excited to see the premiere tonight.
Awesome.
You're all that's awesome. You're all there.
I I am also there. But I also I had this flashback that when it came out I didn't know how to like I was like I think we were like seven when this film first came out, right?
Yeah.
And for some reason I refuse to say devil. I used to call it the Devil West Prada. And my mum was like, that's I don't know why. For like a deal. It was my favorite film. My mum was like, Why are you doing that? You know how to read. You're like the best you're like obsessed with your home reader. And I was like, just sounds fancier.
It's so funny.
Really weird, so I'm like having flashbacks at the moment, but
no idea what to expect from this event tonight either. But get a r like, guys, we're lifting. So if you see me, just know.
She's lifted.
Lifting.
So like comment on that post and be like, You you look so good.
Wow, you don't look ill
At all. No like no sickness detected, you know? Thank you so much for listening again this week. Please remember to leave a review, tap the bell, follow us on Instagram at big small talk underscore pod. And we'll see you next Tuesdays.
Oh, actually see you tomorrow for Scientology. Oh.
Actually see you tomorrow for Santology. See you on Thursday for Sarah's small talk and then we'll see you next Tuesday.
It's it's that week of the month that you actually will see a lot of us.