Hello and welcome to Big Gay Energy. I'm Bree. I'm Fiora. And I'm Caitlin. Come along with us while we dive into the fun and nuances of queer media. Representation matters, and we're here to talk about it. Cheers, queers. What's on the big gay agenda today, Theora? Well, today we are finally, finally, finally going to talk about red, white and royal blue. Woo Hoo. Yay. Yeah. So because of the strike, we couldn't. We didn't want to do this sooner. Slash when the movie came out
because scabbing is not cool. So we've waited to do it now and we're going to talk about the movie and the book together because there's some fun differences and similarities and stuff, and we figured we'd just do it all in one episode. So if you have or have not seen or read the book, like we're going to talk about both of them. So just a warning, you're planning on watching reading one and don't want to be spoiled. So make sure you've read the book if you want to read that book.
Yeah, exactly. So, And you mind spoilers. If you don't mind spoilers, that's fine. Welcome Yeah 'cause we're going to talk about all of it. So what is red, white and royal blue? If you're not familiar, it is. It first started as a novel novel written by Casey Mcquiston, and it was recently adapted into a film on Amazon in 2020, released in 2023. Overall, what it's about, it's this. Like I'm going by mostly the book when I'm describing this.
So it's like a Rivals to lovers. ROM Com starring Alex Claremont Diaz, who is the current son of the President of the United States of America and Prince Henry of England. Not the Crown Prince, but like the second Prince. These two were basically public figures since they were children and the rivalry. Started a little differently depending on if you watch the movie or read the book. So it starts when Alex was in the book when Alex was 13 due to a royal snub at the Rio Olympics.
If you watch the movie, it started at the 2021 Melbourne Climate Summit in in in the movie. It's a few years before the movie starts, but since regardless of how it starts, since that time, the two have been fostering this rivalry until fate intervenes. And the two reunite at the royal wedding of Prince Philip, who's Henry's older brother and like the Crown Prince, and a $75,000 cake incident ensued is caught on camera. Because that's the basis of everything though, yeah.
Use social media. It's really the the catalyst. It's like Archduke Ferdinand's assassination or the cake incident. Yeah, so it's a little less murdery, but. Politically pretty damning. So because of those, the two are forced into this PR scheme where they have to behave as best Bros, and through this ruse, the two get to know each other better. Oh, so much better. Amazing. Very much better. Intimately if you. Will. Intimate.
Intimately, indeed. So before we just straight up spoil scenes, I thought we'd start with just like who Who is your favorite character? Or like we'll start our favorite character. Did you have a favorite character in the movie or book? Doesn't matter. I guess. Caitlyn, go since I saw your mouth open. No, you can go. No, I was just going to say Henry, period.
I just. I have a thing I may have an obsession with, like English history and different time periods in English history, you know? So I Henry's going to be my obvious favorite. Plus, he's just sarcastic and adorable. I mean, they're both great, but I'm Alex over Henry. I know I will, obviously. But neither one is my favorite. Who's your favorite? Zara and Amy. OK. OK. That track for Caitlin? They're, I just really like their lives their their humor is freaking hilarious.
And I just there's one point where I think. Alex tells Zara Like, I could kiss you right now. And she's like, touch me and die now. That one, that was all, yeah. What about you see? I I agree with Henry. Henry is my favorite. I Alex. So I do like his character and I especially like him in the book because you get both of them in the book really, 'cause you get more in depth about like why they are the way they are. And the book is written in
Alex's point of view. So you're very much in Alex's head. And like the first time I read it, I was like, wow, Alex is really like full of himself. And I don't know if I'm digging this, but like to contrast him with Henry, who's very repressed. I like the repressed character usually. That's who I enjoy. That is our jam. My jam and to prep for this episode.
I want to do a little show and tell with the collector's edition of the book because I there's extra chapters in it from Henry's point of view and there are, but I just kind of want it for those watching at home if there's a collector's edition and this thing is beautiful. So if you're a big fan of this and you weren't aware, I highly recommend going to get those. It's really cool. So if you take like the cover off just it's blue, it's hard cover and it says. History, huh?
And on the back that we could make some like it's so cute and I love that. And this came out before the movie. On the inside cover, backside cover, there's illustrations of them the. Turkey. Turkey. It's so. I wasn't expecting this to be so freaking cute, but like, the ones on the back too. Like, no, I like that one, yeah. I love that the history, huh, Is on it, 'cause it's such a big part of the book.
I love it so much this. I'm very happy that thee is like the mistress of finding what's on the under the books dust covers. 'Cause she takes those off to read them. Oh, I took it off. And then I was like, what? Like I wasn't expecting that. Yeah, 'cause I don't like to ruin the dust covers. But you get an actually like I think 50 ish chapters and it basically spans like five years. Oh, no, no, 50 pages. Sorry, 50 pages. I was. Like that's a white thing. There's there are chapters.
There's. Only 50 chapters in the book 50. Pages, I'm sorry, I didn't mean to get everybody excited about that. And it basically spans like five years after the the book ends and it goes through like their life and like. Spoiler They end up getting engaged. And like, of course they do. And it just goes. Henry's just having all these, like, memories and it's getting his point of view is really cute. He's just he's, I love him. I thought it was his point of view, like during the book.
So that's interesting that it's like a continuation of it. Yeah, but she switches to Henry, which is very cute 'cause you don't really. So it's like them in New York and like. Oh, did I say Alex? I'm no, you said Henry. I just OK, cool. I have a habit of mixing people's names up. And and there's a queer spoiler at that section. And I'll spoil you guys when we, like. Get to it. Which is fun. OK. OK. All right. You.
Didn't really. David's not your favorite Caitlyn. David's, also known as. David. We didn't get enough of David for me to like have him be my favorite like that's now if David had his own scene in subplot like, but we saw Moore's R and Amy. But I wish we also saw Moore Beatrice in the movie. Yeah, I agree. And the. Beatrice is so much more in the book and it's just the relationships. I have this in another section. It's really hard not to like skip sections, I know. Anyway.
That's all right. Yeah, I agree. I I I understand why the movie had to like cut things and condense, which is why I'm glad we have the book 'cause it just it flushes out a lot of other things where it's like, oh man, I wish we had that, but for time wise I get why we don't. Yeah, there's a reason why all the other plots were cut out that I'll. Talk about Yeah, a lot of them were super cut out. So Speaking of book versus movie, let's jump first to Alex and Henry cause like they are.
The center of both things and very much the center of the movie, for obvious reasons. So what did you think of their rivalry, quote, UN quote, specifically between like the book and the movie? So I have thoughts about this. Wait, hold on. I'm just OK 'cause we we skipped our favorite moments. Oh, oh, OK. Yes. What's your favorite? I I thought that was later, but that's OK OK, What was your sorry, go back. What was your favorite moment of
the book Slash movie? Well, I mean, you brought up the dog. So it was when Alex doesn't like the name of Henry's dog, and then it ends up with him looking at photos of Amy's dog and it's just the whole scene and the way she's like, hey, I mind I forget what her dog's name is, but but she's like. Alex says like, but he's really cute. And she says yeah he is. You want to see a picture? And then looking at pictures, that was a cute. Moment in the movie.
It didn't exist in the book. I did like that. Moment A. Lot. Yes. I was very upset that that was not in the book, so I'm really glad they added it because I've the Amy took over cash. Yeah. So, OK. So cash is. In the book, Alex's main bodyguard and he's like a big huge, like Texas guy and then Amy's there too as another bodyguard slash Secret Service worker. But it they just got rid of cash and just I think that's supposed to be Amy. It is Amy.
In the movie, but they've erased all of Amy's character in the movie. But I'll rant about that in another section, because that's what I'm. They didn't. Actually, they didn't. It's not really mentioned or anything. It's not. It's not explicit at all. Right. So I didn't like that. No, but it's Amy is played by a trans actor and they are very they're a big advocate and do a lot of work for the community. So that was my input for that. There's another thank you.
There is also when I know you were like. And this isn't the book, not the movie, when I know Alex is full of himself, but he doesn't want to hear the the tabloids. He wants his sister to read him fan fiction about himself, and I love that. And it just makes me wonder how many people read fan fiction about characters they play. I feel like you have to be curious.
Yeah. I mean, I think some, I think a lot of people kind of go dabble into it a little and then they're like, OK, I'm good now and you can. Get to that one. And they're like, OK, we're just going to put that away. Yeah, exactly. But anytime fan fiction shows up in a story, a book or a movie or whatever, I'm I'm there for it. So. Yeah. All right. Now to Alex and Henry, unless you guys have a favorite moment you want to talk about. I do, but they're like I wrote
them out in later sections. I have favorite. Scenes. Yeah, I'm waiting for the turkeys. Don't worry. Yeah, but I do. I do really love in the movie. I agree with you. The the Amy, Alex moment on the plane about looking at pictures of dogs. That was one of my favorite moments. That that was really cute and it wasn't in the book, which made it more special. Honestly, my favorite, one of my favorite moments in the book. It's probably the karaoke scene.
I prefer that scene in the book than the the movie 'cause there's a lot more going on with the other characters and like Henry's in like that robe. And yeah, I just, I like that scene. It was much more of like an open and free Henry cause of the context versus like the the movie did it really quickly and it it like meant the same thing, but it like it didn't have as much depth of like Henry really being like unabashedly himself in that moment.
All the montages. You see in the movie are like. Basically separate scenes in the book, yeah. Totally. But Alex and Henry, I feel like their rivalry is fairly similar in both things because, I mean, it's based on them, but I feel like Alex seems more open to being by in the movie than in the book. Because it takes him a lot longer to like kind of accept himself. And he was like trying to convince himself he wasn't straight for a while.
Because in the book it says straight people, he thinks, probably don't spend this much time convincing themselves they're straight. I love that one. It's such a good one. Go ahead, Break. I was just going to say that. I really enjoy that they kept the same. I guess I'll I'd call it flavor of their rivalry and how I think you can tell that they read the book that that I I really think the actors read the book.
So honestly it shows. So that was pretty much, yeah, I just there were the moments that they they did have in both were really done well. And I think that we're just kind of people that really like all of the background info. So there'll be times when we're like, well, it's a shame that we don't get to see that so, but I I did think they kept the flavor of the rivalry. Yeah, I think that's fair. And the the, you know, again there's a 90 minute movie they
like had to condense a lot. So like the pacing in the movie was good, which is not always the case in movies. 120 minutes, that's. That's close to 90 minutes. OK, 10 minutes off, I estimating, I said. 129 A hundred. Oh, sorry, whatever, you know what I mean. Versus a book like a not 400 plus page novel, like you know, you're gonna have to cut things like obviously. So I think the pacing was really good, which isn't always the case.
What I didn't really love is that like the I don't like how they change the rivalry like when it started because in in the movie 'cause they they made it like almost a couple years before the movie starts. So it's like they haven't been rivals for that long. Which doesn't like add to the tension of the rivalries to lovers trope. Because in the in the book that started when like Alex was 13 years old. So it's like been a decade that they've like been in this situation where there's like
tension. And like, Alex, like kept a picture of like, like from a magazine of Henry. And he's like, I don't understand why, but I can't stop looking at this picture. And it just, it added to the whole tension part because it's been going on for so long.
I guess I in my brain I when watching the movie, 'cause I I assumed that that was the case for some reason, Like, in my brain, my brain went, oh, OK, so they've known of each other for even longer than this, and I don't know why in my brain. I just thought that. Yeah, no, they say it. They say 2021 in the movie Everything. I forgot that. I think I erased that part in my brain. It makes more sense that if he was 13, because it makes sense that he would hold a grudge over
one meeting. Yeah, I know exactly that. And that's who Alex is. So like, yeah, I think that like parts of Alex's personality kind of got erased when they made that little change. And it just it it lessens the rivalry part for me and like the tension part, it would have been easy to just say that though, to just have that be a little bit of background. It would be interesting, like I want to know why they decided to change just that.
Yeah, I understand why they're like climate conference versus like the Olympics. Because politics. But I don't know why they had to be like 2 years before a year before this movie started. I'm with Theo on this one again. Yeah, so just for me, I prefer the long. Tension building. So I didn't like that change. But unless the timeline of the parents in the politics has
changed as well, well. Here's the deal, Like his mom would have been president at that time in 2021 'cause she's up for re election and it's 2023. So, like, in order to be president, you have to be in politics for like a very long time before you're president, typically. Unless you're ATV star. Yeah, for Taylor Swift and you're running for president. But like Alex's mom because like he mentions too in the movie, she's like you were the first female senator and like all
this. So like she's been in politics for a long time. So easily it could have been like, I was with my mom at this conference and I was 13, right? Easily could have still kept that. So I just don't because she would have had to been super high profile within her party to even be considered for a presidential run. Exactly but. One SEC. Sorry, scene. OK. Caitlin, what were you saying before I had technical? Difficulties.
Well, I was going to talk about how in the movie, when Henry and Alex first see each other again, Henry does snub him because Alex was trying to be nice and be like, hey, how's it going or something like that. And Henry just walks away from him, yeah. Yeah, I'm like. I'm sorry. I'm supposed to like Henry over Alex right now. I understand why you guys like him. I like him. It's not like I don't like him. It's just that Alex tried harder. He did and then drank too much.
But. Yes, it all went downhill from there. Yeah, that was definitely more overt in the movie, in the wedding scene, but yeah. One thing I will add, so when talking just about their their entire arc, like the rivalry to lover thing, one thing I liked a lot better in the in the book too was like you mentioned the quote where Alex was like trying to process all of this. There's more processing that happens in the book versus in
the movie. In the movie he tells Nora and he's just like I've already hooked up with a guy before. So it was like he was kind of already there and it wasn't, which I I kind of like the change because then it's not about Alex coming out, which is totally. He still did. Yeah. I guess. Like he came out, but it's not about him. Am I queer? Am I not queer? It wasn't about that part. It was just about I got publicly outed because of this relationship. It was kind of that's what it
was. Which I I'm down for that angle. Like we have tons of coming out stories. Like I'm totally vied. The thing that I liked about his process and journey in the book is then we get the wait, that stuff I was doing with my friend young girl. Oh yeah, the Liam, Liam character. Oh my gosh. I'm like, wait a minute, how do you not know that? If you do something which I just love the, like, oblivious nature of that, from Alex's point of view, he's like that stuff we were doing was that.
I don't care if you're practicing, it's still gay shit. Listen, you say that, but I literally my best friend when I was, you know, younger was like, it's OK, that doesn't make us gay. And I'm like. You're both gay, right? Huh. You're both gay right now, aren't you? Well, she's bisexual. OK, Queer. Yeah, queer. But yeah. So I like, I like the whole stuff with Travis. And I liked Travis's character when Alex called him, he's like, what the fuck are you calling like that character?
And the fact that Alex was like looking back through his life and he's like. Wait, I've been doing queers off the whole time I've been. Pretty gay. I didn't even know it. That was a reason. I mean, like, yeah. I was literally he was a so that. Doesn't make me gay. The guy was so, like, not very nice when he called. I mean, to be fair, it's really weird to get a call from the president's son out of the blue, who probably You knew that it
was gay shit and he didn't. And he was probably playing you're like. Excuse me? You didn't, right? Well, it's like, it's like, it seemed like they parted ways, like, way back when And like, Travis went on his gay journey and I was just like, I'm not gonna think about this. And, like, so yeah, there's some tension there, unresolved tension. So it's not weird for Travis to be like, oh, what the fuck are you calling me? Like I I get that his name is Travis. Who is Liam?
Oh, Liam. Sorry, sorry. It's over. I just wanted to make sure I'm like, if I'm remembering this, there's a lot of characters in the no, there's a lot of names and just like Travis, Texas, like, it's just in my brain. So Liam, Sorry, Liam. That's why I kept messing or doing heart stopper. I kept calling Isaac in the meaning Liam 'cause I was reading this book and I kept just mixing up the name, so I apologize Liam, not Travis. There's no problem.
CR also just has trouble with names in general. Yeah, I'm bad with me. I also, I also didn't read the book. Read it. So like I things commit to my memory better when I see it. And yeah. Or you. Listen to I can't. I was audiobooking this until I found the collective Brain would just go. What's it? What is that little dot on the wall? And then I will miss half a chapter, so I listen to them while I commute. So like. Yeah, I mean, I would understand. Yeah, that commute.
So anyway, so that's why I screw up names a lot. Just I if I don't see it, it's harder to stick in my brain. So sorry, Liam. That's why I put the subtitles on TV now, 'cause I can remember people's names better now. Oh my God, I need to do that with Wheel of Time, 'cause I keep missing stuff. And I'm like. What were those words, except for one thing in a future episode, I'll tell you like it gave away like a. Fairly big pot line for the episode. I'm like, whoa, damn it, sometimes.
And then it switched back. So you did, in case you didn't miss it, you missed. Yeah, whatever. Anyway, also I put emails here, 'cause I wasn't really sure where to put it, and apparently I thought that was like their rivalry, because afterwards this is rivalry 2 lovers the whole
arc, so yeah. All right, so the emails I. One thing I really enjoyed about reading all the emails in the book was that they always signed it differently and the amount of things that Alex came up with to do the acronym HRHI didn't write them down, but like they're they're all hilarious and it's never once His Real Highness but one of them. One of Henry's emails is for first Son of making me spill my tea instead early morning meeting and it's just it was
always great. And then they also include lines from other public figures letters, which I find really ironic considering their private letters and now theirs are out. That's a really good point. Yeah, like the Hamilton one, but I did like that in the book too, 'cause it. Just it it. And again, it adds to the depth of like queer historical people of existence.
It's forever. And also like, it shows how much like the two of them really do care about history and things like that, which I like that aspect of their characters. But I that's funny. The irony of like, these are private letters when you're reading them and they're about to go public again. So Yep. But I knew they were screwed when they're like emailing each other. The shit. I'm like guys, you never write the stuff down. Like, yeah. Come now. OK. The things that they wrote down
in those letters. Yes, the things they wrote down in the letters. Oh dear Lord. I mean, to be fair, if I was them I probably wouldn't think about it either. But like you're sharing stuff that's in covered under an NDA with each other who he definitely doesn't have clearance to know about this shit, yeah. And now the whole world. Like the thing was that the world? Knows about in those letters. Oh, they know. They know many things. Why did Henry spill the tea? Guys? They all know.
Like they talk on the phone too. Why didn't they just talk? Because you always want to be talking to each other. It doesn't matter if it, like you can't talk on the phone all the time, so. I meant the secretive stuff. There's no. Paper trail. That would be smart. But they were having hormones and that that makes you not smart. They were having horny thoughts, Caitlin. That doesn't lead to good brain activity. I mean, it's easy for us to say after the fact, right?
So or not being in their position, yeah. Yeah, put us in their position. See what happens. All right. So one thing I want to talk about that's I guess book versus movie is the White House Trio stuff. So the White House trio does not exist in the movie. So the characters in who composed the White House trio are Alex, obviously Nora and then June Claremont Diaz, who's Alex's sister who was cut out
completely from the movie. So I just wanted to what were your thoughts on like the existence and non existence of the White House Trio? OK so my the first thing I ever wrote for this section is like I that I get the time is limited. But I really wish that there was a subplot for the other
characters because it raised. So much in the book, and I get that the book is big, but then I read something that the director said that he always wanted to be just Alex and Henry, so anything that wasn't centered around them was going to get cut. Because basically he was a huge Matthew Lopez was the director and is the director and he's a huge fan of the books. And this is. Basically his fan art for the book, so he's like Alex and Henry all the way.
However, I still would like the other characters. I want a whole last other movie for the other characters. I do too. And I'm like, even if there was a sequel, you still couldn't do all the things that like when it happened, when they were outed because of all those secrets. And it's just there's so much that happened that they couldn't even do. But I would like to see. A spin off for Beatrice and Nora.
Anyway, I think that it's OK that they combined June and Nora, but they needed they needed to change Nora more. They needed to make her closer to Alex and the sister figure. Because one of the things that was so meaningful is that. In the book that Alex and Henry both had an older sister that they wanted to protect themselves and so they bonded over that connection as well and they just don't have it. Yep. So there's. The less that connects them, yeah.
The the Nora, Alex thing didn't read. I feel the way it was supposed to. It didn't seem like a strong bond for all the reasons you just said. And it was it like Nora And in the movie, the way they explain why Nora's there is, they're like she's the daughter of the vice president. So, like, that's the same kind of thing of being to me as the Rio Olympics to the 2021 climate conference change it.
It reduces the depth of their relationship because it sounds more like situational, like they're forced together because their parents are in office versus like they were childhood friends too, like Nora and Alex. And like they grew up together and like they dated a little bit and like when he gets in the publicly outed, she's the beard for she volunteers to be the beard for a minute. And so like it shows how much trust and and everything is between the two of them.
And I feel like it just completely goes away in the movie. And it's just like, it's almost like Alex is completely by himself, like more so in the movie than he is in the books. But like they don't really dive into his like isolation plot line, which I loved in the book. So like it like, I don't know. Nora was like there to deliver lines to Alex versus like a person, which I didn't like. Nora had she. Very cool. Character. She was just not giving it up.
Like at what point we forget about her in the movie? I feel like, was she even there at the election in the movie, 'cause I don't, she didn't have a line. I don't remember. She might have been sitting on a couch, but like, yeah, there's no lines for Nora. I understand cutting June. Like I really do. Like, if you're just trying to make this all about Alex, like
sure, cutting June is was fine. But yeah, like Nora was not the same, like character or like did not have the same kind of familial relationship with Alex that she should have had if you're combining if you're cutting June. Because like they were the the two of them were his support system like you know so it's just like Alex had no support system and it didn't seem to matter in the in the movie which is weird because that was a yeah Alex said his support system.
Was so huge. Someone that understands him and that's there for him. Yeah, besides Henry because, like, he needs someone to talk to, right? It reads very surface on screen. Exactly. Yeah, it's 2 dimensional. It's really sad, yeah. And like Beatrice too. Like she's kind of bit she's again, which I understand in the movie why Beatrice is also like 2 dimensional. She has she's like Nora, she's just like their digital reliance to Henry.
But because like this is mostly from Alex's point of view, like even the movie reads it's like an Alex point of view thing. So like, Beatrice isn't going to be even less of a thing in the movie because like, it's mostly set around Alex, really. And then Henry kind of orbits Alex. What I had to do is I had to think of the movie as a fan
fiction. Once I realized like that Matthew was like a huge fan of the book and that's basically what he was doing, I was like, OK, if this is a fan fiction, this makes sense of why these characters barely have anything to do with it because you erase stuff basically like you just the center does. Yeah, yeah, no, that's that's so good. That's really what it does. The movie is super a fan fiction. Yeah, So it it definitely it helps I think.
But you have to have read the book as well, because I think this is kind of AI like that. You got to read the book first, see, because it's more of like when I watch something, I like watch it and then go read the fan. Because you're not going to read the fan fiction before you see the show. Yeah. Exactly. This. Yeah. It's basically backwards here. Yeah, I got the Canon, then the fan fiction movie.
Yeah, so, OK, so we didn't get June and Nora really the O GS in the movie, but like, what did you think of them, I guess, overall as characters? Just real quick, the book does a great job explaining the roles of each of them, which yeah, yeah, yeah. So Alex pushes them, definitely. Alex pushes everybody. He does. June studies them and Nora keeps them honest. And these are all pillars of like things that. They need and so like that's what we're missing basically in
the movie. But I really loved the three of their relationship because, I mean they're very isolated in the sense all of them because of who their families are. So them being together and being so close to the point where Nora is willing to date Alex just to be his beard and. I think it was June. June is Henry's beard. Yeah, exactly. It's just it was so meaningful in the book. And I do love them. I love the relationship of all of them. Yeah, I agree. I hit the nail head.
I like that they tried to keep Nora's, like, nerdiness in the movie, too, 'cause she's like this data whiz. And they did try to keep that. Like, some of her language was like, well, statistically, you're like 99% bisexual or like, whatever. Or like, like, they kept that kind of language in there to be like, yeah, no, it's Nora the, the data girl, 'cause that was her. That was her big contribution to, like, the campaign. Like, she did all the numbers for, like, polling numbers and
things like that. And she's like a really important person in the campaign, in the books. And so they kind of kept that, but like, again erased her paw and they. Kept the drinking game? Yeah, that too. Yeah. So and then I love June and Nora and Alex for the all the reasons you said that the support system.
And I like that you brought up the fact that something all the characters I think really have in common, like the three of them, the White House trio and then Henry, Beatrice, maybe Pez to an extent is that they, they're high profile people. So because of that they're in the public eye and so they have
this. I think they end up bonding over that because they they they're in this unique position where like you have bodyguards and like you're you're limited about where you can go and like who you can talk to and you have to sign Ndas and things like that. So I think that like that helps foster the ultimate friendship all of them make with each
other. And so yeah I just, I like them a lot as characters and and Nora's like a queer person and kind of helps Alex through his journey a little bit and they're just right or die friends, you know. I love that about them. I feel like Nora really wasn't that queer in the books either, though. No, I feel like, well, that's a gripe I have later. The movie erased a lot of the other queerness in my mind.
It might have been there but not discussed, but like the book is way queerer than just like Alex and and Henry, but like I don't remember. Her like that really being addressed, Nora. In the book, yeah, they definitely talk about like, it's like it's mentioned like her and Alex talk about it, all right. Sounds like I don't think she has AI. Don't think she has a label, but she's like definitely fluid or and. Stuff like that. I love Caitlin. All right, fine. I don't.
Know it was. It was a long book and I you can't remember everything. Yeah, I've only read it once, so like, I can't argue it. Because there's so much like there's so much to basically I can remember the scene. I didn't remember that they went to a museum in the movie. So but it was there's too many scenes. So let's continue. Speaking of scenes, I hope you remember the 75,000 cake disasters. The one that's all the posters. Yeah, the one that's in your
face. OK, so I I thought this was a notable scene to talk about because it's like the PR scheme that really, like, kicks off. This is what you told me about this movie. Like, this is the only thing I knew going into watching this movie is the $75,000 cake. Yeah. So basically like, it's the wedding cake at Phillip and his. I forget the woman, Margaret, it
doesn't matter. And his wife's cake or whatever at the royal wedding and Alex and Henry of course are get into a kerfuffle and they knock over the cake and it gets leaked to social media cause of phones and the press and stuff. And so the PR scheme is born from this and the importance of this is that Alex's mother is up for re election so it's she's ending her first term as president. And so in the United States, you only get to run, be president
twice, basically. And so she's just kicking off the campaign. And So what a wonderful time for her son to, like, topple over the royal wedding. Cake. I mean, that's what you have kids for, right? To bring interesting stuff. And keep you on your Oh my God. OK, so. I have a guess about this scene though. Do it. All right, Let's hear it. Because I feel like the media blew this out of proportion.
Like cake. Cake. Come on. All right, They're acting like Alex went into this building was like that cake. I do not like it. Let me push it down. All right? No, it was a freaking accident. OK, maybe you shouldn't use it as a drink table and get icing on your hand and then get the icing all over the Prince, because probably not so. But I believe Henry also puts the glass on the cake. So it is equally their fault.
However, it was an accident and I think that the royal people were not that smart because they should have just had a fake foamy cake and had one little spot that was actually cake for the. Couple to cut out and like you know smash in the face, but that's probably not really and so. That's American. That's an American idea. Whatever, I don't care. Okay And then had a bunch of sheet cake in the kitchen cut up and it would have been a lot. That's the most American thing
I've heard. We got a bunch of sheet cake in the kitchen. I'm just saying like it would have been cheaper. It would have not had this incident happen. Oh, but their secret would have been out because they would have sheet cake instead. Yes. You can't have sheet cake if you're if you're royal. Didn't you know that I love the whole point is? Extravagance. Yes, I love Caitlyn. The fact that you're so charged up about the fake, the scene, and the fictional PR thing,
that's my favorite part. Because I went into looking at the most expensive cakes for this scene like so, I was curious. So Prince William and Kate's cake cost 80 grand. Jesus Christmas, Diana and Charles. Charles. They had like 27 cakes I believe, and one cost 56 grand or 60 something like that. It might be 90 something. And then hold on, let me get this because this is ridiculous. This wasn't an actual wedding, but it was like the Big Gay Wedding Show. OK, there is either.
I think it's fifty $50 million. How cake? Why do that? There was crystals on it also. I didn't want crystals or something. No, no, I think so. Another person had Swarovski crystals on their cake. Was. At least it wasn't on their person like Doji Cat. And This is why we're all poor guys. It was well said. Equality. Oh, it was Gucci Mane. Oh. My God, Keisha. Gross. I believe they had 2500 Swarovski crystals in between each of their tiers, so they're OK.
So that makes sense. Because it wasn't they weren't eating them. But it if you just look OK, if anybody listening watching go, just look up National Gay Wedding Show cake. It cost $52 million. Yeah. It does not look like it should cost that much. I don't understand how this costs that much. Caitlyn, you're going to have to put up a an image of the cake. I just sent it to you. I mean for the people, they can do the work, the audio people
have to do the work. We'll decide later, but it just makes no sense. There was it was an 8 tiered cake decorated with a meager. That's what the article says. Meager 4000 diamonds. And that's why there's fucking gems in it. It looks like. Looks like something I can get at the grocery store exactly this is like it does not look. Grocery store cake? No, I'm not. Saying mess up the bottom cake, but like, I'm sure a lot of work went into this.
I just don't understand where all the crystals are. Like, are you eating the crystals? Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I'm sure whoever made this spend an enormous amount of time doing it. But yeah, where? What the heck. Everything on the cake needs to be edible. Exactly because Or like are people, like, painstakingly taking off crystals and then selling them on the black market? I don't know. You get to keep the crystals and take them home.
Or was did no one eat the cake and it was just for shell? Oh, I mean, there's that too, $52 million. Well, we could have bought a lot of queer media. At least we could have done a lot of we could have started a production company. Yes, well, at least Alex and Henry did not ruin a $52 million gig. It was only 75 grand. Sorry for the car for a royal wedding. The detour continue. It's just a super classic ROM com type scene and that's why
it's my favorite. Just because it as soon as that happened, it's when I knew I'd like the movie and I was, it's when I got really into it, is when all that went down because it was so it was so classic. If you don't get that in queer ROM coms like they're they're usually not that. I mean, it's cheesy, but it's well executed and that's the point in my head. I was just like, wonder what it's like to have a huge cake like that fall on you. And then I just really wanted to have a food fight.
Well, maybe after the strike we can ask the actors. Yes. OK, so another another scene I kind of wanted to talk about that I think was big and monumental is like the hospital. So then after the cake incident they do APR joint PR thing. At a hospital, a Children's Hospital. And I think this is where you I for me when you first start to see like the depth of Henry. So in the book and in the movie, Henry purposely goes into the
cancer ward. So in the movie you see him talking to this girl and she has like a headscarf on and like indicating that like she has leukemia and things like that so. And in the book you want I think in maybe in both it's the reason he does that pretty habitually is because his father died of cancer, pancreatic cancer to be specific. So Henry to pay homage to him
visits like cancer wards. And I think for me, the fact that he does it so often, really like you start to see like the depth of Henry's grief really over his father because like they were really close and things like that. Yeah, I really liked the scene. It was just very cute.
One thing in the book I feel like you see more than not really thinking about it as APR stunt, like they weren't there for the cameras, where in the movie I feel like they're it looks like it was just more for show. You did get that like short shot of Henry with the kid, but. And and Alex too. He does like a reading of a puppet show or something. In the movie. Oh yeah. It's really quick.
But yeah, it's just not enough. And it was just like that whole thing of them, like not even realizing, like the kid falls asleep next to Alex, I believe. And like, they're just with them for so long and you just don't get that much in the movie, which I mean again, I guess. Yeah, yeah. You, like we said, you lose the depth of. You lose the depth of it, and you lose some of the characterization. So unfortunate, but there you do with the loss of Henry's father, have you get this?
I guess it kind of like identified with him in that aspect. When he's going to, you know, like this isn't just going to see sick kids for him, it's a way to connect with. People that understand, you know his grief and where where his sorrow over his father's. It's almost like a a healing thing. Yeah, totally. So I totally get that and I enjoyed that whole aspect. OK, one little thing that is missing and like, yeah, things are going to be missing from the
movie, obviously. But thing in the book that was mentioned that I loved is when Henry's talking to that child and he's trying to comfort her. And he's like, they start talking about Star Wars, which comes up multiple times in the books about Henry, like Henry, like Star Wars. And she mentioned something about like the girl, he started to mention something about wanting to kiss Han Solo. And he's like, I think you have the right idea.
And OK, So what I love about this is, first of all it's like, I see you girl like. And Alex is compared to Han Solo a lot during the the books. So it's like. Foreshadowing and I love that Henry's like love of Star Wars is really, it gives you a good hint of his character.
Cause the whole point of Star Wars and like siding with like Han Solo and like the Rebels quote UN quote, is that the Rebels were like against the Empire and the Empire AKA the British Empire. So it's interesting that the Prince of England is like, yeah, go rebels. When in that context like he would be the empire, so I I do like that it it tells you kind of like who Henry is, where his values lie, 'cause he does things in the books like start like youth centers and things like that.
Like he goes, he doesn't take the royal money like he he he doesn't act like a typical like heir to the throne, I guess. And so the other comparison I love is that Alex catches on to this and like then Henry gets like the Leia comparison cause again Princess Royalty of the Rebels. So I love that with Henry and I I just love that that banter like just continues 'cause they there are definitely parallels between like those two characters.
So I like that it starts here, like in the cancer ward and it just like kind of keeps going throughout the book. It's cute, very cute. And that's the thing about. Injecting pop pop culture references into books. For me, there has to be like a really good reason for it to be there, and there's a really good reason. So 10 out of 10. Hi, hi, hi. Sorry. They're just singing to you. They are. Did we go through them in the closet? I'm going to go back, OK?
OK. Because this circling back that just tied in got it. I I was like I don't think she said all of this. So that's why. Yeah. So if that's all for the cancer, I'm going to go to the next scene. All right, so after they're done with the cancer, like, while they're in between all of that, there's an incident where loud noises happen and it's potentially gunfire. So the Secret Service slash their bodyguards basically, just
like, shove them in a closet. Like the irony of that I love while they handle the situation to make sure like the two are not in actual danger. And what I love about this scene is that this is really the first time ever, regardless of book movie, that they are alone, out of the public eye. Like it's the very first time. And I think this is the moment, a moment where Alex really sees behind Henry's mask, because a lot of the the tension from Alex's point of view is that.
Henry appears a certain way. You know, he appears very like standoffish and like not. And he's always like he's not even human. He like doesn't have a personality and all this stuff. But it's like Henry's a royal and he's, he has to act a certain way in public. And this is the very first time they're not in public. And so Alex sees Henry kind of like the real Henry for the very
first time and to me like. The the humanity of Henry in the scene all circles back to like why they're in this hospital in the 1st place. It it comes back to the death of Henry's father. And the reason the snub happened in the 1st place that Alex has been harboring this grudge over is that Henry was upset over his father's death and he's like I I couldn't be around anybody at that time.
Like I was so lost in my grief and it's something that Henry carries forever is the grief of his father. And so like to have the contacts, Alex is finally like, oh. Well, now I kind of like I was kind of being a Dick to you. I like, I just didn't know that part. And there's parts during towards the end of the book, after they deal with the public outing where Beatrice and Alex together are discussing Henry's grief.
And I think it comes it like comes back to this very first moment when Alex learns about this. Beatrice mentions to Alex that. Henry, Henry and her were very young when their father died. And she's like the type of grief that that Henry feels that we were feeling basically, like we were feeling it at a time where like your brain isn't even fully developed at that time. And it's like impossible to cope
with that kind of grief. And it's why Henry, throughout the book, throughout the movie, has these dark days and these depressive episodes. And Beatrice basically says that it's it's all because back to this trauma, 'cause, you know, Henry doesn't know how to cope with, like, bad things when they happen now, 'cause he was so severely traumatized at this time when he didn't know how to deal with it. And that kind of stuck with him and having this bad thing happen
so young. She's basically like every time he feels something bad, like everything bad feels so monumental, just like the loss of his father. So it's very easy for Henry to just spiral more than the average person. And he's somebody who's always going to carry the grief. And that's just who Henry is. And what's so beautiful about this. When Alex hears the the full extent of this later with B, he's basically like, I like he doesn't judge Henry for that.
It doesn't turn him away from Henry at that point. He's known him for so long that he's like, I just want to understand what's happening, but. Alex understands that. He kind of can't. It's like it's something that Henry's always going to have and he's like I I love him regardless with the grief and all. And he just gets into this position where he's like, I just have to learn to support you and you're having dark days and things like that.
So it's like this is something that haunts Henry his whole life. And Alex, once he really starts to understand that, like, this big thing really shaped Henry into who he is, he just really learns to like. Love him with all his flaws and like, learn to support him when he's feeling like that rather than like start another rivalry,
you know? Yeah, I mean, I really like that them getting forced into the closet, like, really forced them to talk because, I mean, the biggest thing is that he misunderstood Henry. Because I need to get out of here is definitely different than Get Me Out of here, Yeah. And I feel like if Alex would have. Heard those words, Maybe he wouldn't have felt the same way. But I think because of his anxiety of being there, 'cause he talked about how this was in the movie, 'cause this, this was
this the book. It wasn't like this, but that this was his first time out in public. So he was like kind of like counting on, which is also weird because he's he was definitely in past things, but whatever. But for the kind of the purpose of that scene in the movie, he was hoping that Henry could help him through it. But so they're both just at very hard parts of their life right
now. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, there is no way for them to actually know those deeper things in those moments, So it made sense. I do like that in the movie, neither of them was actually an asshole to the other. Yeah, only misunderstanding. So it was like very easy to absolutely. Oh, OK, so you're not an asshole, it looks like. The banter that happens when they think that is fun, and I wouldn't erase that, I like that. Not at all. It was great speak Speaking of tension. Misunderstandings.
Let's talk about the Thanksgiving Turkey scenes. I know, Caitlin. I have thoughts about. This is my longest seed I have notes for. I know I'm excited for this. I want, I want to to hear all of your thoughts. Do you want to go first, Theora? OK first of all I just want to set the scene if you haven't like if you haven't read and or watched the book so in the in the movie. Basically, it just, it's very
fast. It's just Alex is on the phone with Henry and they're talking on the phone, OK And he's got this big Turkey in his room because in America there's this weird America. We have to prove her merciful while celebrating the slaughtering of the indigenous people by not killing two turkeys ceremonially and then later eating Turkey. So it doesn't make any sense. It's like this big show of like. We're merciful and it doesn't
make any sense. So it's it's a thing pardoning of the Turkey where the president pardons selected turkeys and they just get to live their happy Turkey lives. So in the movie Alex has the Turkey and he's on the phone with Henry and he's complaining that the Turkey is scary and he's like it's in my room and blah blah blah. And then like they go on to have like a a very long phone conversation. OK. In the movie you missed the full context of that scene though
cause in the book. Alex is a lot more politically involved, and when it comes time for the pardoning of the Turkey, he learns that the what they normally do is they house the turkeys in their own separate hotel room. So it cost the taxpayers a bunch of money to house the turkeys. And he's like, that's stupid, What a waste of money. Just keep them at the White House. And he convinces his mom to save money by putting them in his room. So the fact that the turkeys are
in his room is Alex's idea. So in the movie just looks he looks like he. Just got dumped in his room, but it's like they're in there because of Alex and he literally begged her to put him in. Exactly. It's yeah, he this is 100% his fault because he asked for this explicitly. So that is lost in the movie and makes this whole thing funnier for me. And because he's so freaked out about the Turkey, he calls Henry and it is the very first time they talk on the phone.
So that context is also lost in that scene in the movie. So I have a problem with it because it removes the importance of the fact they're on the phone with each other. And that was actually really huge because they had never really done that before. And it turns into this extremely long phone conversation they have, and it's a very meaningful moment. That is, the context is lost in
the movie. And I don't like that because I think that context is really, really important for like their relationship, pacing and development. OK, Kaitlyn, take it away. The first thing I say is that the scene needed to be a lot longer because it is is so good. I love the book scene so much. It's good. I love that Alex is so stressed out because it's his fault that the turkeys are in his room. But he's that's not why he's
stressed out. He's stressed out because the turkeys won't stop gobbling and he thinks that they're gonna pull a Jurassic Park and kill each other if he leaves the room or kill him if he sleeps in the room. And I have a part of this and I'm just gonna read this how I think it's in his head. In his head? Or is this what he calls? No, no. It's text. OK, so this is what I'm
thinking. His brain is going like, they know he texts Henry. They know I have robbed them of five star combinations to sit in a cage in my room. And the minute I turn my back, they're going to feast on my flesh. So basically, he has guilt about eating Turkey for Thanksgiving. Oh. Yeah, 100% in the in the book it's two turkeys. In the movie I believe it's 2 Turkey. So also I forget what the one is it cranberry. I was just thinking that. What were their names?
Was it like corncob and like? No. Kitchy. I can't remember. No. The one Turkey's name is called stuffing, which I feel like you shouldn't name a Turkey stuffing because it's kind of like Turkey stuffing. It's like naming a pig bacon, yeah. That's pretty fucked up. Yeah, so, so American, though I'm gonna name you after your ultimate destination and then pardon you from that destination, it's so. Funny, I'm pretty sure it's like cranberry sauce and stuffing or
something like that. It's stupid. But there are leaves. Why are there always leaves when Henry pops up into the room? Leaves. Oh yeah, leaves Heart stopper reference. Yes, it's all one cinematic universe. Guys, All right, so we started with the tree in Exo Kitty with those those. Like there's a tree in this thing. Yeah, kissed by a tree. And then we got the leaves and heart stopper, and now there's more leaves and trees. So basically, leaves and trees
mean you're gay. Yeah, we have a whole conspiracy. How? Leaves in Grey's Anatomy, where she realizes she's like when I put my glasses on for the first time, I could see the leaves. Oh yeah, actually I had that moment in real life though, with actual leaves and glasses. But it's because you're gay, Caitlin. I was like, you're gay, 12 And I was like, my God, the trees have leaves on them anyway, but like, we were robbed. Yeah, we.
Were robbed of Alex trying to make Henry listen to the Turkey God, Yeah, that was so funny. I. Just looking. Oh my God, nothing. It's just like, Oh yeah, they sound ferocious. Yeah, it's. I needed that asleep. It was the cute scene. I needed that in movie form. I feel like they could have totally pulled it off. I mean there's they're really good with comedic timing. He should. They should have just had like, they're going to eat me. Yeah, right after me.
Listen to it and then nothing happens. Like they could have done it really quickly. And they oh, it was such a wonder. If they did and they just cut it. Oh my gosh, send us the bloopers, please or extended, please. We do have bloopers. Did you see them? There's a few. Yeah, I haven't seen any. I want to say just released two days ago. I just want to say one thing off
the leaves. One thing I did like because again in this what made this particular scene in the book so huge, was the fact that this is the first time they talk on the phone, and it's such a long conversation that Alex has to plug his phone in 'cause his phone was like dying during the conversation. So what I do love is how they kind of like did this in the movie versus like having like a
long distance phone call. I like that they had Henry there with him because then it 'cause that's how it felt to Alex. And there's internal monologue from him, like when he's laying on the bed, I think, and talking to Henry and about to hang up where he like kind of pictures Henry there and like what it would be like. He starts thinking like, what would it be like if Henry was with me? So I do like that in the film because, like, that is what Alex
was thinking in the book. So I did like how they did that versus like having like a split screen where it's like Henry in his palace with David versus like Alex by himself with the turkeys, and like just having a split screen. I like that they put them together first of all, 'cause then you get to see the actors acting together, which is way nicer. But also like this is told from Alex's point of view, and that is exactly what he was thinking
in that scene in the book. So I did like that twist, yes. Also, I really liked how the sound editor edited it too, for his voice to sound like go on. The phone. And he was still there. That was really. Clever it was. How like as a reader, like as a as a as an audience member, like you're like it. It just, ah, that was so good, 'cause yeah, I love it. It drives a point home. Yeah, it drives a point home,
yeah. There's one thing that like irks me though, is that they didn't have him plug his phone in so Alex could have had his phone next to him and in like Henry's spot. Because it didn't make sense that he was like faced towards Henry with his phone behind him. Because the sound. It would have been weird. Yeah, that is true. Like if he had air pods in or something, maybe that would have made sense. Yeah. But yeah, you're right. No, totally. Just one of those things, so.
Side note, in the book, Henry is watching The Great British Bake Off at the same time. And if Netflix had bought this movie instead of Amazon, there definitely would have been cameos and footage of that show in it. And we could have got them in Celebrity Bake Off, and that would. Have been amazing and I need to see them interact with Peru and Paul. So if you haven't watched Bake Off, that's. Oh my God, could you? All right, you know what? I'm making my own fan fiction here.
They could. I love the kids. Version the Great Junior British Bake Off thing. They could have hosted like a hospital version one and like, volunteered there and they were like the judges and like, that would be so cute. That would be so cute. All right, Caitlin's going to write that fan fiction, I. Don't have time. Any ideas? I give you people, take them and run. Just tag us after you do it. Yeah, tag us if you write, write that fan fiction. We want to read it, and with
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