00:00:00 Ken
We think Dan has headed up to his limit with IPA's and how they are still king in 2023 with Sierra Nevada going hard into the world of IPA's when he talks about Tree House opening, a massive tap house with a golf course and what other type of venues we'd like to see a tap house or brewery in. And Kent talks about the reconsolidation of craft beer from the major players.
00:00:20 Ken
Like A, B and what smaller companies will pick up the pieces.
00:00:24 Intro
Whether your beer is in a bottle can or glass kick back and relax, it's better on draft.
00:00:40 Ken
Welcome everybody to the crappier news segment. Better on Draft 4, August 18th, 2023. My name is Ken.
00:00:48 Ken
Thank you so much for joining us.
00:00:49 Ken
We truly appreciate it.
00:00:51 Ken
Let's go around and see what everybody is drinking and starting with Dan.
00:00:54 Ken
Dan what?
00:00:55 Dan
Do you got? I have.
00:00:56 Dan
Got a Yuengling lager?
00:01:00 Ken
Wendy, what's what's on tap for you?
00:01:04 Ken
Wendy, you're muted.
00:01:07 Wendy
I really muted myself instead of unmuting.
00:01:10 Wendy
I am drinking an Alaskan Juno juice.
00:01:14 Ken
Just like our guests earlier this.
00:01:15 Ken
Week I too AM.
00:01:16 Ken
Drinking an Alaskan beer.
00:01:17 Ken
The Alaskan amber.
00:01:18 Ken
Alt style ale.
00:01:20 Ken
If you have listen to that episode, go back and listen to it with Jeff and Marcy.
00:01:24 Ken
Plenty to learn from.
00:01:25 Ken
From sustainability to brewing, being one of the first craft breweries in Alaska, the changes and trials that go on up there, it is a wonderful listen.
00:01:35 Ken
But we are talking about the craft beer news that is going on this week.
00:01:40 Ken
So what I'm going to do is I'm just going to pass it.
00:01:42 Ken
Right over to Dan.
00:01:44 Dan
Let's do it.
00:01:44 Ken
What is the the article you want to chat?
00:01:46 Dan
About today, so just as we talked about, I think.
00:01:49
It was 2.
00:01:49 Dan
Weeks ago, the last time we had a show.
00:01:51 Dan
That we are hoping some of these IPA phases would, or fads, would go away, and then all of a sudden, Sierra Nevada says they're doubling down on IPA's in 2024 and greatly expanding the selection.
00:02:05 Dan
Pretty straightforward article.
00:02:06 Dan
I'm not going to really go into and read it, but they're really expanding the hazy little things and making all kinds of variants to start.
00:02:13 Dan
Running out.
00:02:15 Dan
So when does this end?
00:02:16 Dan
Do you feel that this is just another brewery chasing a fad versus sticking with, or what?
00:02:21 Dan
Cause we talked to like you mentioned, Alaskan on.
00:02:24 Dan
The previous interview show.
00:02:25 Dan
And you know.
00:02:25 Dan
They stick to what they've been doing.
00:02:27 Dan
They're they're not chasing fads.
00:02:29 Dan
Yeah, they started at Sillery and it's doing well.
00:02:32 Dan
With the RTD's but you don't see them pumping out 19 variants of an IPA and chasing.
00:02:38 Dan
That newest trend?
00:02:40 Dan
Is this just another instance of a brew or a well established brewery chasing?
00:02:44 Dan
A fad and.
00:02:45 Dan
When do you guys think it's going to end or it's going to be too much and?
00:02:48 Dan
I'll start with you.
00:02:50 Ken
Yeah, I don't think it is going.
00:02:52 Ken
To end anytime soon.
00:02:54 Ken
If you guys are not listening or if you're listening via the podcast and not watching the video, go check out.
00:03:00 Ken
The video you can find that on all video platforms that's kick rumble, YouTube, Twitch, Facebook.
00:03:06 Dan
It's render, yeah, yeah.
00:03:06 Ken
Et cetera.
00:03:08 Ken
So you can see the the article that's going on right now and as you can see, it's kind of scrolling down, it's showing all.
00:03:13 Ken
The different types of brands that Sierra Nevada has been expanding to over the past, you know, a handful of years and within IPA, I think Sierra Nevada saw exactly what new Belgium did with regarding the massive amounts of Voodoo Ranger that's out there and how Voodoo Ranger basically took over their entire portfolio.
00:03:36 Ken
That's going to be.
00:03:36 Ken
The same with even bells here in Michigan, where we have now black hearted, 22 hearted, light hearted.
00:03:42 Dan
It seems to be the new trend with a.
00:03:45 Dan
Lot of these companies.
00:03:46 Ken
I think people want to be IPA curious but not IPA heavy and that's why they're going into all these subcategories of IPA's, which is why we hear things like Cold IPA or like I guess earlier today talked about like black IPA's like these are the types of beers that are going to sell because people bought them.
00:04:08 Ken
When I was.
00:04:10 Ken
At the Delta Lounge in Dallas last week, like that's what they had is they had an IPA there. They didn't have much of anything else other than Shiner, Bach, but even Shiner, they have their IPA brand that that they're just releasing. When we had Shiner on the show. So I mean, IPA's they talked about not Alcoholics too.
00:04:31 Ken
I think that's just, you know, we're still trending towards IPA's cause IPA's are still the the big dog. But Wendy, what do you think?
00:04:41 Wendy
I agree.
00:04:42 Wendy
I don't, I don't think.
00:04:43 Wendy
This is anything really new.
00:04:45 Wendy
I mean, even at local breweries, you see where they do a lot of variants of the of their beers that are most popular.
00:04:55 Wendy
I mean, look at Dragons.
00:04:57 Wendy
I remember a few years ago, Winter Beer Festival, we called it 50 Shades of Dragon smoke.
00:05:03 Wendy
Because they came with like every variant and it was an amazing beer festival.
00:05:09 Wendy
Don't get me wrong.
00:05:10 Wendy
I mean I I think it was amazing because.
00:05:12 Wendy
I don't remember a.
00:05:13 Wendy
Lot of it.
00:05:13 Wendy
It was 50 Shades of dragon.
00:05:15 Wendy
But I I just think this is kind of normal, but they're looking for a way to expand that their.
00:05:25 Wendy
Profile without creating something 100% new, we see it a lot. Look at AD side and all of their.
00:05:35 Wendy
Different versions of the same thing on a couple of.
00:05:38 Wendy
Different excuses they have.
00:05:42 Ken
Yeah, odd sides got the the **** *******, which is they're kind of like alternative.
00:05:46 Dan
Of course, you went to that.
00:05:48 Ken
I mean that's that's the beer that where they're they're adding all their adjuncts and having different ones and that's what people were drinking at the summer beer fest when.
00:05:55
I was pouring for them was the.
00:05:56 Wendy
The mosaic.
00:05:58 Wendy
Not great.
00:06:04 Ken
So that's that's obviously.
00:06:04 Wendy
Now, well, they've got the fruit sickles, and they've got the cheese tank juice.
00:06:06 Ken
They got the fruits apples.
00:06:07 Ken
They also have the the.
00:06:10 Ken
Yep, dake juice.
00:06:11 Ken
The spirit lists cocktails that they just launched.
00:06:15 Ken
So yeah, they're outside, is obviously its own beast.
00:06:18 Ken
I think outside is kind of what we treated shorts as maybe 10 years ago with all the options that shorts used to bring into the market.
00:06:29 Ken
But I think that.
00:06:31 Ken
These breweries, I mean.
00:06:33 Ken
I I understand where dance coming from.
00:06:35 Ken
Where just.
00:06:35 Ken
Seems too much like decision overload.
00:06:39
Well, it's, it's.
00:06:40 Dan
Funny too, because here in Nevada makes you know one of the biggest pales out there, you know, in the country if.
00:06:45 Dan
Not the world.
00:06:46 Dan
But they don't experiment with that and make different variants.
00:06:49 Dan
They go on to this IPA craze because you.
00:06:53 Dan
Just to try and stand out, it's like you.
00:06:54 Dan
Already have a.
00:06:55 Dan
You could do this with it.
00:06:56 Dan
But you don't.
00:06:57 Dan
It's just kind of.
00:06:57 Dan
It's a little frustrating to see, I think.
00:07:00 Ken
As much as we understand Sierra.
00:07:02 Ken
Nevada as a whole, as a buyer, nobody asks.
00:07:05 Ken
What's your pale ale?
00:07:06 Ken
They ask what your IPA is.
00:07:08 Ken
That's fair.
00:07:09 Ken
And I think that is a little bit of marketing whether they utilize like Sierra Nevada pale as the base and do other things with it and.
00:07:19 Ken
Just call it an IPA.
00:07:22 Ken
You know, because.
00:07:23
The rules don't.
00:07:24 Ken
Matter and the points are.
00:07:25 Dan
Made-up.
00:07:28 Ken
But that's I I think that's why they would not do regular Sierra Nevada cause I mean Voodoo Ranger, if I'm not mistaken, was just your regular new Belgium IPA, but now it's literally everything.
00:07:42 Ken
They're hazy, voodoo Ranger there.
00:07:44 Ken
It's the same with the hearted series.
00:07:46 Ken
Hazy hearted 2 hearted.
00:07:48 Ken
Double hearted, black hearted like those places.
00:07:52 Ken
Had an IPA to branch off of whereas Sierra Nevada.
00:07:56 Ken
Didn't they just had a regular pale?
00:08:00 Ken
And and again I think.
00:08:01 Ken
It's just a a marketing thing, but I mean.
00:08:03 Ken
Do you think that?
00:08:05 Ken
I don't want to say jump the shark cause I think we've probably been saying this for.
00:08:08 Ken
20 years especially.
00:08:08 Dan
We've been saying.
00:08:09 Ken
It forever. When we started the show during the the 85 Crooked Tree days. Like do you think do you disagree with their thoughts of going all in on these beers or do?
00:08:17
OK.
00:08:23 Ken
You think that what? What?
00:08:24 Ken
Do you think would be better for them?
00:08:26 Dan
I I personally think it.
00:08:27 Dan
It is because I think IP's.
00:08:29 Dan
Played out.
00:08:30 Dan
You know, you feel similar to the way I do about them.
00:08:33 Dan
But you know, they have things like narwhal.
00:08:36 Dan
There's another dark beer there is they made, I think Bigfoot.
00:08:40 Dan
Yeah, things like that.
00:08:41 Dan
Like expand on that. You remember the line for people getting marvel at GBF last year. You know, people want that stuff too. We don't need 85 variants of hazy little things, you know, save that for dark Horse.
00:08:54 Dan
You know, I think different.
00:08:56 Ken
I think GBF is its own.
00:08:58 Ken
Beast, like I really don't.
00:09:00 Ken
Think you could consider the the?
00:09:01 Dan
Can't can't judge it based on.
00:09:03 Ken
No, cause it's basically beer geeks.
00:09:08 Ken
And like like.
00:09:09 Ken
Just trashy beer nerds who are on untapped the entire time, checking in their one ounce pores and giving them two paragraph review.
00:09:15 Dan
That's true.
00:09:18 Ken
You've got, you've.
00:09:19 Ken
Got the people who are there to party like?
00:09:21 Ken
We saw, I saw a handful of, like, Bachelorette, bachelor, birthday parties that were running around.
00:09:28 Ken
But like you go and.
00:09:30 Ken
You get narwhal because it's your opportunity to get narwhal where you don't have to chase a truck, or you don't have to gamble and hope that Jack over at the tuna liquor in Rochester Hills, just South of that 59 on Rochester Rd. has a bottle. That's what utopia. I don't even bother getting utopia, but the opportunity to get Utopia and.
00:09:49 Ken
Yeah. Yeah, sure. I'm.
00:09:50 Ken
Gonna try it, but am I going to?
00:09:50 Dan
Of course you.
00:09:51 Dan
Never buy a bottle of that.
00:09:53 Ken
Am I going to buy Utopia and all the utopia alternatives like worldwide Utopia stout and stuff like?
00:09:59 Dan
I do have a bottle of that.
00:10:02 Ken
But that's that's The thing is, is that there's there's certain styles that are people are going to run to when the opportunity is there, like media Noche over at Weld works.
00:10:14 Ken
Yes, well, works the line for media. Noche was crazy. But when you go into, well, works, it's like thick milkshake IPA's like.
00:10:24 Ken
That's just what they sell.
00:10:27 Ken
So I think I think Sierra Nevada just doesn't have an IPA they could truly tie their name to to really do the IPA.
00:10:33 Ken
Game, but again that was also before hazy the little things, the little Things series really kind of exploded.
00:10:42 Ken
I wish we had because I know we talked about the the portfolio like a month, month and a half ago and we talked about like percentages of their portfolio for hazy.
00:10:53 Ken
Little things but.
00:10:55 Ken
Yeah, I think.
00:10:55 Ken
This is this is just where we're going to to be in a world where people are.
00:11:01 Ken
Going to still want their IPA's.
00:11:04 Dan
Yep, fair enough.
00:11:06 Ken
You know, not not too many people like us.
00:11:09 Ken
Go into a bar and be like what's your your English mild or what's your?
00:11:15 Dan
What's your ESB?
00:11:16 Ken
Yeah, and and I.
00:11:17 Ken
I was I I toured around Dallas a.
00:11:19 Ken
Little bit and.
00:11:19 Ken
I found plenty of, you know.
00:11:21 Ken
Mind you, each site only had maybe one option.
00:11:25 Ken
But you know, what was your brown?
00:11:27 Ken
What was your amber?
00:11:27 Ken
What was your ESB?
00:11:30 Ken
Because everything else like Martin house.
00:11:32 Ken
Oh my God.
00:11:34 Ken
The amount of seltzers they have, they they had a mustard beer too, by the way.
00:11:37 Dan
Or did you drink it?
00:11:37 Ken
Like actual.
00:11:39 Ken
I tried it.
00:11:41 Ken
It was it.
00:11:41 Dan
Should you throw up?
00:11:43 Ken
I'm glad that the guy did not sell me a a taster.
00:11:49 Ken
And he just gave me a little bit to try, but that thing he says it it it sells awesome and hot summer days and people love it for like when they're mowing lawn and stuff and pairing it.
00:12:02 Ken
With a hot dog so.
00:12:03 Dan
I can see that with a cucumber beer.
00:12:06 Dan
Or a cucumber seltzer, mustard.
00:12:09 Ken
It was tart. It would.
00:12:11 Ken
It I am glad it was the last thing I had there and I'm glad we had like another 30 minute drive before the next brewery.
00:12:17 Ken
So, Betts McGee and the Chad saying he wants his IPA, two in our chat saying that if Sierra Nevada made all of Olivia Quad.
00:12:29 Ken
With plums.
00:12:30 Ken
Again, I think we talked about that on our show that on our.
00:12:32
I think we did too.
00:12:33 Ken
Show, yeah.
00:12:35 Ken
But anything else you want to touch on?
00:12:38 Dan
On this article, no, we can move on.
00:12:38 Wendy
Because I can't get that.
00:12:44 Wendy
I'm good and I think we've covered it all. I do think, though, that people are, so people want the mix packs of the IPA's right now and I like mixed mixed packs just because it means I.
00:12:56 Wendy
Don't have to.
00:12:57 Wendy
By so many of the same thing.
00:13:00 Wendy
So it gives me a little variety.
00:13:04 Wendy
I don't I like the hazy little thing series.
00:13:08 Ken
Yeah, hazy little.
00:13:09 Ken
I mean, Dan, I think you like that.
00:13:10 Ken
Series too, when they shipped.
00:13:11 Dan
It wasn't terrible.
00:13:11 Ken
It out to you.
00:13:12 Ken
It wasn't.
00:13:13 Ken
It wasn't overly.
00:13:13 Dan
Not at all.
00:13:14 Ken
Bitter and it it didn't taste of like spruce and pine and stuff.
00:13:21 Ken
So no, it didn't.
00:13:23 Dan
I wouldn't, it's.
00:13:23 Dan
Not something to.
00:13:24 Dan
Go by, but as far as an IPA it was it was palatable as far as I thought.
00:13:30
Well, Wendy.
00:13:31 Wendy
I actually went looking for an Alaskan.
00:13:31 Ken
You're going off.
00:13:34 Wendy
Mix pack here.
00:13:35 Wendy
Recently so.
00:13:36 Ken
I I bought the last one at Kroger today.
00:13:40 Dan
That's why you couldn't find one, Wendy.
00:13:43 Wendy
No, I had to go to three different stores to get the what I actually wanted.
00:13:47 Wendy
But cause you can get Amber anywhere, but you can't always get all the other stuff anyways.
00:13:52 Wendy
Do we want to move on?
00:13:53 Wendy
To my article now.
00:13:55 Ken
What do you want to?
00:13:55 Wendy
Or are we talking my ears?
00:13:55 Ken
Talk about today.
00:13:59 Wendy
So my article I found in cough digest of all places don't ask me how it looks like tree house was looking to expand their operation and during COVID found a.
00:14:17 Wendy
Country Club.
00:14:19 Wendy
That had shut down.
00:14:21 Wendy
And they opened it up here a few months ago.
00:14:26 Wendy
Back in June.
00:14:26 Wendy
They opened it during the US Open, the US Open.
00:14:33 Wendy
In June, they posted photos celebrating the opening of the clubhouse in Tewksbury, about 1/2 an hour north of Boston.
00:14:41 Wendy
They've got a wood panel, tap room, a pro shop, a putting green with the treehouse flagstick and of course, lots and lots of beer. I think they said there was something like 78 taps, but they turned.
00:14:53 Wendy
But here, recently in August, they actually opened up where they had a nine hole golf course.
00:14:59 Wendy
And I I've always said that, you know, if you can have something to go along with the brewery, I think a lot of people will come in.
00:15:07 Wendy
I know there's that place in Texas that we interviewed.
00:15:12 Wendy
Was it Texas where they had the?
00:15:14 Wendy
Disc golf course.
00:15:16 Ken
Live Oak, yeah.
00:15:18 Wendy
And then I have a friend who really thinks that somebody needs to pair a laundromat and a brewery because those two things kind of, I think they could make a lot of money off.
00:15:31 Dan
Forget about your laundry at some point.
00:15:34 Wendy
So I'm just curious like what would you guys go to this golf course because it's treehouse?
00:15:41 Wendy
I don't know.
00:15:41 Ken
I would.
00:15:43 Ken
If I wanted the opportunity to see friends and they're golfers and I.
00:15:47 Ken
Don't care about golf.
00:15:48 Ken
Like, I'll be like, hey, we could go here and I'll be your caddy because I know I'm gonna get, you know, amazing beer.
00:15:54 Ken
And like, that's probably what I would get up to, but I wouldn't necessarily go here.
00:16:04 Ken
To to play golf and Drake like I I think it would be more secondary or an opportunity to be like hey, you know when your your friends obviously they want to get especially in Michigan or Boston they got their tee times.
00:16:18 Ken
So they want to.
00:16:18 Ken
Make sure they get on.
00:16:19 Ken
The links for me, I just want to make sure I get in a few.
00:16:22 Ken
So I'll just be like, I'll go drink with y'all, but when the the choices are go join them and it's probably all like standard macro lager.
00:16:33 Ken
And then the few summer beers like Oberon or Shock Top or something like that.
00:16:37 Ken
Like, I just don't want.
00:16:38 Ken
To spend the time.
00:16:43 Ken
Not saying I'd go for the Treehouse beer, but I don't golf exactly.
00:16:47 Dan
Yeah, I'm probably one of the worst golfers in the world, and especially if they had, but I'd go and do like you do, Ken, and just be their caddy, especially if you got people driving on golf carts bringing you beer to buy.
00:16:58 Dan
You know, like you have a lot of golf courses.
00:17:01 Dan
I would totally be down for that, but.
00:17:03 Dan
Like I could I know a lot of people drink on the golf course, so I guess everyone will be playing ******, but yeah, I guess if you're in the.
00:17:10 Dan
Golf, though. It's really cool.
00:17:12 Wendy
Everyone I know.
00:17:12 Wendy
Drinks and everyone I know.
00:17:14 Dan
Yeah, that's what I said, like I.
00:17:15 Wendy
Drink goes.
00:17:15 Wendy
That's part of the reason they golf, let's be honest.
00:17:15 Dan
I can't think anyone who does it.
00:17:19 Ken
I they all drink, but I think they also want to all day drink, whereas these beers especially like free house like I would hope they get a little bit more sessionable with their 78 taps that they have a little bit more you know 4 to 6% ABV beers because I can only imagine if you, you know knocked out three cans of Julius while playing nine holes, you're probably going to be.
00:17:31 Wendy
Right.
00:17:43 Dan
Probably not finishing the nine holes.
00:17:44 Ken
You're just. No, not.
00:17:45 Wendy
At all.
00:17:48 Wendy
So even though we don't golf, what is the one pairing you think would work out that would make you want to go to visit a brewery?
00:17:58 Dan
I got what they came right to my head.
00:17:58 Ken
Like a.
00:18:00 Dan
Sorry, Ken.
00:18:01 Dan
And you could never do it.
00:18:02 Dan
No place in the world will allow it.
00:18:04 Dan
But beer in a shooting.
00:18:05 Dan
Range. Ohh geez.
00:18:10 Wendy
Yeah, I don't see that being.
00:18:11 Wendy
A good idea?
00:18:13 Dan
But that would get me there.
00:18:14 Wendy
I'm just saying.
00:18:17 Ken
I mean, you could probably pull it off.
00:18:19 Ken
For like after.
00:18:19 Ken
The fact and just be like.
00:18:21 Ken
You know, hey, you can go shooting and then once you enter here, you're no longer allowed back in the shooting range.
00:18:27 Ken
So if you're like, hey, let's go shooting and then go have a beer or two that.
00:18:31 Ken
Might not be a.
00:18:33 Ken
A bad secondary.
00:18:35 Dan
That could work, but I don't.
00:18:37 Dan
I don't know anyone like any state that would allow you to sell beer at a shooting range in any capacity.
00:18:43 Ken
Yeah, for sure like.
00:18:44 Ken
I mean.
00:18:44 Ken
We're talking legalities and stuff here like.
00:18:48 Ken
Like for me?
00:18:48 Wendy
I mean, in a perfect world.
00:18:50 Dan
In a perfect world, you.
00:18:51 Dan
Could just take a can.
00:18:52 Dan
Of beer in there with you.
00:18:55 Ken
Uh, yeah.
00:18:56 Ken
Like for me like.
00:18:57 Ken
I would we've talked about.
00:18:58 Ken
This before and I remember Nick was kind of like shocked when I said this, but I would love some type of a beer or bar in a a hospital.
00:19:08 Dan
Yeah, you could totally use that there too.
00:19:08 Ken
There there is some places where you just you're there for so long because you're, you know, loved one is in surgery or you just wanna be able to, you know, cause you're there and you're waiting like you know, get something instead of whatever is in the the vending machine.
00:19:27 Ken
Like you could easily do like a.
00:19:29 Ken
And the the rules for these hospitals are crazy with regards to what you could sell food and drink wise already.
00:19:37 Ken
For example at U of M health systems like you cannot sell regular coke.
00:19:42 Ken
Or any regular soda like it has to be all diet or 0 sugar.
00:19:46 Dan
Ohh I I don't get it.
00:19:46 Ken
Yeah there's.
00:19:49 Ken
I I don't know the why, I just know one of the the people that owned a bunch of of the delis inside U of M hospital systems and the rules that they had to follow for a lot of the things.
00:20:01 Ken
So obviously there's no way you're going to be.
00:20:02 Ken
Able to get alcohol if you can't.
00:20:04 Ken
Sell regular coke.
00:20:08 Ken
But for me, honest to God, I there's.
00:20:11 Ken
A place that.
00:20:12 Ken
Opened up in Grand Rapids that does duck pin bowling, but I would love some type of multi lane bowling alley that does the handful of different bowling in the state in the US.
00:20:27 Ken
So there's duck pin candle pin.
00:20:29 Ken
You could do 5 pin cause all the lanes are nearly the same size length wise, so you could get in there and easily install different types of lanes or what.
00:20:40 Ken
What did we learn?
00:20:41 Ken
9 pin or something like that over in Texas?
00:20:42 Dan
9 pin yeah 9 pin.
00:20:47 Ken
So there are a.
00:20:49 Wendy
Wait, you're telling me there's different types of bowling?
00:20:55 Ken
So 5 pin is a massive Canadian type of bullying where it's a a lot smaller ball, almost like a bocci ball.
00:21:06 Ken
Same with candle.
00:21:06 Ken
Pin and but instead of the the pins being like pin shaped, they're just like a tall candle.
00:21:13 Dan
And you just leave them laying.
00:21:14 Dan
There too, don't you after you roll.
00:21:16 Dan
I thought so.
00:21:16 Ken
Yep, duck pin is another small ball bowling alley bowling type all.
00:21:23 Ken
So like in Michigan, we have 1 duckpin lane and no No 5 PIN lanes that I know.
00:21:30 Dan
About there's a duckpin lane on Mackinac Island.
00:21:33 Ken
Too. Ohh, is it really?
00:21:36 Dan
So in one of the hotels.
00:21:37 Wendy
What is fascinating?
00:21:39 Ken
This is bowling time with.
00:21:41 Ken
Yeah, with Ken.
00:21:42 Dan
Bowling time.
00:21:45 Wendy
Feel like I feel like we could do a tic TAC series on this, Ken.
00:21:48 Dan
On bowling.
00:21:49 Wendy
Just saying the different types of bowling lanes.
00:21:50 Dan
I mean, Ted had a great shot he took.
00:21:51 Dan
The other day.
00:21:54 Wendy
That are available or that.
00:21:57 Wendy
You think should be cleared with the brewery.
00:21:57 Dan
There, there.
00:21:59 Ken
The the issue is and I'm not going to lie, I did look to see if there's any bowling alleys for sale recently.
00:22:05 Ken
Not because of this conversation, but other conversations.
00:22:07 Ken
And sadly, only like.
00:22:09 Ken
Friends of Ross Common is for.
00:22:10 Ken
Sale, which would be a great buy, but then?
00:22:12 Ken
You'd have to move to Roscommon.
00:22:15 Dan
Turn it into A5 pin lane.
00:22:15 Ken
UM.
00:22:16 Dan
Be like, let's go. Yeah.
00:22:18 Ken
You'd probably **** *** more people than.
00:22:19 Ken
Anything doing that too?
00:22:24 Ken
It says we have a small.
00:22:25 Ken
Pin Bowling alley in.
00:22:26 Ken
Yeah, there's there's a handful of different.
00:22:28 Ken
Bowling alleys that I think would.
00:22:32 Ken
Do like duck pins doing great in Grand Rapids.
00:22:35
Is it?
00:22:36 Dan
Ohh yeah surprise it's.
00:22:37 Dan
You're all a smaller ball with that too.
00:22:40 Ken
And you don't need, like, I I don't think you.
00:22:42 Ken
Need equipment or?
00:22:43 Ken
Anything like that?
00:22:44 Ken
I don't know if you need bowling shoes.
00:22:45 Ken
But yeah, it's and and they're charging like $30.00 or $35.00 an hour for a.
00:22:51 Ken
Lane, right?
00:22:51 Dan
OK.
00:22:53 Ken
And people are paying it. But if you could tie in there used to be a alley 59 over in Clinton Township used to be a massive craft beer bar and bowling alley. And then there was another one up in like Lapierre that was an.
00:23:06 Ken
Awesome bowling alley and craft beer bar.
00:23:09 Ken
But if you could turn it into like a brewery where you not only you get the brewery destination, it had to be probably.
00:23:15 Ken
A brew pub.
00:23:17 Ken
A brewery destination with bowling alley, that'd be great.
00:23:20 Dan
So like, do you have something like that out here? And if you come out for the Red Wings game state 48 in Glendale, it also has a bowling alley.
00:23:29 Dan
So it's a pretty cool place that a lot.
00:23:31 Dan
Of people go to.
00:23:33 Ken
Yeah, I mean I get 2 checked bags and I can.
00:23:35 Ken
Fit 3 balls in a.
00:23:37 Ken
I'll check bag, that's for sure.
00:23:43 Ken
The fun thing is axe throwing next to.
00:23:46 Ken
A brewery that serves while.
00:23:47 Ken
You're working out your inner Viking.
00:23:50 Ken
A toot says.
00:23:52 Wendy
I went to a when I was in Greenville, in Taylors, there's a brewery that right across the way, like, right across the parking lot, is an axe drawing.
00:24:02 Wendy
And I did that when I was there we.
00:24:03 Wendy
Actually, they didn't sell beer at the X ring.
00:24:07 Wendy
We brought it from the brewery over to drink while we're X ring.
00:24:12 Ken
Yeah, big Buck obviously in Auburn Hills is now an axe throwing place and football bowling following.
00:24:21 Ken
Yeah, it's the urban bowling, that's what it's.
00:24:24 Ken
Called cause you.
00:24:24 Ken
Can't call it falling if it's not a folling facility.
00:24:28 Ken
That's that's trademark, which is good on them because.
00:24:32 Ken
If you can do that.
00:24:33 Ken
That's what you get for loading up before an 01/16 lion season. You create a game because that's the only entertainment you got.
00:24:42 Ken
What about you, Wendy? I.
00:24:43 Ken
Mean we talked about all the different places.
00:24:44 Ken
We'd love.
00:24:45 Ken
To open or go to.
00:24:45 Wendy
I don't know if I would pick.
00:24:46 Wendy
Any I don't know if I would pick any games.
00:24:51 Wendy
Mainly because I do love board games, but that's at every brewery anyways.
00:24:56 Wendy
I think I would probably like a brewery in a bookstore.
00:25:01 Wendy
So while I'm cruising books and trying to figure out what I'm going to spend my money on, I can have a beer too.
00:25:09 Wendy
I probably spend a lot more money in the bookstore if they let me drink beer while I was looking.
00:25:13 Wendy
I'm not gonna lie.
00:25:15 Ken
In Fort Collins, so as much as you say board games, there's like brewery board games and then there's board board games like your Dungeons and Dragons, warhammer, et cetera.
00:25:26 Ken
There is a place in Fort Collins that was a bar and board game place and they had like people signing up to do D and D1 shots and when we went there it was.
00:25:35 Ken
So wow.
00:25:38 Wendy
So I've never.
00:25:38 Ken
I mean, that's.
00:25:39
OK.
00:25:40 Wendy
I've never played D&D, but there is this really fun game called Rainbow Pirates.
00:25:46
OK.
00:25:46 Wendy
That I'm highly addicted to.
00:25:48 Wendy
I think we should have more available more often, so rainbow pirates, everyone looked that.
00:25:48 Dan
Ohh boy.
00:25:54 Wendy
Up it's fun.
00:25:58
Well, I.
00:26:00 Ken
As we go.
00:26:02 Ken
Rainbow pirates.
00:26:04 Ken
I I got nothing else to segue off of that.
00:26:06 Ken
So we're.
00:26:06 Ken
Just going to go in.
00:26:09 Ken
So the the business Tilray, which is a Canadian cannabis organization, has been on the assault buying different beverage organizations from the big breweries.
00:26:24 Ken
So if you actually look at.
00:26:29 Ken
What they bought, I believe it was just a.
00:26:30 Ken
Few weeks ago, as I'm.
00:26:32 Ken
Bringing it up on the screen right now.
00:26:33 Ken
Of course you can watch it live as well as on demand on youtube.com/better on draft.
00:26:41 Ken
This right here talked about all the brands that Tilray is purchasing from Anheuser-Busch, including shock top, Breckenridge, Blue Point, 10 Barrel, Red Hook, Widmer Square Mile and High Ball energy along.
00:26:57 Ken
With this so.
00:26:58 Ken
This came out roughly 2 weeks ago, week and 1/2.
00:27:01 Ken
Still, till Ray actually went through and purchased something from Molson Coors as well, which is the trust beverage organization, which is a cannabis infused drink maker maker that Molson.
00:27:16 Ken
Said as we were starting the podcast, obviously a lot of breweries were being purchased by these big name breweries, so I guess my question to you guys is, is that, is this a sign of the times where we might start seeing these major organizations?
00:27:37 Ken
UM.
00:27:38 Ken
Start selling off the craft breweries to stick to their domestic and alternatives that they currently sell.
00:27:47 Ken
Like will we see a a sale of Goose Island anytime soon, or a lesion or wicked weed?
00:27:55 Ken
Or do you?
00:27:55 Ken
Think these are all still on a different level?
00:27:58 Ken
Then other breweries and I will start with Wendy.
00:28:05 Wendy
I think some of them are still on.
00:28:07 Wendy
A different level.
00:28:10 Wendy
But yeah, I do see that they're they're going to have to start selling some of these off.
00:28:18 Wendy
Because their shares are dropping.
00:28:24 Wendy
Like their, their main brands aren't as popular as they were, especially with a lot of people going over to Seltzers and.
00:28:32 Wendy
At RTDS.
00:28:34 Wendy
So I think they have to figure out a way to get rid of some of the stuff that.
00:28:40 Wendy
They were trying to diversify with, but wasn't necessarily the best option.
00:28:45 Wendy
For them.
00:28:48 Ken
I I agree.
00:28:50 Ken
With you, I think the the fact that all of these alternative beverages including spiritless cocktails cocktails themselves like RTD's, seltzers, et cetera, like that's where a lot of the business is going. But you could only own so much capital.
00:29:08 Ken
To where you may need to sell old.
00:29:10 Ken
Capital, is this going to allow us to see a lot more conglomerates like Canary or what the CBA?
00:29:18 Ken
Used to be.
00:29:21 Dan
So, you know, I'm looking at these that are being sold.
00:29:24 Dan
I'm not surprised Anheuser-Busch is selling off a bunch.
00:29:27 Dan
But like, look, looking at these brands.
00:29:29 Dan
Can anyone here name?
00:29:31 Dan
Beer outside the ESB that Red Hook makes.
00:29:35 Dan
I bet you probably can't.
00:29:36 Dan
I can't.
00:29:37 Dan
So you know, they're selling off what seems like low.
00:29:43 Dan
Low producing or just low, you know performance as far as fears go, as far as sales go because you know the only other one I know here, yeah, everyone knows shock top, but 10 barrels, the only other one I even know on this list outside the ESP for Red Hook for their ESB.
00:30:01 Dan
I think they're jumping off, just underperforming and this company picking them up is hoping they're gonna do better.
00:30:10 Ken
I think if they.
00:30:11 Ken
Put in a decent amount of effort to rebrand the brand like Shock Top needs a rebrand that, like Widmer Brothers, they're I think they're happy as one of like the the more well known beers out there.
00:30:27 Ken
I swear there is a beer.
00:30:29 Ken
From blue Point that we have that that I've enjoyed and I just don't remember it because I remember blue point back before like the craft.
00:30:38 Dan
Beer boom here in.
00:30:39 Ken
Again, that was one of the beers that.
00:30:41 Ken
Was always on the.
00:30:42 Ken
Shelves here and the the craft area like going to 8 degrees.
00:30:46 Ken
Ferndale that long ago.
00:30:50 Ken
So you think that, well, let's let's on this document there is the the handful that Anheuser-Busch still owns, including Golden Rd.
00:31:00 Ken
Lesion, Goose Island, Carback, four Peaks, wicked.
00:31:03 Ken
Weed and devil's.
00:31:07 Ken
I mean here in Michigan, at least if.
00:31:08 Ken
It's not Goose Island.
00:31:10 Ken
There really isn't much that I really.
00:31:13 Ken
Know about other than like you know I.
00:31:14 Ken
Know about the the handful of beers that.
00:31:17 Ken
Elysian, Golden Peak and four Golden Road, four peaks and.
00:31:20 Ken
Wicked Weed made.
00:31:21 Dan
But yeah, everything else. Four peaks is local to Arizona. You don't see it outside the state golden Rd's pretty much just the southwest, like Nevada, Southern California and Arizona. I think a lot of these are just.
00:31:36 Dan
Regional and you know, four peaks are examples of biggest Brewer in Arizona.
00:31:39 Dan
They'll probably never get rid of that.
00:31:41 Dan
You see how much Golden Road and Goose Island makes so.
00:31:44 Dan
It's. I don't think they're.
00:31:45 Dan
Going to get rid of.
00:31:46 Dan
Those it doesn't show the numbers of what these breweries are letting go of make, which is too bad to see the.
00:31:53 Ken
I believe they did a combined.
00:31:56 Ken
Number which is 490.
00:31:57 Ken
5K in 2020 in all of them.
00:32:00 Ken
I it it?
00:32:02 Ken
Says shock top Breckenridge, 10 barrel and blue Point.
00:32:06 Ken
So it does not include Widmer Red Hook, Square, mile and highball.
00:32:10 Dan
And just those those.
00:32:11 Dan
Few did 495, which is what Goose Island did on their own.
00:32:16 Ken
Yes, yes, that is correct.
00:32:17 Ken
Those four did a goose island.
00:32:23 Dan
So I think they're just getting rid of some of the underperformers, though.
00:32:27 Dan
You look at Devil's Backbone, I don't know anything they do or platform.
00:32:32 Dan
Ohh, they.
00:32:34 Dan
Ceased operations, apparently.
00:32:38 Dan
I'm not sure what's going on there, but yeah, those are look like they're under perform.
00:32:41 Dan
I'm surprised.
00:32:42 Dan
I held on to those too.
00:32:46 Ken
Yeah, omission, I think is their gluten free brewery.
00:32:52 Ken
I feel like that's like a Trader Joe's beer that I see out there like.
00:32:59 Ken
But yeah, along with Tilray starting their partnership with Molson Coors too, buying the the Trust beverage, which is cannabis, I I feel like a lot of these.
00:33:14 Ken
Acquisitions and breweries that have kind of maybe spread themselves a little too thin are going to start selling and creating space for what's currently hot, as opposed to brewing what's currently hot at.
00:33:30 Ken
Those breweries?
00:33:33 Ken
So I I mean, I could see Goose Island easily selling here just because like if they don't.
00:33:38 Dan
Kings and convicts will be coming up soon.
00:33:41 Ken
Ohh **** yeah.
00:33:42 Ken
I mean kings and convicts is.
00:33:44 Ken
Apparently got money.
00:33:49 Ken
The same with Wicked Weed, I mean.
00:33:50 Ken
Wicked Weed is that huge South.
00:33:52 Ken
East area over in.
00:33:53 Ken
Asheville, NC.
00:33:54 Ken
Like I think the people of Wicked weed, if they could figure out someone to buy that organization, they would try to get it sold in a heartbeat.
00:34:05 Ken
Because I I just don't think any of these brands took off like they tried to get these brands to outsell some of the bigger breweries.
00:34:15 Ken
But in turn, like Sierra Nevada still on the top, youngling still on the top.
00:34:21 Ken
Sam Adams saw on the top, obviously.
00:34:23 Ken
The number one.
00:34:24 Ken
Craft Brewery in the US, Paps Brewing is still on top.
00:34:31 Ken
Thank you.
00:34:32 Ken
Appreciate you appeasing me.
00:34:35 Ken
So I I just, Dan, you think that there's going to be a lot more consolidation from the bigger breweries to medium sized organizations buying them out.
00:34:45 Ken
Like kings and convicts?
00:34:46 Ken
Is that what?
00:34:46 Ken
You're saying? Yeah, I.
00:34:48 Dan
Could see them doing that.
00:34:49 Dan
If you've got this cannabis company buying a bunch, I could see kings and convicts buying more or someone similar.
00:34:54 Dan
It doesn't have to be them.
00:34:55 Dan
They're really focused on.
00:34:56 Dan
The on the southwest, really.
00:35:00 Dan
But there definitely could be some that come out and start buying some of these from the big guys.
00:35:05 Ken
I mean, I think a big player, especially with the Monster Energy Cash infusion Canary could easily come in and buy a.
00:35:14 Ken
Handful of breweries and.
00:35:17 Ken
Not bad and I, with the amount of.
00:35:18 Ken
Money they have.
00:35:21 Ken
Do we see any Michigan breweries selling anytime soon?
00:35:24 Ken
I mean, I I didn't want to ask Alaskan, but I mean they've been brewing for 40 years.
00:35:27 Ken
I'm curious.
00:35:28 Ken
What's going to?
00:35:30 Ken
Happen when they're ready to retire.
00:35:31 Ken
They didn't look like they were ready to.
00:35:33 Ken
Retire. But no, they didn't.
00:35:33 Wendy
Their employees are they've got employee share.
00:35:38 Wendy
So I don't see that.
00:35:38 Ken
Well, I mean that doesn't mean much new new Belgium had employee share.
00:35:43 Wendy
That's true.
00:35:44 Wendy
They don't look like they're happening anytime soon.
00:35:47
No, no, absolutely not.
00:35:47 Wendy
They're they both, obviously.
00:35:48 Wendy
Still have a hand in that brewery?
00:35:50 Ken
If you listen to the the.
00:35:51 Ken
Craft beer news only go check out the Alaskan Brewing podcast that we just released a few days ago.
00:35:58 Ken
We just recorded it here tonight on Friday, which we record every Friday starting at 7:15 PM Eastern facebook.com/better on drafttwitch.tv. Better on draftkick.com/better on draft.
00:36:10 Ken
Youtube.com/better on draft.
00:36:12 Ken
That's everywhere that.
00:36:13 Ken
We're live, so.
00:36:14 Ken
You can interact with us.
00:36:15 Ken
Like our boy Toot McRae.
00:36:18 Ken
Talking about Devil's Backbone was great.
00:36:21 Ken
Then they went to I'm guessing the the dot dot dot is AB and people were angry.
00:36:27 Ken
It was the same with Wicked Weed.
00:36:29 Ken
I talked about going to wicked weed like two weeks after they got bought and the staff were happy because they had health insurance and the.
00:36:37 Ken
People in Asheville were ****** and I'm like.
00:36:40 Ken
It's hard to.
00:36:41 Ken
To balance that kind of work, but.
00:36:45 Ken
That is going to.
00:36:46 Ken
Do it for the craft beer news.
00:36:48 Ken
Segment, we will be back next week.
00:36:51 Ken
Next week our guest is the looks like, yes, the Chain Brewery, BJ's Brewhouse.
00:36:58 Ken
So we're going to learn.
00:36:59 Ken
A little bit more about what's going on.
00:37:00 Ken
And in the world of I, I don't think they're even franchisees.
00:37:05 Ken
I think they're all corporate, but corporate brewing across the United States with their head Brewer.
00:37:11 Ken
So we're going to learn a lot more about BJ's and then in two weeks we've got Harold Remlinger.
00:37:17 Ken
We're going to be.
00:37:17 Ken
Talking about about building a.
00:37:19 Ken
Brewery from the ground up and when I mean the ground up, I'm talking nuts.
00:37:22 Ken
And Bolts brewery architecture.
00:37:25 Ken
So that is going to do it for this.
00:37:26 Ken
Episode of the Better on draft podcasts.
00:37:29 Ken
Thank you so much for joining us.
00:37:30 Ken
I appreciate it.
00:37:31 Ken
Of course, all the social media is at better on draft.
00:37:34 Ken
And no matter.
00:37:35 Ken
What you think of your beer?
00:37:37 Ken
We think it's.
00:37:41 Ken
Butter on draft have.
00:37:42 Ken
A good night.