Also media.
Forty years ago, the old gods decided to create a podcast. Are capable of withstanding twenty hours of podcasting in the space of five days. I am at Zeitron and this is better offline CS coverage. We are large and in charge in the Palazzo Hotel in Las Vegas, beautiful Las Vegas, Nevada, with an open bar, Tacos and the strongest bench of tech commentator talent in the known universe. As every We're
bringing you coverage of the world's biggest tech conference. It's day two, Episode two, and our first contestants have just arrived. Joining me for the first block is the amazing, victorious song of the Verge. Hello, And we've got the wonderful stand up comedian host of the Factually podcast, Adam Connover.
Hello, and of course.
The legendary broadcast of My Dad's Gonna be So Happy. Rory Kecklin Jones, who writes the Always On newsletter and the mo is on the Movers and Shakers podcast.
Thank you for your sorry, Hello, so pleased to please your dad.
Oh, He's gonna He's gonna be elated, So Victoria. You describe your beat as the Curse Technology Beat and I think this is a great place to begin.
Not for my mental health, but sure.
Yes, but for the full of yucks. Perhaps what have you seen? Just just start anywhere?
Okay, So with my editors, you know, we're talking trend pieces right now, and they're like, what's your what's your trend this year? And I was like, bodily fluids. We are talking piss semen, uh, blood urine, bodily fluids, because you know, my actual beat is wearable in health technology, right, so you know, I'm you know, I'm surprisingly light under unwearable today.
How many people got today?
I only got two? The other day I was racking.
Four like a parallax style things.
Yeah, actually, actually no, I have AI You you sent me these?
Yes, yes, don't name them insuls.
The AI generated insuls. My feet seas still hurt, So there we go. H But yeah, so you know, longevity quote unquote longevity tech is in right now. Wellness is bullshit, as we know, but a lot of my beat deals with wellness, and therefore the snake oil perpetuated by wellness influencers in the world, and I get to have the lovely job of going, what bullshit are they going to make me? Wear this year. So I've worn uh, I've
worn in led face mask that makes Jason Vorhees look funny. Okay, but you know it's not the Jason Warheas type led mask. It's you'll see it tomorrow on Leverage Dot. There's that I closed the loop on the taint zapper and you know.
I'm gonna stop you then, Okay, what is that?
Okay?
So we have to go back six years because this is a year. This is a story that is six years in the reporting and the making. So CES twenty twenty, right before the world closes down because of COVID. I'm at Cees suffering, I have a cold or whatever. I'm at CS Unveiled, which is the inaugural Nights showcase of vendors and whatnot. I'm walking along a long what am I going to cover? What am I going to cover?
And I see a table. It's one of those booths that's very empty and sad, right, and on the table there is a mannequin and it's just this mid torso section of a male mannequin with Kendall smooth giblets, and it's on its back so its tant is exposed to a roving crowd of tech journalists and on on the goos of this, of this, a mannequin is a band aid, right, And on this sparse table, I really have to paint the picture. Here there's a laptop, and on the laptop
there is a slideshow presentation. And I want you to think of a black and white picture of a couple in bed and they're disgruntled. The woman is on the bed and she's sitting here with her arms folded and just like a look of disgust on our face. And the man is at the edge of the bed with his head and his hands and he's so sad. And the text on this slide show is premature ejaculation is the number one male dysfunction. So I take a picture.
I was like his moto at the time. So I take a picture of this and I send it to our slack channel, and my editor goes, bitch, you must write this, and I go, okay, so I'll just describe it. I wrote it. A week later, the CEO Lovely Man, Jeff. He reaches out to me and he goes, I because I had some burning questions about this taint banding. I was like, is it gonna rip off the hair off these men's gooches, Like, is what are we doing here? And it's like the proposed it was a concept wearable.
So the proposal was that to help men with premature ejaculation, it was gonna zop you, okay, to you know, delay orgism. And so I was like, I have so many questions. I asked many penis half others that I knew. I was like, would you would you try this? Would you do? And they're all like, bitch no, And so you know, a week later he reaches out to me. I was like, I want to answer some of your questions. No, it's not going to rip the hair off. We've done a
lot of research into the type of adhesive views. And I was like, okay, I'll write that follow up. The next year, I see them again and they have the most They have this gift that shows how it works and it's like a if you were on the floor and you were panning up, it's like the view of the gooch and just it's the most cursed gift I've ever seen in my life. Right, it's in our social video if you want to see it. But yeah, so that was there and we were talking and he's like,
we've discovered something mysterious in our testing. And I was like, oh, okay, cool, what sure? So I met up with this guy this year and it's now a product. They are FDA cleared. Nice And the mysterious discovery that they discovered was that not only can it help men with premature ejaculation delay orgasm mm hmmm, the electrical signal contracts the prostate and makes ejaculation more forceful.
So how did they measure.
That it was discovered? It was discovered in test.
You can tell when you do it how forceful it is.
Well, I've never had sex, so yeah. No.
Sometimes sometimes you're in a good mood and you hit the wall and and people it must have experienced this.
Yeah, I actually you know that year after, when I was doing the follow up, I talked to a user who had used it. You wanted to be anonymous, and he was like, it's saving my marriage. It's great, it doesn't hurt, it feels great.
I'm being kind of cynical, but it seems like it's actually possibly use.
But you know, there's there's like a lot of meaning between FDA proved, FDA clear isn't listed, it has to do with the type of medical class device it is and whatnot. But but, but but I did get to try it myself on my forearm, as I do not possess the actual body part necessary for real life testing, so I put it on my forearm. I got to try it out. It costs three hundred dollars for the starter kit it has.
Does it require a subscription?
No, And there's no AI involved, so you know, but you know you can. You can customize the zapp pattern, so you can you can. There's a strength level of one to one hundred. I could feel the strength at one, which I was yeah, on my arm, tained which I was told that makes me a unicorn because most people can't actually feel it at one. Like he was saying that depending on your body, uh, how hairy you are, how much body fat you have, you might need to like go up to twenty five to feel something nice.
That's that's yeah, that's good. I'm trying, like I'm trying not to like just laugh at the idea of bums just like just like wooo bum poo, but like it seems like an actual, like weirdly useful thing, like well, you.
Know, a lot of men don't want to talk about premature ejaculates.
I don't want to talk about sex at all. Like that's like that's a universal thing with the Fellas, Like this came up last year with Shad and like men just like you start talking about sex and like no, I couldn't possibly.
Yeah yeah, And you know, the their founder is a really good sport because Jimmy Kimmel did roast him on a monologue in twenty twenty two about it, and he's like, that's fine. I just want people talking about it, and I want men who suffer from this to actually do something for you. Jeff, Yeah, Jeff is like he's.
A cool d And the FDA clearance would mean this it works, like they've tested it or is it just not going to kill you?
It means that it's safe basically. So they did have to test it on rabbits, So.
You mean they didn't have a double blind placebo control trial.
I love the one that doesn't.
Think you think you've been shocked, but if you have an actually been so just it just naturally hot.
It feels more like a vibration, to be quite honest, It's not like a type of feeling. But what FDA clearance means is like there's different types of medical devices. There's Class one, which is like a tongue depressor, it's not really doing anything. Class two is like moderate risk. And I believe this would probably be in class two because they require five ten clearance and basically they have to go through testing for safety, efficacy, privacy.
And this one. This is all of it. It's past them.
Yes, it passed that. It took a long time because this is a six year period. I want to say, like they had to go through two rounds of funding, like FDA clearance, millions of dollars, millions of dollars.
Right now, the Titan Zeppr is the most functional product we've discussed on the show. Like I'm deadly serious, Like we spent the last two outs spend like, yeah, this doesn't work. This doesn't because it's not. The Titan Zuppr is real and it's real.
And you know, so part of the thing was is that you know, they had done their initial round of gathering data, which took them a year and a half to gather all all this data, and then the FDA was like, yeah, but we're gonna need you to do animal testing so you're gonna have to put this taint zapperro ond bunnies.
And just to be clear, that's not the tits.
No, it's not the bunny taints. They're putting it on the bunnies because bunnies are furry and some taints are furrery. So you need to make sure that when you put this adhesive on on on skin that when you take it off, you're not causing rashes, irritation, ripping things out. So you know, they he told me that, you know, they'd have to put the patch on the bunny every single day and monitor it for a few hours and you know, and yeah.
So Rory, moving on, moving on from the tank for now, I'm just a dog.
I've wandered off the streets and it's an old BBC man.
Oh, it's actually not called a taint zapper. That's just what I've called it, called more m O R.
That's a horrible That is one of the worst names they could have come up with.
It's called more but it sounds like one thing you don't get is more. You don't like there.
You don't get more more velocity.
More, more velocity, more lasting power. The company behind it is called marai inc and maori and Latin means delay, so shocking.
Call it longer longer long yeah, with no e Yeah.
Because then it's like you're going longer and your dick is longer. Yeah, men like longer.
That's and that's the that's men like longer. But Rory, what have you seen at the show? Anything unrelated to bums?
I'm just that I've not got any human detritus to bring before you. I mean, I've seen something incredibly wholesome.
Please please tell me.
I went to the Lego press conference. I used to come here a year after year for the BBC and it was a nightmare because of the time difference, and we had to make a store on a Sunday and a Monday to go out on the Tuesday eight hours behind and be desperate. And I learned a good lesson there, which is never go to a CS press conference because they're terrible. Because every single press conference features a CEO who thinks he's Steve Jobs unveiling the iPhone and he's
not Steve Jobs and he hasn't got an iPhone. And I know this because my very first CES was my best ever because it had a historic event in which in the BBC, having paid an awful lot for a lot of us to come over, led by me, I said to them, listen, We're going to take a day out and leave Ces and go to think called Matt World, because there's a room if something BIG's going to happen.
And so I was there when Steve Jobs did unveil the iPhone, which was better than any event that I've ever seen it fifteen.
When he goes, when he goes, are you getting it? That's my favorite part.
Yeah, you get it?
Were you getting it in that moment? Were you like, wait, it's one device?
Well.
I was kind of shocked in a kind of very British way by the fact that there were people standing up and cheering. Were journalists we don't cheer for. There was not the requisite level of cynical old hackery, but even I got carried away. I knew something was big when my desk in London rang people who were not remotely interested in technology and said, you've got to get your hands on that phone, and I said, you are deluded.
Apple is like North Korea, but less less open. They will never let me near a phone that's not coming out for six months. Are you dreaming? And then I remembered that we've been promised an interview with Phil Schiller, a tubby little marketing guy who did not quite have Steve Job's charisma.
And I had said, yeah, yeah.
Yeah, we'll do that, thinking no, we won't, and I changed my mind and we headed back to the Moscowe centerency. We would like that interview with mister mister Schiller. After all, he appears, I see you don't happen to have the phone,
and he said, oh yeah, handed it to me. I did my piece to camera and did an interview with Phil Schiller, which we didn't use, and I had my shot on the on the main news and the following weekend, a tech columnist in The Venerable Observant newspaper described me as looking like a French medieval peasant holding a piece of the one true cross us, which was because God damn Christ, I had actually got the whole of the
damn thing. So, which is a long way around saying CS has been sort of twenty years of disappointment for me, mainly, but this year I decided, against my better insects, I would go to one press conference. Yeah, and that was the Lego one, right, and the contrast between that experience and sitting through I didn't bother to go, but watch the live stream of the Nvidia press conference was quite instructive.
We hurst ourselves with that on the first day. It was truly truly boring.
Yeah, but where is the great thing about the Lego one was we got a little freebie, a little package of bricks on every seat. It was short, it was forty five minutes. It was the toy industry and the media industry because Disney and lucasfilms were there and Star Wars characters telling the industry. Actually we know a bit about storytelling, and which I'm afraid dear mister Jensen Wining he obviously did not.
He doesn't and it's weird. Other than these shiny jackets, he doesn't really have much going on. And mostly I was already the listeners already heard me say this, but it's like it was mostly him just repeating stuff from three to six months ago. It felt kind of washed, and I mean it was quite enjoyable.
When the tech when he's describing the most advanced, exciting technology in the world and his PowerPoint failed.
Someone's getting shot.
Well, somebody, a whole team is going to be replaced by AI within seconds.
I do respect when it's a live text presentation now though, because you know now they just flies to the Steve Jobs Theater for ALP. Watch a filmed presentation in a theater, like.
No sense of peril.
Yeah, that's you know what in video could use a little peril in that. There should have been some trap doors or something. It was. It was very bizarre. It was like two hours of a man clearly trying to feign excitement and he's just like, yeah, Blackwell might come out at some point. Yeah, it's in full full manufacturer, and just the audience going yeah. The reaction was really sad. It was it was, it was. It was.
It was like a you know, a failing politician at party conference setting up the que lines. Applaud, applaud and yeah.
Yeah yeah it's thank god. Okay, it's good to good to know other people heard that. But let's let's change, because Adam, what have you seen? You've just got here, So what wonders if you bold?
You know, I'm sort of drawn to everything that's not AI related.
First of all, I was.
Just walking your goal the section.
Well, what I found was h Strangely, I saw like five or six products related to teeth.
Have you guys noticed a teeth trend? The teeth Every everywhere I'm looking.
There's usually it's an AI toothbrush.
The first thing I saw was I was all the AI you know, blurred out, and I just my vision
honed in on something called the y brush. Yeah, it's a toothbrush, but what if the end of the toothbrush was the same shape as all of your teeth, So you just put it over all of your teeth at once, and it brushes all your teeth simultaneously, And you know what as the owner of an electric toothbrush, and it has a timer and I'd do it for two minutes and it's like thirty seconds per quadrant and it's so boring and I have to listen to it to like two minutes of a podcast. I was like, you know what,
ten seconds to brush all my teeth? Yes, someone buy me this shit at Brookstone for Christmas.
Thank you. This is what cees is for. This is what it's supposed to be. Is dumb garbage that says is going to save you a minute and a half. Right, that's nice.
I like that, did you see anything that was useless? I was just describe the rest of the cees. I guess do what else did you do? You see more teeth related things?
Yeah, look, I even got a teeth I got. I got a free night guard. So I.
Have a loose plastic bags and beautiful I've taken out of my hoodie pocket.
I've produced it.
Yeah, so there was a smart night guard that I wear, a nightguard for tooth grinding. And it's a night guard that will much like the taint zapper when you grind your teeth, it'll buzz in the middle of the night to stop you from grinding your teeth. Which reminds me of when I was a kid and I used to wet the bed and my parents would put the pistol arm did it? And you know the pistol arm. No, this is from the early nineties. This has been very high tech. It's a little so you know, if you
used to wet the bed, it was just common. You know, it happens to a lot of people. Ed like, you know, I'm like older than you.
Should be on wedding the bed and and so.
Once again, when you get to a age, well you would be interested in this product.
It's it's a pad like with election roads out that you put into your underpants and then when it to text moisture, it's connected to a little speaker that is like attached to your shirt.
And so this is a so this is sorry, I'm lost, it's the piste along.
Now I'm describing something that was inflicted on me as a child that frankly, was almost like a form of abuse to stop me from doing something that just.
Naturally stops, like something that kids do accidentally.
Yeah, like a very common thing. But it's a shame alarm right now, like.
A short color for dogs, is that right?
Yeah?
Yeah, this is the same thing for grinding your teeth. And actually it's not a bad idea because I do I can't.
Yeah, I can actually see the use of that because I grind my teeth sometimes as well, and I'm I find myself accidentally doing it.
Yeah, and I wear a night guard, and you know, sometimes I'm like, am I grinding my teeth? Do I need to keep wearing the night guard? Or I switched to sleeping on my side? Is it still happening?
You know that? I was like, all right, that's kind of nice.
And then they they gave me a they molded a nightguard to my teeth, and they gave me a free nightguard. And this sort of like loose bag. You might use the bag produce at the supermarket.
This looks like what a criminal would hand drugs to someone. And it's just.
Like going to central seat over my teeth.
On your headline, I sober, it says Steph Cory finally finishes eating mouth God. But for the three basketball listeners, no, that's that's good.
There's a jerkoff machine. You saill a jerk off machine right in the Eureka.
It's called the Handy.
Yeah, that's good, and.
The handy too. They've got both of them in the same what's the sequel? Like, it looked like that's basically the same thing.
Just shakes heart.
Yeah.
I saw that thing two years ago and I was like, okay, cool, that was that's funny looking. And then it's back here again and I'm like, bill more the same.
It's it's like, got all this copy where it's like, don't worry everybody looks twice like, yep, it really is.
It's really hamming it up, you know, the only.
Way to do that is be super serious about yeah, just like you're like, excuse me, said something funny about this.
Yeah, see that would be better.
That would be so much more interesting. It's like a huh yeah, we went there.
Yeah, it's very much the Cards against Humanity. They're like just for nerds.
To be able to I recognize this as comedy.
You know, and be able to let I mean CS as a show is extremely prudish and does not fuck like the Rue.
Yeah, well, the jerk Off Machine is not a fucking machine. I'll tell you that.
There was a time where there was like a like back in twenty nineteen, twenty twenty, there was like a controversy because they had given a vibrator, uh vibrator. It was like a micro robotic kind of lingus dildo type device and it was the Laura de Carlo and they had given them a innovation award and they're like no, no, no, no, we're gonna take the innovation award away. And then everyone's like.
Why did they take it away? Because it was imbrober uh so they could give it to just something that didn't.
Exist, Like yeah, they were just like this is not this is not robotics. And everyone was like yeah, it's robotically.
Like they gave it and people complained and then they took it away again.
That's so that the most cowardly fuckless ship I've heard in my.
Then the next year, the next year, they're like, no, we falk get all the sex tech companies to come back and we'll have a sex tech pavilion. And they had a whole camper. They had like a build your own dildo experience, which I did and you know I was reporting on it. And now it's just like, where's the sex tech companies. It's one hand job device thing, and it's like, okay, I would.
Have expected build adild to be a big hit.
You know, it was that year they could, you know, have have it be a kiosk in the mall. You know you go with your for your friend's birthday.
Not smaller, smaller, smaller, you got any Yeah, we got a special one out back right, not small than that. No. I like this though, because David Roth sadly was only here yesterday because the sex conversation we had towards the end of Lost the Yes, just watching him like, no, he's a lovely guy. I'm sure he's had sex. I'm not going to comment further on that before I can get comment from him, which would be really funny to
text him. Actually lost the Yes, I got in trouble for texting my family group chat what my dad's horny level was. Sorry, dad, you can now hear this anyway? Your son's doing you proud? Yeah, it's it's it's actually kind of nice to hear this useful stuff.
But I guess it usually is.
It's just takes six years of you know, development.
Of bum buch.
Of taint research is just.
Like coming back here again and again.
Yeah.
Yeah, And it takes a long time to get some of the stuff actually made. It's it's not like a you know, a lot of the I say, a lot of the tech I see here on my Beata's vaporware, because it's just like where where is it?
Where is it?
Sometimes it takes six years to get approval, you know, and bunny testing to make sure it's safe enough for human use and that there's a scientific reason why you might want to actually use this shit.
Yeah. So yeah, it's funny like the non AI stuff is like for real people doing things like fucking.
Well, you know, they are looking into AI for the tant Zappera as well.
So I just I if you can as a listener, if you're hearing this and you see something at CS with AI and it works, please let me know because so far, I'm oh, four hundred I think it is.
I had a really interesting conversation with a woman and it was like the sort of conversation where I was like, I wish I had had a camera I was recording it or something, because it was one of the first boots I went up to and I'm like, I flew here today.
I didn't get enough sleep.
I'm like kind of zonked out, so I just walk up to this thing and it's like AI fast food ordering thing. Yeah, well the most obvious possible thing. But the guy demonstrates it and he's like, I have a coffee please, do you want to make it a calm?
Yes, I want to make it a combo? Could I have a croissant?
And it goes five croissants and then do you want to make it a combo? He says yes, and then it makes one of the croissants a combo, and he says could I remove the other four croissants and it goes yes. See it can remove stuff you know, and they're like, what do you think? And I was like, I mean, it seems worse than ordering. If I were to confront this rather than a person like I wouldn't like it.
I'd be actively annoyed.
Yeah. And you know they're like, well, you know, sounds bad.
I'm like, yeah, yeah, but it sounds bad, but also it is.
Yeah, it needs a bit of wo But what I asked the woman was, I was like, she was very nice to engage in this conversation.
I was like, because she was saying, you know this, people want a good customer experience, and a person doesn't always give you a good customer experience.
For some robot doesn't, so.
I give you a bad one every time.
Yeah.
She was like, I checked it at the hotel today and the guy was rude and and you know, the AI can never be rude. It'll always be in a good mood. And I said, Okay, even if that's true, if you you know, did the travel I did here today, right, You got in a way mow. Then you get to the airport, there's no person to check in. It's just a kiosk. There's no TSA agent, there's no person to talk to you in security. When you go get your coffee, it's just a you know, a thing you talk to
and then it dispenses it. On the plane there's no one to talk to. You get to the hotel, there's no person there, right, and it just gives you a key. Is that a world that you would like to live in?
Yeah?
Japan they do that in Japan.
Okay, we do that there.
Yeah, but it's cool there.
I don't know. Yeah, as a as a UK citizen coming through the American border, I'd quite like to you know, global entry is have a rope book.
There's certainly some things, but like she goes, she goes. Well, you know, I like talking to people, but most people don't. I like it, So, you know, I would maybe prefer to have a person. I'm like, I think most people do like other people.
To your point, I was at pepcom last night and we saw this thing called ag.
I bought and I've heard about that.
So this this this giant bot and then there's like a smaller version next to it. So just imagine this that the smaller version is like doing taichi and break dancing like a psycho bot. It's like quite smoothly too, very disconcerting. And the big bot is supposed to be shaking tech reporters hands because the purpose of this bot
is to greet people at museums and that stuff. And it's like it's supposed you're supposed to walk up to it and it has like a doesn't have a face, it just has a screen and it's like, my name is Luca, say hi to me or whatever, and you're supposed to say Hi, Luca, and it's supposed to put out its hand, and you're supposed to put your hand out and shake the robot's hand. And so my colleague Jen Twey, she's our smart home reviewer, and she's like
on a robot mission this particular cees. She puts out her I'm like, Jen, you know you're doing the robots. Let me get a video of you shaking this robot's hands. This robot was like incapable of shaking her hands, and the one time it does, it pulls her hand down and she's like Jesus Christ, and then it just starts flirting with her and.
We're like, oh, have you heard about the more?
Yeah?
But like the funniest thing about this show is that this is the largest tech show in the in the US, it's the big thing of the year. No one can get fucking Bluetooth or Wi Fi correct at this show, and so all the demos fucking fail all the time.
I just don't want to touch any more. I don't want want to go places. I don't want to talk. I like seeing people.
You don't want to touch your robots.
I don't want to touch anyone. I don't want to shake hands with someone. I want to go to the museum.
Just the robots.
But to the point that I was asking the presenter I was talking to like you you.
I'm finally talking to me, I quite like And I think if I just walk through a series of machines, that was like when I went to Korea, there was a lot of machines, but like still the occasional person. If it was just to your description, Adam, just a series of screens that I interacted, but that would fucking suck. I'd feel a loan in a way that I quite like being solitary, But that would just be like I feel like I'm going through tubes.
Yeah.
I think what it's gonna be the future that they're gonna have I describe, you know, when I go to the Alaska terminal at Lax, they've specifically done this where like there's no check in counter, it's mostly kiosks and there's like two people roaming around. So it's the self checkout of airlines. And whenever I fly Alaska, there's always some fucking problem with my ticket. I don't know what it is with their system, and so every time I'm like,
where's the person? And that's what it's gonna be everywhere And this as I'm talking to this woman, she goes, well, I want people to have the choice. Maybe they want to use the automated system. I'm like, I don't think we'll have a choice, and she goes, yeah, we won't have a choice because it's gonna be so much cheaper to automate everything they're gonna do, like.
The robo things. You call your bank and you just want to talk to someone, they're like, press one for the thing that you don't need to do. I am press see for the second thing you don't need to do, and you're just on the phone. You're pressing zero.
Give me I would take that, and we're going to rotate to the next thirteen second. But I just want to say as a British person, every fucking single American voice activated thing sucks for me. It's just like, okay, give me a reminder for seven pm calling your mother, calling, calling mum, sending her your last link, which was the teen sapper. All right, we're gonna rotate through the next ad. I fully endorse and if you don't like it, email me at god at gov dot biz. Welcome Berg, Welcome Berg,
Welcome Berg, Zitron, We're back. It's the Consumer Electronics Show, better offline and joining me in the room is the victorious song of the Verge, Robert Evans of Behind the Bastards.
Yeah, I gotta do this real quick. Sorry, Yeah, I just like on air was the best way.
I've decided not to do that because I've drunk so many diet cokes already and I'm I've got like three more in me. And of course Adam kind of a wonderful stand up on the host of the Factory podcast.
You know, I stayed at your apartment once and I was frankly concerned at how much diet coke was in that apartment and no coffee maker. You're one of those no are you die coke? In the morning, pervert.
I'm a diet coke whenever. Perfect. Oh man, it was ten thirty pm and I went to bed half an hour later and I drank one of those motherfuckers with my sleeping meds. Yeah, I'm a they're gonna.
Say, so, caffeine doesn't affect you.
It just it's fine. Yeah, Like I have like ADHD, and I take medicae.
Off prescription at all, but I.
Also have concerto. Like they give me that, but the doctor gives me that because I actually unsupposingly have ADHD. You haven't worked that out from the tens of thousands words. So Robert, you got the sea of intuit to say something.
The CMO into it. Yeah, So I started my day. All I did really today was panels. I was in like six different fucking panels, and the first one was about uh one, I should probably have had this.
It's okay, intuit intu. It's wonderful as well because they have this new chat GPT integration. They've got it.
That's exactly what I was talking about. So I was in this uh this panel, which is like a leadership roundtable sorry on like technology and advertising. Although the actual panel did not seem to have much to do with that, and the CMO of Intuit was there and talked about the integration that they've been doing with chat GPT and talked about how like they're partnering with open ai so that you have when you're doing your taxes, you have access to like a chat bot basically to help do
and you can have an agent. The idea is an agent will at some point be able to handle most of this task. But yeah, well that's kind of the problem, and like so there's there's a couple of issues with this. When I first started, like, I had been reading about the into it integration because they're putting like one hundred million dollars into open ai million, not bl the trip.
I said that clearly. And when that first happened, I read an article by a security researcher who was pointing out that they are giving into it is giving read and write access to an LLM jesus of your tax data, of any of the tax data that's integrated into that, which is a problem from a security point of view. One of the things this guy points out is that there's a kind of attack that you can execute against AI models that is there's a kind of attack that
you can execute against AI. Yeah, yeah, prompt injection.
And that's when you do you go to a website which tells the LM to do something.
Right, a website or one of the things that this guy proposes. If you want to put in a fraudulent invoice, you could have an invoice that has that's not like visible to the naked eye, but that the LLLM would read and that text basically executes an exploit. And there's not a like you can't defend against these really like
there's not a functional way to stop this. The point he was making is that it's not a question of whether or not there will be a data breach of people's tax data because they're integrating it with this chatbot. But when And the question that this researcher had that I thought was a really good question was who is then responsible? This is Chris Black published this in a website called a raptus, But who is responsible if your data all gets leaked because of this integration? Is into
It responsible? Is open AI responsible? Is whatever third party you're using that uses into it software responsible? So I asked the Thomas renize, who's the CMO of into it that right when they had time for questions, and I said, I basically brought up what's in this article? I said, given the fact that this is in an ability that attacks like this will be carried out and data will be leaked, who do you like who is responsible? Like
who should take legal responsibility in that instance? And like what safeguards are you building to try and deal with the fact that this is going to happen. And the first answer he gave is that we're talking about it with open AI, which which I viewed as a non answer. So I came up to him after the panel and kind of corning up a little bit and asked, like, you have to have more You're the CMO. Yeah right, you're like the chief marketing officer of this entire company.
Security is a pretty big marketing huge standpoint, right, Like I would think you would know something about this, And he eventually got angry at me and said, like, I don't have any of that information. That's not my job basically to care about this sort of thing. I've got a recording of it we'll play at some point, but that that's literally all that I got from him, was like, we're talking about it with open AI, And I don't really know A.
Browsers right, because yeah, hair browsers doing the same thing. They're so so, so so vulnerable to the prompt jack.
I really like that. Also, they trying to pretend A eyebrowsers are useful. They're not.
I tested five of them. Me, I had to test five fucking AI browsers. All I wanted was the pair of fucking new balances, and it couldn't get me. I had to get my mother in law to get me the new balances, Like what are you doing?
So what are you doing on the AI browser? Try to get the new.
So you know, they're like gent like AI. You can ask it to find you the fucking new balances or whatnot, and it's supposed to help you research this stuff. And all these tech CEOs are like, well, the future of computing is that you will not do anything on the computer. You'll talk to It's kind of like Her, the movie Her, where you just talk to the computer and it goes here you go. So all I wanted was a pair
of fucking new balances. But I take my shoes very seriously, right, and I'm like, Okay, I want a pair of new balances? What these are the prep like the parameters that I want? How am I going to get them? And my query kept getting longer and longer and longer and longer and longer because they can't into it things. So I was like, my foot size is this, This is the stuff that I have to deal with. This is the color I want,
this is the style that I want. These are the scenarios that I want to wear them, and these are the prices that I want to have. So it's like a fucking three paragraph prompt that I have to give, and I'm asking all five of these different stupid AI browsers to just get me a pair of goddamn new balances, and it's just like that, I can't do it.
Oh So I like browsing the Internet, not as much as I used to due to all the obstacles, but looking for a pair of shoes, looking for something in a store, that's kind of you know, you fuck around, you learn some stuff. It's kind of fun.
Like, yeah, no, I did ruin once again, cursed tech beat. I did ruin my mental health just trying to bigger.
Pair by three hundred word essay.
Yeah, I mean the part of The enjoyment of purchasing something is to know that you got the thing that you want. You put the work in, you found the like I'm trying to I've been trying to buy the perfect set of towels for a little while and I'm and I was like, I was like, no, I don't want to get the Onsen towels that like the fake Japanese towels. I want to find some real Japanese towel. And so I found out about like a variety of towel that's like only made in one town in Japan,
trying to find the right vendor. And I know when I get the towels, I'm going to be like these, I went through something to get these right. And that's how people you want to feel about your new balances.
These are so good.
You want to I got the ones I put a little bit of sweat equity in. You want to be like I got some shoes. The computer bought me some shoes.
Also, the computer doesn't listen. I said, I already have the perfect running shoe, right, I thought I found that I was stylistic. I want walking shoes. And what did it do? It gave me the fucking running shoes over and over and over again. I said I didn't want the running shoes. I wanted the walking shoes.
Right.
This is kind of like every one of these AI browsers I've read about. It's kind of the same things. Like imagine, if you will, you're seeing that you want to buy something, and there's just no way to do that. It's just like an alien, an alien that's never used anything. Yeah, how do we do anything? Oh, I'll type in and it's like, yeah, off the three minutes, it might do something. Right. Yeah, It's like fucking yeah.
That's the that's the frust That's the frustrating thing about sitting in all of these panels in particular, is that it's like entering this alternate world where all of the technology works much better than it does, and people talk about it as if like, yeah, we deployed fifteen hundred agents, right that are you know, they're doing great work, And it's like, okay, but I'm looking at, for example, the statistics that Copilot released last year that about so or
that were released about Copile last year that about seventy percent of work tasks that it's tasked with, it fails at y right, because the agents are not functional yet.
So I you know, I'm trying to tell Atlas chatgbt's thing to buy me these fucking new balances, and it's just like, oh, crap, there's a pop up. Let me try and close this pop up. Oh that didn't close the pop up. Let me click more precisely at the coordinates and it's listing the coordinates on the site. Let me try and close the pop It took.
Just gas fumes.
It took five I'm watching it. It took five attempts for the AI to close the pop up a minute and thirty seconds. I'm just watching it, and I'm just like, Jesus fucking crazy.
Close.
It's narrating as it's doing.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, it narrates. It goes just like, let me think about the best way that I can close this pop up. It didn't seem like I clicked hard enough. Let me look at the coordinates and click more precisely. Well, that didn't order.
I know.
The compute on that is also bonkers.
You know that they boiled oceans to watch and AI struggle to close pop ups minute and.
Seconds giraffes from the back of a truck into a furnace to make this like a guest turbine in a poor community in Texas. Yeah, many people got cancer and you didn't get the shoes you wanted.
Yeah, And it's in between panels. A friend of mine back and Iportant sent me a video that's some guy I think in Tennessee recorded of like the sound of the data center that went up near its house. That's like this, I mean for months has just been this like constant like droning beep noise thing, like like it
just sounds awful. And so I'm I'm going in between these people talking about like you know and really focusing on how like AI's going to augment human capability and you know, these agents are are only getting more capable, and like we're going to be using this to like really set human creativity on fire. And then I'm like watching a video where a guy's like, yeah, now it
screams every day, the internet screams every day outside my house. Yeah, And I'm looking at the statistics that show that like none of this stuff works as well as these people are are saying it does, right, like not to the extent that like I would want it doing a job that really matters, and I'm just so like in between that.
The other thing that I read while I was going in between sessions was an article that came out today about a patent Sony filed last year to basically create use an AI agent to play video games for you when you're trying to do something hard if you can't beat a boss.
Did you see Razor stuff?
Yeah, well, and that's the other crazy I haven't seen the booth yet though, but you want to talk about that.
I saw that.
I was in that really sweaty Venetian suite where they were giving the preview of the role a.
You know, it's so crazy.
Oh my god.
So they had two crazy AI concepts. First, this Project EVA, and the only way you can describe it is a little anime wife, the wife Tube. It's the wife Tube. It's a little desktop wife tube where the holographic anime wife who named Kia, and like there's a camera in the thing and so she's watching it and she's gone, like and it's based on grox Annie if you oh god, yeah, they did tell they did tell us like specifically that it was based on And I'm.
Like, oh, did you ask if it was based on an adult.
Well, I'll tell you what it's based on. Visually, if you ever watched the show Archer, there's like, yeah, creepy Sid has the Waifu hologround looks identical smaller.
I was there with my colleague Antonio, who Tania, Oh god, sorry Antonio, because he does listen to your podcast, Antonio di Benedetto and he's our laptop reviewer. And so they're like, you know, Kira can help you when you're playing your game, and so he's playing like this a first person shooter but it's just like a it's like not an actual level,
so you can't die in this section. And she's like, oh, this is the gun you're holding is not the correct gun, and it's like, oh, you died and he didn't die. And then they like programmed, they programmed like, oh, so did you see anything really cool at cees and like this is how she talks because it's based on and
he's like no, and she's like, oh that's cool. And but so you can have different like avatars doesn't have to be an AI wife who you can also have Zane the AI husbando and he has like nake tattoos on there and it goes like, hang.
On, I'm stuck. I need to ask the wife tube again.
But like that's the whole point of games is that you're strugged, is that you're playing, that you're using the problem solving and all that, and it's just like, no, tell me how to beat this level. And all the time I talk to these companies and they're like, yeah.
You're going to be able to yeah, because they're training it off of like YouTube videos of people playing the game too, which I also I just don't know if I believe it's going to work well.
It is a pattern, so maybe Sony doesn't either, Like they.
Are they showing the AI just like the video frames, like the literal.
The YouTube video from the patent from what I haven't read the patent. I read an article about the patent application. That's what it sounds like.
You could you could program an old fashioned AI, what we used to call AI in video games, just like you know and n PC.
You could just when you're making a video game, you have the world state, you know, how the game works.
You could just like have something in the game. I think, yeah, exactly, that like is part of the game. It's an artificial world.
Why do you need to insult a game?
I think this is like Aana.
It didn't ask if we should actually fucking make Krtana. Losers just played Halo way too when they were in their formative years.
Yes, I think a big mistake that they're making, or just which one. Well, look, there's such a big difference between a tool that extends or enhances human capability makes you more powerful, and you not doing it yourself and having someone else do it for you. I literally, just for the first time, hired an assistant because I the perfect person who I knew would do is such a great job for me, is available for a couple of months.
So it's great you correspond with she's amazing, right, But like it's because I have worked with her before in a different capacity. I know she's amazing. I like trust her to do all these various things that I don't have to do myself anymore. But the moment that, like I work with someone who fucks something up, I'm like, well, I can never work with the contract. I'm not going
to assign things to them. And like versus, when I fuck something up with a tool that I'm using myself, I'm like, Okay, I need to do a little bit better or whatever. Like the experience of those things is so fundamentally different. The use cases for them is different, the sort of person who wants to do them is different.
And so like, I don't know, like for into it to be a company that goes from you know, here's tax software that helps you do your own taxes if you would really like to do that, and yes, but like to go from that to now we will automatic will be an automatic accountant. Is like they don't understand the gulf that they're trying to jump.
Now, well, it's because they misunderstand. It's kind of the ongoing thing of See, it's like people that don't experience the problems they're trying to fix. Because the best assistant, to your point is someone that you kind of hand
stuff up, like my written edits to Matt Hughes. The whole reason Matt works well with me is he can anticipate, like he kind of gets my thing and he knows yeah, and I can trust him to get it without me having to I don't know, give a three hundred word prompt to explain every nuance because so much.
Handholding and I don't want to hand hold an assistant. That's the whole fucking the whole point.
Yeah, it's handholding. And it's also like picking having an assistant to do the things you wouldn't have an assistant do, like I don't play a video game for you. Yeah, but there's so much of it is focused on, like the the tasks that are deeply human. Like whenever I hear like this AI can help you brainstorm, it's like, well, no, it can't. That's not how brainstorming works. Someone else can't brainstorm for you.
That's not You're.
Just talking to yourself in the mirror. But the mirror is a chapla.
Yeah, and you were hoping to plagiarize a good idea from the chatbot that itself is built from plagiarism, which I also feel like is a mistake.
But regurgitating thought into your own brain and the hopes and new idea comes out.
Yeah, I mean, like I've talked about this before, my most positive experience with chat GPT was I was trying to decide whether to get myself a little apartment in New York and I'll talk to you about this, yeah, right, whether it's a good financial decision, and I plug into chat GPT. Hey, here's all the numbers, and like, is this a good thing?
You know?
Would this be a big mistake? And it sort of goes, no, it wouldn't be a big mistake. You could do that. If you want it, you can do it. And then I'm like, okay, but what about the fact that I can't sublet it? Oh, that means it's bad.
Now you shouldn't do it.
Now you're fine.
Oh, but what about the fact that it's kind of important to me. Well, if it's really important to you, you should do it. And I did actually find that clarifying, like it did help me think through it all.
But just agreed with your lost statement.
I was talking to myself in the mirror.
The only that's the most useful it is it's like you need to talk out loud to yourself, to myself, you can, But sometimes I can do that to you people.
If you answer all my texts for some reason, because my friend.
And I love you, like that's why I do it, because I care about you and want you to be happy. And the chat ball.
Doesn't can't, No, the chatbot doesn't care.
I actually wonder if my latent like actual autism is mounting myself on the show. Like, that's why it doesn't work, because when every time I've tried anything like this and just like just talk it to my fucking self, Why are you agreeing with me on everything?
But I mean like that's because that's you, like to be real, that's I know. I'm talking to myself on that too. It's just like it just doesn't work.
Like I literally have tried to do the things. I'm just like, no, just like there's a blog. I'm just like it's just repeating more just faking said.
Yeah. No, you're like you have to know the artifice in order to get to a point where you're like, if you understand that you're talking to yourself, you're just thinking aloud in a different format, it can be helpful if you understand that that's what you're doing. People don't understand that's what they're doing. That's why they're getting the AI psychosis. Yeah, they're mistaking this for a friend. It's not a friend, it's literally a person.
Yeah. I will say one thing that was interesting to me. I did a panel that was Intelligence through Motion AI takes physical form, and it was about like robots, robots with AI in them. It was actually the better one of the day. There was not much that was silly, and it was I think it was a really good example of like how you ought to be responsibly talking
about and thinking about products like this. So one of the people who was there was Andrea Thomas, who's the co founder and CEO of Diligent Robotics, and they've built a robot that is basically an assistant for doctors and nurses at the hospital, not doing medical stuff. But like, the thing that she pointed out is when we because we started and this was the first thing they liked. We started not with a product idea, but by talking to a bunch of doctors and nurses and figuring out, like,
what are the different jobs you have. And one of the things they figured out is that nurses in particular, spend a shitload of time every day running stuff back and forth through the hospital, and so like, well, if we have a robot that can move things and can potentially move refrigerated things or move things that you have to be very careful when carrying, then a skilled, trained human being isn't doing that bullshit work and they can
do more medical work. And there's not enough medical profession that's effectively a convey about right right, which that's more maneuverable than a conveyor because it can go.
But the point is like it's useful because it's moving stuff between places, right right.
And I believe there was some talk about other like they're looking at adding other capabilities, but the way that they were thinking about it were, well, first, we're going to talk to the people who we want to we want to be making products that will be used in hospitals. Let's talk to people who work in hospitals to see
where it's useful. And then the other thing that they said during that this was something a couple other people pointed out, is that you have to when you're talking about building products that human beings will be working alongside in an industrial capacity, you have to assume that there will be failures and build that in because otherwise you're
taking risks with people's lives. Right, So you have to be figuring out, we want this thing to fail when it does, because it will in a way that doesn't endanger human beings. How do we build that in from the ground up. This is like a fundamental assumption it will fail. We need to make sure it fails in a way that does not lead to it crushing or killing people because it's going to be around them, And so I really appreciate it. And it was such a that was such a gap to me from how everyone else.
I'm used to other people talking about this a lot more.
In the health techomy, right, yeah, because the stakes are so high. Yeah, you know, like all the tech people are like break shit, disrupt, but like medicine is like, no, no, don't break the people.
Something's already broken.
They're broken already.
Yeah.
Yeah, I think one of the barriers to that though, And this is not even me being cynical. It is just you ask people what the problems are and then you go, oh, you're an LM. Can't do that sorry. Like the answer is the problems that you have are not fixable with the technology we have NAT like housing and health like health stuff. It's like there are very big limitations because of medical device clearance. But also just well.
Technology is streamlining, right, like if you think about the like I just remember this from a macro acinemic class in college. But like all technology does is it moves the curve up. It doesn't. It doesn't like change the angle of the curve or whatnot. It just you know, allows you to do more. So it's about streamlining things. It's not about fixing problems. It's about finding things that
you could do more efficiently. Being more efficient doesn't fix the problem, right, different, it's two different streams that you're approaching, but they're conflating it by being like, if you're efficient, you fix the problems. Like, no, the problem isn't always efficiency.
Yeah, and you know, I mean the thing I think about a lot is what I'm in any city, but especially New York or LA where I spend a lot of time. It's like the physical infrastructure is so bad. But everybody has cell phones right, right, Like no one's even like oh, homeless people have We know, everybody has cell phones, like because the price of them is so cheap and and you can do a lot with them.
But like there's potholes, the trains don't run right, and like those are the problems in society, and the fact that we have you know, high technology in these particular areas but not in like the rest of our society is like a weird distortion. We all know this. We don't think about it often enough. But like what you're talking about is is this AI will like push that distortion even further. Yeah, in the best case scenario and people like you know, Simon Wilson or whatever will have
like some crazy agentic shit happening. You know, like they'll they'll be you know, in some fucking matrix and everybody else will be like, how do I buy food?
Someone Willisson be trying to draw a Pelican on a bicycle. I think that's the one thing that's literally the test thrones on every LM. But yeah, Willison is kind of realistic about and yeah, yeah, to your point, Robert, with that panel, it's like, yeah, we're talking about this fantasy land. But even when we so during the Nvidia conference, it was talking about yeah, and now agents are getting even more powerful in doing this.
They're not well yeah, no they're not.
But also gun to your head, explain what that means, like, because I regularly am arguing with people about this online perpetual that.
Was they're talking about the agents and the consumerism and the commerce aspect of agents just because that's the only way they have a chance of making them.
Such a lack of specificity, like that is the thing that is most like in like the first three panels I did, all of which were one way or the other talking about like agents and their ability to like
improve productivity and creativity. There was an exam exactly one specific example of a thing that people used AI, like that a marketing or company used AI to do for marketing, right, because these were all fairly marketing focused, and it was specifically it was the company that makes Allegra had like a new non drowsy formula, and they engaged in what the the I think it was a deloittte I forget, I forget who who said this, it's in my notes,
but what the person who was talking about it described as model hacking to basically put out a bunch of content so that chetch ept would repeatedly scrape articles or whatnot that talked about how Allegra was non drowsy, so that if people asked questions about it, the LLLM would return both always would say l Allegra is non drowsy, would like put that before the word Allegra, and would
like subtly talk about other allergy medicines causing drowsiness. And they were talking about like and that's like a really great example like the this is like a strategy developed using AI that like, uh is not what we couldn't have done marketing like this before. It couldn't possibly have come up with a way to reverse. Yeah, first off, like you're you're the most specific example of the use
of this technology in advertising is disinformation. Yeah right, basically you know, or at least that yeah, on that spectrum.
And that probably costs thousands of dogs, Like probably so thousands of articles or whatever just fed into the training Jesus fucking Christ.
Well, and at the same time, they're talking about how important trust is and that like you have to be you have to keep and there's yeah as they lie and they're like, well, you know, people only trust you, will only trust your AI as much as they trust your company, So it's really about like having a good bread so the other way round.
Well, that's what kind.
Of what I took it as them saying is that like, look, people don't trust AI, but they still have some trust for specific brands. So if you really want to, like there's a limited period of time for.
For that trust to stay alive.
It feels like blow it up.
Yeah, that's honest to god, makes the show more boring.
Yeah, it really, it's all fucking AI ship.
Yeah.
Like the stuff I was popping for was there was a robot lawnmower that could go up a hill.
Yeah, see that.
All the robots are getting GEN again. Look like Gen's coverage. It's just about how last year the robots had arms, This year the robots have legs.
Next year, big old Willie.
There was also a.
There was we were I was talking about the jerk off robot last time. But first I saw there was a robot called beat Bot, and it said.
That was like a masturbation.
That wasn't It was that nothing beats beat bot, and I was like, this is a masturbation.
Great.
It turns out it's a little robot that swims in your pool and cleans your pool. And I think maybe it's also the Bluetooth speaker, and I was like, it's like a pool room.
But also you didn't if you were going to if there's any good call for a hybridized robot, a combination pool robot or gas and robot, like make the sexy pool boy a robot.
And it's just doing that weird song from you remember that one. Yeah, there was the offbeat song the guy was claiming he would only have sex to No. No one remembers that. No, just oh god.
Yeah, you can market it to Richmond with like wives in their tow twenties where you're like, look, your wife is going to cheat on you with the cabana boy. Just make sure it's a robot cabana book.
What you look depressed?
Honey? Do you need some time with the cabana bot?
On new music?
Genuinely the best, one of the best use cases for generative AI has sex stuff like it.
It's certainly one of the most.
Use Sorry, as someone who was subjected to testing Annie the Grock sexpot, Jesus that was damaging, you might have.
A workman's comp Yeah.
Listen, I keep asking for hazard pay at the Verge dot com and for my title to change to Senior Curse tech Reviewer. It's not happened yet. It's not happened yet. But I did have to test Annie, and boy did she.
Yeah noticed, Like the only people who are really making good use of like Sora style videos are niche fetish communities on the Internet who have been able to move from writing fan fiction for each other because that's a cheap thing where they can, you know, have make media for each other. Now they can make little videos they're making and they're so happy there.
Okay, but AI doesn't know how to animate tongues. And I know this because again my job is cursed, and I had to I had to test these AI video generating more men kissing, making the AI kiss each other. No, they don't, they don't. They don't understand how tongues work.
It's just a little Jensen Wong said that the new generation Vera Ruben is four times more powerful for training. So maybe that's the Jensen Huang's bring the tongues in. But sadly we are go, we're gonna have to end this thirty second. The next thing coming up is an ad for a tongue training models. And if you hear something else that's an error. Whatever it is, just ignore it because we're meant to. It's the tongue training app.
But before we get to the tongue training app, Robert has a very important man.
So I came across the booth during the brief time I spent on the floor today of a robotics company called Zeroith, which I think is a reference to the laws of robotics, and you know, you had the normal laws and there was the zero with law, YadA, YadA, YadA. Anyway, we don't need to get into Asimov right now, but it's they had a whole booklet. I actually thought these were like notebooks at first, but every page of this is printed, explaining the vision for their company and the
robots they make. The origin story. I'm just going to read a little bit from here, Okay. The prevailing narrative in robotics has long been one of replacement and utility, Robots as instruments of precision, built for efficiency and stripped of warmth. Yet from across the long memory of civilization, the impulse to create was never merely mechanical. From yan Shies graceful wooden automaton and ancient China to Tallos, the bronze guardian of crete, our earliest machines were not tools.
There were mirrors, reflections of an ancient longing too, with the reflections of an ancient longing to understand ourselves. Zero withth emerges from that unbroken thread of imagination and hearing that, and there's so much more flowery pros. I need you all to see. The robot that they wrote that.
Okay, let's let's take it.
Why is he wearing a little Zo Polo shirt?
I love that that's your first question.
So listeners at home, what they've got is a robot that looks kind of like a cross between Elon Musk's shitty robot and a guy in a fencing helmet. It can't stand on its own power. They have like a sex harness built that's like standing it up. That's like so it doesn't fall on its ass, and they put an awkward T shirt on it, I think, to hide the straps.
From the thing that keeps it standing.
Jesus fucking this is the consumer electronic show everyone. This is yeah, they did. They are lying to you. Any motherfucker that tells you that robotics ry is coming, they're fucking lying anyway. If this is an AI add off to this, that's the fucking problem. Diane. I'm once again in scenic Las Vegas, and the locals are staring at me with daggers in their eyes as I insist on podcasting further. After rotating cubes in my head all day, I'm now rotating. My guests joining me once again is
victorious song of the Vergine, not remotely. You're wonderful and your very popular listeners love you as well. It's important for you to hear this.
Not from my ego.
You need the ego. Ed On Guaiso, Junior of the Tech Bubble newsletter and the incredible, wonderful stand up comedian. The start of the movie is this thing on. Chloe Radcliffe is joining us?
Yeah, what is hell?
Your first ces?
Yeah?
What do you think?
I'm a cees virgin? Wow, there's so many boys.
It's crazy boy.
No, no, no, no, there's so many hairlines. Is I should stay a lot of balls? Yeah, a lot of combs, Yeah, a lot of a lot of comb comb over ponytails.
Offer any hair stuff?
Yes they do.
Did you go to go to Eureka Park? There's always someone who has like some led hair bands situation and it's yeah that's good.
Yeah. So Chloe, you'll first ces. Have you seen anything that's stuck in your brain?
My biggest take has so far from being on the floor for a pretty limited amount of time, is that the theme is numbers that you don't need.
Okay.
I stopped at a booth that had a smart dog cage.
Oh, the smart pet crate.
Yeah, yeah, smart pet crate and it tells you your dog's It tells you your dog's heart rate and breathing rate, and then it also tells you the distance between the top of the cage and the dog.
Welcome to my useless numbers.
Uselessnessnumbers, And I said to the guy I was, I like, stopped and was Lena, And I was like, well, why do you need the distance from the top of the cage to the top of the dog? And he goes, well, that's how you know whether the dog is moving or not. And I was like, yeah, but you just look and he goes, well, but you're like looking at your app and so you want to know maybe if the number, if the number has stayed static for a little while,
maybe the dog has died. I said yeah, but wouldn't you know that from the other numbers like heart right.
To take your dog dead.
They're gonna ramp up to four hundred biometrics. That's something.
Your dog is Lena Dunham Inde. I love that well because it's like, if the dog's moving, couldn't emotion sense, I mean, there's so.
Many things, couldn't We already have pet camps whoever has whoever is.
Buying a smart pet crate also.
Already has a video camera trained on that dark's crane. That person is not doing smart crate over pet camp and.
They're like, hey, can you look at this graft?
Do you think I've got I've got two cats and a lot of cat tech. I don't need a crate. No, Like I got auto feeder. It has a little camera. And we did that because when we went to Italy, I was just like, I got to make sure these dumb cats are eating in between pet sitter visits. And literally day one I'm in Italy, I watched my cat look at me through the camera. It's pissed, knock cat rage, and.
I do need to ask if the cats were not eating between feed feeders, between pet sitters.
Yeah, what were you gonna do for me?
Nothing?
Nothing.
I was gonna call the pet sitter and be crazy lady and be like, my extremely ro ton nineteen point five pound cat is not eating.
It's now living off its own body fat and it will be fun. Yeah, and it has enough calories to support it enough. But yeah, So I mean that's the thing. I think that like all of these numbers that my theme of numbers that you don't need. What they wind up filtering into is anxiety. Oh yeah, it's like too much information leads to anxiety.
Senior cursed tech reviewer. Because I I'd test wearable. I have useless numbers for humans, yes all the time. Yeah, and just I'm completely overwhelmed and over inundated, and yeah, it's very accurate.
It would drive me insane all of the sleep tech I'm The thing is that I'm like sort of the wrong person to be here because I'm like, stay away from me with your with your numbers and your vibrations.
Having you here is good. We need that kind of energy because there's too many perverts here. Like, actually, we need enough number so we know how the space between your dog and the seeing the crate, but what if about what about the sides?
Yeah, how are they going to get that?
And also just I love the idea of getting a notification about what does notification say your dog is this tall? We've measured your dog.
Like the smart little robots they're now having like cameras so you can watch your cat go into the little robot to piss.
Wow, they already, they say, already weigh the cats as well, so you can see how much my like I can.
I can literally look into an app and go like, oh you lost zero point five pounds on that douchie, good for you.
What do you mean eating?
Brother?
Brother?
The only exception is is if I have a cat with a urinary thing, how my beautiful, big, beautiful and annoying, just like daddy. But he is this beautiful cat who he occasionally has pe problems. But you can mostly just get that by looking at your cat like you're just checking occasionally be like, oh, okay, he hasn't paid in a while. I don't need a four hundred and fifty dollars WiFi connected thing to be like, are you sure? I think that's how much they know?
They're like eight hundred dollars.
Fuck off, Sorry not to you, but the cat thing, Yeah, how much do you love your cat?
I love my cat so much. But a beautiful ARMANI suit. I assume god he'd look fetching. He's a big, big, white and ginger cat. Oh my god. No, I did get him a bow tie at one point.
Off, Oh I hear it. Yeah, I used to get my cats.
I had the both ties with bells so I could hear them because they would disappear into yeah, I didn't know where in the house, and they always would rip them off and leave them yeah outside.
Like a real fuck you, like just like that's where that ship goes, right, don't don't put bells on me. Yeah. I put a little cats on, a little tie on him as well. Once. There's so many good things you can do with the cat, none of which involve an eight hundred and fifty dollars piss measurer.
One time I tied a balloon around a tortoise. Didn't why because we kept losing it.
I lived and it kept getting stuck under the radiator, but then we wouldn't find it for a couple of days.
She was fine, but kept was just smoking around the apoblem with the ball.
Told version of up.
Yeah, she was trying to get taken away.
That should be at the but at the consumer electronic show would probably be like a wearable tortoise tracker with.
No no, you can steal a balloon, you can ruin a kid's day to get your tortoise found.
They would have like an optical tracker to read the tortoises temperature and it's art right, so you go to her app and be like, is my reptile alive?
Is what happened to you? It's just a tool slowly walking ye seven hundred dollars.
There's this video from an account I followed because of this video where they have a tortoise and they have a cat and the tortoise has a skateboard to follow the cat around all day and harassium, that's the tech I would get.
That's, you know, a little skateboard for my little guys.
You know, someday we're all gonna go.
Back, so is cats and skateboards. That's the real technology. Did you get any other numbers that didn't that don't match or make you upset?
There was a there was a sleep bot.
Nice.
I think I'm calling it the right thing.
It's a it's a smart pillow, okay, and uh it seems like the actually useful thing is that it's filled with these little like pneumatic air sacks that inflate or deflate based on your snoring to stop you from and.
That that beds. Yeah, okay, that seems.
Right, like I can buy that.
It's like that that that passes the sniff test. But this pillow also when you're When it senses your head is on the pillow, it turns off your lights, It turns off your uh speaker if you have a speaker plane, it closes your curtains for you automatically, and then it this is not a lie, texts your family that you are asleep.
And I took pictures.
Of pillow for a prison you know, I'm.
Going to close. I'm reading.
I'm reading the example text that it has sending a message to the family. Cassie Oscar has been detected lying down. Wow, Jimmy Oscar has been detected, lying down.
I am I am not making this up.
Doctor Larry Calibracy, Oscar has been detected lying down.
Text he has this is this is a prison pillow.
Yeah, this is just for what you do.
If you got that text, I.
Would be horrified. So funny, I mean everyone, and of course everyone who comes to see yes with me has to use I love the odor as well. That you're just going to bed, your your blind's rope and all of the lights are on you just blaring core when I assume and I have no way of doing any of this myself, So just my pillow will psychopath I know.
Sleep tech is all about like optimization. That's why my newsletters called like an optomizer. This whole beat of health tech and all that is just about having the most optimal something right. So they're like, oh, science shows that if you sleep in like X, y Z conditions, you'll sleep so good, So have a pillow, close all of these things so you're in the most optimal sleep environment whatever, and like, yeah, it is good to have an optimal sleep environment. It is good for you to do all
that stuff. But you don't need to fucking text your doctor calib races about your sleeping.
That would be such a strange text to receive, like he is, and especially with the way it was written, like Galactus.
Hated.
Also, the smart pillow doesn't like smooth out your bed sheets for you, you know, like all of this stuff that actually make it everything that actually makes sleeping good, which is like wear the right clothes for you to sleep in and.
Have the right bed you know.
It's like, I've done the digital sh I've done so much sleep tech testing, and the only thing that's really worked for me and my spouse is unfortunately, a five thousand dollars smart mattress cover, which.
Is yeah, I burn. I pay for one as well, and like people made fun of it because of the a WS thing when it went down, your bed wouldn't work. Yeah, that happens to me.
I think it happened. It definitely happened.
Like I need to sleep in an ice coffin, like I just my poor girlfriend, just like even for her, I'm just like, yeah, this is I sleep at fifty degrees like Dracula.
It saves marriages and relationships because you could sleep at different temperatures. I need to be a cozy little a cozy little gal normal.
Yeah, I need to be a little book bug in a rug.
I need to be like toasty. And my spouse also needs to be a corpse so we can set different temperatures.
I need to set to Dracula.
Yeah. And you know, they snore, and it used to be a thing where every every like day, I would hear them storing and I'd be like, what fuck up? So I can sleep? But now the bed actually just lifts when it detects and snoring on his side, no on our side. So sometimes I go like, oh it's moving, and I will fall right back asleep. But you know, ever since that happened, he doesn't wake me up snoring anymore. That's good, Like it's saved our marriage.
Wow, this is unfortunately you're selling me on this discover But.
Unfortunately it also comes with useless numbers, Like how can.
I useless number? Here's my psychopath thing? Though I have my numbers for my eight sleep and I have my numbers for my aura ring and they disagree all the time. I love it.
Yeah, same is like long term tusting that.
My favorite thing was I posted because I also use so many which is the thing that electrocutes for Actually what I love it. It's this thing that electrocute you head. It sounds insane. Just best not to think too hard. But like I posted my numbers on Blue Sky once, which was a mistake, and so it was immediate like you're not getting enough deep sleep, you should be really concerned. I'm like, I really had to stop myself being like kill you.
To be clear, the or ring is like they do a lot of science, they do a lot of research. They're only about like I want to say, seventy nine percent correlation between the gold standard of polysomnography. That's what are you guys dreaming a lot? No, I do have medications.
Dream that'll do.
My new medications are giving me night terrors really bad.
I heard them going.
I was like, you gott he's listening to no, no, he was listening to this stuff.
But he lied down on this pillow. You know he has night terrors. Yeah. He strikes me to kind of just wake up, like, yeah, I used.
To think when he went to sleep he would just be in his memory palace.
Yeah, exactly, like regarding it. Yeah, that's the thing that's well, it's like the basic things for sleep, like is it light in there or dark in there? Are you the right temperature? Are you comfortable? And it's like, yeah, but what if the pillow did all this ship you already?
I asked. I asked the people at the booth.
I was like, but what if I want to lay in bed and not have the lights out?
Yeah?
And he goes, well, you'd have to put another pillow on top.
What's great? What's so good about that? It is likely no one has asked them that. You're the first person to be like, what if I am in bed but not sleeping yet? He's like, fuck, how much was this? Did he give you a price?
I didn't even ask I should have asked.
It's probably, like.
It's probably my estimate is six hundred yeah, five dollars. It's always stupid.
N you could go on like eBay and get some like really nice sheets that will like some like Crisp Bokale.
Perhaps I've tested smart pillows in the past, but like it was a very different smart pillow was testing like my breathing rate?
Why not?
But it was also like it had a speaker in there so you could listen to your podcast to fall asleep in your smart pillow. And I was like, this is dumb. It's so dumb.
I'm someone who you know, I'm not trying to optimize sleep, but I do value the dream pertion of it. So is there really is for someone like me who's just like I, you know, I'm interested in deeper sleep. Does it make sense to go on the journey of trying out the smart attach it or should I just invest in.
I can't.
I don't dream on melatonin?
What about trust?
Usually melatonin will make your dream super intense?
I wake up?
What about magnesium, the one that doesn't make you poop?
I haven't done what is it?
I know?
I haven't I haven't tried a.
Magnesium I think it's magnesium glyconate makes you sleep, and magnesium sit trate makes you.
Ship relaxes you. Magnesium healthy aine. And then there's also you could try a GLP because one of the side effects of that is intensely vivid dream.
Oh yeah, I mean you know, I like I lucid dream regularly, which is why I'm like, okay, I'll do anything as accept whatever goes and fringes on that. But I've never thought too much about doing the tech beyond, like I'll just invest in really nice sheet, you know, and just to get myself really comfort.
The sleep measurement stuff sucks, but I really love the keat. I love the cold. I love the fact control over the end. I burn half I sleep and I look and I have like a full scale like blackout eye mask. I have a giant sheet. I like curl myself up in a ball. It's probably not great, Like it's probably not a great sign. And I'm just like cold and like wrapped in this thing like I've just blacked at, like and I wake up when my alarm goes off
and not a moment earlier. It's fucking great. I mean, I write constantly I think like, this is the only reason I can just like endless sleep. But it's again, the numbers do fucking nothing for me. I wake up feeling like shit, It's like you didn't sleep enough. Thank you?
Yeah. For me, the numbers make it so much worse because mostly if I'm having trouble sleeping, then a huge proportion of my brain is fixated on I am not sleeping and that is bad. And so then to have when they're like, this is going to help you sleep better, I'm like, no, no, no, it's gonna remind me how badly I'm sleeping, and that's going to make me sleep so much worse because every night when I lay down, it's gonna be like, well, tonight has to be the night that it is good now.
And get you loved ones get a text saying she's not sleeping.
Chloe has been detected lying down, but has not been detected unconscious yet.
Chloe has violated the rules of the Billows Sleep bought that.
That matric is called sleep latency. It sucks.
Yeah, what's the what how long it takes you to.
Sleep, how long until you try to go to sleep, and how when you actually fall asleep it's called sleep latencyy and you can kind of measure certain things by that. It's it's bullshit occasionally bullshit, but it's bullshit.
I occasionally really like I'll get like a two minute one of the fuck.
Yeah, well, like all it does. All it does is if you have a sleep and see under fifteen minutes, it just means you're really fucking tired.
And that's bad. Interesting. Yeah, wait, you mean like healthy people have.
About fifteen minutes to fall asleep.
Interesting, that's like a normal Take that boyfriend.
Yeah, like you're falling.
He falls asleep in forty five seconds. It's like if and then highlight there he helps angry.
Listening to him, get this peaceful rest that I should be enjoying.
I'm like, you fall asleep too quickly.
It could be one hour yesterday, Jesus Christ. Yeah, okay, seventeen six minutes, two days ago, thirteen sixteen and seven, seven sixteen, twenty eight, eight thirty three, one fucking fucking lost Friday, one minute, just fucking I think I was like in a moment with my girlfriend, I'm very happy. So that's lovely. Under that layer, all you.
Need is like a baseline and like the only point of these numbers is to build a long term base, and when you're off the baseline, you go like, oh, okay, maybe happened to me.
It's yet again to go back to sort of the theme of earlier, don't you know when you're off the baseline by I'm having trouble sleeping lately?
Yeah, I'm having trouble to sleep. Like.
The whole point of this is that they're trying to do something like illness prediction, and there is science that they can do that. Like during COVID they.
Were yeah, or is not great of that?
It actually is.
It hasn't been great for me.
I've gotten it where like the symptom radar is just like you're getting sick and then I would get sick, so like, but you know, it's not that helpful because it's like a forty eight hour button.
Though again I know I'm like, I know my throat has a tiny tickle, I'm about to get sick.
Like all of this stuff came from like when they were doing COVID research because it's asymptomatics. Okay, get like that sort of like, but.
This is the thing with all this wellness shit. It's like well, you can't be mad at us that it isn't really useful, because once it.
Was snake oil. That's my beat, snake.
Oil, snake oil cussed feet.
Yeah, I just I just sit here and go like, no, that's not true, No that's not true. Here's the nuance. And everyone yells at me and they're like you're a big farmer shell and I'm like, no, I'm not.
What the fuck does that? I mean, what do you mean a big farma shoe?
Oh. I wrote a story recently about the wellness wild West. It's kind of like a storyline that I read about a lot, and I was talking about how people shouldn't be injecting unapproved drugs. Ideally, even if it.
Peptides, yes, Chinese peptide.
Don't don't do that. Don't take GOLP three. It's not actually a GOLP three because the only people with access to the proprietary components to that is Eli Lilly. So whatever you're getting from China is almost one not a gil and.
You're not seeing GOP three is a problem. Just getting it from an unlicensed getting it from.
An unlicensed Chinese pharmacist is not a great idea. Bub reconstituting it yourself. You are not a pharmacist. I don't see any of you on TikTok using fucking sterile ingredients or sterile instruments or whatnot. Like I said that and they were like, fucking big sh pharma's shill. I can't believe me saying don't use unapproved drugs. Is me being a big farmer.
Show I'm this week, I'm using the new viral GLP.
From REDDA and Rada tu weey because there, you know the the videos. It was like, oh my god, here's week one on read. I'm like, first of all, you're not on REDDA, You're on some other fucking co The The thing that they're calling GLP three, which is also like not the correct way to call it, is redd a true tide.
I feel like if you describe this like a hunt, like I went to a mysterious man who handed me some pills, you'd be like, yeah, that sounds bad, you should go to the doctor. But this is like, well, not because I got it from the internet.
Yeah, I just was reading an article about peptides. Because not because I was like would those make my life better?
Not certainly, not that Not because I was thinking about trying them, and I read an article and there was somebody was quoted. Somebody was just saying, like, they're all over Silicon Valley and uh, like this crew, you know, Crypto loves them, AI loves them whatever whatever else, this other thing loves them. And whoever was quoted said, the only group that's a little more skeptical is uh. Anybody who works in biotech is a little bit more skeptical.
But they're just so in the pocket of the FDA, or they're so they're so uh they like bow down to the FDA. And I was like, well, the other interpretation is they this is the world that they work in, and they're steeped in way, way, way more information than somebody who works in crypto is about peptides specifically, So maybe their skepticism is like healthy and ractional.
It's partly like little like the FDA doesn't want you to have that. And I get where that's coming from, because you know, healthcare sucks in our country, it's expensive. These things could be helpful, but you're getting blocked from it. They are trying to, you know, make sure that they're making the most amount of money of it. Those are all true things, But the FDA exists. We have these
regulations because people fucking died. People died before, Like this is how people die or get really adverse effects because I don't know, but doctor matt On TikTok, who is most certainly not an actual doctor, telling you how to dose gray market Chinese peptides from like things you bought from Amazon. I'm sorry when you're in the comments and you're like, oh, yeah, I was vomiting uncontrollably.
Oh I wonder why.
I'm just doing weight loss math math.
I had such a distant sense of the GLP once because I've been learning about them from the way in which they're displacing insulin production in a lot of places, and I hadn't had a good sense of the extent to which I was like, oh, why are they calling
them Chinese peptides so incessantly? And that piece was interesting, and that time piece was interested in laying out one Silicon Valley's obsession with them and also making click into sense that I feel like we're seeing others subcultures be like, well like, yeah, of course you got to do it yourself. Of course you got a looks Max. Of course you gotta yeah, you know, like uh optimization.
Yes exactly.
I just want to be abundantly clear about something. By the way, we're not saying g o P one is a bad thing, like it's totally fine. I just want to be really abundantly to developed. I mean.
And one of the use cases is for like, you know, if you have, for example, diabetes. You know that, you know that's that's one of the uh the proven use cases. And yeah, gives it to you.
Yeah, as long as as you're not doing it in your bathtub.
PhD in philosophy teaching you that.
It's been so fascinating to see the extent to which people are like throwing a lot of uh reason out of the door just to be like, no, this is fine, this is okay. Actually, and you are a big Pharmachelle, if you are, you.
Know, maybe maybe you know body builders who already are a very lean taking GOLP so called GOLP three. Maybe that's not a great idea because they've actually never studied what this medication does in people with low body fact. You don't know what.
If you're going to do this, how many times are we going to do a wave.
Of a drug that does seem to have a really miraculous impact on people. And then you know the crusading group of power users maybe you know who are like, hey, you know, well, if you're not supporting everyone using it as widely as possible, then you're.
In the pocket of the I mean, side effects are a lot more. Yes, effects are real.
We may not actually want to have those side effects. And like, these drugs are so new, we don't know what the long term effect is. And it's not bad to say, like, you know, you're you're always doing a weigh a pro and con like I'm willing to do the side effect because the alternative is worse, and like, those are conversations you need to have with a real fucking doctor. Oh, not a comment section, not some billy bob doctor boo on TikTok. It seems it's.
Times.
The word A thought that I was having on the plane here is it feels like society as a whole, and particularly like the this this sections of society that are more online, that are more techified, that are more you know whatever for sort of forward in that kind of progression.
Uh have plenty of room for.
Skepticism when it comes to systems of like social support, but do not have room for skepticism about tech or so.
Yeah, yeah, just.
Like medicine, Like, oh, medicine, vaccines, why would we do that despite hundreds of years of evidence, Like they can't possibly be right because coach Matt told me on TikTok and it seems right.
And I mean I say this from a perspective of I've been very overweight in my life, like I used to be like three hundred and fifty pounds a while back, and it's like I get the desperation. Yeah, I get desperation, especially when it's like GLP one is like very GP three. I'm sorry, but it's like very expensive. You have to go to a doctor and all that, and just being like maybe I could do this cheaper, maybe my doctor won't give it to me, maybe whatever, And I get
that fucking desperation. You'll try it, Like when I've had weight problems, you're fucking scratching at the walls, trying to find some cheat code around the actual hard thing of changing lifestyle, which I should be clear, it's very fucking difficult. I have sympathy with everyone. I've been through it multiple cycles in my life I get it, but it's like to your point, Victoria, it's like, yeah, you're gonna get
side effects. I'd rather roll the dice on the doctor who's using the thing that they know the side effects, they've done trials and such, versus the doctor.
It's hard because you go to doctors and doctors don't listen to you. I have bekase, I have metabolic conditions. I'm on a GLP actually for it for like peacos and fatty liver, And getting to that point was over a ten year long journey.
Yeah, but these.
Are conversations I was having and I had to fire like five doctors because one was like listen to the Huberman lab no, or like maybe you should be maybe you should be a vegan. Fuck off. Not not to like say anything with vegans, but like that's not the solution I was looking for, or just being like, well, you know picos causes weight gain. Also the solution is weight loss, but also your body will not let you
lose the weight, so just lose some weight. And like I understand that desperation, like from a very personal level, but at the same time, you have to believe in science. You have to believe in like the process exists because people have died because side effects are also debilitating to quality of life. The worst part about being on a GLP for me is that I like food. I don't have a lot of food noise. I actually genuinely don't have food noise. My liver just wants to fuck me over,
and so like I can't eat. It's so it takes the joy out of eating for me. I don't enjoy it at all. I'm sorry, yeah no, And like I'm tired. I get fucking clown nightmares. I literally had a nightmare that my spouse's X came running after me and I was like, oh, this ho and then she turned into Penny Wise, the fucking clown, the Bill Scar's Guard version. I woke up screaming like.
This is the side effect I have, clown.
Yeah, no, that's a side effect I have. This is a thing, you know, and you have to wait those pros and cons for health. But you know, in the pursuit of optimization, and that's rampant here at CEES, people are like, yeah, numbers that don't matter, do this, do that, and it's like, this is why I have mental health problems doing my job.
But now you have numbers to help.
Yeah, yeah, now you have so many numbers.
I want to I mean, I want to go back to one thing that you said, which is you said you have to believe in science.
Yeah, because people have died, we've done this whatever.
I think that there's just a huge swath of the population, which is heavily represented here, of people who would just say, no, you don't have to believe in science.
It is lies.
It is you know, it is bunk, it is biased, it is whatever.
And that fracture is where I'm like, oh no, we've not just about science particularly, but sort of like the like communal agreement on some like really foundational social pillars.
Consensus reality.
Yeah, consensus reality is is like seems to be crumbling.
And it doesn't help that the leader of the FDA sounds like a fucking cyberman. Oh you know yet. Yeah, Now, we can't make fun of him. It's a physical condition. We can't make fun of him for that. We can make fun of that, for the fucking worm in his.
Brain, the warm in his brain, and the.
Whale corpse and the bare corpse.
I he keeps me up at night because in June he was like in four years. I want every American wearing a wearable and as we quantified people on the earth wearing three to four wearables continuously twenty four seven, three sixty five.
No, don't do that, so at that point we can rotate. Oh guess one last time, Thank you so much for listening. The upcoming AD I assume is not for weight loss drugs. If it is, well, I guess.
You know how we feel about that now, but that's not really my goddamn problem.
Welcome back to the better off line CS experience. We're just talking about wanking. I guess.
I was more specific.
I was saying, the flashlights are They're just okay, and so.
Why would be interesting take yes, oh.
What because you're oh, because I admit to using a sexat.
A man who.
Uses a sex toy. Women are vibrator vibrator vibr because men.
Are inadequate, because men, and if you say that women are inadequate, I will take deeper.
The next generation of sex toy.
Welcome. Welcome to a offline. You complained last year we didn't have enough woman, which was true. Now we've got one that's just immediately created. The fracture got you for two more days. As well as gonna be great hair now this chaos and truthfully having like amazing teams the
core better offline team for the show as well. And I'm actually like both you and Adam Chloe, you both kind of were like it's like like Adam, you've done a bit of tech cloth you've not done really and you're like, oh is this Am I going to be a right to do this? Because like I haven't done it. This is the perfect view because I think the really tech poisoned people are incapable of just being like that sounds fucking useless. That sounds dumb as ship even the
jack off machine. It's like, you're going to attach this heavy looking looks pretty heavy.
It didn't. It didn't look useful or necessary.
It's a we've already we've already talked about.
It doesn't look useful or necessary.
To describe.
Because we talked about the handy and Handy too in the previous segment, we didn't describe what it is. It's basically the it's called the it's it's a joke product.
People laugh.
It's like the inner core of the flesh light, which is like, okay, a flesh light if you're not familiar. You know, the sticky hand from the vending machine of the supermarkets.
Trust that is that material.
That's the material you put lubin in and it's squishy, okay, and and again just okay. As an experience had I got it's been in a drawer for years, right and I got it, uh for free, by the way, because I used to do a comedy show in a sex shop in Los Angeles.
Wonderful show at the pleasure chests. But uh, I didn't pay for it, but so.
Imagine I would have. It was on my list.
I support the industry genuinely, sup.
It's just it's a squishy core of a flesh light and then it's attached to a velcrow harness which is attached to like a big piece of metal machinery that that moves it up and down.
And I'm like, I have hands, Yeah, I just And.
Here's my pitch.
Here's my pitch for an analog version of that is take one of the actual sticky hands that you actually stick on the window, and put some lube on that and put.
Just hold that on the problem of your hand.
And check that out that it's gonna feel like it's somebody else's hands.
Here's here's what I would like.
I would like a woman to stand across the room.
I must I must also be clear, by the ways. So I looked up the handy too, and I just want to be clear. There are two SKUs. And there is the standard, which is one hour of battery life save sixty dollars launch price, and it's regularly two hundred and niney nine dollars. And then there's the five hours of battery.
Oh, the cooner package.
Yeah, three hundred and seventy nine dollars down four hundred and ninety nine. And you scroll out and it's like, we recommend the FoST charger handy, And I just got to ask how much you? How much you doing that? Yeah? Well, he purchased the award winning VR compatible Automatic stroker. Think, but isn't the isn't.
The point of it V? It's VR.
Come on, I mean, you're watching the poeos and all that, But but isn't the.
Point of the device that it's supposed to be very fast, supposed to make you come fast?
Really?
I would think so.
They should put it three four hours of battery life.
Yeah, I know, I just they should use like most of that battery life for a little screen where you can watch some porn on it while you're gone.
It's just really like people that don't have sex or jack off. It sounds like it's just like the least sexless people.
I would love to know that the man who is horny enough to want to use the jack off machine, but so dedicated to tech that when he goes to pick up his jack off machine and the battery is dead, he goes, I have to put it on my fast charger now and wait for seven minutes for to give up battery life to make.
Me come to thing his fo like sonic a hedgehog sitting on.
His hands, being like, there's no other way to do this?
Does this ever happened to you? It's just I must be This is a sex positive podcast. It's great, sex wonderful. It's a great thing between consenting adults and wife fu tubes, I guess. And it's just very strange to look at another product on the show is just like an alien made this, Like what what do you need? You can't jack off? I guess, or you really want to. And also I just feel like just there's a masturbata that's
a great thing to say. I just feel like picking this thing up, I would just be consumed with shame immediately. The only thing would make me more ashamed would be if it was out of battery. Mm hmm, you're like, fuck, I've used it. Yeah, just like I'm too into this.
See now, this this is my pet peeve because I think when you see be consumed with the shame, you're ashamed of your own sexuality. Yet that's what's happening, is you as you are a shamed the idea of masturbating with a device.
Why why Because my hands can do it perfectly fine, that's I can have.
Why shame?
Why?
Why shame?
Why not?
Why not amusement? If your hands can do it perfectly fine, Like I just.
Well already we're in this weird world where I wouldn't buy it.
Yeah, Like so it's just would you feel a shamed not not a shame?
Would you feel shame if you picked up a flash light if you were going to use a flash light?
Or is the machine worse? No, I just feel the machine laughing at you.
I just have never seen this.
We're now going on the show, or just that one's like, how does that jack off? It's just like the idea of the unnecessary. To me, I don't like something else.
That's because maybe the male sex toy is not a jerk off device, because we can do that perfect. The real male sex toy is a butt plug, and men won't buy them. That's it's prostate stimulation.
Yeah, that is you know if you like that, that's fucking cool.
I like, my problem isn't And you know what, maybe as a guy who just like he's like a sex guy and he likes all the different kinds, Fine, that sounds fine. I just think like if I got a machine that was out of batteries for jacket off and it was unpowdered, be like, I've been doing this a lot, haven't I do?
The do the sex toys have big useless numbers too? Oh god, I wonder if you haven't been coming lately.
You haven't you come?
Wait and see.
The distance of time between when you begin to jack off.
It's like a little prompter you okay, you haven't.
And when you are off the baseline that.
Is when you I'm actually looking out to see if there's any metrics that come discrete delivery, I.
Mean discreet delivery.
One nice.
What if what if withings made a sex toy and then it tracked your you know what I mean, it gave you some stats.
The gooners might like that some jerk off so.
What yeah, like, oh, how about like a special watch for.
Jerking on off that like Matt, you know, they have like a stat line. It lets you know how efficient you're being and.
How much time you spend, like you know, how on treadmills.
You can follow the little workouts where it like shows it it's like it's gonna get faster now, and then the treadmill goes faster, you have to run faster, and then it's like now it's slower. If you're if you had a little like if you had a little gooning workout line where it could be like go faster now, and then it's like slow down, so down, sow down, sow down, and you like follow your little workouts.
I mean.
You're describing joy videos.
I just want to read something.
It's a really good form of video porn.
I think those are like it's very kind of wholesome because it's sort of like I want someone.
To instruct there's a relations there's.
A relationship about the jerking off.
I just want to be clear. There is a button on this website to lead you to various videos. It says explore the handy verse and handy verse. I don't feel great having read that.
The greatest sin that Mark Zuckerberg has committed on the phase of this planet.
He's giving us blank verse. We got that done. I'm close.
We got the handy verse with sixty nine.
What actually, oddly, like, what is handy feeling? There's like a whole thing and I'm like coming around to this, like this isn't for me, but I'm like, okay, if someone's a real beat offerer, like this is quite nice.
I don't know.
The reason I feel shame is because I feel like we're falling for it because this is a gag product.
We're talking about it.
No, this is real. This is just like a real thing that charge in frint.
It exists, but I don't think it serves it's to laugh at it. Cees and devices know if I agree.
Like, here's the thing. Woman sex toys very well documented and used and talked about quite.
You've seen pictures of them, yeah, very.
Also like women discussed them. I feel like, Adam, You're like one of the only men I've talked to about sex who's just not immediately Yeah, I've had it like one million times, but I can't discuss it at all. Yeah, but it's like I believe that, like, there are men who jack off in this man, I'm good on them as long as it's like normal and consensual, and like.
I could be wrong. I just don't believe in this product. I believe in sex toys for men.
I believe they're underrepresented a category, but I believe where this product is situated in the hall and the way that they have designed it.
Yeah, yes, Okay.
The only one I saw was the love Sense one, which was the vibrators. I was like, okay, I saw that last year also, so I was like, okay, that's the one I know.
It's in the Eureka Hall and it's sort of position it's like meant to make you laugh. And I think it's a five hundred dollars back big.
But was it a big it was it a big booth?
They had a big booth, then that's a real company.
Because well, look, men called it big, women call it.
Yeah, it's just a regular size nice. Yeah, but that's the thing. If they have a regular sized booth.
It's a perfectly normal sized booth.
It's a good get biga during the show, if like that's a real company, because otherwise it's just like, yeah, we've one hundred thousand dollars in the jack Off booth. I do, I do? Let the idea has spoken of, I can have a goat.
Hey, come on over to the jack Off booth.
Come in, Uh, everyway, both anyway in the booth for you.
We're going to segue away from this, right.
Here's a question that is sort of off of this theme. As a Cees virgin.
Right not to really lean into this kind of language.
Uh, how many of these products, Like, there are a lot of products that seemed absolutely fucking useless. Yes, And what I don't know is how many of the people who are here earnestly believe that what they are hawking is going to make the world better in some way, and how many people like what what is the percentage split between earnest believers?
Uh, people who are here for.
A paycheck because they need a job and this happens to be the job they're doing, and people who are totally disillusioned but are still doing it for the paycheck, but like, are are totally jaded?
I would be curious.
I think what it is is like you get a job. It's hard getting a job, and you get the product, and it's like, well, I gotta fucking believe in something. So you learn the talking points and you're like the pillow thing you were talking about last piece, It's like that person clearly had never had a conversation with someone who's like, yeah, but what if I want to lie in bed without falling asleep? Because they've memorize the talking
points and they've internalize them. I'm sure that there are a percentage of cynical people, but I think a lot of these people have just like not thought about it too much. They're like, yeah, the air purifier with the spike on it, the dog scratches itself on. That makes perfect sense because I've been forced to believe it because this is how I make money. And I think that there's something kind of sad about it because you have to believe. I mean like there's a certain degree at
times when you get a product. I don't do consumer electronics, but like in the past where I've had to be like yay, even go, it's like it's gonna pay mortgage. Like, I think that that's a degree of that. And I think some people just fucking stupid. I think some people are just like, yeah, they said they isn't it cool it can do this? And they focus on how cool it is. And then when they think two sex and they go, oh, fuck, this is one alien would use.
This is like it's just like stall Trek accept nothing like it.
I think.
So.
I also think a lot of them are just happy to like do the job.
Yeah.
You know, like when I went to the ORB thing, my ORB debacle, all the people I told, well, whatever, people know about it or they don't. But when I talk to people who work for this horrible product, like some of them seemed kind of enthusiastics. Some of them sort of had thousand yard stairs yeah, where where I was talking and going like, ah, they're making like three hundred grand a year probably yeah, working for like a sam Altman company doing interesting work. Like they're like they
wanted to be an engineer. They're a software engineer. They're working on something that's tech technically interesting. They would like for it to work. They sort of have to drink the kool at exactly in the same way that someone who's like working on a shitty movie.
Is like I'm living the drink. All the movie kind of sucks, but I'm living the dream.
But you're gonna be good.
It's gonna be good. I'm making movies like it's this. Yeah, that makes suspension of disbelief.
But I respect people of movies way more. Like, just do want to be clear, Like learning about how movies are made. Recently, it's insane a single movie has ever been made. Yeah, I do not understand how any movie is made.
Well they're not made anymore.
Well, yeah, that's that's also the other thing. No, they're either one hundred million dollars or one million dollars.
The movies when you watch movies now, like I you know, I was watching like Rob Ryner movies because he passed away, of course, and watched like Harry Met Salary another movie like that. It's like walking through like the ruins of like a Roman Colisseum in the Dark Age is like look at what humans.
Used to be able to do, Like it's and then you watch Stranger Things and there's a big crab and win on a Ryder punches it to death. You just I don't watch that show strange enough already and it's just sad. But I think I think movies are gonna be. Okay, I'm choosing to be optimistic for no reason.
Yeah, yeah, I mean that's a sort of a whole separate yet whole other conversation. But I do think that there's a lot of people who would say, like the same people who are who are who.
See movies as sort of the dinosaurs, the things of the past.
Are the people who see a lot of shit at CST, who sort of willingly drink the kool aid of a lot of the shit at CEES and are like, this is the stuff of the future without actually even being paid three hundred.
Thousand dollars by the company because they want to be first.
They want to, but they sort of have gotten on the roller coaster of they're addicted to the high of u the possibility of success, the newness.
Yeah.
I mean, I remember when it was over ten years ago now, but I was working at College Humor and stuff like Google Glass would come out and.
My coworkers would be like, it's it's gonna be.
The future and just based on the premise alone, and I have to be like I don't think so, yeah's right, same thing happened with the VR.
You know you wait, Adam, Google Glass is coming, ray Ban Meta glasses.
People were so they had the script in them for I think, you know, and they want it to be true. They just want something new that's gonna be fun.
I also, I'd be curious what you think, because you know you've been coming to see us for a while.
How much of it is Also people at a firm that tried to sell something to another business and it failed, and now they're doing consumer because I feel like I would talk to some people, especially in Eureka Park, and they wouldn't say it, but you could hear in the conversation that there was a much more ambitious plan and that fell through, and now they're winning to something else that a consumer might be able to use.
It's the raw economy, baby, It's growth of all costs. Because if you solve a small, boring problem for a million people, that fucking rocks, is that gonna be worth ten billion dollars new you're gonna be able to take that public? No, you can sell it to enough company. No, But if you say I'm gonna solve fucking everything, forever you get hundreds of millions of dollars because you've just over promised and being part of this newness futuristic thing
and vaguely attaching yourself to it. If you're wrong, you can say, oh, it is experimental. If you're right, you can say I was fissed.
Yeah. But and that's sort of to what Adam was saying about, you know, wanting it's my language now, like wanting the possibility of success addicted to the high of that possibility. But everyone you were saying, I think you're saying like the U when you're saying that they had
a more ambitious plan. Do you mean they had a more ambitious plan for what the tech itself could be capable of or do you mean like they've had They've figured out a tech that is capable of whatever it is, and the ambitious plan was to use it in a much broader use case or a much higher scale use case. And now they've sort of been like shunted down to a bof a ces where they're trying to make somebody pay six hundred dollars.
It feels like they thought the idea was worth ten x what it actually is. An example, I mean, I saw it a lot more last year where it would be people talking about tech that would be that's helpful assistive tech, but their initial formulation of it seemed to be we are going to apply this at scale and workplaces to augment your.
Productive for like standing up the thing for opening the cash rep.
Right, you know, something like that, where it's like not even really clear that would be adopted at an individual scale.
Well, so that one really pissed me off because it's like, you don't give a fuck about anyone, you don't love them in the eye, No, you were excited about touching a screen towards it treats you little.
You know.
It feels like it's like we wanted to sell this ad scale to like McDonald's at a bunch of other fast food restaurants, and that didn't work. So now we are cobbling together some of the IP to figure out another approach that might be usable in smaller UH settings.
And I feel like, you know, when I talk with people, especially in some of the assistive tech, you know, where they're not really talking about it in the way of we're helping people who are disabled or helping people who need mobility it's it's it's it's almost adjacent to or sounding just like how we talk about convenience.
Yeah, you know, did you see anything today that was of note?
Like I mean, most of the stuff that I saw today in Eureka Park wash more misuse of agentic language and saying oh no, let's you know what if you had a chat bought that you know, managed your home Google calendar and told you when to pick up your kids because you forgot, or you know, when we got because you don't give us ship. You know what, if you have something, I would look at your ship and tell you when you're sick or not sick.
You mean literally your poop?
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah no literally, yeah, you poop.
That was one thing that Victoria. We didn't get to the piss poop. We go to the com sadly, but it was like there's a many different toilet measures. Now.
Yeah, oh I saw a good product, yes, and I would describe it. I walked I saw this product, I looked at I immediately recognized what it was. I walked up to them.
I said, fit Bit for your cat, and they said, that's what you know, fit Bit for your cat. You're going to sell that, and it's like a little food dish, food dish and a bubbler for your and then it like, I don't know, has some stats about your cat, and it said like here's how much food is left, here's the temperature of your cat, and then it just said healthy.
Yes, and that's it's like, really, all the cat owners what.
It's like, Well, could it could the box say my cat's healthy and it'll relieve my anxiety and.
Your cat owner, yes, I have, I don't know, like and it's the only measurement is like how beautiful they are like that, which I remind them of constantly. I just how holt my cat is is very funny.
Yeah, I got two cats.
And it's like when I learned I got a I got one of the letter boxes, those automatic ones. When I learned there was an app, I asked them, can I do.
I need app? Can I delete that?
They're like yes, And I was like, okay, I will never look at this ship again. Yeah, And it works out.
You know that anything that even wears other or has a little motor other than.
The litter box, they destroy. They swat it, they throw.
It down the stairs, they push it, they literally catch it. To the stairs and throw it down, so I can't get anything smart for them.
I get a fit bit for a dog, though, because you like woke them. I would love to, actually, just for my sick pleasure, know how fast Barbo runs because him and his sister Pokey too bad. But no, they just they will be sleeping all day and then just run into bam, just fucking like across the entire house, gone back.
They're trying to get their steps in exactly like just.
Cats like don't experience the same things that human being, Like, they're not seeing that being, Like do I run around a lot? They get the instinct like I need to fucking run so fast in a straight line, fast than I've ever But it's not because they're like I need to be healthy. They just fucking cat Stop trying to optimize my cat. Bro, My cats. Cats are not optimal other than how beautiful and fancy they are and how beautiful I miss them, anything else, like it's just this.
You're gonna be here for another two days. You're gonna see more stuff like this.
But I'm general I saw something we all need and present ads inside of AI. How to put ads inside of chatbots, how to put ads inside of any sort of interface or product I might use the genitor of AI.
It's so cool they haven't worked that out, I know.
Yeah.
That's also like the most obvious thing that they need it the way that they would monetize this fucking thing. Yeah, the one way to make the one way that every per I get three emails a week from someone being like, have you thought that they could put ads in chat jept? Yes, motherfucker, I've fucking thought. Every single time you've emailed me about this. I've thought about it.
Do we know why they haven't yet?
Because it's very hard to guarantee. The whole thing with ads is you need to have applicability and reliability and accountability. You cannot have your you can't have like an ad for a children's thing by someone looking up sex and vice versa. And the best example we have that this doesn't really work is Perplexity. Their ads chief left a few months ago and they made twenty thousand dollars selling ads in twenty twenty four.
Plex They Yeah, I mean the needs of advertisers like determine everything.
Yeah, Like you know, why does YouTube wor the way it work? Ninety percent of.
YouTube is to please advertisers, so to make sure that you know, age verification, like content warnings, like all of it is just for them and like they'll sort of run the show. But also isn't part of the problem that like advertising is not enough money for you know, the massive amount of investments these companies are taking on, like.
You put ads and chatgy, but you're saying enough, yeah, yeah, it won't sustain trillions.
Well, the other problem they have is the information and a good story about this where it's like nine hundred million weekly active US is ish even though Opening Eye
double counts people all the time. They admit this and they're on academic papers, but nevertheless only one hundred million if those are in America, which is a large number whatever whatever, But that means like they're mostly overseas who are lower value advertising plans, because there's a very big difference between to advertising someone in America versus in India or Indonesia where they release chat gpt go, which is the cheaper one, which will inevitably be advertising support it.
And it's just like I do love that there are like different boots of people being like what if we could solve the problem the open Ai, Google, Perplexity, and multiple other companies just haven't been able to touch. It feels like watching the end of the world in a very boring way at times.
Well, so that's what brings me back to my that brings me back to my question about how earnestly do these people believe in what they're pushing. Like are there people who are like, yeah, yeah, yeah, we are the we have the secret key, we are the geniuses. And sure would I be hired at Google if I was really a genius. Maybe, But that's not what we're talking about, right.
I think that they at the very least considered themselves to have be the holder of a lottery ticket. Yeah, maybe it'll work. And if it works, I'm a billionaire. And if I can convince someone it kind of works, maybe I get Aqua hired by Google, and then I make half a million dollars yeah, you know, and like, and I only have to get to like, you know, next month to make that happen.
I just got to convince some dopeoo's here right now.
I believe all the TV people believe it fully, and I get it. And I'm a big dumb ape. I see a giant scream like.
Yeah, baby, oh yeah, I want to see the TVs at this so goo and I got mad because I saw I think I was looking at the Vergis coverage or something, and there's a new TV technology that's better than I MINI bought the best. I bought the I bought the you know the one, the one really good Sony one. I got the really good Sony. I'm like, I don't want a fucking better TV. This is as good as TV's need to be. Seventy seven inches, it's true black.
Stop.
I don't know.
Just to be clear, you'll you'll find they haven't really made better than that.
Like I know it'll be in ten years. I'm still just like, stop it.
I don't know if you're gonna have kids.
But I've heard a couple of dad sentences, both in this TV discussion and earlier when you were like, now I saw a good product.
I'm oh yeah, but I was able to buy this TV because I'm not as price sensitive as a real dad, because I don't have the kids.
That's why I got to get the get the get the good one.
And it's like, as a child have a that's the normal way to say it, Like big screen, big Screen's fine. It's like, you got a big screen, that's the coolest thing to shoot, big screen, giant screen, to play Minecraft on your fucking best father in the world.
Two so you can both play it in separate rooms, so you don't have to talk to me exactly what they want.
One of the most cherish things is watching my son play Minecraft explaining shiit to me. But we're not talking about a normal thing. We're talking about what the consumer wants separate themselves.
We're talking about what that guy who did the tweet about how he gets boiling mad if he spends more than ten minutes with children.
Did you see this?
There's some dad was like, am I normal? If I spend more than ten minutes? Was it day with my children?
Day?
My blood boils? That's normal?
Right?
But everybody was like, hey, buddy, that's not totally normal. But like, we totally get it. Being a dad is hard.
You're a balance, you know, for that is, but not like ten minutes should not because you can you have a lot more of those in the day with the child than that.
Yeah, I mean, it seems like this guy doesn't have to.
But it reminds me of when when you know, the COVID lockdown first happened, and all the parents and the ones on the internet were suddenly like.
Someone needs to help me from being around my kid. I thought you liked having the kids.
Now you're mad that you got to be around the kids. Why do you Why do you have the kid if you don't want to be around them. And it also makes you realize that like, oh yeah, the main purpose of school was not education. It was just childcare so people could go to work. That's why they're complaining. They're like, I need to go to work.
Well, that's You've just revealed a fucked up thing about school and parenting all at once. I actually think that's the lens. I'm going to go through everything tomorrow.
I'm just going to look around the exposent to being like, okay, what's the shoot where it's just people like I need to get away from my obligations, like I made these fucking decisions throughout my life. I got a fucking fast, unhealthy bitch of a cat I got.
We were all waiting on what that last word was gonna be.
There some options.
It's like cat okay. He's saying cat okay.
So I wasn't referring to any of my perfect fucking angels, but it's like these people were just like, Okay, I need to find it if my cat's healthy, because I don't want to look at it or use it. Can I keep my child in the separate room? Can I give it an action figure that can go a.
Robot and an action figure that will talk to each other.
And and also if you want any of these things, don't worry. They don't fucking work. They don't even do the thing that we're promising you. But it's funny. Just imagine this guy is walking and being like, please get me away from all this. Can this is the robot gonna be Oh, the robot's gonna fall over. It's falling over. It's gonna kick me in the nuts. Do you see that video the guy just getting fucking hoofed in the
nuts by That was great. If you've got a bootho guy's being kicked in the balls, I don't care what you're selling me, fucking Lockheed mouth.
I mean, so that made me kind of sad. Like there was one that was I don't want to say the name of it because it did make me sad, but it was a little It was like a little toy, like a little Hello Kitty type toy, and.
It was, you know, you could talk to it.
Was it the one that was like the future of robot Friend.
Something like that. It was a funny.
It was also like it'll watch everything that you do and remember it. And I was like all right, and I and I walked up and I was like, oh right, what was it doing here?
It is?
I was like, oh, can I talk to it? And she was like no, you know, the Wi Fi is in here.
In here is bad and it uses chat GPT, so it can't connect to chat GPT right now. And I'm like, this is just some somebody put like a couple hundred grand of their own money into like a little doll that connects to the Chat GPT API and is here thinking that's anything, like like, why would we want such a thing? Why would anybody here be excited by just a front end to chat GPT a product that already exists.
But that's the thing I think. I feel like, as we're rapids a good way to put it. It's like there are two there are two real cons with AI. There's the con of the consumer being told it will do this for you, that for you'll be a personal assistant. And then there's for companies that are like, yeah, if we put chat GPT in this, it'll be smart. No, motherfucker,
he's not gonna do that at all. And it's like it's you don't want to name the company, which is fine, but it's like there are so many that were there last year as well. It's like, oh, it's an agent. It's like it's just a fucking chat bot and you've poorly trained it and it's like gonna tell you that Taiwan is part of China or like BDSM shit like, and it's just quite sad. It's like everyone is being conned by these companies. Yeah, both the consumer and the
companies themselves. I can't wait to catalog them. I'm looking forward to watching the sadness. But it's just it's it is quite sad. I'm so glad I'm here a week. This is great, my dark my joker, Like it's a shrug.
It's a shrug economy. Like everyone just sort of hoping.
Like I was talking to people about the Disney open a ideal because that's like a bunch of people in Hollywood. Yeah, like freaked out about it, especially writers who are worried about IP and stuff like that.
But like my take on if you look at the deal is nobody even knows why they're doing it.
Yeah, Like open Ai has the idea that, like, we need licensed characters for Sora, and Disney just doesn't want to be left out. Yeah, but like they think, they appear to think maybe it's marketing for Disney. Plus open Ai has some idea maybe people will want to create scenes of Deadpool hanging out with Elsa or whatever.
How does that result in money? Question mark? Nobody knows.
Yeah, it loses money, But like Disney is just like not getting left out of a thing. That's maybe the future. Open Ai is making a deal that makes their business look better to whoever the fuck is gonna give them money next, and they didn't even pay Disney for it.
Like they're doing a licensing deal where they pay Disney in open Ai stock, which Disney already bought more of, and in fact, Disney has the option to buy more stock. It's just you gotta wonder what happens when open Ai collapses, because he's gonna fucking help. And it's just like these companies will change to the Chinese models, I guess, or what remains of anthwer It's.
Just everyone can use quin.
Yeah, the quick Kimmy took too deep sea.
Gotta be fine.
Well, all right, I'm gonna wrap it there so I don't just launch into a rant about AI as per fucking usual. Thank you so much. We've got the core three here. It's gonna be joining us the next day or two. It's gonna be wonderful. Thank you so much for traveling in with us. We're gonna end the episode as we have, dedicated to Sean Paul. He's a wonderful fella. Came in twenty twenty. Donate to the Pediatric Epilepsy Research Consortium. Link will be in there, dedicated to his son. Thank
you so much everyone for listening. We'll be back tomorrow. Thank you so much. Thank you for listening to Better Offline. The editor and composer of the Better Offline theme song is Matasowski. You can check out more of his music and audio projects and MATTASAUSK M A T T O S O W s KI dot com. You can email me at easy at better offline dot com or visit better Offline dot com to find more podcast links, and
of course my newsletter. I also really recommend you go to chat dot where's youreaed dot at to visit the discord, and go to our slash Better Offline to check out our reddit. Thank you so much for listening.
Better Offline is a production of cool Zone Media.
For more from cool Zone Media, visit our website cool Zonemedia dot com, or check us out on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.