Bengals Booth Podcast: Set On You

mind is set on Joe Burrow. He'll explain why. Plus we'll discuss John ross Auden, Tate, AJ Green, and much more, and getting back to Joe Burrow in honor of his LSU uniform number nine. Bengals offensive coordinator Brian Callahan answers nine questions about the possible number one pick in this year's draft, which as of this recording is only forty

eight days away. All of that is straight ahead, but first, here's a quick reminder that you can add the latest edition of this podcast delivered right to your phone, tablet, or computer by subscribing on iTunes, Stitcher, Google Play, Spotify, or pod Bean. It's the greatest thing since find my iPhone. On a recent UC basketball road trip, I lost my iPhone. I searched my pockets, my luggage. I searched the team

plane and the team bus. No luck. Then someone reminded me that if I had an iPad, which I do, I could use the Find my iPhone app. So I clicked the button and a map popped up with a glowing circle that showed exactly where my phone was. It also allowed me to remotely lock the phone to prevent somebody else from using it, and type in a message to help me recover it. As it turned out, it was on the team plane, just extremely well hidden. Hopeful I won't lose my phone again, but if I do,

I know I'll be able to find it. Now, let's get to Greg coo Sell. During the season, Dave Lapham and I do two radio shows together each week, the Bengals Game Plan Show on Wednesdays and the Bengals pep Rally Show on Fridays, and one of our favorite guests is Greg coo Sell. He's worked for NFL Films for roughly forty years and is a master of watching game tape and breaking down the intricacies of football in a

way that all of us understand. Last week, I got together with Greg at the NFL scouting combine, and I began our conversation by asking him about Joe Burrow. Is he the guy the Bengals should select number one overall? Yeah, that's an organizational decision, But I like Burrow a lot. I think Borrows the best quarterback prospect in this draft. My guests has given Inny Dol's age that they're going

to look to the quarterback position. My guess is that Zach Taylor would probably like a quarter back that he that's his guy, and with his background, you know, the McVay Shanahan type background, I think Joe Burrow fits that exceptionally well. I think Burrow has pretty much every trait you look for except for elite arm strength, but I think his arm is strong enough to do what you need to do in the NFL. Certainly, if you're thinking of, let's say, as Sean McVay type offense, Joe Burrow can

make every throw that Jared Goff can make. And Burrow plays with kind of an uncommon poise and composure and awareness. In some ways. In that regard, he kind of reminded me a little of Tom Brady, just the way, you know, just a poise with which he plays it seems like nothing is too fast for him, nothing is too chaotic

for him. He's very comfortable. He's very accurate, and I think that's a trait sometimes that gets overlooked because there's been so much talk over the last year or so about quarterbacks that can run around and make plays that people lose sight of, just the to make accurate throws from the pocket, precise ball placement throws. And I think Joe Burrow is really really good at that. I know from previous conversations we've had with you. You like quarterbacks

that have that pocket awareness. Yes, not necessarily going to take off and run for twenty yards, which he can do, by the way, and he certainly did in their biggest games at the end of the year, but have that unique ability to move up a little bit left or right, step forward, whatever, just to buy a little extra time. Yes, and he's very very good at that. And you know, I think that Burrow can do that really well. He can get out of the pocket really well. He can

play from the pocket really well. You know, because you have to remember one thing. We all get enamored with these guys who can make run around plays, but that's not how the position is taught. The position is taught within structure. When you start with OTA's minicamp whatever they call him these days, I don't I don't know what the term is anymore, right, right, right, But when you start and you start coaching players within your offense, your

coaching them within the structure of a scheme. You don't roll the ball out and say, let's run around today and see if we can make a few plays. You coach it and teach it within the structure of a scheme. And it's whether it's three step drops, five step drops, deeper drops off play action, and that's how it gets taught. And I think that that Joe Burrow can handle all of that. I think that you know, from the standpoint of playing with timing, he can play with timing in

quick game. He can be late in the down in the pocket and still make throws. So to me, as I said, I think he has every trait that you look for other than elite arm strength. And there'll be different conclusions about that based on its relative importance depending on who the individual is. You know, different people have different points of view on that. But he certainly does not have a below average arm does that ever get better in the NFL, do guys go from having average

to slightly above average two good? I think so. I think there have been quarterbacks. I think, to me, Tom Brady fit that category. Tom Brady ended up with a pretty darn good arm. Don't forget he had to throw balls to cut through the wind in Fox Borrow and he never had a problem with that. I thought Drew Brees, I mean until recent years. Obviously he's all he's older, but I thought Drew brees arm strength got a little better as his career progressed. So Joe Burrow is never

going to have a hose. He's never going to be Matthew Stafford. But I think you can improve your arm strength a little bit. And some of that has to do with just working on your mechanics and repetitive mechanics. I'm a big believer in that, and I think coaching is so critical the quarterback position, you know, I think repetitive mechanics become really important. So so Burrow's arm could arguably get a little stronger, but it's certainly not a detriment.

Right now, we're talking to Greg crow Cell from NFL Films and the NFL matchup show on ESPN. Did the offense that he ran last year at LSU translate to the NFL? Well, it was an NFL offense because it was Joe Brady who was at the Saints and now is in Carolina as their offensive coordinator. So, you know, I think you saw a lot of concepts. You know, I even made this point NFL vertical pass game concepts and LSU offense double post cross or dag or post

in or go h seemed flood eh sale. You know, a ton of NFL concepts, So Burrow's familiar with those. They were in a ton of high low concepts against zone, which everybody in the NFL runs. It's just it's all how you get to these concepts. There's not a thousand route concepts, Dan, it's how you get to them. And you know, the LSU did a really nice job with that. Joe Burrows familiar with those. Some people say one year wonder because he made such dramatic improvements statistically, at least

from his junior year to his senior year. Should that be something that concerns people? You know, you could argue that it's coaching, which, like I said, I'm a big believer in you'd like to believe that NFL quarterbacks do get coached. That doesn't bother me because he did play the year before. He was not a one year stater. He's a two year stater in the SEC. See the offense the year prior was different, not as conducive to putting up numbers as as offense was in twenty nineteen.

But to me, numbers are numbers. When I evaluate a quarterback, I'm trying to isolate the traits, the attribute to the characteristics of the quarterback. Obviously had very good receivers, he had a really good back. They had a solid tight end and Thaddeus Moss, so they had players that gives you numbers, But that should not influence or impact your evaluation of the quarterback because you still see the traits now. I, in the case of full disclosure, I did not see

Burrow in the year before on tape. I saw other quarterbacks, but I did not get to him last summer, so I only have twenty nineteen tape as my foundations. It's a lot of games. It's a lot of games, a lot of dropbacks, and I watched almost every game, so I saw I don't know how many drop he had five hundred and forty eight drop backs, So of those five hundred and forty eight, I probably saw four hundred, so I felt that that was a good enough number to be able to get a sense of what his

traits are. A couple more questions for great co Sell. You've got some Manila envelopes in front of you from the players that you've been studying to this point in the draft process, and I know you've taken a long look at the wide receiver. Everything I hear from people is this is one of the deepest wide receiver drafts ever. You can kurk I do. I do. Although to me, and again this is all based on film study because I don't work for a team, so I'm not interviewing players,

and I know that matters in the process. But to me, as far as the receivers, I would look at Jerry Judy from Alabama as clearly the number one wide receiver prospect in this class. So the Bengals have the first pick in the second round, first pick in the third round, although I predict they're going to trade down in the second round to get more picks. You heard it here first, so you don't think they'll draft at thirty three. I don't, okay, now, I know they want more picks. They only have one

pick in every round. Obviously they have a lot of holes to fill. They're not going to trade out of number one overall. They want Joe or so. It just seems to me when the first day ends and all these teams see players left on the board that had mid first round grade, somebody is going to offer a nice package for the Bengals to trade down. That's very possible, and it probably makes sense for them to do that.

It's a deep receiver class. Depending on who the team is, I mean, and how far they drop from thirty three, they can still get a quality receiver. I'm no good Dan at this. You know, knowing, you know who's gonna be there. You know that that's not my thing. But you can get quality receivers. Now, it comes down to what you're looking for. Because you know, everybody loves lists.

I'm not a list guy. Because there's I mean, if you want to take all the six three or six four receivers and put them in one bucket, that's fine, but you can't compare a six three, six four receiver with kJ Hamler from Penn State. That's a pointless comparison. You know, kJ Hamler came in at under five nine and about one hundred and seventy five pounds. You're not comparing him to Michael Pittman at six four to twenty three. So then it comes down to what you're looking for

in the context of your offense. And you know, is aj greenback? What's their view of autumn tap? You know, players, how do they see the players that are presently on their roster? Is Tyler Boyd? Is he truly a slot guy? Is that where they want him to be in an ideal world? You know, these are questions they have to determine as they go both into free agency and the draft. I know you thought that John Ross was a good prospect coming out of Washington. What have you thought of

his play when healthy? I think he's shown flashes. I think that the health issue, though, is when you can't get around, you've got to be able to play. You've got to be available. And he's not been available because we don't know how he would have progressed if he'd been able to play in games. I mean, has he been in the league three years now? Yes, he missed almost his entire rookie year. So how many do you know? You may not know offhand, but generally how many games

has he played in his second year? He played a decent number. Has he played in a full total full sea a number of games yet total, probably, but maybe about seventeen eighteen games in three years, and probably a lot of those games he didn't play full games, correct, So you know, do you this is rhetorical? Do you still believe that he has a chance to be a really good receiver or are you ready to cut bait so to speak? You know, I thought that he was pretty skilled coming out. We know he can run. I

thought he showed some route running ability in college. But he's not on the field, so that's you know, unfortunately, that's the problem. Yeah. The sad thing is at the end of three weeks last year, he then led the NFL in receiving yards, right, then he got hurt, right, and there goes another year, right, you know, And it's interesting. I'm very curious and maybe you know the answer to that they're feeling about autumn tate because I remember autumn

tape coming out of Florida State. He was a little overweight, but there was something about him I life, you know, So you have to evaluate a receiver for what he years. You can't watch Autumn tap and go, well, he's not a good receiver because he's not fast. Well, yeah, I know he's not fast. He's six five whatever he weighs now, but when he came out he was probably two twenty five maybe, you know, he looked like he slimmed down

a little, just slicking at the tape um. You have to evaluate him for what he is, and I think for what he is, he can be a pretty good player. Now, is he Julio Jones? No, he's not Julio Jones. But I think he can be a really solid player. You know, whether you want to call him a number two. Everybody wants to get into these designations of receivers, you know. But you know, I think he's an interesting guy going forward. He's like a really good detached tight end that isn't

asked to block. He uses his body, he gets open, he catches everything in his vicinity. He's got a wide catching radius. He can go up and snatch it. No, I think he's you know, you're not You're not playing autumn tape to say Hey, let's go vertical, and let's run deep posts in nine routes and let's go on top of corners. That's not why, That's not what he is. And if you view that as a weakness, then you don't understand the player. You know again, and I guess

much comes down to AJ Green. Now, whether he's back in Cincinnati or not, they will franchise tag him if they don't sign him to an extension. So yes, he will be there for at least one more okay, and ideally he can stay healthy because I always loved AJ Green. I know he's fought injuries over the last number of years and he's not a kid anymore. But at his best,

you know, he was explosive. I mean, not many guys at his height, and he wasn't heavy, but he was still two hundred and twelve two hundred and thirteen pounds. Not many guys that that size could move like AJ Green. If you're going to have Joe Burrow starting every game as a rookie quarterback, would be nice to have AJ Green as somebody to throw it too. I couldn't agree more.

I don't think to me, one of the worst things you want to do well, and obviously you can't fix every hole because their online is an issue, and you know, we haven't discussed that, but it probably doesn't need to be discussed. It's an issue. But the one thing you

got to be careful of is you get borrow. You don't want to have a bad, bad online and that's maybe another thing they need to address, you know, with more pet because often you can get offensive lineman second, third, fourth round who can be quality players, but you don't want to have a bad online and you don't want to have no weapons because that's just not a good way to start a career as a quarterback. I could do this all day, but I'm not going to force

you to spend a half hour chatting with me. However, here is my hope that the Bengals get good again so that you will be watching them regularly for the matchup show and we will have you on more during the season with Dave Lappaman some of our Bengals radio shows. All Right, Dan, I appreciate it, Thanks so much. Thanks Greg. How great is Greg co Sell. In addition to that conversation, he was kind enough to share his typed out evaluation sheet of Joe Burrow and allowed me to post it

on social media. It includes all sorts of great nuggets about burrows strengths and weaknesses, and had the following conclusion. Burrow consistently exhibited the needed traits poise, vision, larity, timing, pocket efficiency, precise ball placement, and second reactionability. Burrow is a high level prospect with a chance to be an

outstanding NFL quarterback. All right. Time to move on the Bengals offensive coordinator Brian Callahan and a long conversation he had with reporters who cover the team on a regular basis. I've pulled out nine interesting things he had to say about Joe Burrow in honor of Burrow's uniform number at LSU. And I should point out that I thought that Callaghan was extremely candid in discussing Burrow, considering that he's not

a Bengal yet. Coaches in front office execs are often tight lipped leading up to the draft, but Callaghan was anything but. So here's topic number one. As Greg Cosell pointed out, Burrow displays innate feel in the pocket. Is that something that can be taught or does a quarterback either have it or not have it? I think it's one of the things about playing quarterback that is an innate ability. You can you can improve it, you can get better at it, but you definitely can't inject it

into somebody. So either they have some feel or they don't. And he's Joe's gotta be in spades. He's got a great natural feel in the pocket. Um, you know, just guys that I've been around, some have really great feel, some have okay feel. And then I thought, you know, you can get better though. There's things you can do to get better. You can improve it, you can drill it, you can do as much as can. But really, at the end of the day, it's such a feel based

thing for quarterbacks. And the guys that are the best at it, when they keep their eyes down feel and move and slide and find receivers. M those are the guys that you don't need to look at any go odds. That's I can't teach that. It's like teaching somebody to run fast. Like you can improve speed, you can get faster, but either you're naturally faster you're not, you know what I mean. And he's got the natural a building in

the pocket. Topic number two in his ten previous seasons as an NFL coach, Callahan has worked with two quarterbacks. So where the number one overall pick in the draft, Matthew Stafford with the Lions and Peyton Manning after he went to the Broncos. Does Borrow share any traits with the number one picks in ninety eight and two thousand and nine. They don't put themselves in that position without

being kind of wired the right way. Their preparation habits just Payton and Stafford to pay notoriously the best, one of the best ever when it comes to preparing and Stafford quietly, he's probably right there up with them. They're two really really impressive workers. And then they're talented on top. So you put their talent on top of what they do with the work in the mental part of it, and then you get that you get number one overall type. That's kind of what you hear about this kid. That's

that's everything that I've heard that's been out there. So, yeah, it'll be fun. Unfortunate, it'll be if that's the way it goes, and I get to go for a third number one overall pick a quarterback and it's great. Usually usually means good things. A topic number three. Last year, the Bengals finished thirty if in scoring and twenty sixth then yards gained. The quarterback is one of eleven guys on offense. How much of a difference can he make? But a bit? I mean, I would say that we

need improved play account across the board. On offense. You certainly weren't good enough for long stretches of the season, but they can help the production and they raise the level. So you know, let's say you're in a one possession game. Well, the difference between a one possession game sometimes is what

was your success right on third down? If you're in the thirty thirty five percent, that's very average, And all of a sudden, you get a guy that can run for three first downs or two first downs in the game, and now you're up in the fifty percent, and I have extended your drives, and now I've extended good chances to fourth points. So I think that if you're if everything's being execu at a better level, at a higher level, you got a much better chance to score points and

win games. I think. So it certainly wouldn't fall on one guy. We need to get better in a lot of places. Guys had to play better, from top to from receivers to backs. It's offensive line, The whole thing has to get better. So but when you got a guy that can that can distribute the ball and play really at a at that type of level, you certainly expect to be better on offensive topic Number four. As a junior in twenty eighteen at LSU, Burrow completed fifty

eight percent of his passes and through sixteen touchdowns. As a senior, he completed a ridiculous seventy six percent of his passes and through an even more ridiculous sixty touchdown passes. He went from sixteen to sixty. It's been well documented that assistant coach Joe Brady brought concepts from the Saints offense to LSU last year, So how exactly did that enable Burrow's performance to skyrocket installed the very pro style mentality as far as getting guys in space and matching

people up. They were in five man protection quite a bit, and they did a really good job of exploiting those people that they had and putting a position to be effective. And sometimes when you look you look at his eighteen tape, they didn't do quite as much of that. It was more just this is how we're going to run the system. And I will say, if you watched the eighteen tape his trajectory as the season gets towards the end, it

starts to go like this. You start to see all the things you saw this year, just in a larger scale because it was more game tape of it. But I thought he improved through the end of eighteen, and I think you see him do some things that he didn't do in nineteen. So he's understenter a little more, a little more understand the play action. So there's things that he's got such a variable skill set that I think he's gonna fit however, however you want to put

him in an offensive scheme. But I do think that some of what they did and that the scheme in nineteen played the strength of his anticipation and his accuracy. And that leads to an obvious topic Number five. Since Burrow was so prolific an LSU's offense, how does that

compare to what the Bengals do. They ran an NFL passing game as far as the drop back passing game goes, So there's not a whole lot of things that that you watch their tape and watch ours and see that there's there's definitely we have very very very many common concepts. So you know, it's the West Coast in nature. Sean Payton is where Joe Brady got a lot of that stuff from in the drop back game, in the empty game, So that's not all that foreign. I mean, there's a

lot of things that that are the same. Now, they did a little they did a really nice job and some of the RPO game, and there's some things that they did that we thought were good that we will bull at some point, whether Joe's playing for us or not, we'll probably end up taking just because it was good, good solid scheme. Topic number six. Callahan has watched every

snap that Burrow took at LSU. Many of us watch Joe against Alabama and in the College Football Playoff wins over Oklahoma and Clemson, and in those three games he threw fifteen touchdown passes and no interceptions. But were there plays that many of us didn't see that caught Brian Callahan's eye. There's a couple of plays where you see him and the movements so subtle, and he takes just a slight slide in the pocket as he's slidding in it,

he makes a really accurate throw on third down. To me, those are the ones that make it really that stand out to me when you're watching just the finer points of everyone sees the big ones. You're right, there's all these crazy scrambles of moving. But it's the ones where he's he slides once, or slides slides right, slides up or pushes up and he makes an off platform throw but the ball puts puts it right in the spot where the guy can catch him. Those are the most

impressive to me. Those are the more that's the most translatable skill you see as that happens over and over again. You know, you know, the big plays are the big plays, they're they're great. You hope you have a lot of them. But that's the subtle movements that he does so well and then delivers an accurate throw Topic number seven. As Greg Cosell pointed out, Burrow does not have exceptional arm strength. When Callahan watched the tape, did Burrow's arm appear to

be strong enough? There's been nothing on there that says that he can't make any throw you're asking to make. You know, there's there's multiple times where he throws balls to the field to the far sideline where you go, yeah, that's that's more than enough. That's gonna get you everything you need. His deep balls I think got better as the year one on. He had a couple earli in the year where you're like, what's is there enough there?

And then I think he puts most of those things to bed when he when he throws some of the balls and he threw there's I have no reservations about his ability to throw the ball. And that leads to a natural follow up for topic number eight, just how important is arm strength for an NFL quarterback? I think you have to have enough. I mean there has there's there is a baseline arm strength, and I think you

have to have that. But I think what makes playing quarterback in the NFL so much different is that the anticipation and the accuracy are so much more important over the long haul of than just pure arms strength. You know, there's a lot of guys that can really throw it.

There's and you know, you look back at the history of guys, there's a lot of guys that will come here and throw and oh boy, that looks great and they're in shorts and they can look pretty, and the law comes out and it goes, it goes far, and it goes fast, and then you look at them playing the game and you just don't see the same thing. So to me, and sometimes it's a little bit like forty times, and there's guys that run really fast, but they don't play fast. There's guys that throw really hard,

they don't play well. So you kind of try to factor all those things in. So there's a baseline, certaintly that you have to be able to make with the velocity in your ball, But to me, the accuracy and the anticipation are so much more important than just pure armstreng fine lay topic number nine. The Bengals have missed the playoffs for four straight years and are coming off

one of the worst seasons in franchise history. How much can a quarterback drafted number one overall invigorate the entire franchise. Anytime you add a caliber player you're gonna pick at the first overall pick in the draft, no matter what the position, can certainly certainly lift your team. It does

provide an excitement. There's an excitement that you're taking a type of player that can really push your franchise forward, you know on the flip side, not such as a quarterback, but we took von Miller in Denver at two overall and that injected as a whole different type of life on our defensive side of the ball. We felt good about offensively where we were. But that lifts the whole thing.

It makes the confidence in what's going on that much higher that you're going to get an impact type of player. And really you're picking a top very round, so you should be adding three or four impact type of players that build meant they walk into building, they're helping your team. So I think that's there should be some excitement about that, Like there's no you don't like to be in the spot and hope to never be here again, but you hope that when you are in the spot, you the

most of them. So there you have it. In honor of Joe Burrows uniform number at LSU nine, Candid answers about the Heisman Trophy winning quarterback from Bengals offensive coordinator Brian Callahan. That's going to do it for this episode of the podcast. Next week we'll hear from NFL draft expert Dane Brugler. If you haven't done so already, please subscribe to the podcast and if you have a minute, give it a rating or share a comment. Five star

ratings help more Bengals fans find this podcast. I'm Dan Horde and thank you for listening to the Bengals Booth podcast