AFC Over/Under Wins: Best Bets (Ep. 49) - podcast episode cover

AFC Over/Under Wins: Best Bets (Ep. 49)

Apr 14, 202043 minEp. 49
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Episode description

With the NFL Draft around the corner and early Over/Under win totals being available, Adam Burke of BangTheBook Radio joins the show to talk about the best bets available across the AFC. The AFC East is a wild card with the Brady-less Patriots, but how much will actually change in the division (2:37)? After flopping in 2019, are the Browns primed to hit the over on their projected win total of 8.5 (14:59)? What do you do with a large projected win total like that of the Ravens (23:26) and which team offers up the best bet in the AFC South (25:24)? To round out the AFC, there's one team in the West, that is being underestimated (33:36).

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Transcript

Speaker 1

Hey there, everybody. Welcome back to the Betting Pros NFL podcast. I'm your host, Dan Harris. You can find me on Twitter at Dan Harris Ady. Lots happened since our last episode where we broke down some NFL futures and the Oscar odds, and the NFL offseason just keeps rolling right along. So today we're going to break down some win totals for the AFC. With me to do that is Adam Burke, a sports betting writer over at bangbook dot com host of Bang the Book Radio. You can follow him on

Twitter at Skating Tripods. Adam, thanks so much for joining me today.

Speaker 2

How you doing, I'm good man, How you doing? Not bad?

Speaker 1

I mean, it's a little weird right now, obviously for many reasons, and there are a lot of more serious things going on in the country than just sports, but the complete lack of sports. I mean, I watched with my kid game seven of the twenty sixteen NBA Finals, where you know, Lebron and the Cavs won, and it was it just like, it reminded me of how bizarre it is right now to not have anything at all just to turn on and watch, you know what, I mean.

Speaker 2

Oh, yeah, absolutely. I mean it's you know, that's a pretty big day for us around here. That's something you'd almost remember quite well. I mean those are those are the good times, the simpler days, I guess. But the one nice thing I guess about, you know, talking NFL, is that this is kind of the point that the offseason would be in any way. You know, we had a draft coming up in ten days or so, and you know, we were just looking at win totals and

futures and all that. It's it's not like we're sitting here talking about how we don't have baseball, which I know is very hard for both of us.

Speaker 1

Yeah, no, it is. And by the way, Adam is from Cleveland, in case you didn't know that, or at least he is a Cleveland fan. Are you born and raised in Cleveland or what?

Speaker 2

Born and raised? I actually grew up about ten minutes southwest of downtown.

Speaker 1

Well, I remember you had last year when we talked in an early episode. You had a correct take about the Browns, you know, in their their future to win the division, and you were not quite as bullish as the general consensus. So you had that one peg. So I'll be interested to hear what you think about their own under today. So for today, as we said, we're gonna go division by division. In the AFC, we're going to talk about the over unders for every team in

the division. Now, for the odds, we're going to be using the consensus over unders from bettingpros dot com. That's the aggregate of the odds that are available in the market, and you can find those over at bettingpros dot com slash NFL hyphen wins. And you can find more than just the win totals or team futures. If you're interested in the draft, go to bettingpros dot com slash draft hyphen props. Those are consensus lines on things like how many of any position are going to be drafted, or

the first pick by team and things like that. You can find lines on pretty much every potential thing to bet in the NFL, So go check it out, all right, Adam, Let's start with the AFC East here, a division which should be a little more interesting than in past years. Right now, the consensus lines are the Bills are over under of nine, the Patriots also over under of nine, Jets are an over under of six and a half,

and the Dolphins are an over under of six. So any of these over under, any of these bets, do you find enticing.

Speaker 2

I think it's you know, really tough to kind of figure out right now because we're still sort of in a holding pattern with New England. I think that New England it's very hard to see them going into the season with you know, Jared Stidham and Brian Hoyer at quarterback, and yeah, maybe they take one in the first round, but I can't imagine that Bill Belichick's gonna run a rookie quarterback out there right away, So maybe Hoyer is

kind of a placeholder something like that. But I mean, this defense is still exceptional, you know, it's still one of the best defenses in the AFC, if not the

best defense in the AFC. So it's tough to kind of ascertain what to do with the win totals here in the AFC East until we get more clarity on New England's quarterback situation, because if they upgrade at quarterback, this could very well be a team that goes eleven and five, you know, or has a very very strong ten and six record, which at that point in time, would you know, positive or would potentially, I should say impact the Bills impact those two head to head meetings

with the Jets. Same thing about their games with the Dolphins. So I couldn't really do too much with the AFC East right now until I figure out where New England's kind of going to fall, because you know, those head to head games with two per team are very important.

Speaker 1

So let me ask you something, what does upgrade the quarterback position mean to you? Does that mean literally sign anybody else or trade for anybody else or anything like that that's going on. I mean, you we obviously have you know, you've got Jameis Winston and Cam Newton out there. The Bengals are of course looking to deal Andy Dalton if they get one of those guys, is that completely

change your outlook on this division? I mean, how would you feel about an over under of nine if they made one of those moves?

Speaker 2

Yeah, I mean I would have to go over at that point. And you know, I've even kind of seen some of the places out there in the offshore market kind of have a head to head matchup between New England and Buffalo, and you know who would have more wins in a battle between those two teams and I mean, look, if New England makes an upgrade at quarterback, I think their win total nine and a half looks good. You know, I don't think that they would go all the way

up to ten necessarily. And as I look at the betting pros consensus ods, you know, some individual books out there do have nine and a half. I mean, is Dalton a half win upgrade over you know, Hoyer or Stidham or let's say they take you know, Jordan Love or something like that. I think, so is Winston and upgrade. Yeah, he doesn't have the same skill position talent that he had in Tampa Bay, but I mean he's still a

better option, I would say, than Hoyer and Stidham. And you know, Cam Newton could be an option here too. I think New England, if I had to bet it right now, I'm still taking New England to win this division. I wouldn't be in love with it. But given the fact that both the Patriots and the Bills are sitting there at nine, I mean I would have to look probably more over nine with New England than I would with Buffalo.

Speaker 1

I think it's fair. I think that I think let's start with your first point, which is It is nearly impossible to accurately kind of assess this division without knowing what the Patriots are going to be doing. Right now, let me start with this. I guess if they don't make an upgrade on quarterback, let's say they go with Stidham. Okay, let's say they say, this is what we're doing, this is our future. We like what we've seen, despite the fact that he's thrown what four passes in the NFL.

They go, it's Stidham. What do you think about the over under nine? And you pointed it out, by the way, when you look at the consensus odds, it's nine nine and a half, nine nine and a half, nine nine and a half, So it's one of two ways at nine and a half. Personally, if they don't make an upgrade, I'm easy on the under here. I get that the Patriots are incredible. They haven't won fewer than ten games since two thousand and two. The defense is good, they're

very good. But they have lost a boatload so far in free agency. Right they lost Kyle Van Nooy, they lost Jamie Collins, they lost Shelton, they lost Harmon, they lost a Landon Roberts. You know, I get that they still have you know, Stefan Gilmore, and they still have

mccordy and everything like that. But you know, the thing is, defensively, they're very good, but they're not this elite unit that everybody kind of thought that they were because they were beaten the heck out of that horrible offensive competition that they faced earlier in the year. They're a very solid defensive unit, but I don't think they're good enough for the offense to carry them. And they just have done

nothing right now. On offense. I mean they tagged you know, Joe Toney, they still have Mohammed Sanu, they still have Marcus Kennon, but they really I mean, unless you're saying Nikhil Harry or Jacoby Myers are gonna take a huge leap or they're gonna do something with you know, their twelve picks to really make a move or a trade or something like that, this team is not very good. I mean, their defense is is decent, but their offense and you know, all I hear about all the time.

And again I live in New England, so this is certainly what I get from my in laws and everything like that, and just from the crowd around here in the sports talk radio is you know, you think back to the Matt Castle gear, but you know, this is not Randy Moss and Wes Welker sitting there on offense. You know, it's not as if he can just Belichick and just do this without Brady. This is not a

very good offensive team. So for me, absent a major you know, absent upgraded quarterback for sure, but maybe even more than that. If it's nine and a half, I'm still going under. I'd probably stay away at nine, I guess, But for the nine and a half, I really think I lean under.

Speaker 2

Well, I mean those are all fair points. And you know, again, I mean there are a lot of moving parts with this team, and we know that, you know, they're very, very sharp and very smart organizationally, and there also has been a brain drain in terms of the coaching staff too.

You know, you lose a guy like a Jerry Schaplinsky, you know, somebody like that, a guy that, yeah he's not an offensive coordinator, Yeah he's not going to get the same headlines, but a guy that's you know, been in that quarterback room, been in that offensive room, obviously a very smart guy. Three Super Bowl rings. Now I don't even think he's forty yet, or he's pretty close to it. That's another byproduct of being really good is that you start losing some very smart people within the

organization as well. Now that being said, you'll get their eight home games here, they get San Francisco and they get Baltimore at home, two very very difficult games. Otherwise, you've got the three Division teams Denver, Las Vegas, and Arizona all six of those very very winnable games. And on the road. I'm low on the Rams for this season, which I'm sure we'll talk about in a little bit.

I'm very on Seattle for this season. Those are two road games that there'll be an underdog in in all likelihood, but I think they're kind of there for the taking. The three Division games. Houston, I mean, who knows if Deshaun Watson doesn't just walk out on that team at some point here with everything that's going on with them, Kansas City and the Chargers a couple of tough road

games against the AFC West. I don't think their schedule is that bad, and I think if they've got a quarterback that doesn't actively hurt them the schedule sets up relatively well for them to be, you know, a ten and six type team if everything falls into place. But again, you're talking about a much thinner margin for error than we've seen in the past. I think it's more of a commentary to me on I don't think Buffalo is as good as people think they are, and I think

the Dolphins will be better. I don't think the Jets necessarily will be. It doesn't shock me.

Speaker 1

I'm sorry, sorry, as a Jets fan, I have to do that every time somebody says that the Jets are not going to be very good, which, to be fair, it's accurate and happens on every single podcast, So I'm sorry, go ahead.

Speaker 2

No, that's all good. But I just I mean, I could see five and one in the division. Again, I could see them splitting with Buffalo and you know, winning the other four games. And I mean, maybe your view is different from mine and the Dolphins and the Jets, and maybe that's kind of how we differ a little bit here. But again I think that the Patriots until I'm proven otherwise that you know, maybe it was all Brady, or maybe it was all you know, some of these

quality control guys and all that. I just feel like Belichick finds away.

Speaker 1

Yeah, I look, I certainly cannot dispute the Belichick finds away, because Belichick finds away. It is worth noting you're talking about the schedule, and again this is not the best way to necessarily analyze the schedule. They actually have the toughest schedule in the league in terms of opponents win percentage. Last year it's five thirty seven. That's the toughest in

the league. The whole AFC East has a very difficult schedule because again they play the NFC West, which is a very solid division where you know, you've got the Seahawks and you've got the forty nine Ers. The Cardinals are going to be improved. The Rams are still putting up a fight, and then they've got the West, which again you talked about it not that great from top to bottom. The Chiefs are, of course fantastic. The Broncos

are going to be improved. The Chargers are a better team than they showed last year, even losing Rivers and going to Tyro. Taylor are not really sure that it's a downgrade at this point in their careers, but they lost all those one score games so they could be better, and then you know they were the best team in

the division. They're going to get the Ravens and then the Texans, which again, you're right if there's not a mutiny over there or Bill O'Brien doesn't trade the entire team for you know, four tires or something for his new truck. But yeah, it's an interesting thing, and I agree the division itself. I like Buffalo. I don't necessarily expect you know, they've lost a lot of pieces, but they've had a lot of pieces on defense. The big

thing is digs. But again, you've got basically the least accurate deep ball quarterback in the game with Josh Allen, So it's really tough to know what you're gonna see from then. With the Jets, yeah, I think they're gonna be okay like they were last year. They've built up their offensive line right now. It's gonna have to see what they do in the draft, if they had a receiver, or whether or not they had an edge rusher, but they obviously need help. The Dolphins, actually you mentioned them.

That's the one that I do like. Here is the over under of six and again it does depend a little bit on the Patriots, but you know, look they finished five and four down the stretch. They've had a monstrous offseason with Byron Jones, who's you know, between him and Saving Howard, they're looking really good. They added Shaq Lawson and Kyle van Noy and the Landon Roberts and Emmanuel Agba. The defense is going to be a lot better.

And on offense they've added a little bit. Jordan Howard is better than you know, whoever they were throwing out there last year, especially Klin Bilage, Ted Carris, Eric Flowers, you know, Devonte Parker, still developing, Preston Williams if he's healthy, Micah Sicki. They've got fourteen picks, three in the first round. You know, I get that Fits is not the future,

but he's capable of winning games. Again, tough schedule here, but they don't go to Arrowhead, they don't go to Seattle, so at least when they get those they'll have a quote unquote fighting chance and the fact that they'll be home. They get the Jags, they're home against the Bengals. They've got a lot of games that they can win, especially

you mentioned the Jets. Depend on what happens with the pat So for me right now, if there's one pick in this division that I like, and I don't love any of them, but if I had to go with one for me, it would be taking the Dolphins over six wins.

Speaker 2

I agree with that. And you know too, I mean, you look at the moves that they've made in free agency here and kind of the the expectations for them in the draft where they are going to address the offensive side and you know, quite possibly address the quarterback position as well. But Flores is a defensive guy by note, by trade, So you get a Byron Jones, you get

some pass rushers. I think Emmanuel Lagba is a very very good player, just wound up getting overshadowed in Cleveland because you know, Miles Garrett's here, and then you get you know, Kyle like Kyle van Noy, who Flores obviously knows, well, they've got a lot of pieces to build around here and something else you really like about Miami and obviously they got off to the atrocious start last year, but

he improved the culture of that team. Flores made it a point to do that very early in the process, to get rid of guys that weren't buying in get rid of guys that were kind of dragging everybody else down. And we saw what happened at the tail end of the year when they kind of changed that culture. They got guys that wanted to be there, guys that wanted to play. They were a much more cohesive unit. So I think you're definitely onto something there. It's obviously scary

thinging about this team. You'll potentially having to improve to seven wins to go over a win total, right, but you've got to like everything that they've been doing here over the last eighteen months.

Speaker 1

No, absolutely, And again, remember they had five wins, but that was all in their last nine games, right, I mean they were basically tanking, so they finished strong. So yeah, I think they could get there. It's a two win improvement is something that kind of shocks you a little bit, But with all they've done and how well they played down the stretch, I'm willing to buy it. So if we did go with one in that division, that would be my pick. Let's move on here to the AFC North.

You've got the Ravens at over under of eleven, which is a big number, of course, but they earned it by going fourteen to two. Steelers are over under nine, the Browns over under eight and a half, and the Bengals amasely over under of five. So which of any of these do you like?

Speaker 2

All right? Well, be a homer here, right, because the Cleveland Browns are going to be better than they were last year, and I like this team to go over eight and a half here. I see there's a couple of rogue eights out there as well on the betting board. I like this team a lot. I mean they're loaded with skill position talent on offense. Now they pick up a guy like Austin Hooper, and most importantly, Kevin Stefanski

seems to know what he's doing. Now, obviously we'll see if that translates into being a head coach, but as an offensive coordinator, as a play caller, as a guy that knows how to get all of his guys involved, much like he did there in Minnesota. I mean, they've got so many weapons, and defensively they're very, very good.

They'll improve the offensive line here in the draft. And you mentioned it in the top of today's show that last year I talked down about them because they had such a challenging schedule, in particular early on in the season when they were trying to get everybody acclimated to what Kitchens wanted to do and all that. Their schedule is much much softer this year. I think I saw they go from like thirtieth and strength to schedule to you know, ninth, something like that.

Speaker 1

Now they have the fourth in terms of opponents winning percentage, at least their fourth easiest schedule in the NFL.

Speaker 2

And they don't really have to travel much either. Their schedule is very very close to home. I mean, this is a team and this happens a lot of times too. When you've got a team that's expected to do big things and they fall flat on their faces, that following year is when they kind of tend to come through a little bit. I think the Browns are in that exact situation right now. And I get it, I'm from Cleveland.

It sounds like a Homer pick, but you know, hey, I was honest about them last year, and I think this is a pretty honest assessment this year.

Speaker 1

Well, look, the bottom line is from last year, you've earned a ton of credibility, at least for me and hopefully with our listeners, because yeah, you per word, cold water in them. I was more bullish on them. I had a tough time justifying the under or not picking them to win the division last year because I really thought that they were going to come out gangbusters and it basically unfolded on almost exactly like you said. So certainly I'm not taking the home review and I'm not

going to disagree with really anything that you're saying. I like a lot of what they've done here in the off season. I mean, Hooper was a little strange to me, you know, because you know, I know in Joko hasn't been great, but you know, Stefanski runs a lot of two tight ends sense to the to the extent that they keep in Joko. But I like adding you know, Jack Conklin and getting a solid backup like case Keenum, and they're gonna go. You saw that they're their offense

last year, and again it's gonna be a different system. So it's not gonna look exactly like that, but you know, they're they're keeping Kareem Hunt. I assume they've got a second round ten around them. I don't think anybody's gonna want to pay that. And you know they've got Andy Jenovitch, So they want to run the ball, right that that's sort of part of what they're going to be doing. Baker Mayfield's gonna work a lot better on play action passing.

So I find it hard and it's probably the optics, even though it shouldn't because it's an entirely new coaching staff and they still have talent to do the I'm gonna go they're going to improve three wins, right, that's well, that's just a lot in the NFL.

Speaker 2

Right.

Speaker 1

They were six and ten last year, so it's hard for me to go out there. But I really I can't really disagree with anything that you're saying in this one, especially again they've got a really really easy schedule and the travel. You're right, So for me, yeah, I'm not going to really argue with it. It's not bad the

one that I like a little better in this one. Again, maybe I just like the worst team in the division and the lowest over under, but I kind of like the Bengals over and again this is one where you'd have to go way over because it's they were two and fourteen last year and the over unders five, so you're expecting them to improve six wins. But this kind of offseason has been different than the usual Bengals offseason, right.

I mean, they've spent money, They've gone out there and they've they've really helped their defense with DJ Reader, Trey Wayns, McKenzie, Alexander and Von Bell. So they're going to be better against the run. And you know, Wayns and Alexander they weren't that great in twenty nineteen and they've lost you know, Darkez Dennard and Drake Kirkpatrick. But you know, I do think defensively they're going to be better and on offense, Look, they're gonna get aj Greenback and you have to assume

that they're gonna get Joe Burrow. It's possible they trade that pick, but everything I've seen sounds like they're gonna go for it. They sell a Dalton on the roster if not, but they're gonna get with Joe Burrow. And look, can you find six wins? You look at their schedule. They've got the Redskins, they've got the Jaguars, They've got the Dolphins, who are gonna be improved. But you know

that that's certainly a potential. They've got the Giants, you know, those are those are some games that they could easily win. Divisional games are always up in the air. Five wins is a pretty low total. I don't love it, and this division is my least favorite division in terms of

finding a pick that I really like. But I kind of can see and again this is me probably assuming that they go with Joe Burrow, but I could kind of see, you know, in in their second year under Taylor, the Bengals taking a leap and getting to more than five wins.

Speaker 2

Yeah, that one, that one's tough for me to get to simply because I want to see what the defense looks like. You know, we know the offense should be better. I mean, Burrow's gonna have Green, he's gonna have mix, and he's gonna have some guys that he can kind of work with a little. But what happens with this defense? I mean, can this defense get stops? And again, I always like to look I base a lot of this

on the six games within the division. The Browns obviously look very good and look capable of scoring a lot of points. Pittsburgh will get Ben Roethlisberger back whatever state he's in at this point in his career, and then there's Baltimore, who is probably just the best team in the AFC. And you know, unless you consider the Chiefs to be the best team in the AFC, they're kind

of one A and one B right there. Can the Bengals find wins outside of the division, because if they go zero to six in the division, which is very possible, then you're asking him to kind of get six wins out of their other ten games. That's a little bit difficult for me to kind of wrap my head around. But I will say this, I do think that you start building the foundation because Taylor, again by trade a quarterbacks kind of guy. You get him Burrow, you see

him provement in the second half of the season. Maybe next year is the bye year for a team like that. I will say, though, maybe this kind of works in with your thoughts on the Bengals. I'm not real high

on Pittsburgh this season, you know. I mean, I think that Pittsburgh is a team that is obviously still a very very well run organization, but there were questions all year long last year about Mike Tomlin and his job security and all that Ben Roethlisberger goes down gives them an easy excuse to, you know, just sort of keep things status quo and you know, wait and see what happens next year. But I'm not a real big fan of this Pittsburgh team. I don't know what we're going

to get from Ben. Obviously, it was going to be more difficult having Antonio Brown alongside Juju Smith Schuster, and we saw that with Smith Schuster, I mean it was it was tough for him to get open. It was tough for him to find a lot of room to work. Is Ben gonna be able to throw it in those windows? I don't know. I don't think so. Pittsburgh is a team that I'm just pretty sour on overall for this upcoming season. I was sour on them a little bit to a degree last year, and I did I don't

see them getting to nine and seven. I mean, obviously they went eight and eight and you would think, oh, upgrade Ben's back and this and that. I just think that the Browns passed them by, and maybe within a couple of years the Bengals do too.

Speaker 1

Yeah. I don't love the Steelers over nine at all. I don't really know what to make of them because they are basically the same team right, They've got a great offensive line, they've got a great defense. They once they brought in Minko Fitzpatrick, it was, you know, the defense really turned and they basically got to eight and eight with nothing at quarterback last year. So if Ben can do anything, you do kind of feel like they'll

be better. But I think the fact that they did get to eight and eight last year makes me just say, you know, no matter what, they're going to be a tough opponent, you know. So you can't look at even if Ben is terrible, you can't look at at that as a game that the Bengals can be like, oh great, well, when I agree, you look at their schedule, it's not

that forgiving. I mean, they do have an easy schedule, the whole NFC AFC North does, but there aren't that many games that you look at and can say, oh, wow, this is game the Bengals are definitely gonna win. But at the same time, I do just feel like this is going to be a team. I think their cultures and be better. I think if they get Burrow, I think they're going to be which I'm kind of banking on at this point that they're going to be well

improved offensively. So this is a team that I kind of like, I'm not overly bullish on, but I think I can see them getting a six months. Let's move on here.

Speaker 2

Let me ask you real quickly. Go ahead, because by and large, and I talked about this a lot when I wrote the MLB Betting Guide, which is now and large juiceless with the season, you know, being so shortened if it gets played at all. But one of the things I always talk about in that betting guide is that, as a general rule, I don't like to play really high or really low win totals because there's just not

a lot of margin for error. It's very hard to bet on the degree to which a team will be really good or the degree to which a team will be really bad. Is there any way you can take Baltimore under eleven or under eleven and a half, because I don't think I could. It would have to be over or nothing. Right.

Speaker 1

Yeah, and again they you want to talk about they have the easiest schedule in opponents winning percentage of four thirty eight, so it's really really difficult. I remember one of their quote unquote harder matchups is the Patriots, which is not going to be nearly as hard a matchup as it was last year for the reasons that we discussed. But in the end, yeah, no, I agree with you. I'm certainly not going under. I just I couldn't you look at what they've done this offseason. They're probably only

better right now on paper. Right they traded for Kalais Campbell and adding Derek Wolf and everything like that. It's really going to be tough. They've got to add an inside linebacker, they've got to bulk up the interior of their offensive line. But really they're basically just as good as last year. Is there a chance that the league can adjust to Lamar Jackson? I mean, is there a chance that was there a quote unquote blueprint that the Titans were able to put out there in the playoffs.

I don't really think so. But you know, it's hard with this type of offense that they run that you just feel like eventually a team's going to kind of figure out how to play them. But for me, no, I agree with you. I don't like it because eleven's way too big a number for me to really sit there, and there is a high or over under that I like the under which we'll talk about in a few minutes.

But for me, yeah, I agree. If I worried about on the Ravens right now, I would go over the eleven because it's just really difficult, especially with they've had a very good offseason, to see them really falling off too much. Let's go to the AFC South here, and this one's kind of all bunched up together. You've got the Titans at eight and a half, the Colts at eight and a half, the Texans at eight, and the Jaguars at five. So what do you think here?

Speaker 2

This one's tough. I mean, this one is really really tough, especially.

Speaker 1

One there's one I like only other than that, I really don't want any part of this.

Speaker 2

Division, especially because you know we've seen the adjustment to Houston and deservedly so. I mean, this is a team that you know want its division last year at ten and six with a negative point differential, and they trade it. As much as I love Deshaun Watson, they trade away their best offensive player in DeAndre Hopkins, and Will Fuller is never healthy. Brandon Cooks has always got the concussion background that you know you need to worry about. Maybe

David Johnson sort of has a career resurgence. I don't know, but it's unfortunate that Houston has already been adjusted down enough some places, even showing seven and a half out there now that you can't really take that one. I mean, were the Titans. Are the Titans going to be as good as they were in the second half of last year? Probably not. Do I still think that they're the team most likely to win this division? Yeah, I think so, so over eight and a half with Tennessee probably my

favorite play. But it also doesn't shock me if any of these three teams, you know, whatever order they finish one, two, three, not gonna surprise me at all. The only thing I think is for certain is that Jacksonville probably does finish in the basement here once again.

Speaker 1

Yeah, I mean, Jacksonville is coming as close to outright tanking as you possibly can be without seriously just saying, yes, we are trying to lose. But for me, the one I like actually is and there's no way I'm going anywhere near the Texans because I don't know what the psyche of that team has to be. Right now, where you have trades that you know, everybody who looks at is like, what is happening right now? How could you

possibly do that? And Bill O'Brien just like, yeah, this works for me, and I have total control, so I'm gonna do what I want for me. I kind of like the Colts at over eight and a half. So here's why I personally probably a little more I don't want to even use the word bullish, but a little more positive on Rivers and what he has left in the tank. I honestly think that last year was much more about him just getting the crap kicked out of him all the time. He was sacked thirty four times.

He was pressured thirty six percent of the time. Nobody likes pressure, no quarterback, especially someone who is basically a mobile like Rivers. He had a terrible offensive line. Now he's with the Colts, which is kind of the perfect spot because I have a great offensive line and they kept you know, Anthony Castanzo. That was a huge move. He's familiar with the sick with the system because of

Nick Soriani, and he's got enough pieces on offense. As long as Paris Campbell can stay healthy, Marlon Mack is still a quality back. I don't I don't love Marlon Mack, but he's a quote unquote quality back. He's good enough. They've got Nahima Hines for all the dump offs that Rivers likes to do. They are solid defensively. They let pier de siergo, but they added to Forrest Buckner. Not sure that he was worth a thirteenth pick, but certainly that's an addition for them. So, look, they can go

four and two in the division. I assume, you know, they can be Jacksonville twice. They'll probably split, let's say, with Tennessee and Houston. They get the Jets, the Raiders, the Bengals, the Lions, the Bears. It's not the easiest schedule overall, but they have a ton of winnable games.

I just I really like that team. I think the fact that they they you know, they wound up finishing seven to nine last year, but for a while they look like they were gonna possibly win that division with Jacoby Brissett, who is just not equality NFL quarterback in my personal opinion, And the fact that they had to do that while losing luck in the preseason. You know, I know they were kind of preparing for it, but they weren't exactly saying yes, we're gonna go in here

with Brissett. That was still kind of a big blow. And they're just so well coached, they've been put together. The bones of the team are really strong. So I think if Rivers has anything left, and personally I do. I know how bad he looked, but again he was just he was just getting blown up every single play there. The Chargers offensive line was terrible last year, so I think it's got a little more in the tank. You give him an offensive line, you give him a decent

team around him, and him a well coached team. I think that's a team that can get to nine wins.

Speaker 2

Yeah, I think that's fair. And again we see that with the Jews that's out there in the market ranging anywhere from you know, minus one twenty five on up and look Rivers to me again, feels like one of those guys that and he's probably earned this right being you know what is the almost forty now or over forty. He's earned this right of being comfortable, and like you said, last year, he was uncomfortable. He had the offensive line issues.

You know, he was very good for Ken wizen Hunt too for a while, and then wizen Hunt I don't know if the shine came off of him or if they just wanted to make a change or what. That's something that probably did impact Rivers negatively as well. You mentioned Sirianni and kind of the rapport that he has with him. Sirianni was the quarterbacks coach for the then San Diego Chargers, also a wide receivers coach. Rivers is

comfortable with Syrian. He would have to be, otherwise he wouldn't have, you know, said okay, I'll go to the Colts. So that helps. I think Frank Reich is an awesome head coach. I think that he's had a lot of hardship to deal with, in particular on the injury side as it pertains to the Colts, you know, with the couple years that he's been there. So I think he's a very very good fit. You know, to have a guy like Philip Rivers. They get a lot of third

and short situations. That's somewhere where Rivers can excel. If it's third and three, third and four, Rivers is fine. If it's third and eight, third and nine and the pass rushers are coming, it's a lot tougher for Philip Rivers. So I think schematically it fits. Personnel wise it fits. I completely agree with you on both of those counts. I need to see the defense. I don't even want

to say improve, but just stay healthy, man. I mean, you know, that's one of the things I failed to mention about the Browns is that they had three or four weeks in a row last year where there are four starters in the secondary were all out. And when Indianapolis is healthy and at something resembling full strength, they

are a very, very good football team. It's a two horse race between the Colts and the Titans for this division crown as far as I'm concerned, and I think you could make very strong, very compelling arguments for the over with both of them. And I think that we've kind of done that.

Speaker 1

Yeah, And I think that when we say it's two horse race, which I agree with, then you and I can have another podcast at the end of the season after the Texans miraculously go twelve and four, just bye a negative point differential, which they seem to be able to do. The one thing you pointed out, by the way,

which is true. I should have pointed that out. I mean, this is you know, it's pretty juice, right, I mean to take the over, it's minus one twenty five and it's plus one oh three to take the under, So I mean, I think that the over is the right side at this point. I think that you know, it wasn't like that. Frankly a week ago it was much closer. So I think it's moving that way, and I think that there's a reason.

Speaker 2

Well that's an important distinction for listeners too, is that you know, as a general rule, you know it's about I want to say it's about forty to fifty cents, was about a half win in the NFL marketplace. I apologize if I'm off by that, but I feel like I remember hearing that. So this is almost essentially like what over nine at. You know, maybe a little bit of a plus money price something like that. Would you

be willing to take that. If the answer is yes, then don't necessarily be afraid of that little bit of extra juice on the over eight and a half because you're kind of getting like a really cheap nine price. And if you're comfortable with doing that, you know, obviously it takes away the push on nine, then you know, by all means, go ahead and do it. If you feel strongly enough about it.

Speaker 1

Yeah, that's a great point. And again, you know, for the most part, with all of these, they're they're almost not all, but the vast majority of them are. The juice is minus one ten on the over or the under. Like the entire AFC West, which we're about to talk about, over and under is all one ten minus one ten all around. So this is one, you know where it's a little and some books. Look, I'm looking at one. I think it might be it's a FanDuel. So on

FanDuel you look at it. Over eight and a half is minus one, say, and under is plus one thirty five. So again that's another reason to shop around. But yeah, for this one in particular, there's really a big disparity between the over and the underwitch there aren't usually, and there aren't necessarily with the West, where everyone is at either over or under at minus one ten, and that's the chiefs at over under an eleven and a half. Everyone else in the division seven and a half, Broncos

Chargers Raiders all over under seven and a half. Everybody the juices minus one ten on either side. So how do you feel, do you like any of these.

Speaker 2

Well, you know again, I mean, we're talking about teams that, at least according to the win total odds are kind of interchangeable there with Denver, the Chargers, and the Raiders. And there's one that I disagree with, and that's the Chargers. I mean, I think that this is a team that you know, we just talked about it with Philip Rivers and how he has the mobility of an Easter Island statue. Tyrod Taylor does not. Tyrod Taylor can move around a

little bit. And while I really wanted Jameis Winston to land in LA with the Chargers, and who knows, maybe he's still could, Taylor's probably an upgrade just from the simple fact that he can move around the fact that

they can. Now I don't know if they're going to try to adopt something of a Lamar Jackson style offense with you know, the backs that they have in a mobile quarterback like Taylor, but they're not handicapped by the fact that Philip Rivers can't move They're not handicap by the fact that Philip Rivers won't QB sneak on third and one or fourth and one anymore. They've got a guy in Tyrod Taylor, who's going to be willing to move around, and I think that's going to help everything

about this offense. And look, this defense can be downright nasty as long as everybody's healthy. They obviously have the pass rush. You know, you got Linval Joseph in the middle defensively to kind of help them out with the run a little bit. Again, another team that needs to

stay healthy in the back seven. But if we're talking about ceiling, which by and large is what I try to look at with any win total market in any sport, I want to look at ceiling and I want to look at floor, and I think the floor for the Chargers probably is that six and ten, seven and nine range. I think their ceiling could be as high as ten

and six if everything falls into place for them. So because they've got a bigger gap between floor and ceiling than say the Broncos or the Raiders, the Chargers would have to be the one. I'd look at it over seven and a half.

Speaker 1

Yep, that is the one that I like here as well. And you know you brought up the good point first of all out of curiosity. Do you think they're going in with Tyrod Taylor or do you think they're going to be doing something else?

Speaker 2

Oh? Man, I mean, if if they were going to do Tyrod Taylor, wouldn't they have already gotten somebody else?

Speaker 1

Do you assume?

Speaker 2

But I mean, or do they do they draft someone?

Speaker 1

You know, I think they probably do draft someone, but I think it's much more of a long term pick. What are they six? I think they're the six pick in the draft. I think it's more of a long term option. So if they're if they take.

Speaker 2

Justin Herbert, does he start you know, like maybe week three, week four, something like that, or do they give Taylor all year?

Speaker 1

I mean, it could be sort of like they did with Taylor with the Browns right where he started out the season then they turned it over to Mayfield. So they certainly could do something like that. But I agree with you. By the way, this is the one pick that I like. And you know, remember we talked about the offensive line, and it's great to have Taylor who's able to get away from pressure. But they also upgraded

the offensive line right with Turner and Brian Blaga. So you know, I agree with you basically all the points that you made, and you know, you look at their schedule, They've got a ton of winnable games obviously, you know, the Raiders and the Broncos. I think you're looking like I do, is that you know, you can easily see them, you know, being the better team of all the seven and a half win teams.

Speaker 2

You've got the.

Speaker 1

Dolphins, the Jaguars, the Panthers, the Jets, depending on what the Patriots do, the Falcons, the Bengals. There are a lot of really winnable games that you look at on their schedule coming in. So that is a team that I don't know if I'm looking at an over under of one of them. That's really the one that I like the most. Again, you mentioned their defense, so it really is the key. There's one other that I like,

And I wonder what you think about this. How do you feel about the Chiefs over under of eleven and a half.

Speaker 2

Well, it's a big number. You know, you got over the hump last year you won the Super Bowl, so you know, obviously there's there's kind of some difficulty with that twelve and four last year with the Mahomes injury. You give them a lot of credit, you give them full marks for that. I just the relative strength of the division. I think everybody around them is a little bit better this year. You've kind of got that sign

on your back. Now we know what Mahomes just did last year, and I have a really hard time just looking at that team and going, yeah, they're gonna go twelve and four or better. Again, It's it's a big ask. Yeah.

Speaker 1

I mean, if I were to pick another bet in this division, it would be the under on the Chiefs over under eleven and a half. And it's hard to do that, and I don't know whether or not I would really have the inteslino fortitude to make that pick, just because betting against Patrick Mahomes even in a single game is just devastating, and I'd hate to do it over a full season. But look, I mean they've got to go You mentioned it, right. Their division is tougher.

I don't love the Broncos, I don't love the Raiders. I don't even love the Chargers, but you can easily see them going four and two. Let's say the Chiefs against the division, and then they've got to go two balls. They've got to go to Buffalo, and regardless of what you think of Buffalo, that is a very, very difficult place to play. They've got to go to New Orleans, they've got to go to Tampa Bay with Brady and

that team. They have a lot of difficult games on their schedule, and I know that Patrick Mahomes is capable of overcoming a lot of things that The defense played a lot better down the stretch, and they're pretty much intact offensively, you know, they've still got you know, they're going to go with Damian Williams again, they added DeAndre Washington. Offensively, they're pretty much intact. But you know, give it. That

is a huge number going on right now. The other thing that we didn't talk about necessarily is, you know, if the Ravens are as good as as sort of we expect this, There's only going to be one by this year, right So if the Ravens are, you know, going ahead and easily going to have that buy, the Chiefs may not have any need to push it down the stretch, you know what I mean. Like it could be something where you could see them saying if they don't have that buy necessarily, they could take their foot

off the gas. That could work the other way too. They could be going for the bye and trying to get there and so going full team all the way. But it is some situation where if the Ravens are ahead of them, the Ravens beat them head to head, and the Ravens have the tiebreaker and they're getting there. The Chiefs could you could see at the end of the season sort of take their foot off the gas and just rest a little bit to try to get healthy as they go into the postseason.

Speaker 2

You know, yeah, oh no, I absolutely agree. That's definitely a consideration you always want to think about, you know, the situations for teams. And obviously it's easier in a sport like baseball where you got the trade deadline and you know you kind of have an idea of where they may be. But you're right, Kansas City may not be pushing it as much late in the year because again, I mean, they played three extra games last year, so less turnaround time, less recovery time is assuming the season

starts on time of course, right. You know, so this is also a defense that bent a ton early on in the year. As you mentioned, they got a lot better down the stretch, but they also got to pad some numbers against an Oakland offense that wasn't great. They were okay. They weren't great. They weren't prolific by any means. The Patriots were way down Denver and the Bears. You know, the Chargers moved it on them. The Texans moved it on them in the play because they were kind of

playing that pre event defense type of thing. But I mean, again, this is a team that, you know, when they had to step up in class and face decent offensive offenses last year, the defense did struggle. They were a true case of being very very good at playing the bully, and I don't think they have as many bully opportunities this year.

Speaker 1

Yeah, no, I'm inclined to agree. Again, it's not something that I'm loving. There is one pick that I like in this division, and that is the Chargers. As we discuss remember by the way, I realized, I forgot to mention it. I forgot exactly what it came out to. But at some point somebody tweeted out what the Chargers record would have been if you just reversed every single score game. I don't know remember exactly what was. It was probably eleven and five or something like that of

something ridiculous. And again, that's just something that speaks to the strength of the team. The team, it's a very good team. Rivers played terribly and they had a terrible offensive line. Taylor's probably gonna make them better, and the better offensive line is really gonna move into that. So I think to improve three wins is not something that's going to be crazy for them to do.

Speaker 2

And real quickly. That's a really good point for all the listeners out there. Look for record in close games, because if you've got some outliers in that department, that's generally something that year over year kind of regresses to

the mean a little bit. A good way to start kind of narrowing your focus for some of these teams, the ones that were say four and one or five and zero or something like that in close games, like a Seattle Seahawks type team for example, maybe that's something that you know, you want to scale back a little bit, kind of gravitate towards the under or the over, as the case may be.

Speaker 1

Yeah, in terms of the Chiefs, yeah, I just it is something where I certainly wouldn't go with the over. I'm not I'm not going them to get twelve wins. And we talked about the extremes. But for me if I had to go anywhere, it would be something with the end. All right, that's gonna do it for today's show, Adam. It was really really great to be able to catch up and having you on again. Remind everybody where they can find more of you and your work.

Speaker 3

Please.

Speaker 2

Yeah, great to chat with you as well, but yeah, you can find me over at bangbook dot com, at Skating Tripods on Twitter. Still doing the Better's Box, my MLB betting podcast twice a week, ramping up our draft stuff over there with I mean, my god, the prop catalog for the draft this year is just insane. There's so much going on, as I know you guys are doing a lot over at Betting Pros for that as well. But just trying to stay busy, man, trying not to you know, fall too far down the hole here with

everything that's going on. But I really appreciate you having me on again, Dan, And you know, it's always great to chat no matter what sport it is with you.

Speaker 1

No, absolutely, And it's a shame we couldn't be talking about baseball at this time and leading into it, but you know, at least we do have the NFL and the Draft coming up. So thanks again for coming on.

Speaker 2

Absolutely man, thanks for having me all right.

Speaker 1

Don't forget to add over to bettingpros dot com to check out all the consensus lines, including our Draft day props and NFL futures. Thanks for listening, everybody. We'll be back later this week to discuss the over unders for the NFC win totals. I'll talk to you.

Speaker 3

Then, money the mo I thin that the fact that have not been as com

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