Cancel Your Queers 2022: Is Netflix Homophobic?

Hello and welcome to Big Gay energy. I'm Bree. I'm Fiora and I'm Caitlin come along with us while we dive into the fun and nuances of queer media representation matters. And we're here to talk about it. Welcome back everyone. It is 2023 the year of, let's hope this is better than last year. That every year has been every year since 2020, okay? The the 20s have been the absolute worst.

There's no sugarcoating that by 2022 in particular, was a dumpster fire of the year for television shows and it was felt pretty hard in the queer Community. Mmm, and we've all felt it. Literally every show we've covered so far on this podcast has been cancelled in 2022. And it has a lot of people including us feeling some ways. And so oh sorry, go ahead. No, just awful. Feel Yahweh ceiling some ways awful, depressed, traumatized, all of those things. So, we thought we'd explore why

on Earth this happen. Like what even what happened? We'll explain what happened. If you're not, if you weren't filth, if you didn't feel the devastation, that was 2022 for career media and kind of dive into some nuts and bolts about why this happened and like what is actually going on because the perception is that we as the queer Community or being targeted, in particular, all of our shows are basically cancelled. And it's leaving us very sad and

feeling a little bit hopeless. So this is, by no way. It may shape or form a comprehensive topic. We're not truly experts on the topic of like, what actually goes on behind the scenes, but I tried we tried and we just wanted to provide some insight into some aspects of what's going on because this is a multifactorial thing. There's a lot of players in the entertainment industry that have there. Wants their needs their

financial whatever's. So we're just hoping to shed some light on this and give people some peace. So in memoriam of all the canceled, queer shows in 2022. We present this episode to you. Sorry at the end. I should just do dedicated to and just like a, yeah, credits. Exactly The Tick-Tock. Another One Bites. The Dust on there, though. You're just get rid of the sound anyway, it's not all of them either. Wait, a smart play Taps. Its heard.

My new theme song for this is actually is so for those that don't know, No, what on Earth Taps has? If you don't listen, our motherland episodes. Basically, it's a like Song, a horn song that's played in America for military veterans, that are being buried. So it's like a final salute kind of song. Thank you for your service. So yeah, we will play that at the end. What will say? Maybe you'll hear some tabs. So, something to look forward to

at the end of this episode. But before we get to Taps maybe we don't know. Let's start with what on Earth happened in 2022 because what the fuck was that? All right, I remember like, starting off 2022 being like, yeah, this will be better than 20 21 like we do every year and because my favorite show is coming back for its, what should have been the second to last season?

But became the last season because of the pandemic, a television show called kill Eve. And then in April, it ended very homophobic lie. If you've never seen the show that was this year last year, 2022 was a marathon of stuff time. What is time, right? It's a constructive swords. So it's started with that ending spoiler alert, skip ahead, if you're planning on watching the show, ends in a barrier gaze Trope, like actually ends up above it, like that starts it off then.

And the Wilds get cancelled gentlemen, jackets, cancel it. Then all these like, queer ledge Sapphic, lend show. Start getting cancelled, like one by one until we have this amazing death toll, at the end of 2020 to. So like the depression just kept going and going and going and going. So that's what happened and I wanted to know like, okay well we're in our little queer media bubble. We have particularly been covering certain Sapphic shows at this point.

So like what actually was the scope of all of this in 2022? So I dug into like the numbers and have some stats. I promise they're relevant and not boring. Just stick with me on this So in 2022, there were a total of 120 shows that were canceled. Keep in mind, there were like over 500 television. Shows that like happened in 2022. So like one, fifth of them were cancelled in 2022. For the purpose of this. I that's the total number of what was canceled.

I then excluded the ones that weren't scripted. So by that, I mean, things like talk shows or reality type shows game shows. I remove that from the total so of the shows that are scripted. So like have writers rooms and all that stuff, there were 92 shows that were cancelled in 2022, Of those 92 shows. Two of them were canceled after

a renewal was already announced. So the renewal for the show was revoked and they're like, JK, it's actually cancelled those who shows were Dangerous Liaisons, which is the star show and Minx which is an HBO show. Then of the 92 to shows that were deemed cancelled, or actually quote, unquote, saved and picked up by another Network.

So those two shows were Magnum p.i., which was canceled by CBS and is picked up by n by NBC for its sixth season and manifest that was canceled by NBC, and is now moving to Netflix for its last season, which I didn't interrupt real quick. Yeah, I love manifest. I know people hate it because it it's like saved it and Netflix is doing a lot of us are, like I love manifest. So very happy by this because it ended on the whatever I but it's not really that queer.

So continue. But hey at least manifest fans are getting peace of mind. So like that's positive but again, it's kind of fucked up that you had two shows that were like we're doing it. We're not renewing it. And then two shows were there. Like we're not, renewing it but then it got saved by Network. So, like I guess those scales are balanced but still suffer a was a foot And so that's the

breadth of like the show. So the 92 scripted shows were cancelled in 2022. I wanted to know, like, okay well what were these shows, what were the trend or there any Trends or anything we can kind of pick apart from what was cancelled and then maybe let us to like why they were canceled. And so I don't watch all 92 of these shows. I like this is based on the best research possible that I could do without like actually working in the industry or watching all

of these shows. So I picked apart the shows by genre based on what I am DB says they are and so of the 92 shows those twenty-five percent of them are sci-fi shows. Then about 18 percent each after that was comedy and drama. So like the top genre of things that were cancelled in 2022. We're sci-fi shows which was like 1/4 a quarter of all the shows then we got the comedy and drama after that but like of the show's that's like the majority genres comedy-drama.

So keep that in mind. Then I look to see okay that's what's being cancelled, who's canceling all these shows. And so as unsurprising to anybody who's probably listening to this podcast, the number one network that was canceling shit was Netflix. So Netflix canceled 15 shows which accounted for about 17 percent of everything that was cancelled in 2022, the top genre of type of show they were canceling. We're sci-fi shows. So there are seven shows out of the 15.

So it's like almost Most half. The next Network that we can all get mad at is the CW because it's often see them later as well. It's the CW. There's a lot of reason to be mad at them, so they were number two, they canceled 10, television shows in 2022. 11 percent overall of everything that was canceled, the top genre for them. Where superhero shows that's, I guess it's kind of sci-fi fantasy ish, but like, I'm picking that out because they're distinctly DC Comic superhero

shows that were all canceled. And There's four of them so about how almost half like 80% or 90% 40%. The next, the next networks after that is Showtime, Showtime, cancelled 7 shows which is 8 percent overall of the cancellations, their top genres were comedy and drama is about to shows each then HBO. Max also had seven shows. 8% top genre was comedy. So, The biggest offenders basically of all the cancellations Netflix CW and they're primarily canceling sci-fi fantasy superhero, type

shows those that stackable, huh? Huh effects stuff. The exactly that's that's what I'm getting to. Those are shows that require special effects versus everybody else. Primarily what they're canceling is like dramas comedies in much smaller amounts. Now, the part we're probably carrying the most about was of these cancellations. How many of them had queer stuff? So, I broke this down by, like, queer representation in the show, just in general, not

distinct by who led the show? What type of queer representation? It was just queer representation in general in the 92 shows. So, this is actually kind of cool, but sad, so like of the canceled showed 55 of them. Had queer representation so that was 63% of the show. So 2/3 of the shows like just that were cancelled had queer representation in them, which it sucks that they were canceled. But that's a pretty high number for like having queer representation in shows, which is kind of cool.

All of those shows with queer representation. I specifically looked at Sapphic representation, so like to figure that out because it seems like that genre that group was being more canceled. Because we had some shows that were cancelled that were Sapphic LED versus like, male lead gay where the male lead gays were renewed and the Sapphic ones

weren't. So just wanted to see of those shows how many so it's actually about like 50% like that had Sapphic representation in the show as a whole Whoa. And 25% of all the shows that were cancelled had a Sapphic lead. So about so quarter of all the queer stuff that was canceled had a Sapphic lead that was queer. So it's, they so Sapphic. People weren't specifically being targeted, but we're definitely, they were definitely in there.

And the last thing I wanted to know about what was canceled was the survivability of the shows basically like after what season was it canceled. And so here's kind of how this breakdown was. So, about 41% of the cancellations were canceled after a season 1, it's a biggest group. Next after that was after a season 2, which is about 32 percent and like it's minor after that, like, how many were cancelled. So it seems like once a show survives the second season, it's

easier for them to get renewed. Basically, that's my takeaway, I have nothing to back that up. But the majority of stuff that was canceled, that in 2022, was on the after the first season. And then after the second season, those would be like the bulk of the killings basically. Those are all the statistics I have any comments concerns grievances from you guys any of

that? Surprising or say it's surprising and pretty much checks out, as far as that's like what I thought and it's interesting because we don't really. We think about what a terrible year, Netflix's had financially and the changes. They now have like a cheer that's an ad-supported tier. They now have you know, I'm gonna get there. I know you continue. After I set it up, figured you were going to get there. Okay. This is just the situation part. What is the situation?

Yeah. Um, I think that it's, we, it's nice that we have can see that there was so much representation in the shows that were cancelled, but I would like more varied representation as well and also what the actual. My, my my brain. I did break that down to like, yeah, I didn't watch the shows. This was just from like superficial like searching on the internet about like what the representation was. We did an excellent job but I did I did look at that. Like overall not just like what

was canceled. So it's like at least 50% of shows like hems some kind of representation in some form, like the extent of how much like a queer lead versus like a Character that pops up. Definitely varies. Yeah but the trend, the trend overall, even though but surviving shows was queer, rep is going up in general. Like visibility in shows the degree of like the visibility definitely varies but I didn't compare it with the cancellations, but that is a overall good thing that's

happening. And the other thing I kind of looked at I was going to save for like the end where we get to. The positive part is that like I also looked at Like casting. So was there diversity in the casting people of color. Queer people. And overall there is a Significant television shows have just diverse casting for like the leads. So there's positives here, it's just 2022 is a year or we kind of felt like we were being attacked by these networks and

their cancellations. Yeah. I just keep forgetting how long it was. Yeah it was the worst absolute worst part. I really want is like where I think a lot of this is is us like you're trying to make the point as feeling attacked and that's we're we've been feeling attacked in so many ways since well, the being of time, but since especially the pandemic started or the Panera, whatever Yeah, that's happened since the Panini started and financially speaking.

And I think that part, I mean, my brain goes to we're seeing that from the financials of these companies. Yeah. And absolutely. And it also, the, it bigger impact of this, like, yeah, I just, we just spotted a bunch of numbers was that it has an actual effect on all of us. So what I've noticed and felt from myself is that because of this like trauma responses are being developed by queer viewers?

Like I feel it too because of all of this and so I've noticed later in 2022, like as shows are airing, there's already campaigns to save the show. It's not even done airing and its entirety and already like fans are like there's a queer lead. It's going to be on the chopping block. Like we have to start campaigning immediately before it's even done. Finishing in its entirety like and for me we're sorry didn't Warrior. None start before it actually is

yes yes. Willow did the same thing like that's what I'm saying. And so there's campaigns are ready to save shows before they even are and there's all this pressure especially with streaming shows to like binge it immediately so that like numbers Or up because that's the metric. They're looking at to decide whether or not it's worth saving. We have to be obsessed with how

much it's on social media. And so like and there's just this general anxiety and Gloom the entire time because your, like, focus fixating on the fact that it could get canceled instead of like enjoying the show it for me. It takes all the joy out of actually watching this thing, you know, because it's like you're just constantly like in survival mode to save something that hasn't been canceled.

Yet, because you're traumatized by all the cancellations that keep happening for, like, the things you love watching. So, it's just creating a group of, it's just creating a bunch of like, post-traumatic stress disorder for people and it's making watching the shows, not fun, because I can't just enjoy

this thing at my own pace. I have to binge it immediately to get the numbers up and like it's just exhausting and it's not fun and it's not fair to us that we have so little representation to begin with and then when we get it, it's like we have to like Zoom, it. We can't even enjoy it. We have to get to work and make Billboards and like, consult me on social media about it. And it's just like, when do we get to like, actually enjoy this thing?

Like, when the last time I enjoyed a television show was killing Eve because it already had its Seasons. They release weekly. And it was fun to just like, enjoy it. You could just enjoy it because it her, it was already secure, everything was good. And then but now it's just like, there's so much uncertainty and it's just for every show, there's camp.

Ends immediately and it just it's not fun to consume this media anymore because it's just you're constantly got that weight of like am I doing enough? Am I like contributing enough? Am I going to help you know if I don't binge it all tonight, will that make Netflix? Not renew it like it's just not fun and then you have the people attacking you on Twitter if you don't do those things, right? It's like a which again like is their trauma response to all of

this stuff that keeps happening. So it's like you can't be mad at these people. Because like they're traumatized, we're all traumatized and it's making this, just not fun and that's not fair to us. So if you feel like that like we get it, it's just we all feel it and it's just it's fucked up. Is what it is. I don't answer for that. It just sucks, it's not fun. I was up to my neck in motherland for Salem campaigns until you guys were there. Like we were freaking heavy in.

In that stuff. And then all of a sudden you know there it's kind of dissipates into the, you don't know what to do after that. Like what's your purpose anymore? And then you're like, why is my purpose? Why is this my purpose? This wasn't supposed to be. This is like a television like

on one hand. It's like this is a television show and the representation is important, but at the same time, I've, you know, now I'm dealing with all of the Fallout, emotional Fallout of Being invested myself into this whole thing for so long. And then to come out of it. And then for it to like happen again, with Warrior none.

That's why I didn't get super involved in the fandom because I was already so exhausted from motherland because that was like a solid year of doing these campaigns and trying to get, you know, stuff together and And it was a great experience in a lot of ways but in other ways, it was just like you're saying now. I have all of this emotional Fallout and don't know where to put it. Yeah, it's a little shit. All of that. Brought me to you guys.

So really glad for that it's that's why it's a great positive, yes of it. And they're great positive parts of being in the trenches with other people who are like minded. But it also we need to look. I think we really need to look at the negative effects of this is having on the community as a whole and us as individuals and everyone whether you're whatever part of The community you are in. It's going to affect you in some way, shape, or form. Yeah, absolutely.

And the thing is, it's like, like you said, you know, when you're involved with one of these campaigns and they're like, okay, well I'll watch this other show and then it happens to that show to. It's like you're just tired of losing all the time, like it just it just feel exhausting. It's exhausting. It's just like I keep losing. I don't even want to watch TV anymore because it's like why then I get attached to something and then it just goes away.

And now I bet we're back where we start. It's like we're in Endless cycle of just like I watch a show. I like the show I meet cool people in the fan of it gets cancelled immediately. Now we're in a campaign and it's just like it's tiring. So I think it's important to talk about How did we get here? Like, how did this become watching television? Because television used to be fun and now it's become this never-ending cycle of, like watch like, get attached cancel. How did we get here?

I feel like it started for me with Buffy after You laugh. All you want Caitlin I after that? I was setting up Caitlyn for the transition. Yeah. I'll just see myself out. No, it's okay. Originally it started with barrier gaze stuff and now we've just moved it to cancel your queers where they're just not burying anybody there just canceling, the whole fucking show. I mean they might be burying some Yeah, but it's like that's not the way we kill off. Queer characters anymore we just

and keep the show going. Now we just scrap the whole show. That's the perception. It's a cancel, your query Attic. So anyway, here, but now it's

time for me to try and put my degree to use. so I get a little bit excited because this is what I studied in school and Umbreon, fewer had to learn that the hard way because I refuse to stop researching like we're lucky we're getting this episode now because I finally stopped searching like I was in academic journals and like really trying to get every single point possible and then I was like, oh you can't so this is this is my simplified version which is still like five pages long So we

started with syndication, syndication used to make you feel secure because networks wanted to be able to sell their shows, license them, to other networks to make more money. So for a show to go into syndication, they would have to have been on the air for four years and have 100 episodes, could you imagine getting 100 episodes of our favorite shows right now? I would do like, right. Seems unfair the law now, doesn't it?

Yeah. Just like if we make it to 30, we mean if we make it to 16 Caitlin for people who may not know what that word means. Can you explain, what syndication is like, what does that mean? syndication is when after a show airs, It gets license to another Network and it they're able to air it so airing on a different network. Is it going into syndication and being available to other platforms? And is this primarily referring to like cable shows or does this

apply to streaming shows to? This is just cable because yeah, this is basically not a thing. Now, the streaming's of thing, right? Yeah. I just wanted to clarify like this. Is the old model with cable versus dreaming. Okay? Thank you. This was a good old times where you wouldn't see a show? Well, no, actually the thing is, it's not. All right, we'll get there later. All right. So come on contradictory my

brain right now. And this is the back in my day, second back in my day, when I was three, Television. So they like this is I learned this when I was in like third grade, like these shows had to have these episodes. So, yeah. So that's why, if you remember like four seasons because when I was, when this was the thing, I was watching Disney because I was a baby and they all shows had four seasons and it never went past Four Seasons.

So, I was really curious and luckily goo Google was a thing, and that's how I learned about syndication and in elementary school. That's amazing. It's really weird. That's cool. It's amazing with the internet can do. But yes, so now people people are really confused because we don't get four seasons of things anymore. If something makes it to Four Seasons you're like damn this shows amazing like yeah. Just people are really watching

it and then it went to three. You like you saw three seasons of a lot of things now it's going to to And you're still lucky if you get to the availability of the shows that we watch have changed since the beginning as well. Because I know my dad loves to remind me that once a show aired, it aired, if you missed it, you missed it. And you never got to see it unless for some reason it like it came on again. A rerun.

That's what I study called. Yes I rerun which this is a side note but that's like I really thought that Full House came out in 2006. Oh my God you thought that it came out in 2006 and it was just set in the 90s. Hey I hear you. I was like eight or nine stop right there. 90s. It's a period piece. Yeah, so I would watch it, every Tuesday, I'm turning 40 this year. It took you out to realize it was it. But deny story. Aubry is having an existential crisis.

Tell us more about this Gate 1. Oh, my gosh, episode everyone, Okay, so used to be you could only see it once, then it became the show aired, it would be available for home entertainment so you could get it on DVD and rent it at stores. I believe that's what it is again. I put split off Buster so um, Seven. I had to realize was the 90s. That's interesting. Yeah, so it started as a DVDs. We had them.

We had Netflix and Blockbuster as the malins, sure, that we still have some of them around somewhere. For John. Yes. So all that stuff and then it would go into syndication. So there's three separate windows for people to make for the companies to make money off of it.

Now that streaming has become a thing home entertainment and syndication has is basically the same thing because syndication It's just streaming at this point and people a lot of people will just wait for a network show to be like fully run and then go on Netflix or something so they can just binge it all

and not have to wait. And I do, I remember I was in school, like when this was like, really happening college and so I was able to actually like talk about it in classes with professors who were working in all of it. And it was very interesting to watch the ratings, just like consistently drop and drop and drop because and shows were getting cancelled even more because they weren't expecting

this, like it was just technology is rapidly. early changes in so much that we can't keep up and systems that we have in place are Not able to consistently change. So when they saw the ratings continuously drop shows, were can't getting cancelled right away. And then if you notice like years later shows that had the same amount of ratings are now being renewed because that is a

new normal. But at that time, they weren't expecting it. Because Netflix basically broke television, but it became a streaming platform, in 2007. Networks were like, Basically terrify a kit change the way it. Sorry. My brain goes really quickly with this stuff because there's just so much and it's hard to explain to people cuz, My shit. So Netflix broke TV. Yes. And they were terrified the next

state. Okay, I figured out where I was going with it. They basically created Court cutting so people were beginning to cancel cable subscriptions and just use streaming platforms. So basically what we're talking about is the business is changing and now that streaming is here to stay, and is the dominant thing in the industry, there are less windows for Revenue. So, these Productions don't make as much money, but they're costing more and more.

So the companies are having to figure out how to make money and another big thing that has changed with the switch to streaming and this is again, Netflix is fault. Is the Vintage versus weekly releases? Now in the beginning I feel like binge-watching which is like so cool. Everyone is just 60 like wow, we get all of it at once and now I mean, at least I'm feeling like, can we get it weekly? Yeah, because I like the community that is built around the weekly releases. Yep. Like will.

Okay. No Disney's doing a great job right now because they released two or three episodes. I think it's like to now but two episodes and then do weekly. So it's enough to get you to binge it in the beginning and then like, continuously watch it each week. I didn't watch Willow, I had no idea what will it was until people actually started talking about it and, like, all right, fine. I'll try, I'll try to watch it. I'm still not done, so it's taken me more than a month to

watch this show. We're busy people don't even remind me, but you're right. Like, there there's something to be said about like the word of mouth advertising. That is weekly releasing like affords. You and like, for me that's what my Fondest Memories of watching. Killing Eve. I'm going to keep coming back to this because it was BBC, AMC, show. Let's forget about the fourth season because they fucked it all up with how they decided to release it.

But, like, originally, it was a weekly released broadcasting show and because of that you like talked about it, the entire week leading up to the next episode. So there's you would draw more people in until like people, like Taylor Swift. They're like, oh, now I'm gonna watch this show because this is great because it creates like buzz and advertising and like it's an experience to like

experience the show. Show versus just watch it all and then be like, alright, let's move on like it's a different experience and it's and I think it's better personally from marketing standpoint been shows doesn't make sense because you can only mark it until that. First episode is released because people are going to be in different areas afterwards and people are already going to have, like there's going to be some people have already seen it, so like the marketing

doesn't really matter for them. And you can't really like spoil it with doing other stuff. So, you only have that one big push and social media is only going to be talking about it. Nadia a month after its relaxed, right? It's just it's one big push and then it's done and stuff. It's a weekly show when people keep talking about it, like I saw our timeline is just like a great example of this on Twitter because it is just slowly became more Willow.

And I'm just using Willows example because it's a One that was released. Yeah, that I watched because people were talking about it on our timeline so much and inner Discord, feel free to join a Discord. If you like care to link down below anyway I think it's the perfect section famous guys. Anyway, with each week you're able to do promos like motherland every week. There was an after the show thing. There's so much promo to create engagement. Which could create a bigger audience.

Yes. Whereas especially with Netflix if they will is the advertising thing in itself. But just in general say they do a lot of advertising for a show. It's that one episode and that's just like okay, what's next? And it just it doesn't make sense. Yeah, because then you're not going to get that Snowball Effect because viewership will not go up. It's just going to continuously go down. It's almost like back in the day.

Like your dad said, you had one period of time to watch it and that's it. That's kind of what binge streaming is. It's like you have that one period of time where it happens, and then it's over. Yeah, and then it's like from the company's perspective, they really only have a short window to determine was. This is this worth keeping because it's going to dwindle

after that. Like, the people are that people are that are going to find the show because it all happens, like all at once, like all the social media people talking about it, all the gift making, all that stuff. All happens. Like at once when it's released and then it kind of dwindles after that. So like the chance of people finding it dwindles also. So, like you and remember tiger Oh King. That was a huge one. No one talks about that one anymore. Oh yeah.

That was like a month. We were bored during the pandemic. That's him. Tiger can't happened. People were trapped in their homes with nothing. And then that came out there like something, perfect. Yeah. But like exactly like this the binge stuff it just once it's gone, it's gone like people move. The next thing is now been streaming that we have to move on to and watch all at once before social media spoils everything about it too. That's a part I hate also. Is it? Oh my gosh yes.

Sorry I have an issue where you're not just freaking pissed me off because you don't. Okay deaf people. You can always tell when you Strike strike a chord with me. I am, but like it was two hours after it was released people. Just fast forward. I'm getting so lightheaded right now. I forgot to breathe. People just went to the last episode and ruin the ending, right? It's okay expose it, right? And that's the thing. It like, this whole binging

thing. It really like a dropping the whole season at once it ruins the experience of the show. Because part of it is like Talking about it with other people. And like, if I didn't watch the whole thing immediately or just jump to the end. I now cannot go talk to people about this because I'll get spoiled, and it's like, it removes, the whole fun of the whole experience in my and live-tweeting, that can't be a

thing with streaming shows. And that I okay, paralyzed taught me all this shit because that I was in seventh grade when that came out. And so that was my whole Social me existence was live-tweeting that every single Tuesday, it created engagement with the cast and create engaging with each

other. And that's why it went on for seven freaking Seasons. Yeah, it's like the binge streaming makes less and less sense when you really think about it. I know people like it because they're like, I don't have to wait, but, like, do you even enjoy it as much, right? Do you enjoy it? Like, do you catch everything? When you sit down and just watch everything? Like, how do you get to enjoy the show? I remember what? It happened, right? I can't remember what happens

when I binge anything. It's just like, it's like, yeah, I'm getting those endorphins immediately, but then when it's gone, it's gone. And it's like cool. I guess I move on to the something special about having to wait with, and you're like, what's gonna happen to other people there? Just like we want to know, yes, Bree I'm the opposite. I get like, I totally get your points but I have a problem with waiting.

Yes it is. You want all the spoilers and I'm a person that enjoys a show in a vacuum all at once. And then goes to talk about it. I don't like to talk to people in between in between text if you will but I totally get how it affects everything and I agree. It's not the best model. Anyway, that's my two cents. I mean every week. So I was a great model and it

works for them. Okay. So, like I can't fault Netflix, I'm actually quite impressed with Netflix in the like, they took over like they were able to just create the biggest streaming platform. I mean, I think they were the first really the first Drew. Yeah, they were the first, and they're really the first that, I mean, who knew existed. And was kind of doing their own originals, but they were the first one.

This is why it hurts so bad. It all started with Orange is the New Black a Sapphic queer ledge show. Mostly women not men cast. That's where this all started when they're like here's the first show or I'm going to give you all of it all at once. Well yeah, as you go first Joe that you could read into the whole thing. It was that stuff you had trans stuff you had?

Yeah. Like everything yeah a non medlen show with queer to queer leads that's what started all of this and then That's why this kind of hurts the most coming from Netflix because it's like we made you big. Yeah, that was the first show that just the whole season at once we're like what we can watch the whole show. So it was like novel and it was fun to do. But like, now all the shows you're doing tonight, I don't remember the year, Is there any matter? Yeah, I do. I've never seen it.

Binge-watching is good for me personally but it ruins the culture. I understand why people like it, people who are like, well, I have anxiety and I need to know what happens next. I don't want to dwell, but like, for me, it makes it less fun because like, that's, I'm a re Watcher to. So, I go back and re-watch.

I re-watched it. So this is like to your point of not absorbing it at all at once, that's I have to do with books too, but that's why I story is always new to me because I have the ADHD brain, that forgets everything. I will say, there are shows that came out weekly and I like there is a chance that like the audience just falls off and never sees this episodes like there's pros and cons to everything, and there's definitely shows that I loved.

Like I still have not finished the Bold type, and I was obsessed with that show when it was coming out and saying, We talked about that one. Absolutely, yes, I love that. I also wrote, I wrote a paper on that show. I this is why I went to school for this shit. Anyway, those are our two cents about fins, binge versus weekly releases. There are definitely pros and cons from a viewer perspective and then like the company's perspective and it does affect how things are advertised.

So, like that's probably why it feels like. Hey, they're not at nobody's advertising some of these shows, but it's like, it might just be one little thing and they're like, there it is. It's releasing tomorrow. Like that's it. I'm trying to hold myself in from talking about something else because I think it's later. I've read so much and done so much research for this. It depends if you want to talk now or we can.

Okay, continue you go. Alright, so another thing that happened that nobody was expecting at all except scientists because I was at a conference or there were talking about this the year before it happened was the pandemic of 2020. And the death toll of shows, we saw in 2022 was partially due to actually the pandemic and how that impacted, just literally everything, including the entertainment industry. So, in 2020, because there was a global, pandemic happening Production Studios were

temporarily closed down. And so, because of that the number of originally scripted television programs dropped across All the platforms. So broadcasting. Your syndicated stuff streaming. All of that everything just dropped because everything had to stop, right? And so that included like new shows that were being developed and shows that were already greenlit that were trying to go

into production. All of that stopped basically in 2020 and to because there were these production delays in 2022. All the or 2020s are all the shows that were going to are in 2021 that had to get stopped from being made got moved to like the twenty twenty one, twenty twenty two seasons so like they got pushed back out a year, right? The things that were already in production that had to get

stopped on top of that. You had new shows that were being developed and like the writing was happening over Zoom. So like shows are being produced in the background from a writing point of view whereas like the actual filming had to stop and get pushed out a year. So it created a backlog of shows that all kind of got aired in 2022 because the ones that were supposed to be are in 2021 got moved.

And then all the new shows that were being created, then got produced when everything got greenlit and then you had too many shows essentially In 2022. so, In to put it into perspective in 2019, there were 552. Scripted shows that like happened and we're kind of streamed in 2020 that drop to 493 of things that were like kind of coming out because they're already done and things

like that. Then in 2021 because of the backlog, there was an overshoot of like the number of shows you have like 550 500, like 60, almost Rose. And so, while you had this imbalance of the number of shows and existence in 2022, it didn't change the amount of money these Studios had to, like, produce shows. So, because of that, we ended up with this peak TV is what they called it in 2022. We're basically now, the Studios have to figure out well, which we have too many shows, which

ones are we going to? Like continue and which ones are we going to cut? And so I think part of what happened is, there's like there's a finite amount of money and there's too many shows and 2022 and so it looks like more things were killed off going into the 2023 season because you had the Pandit shows that got shut down because of the

pandemic. The new shows that were supposed to be produced in between all kind of came out together ish and there's like only so much money going into 2023. So it was like an anomaly year partially because of that. Yours really good at talking. I'm just saying summarizing and talking. Yes, summarize it because Yeah.

All right. I mean I can also attest to this as a killing you fan because that show was given Five Seasons supposed to have five, but because of the pandemic in 2020, when they were filming season for they lost a year and this is a show that films all over Europe. So it was completely compromised of what it could film.

And then in 2021, when production was opening up again, it was limited where they could film and the actors were are and pretend the People in production were already booked for Stuff past the seat when season 5 was supposed to happen. So because of that, they had to end the show a year early because everybody was booked and it's like we cannot continue the show because everything's we lost a year and that's it.

And so because of that the show is losing a year and they had to rewrite the whole thing and that's partially. The reason we got the horribleness that was the final season because it wasn't supposed to be the final season. It just the pandemic robbed everybody of a year and they could not continue it because everybody was Worked. So a lot of things got quote-unquote cancelled.

So technically was a cancelled prematurely because the pandemic, we lost an entire year of like actually filming the show and some shows they couldn't keep going because the scheduling conflicts and things like that, with actors and creators. And shows were also still coming out in 2020 2020. Yes. Yeah. One because of 2019 and like, those shows I feel bad for like Teenage bounty hunters. Came out in 2020. All right?

And I will never be over this because that one got canceled right as I found it and watched it. Yeah, that was people so fast. It was like super fast like right, I do it. I'm like I didn't even know it existed, it's so good. That's another story back to other business stuff. All right. Rain in my fangirl putting on my business. This is also a therapy session. It's okay, as all its every episode is that you guys, if you're new here in, this is your first episode. Welcome.

They gave their make him to therapy. We can't guarantee you'll come out of it, feeling better well at the end were blending on a happy note we promise, hopefully, so other business stuff that's going on. On. In the, in this industry and itself. And if you haven't noticed that everyone is creating a streaming service everyone. How many streaming services are you subscribed to actually, I'm curious. How many are you guys subscribe? But me personally because there's somebody, are you

personally subscribe to it? How many do you mooch off other people? See, but here's the thing is like 5 includes a motoring. I only met, which one. I'm the primary and everything else that people moved off of me. Yeah. And I'm triggered figure out how to get HBO Max well in Prime that for you, we can get you that in Prime. I'm subscribe to a service within Prime, so it's like a service in a service. Yeah. That's like wanted the sir. Yeah. So like it's like Britt box inside of Prime.

Oh, I see. Okay, I can't do that. We watched in Christmas there. Sorry. I thought that was so random, but I forget what it is mean. We watched some show with your mom. Oh oh. Oh yeah, what mother? And I primarily watch Brit box if it's not, you know, I guess it's not queer for that too. But again, people mooch off of me for that. Yeah, I mooch Hulu and disease. If the streaming services are listening, we don't, we don't actually, we don't actually do that.

Actually, my family members and we share money. So So it's really not mooching. I'm just the primary. Now, I used to, I was subscribed to Disney for the three-year promotion and then, I'll get into that one later as well because there's a graphic that fully shows that anyway. Yeah, so you basically probably have access somehow to all of them don't actually pay for all of them.

But anyway, Since everyone is creating streaming services and the Network's themselves have them, they have no reason to license their content to Netflix and other platforms. They have more What is the word intuitive? So yeah, it's going to keep that to themselves and put it on their platforms because then people will subscribe to them. So we saw this with friends when a Netflix spent a hundred million dollars to keep friends and I forget which one actually

had. It was it Embassy sent me on friends? Yeah, they're like, well, I'll take the money for right now. So, yeah. So none of us. Got to keep friends for a little bit. So now that other license content is getting taken away from these platforms net. We're just going to use Netflix as an example, because I don't think they are. Would let me look at all of them because then Netflix has the most data they've been there the longest. So it just makes. Yeah. We also would never have gone to

this episode. Because we I just would have been searching things forever. Anyway, so services, like Netflix, have to rely on original programming to be competitive with all these other platforms. the shows that they make, they have to make sense financially and there isn't room to keep shows that aren't a success like a huge success because if something's not making money, Why would you keep it? Now, we asked on Twitter about

assumptions. People have about shows, getting cancelled, and two of the big ones that we kept hearing was Network streamers. Don't care about representation unless they can make money, and they prefer to please mainstream audiences. No, I have a little rant for this. I never understood these arguments. They are a business. If they didn't care about those things, we couldn't get anything. Why should they, why should they be expected to keep a show that isn't giving them a return on

the air? Just because some people like it and I understand the representation, and I understand that these shows mean something that's people. But if they don't, if they can't actually get their money's worth for these shows, they're not going to be able to make other things. And continue to give you content. So, Yeah, you have any comments about that. Any opinions. I mean yeah, I understand that from like a business perspective because it's about return on investment, right?

And we'll talk about this a linen other section like what it actually costs to like do this. So yeah, I understand that I don't understand the nuts and bolts of how that all works, maybe that's in here. And I think that's again like

how they make money. I don't know what goes into the decision like to run and what, what constitutes a success, I feel like that's another disconnect that's happening with people because looking at certain metrics, like, again, 2020s fucked up a lot of shit, but looking at metrics, like Warrior and I was an People like the warrior. None streaming numbers were better in season 2 than season one and season one. Got a renewal, but not season 2.

So it's there's a disk. So people don't understand. They're like, well, what do we need to do? Because like, everybody who's traumatized battle, this are trying to take it on themselves to be like what can we do to say, like save these shows like to keep them going like what do we what number do we have to meet? What's the metric? And it seems arbitrary when you try to actually look at data that it gets out there and be like, I don't understand because like The numbers here.

Look too good for this show. This got cancelled, the numbers. Your for this show are less, but it got renew. So it's like people are confused and I think that the assumption is like, well, there's more diversity in this show. There's a Sapphic lead that must be it versus this show. It's like a white cast with a gay man lead that got renewed.

So, like people are just like trying to figure out what the hell because it doesn't the math isn't a thing is I think yeah, part of what leads people to this. Assumption. And it's like, yeah, the Wednesday comparison comes up because they're like, yeah, that's mainstream and I think mainstream granted that really isn't mainstream. If you know the history of The Addams, Family really isn't but it's like it's with movies to this thing keeps happening where it's not really original

content. People are taking establish it. That has a fan base in like multiple generations and they're going, let's make a project based off this because there's already fans were less likely to fail. Like it's it, It is reducing creativity and it's just people are being like let's redo old stuff. That's one is 500 Spider-Man movies. And there's only one everything everywhere all at once. It's because like people don't want to take Financial risks on

stuff. They're like, I need to know that this is going to succeed and we can label it, original content, and keep it and license it. But there's already fans. So it's less likely to fail, and I can make more money off of this.

So like and if you look at that project, it's like yeah like this was appealing to like white people in like the 80s or whatever so like it seems mainstream from that perspective versus like something with an overt queer lead, POC cast, like I understand where the assumption is coming from when you're just looking face value at two different projects, one that got canceled in one did it and you're trying to figure out what the hell is happening because like this thing got a

season. To and the numbers are better season two. Like I don't understand what's happening. I think that's where these assumptions are coming from. And again, it filled the whole, the reason we're here is because we feel like we're being disproportionately targeted because we have less stuff to begin with and then when you're slaughtering 25% of it, it impacts us more because there's less stuff to begin with versus like love Island gets renewed. And you're like, what is this

garbage? But there's money differences in all that stuff that go into. Those two different shows so like, sorry. I understand, I understand. Yeah, where people are coming round number discrepancies. I think. Oh, and also some of it comes from people not knowing how to interpret the data that they're

getting. And what the debt, I mean, they just don't have the, I mean, the general public probably doesn't have the statistics knowledge and internal knowledge of TV, or sorry, streaming services, and things of that nature. Especially also, no one has all the data correctly. Exactly. We don't has copious amounts of data that they are spending, so much money on analyzing, I like it's good. They they're really good at targeting but they're never going to share it because it's

not in their best interest. Exactly, right. So we will never fully know what the hell happens behind the scenes. Well, we are going to go into some more things. There are like, some Somewhat plausible reasons. Why some things have happened. Correct, correct. I want to say something about the streaming platforms. If that's okay, I think another reason why there's perhaps a lot of like, Mass Exodus of certain shows on streaming platforms to is because every single one of

these require payment, right? So it's versus like, back in the day where it's like, you had one fee, you had the cable subscription, you paid that fee and then you got access to all of the television shows because they were all on cable. And then when it moved to streaming it was like okay I have like Hulu, it's all on Hulu. Now it's like if I want to watch this specific show I have to get a specific subscription and pay money to go somebody somewhere

else. So like there is a barrier to people being able to have access to shows because it's all behind pay walls, like different pay walls. So, because of that, like there could be quality career content on like a streaming platform. I'm not subscribing to is, I don't have the money to subscribe to it. So like I will never see it so it's like it's actually hard. It's creating Accessibility to it's a barrier to accessibility and like because it's all being binged at once.

Like people like you don't know what fully is going on because you can't unless you're like stalking all these streaming services and have all this money to like you know, you describe to end the single one of them. Since we're like, cancel culture is bleeding over into streaming networks, people are canceling, it after they're done watching One show, like they keep going to different platforms because of a sure they hear about.

And so it is hard to like know about a show unless it's a huge success. Yeah, exactly. And like, again, the barrier to watching it in the timely manner for the metrics they're looking at could be, I don't. And I can't afford a subscription to watch it right now. I'll watch it later maybe when I can afford it. So yeah, basically I think some personally something has to cave with everybody.

Having their own fee like for their streaming service and there needs to be like a conglomerate that has all of these things together. So you can watch them, all being cable, kind of like a streaming version of cable we have. Yeah, it's called sling, right? But okay. Getting audiences and like, honestly, like it lowers your your I don't know. Whatever. It's just. No, I totally feel. I totally hear you. And I that that was a joke. Example, sling. Don't anybody come for me?

It's not really that. But yeah, totally see what yours go. Oh God, she's like, chomping at the bit. There are there's bundles for everything out, like, Disney has ESPN, Hulu and Disney and Discovery is Discovery and something else. They like, because of a bunch of these mergers and these companies are related to each other which we're going to get into another like by out thingy in a second. No, sorry for years of school, in one episode, it's not

working. Because of these relationships, they're able to create deals where especially because a lot of phone companies were merging with networks. So now if you have Comcast you get Netflix for free, Verizon you you can get the Hulu ESPN and Disney bundle. so these bundles in my phone plan Netflix through T-Mobile yeah, so I can they're still working on ways to give people more access. I feel like it's a Trisha Spirit.

Yeah, he had to constantly changing, its have office going to be changing because the, the technology behind all of this is always changing. And I only know from when I was really little, but From the time I was born to now. Like technology has changed so much. Look I used to, I had it. I used to floppy disk at one point. I'm sorry those were terrible and VCRs. Computer computer programs that

you had to install from a disk. I have that in my cover letter, by the way, I make people feel really old when they read my cover letter. Anyway, that's not the point of this. I got off on a tangent. Like I always do. How about we take a break from Netflix? Real quick. All right, put them on the back burner. Let's count on somebody else. I'm questionable today. Okay. So we're going to go to another company. That's what executive this people off. People have feelings about.

Gee I wonder who it could be. It's two letters. CW. My first note for this, ew. Is that it seems to be a mess right now. Yeah. I just want to say every single time a show got cancelled in 2022 that like, I was like invested in. It was always that a time where I had to like, go do a performance that like, in a competition and I'm just like, oh shit, how am I supposed to do this now? Anyway, I did warn them that. Yes, if you are in breed, that my brain would be like this

today. You're doing great this ew. Has not been profitable. At least in the most in the foreseeable past. Yeah, I don't know if they were ever profitable and they Heaven, they're like not even just that profitable. They are operating at a ongoing loss. Like they never made money from their stuff. It's amazing how they even exist. It feels like it shouldn't be

possible. So you know how As soon as you watch like the flash Supergirl or anything like that, the day after they finished airing their season, it would be on Netflix. That deal. Is what made CWB okay, because that brought them in money but that deal has expired. And now they make the mommy again. But let's look into their past. Alright, look into the crystal ball. Of this. Ew. Historically they cancel an average of three point. Three shows a year how many

without reading the thing? Because I guarantee for your just read it and just read it sound like a 300-pound. That's yeah. Did you say it already? No I mean I did the queer ones which is a substantial proportion of that. Yes. How many shows do you think? The CW canceled in 2022. What was their average before 3.3 per year? Well since we're doing this episode and we're talking about them as a big point. I'm going to say don't go outrageously high. No, I was going to say they

cancelled all of them. Here's my she's doing math. Gays? Can't do math. Why would you excuse me? Just prove that they did. Hello, 10, 10. 10 8 to 10. It was my range. I'm going to say nine because it's in the middle, huh? It's ten. Good job. Good job, free. Yes, I can do something after all. You can do a lot of things with numbers. Oh a lot of things and 10 is substantial increase from 3.3. Yeah I would say so yes.

Hmm. So over the last four years, The CW has had 17 to 19 scripted shows on air. With all of the cancellations, they now have 11. What's that you got they only have 11 shows because like think about it is that viable. They're not viable to begin with. I will tell you what they're going to get there. Not viable.

I will tell you what their strategy is right now because they have just been acquired by next star which has a controlling share their goal and they believe it's possible to make CW revenue-generating in Profit by 2025. Basically, they want to do that by creating a bunch of reality shows because they're cheap. Oh, God. That's the also get into easiest form of content to create correct. Yeah, so the CW CW made us even sadder this year. I mean, what the hell CW you got

the flash. What's the other show? They still have? I mean, they're trying to read, hell knows. Yeah. Like they don't naturally spinoff Yeah because it's already a thing because yeah, exactly. It's already a thing in reality shows or like where it's at. It's also been a Spate of these four years. Now, I know it's annoying, he's have not been new and so long, really everything everywhere. All at once is like the most novel movie. I've know what that is.

It's just what a bunch of awards go, watch it. It's so there's queer stuff in it and we shouldn't talk about that movie actually. I know how to walk how these No, I don't watch movies either because they're so repetitive now. Except that one that one's the most unique movie I've seen in years because it's just the same crap over and over again, even like the Marvel stuff on Disney. It's like this already exist as a book. We're just making it a movie now and it's like, cool.

I don't care. Thanks, I hate it. Yeah, you know I think that we need to talk about The actual costs associated with this, and the aura has a unique perspective if we're still going with that. Yeah, so basically, when I think about, I don't know the ins and outs of movies or watch TV shows because we're focusing on Kaitlin's and talk about it. But to me it seems a lot like the way drugs are developed. And so as some of our, it just sounded like it seems like drunks tribes medicine but it's

on drugs. There's no but like Kate never mind. But some might be greatly. So from my perspective like in school, so I went if I'm a pharmacist, I went to pharmacy school where we had to learn about the industry of, how drugs are made research, all of that stuff. Because when we're in the pharmacy, I used to work retail for a bit.

I almost did become a pharmacist because I hated it so much, but basically be a yelled at about the cost of when people pick up their drugs and why is this so expensive? And the reason is, if you're ever wondering is because it takes 20 years to make that drug like to just make it because initially a company because this is all at the end of these are businesses For Better or Worse, the end of the day, the company that's going to make it has to fund a bunch of research to find

the product. Right that takes like 10 years. So just find a molecule that's going to be the drug then they got to test it in animal models. People models And that takes like another like 10 year like 10 years towards the tail, end of that second ten years they then have to like propose their data to regulatory bodies. If you're in America, it's the FDA Food and Drug Administration. Because they have to prove, it's safe. And it does what it's supposed to do.

Once that gets approved, they then get the patent for that drug. Is why drugs have two names that brand name because that's the patent name, when they get approval to like it, give it to people, basically put it on the market and that last, like, 10 years or so, where they get exclusive rights to that drug because they have to make up the

money. They spent 20 years developing this drug and it's not cheap to pay all these researchers to do all these trials to have all the The equipment you need doing studies is the I don't know how people do it. It's so time-consuming and terrible and it just costs a lot of money. It cost Millions to make this billion sometimes to make this one thing.

And then you have 10 years to make up that money before you lose the patent and then anybody can have access to it and then be like, like, for example, it's a good drug like Motrin, okay? Is like an over-the-counter drug now, but that's the brand name for ibuprofen. People. Use it all over the world, right? So like bear. I think who did not actually?

Yeah, I don't remember. The company is, but the original company that are got that drug had like 10 years to like sell it as the brand name exclusively and make up that money before anybody, Walgreens can sell ibuprofen now and you notice that there's a price difference between your brand name and your generic the second name, right? It's because other people are like, hey, this sells well, lets us try and sell it. And we'll cut cost because we didn't have to make this thing.

We just take the recipe and then sell it to people. So, all is that to say is like there's a lot of behind the scenes stuff that happened four years before you get the drug at the pharmacy and the company that spent decades, putting all of that together needs to make money to then make the next drug. So, because of that, it looks like Oh, they're just price gouging me, which is partially true in America, but also it's like it took 20 years for you to

get this. And they had to pay so many people and they need the money back to make the next drug. So, that's kind of how it works with drugs. So they got to recuperate the money. I'll drunk Russian. Sure does that mean. Vyvanse will have a generic at some point at some point it will hit some how many more years 33 years? Three years. Okay, however when it first comes off the brand name, the price is still comparable to when it was a brand-new, it takes so it takes years for the

price to go down. Gosh. Darn it. Yeah it's not instantaneous because people are trying to make because they gotta make it for the first time the other plant they have to get inspected. Making it there's a whole bunch of behind the scenes stuff that like they have to like account for in the price of the pills that you don't see. Because you just see the pills. I know we can because of the price of the pills and it's like I can't go too far into the Bob.

Just I need to ask you about insulin because I know there's like a A whole thing about there's no patent on insulin, that's why it's outrageous what they're doing in America. There is the the, the person that made it said, no patent, anybody can make this, this will save people's lives and the drug companies like cool. We can charge of the how we want. There's no patent on that on

that. Oh, so if they would have kept the patent, it probably wouldn't have been potentially people need that to live and they're bad as straight up price gouging. That's ridiculous. It is ridiculous. It is absolutely ridiculous. There's no need for that. So really to bring it back to TV, bring back to TV. If all of these platforms decided, you know, let's just raise all the prices. Yeah, yep. We would have to go with it because what is the alternative? This is like the Monopoly

scenario. This is the scenario. Now, we're like inflation is causing prices to go up because if all that there's like three companies and one of them goes mom and raise my price. Everybody else goes, well let's raise our prices to they have no other option, they're just going to pay that is what's happening. That's that's partially why things? Keep getting more expensive

because there's less companies. So like if it's Netflix and Hulu and like, one other, that's why these Acquisitions are not great. Like, the bundling, like, Disney is slowly buying up the entire entertainment industry, and once they have the Monopoly, they can charge whatever the hell they want, because what is your alternative? There is no alternative. If you want to watch anything, you have to pay with Disney says, you need to pay. Say, that's my problem. Their lawsuit about this right

now. Yeah, that's why. This is a good thing, but there are systems like they have to. I think it was Time Warner and AT&T think it was them. Yeah. But either way, that merger had you go through a lot of obstacles to get approved because they are trying to prevent. Yeah, but some of them are still being approved in there. Yeah well there's also a lot of money involved and stuff option, an idiotic shit. We're still here creating complement. What do you expect?

The end result though is that this is going to get more expensive for us and access to things is going to reduce And so overall you're like, while you're trying to grab up all the people to get on your streaming platform by owning all of them. Like if you hike up your prices too much, people can afford it, you lose people. Like there has to be a balance that kind of happens here too like recuperate. These costs, I believe Netflix is the most expensive one right

now, though? Mmm, probably they were even over HBO. Because they keep like there's ice where there's like three price increases in here once. Probably, I don't know. There's also they're trying to make it cheaper with ads. Everybody's having ads, that's another section. So Caitlin, what's the cost of production a lot? That's Isabel entered. I just I'm gonna go straight into the reality shows versus scripted because that's the easiest way.

Okay. To like really compare it and see like understand how much scripted shows are costing. All right, let's do it. Also because I wasn't totally sure how your drug thing was going to go. I wish I did more for this section. Well basically the analogy I guess. If you're not going to summarize it I can kind of summarize it like. So I guess to compare it to TV shows like as the end user as the viewer. The person getting the drug to bring that back.

Basically, you just see the final product, right? You just see the show but I can talk about like the promises. How do we get to that show? Yes, basically. Okay. So I don't know the exact cost for like because like there is not one cost for each thing. Totally, but so basically, Somebody has to have an idea. And then they go to a bunch of networks to pitch the idea. And if you're lucky enough, some networks can be like, all right, I like that. So then you get greenlit to make

a pilot. So you have to a lot of times the showrunner is also like a writer, at least that's what I've seen. So they get like a team of writers. They write it. Then you got a cast it. These there's a bunch of people involved in each of these processes. Once you have the cast, then You get, I believe the cast is first, I think because, then you have to have a bunch of crew and the amount of watch the credits. Just watch the credits, the jobs that there are for each set is insane.

Like it's no wonder the credits are long K. Just watch them give these people credit. Okay that's what they're for just sayin cries. So then you get that But then there's also a pre-production with some of these crew members, and they have to design everything, and they have to plan it and the scheduling, and then they make it, they actually, and it takes at least two weeks for something unless it's a multicam comedy, then it

could be like a week and a half. I think for the actual production of it. And then you go to post production, where this is, this is a random thing. But like if the, if an editor Years. And like, the dailies, which is like the footer. Say shot that day. Oh, they'll fix it in post. They will kill you also, because post-production is more expensive than the actual production.

Yeah. And that's also because there are less people skilled to do the post-production stuff like audio engineering visuals face because like if you look at one shot of visual effects like not even a full minute, There could be like 22 passes on something, where they have to do little particles here. Little particles their fix, this, put this put multiple different shots on top of each

other to composite an image. There's so much that happens, and then you also have color eight and fully wishes, creating like the steps that you hear the like the hunches that's not captured on set, some of it could be, it would be a lot cheaper if they did it. But people are in a studio using all these weird different instruments, which I would really want to talk to somebody one day because it's really

cool. And people should really like, understand how it's done because it's just amazing, so much that goes into these shows, okay? So then post production is done well hopefully if if you did get picked up by a network and this isn't just like an independent project, you have to go into distribution but then you have to do all the marketing and advertising and then it goes out and to make sure that you can sell the ads to actually make back the money.

And then we just talked about how hat used to have a bunch of different revenue streams. Now just goes from airing to streaming and then sometimes it doesn't even get that, so if it's a Netflix show, it goes straight the streaming. There's no way for it to make money in between Does this make sense so far? Hmm, yes cool. Alright so with all those steps said, reality shows.

You see a bunch of networks are fully dedicated to reality shows because they can cost a hundred to five hundred thousand dollars in episode. They don't their post Productions, barely anything their pre-production is just making sure they have the I mean again I don't I've never worked so directly in reality TV. I don't know if I really care too. There's enough drama going on in the real world. And I don't mean the show. I'm glad that made you laugh free.

I don't know. Who's gonna remember that show, but yeah, there's a phoenix I remember here. Yeah, I watched it. So anyway, anything goes here that show that anyway. With a show reality should call someone to 500,000 and episode scripted series can cost multi million to like rivaling Blockbuster film. Like their whole budget for a film, that could be for one episode. I believe that's like what stranger things is. I'm not surprised by that.

Like it's insane and I we will share that we have been told That motherland cost around five to seven million an episode. But obviously, we can't like a hundred percent say that for certain because we weren't there, we haven't seen a budget. We are going by Word of Mouth We need tangible proof to fully say that, this is definitely what it was. Reality shows are also. Able to make more money back because you could throw bags of Doritos.

At people, give them away as prizes and stuff like that in reality shows and not have it be weird. Whereas if you see I used to see this all this, at least specially when it first, like like really became like popular and a thing you see, Walmart bags, just sitting there and you're like, really, I mean, like, come on. It's just like fully in the third of the screen. It's just this Walmart. Bag. I wonder who sponsored this show. So it's a lot easier to sell more things for reality shows.

I believe one source that I saw, they have a 40% profit on their shows, that's crazy. Yeah, because it's so cheap to make because reality stars and less like they become huge. Like there are I think the Jersey Shore people like they ended up getting like a million or something and episode. But most reality stars, they're not getting paid that each episode. So the costs are minimized. Extremely in those. I think this is where I go on

break a little bit. Okay, so then the other thing that plays into why the cost of a scripted television show is so astronomical has to do with the visual effects in television. And so that is also a new thing like having quality visual effects and television quality, because it used to be yeah. Quality visual effects can be a loose term. I'm talking about like, cinnamon, Level like Cinema used to be the standard of visual effects like decades ago, like

that was the standard. Like, if you want to see cool visual effects, you go watch a movie that has visual effects like an action movie or whatever. That was a drop, right did. And that was it right now. It is expected to have quality visual effect. Like Cinema level is what that the article I read like they team, they term it that like Cinema level. And so, again it's blurring. The distinction between

television and movies again. Because the quality of what you're seeing is similar and this is what plays into like sci-fi shows and being canceled at a higher rate perhaps is because they have the visual effects budgets. And in the article, I was reading shows like that the total budget of the production, it can be up to 25%. So, like a quarter of the budget is just for visual effects that

doesn't take into account. Literally everything else, Caitlin listed, And all those people you have to pay and like everything up a quarter of its just visual effects, that's a lot. And the other piece about this to and why it's complicated is that in a movie where you have visual effects, the timeline for post-production visual effects, all that stuff is a lot longer for those people to do the visual effects than it is for a television show. It's stunted. Like the time they have to

actually get it done. A lot shorter. So that puts more strain on the resources available for a television show that's using visual effects, not just money, but like the people that then have to like, turn around and do this super quickly. And so sometimes they can't do it in a quality manner because they don't have time to like do

this for the show. So people who complain about visual effects, discrepancies like a, sometimes it's like they don't have time to make it look like stranger things. They have like I think I saw 01 in the article, the example was like, normally what you'd get in like Cinema is like six months to do it. You get like, a couple of weeks, like it, like, 10 weeks or something like it. Do, like it's substantially less.

So like, yeah. We could make it look like this, but we don't have the time to do the budget or the budget. So, like, yeah, like so you can't be mad at visual effects and TV because it's like they're already working like they're already at a disadvantage money-wise. And time wise like even if you're the most skilled person in the world, like if your time is limited, you have to decide where you're going to put your energy.

Like you can't make it look like a movie where you have months to just do it. So my going to small little rant real quick. Yeah, yeah sure, sure. Sure, you can continue the largest, I have one last Point real quick about this too. And so one of the ways that Studios cope with this and like offset the budget. So to Peak is they've started putting their production likes. Just straight up spending time. Not even filming, just spending time in countries that offer them tax incentives.

So they just move their production to areas where it's less money to operate, just to save money so they can put mud funnel money into the visual effects. So like that's one way, they try to offset this. So, like, Netflix trying to do stuff in Spain. Like, they get tax incentives and money incentives to be there. So it's like if Are offsetting their costs by like doing things like that because it makes up a bit makes up a larger proportion of budgets now and that didn't

used to be a thing 10 years ago. French for Kaitlyn. My rent is that it doesn't just apply to visual effects either, but people are so quick to complain about different aspects of a show. But you don't understand like what the quality, like the work conditions or anything that they're going through, making this show, people are working 16

hours a day. Minimum sometimes, there are people who probably died from exhaustion working on these things to give you something that's good, but it takes so much time and effort, but you only see the finished product, it looks so easy. You're like, oh, anybody could ever you can you can try filming something, get good audio, get good lighting. I mean it took us this long to figure out how to get my camera out. The turn off. All right.

So yeah, it's difficult. So I figured out stories locating I know two years fragra. Oh my gosh, we had a bigger budget. We'd have studios in every single place, but anyway, it's just respect, respect the entertainment industry, because who did you turn to during the pandemic all the artists. So it's a whole another rant. All right, let's get off of that. Was back in the flex. Unfortunately, there just there in that seat. Back to Netflix being our example.

As we have stated before, I believe we stated before, Netflix is losing money. And something that people don't really know. At least I didn't before. This is Netflix pays all the production costs for their Originals plus 3% on top of that. So they are paying more for the content that they are creating.

20:22 was the first time they lost subscribers and this was a wake-up call to like the entire industry because for so long they wanted to reach Netflix level but now that Netflix didn't grow like they lost people for the first time. They're like oh shit we're all Mortal basically. Like we're not Untouchable if we don't do this, right? We are going to crash. So Netflix right now is trying to figure out how to like, stop going down.

They as we all know they're giving an ad-supported here now because they keep raising their prices. But obviously people aren't going to be happy with that. So giving them an ad-supported allows them to have a lower tier, but people have to do with AIDS. That's another rant that I also have four people but I won't get into that now. Also, I mean, I know this isn't going for everyone, but password sharing really is affecting these people because like think about it, everyone does it.

It sucks that they're cracking down on it, but at the same time, it does make sense. There's so much money that is being lost by password sharing. and then like everyone because the economic hour, Economically. We are not doing well. Like the economy is job doing. Thank you do. Believe me. The economy is sucking in the nun. Oh my God, just keep going. I'm sorry, I can't think so what's happening because of the economy. There's layoffs laugh. Alright. Alright let's go with other

notes like stuff. Now there's just so much happening. There's so much that goes into it and that's basically the gist of this episode but don't worry. We're not done yet but wait there's more but wait, there's more yet. Netflix has a lot of shows like a lot like you'll never see all of them. One report stated that they have 700 original shows in A original movies which is like they have to have more than 80 original movies, so I wasn't able to look more into that so take that as

you will. And the average Netflix show gets canceled after season. Two, this is not, it's not really a surprise. I mean, I'm surprised it's not season one. Yeah, maybe that's a historic Trend because like, Orange is the New Black. I like five seasons and so in the beginning they got more seasons and now we're going down because there's also like less competition in the streaming world and now jangling oh and demand has gone up. Correct.

Well Basically they want shows that will bring in a big audience and be viewed by majority of subscribers majority being the key word. So I feel like this is out of order, but one of the big things that you see, when the show comes out, is keep streaming it, put it on, in the background, just keep watching it. No matter what, just eat, sleep, and breathe the show, but it's not going to help because you

need more people to watch. It's not the numbers that of streaming that they're looking at. They want to make sure that a lot of people. It's the people, the quantity of the people, the percentage of Of their subscribers watching a show. How many people do they bring in that? Watch that show. So you can stream it all you want, but it's if other people are not watching it as well,

it's not going to matter. Netflix apparently looks at three metrics to metrics in the first 7 and 28 days which is households that start a series and how cells that complete a series. Now everyone especially okay, I'm using born on, that's the biggest one that happened recently. Everyone is like you have to finish in 28 days you have to finish it, watch it. But they yeah, they were also like watched as much as possible

in 28 days. Now it's the households that complete it. If you complete it more than once you've already completed, your only one. So if you completed three times or so one, Just saying. And then they also look at the number of subscribers that watch a show and that was referenced a lot for cancellations to this

one article that I got this info from, Another. aspect of the cancellations, is that Netflix has to pay the production Clause so they're not licensing this content like we said they'd pay the production Cost Plus 30% but they promised increases to the people each year. So these series are more expensive after the second season and gets exponentially expensive each season that they go on.

So for Netflix, it is cheaper for them to cancel a show and completely just make a new one, then it is to keep a show going. That's not like Huge success, like stranger things. Squid games Wednesday. Yeah. And all that stuff because like everybody watches it, it is There's no comparison to a lot of the shows and unfortunate. It's not fair. It's not fair to other shows. But bunny is just a big part because it is a business.

I already did my need more people to watch and complete rant, but again, get more people to watch it and also because people were so obsessed with the top 10. When you keep re-watching, it it's the number of hours streamed. So of course, it's going to inflate the numbers. In the top 10. So it's going to look like more people are watching it but it's the same people streaming it again and again and again.

So you don't know exactly how many, it's not really a good indication of how many people are watching it. If you're just free watching it over and over. Okay, and then we get the churn rate. And now I didn't know what this was before this either. I think I should have heard of this. Yes, so the churn rate is basically how many people these networks are. Well streaming platforms, are losing's subscribers, so Netflix Is one of the lowest to lose

subscribers. They only lost three point, three percent in 2022. But the importance of this is that the number of subscribers I lost went up 66 percent from the year before. Whereas other platforms may have a higher churn rate where more people are unsubscribing, but they're getting less people unsubscribing each year. So Netflix is the biggest one to lose subscribers and they are consistently losing subscribers. So that is the use this as an outlook for the overall business itself.

So basically they're not heading in a great Direction, which is why Netflix is really scrambling right now. To figure out their next move which is why we're getting all of their crackdowns and to try and Salvage money basically and also Probably why the canceling a lot more. Because mmm. We'll get there later, I think. Why do some shows get renewed over others? This is this is the big one. We've seen on social media as

well. I saw Wednesday be compared to Warrior none in the beginning and I really don't understand that one either. Do you think that you can't was sparked from an advertising point of view? Because again, the perception is that some shows are getting actual advertising by the streamer, whereas, others aren't so part of the Assumption or what people have noticed. Association, I guess is the right word.

The association is that the shows that are getting cancelled, are the ones that aren't really being invested in by the network. So they're like setting them up to fail, like Warrior down was off the air for like are off the air. Didn't like we basically to wait two years for the season two because of the pandemic, right? It got greenlit for a season 2. Pandemic happen production got delayed that's how I got tossed in the 2022 bin whereas this

should have been a 2021 show. And so what people notice is that like there was no Promotion at all for the show. It just dropped and that was it. Whereas Wednesday had a bunch of promotion from the network leading up to it. So, people are saying, like, basically, like they're setting these shows up, to fail, they're not investing in them. Hence, why want some succeed and some, don't in a model where you're trying to get more individuals, to watch it?

If you're not promoting it, how are we going to reach other people? That's the perception. And that's where that comparison comes into play. It's definitely fair. And I, obviously, we're never going to know why, right? I'll be tried looking at me and really tried to look into this and could not find a damn thing. So, we tried, I don't know what this is.

This what happened last night? Yeah, when you were like by you just literally said, by in the middle of us researching this know which is valid, but I couldn't find it. I mean, I don't work in the industry. Obviously, I just told you I'm a pharmacist. I tried to research this. I couldn't figure out how these decisions are made. Honestly, I will say I'm trying to get us to talk to somebody in programming so hopefully they will be able to explain a little bit more.

Hopefully they'll agree to an actual interview with us so everyone else can hear as well if not you can do like a follow-up episode of just like summarize. What we've learned It's just a lot. We're still not done. It's just It's just a lot you can but like we touched on the Wednesday Warrior and on thing a little bit again, it was a Content that already had a fan base. It already.

It's just it's a reboot or like not even a reboot, a spin-off, whatever off of something that was already established, like on the visual media platform. Yes, Warrior, none is based off a comic book from the 90s so technically it's a visualization of something that already existed. But The Adams Family has multiple movies that were Blockbuster success as it was a TV show.

Again, it has generally Generations, know that show so like it was already going to be successful because people are like oh I remember this, let me watch it. Like if anything people were just going to tune in because they knew what the Adams Family already was. So like it's really not a fair comparison. It's like a Marvel movie versus like an independent movie. Like people already know what these this content is.

This it's Nostalgia people are already going to tune in, like it's really not a fair comparison and so in a company that's hemorrhaging money, it would make sense to be like, let's promote the hell out of this because more people are going to watch it because they know what it is. Yes. Yeah and I'm sure I'm sure it'd cost a ton of money to get the rights to an Addams family thing also. So they're probably trying to recuperate whatever went into like getting this content.

Aunt too. So basically there's a lot that goes into it and that's going to be a lot of decisions that you don't understand. Because there's a bunch of things that happen behind closed doors, even like politically in these Productions as well. Like, you never know, there's so much that I am totally. Yeah. Unfortunately, people who aren't the Creator's? Who hold the purse strings. Get the final say like and it

isn't fair. That's just that as the way Capitalist World works also because Netflix pays all these production costs plus like the 30%. It doesn't make sense for them to allow it to go to another Network because they put so much money out for it. Yeah. So that's why there's a huge fight to get the rights back because the other people have never owned the rights. It's always been Netflix's and it's not in their best interest to let it go to another Network.

And now we're gonna go to another thing that was talked about a lot on social media, the queer on queer fight. Yes, and brings us to our next assumption. That we have heard a lot. Women love women, is that how you say it WL W shows are being cancelled? Warm and loving lesbians shows her being cancelled but gays are getting renewed. Right. Sappho is under attack with the assumption. Know what out. No Bree Bree. We can't hear you. Hey there.

Yeah, there you go. I was just trying to make a we're talking about. Like, like you said Sapphic, but I want to make sure the bisexuals are seen. Okay. Oh yeah, I just mean that as an umbrella term of non men basically loving women on men. There you go. We're doing this in a different way. Shows, like, first kill are being canceled but shows, like heart-stopper are getting renewed. There we go. All right. Let's what's? It's just all complicated guys, it's just complicated.

But one Forbes article has tried to give reasons again, we're all trying to explain this. We'll never know why. But here's some reasons why it could possibly be in the realm of possibilities. They have stayed at for different reasons, I think is that their flimsy book? Like this, what you got? We're all the same boat here ratings. We are used to hearing that rating. I'm so sick of ratings at this point, the critics gave heart-stopper 100%. That's actually pretty damn good.

The fans gave it 97%, well, first kill critics, gave it a 58% And fans give it a 90, which is not a big thing because Netflix has renewed stuff that critics didn't like before. Again Supernatural elements are more expensive. Then a high school. Heart-stopper, could have more viewers out of the top 10. Also, it could have been that because we were doing the let's re-watch the show on repeat. It was inflating numbers. That's my own take though. And then Source material go ahead?

Yeah, go ahead. They Netflix did say in some article or whatever about Heart Stopper. Because heart-stopper, the reason why this one hurt is, it's not that it got renewed, it said it got renewed for two additional Seasons like immediately. I haven't fearing for that. It wasn't even done being streamed and I saw one of the, one of the it wasn't done, And I saw one of the reasons which wasn't because Oscar winner,

Olivia Colman isn't it? Which okay, how much of the budget was just getting her on the show? I just want a mouse. What? I'm sorry. I don't know what it is. Oh my God, it's fine. Let's move past that the reason I saw that's not that was that it was the subscriber growth, like individuals watching, it was going up consistently from week to week and that is there metric. But like to get two seasons is pretty crazy.

At once from Netflix, my assumption is that they didn't have to do the pay bump as much because you know how they it costs each month. More each season. So we're like okay this is doing really well. Let's just give in to season so we don't have to like increase costs as much from year to year. Oh I see. And then I heard the other reason or I read somewhere

another reason. Something like this happens is because so both of these stories are Productions are based off of written material first kill is based off of a short story. So like one in done in the short story is basically already done in the first season versus heart stopped. For which is based off of a book series and I've heard partially why book series get renewed more easily is because the executives who aren't the creators, understand where this story's

already going? Because it's already written down. So it's like Sorry I can't I don't know what I'm talking about. Didn't read it. Yeah my bad but yes what Fiora said, sorry it's really fun. The other people talk please. I have a tendency to take over but again that one just hurt because again it like the perception is that okay? We had a Sapphic ship. So to non men two women, one of

them's a lead person of color. That's the show that gets axe versus the all like the white leads that are both men. Like, that's the perception like just looking at the two things so and then one gets axed, one gets to Ins renewed. This isn't relevant but I looked up Olivia Colman and I'm assuming that you know her from fleabag. Yeah. She's no are from everything,

it's ruptured, know her. But she's been in a lot of Thomas stuff so I'm sure I know her some put it on the crown like it's Olivia Colman. I've never seen the crown. My God. Olivia Colman is a gem and every time she wins Awards, she never preps her, her speech. It's like a thing now. So she just fumbles her speeches when she wins. She is Is the actual best. So I don't understand how they got her on the show. Like what were they paying a Livia Coleman?

So anyway I just budget cost to get her that must have cost a pretty penny but she's amazing the coming out scene to Olivia Colman in Dart Stoppers one of us. I've seen nothing that she's been in, sorry. All right, we've already covered Source material. Weren't, which brings us to our next assumption? About Netflix. Or actually call them really know. Yeah, this is actually, I forgot. This is all of them, but we're

using Netflix as the example. the assumption is that they cancel anything that is controversial and I found some things while looking at Netflix that like I was surprised to read so Netflix has tried to make a few shows with lgbtq plus representation in Turkey. Turkey, does not happy. They had to pull one because it was denied a license due to the

content. and they had to pull another show with an openly gay character, when there's bunch of social media of campaigns to boycott Netflix, And it's basically just the Turkish government like sensory and but because they are a streaming platform, they don't have to go through censorship. As much like mmmm. So I think that's how they got

around things. And another instance of them actually advocating for representation is in is with this Arabic film, perfect strangers, it sparked, a controversy in Egypt and West Asia due to a gay character and taboo breaking story lines and Everyone was like so against it. Not everyone like the entertainment industry in those countries where actually rallying behind it. The actors and Netflix statement to this outrage against this

film was perfect. Strangers is a fictional story that explores Universal themes, without taking a moral stand and said inviting the audience to have an open dialogue and debate, the film tackles tough subjects through humanity and humor, led by a talented Arab cast focused. On Creative Excellence. They're like we're just opening a conversation and letting people decide for themselves which with countries like the censoring things. They don't want that conversation to even be a thing.

They're like, this is bad, this is immoral. We don't do this stuff. You're gonna have gay people. Anywhere. Queer people lgbtq+. People anybody in that Community. Anywhere you go. Oh okay. My next point is that shows are constantly getting cancelled. It looks like they're homophobic because our shows keep getting cancelled. And representation for our community has gotten better, but the leads are still not prevalent. Like there's less clearly queer

characters as leads. So it makes it seem like it's only our shows getting cancelled. I love how I wanted to put this point in here. My next note was not really relevant here, but country Comfort got cancelled before I even knew about it, and it was such a cute show. It's not queer in the slightest but it got cancelled after one season and I didn't know about it until after it was canceled. And I was so sad and it was just

adorable. It's a cute little comedy show and I suggest it. If you don't mind watching kids in a show, another point to this is that Netflix doesn't have Pilots, but I keep wanted to keep talking about this before

now, but here we are. Instead of ordering Pilots where the network will be able to see a cast chemistry, if they think it'll work if they want to like, recast anybody and sometimes, like I think almost half the time, those Pilots don't even go to Series so you'll never see them Netflix, just orders every show that they have straight to ones like a series. So six eight episodes. You will get it.

So the good thing is that you get to see shows that you might not have seen before especially if they have this representation, like you don't know if it would have liked tested. Well But the bad thing is that it looks like more of our shows are getting cancelled as well, by Netflix because they're just, they're making everything basically. So, it's again, pros and cons to it. But there, I also read that a lot more platforms are doing it this way.

So it's going to inflate the amount of cancellations we have each year because obviously, you can't afford to keep making it too. And also make new shows, Just trying to like throw it out there and be like, what's going to stick? with, but they also look at their analytics, they have also People like to. Again, I'm not commenting on like specific things. Don't come at me for be like, you're targeting our fan on and

all that stuff. No, because everything does this, everybody's like so excited when things trend on Twitter And this used to be like a huge thing before the for you trending happened, but now there is like Twitter. Kool-Aid sets trends for you specifically.

So if you're talking about something and the people that are interacting with that subject are also talking about that one thing, it's going to show up as trending for you, but this doesn't mean that people who don't even know about the show, we're going to see it. So maybe like, oh look we're going to see more. People are going to see it because we're trending. No more people are seeing it that are talking about it. So that's what it looks like.

These shows are always trying to cause if you notice Like motherland. ARP. What you're not? This other always trending. We're only trending for us. You know? Maybe they are being enough to try and sometimes Countrywide worldwide. We don't know because we're looking at for you Trends, so just just, that's just something to keep in mind because you can go to different categories of

trending. You can go to a trending in your country and what's trending globally, but you actually have to navigate towards that And so I just want to make people aware of that. but I know that this was a lot of this event, I feel like the bad person right now, like, giving all the Dozen The Doom and Gloom know people's like perspective of things. But like, I don't want people to waste time and energy on things

that don't actually matter. Yeah. Well that's the thing we've been where we've created trauma responses where we're adopting behaviors, that are very time-consuming and seemed defeatist because they never get us anywhere. and the truth of it is, is that we're operating at a disadvantage because we are Less percentage of the overall population and it sucks. And it's not fair.

And we're constantly reminded of that in this scenario, which is why it hurts and it really like that's why we latch onto these things to begin with. And then now, we're just losing all of these things that we resonate with. That means something to us and it's very hard for us to like, It's important for us to mobilize as a group, but we are

a smaller portion of people. So, It's harder for us to make an impact and a lot of things like you mentioned our algorithm based that are showing us what we want to see. And it's giving us false hope or skewing our percent perceptive perspective words of what's happening. So it's not your fault Caitlin. And this is like thank you for pointing these things out. Like I didn't know that and I'm not a huge Twitter person. Obviously. Have you met me? And sorry.

I'm so, like, I didn't know that. That it's curating trending. I thought that was just what's trending on this platform. So to illustrate that example, I'm on our Twitter account. Trending for you, Beatrice Warrior known billboard Gap. The series to watch Captain steers. You go to trending in the United States. Chiefs Ed Red Eagles, Beyonce optic. Watch caturday UCLA because I don't do entertainment The Proposal 10 Things I Hate About. You Blue Ivy Todrick. Nia Long Percy.

What does things and then 20 year old movies, where are they turning towards the bottom? Holy war movement, which is White one of the warrior nodren. So yeah, I'm sure he's looking at the right trending. People are taking other things that people say to Heart, like about like ratings and stuff, and, like things Netflix, looks or look into it yourself.

You can even fact check what we say, but as long as you're looking into it yourself and not just taking somebody else's word because that's when Miss information does get spread and people freak out more. Yeah, because they're just listening to others. Yeah, so we whole, he's going to do your own research. We hope if anything, this gave you a breath of all the things that kind of go not all.

But some things that go on in this very complicated situation that we are receiving the shitty end of basically and like Caitlin said like look into it sometimes you can't like we're not it neck and we're not Executives at Netflix. We will never fully know what goes on. I'm in the boardroom. We will never know what the numbers really look like. Even if we work there we'd be under an NDA, right? So like we will the sad part in the shooting part is we never will actually know.

So unfortunately, all we see, are these, what's happening? And we make Trends because we try to put it together because that's what human brains are designed to do. And so, yeah, it's really sad but, you know, based on what we have found, we think that there's a lot of things factors that go into this, kind of show was this who was producing it. Fortunately, we don't get the syndicated stuff anymore. So like unfortunately TV has been changed forever and this is

what the model is now. So, Maybe sometimes we only get one season or maybe things will move into mini series versus shows where it's like, it is one season basically and it's done. And we tie up Loose Ends, we don't leave devastating endings or me, never get a resolution, so bounty hunters. Yeah, I mean, Netflix is one of the things I am looking forward to is the seven husbands of Evelyn Hugo that's going to be on Netflix. It is a miniseries of a book, so

it will end. There is no Cliffhanger. Like that's it. It will be produced. Netflix is actually great at that. The Queens Gambit was incredible. It was a mini series one and done so like maybe that's where they go. We don't know. but I do want to caution people a little bit to not to add more Gloom to this, but we have all these shows on streaming platforms and another thing we didn't really talk about that's going to change is that keeping these things available on streaming

platforms? Does cost the money so the next thing they're going to look at really in terms of money saving is like what do we keep on our library? And if Netflix, for example, owns exclusive rights to something like first kill and they're like having this isn't profitable on our library. They will retire it from the library. Yes. Need to talk about why? It's not like why?

It's costing them money? Yeah. Yeah. Oh please do but I just want to finish the thought is that like so some so some shows over time like we've seen like Discovery do this. And and some of these streaming platforms already where they were just taking their original content off of there. And now, the downside of that is that nobody has access to it. Because there aren't DVDs. There aren't hard copies of

these things. So like I want to caution you if you can not that I'm advocating for piracy I'm deaf. Finally, not advocating for piracy. I'm definitely not advocating for you to look down below on how to get stuff to download. Yeah, I'm absolutely not going to talk about play on home / Cloud.

We're not talking about that, but I will say, if you can find a way to get a copy of that show and keep it for yourself, I highly encourage you to figure out how to do that, by legal means because your favorite show might come off that platform and then it is available nowhere else because They now own everything and that's another sad consequence. Basically of this, the streamer owns the rights to everything and there is no hardcopy anywhere anymore.

Again, don't look at the description to get our affiliate link to play on home. Absolutely. Do not, we not do that now but I don't know what you're talking about Caitlin. Maybe just explain why they're doing this, like why is it not possible. So the reason why these shows are continually costing money for them, I'm like, I mean, the shows that they license that's

pretty self-explanatory. Like they need to pay for it to be on their platform but their original shows every time that people stream it they have to pay royalties to the actors if they're like if that's in their contract and to the Creator's. So the friends cancer probably still making bank from friends they definitely because Seinfeld. Yeah yeah so I also, there's people like getting like a check for, like, a penny for from royalties.

For things are like, just don't send it to me, but yeah. So people are still getting paid for these shows when people are watch them. So that's why it still cost them money to have it on their platform. Yeah. And in honored cable network thing, that makes sense, because that's what the old school contracts, right? Like friends and like Seinfeld those actors and creators and writers in particular. They're the ones so. Right or contracts are going to

start changing soon too. And there's going to be a writer strike because they're trying they're not getting the royalties. They used to get and like because of that, it's harder to like be a writer professionally because like, you just have to jump from Project to project to keep getting money because they used to get rid. Residuals. But anyway, so that's a whole nother clusterfuck, that's gonna start happened.

They sometimes will take lower pay in the beginning because they would get residuals and that would be up for it, right? And so that's a whole another thing, it's compounding until like cost and scripted TV and that going to start impacting stuff. But like the thing that used to make up for a lot of that is ADS.

Like that's why we have reruns. That's why I like friends with shows up randomly on like I do. No, I don't watch cable anywhere, but like, it will show up on a cable network that isn't NBC, like, randomly on Thursday. Hey guys, I thought it was tedious. So TBS, every Thursday, or whatever, like friends reruns and it's because they keep it going because they sell ads to it. And that's the ad. Money is how they pay all the people in the contracts who get residuals every time.

It pays or every time it plays. But on the streaming service that has no ads, how were they making money? They're not making money. They're not bringing in ad money. To like Jesus is why they have ad execs so I'm wondering if like by pulling it off they're going to put it in the add sections where they can make money off of ads so like maybe it will be gone forever. Maybe we'll be in that a drowned but like platforms that don't

adopt the ads. I have just removed stuff and it's not accessible anywhere else. So I just caution people like prepare yourselves. That's what I'm saying. But the positive and all of this, like we don't want to end this on a bad note. I know this is a lot. It's a very sad time. This was therapy, therapy is hard, it's a process.

But the bottom line to to remember is that like these shows all exist, like they exist for me and Bree who grew up in the dark, ages of, like, queer representation in media. We had to like make shit up and be like hey, they stared at each other. And there's like 500 Fanfictions about it. And there wasn't even a 03. So as she touched her name, I repeat. That was what we had growing like. Literally not like we had the Xena. Do you guys remember Xena, Xena had where the keep your Warrior

queen of context? Wait, right? Exactly. It's all subjects. Like all of the eggs, everywhere, text spoiler. If you haven't finished watching Xena and he plan to skip ahead and never seen it, It is he in his classic but like the queer kiss happens when in a dream sequence. When one of them is like, inhabiting a man's body and the other ones still themselves and so it's like, yep, you watch. I wrote watching it as a kid being like, What am I watching?

What that was our queer content? You have to understand? Or we were always cast as villains because of laws and TV censorship that we will have a whole other episode about, but like we had absolutely nothing and so the fact that we're getting these shows at all is a very good thing. Like, yeah, we're not gonna cancel it really sucks. It shouldn't have. It was quality, it was quality television. First of all, which In the era of reality TV is hard, but it exists.

The Beatrice and Ava story. It exists. It is beautiful. It is perfection. It exists. So, like, revisit the things that you love, because they exist and they matter, We're not settling for subtext and weird inhabiting men's bodies so it's not actually a queer kiss but it is a queer kiss. As your representationally weird. 18 is a really weird. Imagine being a child. Try to watch this and you're like, I don't know what the fuck are the other?

The other time anything happened on the show is when they were being crucified or had just been crucified because you're allowed to have quit your content, as long as you're being displayed as a villain or immoral, that was the Time we grew up in right? The morality police a terrible time guys. This stuff exists is huge.

The fatter isn't there. The fact that first kill exist with a black woman lead with a black family, that's like healthy family and like role models and stuff that matters. The fact that the Creator's consciously made this understanding all of that that matters because we did not have that decades ago. So things are getting better. We're still getting persecuted and shut on with our stuff but

like it's getting better. At least we have stuff where there's leads and I know that like it's not much but it really is and there are still shows coming out with queer leads. There are some that got renewed like it's not over things are still being produced. Like I haven't seen it yet but the sex lives of college girls. Got a season 3 like Yellow Jackets word we're just cancel out, didn't line? Yes. Yeah it's probably a reason for that. There sure is.

It's a hot mess but like yellow, Jackets, that was something we got, like, slated for like the whole thing. And there's clear representation in that. Like, I know, we're mad at the gay boys, but like, celebrate the gay boys, like hard stopper. And young Royals are getting new season, so, like us being leads, isn't necessarily the deal breaker, it's much more complicated than that.

Also, their representation has been problematic for so long, like they're let them have that they're finally not the like the I don't want to be like a disrespectful little bit like 4:30. And yeah exactly like overall it's getting better and like we're getting queer actors playing. Queer characters are like actors coming out just period and like so it's like it's changing. Its just like it's always one step forward, two steps back and

you just keep going. And are there any things coming out that you guys are looking forward to? That's The only thing that in any way shape, or form was looking, I won't say, looking forward to, I'm curious note because the papadum section, I don't know if I love this. I'm just gonna throw it out there. and there's the reason I'm saying that and it's because it May not be queer, super queer in the first season. We have to wait for the second

season. If there is, if it gets a second season, The Last of Us. Oh, yeah, The Last of Us. Yeah, that I think is very good because she's 14 in the first season. Yeah. Oh, Vigil is getting a season two with syringes. This thing I was pink. Ward to the one thing right now. There we go, there's that. I don't know anything that's out. Coming out. I Do Not A League of Their Own gets renewed, and I have a lot of movies. We gonna live without this.

Okay, wait. Another one for 2024 on HBO, Max. Oh, I wonder what it is. Thanks whisk with Joey Homer, that's going to be. My Fiora wants to see that. I wonder why we've been hearing about that since before we were big gay energy. Yeah. Is the co-star. I will talk about nothing else for the rest of my life. Oh dear lord, I Can Dream you measure. Think that that I would die? Their chemistry is beyond anything. It doesn't make any sense.

It's so stupidly good and they're both incredible actors. So let us know if you want the order of rant about killing me for a whole episode. I don't think that I can consciously do that. In I have a patient go back there. Right now, many things to say about that. There is a podcast in existence that does killing of Justice. It's called well, Villa del go listen to it. They do it justice. But yeah. So basically 2022 soft. There's no denying that but hopefully, I mean things are

just changing. That's just the way that it is the queer content is still being made, but I mean, I think it's time to kind of like set our expectations a little bit differently maybe because like all the shows are getting acts. It's not just us, it just feels disproportionate because we have less to begin with, which is really unfair and Donut.

But I mean overall the good thing I learned by doing this was that like the representation in general in projects is going way up, it's more than 50% like that's huge. Like we had to scramble for shows that even had a queer character in them. So the fact that they're just like in shows now is that is good that is a good thing in and of itself like we need more time to get like the leads for something that retains multiple Seasons while these fucking streaming services figure their shit.

Out, because I think the bottom line is, they don't have their shit figured out and like everybody suffering, until they kind of figure out how to adapt to like the cluster Fox, and then a pandemic happen. So, like, everybody got fucked. Is my boy, I'll listen to our interview with Steven Tyler O'Connor about casting diverse City in series and it's great. Yeah, there are Advocates least even their Advocates and casting

he won an Emmy for casting. Like, you know, a It goes on behind the scenes that we just don't see. So hopefully this gave a some kind of explanation some kind of background about out, you know, the war on the queers, the cancel your queries of 2022. And I'm glad the 2022 is in the past. I don't know about you guys. Fuck me, huh? I mean half of things that happen. So there are some good things. There were some really messed up things and it's over. Now we're going, we got to meet at.

That's not was the, that was the big positive for us personally. Yeah. So, we got to hang out with our friends in Vancouver. I don't know why I said it like that. Anyways, it's you 20:23 is going to be better or I'll punch it in the face. I have a question for our audience. Okay. Would you be interested in hearing us? Talk more about topics like this. Like, research-based anything more into this? Just let us know. Thank you. Have a good day.

All right, thanks for listening. Let us know what you're looking forward to in company, coming down the pipeline and Fuck 20:22. That shit. Is that? Leave it in the past. Leave that trauma in the past. Let's move forward into a bigger gay or future. Thanks. Bye. And with that, we've been big gay energy. If you liked this episode check out all our other episodes on whatever you're using to listen

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