Bengals Booth Podcast: Learnin' The Blues

from my broadcast partner Dave Lapham. Then, in this week's fun fact segment, you'll learn that Frank Pollock is not only a great offensive line coach, but a sensational storyteller. The Bengals Booth Podcast is presented by Ultimate Bengals, the free to play Next Level Fantasy Football game downloaded now from the App Store in Google Play. And here's a quick reminder that you can have the latest edition of this podcast delivered right to your phone, tablet, or computer

by subscribing wherever you get your podcast ASTs. It's the greatest thing since eighty Bryant. The current season of Saturday Night Live isn't doing much for me, but the one cast member who consistently makes me laugh is Ady Bryant. Whether it's her physical comedy, intentionally weird pronunciations, or one hundred percent commitment to the musical. Shorts like the one about regifting a Christmas candle, Aidy Bryant elevates every sketch

she's in. So here's to my SNL MVP Ady Bryant, with a thumbs up to Kate McKinnon and Keenan Thompson too. Now let's get to Sunday's game. After the two teams traded punts on their opening series, the Bengals force the forty nine Ers to punt again. The second time they got the ball, Wishnavsky lets it rip, Phillips, moving forwards, struggles to catch it, leases the ball. He muffed it. There's a wrestling match for the ball and the forty

nine Ers recover at this Cincinnati twenty three yea. So the forty nine Ers took over on the cusp of the red zone, and while the Bengals defense did not give up a first down, Robbie Gold kicked a short field goal to give Sam Fran a three nothing lead. Phillips was briefly injured when he muffed the punt, and Stanley Morgan took overs. The Bengals kick returner. He promptly muffed the ensuing kickoff before recovering and getting tackled at

the fourteen. Cincinnati overcame that and drove to the San Francisco nineteen before settling for a field goal in the red zone that tied the game at three at the end of the first quarter. The Bengals d only gave up two first downs in the first quarter, but Kyle Shanahan is too good of a play designer and the forty nine ers have too many good players to shut

them down all day. Second down at eight, the Bengals twenty seven Garoppolo fakes a handoff, no he did give it to Deebo Samuel, spreading to the right, turns the corner down the sideline into the end zone, touchdown. St. Francisco. Deebo Samuel is listed as a wide receiver, but he frequently lines up at running back, and that twenty seven

yard run gave the Niners a ten three lead. The Bengals cut the margin to four when they drove into the red zone again before settling for a short field goal with one forty two left in the half, and it looked like Cincinnati might score again when the defense forced to quit three and out one oh seven left and a half. The forty Niners half to punt way up into the air. Phillips calls for a fair catch and the balls it's recovered by San Francisco at the

Cincinnati thirty yard line. Second muff punt of the game for Darius Phillips. Phillips did not return another kick or punt for the rest of the game. Here's Mike Kilton in my opinions, one of the hardest job is to be a punt returner. You know, you got guys screaming down and you just got a number one kissed the ball in. You know he didn't do it, but we're not losing confidence in him. We know if he gets the ball in his hands in space, you know he's able to make plays for us. Those were the first

two umbles that Darius Phillips has lost this year. The Bengals defense has been phenomenal this year after turnovers, only allowing two touchdowns the first seventeen times they took the field after a turnover, and it looked like they were going to come through again when they forced an incomplete pass on third and seven that would have forced a field goal. Try, but on the play, Von Bell was called for taunting to give the forty nine ers a first down. Was it a good call? Here's Zach Taylor.

I didn't personally see it, but it sounds like it was. It was probably wispen called historically this season with taunting. But I gotta be careful because I haven't seen you yet. But something feedback was that that's kind of wispen called. It was the second time this year that Bell has been called for taunting, and this time it cost the

Bengals four points. Cooppolo catches the shotgun snap, he's back to throw, has time, looks around, floats it down toward the two caught pie Kittle extends the ball to the pylon, touchdown out. San Francisco. Man talk about mistakes, fumbles, penalties, taunted, penalties, all it is a self destruction. It made the halftime score seventeen six, San Francisco. Here's Sam Hubbard. You can't beat yourself. I think that really is what comes down to it. The good teams they don't beat themselves. They

will make those mistakes. And we want to be a good team. You know, we do a lot of good things. There's bright moments, But when it comes down to it, there's situations where we can't make the mistakes we've been making the last two weeks to win games. As for tight end George Kittle, he destroyed the Bengals all day, finishing with thirteen catches for one hundred and fifty one yards. We tried everything. He's one of the best tight ends. We've known that for a long time. And you know,

he had similar production last week. I think he almost had two hundred yards receiving. And it's it's not like he surprises people. When a guy is that explosive and that big, that kind of hands, that catch radius, he makes a lot of ways, and I promise you, we try to like hell to take him away, and he just he finds way to make those plays. The deficit got bigger in the third quarter. The Bengals opened the second half with three straight running plays and had to

put on fourth and one. The forty nine ers answered with a field goal to take a twenty to six lead. The Bengals responded with a nice drive, marching to the nineteen, but a sack knocked him out of the red zone and forced them to call on kicker Evan McPherson Harris's snap, Hubert puts it down. The kick has plenty of distance and it is wide left. Told it left. The misery extended for the Bengals today, as they are having a wide variety of failures in every aspect of the game.

To that point, there had been three muffs in the kicking game, a taunting penalty on defense that turned a field goal try into a touchdown, and three trips into the red zone on offense without scoring a touchdown. It seemed highly unlikely that the Bengals would rally from fourteen down in the fourth core, but then again, they have Joe Burrow and he was close to perfect for the rest of the game. Fourth down in five in the red zone, the Bengals line up to go for trailing

twenty to six at the seventeen of San Francisco. Three receivers left, one right. Burrow has the ball. He's back to throw, scrambling left, turns back toward the right, running to the right, looking down field, throws into the end zone. Oh Baby to catch in the back line around touch down Bengals Jamar Chase hauls it in have The Bengals are alive with nine twenty to go. It was hard to tell on TV just how remarkable that play was.

Is Burrow threw the ball in the opposite direction of where Chase was running in the back of the end zone. When I threw it, he was still running left, and he did a great job of you know, we were just on the same page. I knew exactly when he was seeing, and he knew exactly what I was seeing, and I he was running left. It through it right, and he put his food in the ground and went

and got it. I don't really know why he did that, but he was just saying, you know, he was throwing the ball away from the defender because the defender got a ten of SIPs which way. I was like, man, that's really kind of smartn't you know what I'm saying, food me off the So that was actually a good play by him. That made a twenty to thirteen, and the Bengals defense got two straight stops to give Burrow

a chance. The first time they got him the ball, the Bengals had to punt, but the second time, Cincinnati started at its own thirteen with two forty to go and drove down the field to tie the game one twenty five on the clock, a two by two formation, Burrow back to throw, looking firing deep for Chase in

the end zone. Touchdown down Joe Burrow and the Bengals as he delivers to Numero uno, Jamar Chase, one nineteen on the clock as he beat Thomas and now the Bengals will line up for the extra point with a chance to tie it with one nineteen to go. You couldn't put that ball on a better spot. I mean, Chase ran a great route and Joe Burrow threw the ball over the outside shoulder. The only guy that could make a plan that football was Jamar Chase. Unbelievable catch,

better throw. Here's Burrow and the Bengals come back. And we've kind of been a second half team the whole season. We figure out what we're seeing and then we go and attack it. You know, it's a's four quarter game. You're gonna have ups and downs throughout the game, whether it's in the first half of the second half, and you just got to finish strong and try to find wins.

The only negative about the touchdown was that it left enough time on the clock for the forty nine ers to answer and a nineteen yard pass from Garoppolo to Kittle on third and ten gave seventeen year veteran Robbie Gould a chance to end it. On the final play, forty seven yards away from the left hash to win it for San Francisco. The kick is on its way. It's a line drive kick. It is oh good, he missed it. Edward I handed over time tide at twenty. The Bengals won the toss and got the ball, meaning

they could win the game by scoring a touchdown. Burrow hit Te Higgins for twenty six yards. After a run by Joe Mixon got stopped for no gain, Burrow hit c j Uzamba for a gain of twenty three. It was first and ten at the San Francisco twenty six. In the fourth quarter and overtime, Burrow went eleven for fifteen for two hundred ten yards, two touchdowns and no picks, for a passer rating of one fifty four point eight.

But rather than letting Burrow go for the juggular, the Bengals handed it to Mixon for a gain of four, then handed it to Joe again for a gain of three. On third and three, Burrow dropped back to throw and got sacked. Joe was asked about the play calling on the final drive. Whatever play calls is called, we're gonna execute to the best of our ability. We had a good drive there, we just weren't able to close it out.

Joe wasn't about to publicly second get the coaches, but Zach Taylor second guest himself when he was asked the following question by my former colleague at Fox nineteen, Joe Daneman, is there ever a thought as a play caller when the quarterback's hot to stick with a hot hand and ride him. Yeah, yep, I agree with you. You know, it's it's it's that. That's one that'll keep you up at night. You know, we got a quarterback that can win us a lot of games, and you know there's

maybe one more pass instead of a run there. Sure, if we hit that run, I feel great about it. But we didn't, and so then you go back to hindsight, and I'm sure I'll feel a lot of that tonight. Evan McPherson kicked a forty one yard field goal to give the Bengals their first lead all day, twenty three to twenty, But that meant the forty nine ers would get a chance to either tie it or win it.

From the twelve yard line. Garoppolo fakes a handoff short throw caught by a UK ten five dives for the pieline. He goes out of bounds first. Wow, he's out of bounds at the two where it will be first in goal. After a few it is a touchdown. Came over. Wow.

I'll bitterly disappointing defeat for the Cincinnati Bengals. They rally from fourteen down in the fourth quarter, take the lead in overtime, and cannot stop to San Francisco forty nine ers from driving seventy five yards for a game winning touchdown. The final score San Francisco twenty six, Cincinnati twenty three. Not as painful as Montana to Taylor, but still painful. Here are Sam Hubbard and Mike Hilton drive at the end. You know you got to stop them there, and uh

we didn't. So I'm proud of you know, I love the guys on my team that we went out there in battle. Nobody I don't even know what we were down at one point, but we just kept sticking together, getting stops, climbing back into it. Nobody you know, pointing fingers, But uh yeah, it's tough. It's tough, tough to win in this league. These last two week we kind of dug ourselves in some depoles that we weren't able to get out of. And you know, it's too lossy that

we feel like we played to our standard. We should win those games. And we know as a team we got to start faster and we gotta finish finished like we've been finishing, but that first half, we just gotta come out with more urgency and in more fight. Had the Bengals won, they would have moved into a tie for first in the AFC North with the Ravens, who not only lost in Cleveland on Sunday, but saw Lamar Jackson taking off the field on a cart with an

ankle injury. Baltimore has dropped too straight and the Bengals couldn't take advantage of the opportunity. Here's Burrow and when the one of the teams that you're fighting for the division with loses, you you got to take advantage of that, and we haven't been able to the last two weeks. So you know, like you said, missed opportunities. The Bengals would no longer be a wild Card team. If the season ended today, they fall into ninth on the AFC

Totem Pole and seven teams get in. Cincinnati's final four games are at Denver, home against Baltimore, home against Kansas City, and on the road in Cleveland. All four teams have winning records. The Bengals Booth podcast is presented by Ultimate Bengals, the free to play fantasy football game. Ultimate Bengals will be awarding a weekly winner during the course of the season, with tickets, autograph merchandise, and money can't buy experiences all

up for grabs. Find Ultimate Bengals in the App Store and Google Play. Now time for postgame analysis with my broadcast partner Dave lapham Lap. This is a second guesser's field day, as the Bengals drove in overtime down to the twenty six yard line. They had at first in ten and called two straight running plays that didn't work very well. Eventually, Joe Burrow got sacked and the Bengals kicked a field goal that did not turn out to

be the game winning points. Zach Taylor is pretty candid When asked about it after the game, he said, yeah, I kind of agree with you. I'm probably gonna have a hard time getting to sleep tonight. Yeah, I think he is. You know that that ended up getting a little bit curious, particularly the way that they were They were moving the ball through the air in big chunks. Not just that driving overtime, but the drives in the fourth quarter. I mean, Joe Burrow was unbelievable in the

fourth quarter. In fact, it was unbelievable for the game. But I think the game came down to two things. Turnovers. The Bengals went minus two with the kicking game funnels of all things. Man, that's a killer. In red zone. I mean, these are when the number one and number three offenses in the NFL and touchdown red zone touchdown percentage efficiency, and the forty nine ers went two for

four scored two touchdownes. The Bengals go one for five in the red zone, only twenty percent conversion as opposed to the fifty percent in a game that you lose in overtime. In my mind, that's a massive difference right there. George Kills awesome, He's had as many as fifteen catches in a game. He's mad that had more than two hundred yards in a game. He had more than one hundred and eighty. Last week against Seattle, he had thirteen catches for one fifty one today. Why can't a team

stop George Kittle? It's remarkable, you know, and and you look at it. I mean, they've got good recite wide receivers, but it's not like they have you know, Jerry Rice and John Taylor out there. You know, Kittle, he just he seems to He's so savvy, he's so smart, he's so strong, he's so physical. He's just just as as good a football player as as I've seen, honestly. I mean, I don't care what the position this guy approaches. Every single down that it's the last play to win a

Super Bowl. Every single snap this guy takes, He's one of those one of those guys that you just you feed off his energy and enthusiasm. I mean, he is so serious. He takes the game of football so seriously that it's contagious. It's it's unbelievable to watch the guy perform. This is a really costly, painful loss, a chance to move into a tie with Baltimore. We don't know what's going to happen with Lamar Jackson, who has carted out today, you're down by fourteen and the fourth quarter rally to

tie it, to take the leading overtime. You were in the locker room. How devastated was that room? It was? It was quiet, quiet in there, and guys were you know, the one of the many smiles, that's for darn't sure. And and they just were very reflective, stunned. In a lot of cases. Um, you know, it's like in those situations. I've been in those situations, and it's almost like a bomb goes off, you know, and you just don't know exactly what happened, why it happened, how it happened, or

anything like anything else. And uh, and I don't want to be that dramatic, particularly with what goes on in today's world, but I mean, it's it's it's just it's almost uh, it's it's almost beyond comprehension that that something like that unfolded the way it did, you know, particularly after the amount to come back, you know, and you

get back in two weeks in a row. Now you know, they're down twenty four nothing to score twenty two to make it again, and then never take a lead though and this one though, they come back from down two scores in the fourth quarter, tie it, take the lead in overtime, and then don't finish it so they're closer. But still, man, they just have to they have to quit the self destruction. I mean, these teams are good enough teams. We say it every week. These teams were

all fighting for the playoffs. They're good enough to beat you. If you help them, you're done. You're cooked. Forget it, it's over. You can't help football teams beat you by stupid, silly mistakes, whether it's dumb penalties, turnovers, whatever the case may be. You just they're gonna have to be eliminated. And think about it this way too. In the last

two weeks, they've had four turnovers that weren't forced. Two muffed punts today that led to ten points, that Jamarches juggle that are raised to seventy one yard touchdown and became an interception last week, and Joe Mixon's fumble where it wasn't really forced. He was just kind of doing a jump cut and lost control of the ball. I mean, it's bad enough to commit turnovers, it is ten times worse when the other team doesn't even force it. Absolutely.

I mean that's just like saying, here you go, I don't want this football game, you know, I really I can compete with you, but I'm still gonna let you win it. Here you go, I'll just give it to you. The only one that came close for them from a turnover standpoint was Jimmy Garoppolo dropping and think took up for tour Us bounce. But other than that, I mean, they played like a playoff team in terms of taking

care of the football. The Bengals didn't, you know, And I'll guarantee you Darren Simmons is fit to be tied. I mean, he's probably pulling hair out by the roots as we speak. I mean, because I've heard him so many times say to return, guys, the primary thing, the biggest thing I need out of you is an ability to track the football and catch the damn thing. Heard him today In a game the Bengals wind up losing by three points. They handed San Francisco four points? Was

it four? Final margin? Four? No? Three? Because there's no extra yeah, said twenty six, twenty three. But they gave San Francisco four points. When vone Bell gets called for taranting absolutely and that one, you know, I understand the intent, but the pendulum has swung too far, you know. And it's when you're when you're in a hotly contested game and the emotions are high. There's nothing wrong with a

little celebration of a play that you made. I mean, it's it's not like you're in a guy's face and mocking him, and it's just you know. The thing is, though, you have to realize that if you're going to do this, separate yourself from somebody and do a celebration. Don't walk up to it. When he walked up to an opponent and did it, he's done, he's done. He maybe had something to say too. You can't do it use somebody else as a prop in your celebration. You can't include

anybody else. If you want to just you know, let it, let energy and you know, emotion boil. Do it alone, Go find a quiet spot to do it. Man, those things are killer. That was so costly unbelievable. All right, So we have been going through the negative and there's lots of it. Let's talk about the biggest positive. Joe Burrows unbelievable. He estimated his velocity at eighty to eighty

five percent because of the injured finger. Today, three hundred forty eight passing yards, two touchdowns, one hundred and sixty one yards in the fourth quarter alone when they had to have it. The dude stepped up and delivered time and time again. The future is so bright with this guy at quarterback. And he sprayed the ball around. You know, that's the thing too. He goes five times to Higgins

for one hundred and fourteen yards. Every one of te higgins catches were nineteen yards or more, you know, all of more. That's two weeks in a row that he's caught every ball he's caught his fifteen yards and more, and today it's nineteen yards a more every single catch. He averaged well over twenty yards a catch. Five catches by Higgins, five catches by Chase, four catches by Zama, four catches by Tyler Boyd, four catches by p Ryan.

I mean, that's that's unbelievable distribution of the football. That's that's spraying around to all quadrants and being patient with what they're doing. And he's unbelievable. He is such a competitive guy. And with that said, uber competitive, but always unbelievably composed. He has the perfect balance. I mean it's like that's juggling act to be that competitive. But never lou, you know, never go over the top where you're hurting yourself because your emotions. He has the perfect recipe, the

perfect formula for success. It's amazing to watch the guy nothing flusters, the guy saying stone face during the entire football game, pregame, post game, in the press room, doing press conferences. He is amazing. Nor the word to describe it. As we chat post game. We don't know the status of Trey Hendrickson. It obviously was scary when they brought out a cart just before halftime and then he got up and walked to the sideline and walked to the

locker room. So that was encouraging, but I'd be surprised if he's able to come back next week. Yeah. I mean, back injuries are tricky. I mean, I don't know where it is. You'd assume it's lower back, but you just don't know. Um you know, I have I've had an issue in my back that was between my shoulder blades one time, and that was about as problematic as anything because you know everything you're doing with your upper body and your shoulders and arms you know, and and then

back injuries in general. I mean, when you're messing with your spine and your back and the muscles that's around it and everything. Man, that's that's no joke, and that's that's nothing to mess with. So yeah, to think that he would be able to come back if it unless it was just totally musculature and all it did was spasm and tightened up to the point where he couldn't

move and it relieved itself for some reason. I mean, if it was something like that, But if it's if it's anything else with other soft tissue or other things around there, and you certainly have to be careful with back problems, that's for sure. So four games to go. The Broncos won by four touchdowns today, the Chiefs kick tail. The other games are within the division. They're going to have to win those games. The Bengals have gone from being in a pretty good shape to now a difficult

uphill climb to qualify for the postseason. There's no question. I mean, there's gonna be so many games you look back on and you say, ah, if and but it's Christmas time. If from Butler Candy and that has to be Christmas every day. But all the teams can say that, you know, and the thing, the thing you gotta be careful about Cleveland. Cleveland's got a winning record now and they're the only ones that have a tiebreaker against the Bengals.

They beat the Bengals and thrash them here here Bengals have to go up in the lake and the last game of the season and if that's a game you gotta win to qualify the playoffs, or win the division to qualify the playoffs, or where it may be, that that's not going to be an easy, easy dynamic whatsoever. Um So, yeah, they're they've they've they've started to paint themselves in a corner. They're giving themselves no margin for error because of error that they've had in trying to

get to that final four games of the season. They're finally there and it's the final quarter of such. But it's not going to be easy on an every day, every week basis. It is going to be like you're playing a playoff game. And that's that's how you have to approach it. That's the intensity level of it. That's we saw last week, that's what we saw this week, and it's going to be the same the last four

games remaining no different or on Sunday's win. Joined Lap and Lance McAllister for Bengals Line Monday Night from six to nine on seven hundred WLW. Now time for this week's fun Facts segment, where you are about to get to know a Bengals coach who turned out to be an exceptional storyteller. Time for some fun facts with offensive line coach Frank Pollock. Born in Camp Springs, Maryland, near Washington, DC,

before attending high school in Phoenix, Arizona. Where did you spend the bulk of your childhood and what did you like to do as a kid. Grew up in Phoenix. I moved out there when I was two. My parents were in the Navy, and when they met and got married and had me and we moved out to Phoenix. So I grew up Phoenix seventies and eighties. And I love sports, love football right from the get go, and just did all the sports growing up as a kid, like probably every other kid, and just got a blast.

I always assume, and maybe it's stereotypical that the child of military parents has a very disciplined life as a kid. Was that the case for you. Yeah, I wouldn't say they were military parents because they got out like right after I was born, within two years, because then my younger sister was born in the same DC area and then we left, So I know, we really remember my dad ever being in the military. I was like two,

so but yeah, I mean I was disciplined. My dad grew up in Cleveland and then went to Benedict in high school and so kind of a you know, midwestern upbringing out there in the West Coast. You know, discipline was big in our house, and you know, so he kept me in line if every got a little squirrelly. We're doing fun facts with Frank Pollock. You're a big man. You're a former NFL offensive lineman. Were you always the big kid in the neighborhood. No, Actually, I was a

late bloomer. I was decent sized young with them. By the time I got the high school, everyone was taller, bigger than me. It's funny to see some of my high school JV team pictures and some of my good buddies that they were all taller and bigger than me, and now I tower over them. So I was a late bloomer and grew a ton right before my senior year and then obviously throughout college. When it came time for college, you became a lumberjack at Northern Arizona University

y NAU. It was the only scholarship offer I had outside of a couple of local junior colleges, so I took it and ran with it. Northern Arizona has a remarkable record of sending coaches to the NFL. Who did you overlap with as a player and then as a

young assistant coach? Yeah, I was very fortunate to be coached by some incredible coaches early on in my in in college, my UH our my office, A line coach my my sophomore junior years was Bill Callahan and then before him, actually for one year really my true sophomore year, I had a late redshirt hardship there, but was Andy Reid was my line coach before coach Callahan came in, and then UH the OC for most of those years

four out of the five was Brad childress Um. Marty morning Wig was a young GA running back coach on that staff. Steve Hagen, who coached a long time in the league tight ends and receivers, was our was our receiver's coach. Um, I was very fortunate. And then uh, they had a few good coaches kind of came in after me when I had left on a different staff. And actually Brad Craigthorpe's dad was on that staff. Uh,

the younger Zampeeze kens Ampez was on that staff. I'm drawing a blank to head coach Carl Durell at Colorado was on that staff. All these young guys that have gone and have great career so um, and he's had a lot. Mike Shanahan coach there early in his career. Um, I'm drawing a blank. Now I'm the old New England old line coach's Karnekia's he coached there early in his career. So it's kind of one of those unique, weird places. I always call it the cradle to coaches on the

West coast. I know Miami, Ohios got that title on the east of the Mississippi. I'm gonna I'm gonna claim it on the west Mississippi. RIGHTFULLYSA, we're visiting with Frank Pollock. You mentioned Bill Callaghan, who is the brother the dad I should say of offensive coordinator Brian Callahan. He was Zach Taylor's head coach at Nebraska. He is a big

reason why you became a coach. Correct, Yeah, he's he's He's been huge impact on my life from a player in coaching, I'm a member writing him a letter when I was playing that I wanted to come in ga for him at Wisconsin and then uh, and he wrote me back, nice letter saying that'd love to have you ga for me. In fact, I saved that letter, and years later when I ended up coaching with him for him in Dallas as his assistant, I showed him that letter. He was flabbergast that I still kept it. So he's

been huge for me. Learned a ton and still learning a ton from him. He's been been very fortunate in that regards. You learned a degree in advertising if you didn't get into coaching, Is that what you would have done? No, it was the classic. I didn't want to I didn't want to go down to the pe route. I wanted something a little bit different, So I just decided advertising didn't have a lot of math in it. Yeah, I'll do that, But yeah, I kind of always knew I

wanted to coach. I tried to stay away from it later in my life and then got back into it. That's where my badgion is. After being named an All American in Northern Arizona, you were a sixth round draft pick by the forty nine ers in nineteen ninety. Describe your draft experience. It was funny you ask. It was a little different than how they do things now. But it was kind of a drawn out process over three days, and in fact, it went like Saturday, Sunday, and Monday

was kind of like the last day. So my agent at the time in Phoenix had a you know, a big to do party and whatnot during the first day of the draft, and he had a bunch of, you know, high first round draft guys. I knew I clearly was not going to be taking that day, but just enjoyed the festivities. But I was under the impression that maybe the next day I might go, And then I didn't get any information and so I had to get up

early on Monday morning go to his office. He was a little kid in Phoenix, and I was just a wreck. I mean, we're getting into the later rounds, the sixth rounds gone, the seventh rounds gone. It's about we had twelve rounds. We're in like the ninth and tenth round. My agents calling around teams. He calls the Washington Redskins

and hits up Charlie Castle. I guess he showed interest in me pre draft draft and he goes, what do you mean the Niners took him way back in the sixth round and he goes, what, they haven't even called him? And he tells me that. I go, I'm not believing I get a phone call. So he calls the Niners and he said, yeah, yeah, we're gonna call him. We were just we just worked out a draft a trade and we haven't a chance to call him yet. So that's songs up in a nutshell. It's like, you know,

there's some six round old line guy. We'll get back. We'll get to them whenever we can get to him. So that was kind of my draft experience, but nonetheless I got my foot in the door. That might be the greatest example of how the draft has changed that I have ever heard. You were an NFL player for nine years, seven in San Franz, two in Denver. You won a Super Bowl ring with the ninety four San

Francisco forty nine ers when they beat the Chargers. What do you cherish the most about your experience as an NFL player? The great teammates, the camaraderie with all my teammates. I told the guys all the time, that's what you're gonna miss. Number one. The great experiences and that we had.

We wanted a lot of football games. Loved my experiences with all the different coaches that I came through the nine years that I was there and in Denver, and then just just those great experiences and being a part of being able to, you know, play pro football is a dream come true. And being able to be on so to a great winning organization. Again, a championship there with the Niners was tremendous. Something always were relish. We're doing fun facts with Frank Pollock. The list of Hall

of Fame players that were your teammates is remarkable. I'm going to name a few, and I would like you to just share a memory or a description, whatever comes to mind. Joe Montana prankster. First thing that comes to my training camp. He'd take guys bikes and throw them up into the trees. We had at Rockland Community Seri Community College in rock And, California, because he didn't have to stay in late meetings. He knew the Skiss system

so kind of an old veteran. They let him out of the meetings early and you'd find it was on the campus as like he'd ride bikes to the meetings back to the dorms and he would put guys bikes in the trees. Great guy. Loved to go out with the full line especially and take him out, treat him out for some drinks and dinners and it was a lot of fun. Great guy. Did he prank you, No, he never pranked me, but he did save me from

getting just abused as a rookie from Charles Haley. But he was guy, was constantly like to pick on rookies. One day in the locker room, we would sign these autograph footballs in front of the equipment room every day. It was part of our deal. And then Charles Haley sees me over there, so he's just you know, taking his ribbings, getting his opportunities at me as a rookie. And Joe it's lockers right there, and he said, hey, hey, Charles, leave him alone. And then I was like, oh, this

is a great guy. And then so Charles never mess with me again because Joe told him not to not to mess with me. It's like, okay, I'll take it. I have new found respect for Joe Montana John Elway John Ell was another guy loved hanging out with the old line Um good time guy loves loves to hang out with the fellas. He was rehabbing his shoulder had an injury, and then I was on an ir with a back surgery that year. So at some point doing rehab together, like they have you off to the side,

he was gonna start throwing some balls. So they asked if I would just go stand over there and he's gonna throw these deep out routs to him. I just had to stand there. Oh my god. I mean he must have been like thirty forty yards away, and how hard he through. My hands were hurting in red and hurt afterwards. I mean, I was just trying to protect my face from not getting just I mean, it is ridiculous how hard that guy throws. That was like, like, wow,

it's impressible. They talk about the Lway cross, the point on the end of the football where you've got the scenes that come together, and how he used to leave an indentation of that cross on guy's chest and stuff that's legit because he zipped the ball in there. Man, it was crazy. Jerry Rice, unbelievable work ethic. I shared stuff like this with my guys all the time. This guy was so talented, but you were never ever going to outwork him. He was just my niacle over it.

Just relentless prepractice, post practice. It was it got. He's just an animal on how he would work out in his conditioning. His work ethic was unbelievable, unbelievable. Ronnie Lott. Ronnie Lot is one of my most favorite individuals. I got the utmost respect for that guy for how he was on the field and in the locker room. But him after a years later before I got on the coach and I got to do some business stuff with him and got to learn just get to know him

a little bit better. Such a class to act and just a man, a man's man, a gentleman. He does a lot for the community with his all star helping kids charity. He is genuine, he's he taught me as an early player leadership from the locker room and chemistry matters more than anything on a football team. I played with him for two years, and when he left to the Raiders. We had a slow start the next year and we had a team only players meeting and I'm

a young guy. I'm as when they're listening, and all the old guys our leaderships then got up in every one of them to a man reference where Ronnie would say this, Ronnie would do that. He wasn't on our team anymore. I'm like, when I coach someday, never forget that. So it's all about leadership. Got come from the players, and team chemistry matters more than anything. Line one culture matters. Dion Sanders he was. He came in with all the

hype right primetime. You're like, God, what's this guy gonna be like? You know? And then when he came in, he was just like one of the guys that all that was just his persona off the field to get himself endorsements. He was just a regular guy, worked his butt off. His work ethic was right up there with the rest of the fellas and how we ran things there, and his talent and speed were incredible. We had a

pretty good player. Dexter Carter was our kick returner, first round draft pick out of Florida state same year as me. Fast and he was good. And then Dion got there, Well he's gonna start returning kicks, and then you could literally see the difference of speed and I'm like, oh my god, that's when I ever realized how fast he was, and some of these players in this league was we could literally see the difference where Dexter Carter is not slow, he's fast, and you're like, holy cow up close and

seeing that. Um And he would lay out his whole uniform, pregame, ritual, his shoes, his socks like it was like one of them chalk lines of a dead body. His pants, his band dans, his sweet towels, all that laid out, his wrist bands on his elbows and wrists, whatever it was, his gloves, his helmet. That's how he would he would lay it out. And he would walk around the locker room and dollars signed boxer shorts to get his getting ready for a game. And it was kind of like

where I learned. Also is like every players got their own unique way to get themselves ready. They're all professionals. You just have their own unique way getting so als ready to play and fantastic player, you don't do that with your clothes. Now, I don't. I don't have the physique or a skill set he has. I keep my ikea clevered up there. All right, a couple of wild card categories to wrap things up. Who is your all time favorite athlete in any sport? Jeez, that's a great question.

I was a big Cowboy fan girl up, so I love twenty Doors, said Rodostall back. We didn't have any professional sports teams axcept the Suns, so at the time that the Suns is a big Walter Davis fan. And then I was a Dodgers fan, so Dusty Baker was my favorite player growing up in the seventies. Those are really the guys I idolized at the time growing up as a kid. Do you have any hidden talents or off field interests that might surprise us? My wife would

definitely say I have no hidden talents whatsoever. I'm worthless at home. I can't do anything, so I would say probably not, except I do like to golf a little bit on my time off in the summer. But I'm horrible, but I love it. It's fun to get outside and a beautiful setting on the golf course and drink and eat while you play. It's always fun to do that. If you're horrible, but you love it, we'll play. We'd be a good match. Last thing, and this is kind

of deep. If you could meet anybody in history, athlete, actor, statesman, politician, religious figure, whatever it might, who would that person date. That's a great question, and I've always I have pondered that if I could go back in time, and I'd always want to go back in time to meet some of the legendary athletes and coaches. And then so with my position right now, I had to say Vince Lombardi and just pick his brain on his approach to the game and practice and just experience and meet a guy

like him. But he's done so much to the sport in person. But really, anybody, I'm a real big sports historian. I love that stuff. So I'd love to meet any of those guys. I mean, Babe Ruth, who would not want to go back in time and just just to be able to be around Babe Ruth? I mean, he was heard he's pretty fun too to be around. But Vince Lombarrie is the first guy that comes to mind. Just would love to pick his brain on everything he'd done. And I can't. I'd be remiss if I didn't mention

Paul Brown, all right, so he would. He's incredible how much he's invented for this game, and since since I come to the Bengals and learn a little bit more about him. Already knew some of the stuff that he's done and created and invented, but he'd be another guy to be really cool. We have a I guess mister Brown upstairs has got a lot of his artifacts and memorabilia upstairs, and my first time I was here, I

got to go check out some of that stuff. I know some of those things that I I was writings are up there. I'd love to go up there one of these days in the off season and read some of his notes on plays and whatnot. This has been great. It's awesome to have you back on the Bengals coaching staff. Continued success and thanks for the time. Thank you, verm. Which is awesome to be appreciate it. That's going to do it for this episode of the Bengals Booth Podcast,

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