2024-10-03- BBI

Welcome to The Big Blue Insider, Thursday edition of our show. It's a special edition of The Big Blue Insider because

You've already got your snowman out the garage.

Yeah, I got the we've got the one that lights up. That's right.

Was he there? And June, he's been here.

We just haven't lit him up. We've been lit up and he wasn't lit You know what I missed it, Darren. What I should have said is what snowman? Yeah, coach, are you seeing a snowman? Turn it? Maybe next time? Well, and here we are right in the middle of It's hard to believe it's the middle of football, but it's also a playoff time. The regular season just ended. But we must begin with Pete Rose, and we will get into the controversy as well. But I got to start

Pete is the eighth one from our seventy five team. Wow, and next year being our fifty year reunion, it won't be coming any too soon.

Yeah.

So the Grade eight is now down to the grade six, And yeah, it's you know, I think if we'd have heard he didn't look good, but there wasn't any rumors about him not feeling good or having any kind of issues. But it looks like that his heart just I know, he's doing the cartshow over the weekend. Looked like his heart went out on him. And I've talked to Marty today, I talked to Johnny and everybody just and even though we knew he didn't look good, everybody's still kind of shocked,

But the coroner reports said, my pretension hardening of the arteries, heart disease. You know so much of it, yeah, from diabetes and being diabetic myself. I'm well schooled in a lot of that stuff. But like you said, Darren, you just don't think he Rose as being a mere mortal.

No. I mean when you think about the career. He had twenty three seasons, ten straight years where he played ninety six percent of his games. I think he missed like four over a ten year stretch. All time winning his player hit king, forty four game hit streak, three time World Champion, seventeen time All Star. I mean, it's one of the greatest careers anybody could have in the history of Major League Baseball.

Doesn't he have the record as well obviously for singles?

Yeah, at bat bats, doubles, I think he's second in doubles now games played, Yeah.

Just incredible. And coach, you knew him, of course when you were a younger minor leaguer and then through the years. But he was a guy who wasn't supposed to make it. That's what amazed me the most. Was kind of a pudgy kid from Cincinnati, was at Western Hills High School, and yet he comes in with a flat top and just.

Stick That's right. You know, he didn't even play he didn't get to play sports a senior in high school. Why academics, no kidding. Yeah, he he got cut from the football team one year, like I think it was a sophomore year, and he just kind of gave up on live football was so big to him at that time. Yeah, and he just kind of gave up on life and and al I wouldn't say life, but on on doing anything positive and and just didn't didn't go to class

Oh, is that one by Keith O'Brien.

Yeah, came out this summer.

Yah.

Yeah, and so yeah, I mean just for me even I knew Pete a little bit, not nearly as well as Doug, but but he was good to me, you know. He he treated me like he treated the big league guys. Took me a couple of places with him, and I don't know why, but I would just.

Lucky you were a baseball professional. Yeah, and I got to think in his eyes that elevated you did.

And he had a tendency to take all the young players under his wing. I've listened to the talk shows recently yesterday, which is unusual for you, which very unusual for me, and to hear all the bad stuff that people are saying about Pete, about his character and everything. I even listened to Mossi's story last night, and you know, I gotta think Pete was just having fun with those guys. He would never because there was no one better with

And Doug's referring to a young reporter going into the Red's clubhouse and trust me, this guy is a good guy, John Jury, but had that kind of face, that cherubic face, and I'm sure Pete sized him up as a new guy. And I would almost see that as a badge of honor. If you're treated like that, be one of the guys. Yeah, yeah, you're one of the guys. I've been indoctrinated, initiated.

Then I heard some on another show, somebody call in and say, well, Pete was just a bad man. He was just a bad person, and I almost I started to call and then he went right to the news, and I was going to go on there and say I was going to defend my friend. Basically, I was gonna do this. If you know, don't say it. The guy made a mistake. I mean, but do you get on there and say that you don't know all the good stuff he did that he never got publicized, So

Doug, I know you tend to stay off social media almost entirely, but I just want you to know that the day Pete passed away, no one McCarthy immediately reposted the video of the two the moment you two had at the World Series with Pete Rose text message, and I just want I hope Pete knows that that meant the world to that young man to hear from Charlie Hustle about his diving to home.

I just watched that, rewatched the video and I think I think it was on your site.

I reposted it too.

Yeah, I would had watched that, and then I wasn't there at the stadium and the dugout at the time. But that was so cool that you were able to share that with knowlan.

Well and even now, how much more special is it now?

Yeah? Absolutely? You know what what hasn't been mentioned yet that I'd like to mention is when I was a young guy playing high school baseball, and even even before Pete Rose made it cool to hustle, you know, the way he played the game, and every chance I got, I watched the Reds when he was just coming up and the way he ran the bases, the way he

And he loved the game. He literally had fun with all the aspects of the game. He had fun with the hitting. He had fun with getting on guys, I mean around the baton cage with some of the funniest stuff I ever heard in my life. Can't repeat it.

All everybody, it was.

It was amazing, and he would usually be one of the ones to stir it up.

Uh.

And how are you going to get on a guy like him? I mean, he never went in a slump.

You couldn't get on. Call them lolls.

Yeah, that loll for him would be old for four Yeah.

So I got to throw batting practice to to the guys in spring training one day, and and we were over in clear Water, and a man, I just I felt like a big time I'm on the bus with you, Pete Rose and Tony Perez and all these guys. And so we get to clear water and and and my job is throw batting practice. And Pete comes up to me, he said, he said, kid, he said, I I don't I don't want you to try to strike me out. I want you to throw me good BP. I'm trying to get ready for the season. And then made me

That was daily too.

That's got to sound familiar.

It's just daily.

They would get on, four of them, Johnny, Pete, Joe and Tony. The four of them sat in the corner and would rag each other unmercifully the things they'd said. You'd say, he's got friends, and if anybody else joined in, then those four would turn on whoever. Because Davey thought he belonged in that group. Oh uh, and Pete Tony one day said, Davy, you're not as good as we are, and nobody can understand what you're saying.

No, we gotta step out. We'll come right back and talk more with the garage gang here in just a minute. Doug Flynn, Keith Madison, Darren Hedrick on six thirty WLAP Welcome back to the Big Moon. Satter here in the garage with a chain gang. Darren Hedrick, Heith Madison, Doug Flynn were sharing Pete Rose stories I talked about. I had a couple of encounters with Pete. One was okay, one not so okay. But again I was indoctrinated, kind of almost knocked me down in the clubhouse, threw his

Yeah, Pete, you know he picked up the fellow says Dad, Man, I'm struggling one for eighteen. He says, what I do? Pete said, how do I know? I've never been in a story.

He said called Davy. Davy, I'll tell you how to get out of him.

Let me tell you one little quick please, So seventy five seventy six, we win seventy You got to have three years in the big leagues to move outside of where the team stays during spring training. If not, you stay at the team hotel where the media and everybody stays. So seventy seven January, my sister disappears. Dick Wagner, the general manager. I called him up and say, Dick, I want to live away from all the stuff. I got

Wow.

I hang up the phone. So I'm sitting there thinking what did you just do? So an hour goes by the phone rings. It's Pete and he's laughing. He said, did you quit? I said, yeah, I said, Pete got two World Series in two years. The only place I think goes down from here. And he said, you're not quitting. I said, well, he said, I already know the story. He said, I'm staying at the King Arthur's Enn, right down from the ballpark. He said, I got a room for you, and I got a room for your mom

Wow.

And I went there, and that probably had a little bit to do why I got traded, because Dick Wagner was, yeah, you know, but Pete.

Well, he's a clown who broke up the Reds.

Here's a clown. I agree with you. He's a clown. He treated people rude, he treated people mean. He only used me. There's some other people talk differently about him. I don't know him being any different. Well that was it.

That was it.

That was it.

So that did it right there. But so Pete did that, and there was all kinds of stuff if you went to his house, like I started collecting autographs, which I never did before, and all of a sudden I thought I'd do it. He said, here he throws his rookie cards and start off with this one wow.

Wow.

Or he'd give you a pair I got a big pair of those big Porche sunglasses that he used to wear. I've never worn them. I mean, cover your whole head. I can't pull it off, but I still he just he gave people shoes. I just got a letter. Guy the other day, his son got blown up in Iraq. Pete found out about it, picked up the phone and talked to him from an hour and stuff like that. The media just you'll do it, but most of our media won't cover that. And I'm so sick of them

Well we are, because Darren, you've got strong feelings of I know everybody does about the lifetime ban and things like that.

So yeah, you know, in terms of the lifetime ban, I get it, which, by the way, There's been some misconstruing with that. There's a lot of people that said, well, it's a lifetime ban. Now that he's gone, he should be Hall of Fame eligible. The rule actually says permanently banned, not lifetime ban. But still, the one thing that people should also know, and I don't think the common baseball fan realizes, is the Baseball Hall of Fame is not owned or operated or voted on by Major League Baseball.

But and having said that to me, I understand, you're betting he bet on baseball. And I was one of the first ones that if it had been me, it wouldn't even be an argument, but it's Pete Rose because he got and fifty six cents. I understand that. But now I've softened my stance. Really yeah that And here's why, because I was watching the game. The very first commercial is fandel you can bet on pitches, you can bet on players, you can bet on the outcome of a game.

Well, and to your point in expanding on the making money business. Major League Baseball threw Pete away and tried to erase him from history, but they sure did enjoy profiting off his name, image, and likeness for the rest of his life.

And go to Cooperstown. He's all over there. You're right.

And here's another point too that I want to make that I find hippocrateal hip Hoocrydal. Yeah it's HIPOCRIPSI yeah.

Yeah.

They said, hey, Cincinnati, you can induct him into your Hall of Fame. He can't go to Cooperstown, Phillies. You want to bring him back to honor the seventy six World Series team. Come on, he just can't go to the Hall of Fame. Yeah, Yeah, we're going to have him on Fox to be an analyst for a little while. He just can't go in the Hall of Fame.

Well, Sadly, the last interview that he ever did, he talks about there's nobody been a better promoter of the game of baseball. He said, you go into Cincinnati, you drive down Pete Rose Way to get to the ballpark. Yes, and Pete Rose can't even get into the locker room. Yeah.

I did not know this. Somebody posted this on my Facebook page. And I've always been a guy who said, look, you know, he knew the rule right, And what bothered me the most was how he just lied and lied to you guys and never apologized Doug to his teammates, which bothered me. Point taken about gambling, But again, players in different pro leagues are being banned now because you're not supposed follow the rules, all right, but I was not aware of that. You might have been, Darren, all

If he says that when it first happens, oh, we're not talking about this today, you don't think and he knows that. But you know, how do you go up to a guy who's an alcoholic and he's made all these mistakes and you bann him for an addiction that

And I said this the other day.

And because I was just popping off, probably, but I said, you know, you go out and shoot somebody, you get twenty years and you're out. Pete been on baseball and he's got forty years.

Yeah.

Well, and that goes back to some of my core arguments. I have a really hard time with justifying Pete Rose Permanent Band. When we celebrate Gaylord Perry, whose famous pitch was an illegal pitch, a spinball who spent a career cheating. There's the guys in the Hall of Fame now that have done far worse steroids and that's supposed to be illegal too. There's the Astros who still have a World

And I'll say that based on the letter I received. Oring a copy of the letter I saw, he Rose apologized finally these guys never have even admitted to it. You know.

What they're saying about Pete's they did in private chambers, but it's been sealed and thrown away.

Forget that, and so what then?

Yeah?

Right, right, Well, what they're saying about Pete he only apologized in two thousand and four because he had a book coming out and he wanted to sell the book. Yeah, that's what I've heard over and over and over again.

Well, no, this this apology letter that was sent me said that it was sent to Rob Manford two years ago.

Well yeah, but I'm talking about.

Oh yeah, yeah, but how heartfelt was that apology in O four? This one much more? Coach? You've been kind of quiet.

Yeah, yeah, you know, I mean that's not like you. Well, I agree with everything Doug and and and Big d have said. You know, I I think it's a harsh, harsh punishment for a guy when when so many other people have made mistakes. And what a great point, you know, Darren made with with the astros. Uh, you know, it's time. It's time. He's the he's the he's a he's a hit king. Put him in and and like Doug said earlier, he did a lot for baseball, did a lot for baseball.

He must have been a joy.

He's a great teammate. Yeah, he took time. He didn't care what was going on in his game. He took time to help somebody else. He played it, he loved it. He took time to talk to the fans. He told me the best lesson I ever got. He said, not that anybody would really want your autograph, but go out before the game and go sign autographs for ten to fifteen minutes. He said, people will see that and they'll appreciate that. They may not want it, but they'll appreciate it.

Yeah, And stories like that are why I just wonder in a nation of second chances, while we can't temper our justice with a little mercy. And the Hall of Fame is meant to tell the story of baseball.

But they might.

Now, this is how you do it.

Here's what everyone feared, not feared, but speculated when he passed away. Would they do something now? And if they do it like immediately, it shows that in all of this, for me, it really wasn't business. It was personal.

Yes, it.

Was cruel.

It was cruel.

Yeah, yeah, and and I totally agree with that. But you know, I'm fine. I want his plaque in the Hall of Plaques where it belongs. And if they want to have a little tag at the bottom of it, this says band from Baseball for gambling. Okay, that's part of his story. That's part of the story. That's part of his story. But his plaque belongs in the hall and that's I feel strongly about that.

How would you feel about a steroids.

Wing one for me is complicated because we've let those guys back in the league, so why can't we put them in the Hall of Fame. I mean, Bonds was a hitting coach.

Sein is a great example of a guy who would have gone in regardless he was on a Hall of Fame arc as it was.

That's what's my feelings, and I can't prove it, but I think there's guys in there now and I know specifically who have done them probably. Yeah, I mean look at them then, oh sure, look at them now. Yeah, look at their stats before, look at them now.

Look at their hat size.

We we yeah, we've all been had a chance to go out into you know, double A, triple A on the field major League Baseball games. We see these guys, they're they're not average men that you see walking up down the street. A lot of these guys, I mean they look like they look like football players now, and of course you know athletes. I mean, Doug kN I have talked about this. When we played we thought Tony Perez was huge. What was he six three two ten or something like that that.

Take two and a quarter, but he was, you know, six two and a half, six to.

Three and he didn't look like a defensive end. But he looked like Aaron Judge right now.

No, And I know there are some guys like Frank Howard, you know people that are Thomas. Yeah, Frank Thomas, he's a great example. But now you know, now there's there's seventy everybody's like that. There's seventy five or one hundred. Frank Thomas is in the big leagues. I've never been picture of six four or five six, you know.

And I've always asked you this, But you played it one weight, one sixty eight. How about that.

Somebody said today said you look like you're in good shape. I said, yeah, if I lose twenty pounds, I'll be within ten pounds of my playing weight.

Back then you look like a banker.

Yeah, all of us were. I mean you look at the whole makeup of the game. I mean, go through the middle infielders, many Trio II, Smith, you know, all all of us were. Davy was a big shortstop. Yeah and he's sixty one. Yeah, but he was a big short Stoping then Rifican came around, screwed it up here about it.

That's true.

Going back to Pete, I'll just give some final food for thought, because I thought Dan Patrick made a really good argument. Let's say that Pete retired from his playing career and they waited till the sixth year to ask him to manage. So there's a five year window where he's just chilling. He goes in the Hall of Fame. In that five year window, he's a first ballot Hall of Famer, and then he comes back and manages and everything that did they take him out of the Hall of Fame?

Have they ever taken anyone out not to mind knowledge?

See how they could? That's a great question. On that note, we will take a break and come back and talk more with the chain gang of Keith Madison, Darren Hedrick and Doug Flynn here in the garage on six thirty wlap Welcome back. We're in the garage with the chain gang. The garage guys. We've been talking Pete Rose with Doug Flynn, Keith Madison and Darren Hedrick. I want to change gears a little bit. And Darren, I know you listened and watched because that's your job on Saturday, every minute of

I'm thinking, all right, I got time to go down to the lake.

Yeah, they're just six plays right down the field home. Well, here it goes, I thought.

I told himself, all right, if the next possessions like that, it's going to be a long day. Let's see what happens. And we know what happened after that.

That's right. And you know, even when Old Miss took the lead in the second half seventeen to thirteen, they had had what was it two or three drives there where they just had rhythm and were marching, and I'm like, this is this is weird. Good, Yeah, this is not good. This is where Old Miss takes control. And then all of a sudden, it was three and out, three and out, and you're like.

Yeah, our defense was wow, facular wow. And when I saw when I I saw the Omas players slam Duncan the football into the UK backboard basketball goal, I think I could have tackled somebody.

We have seen so much of that, though, Doug. When they just we sought to share with the Georgia game and it slips away.

Well we've seen it for years, in years, but in Stoops had seen it too, because I understand what his thing was. He looked over Brad White and says, you know, we need one to go our way to right, and I think he was right. They are they were due, But boy, that defense played good. In the offense, offense played a lot better than I thought too. Maybe they're starting to get a little continuity there.

What about Brown catching that pass and stopping on a dime?

I don't see why. More easy for me to say, why don't more receivers try to do that?

He's great athlete, I mean he was not many people can go that fast and stop and change directions that quick. That was the us chance.

My yeah, have broke a leg.

So then what it just fell down?

What were your collective thoughts on fourth down when they go a go for it and b they go deep. Because I thought, all right, I thought they needed to go for it, but I thought, find Dane key, if if you don't complete it, maybe you get another p I or hold or something.

When he chucked it deep, I'm like, what are you after Georgia. He had to go for that point down, right, I think because when you didn't do it at Georgia.

Affected his thought process.

Yeah, so well, And I also thought, too, what have you got to lose going forward there? If your defense holds him to a field goal, you still need that touchdown anyway. So because you were there, and when they fled in the end zone then.

Right in front of me and fell on it from from here to that wall, that's how close I was. And when it popped in you out. Your brain just processes things quickly. I thought, oh my god, they got this close and now they're gonna fumble and almost is gonna recover and we're all gonna think about this play for the rest of our lives.

Oh look, so a couple of things went good for him.

Dick.

You'll remember this. I can't remember the year, but we were playing Louisville and we had the game one and we were celebrating and all that stuff, and Louivill came back and beat us. It was like, how about the Gator eight and LB you have the fans on the field. Yeah, well, did you know the Loiver game I'm talking about was home It was I can't remember who was celebrating now, And I remember watching it on television saying, don't do that, don't do that. It's sure enough comes back.

You know.

I'm I'm so old school, and you are too. I mean, we got young pup over there who's not quite We don't like all that celebration going on. And I was just thinking watching the ball game yesterday or the day before, see Lean Door hit a big home run and just brought his head went around the basis. And then I watched the Podrey's last night first inning, Tatis hits one and he hadn't got the first yet. He's just you know,

Hit that really good.

I'm thinking if you were pitching, David Cone, you'd have drilled him the next time up so much.

He'd probably drill the next hitter.

The next hitter, Yeah, he do it. But you know that's kind of I mean, get away from that. But it's talking about, you know, a little class.

And you know, speaking of announcers. As we get to the break, you'll appreciate this there and you might have heard it, but Big Shambi, one of the national guys, talked about the fact. He said, this is when the national announcers take over. And I'd just like to say, we hate all your teams. Oh yeah, yeah, that's always a complaint.

That's what Joe Buck always says, is I hate your team. That's on his Twitter bio.

And it's just ridiculous. I know, I'm glad they're making fun of it, but there are people who take that series, no doubt, no doubt. And it's so funny when people take shots more at me than a Doug because of our sec broadcasts, you know, about us being biased or whatever, like hello, you know how your guys.

So I told the LSU coach it one day when I went over to him and he said, I watched the replay of the game last night. I said, what'd you think he kind of. I said, were we a little bit you know? Biased? And he went well, and I said, you know what, lsu ain't paid me a penny yeah, and he went fair point yeah yeah, but he knew. I mean that's it. We're not doing a national or regional game and local home game, Pride.

And maybe you can back me up on this, I think now, Jeff Picorrel, that's another issue. It gets a little emotional, yes he does. And Tom gets emotional as well, but I've never heard Tom almost break down in tears over a touchdown. Tom does it? You know? He came up under k what like I did? All right, we'll take a break, come back. Our number two is on the way. We're talking to the chain gang. We have a text chain. We're up all hours, aren't we. Dug Oh my gosh, your phone dings till one morning?

My god.

Now it's usually Darren at one am.

But I always answer answering no, that's the thing. My wife will sit there and she'll go, what are they possibly talking about?

Hey? That prime time game just ended.

That's right, And coach you probably just leave your phone in the back porch, don't you sell?

You know, I hang in there with you guys. That's true until about eleven or eleven thirty. Occasionally, Oh now you're just breaking occasionally if I can't sleep, I don't bother you guys, but I'm harassing.

Yeah, that's true.

We need to do Darren, just pick up the phone and call them just to make sure they're awake.

Were little FaceTime, that's right, trust me. When you got that iPad sitting and then a light comes.

On, we'll come back for our number two in just a minute on six thirty.

Wag everything.

Then we're back.

We're with the garage guys, the Chain gang. If you will, our text Shane come to life.

They all night tange game.

That's what ought to be under the wee hours.

Doug Flynn, Keith Madison, Darren Hedrick. You will not believe, Well yeah you will with this group. Well we talked about during the break and that was not just he haul, which is I said, was a guilty pleasure for everybody. There are some great musical acts. If you like country music, I said, great, I love you Johnny. Uh, but what were you explaining to us, mister Flynn.

Oh yeah, but you were gona handb on it.

You were you were quite delighted to tell coaches there's what is it on YouTube?

Oh yeah, you can learn how you have And I think you know him being from Browns, well he should already know.

How to do it. Well.

I taught Archie Campbell how to do it.

There you go, there you go, and if you want to search it out, I've seen two different spellings E E F I N G or E E P H.

That's yeah, that's right, and talking right there.

But that was one of those shows that was on one of the networks, I think CBS, and then they canceled it and it was immediately somebody.

Snatched it up network.

But whoever was snatched it up and syndicated it and made a fortune, you know.

It's it always amazes me that, you know, Buck Owens was one of the stars on the show, and I'm a pick and yeah, and he you know, obviously a great country singer and all these really good West Coast country singers always talk about Buck Owens. Yeah, and my memory of Buck Owens is him acting goofy on not thinking. These guys had by Buck Owens, Yeah, had Roy Clark.

Bakersfield sound, that's it, the Bakersfield Sounds.

Right now. Educate me on that. So let's see the Bakersfield sound that was goings and watt yoakam Merle Haggard. I think Whylon might have had a little bit of it before he went out Law, Yeah there was. It was a radio station in Bakersfield that had all these guys come through and it created the Bakersfield sound.

That's back when people perform live on the radio. Yeah, yeah, that's that's fascinating.

So you watch guys and then Roy Clark's on there, and I remember I hadn't seen him do anything except funny stuff, and all of a sudden he started.

They had him playing guitar and unbelievable.

Oh there are people when they talk about the great pickers, uh, Chad Atkins, Martin Knopfler, Roy Clark.

Yeah, you know, and that guy could play anything he could.

I saw him playing the fiddle the other night on a clip.

Yeahjo, you know, one of the classy things that we do. You know, we send each other stuff. But Darren sent me a picture of a stream being.

All right, I won't ask for conta. You know who Pat Darcy is, Yeah, all right. Pat was a teammate roommate of mine at the seventy five World Series. Pat's always talked Pat six y four. So every time he sees me, he'd send me pictures of Billy Bardy and say, Doug, I saw you in town. Uh person right. And then the guy that the White Sox used that, Uh, Edie Goodell. He said he saw a picture of Eddie Goodell. Says Doug, I saw you. He says, I hate. He sends me

And I'm thinking, man, that's why other than well, we'll be concerned about this.

No, I think it's it's over with now. But you know it's good. It's good that you got that you can do stuff like I mean, the stuff you all send out. Starts out often serious, never end serious never or starts off not so serious and mighty end. We've been really good about that.

I think we surely is serious until he responds with one of his images, you.

Know, coaches, King of the coach, You got nothing anything.

I've got a lot to do, but you guys just strack me from doing it.

He has to stop his tractor.

And did you sell out your golf tournament?

Yes? Yeah, it's going well good? Uh well, is that a.

Shameless plug for we love a good shameless Yeah?

You know.

I didn't want to mention it, but it's October fourteenth, it starts at noon, and anybody wants.

To you got you fill it up?

We got it, We got I need I need a couple more celebrities, Like if we could get come out string being, I had to go get a celebrity from my team. We got Gerald Belcher's celebrity on my team. Yeah. I was so glad to see Gerald player.

Man.

What a He's a hero of mine.

He's a yeah, good nel Gerald, you know him? Vietnam veteran, got shot up. He's from Kentucky, got shot up, came back home rehabbed enrolled in University of Kentucky, walked onto the baseball field and said I want to play. And they had Blair jeans on, no shoes or nothing, and they would ye, all right, gets up to hit hits first two out of the ballpark, they went, So you

Yes, seventies eight seven, you know, early seventies. Yeah, we were going away through his tenure, right, yeah, it was before but he you know, Doug and I were talking about Gerald the other day. And so in my first Old Timers game or alumni game that I had when I started coaching here back in the yuh around nineteen eighty, jeral Belcher calls me up to say, Coach, I want to play, but I want to take some batting practice. I said, you want to take batting practice before the

With him five years when I got when I came back home.

Great competitor, you know. And and I'm glad he's playing because he's he is one of my heroes.

He is a hero.

I have to admit.

I believe I've heard the name, but I don't know that story.

That's a great story, it's really good. I think that this story was born out of a conversation about Heath Hall. That's the way our games usually go.

But it's fun is to say, how do we get here? Retrace your steps?

I think Jered broke the school record for doubles at the time after after serving in Vietnam, and he curious injuries, I mean serious injuries in Vietna.

Maybe why I know his name is looking through the record.

But he could run, buddy, he was fast.

Interesting. Well, all right, we're going to take a break, come back and talk more with a chain gang. Doug Flynn and uh that's you. Oh yeah, he by the way, shut up burn's tie today for the show he did.

Man, Well, you said this was an important show, so I knew that the people out there would probably want to see it.

Well, but it fell on deaf ears.

That's right, he's got his hero Charlie Brown on it.

That's true.

Yeah, I thought that's Darren.

Yeah, it's me. I don't have.

Darreon Hendrick. Keith Madison back at a minute A six thirty W L A B. Welcome back to the garage. We're visiting live with Darren Heddrick, the voice of UK baseball and women's basketball, Doug Flynn, Hall of fame in my mind infielder Old Glover and my partner on UK Baseball broadcast on SEC Plus, Keith Madison, Darren Hedrick's broadcast partner on the UK Radio network. Where it is he coached in baseball at UK and has the life sized bibblehead to prove it.

My favorite coach.

How about that?

I was looking through some social media the other day and saw the picture of you guys at the College World Series and just thinking back and Doug and I had a ball, we all did. And now you're looking at a roster, Darren. It's at least half of it's turned over, but welcome to college basement.

That's right. Thirty new players, freshmen and transfers on this year's team and Matt May and I were sitting at the ballpark a couple of weeks ago. As a matter of fact, we were going around the horn defensively at all the different faces and positions. Devin Burks is back, but you've got a new first basement, You'll have a new second basement, a new shortstop, which I'm excited to see that young man, a new third baseman, and then your outfield, it's going to have a lot of new

And if any of you are going to be in the Cincinnati Northern Kentucky area on Sunday, they're playing Right State University that's right at Prep Park.

Yeah, up in Mason, it's a neton first pitch you mentioned somebody mentioned Nolan. Well, you guys were talking about Nolan and Pete Rose reaching out to him during the College World Series. How surprised were you that he left?

Initially, when I saw the news, I was shocked, But then, you know, after hearing his side of it, I kind of understood that, you know, he had reached a pinnacle point at helping Kentucky to the College World Series. Now, obviously there's still a National Championship to go out and win, but you know, his teammates, a lot of them were either graduating or they were going to the the next level through the Major League Draft, and I think for him, he just felt like it was getting off point, if

That he had the feeling that if he came back he may have been counted on too much?

That's all question that only he can answer. But I think he was looking around the room and realizing that a lot of his teammates were going to be gone, and so I think.

As he came in with he doesn't sound like the kind of guy who would be bothered by that notion. I can understand being feeling like he's on an island.

Yeah, And like I say, there's some other things connections because one of the coaches, what the Georgia Nick assistant at Georgia and Will Coggins too, Yeah, and I will him. I think I don't want to speculate too much because I only know I wasn't in the room when all those decisions were made, and I don't want to speculate too much.

But who's replace placed Amarati?

So they got coach Sloan who was at Right State. He's an offensive, young up and coming, offensive minded. I mean, he was running Right State's offense and we know how good Right State has been.

You'll like him do great, great young man.

He's the players love him in terms of working with him in the cage, working on swings and different things. He is different from coach Hamaratti. They have two distinctly different ways of going about hitting approaches. But the players seem to really have bought into what he and coach Kuzi and the Kuzzano and the rest of the staff want to do.

You know, it's interesting you talked about Coggins moving on, Amarati moving on. Those guys are moving up in their respective professions. Uh, you know, there's there's more money to be had, there's uh you know, if you're a number three assistant, now you're number two kind of thing. Everybody knows this, but especially I think in football, but oftentimes

Now.

My favorite story is as a guy who played at Florida and I've told this before, was with the Bengals and Steve Mawson. I asked him, man, what was like playing for Spurit? I don't know. Never talked to him like what he goes, No, he never talked to me. Would come on? He said? After I signed, he never spoke to me again. Why because I played defense and that just wasn't inside of the ball now his position coach. Absolutely, But it's not that unusual, is it.

No, it's not. And for one thing, the head coach is usually a guy that has to discipline the player.

That's true.

Yeah, so you know that that makes it easier for a player to talk to the assistant coaches, get to know them and be more open with them. But you know, I tried, and I know Nick does too, to establish a really good relationship with the players, because I you know, looking back and you hear people talk about this a lot, it's so true. The wins are awesome, but the relationships are even better. Yeah, and so if any young coaches out there listening, work really hard at developing those positive

That may be what they need in Cincinnati too. I mean, David Bell is as good a person as as I know. But you need pros just like college players need somebody there to set some guidelines and now you've got to live up to it, and there has to be some discipline too. Yeah, yeah, a little different, but it's kind of the same concept.

I mean, I look at the major league managers that in the past that have had that good balance of knowing their players but yet having some guidelines like Sparky, you know, you were your uniform a certain one. Yeah, yeah, and you know Show Walter.

Uh.

These guys are great baseball people, and they love the game and they want the game played a certain way. Yeah. So I respect those guys a lot because.

Those are the guys who have moved from team to team. Not a lot, but Sparky did I mean? And they're successful, yes.

You know.

Joe Tory, Joe Tory, Joe Torri was Bobby.

Cox, Joe Torry.

I felt like benefited and sitting down a knock on Tory because he does what good leaders do. Great leaders do, surround themselves with good people, people that might be smarter than there. The the the value of Don Zimmer on that bench with Tory, I thought was so underrated.

Larry pitching coach.

Yeah yeah, Joe was very loyal to his people too.

You guys are still tight, aren't you?

You?

And Tori?

Well yeah, yeah, you know, I don't see much anymore because and I get mad at him time. Oh yeah, he's in the commissioner's office. So when I see some of these goofy rule changes, I said, Joe, Joe would have never done that as a coach or a player.

But yeah, he changed a lot, you know. I mean when he when he was first a manager. Uh, he wasn't Loop Panela, but he could get all right.

I was there of the year that he was. I came over there when he was a player manager. The first year when he became a manager, he had some of the best one liners. He would sit there and say stuff for an umpire that the umpire would just be tongue tied, not knowing how to come back at him. Yeah, and uh, and he loved it too. He loved it. He now, I can't tell you something stories.

As he as he got older, he wasn't quite as fiery, but he was a great leader.

He was a great leader. But you know, it seemed like back then his shoulders were like, I know, looked like he had shoulder pads on.

No.

Man, he was huge, just a big, strong dude.

He won a batting title. I want to say it.

He couldn't run right.

Yeah.

With the Cardinals, he had lost a lot of weight, gotten in shape, and I never hit this growing up in Louisville and being a Cardinals fan, and you'd watch the eleven o'clock news, and that was back when you get partial scores, remember that, Yeah, you know, and then the sixth innings, so and so, you know, and I see that the Cardinals were down one or two runs that particular year, would I'd be going to bed, I know when inevitably Tory doubles in the winning run or something like that.

You know, I must say, Uh, the Cardinals have had some great managers over the year. Yeah, not lately, but yeah, I mean LaRussa is one of the smartest guys ask him. Yeah, exactly. But you know, you talk baseball that guy. Wow.

Yeah, I mean he knows again you've had the privilege yeah, wow, you talk to him.

Yeah, and yeah, I mean we've talked to him so that.

Yeah.

And Loup Panela is, Oh, he's phenomenal, just a wonderful guy to talk to.

You get him in the garage, he'd be good to take a call.

If he ever gets Lexington, we can get him in the.

Good On that happy note, We'll take a break, come back and talk more with the Chain gang. Darren Hendrick, Keith Madison, and Doug Flynn here on a big Woe Sider six thirty w L Welcome back to the garage. We're talking with the chain gang, Doug Flynn, Keith Madison, Darren Hendrick. They gather every once in a while here in the garage. We talk about anything and everything, and we talked about Kentucky football earlier. But coming on next

Do you love it?

Love it?

All?

Right? Explain well?

I'm a Mark Pope fan. I think the way things had been going, obviously we got one national championship with undoubtedly some of the best talent ever. There's thirty guys in the NBA making All Star teams and we can't win one here, So let's make a change.

So you're making more than a billion dollars.

Well, yes, true, Yeah, so I like it, and let's get back to the It's about Kentucky, it's about the fans. It's about team basketball. If you make it to the pros, great, but the fans have come and supported this for a long time. And there's something special about wearing that big K on there. I mean, I was blessed to do it, Keith got to do it. There's something special about it. Let's make it that be part of special again.

Coach I already felt like Caliperry's success early helped him with this final fours, back in the top five, Kentucky's relevant again. But there was this simmering dislike I think among fans when he would say five guys drafted on win one night. That's the biggest now, you know, greatest. Try to walk that back and come on, and that was explicitly a message to recruits but also saying women's opinion, we know the sec championships met you know, basically cared

No doubt.

I mean, people in this state weep when Kentucky doesn't win. And with coach cal always sensed and and I don't have anything against him, I just always sensed that the draft the NBA was this his ultimate thing. And and see how many guys you get drafted. And he was phenomenal at that, at recruiting and getting those guys in the NBA.

Wanting to help kids better their families in their lives. That's great.

But people in Kentucky and I grew up in Kentucky listening to k Wood on the radio, like thousands and thousands of other kids. People in Kentucky, the only NBA we care about is the teams that the Cats play on. We may follow them, may not, We're not. This is not an NBA state, but this is a Kentucky Walkcat state.

How far?

And yeah, you got to put the Waldcats first, and you got to put the team first. And I just don't like Doug said, Mark Pope's going to do that because he he wanted championship with the Cats, and he knows he knows the importance of that, and I think I think it was a you know, it may prove me wrong, I hope not, but I thought it was a great hire by Mitch and I think he's going to do a phenomenal job. I don't know how they're going to do the first year because it's a brand new roster.

Yeah, we none of us know.

It's go'll be a veteran roster, looks like though. Yeah, yes, but as smart as as smart as Mark Pope is, I actually have a really big senior day.

You know that as smart as he is and as competitive as he is, I have to believe that he's going to win.

And uh well he won in his first two stops and did not have obviously the resources he has now facilities recruiting.

And I love it, Dick, the way the Kentucky fans, you know, at first, they were like, a, you know, we want the best, the winning, as big as name. Yeah, but boy, when Mark got here, they embraced him and and that that thing was, oh my gosh, it was. It was beautiful.

Darren. I think you're already slated for the Blue White broadcast. Yes, so you'll be handling men's basketball and women's basketball for the time being.

Can we text you You're in it, go for it? Can we can we come down be on the air with you?

Can you text him during the game?

I can't get down there.

He more Bobby flanting in there, so I can't get down the shore.

But I was gonna say, can can we can dare and text during a game?

We know the answer to that.

He's the best.

This is a beat.

I don't know.

I feel like that somebody is doing it for him because I see his lips moving over there.

But I know it he's he's breaking down to play on the on the field and texting at the same time, two entirely different thoughts.

I don't know how you do that. I don't think I want to know, because I'd be tempted to try, and I struggle enough as it is. I can tell you, but that's good.

But my wife will sometimes text me during the game and she'll say are you awake?

And then too busy? I'll get this look from Gabe, yeah, just staring at me, like, go.

Ahead, Well, you're reading a text from Darren, right.

That's why I told him, I said's his fault and I'm over there just.

I'm shaking my fist at him shopping.

Heck, I can't even remember to put the hit set on and he's over there breaking the game down and texting at the same time.

You are like fifty years younger than we are.

So you're play the cookies. That's that's that's one great thing you have in common with Mark Pope. You appreciate a good cookie. He's all about cookies.

Man. I'll tell you what.

You ever worked that out? Because I know there was a little thing, but yeah, you worked it.

Out, got it?

Yeah? I mean, oh, he's got his own I mean he's got his contact, You got your hook o, three cookies, a game, there you go, I mean, wow, and delivered really really they're delicious.

Oh my goodness, thanks for that.

Anyhow, getting back to Darren and I'm working pro day as well. We're gonna have to do some studying, aren't well.

We are, man, I mean, it's it's fun to see these new rosters, like these guys were talking about and and I'm actual. You know, we had Cameron Mills on our Clark's Pumping Shop bb AND Radio that airs Monday nights on the UK Sports Now well done.

He was right here in Yeah.

And to hear him be so excited talking about all these new faces on the basketball team, I can't wait. They're gonna get up and down and shoot threes, They're gonna play defense. And you know, on the women's side, these these young ladies are gonna play hard. They're gonna be pretty good our team. Yeah. A lot of size at every position, a lot of size. So I'm looking forward to basketball this year. There's a lot of energy in the building right now at Joe Kraft Center.

What I love about it, And I realize I sound very biased, but it's just as someone who likes a good story watching this story unfold, both the men and the women. Who are these people? How are they gonna play? Are they gonna fit into the sec and starting? And

They have to lean in and listen, lean in and listen.

It's kind of amazing. For years you all have had to learn incoming freshman who you knew very little about. Now you're gonna have incoming seniors who you know very little about.

But there's a lot of info.

Yeah, I said, they've at least got a little track record with them that's coming in. I gotta say too. I mean, I love working with Dick. We've done it for so many years and it's just one of the nice little perks and joys of life. And we have a ball and watching you guys. But I've told you before, I just I think I don't know how much longer you're gonna be here, but I think you do a great job.

Of you know something I don't. Well, I put your name in for uh how many?

How many? How many?

Uh?

What are the counters in front of us? How many of those have you broken since you've been here?

Just one?

I've never broken a count. I tell you, we watched you have some. You had some pretty good ones on this past year. A little more emotion I.

Like that, Yeah, big D. Big D's a great competitor, man. I tell you, he plays to win. He plays to win. My hero is Pete Rose. Play to win the game. That's what he always said, you play to win the game.

Cave Gabe as a checked me because I got intends every now and then to get a little excited. My headphones will jump off my head.

And when you run into our booth and start yelling, yes, listen. The emotion that we have ups and downs, it's because, especially this past year, the group of guys we had in that dugout want it so bad for you.

And you know what, you can never count those guys.

Yeah, and so you know if you get if you get frustrated, or it's you're doing it for them, because.

Yeah, you know, that's right, that's right.

I ken't expecting daring to get an umpire like a voodoo doll thing.

It's not that bad.

Hey, boys, you think the MLB baseball is bad, college baseball they need to work on that a little bit, you know what I mean? Yeah, I mean they need to work on that. You'd love it pitching Getting that pitch that far outside, man, it is a strike.

I did appreciate college baseball trying to become more consistent with the zones, but you cannot give college pitchers a major league zone. It's not No, it's not fair.

It's not. And they're either Yeah, and again I'm probably more sympathetical umpires than you guys are. But it's like they're either they're not, probably you are. It's like they're either auditioning for the pros or they've they've had left the coffee with the pro right, good point, and trying to show tough they are. Like that is that good for the game?

Good point?

Yeah, a better game. Yeah, if you don't notice the umpires, it's a great game.

It really is.

Yeah.

You know that's what I love when I'd work a game and I'd talked to a player a couple of days later about, hey, you know, you guys had a good game against the giants today.

You know, did you work that game? Were you there?

Like, yes, that's a good thing.

I think it's that relationship that you were talking about. You know, why not have it with the player. I mean, I sucked up to some mini umpire was so bad hit night and suck up to every one of them.

I could.

I'd take them tobacco whatever they wanted. What do you need, you know, hot dog, I'll get you one.

Work. Yeah.

With Doug Harvey, everybody hated Doug Harvey the chief.

They called him God.

Oh that's true, yea.

His nickname was God and the white.

Had the white hair looked like a drill.

Sorry, juice. The two redman chewing tobacco, so when he had a game, I'd take him out a couple of packs of it.

Here.

Never had any problem with him, did you?

Yeah?

I did.

When'd you give it up?

Back?

Before I got cancer? So it's been what day is this? I think shortly after I got married. It was because my wife was thinking, really, I said, oh, my fight, I'll share it.

Your breast like a spoon. What about quick funny story. I had a buddy in the minor leagues that, of course you there was a time where you were kind of pressured to chew or dip yep, because that was the cool thing to do. He hated it. He didn't want any part of it. So he would take coffee grinds and put him in a dip can and he would put coffee grinds, wow, and you know they look just like, yeah, just use coffee grinds.

When I got with the Reds, when I would go into the game late for defense, usually going for third basic peak came up, so I'm going for defense. As I was going down the field and up down the dugout guys that were too and would just drill my uniform. I looked like a dalmatian. So I thought to get even I would chew myself. So they took tobacco and they'd wrapped bubble gum around it and then start chewing it. And uh, that's how we started. That's how I started.

Yeah.

I Uh, I did chew a little bit, but it's it's funny. I enjoyed chewing more when I was fishing than when I was on the field. For some reason. It was kind of relaxing.

Uh.

But if I find interesting, you get a nicotine jolt, but it relaxes you.

Yeah. But I never got into dipping because the first time I ever dipped, I don't remember.

I don't remember having dipped back.

In Yeah, well it was it was it was in the REDS organization. Somebody gave me a dip and I swear I go back to my room and the and the room is just spinning. Oh god, And I said, it's not that important to me. I don't know I'm not going to do this again, but chewing. You know, and when I first started, excuse me, first started coaching at Kentucky, Redman used to send us boxes and kidding,

Joe Garziola was going around with that one.

Yeah, I still use Big league chew everyone.

Of course, they have substitutes now for that. I guess I don't think that's non tobacco tobacco chewing for you. No, never, never Tennessee.

But you never Wow.

You think about uh, you know, like baseball has its own subculture. But you think about somebody that's never seen a baseball game before and they come to game and they see guys spitting in the dugout. I mean, it's gotta be weird.

You know.

Somebody from England comes over and and and you know, these guys are all just spitting all in the dugout.

The cups. That's what actually turned the.

Americans spitting during sports.

Right now, the cups are growing. People leave them around. Yeah, you said to dental school, excuse me, I chewed a little bit in adult league, and I started dating a dentist and she told me what exactly what it was doing to my gums, and I gave it up on the spot. So when you can get that information at education. On that disgusting note, we'll take a break, come back with more from the Chain Gang.

And it all started with the Beverly with he Hall.

Here on six thirty doubles. I'll come back to the garage. It's our final segment with a Chain Gang. Darren Hendrick, Keith Madison and Doug Flynn. We've run the gauntlet. We've talked baseball, football, basketball, chewing, tobacco. Heehaw uh. We haven't talked much music because there are new rules about the Internet and my show is like so many the show Darren does on Monday, Seam Deal goes to the Internet as a podcast and there are copyright laws blah blah blah.

So you can't play them. Can you even talk about it?

We can talk about them, but we'll talk about music Without the music, it's not good.

But I will say last night I listened to a song called Woodstock that was written by Joni Mitchell. Yes, and it was done by Matthew Southern Comfort, a group back in the early seventies. I've listened to Joni Mitchell sing it quite frankly, does nothing for me. Crosby steals a Nash great job, a little upbeat, yeah, but Matthew Southern Comfort knocked it out of the part.

Woodstock isn't that interesting?

Yeah, So all you know, all you people out there that have watched the movie Woodstock, you got to listen to that song the way Matthew Southern Comfort portrays it.

I was reading a thing on the internet about jennle on my mind and we all kind of grew up hearing Glenn Campbell you sing it, but hearing John Hartford sing it? Who wrote it? Yeah, it's different and it's not I don't know what the word I'm looking for, coach not. I hate to say commercial because John Hartford didn't sing a lot of songs publicly, but I think he's saying yo yo man and stuff like that. But oh yeah, but you know, and we heard Glenn Campbell

Yeah, and I think I think of Chris Christopher's oh my good one, Yeah, just lost him, just lost him, and and his his rendition.

Of Sunday Morning coming down.

The one that, uh it's happened. I'm old, I forgot we know that. Uh, come on, get it out be and Bobby m yeah being Bobby McGee. The way that Chris Christopherson sings it is not nearly as good as Janice Jopplin. I mean she puts soul into it. Even though he wrote it. She just knocks it out of the part.

It's just another word for nothing left to lose.

That's right.

How about that for a line.

Yeah, if you get a chance, my wife and I are going to see all these groups. Like we went saw Casey in the Sunshine Band. Uh, we were gonna go see saw your Brown.

Uh.

The other night we went talk and saw Eddie Montgomery. Oh wow, there you go ed at renfro Valley and Eddie put on a heck of a show. It is, I mean it's not And then all of a sudden you're in there and you realize, man, they had a lot of songs. Yeah, and his band sounds good.

And he sounds good and renfer Valley is underappreciated.

It really is.

We've seen We'll go see the Oaks again there this year. We'll see the Gatlands again this year. But we're taking were just going out and seeing a lot of the older groups, like you know, saw your Brown. Uh, he's not gonna be there. They had to cancel till November. Has got some voice stuff going on. But you know that's it's so fun that if you love music, go down to Renfro Valley.

That's a fun place.

It is it is. I've been on a in the month of September. I was on a motown Kick four Sea, four Tops, Wow Haitians, And so far this month it's been more eighties one hit Wonders Go West, Duran, Duran.

Has has boy George ever been down to d for about probably not?

Are you asking?

Doug stared right at me, did right a whole right through. You know you're going to start taking more of that, Jared Tools. I'll still say you were the best coach I ever had, though.

That's terrible.

There isn't anyone hadn't rather coach than you.

Well, we only have about a minute and a half left. But I think we've covered just about everything or any think anybody wants to get off their chest.

Or well, I'm just embarrassed. I forgot the words to Bobby.

See.

We were able to stop the tape and figure it out, fire it back up.

That's the only thing.

Chris Stopfords that story about him landing a helicopter, Oh gosh, that's If you don't know that story, google it. Christofferson, Johnny Cash, right, helicopter because you.

Flew chi delivering a song?

Yeah, which and which one was it Sunday morning?

Yes? I believe it was.

And Johnny Cash like yeah, okay, well we'll record this.

Uh.

I don't want to end this on too much of a down note, but prayers to all of our friends and families in East Tennessee, Western North Carolina, Georgia. It's it's really bad down there, and so people down there. Yeah, and if if anybody can help out, they need it, Bridges, water, food, Yeah, Who's Samaritan? Per go through the Red Cross? Who's Red Cross?

Well that is a good note to en Donal.

We thank you for listening.

Thank you all you boys. Great to see you. We'll do it again soon.

I promise.

Keep your phone handy, Doug. We'll be texting.

I know twelve o'clock. I'll be waiting anxiously for your tweets.

You can't miss it.

It's good stuff always.

And we hope you've enjoyed another visit from the chain gang the garage guys. I love it when they come by because truly it's easy for me. I just sit back, push their buttons, push the buttons on my equipment and have a good time. So they'll be back with us soon. I hope we'll be back with you tomorrow night. Looking ahead to next football week and of course the basketball overlap. Next week begins with Pro Day on Monday. It'll be on sec Bus and Madness on Friday, UK Andy on Saturday.

So am I to understand that you men completed your training on your own.

That's the fact.

Everything