Bengals Booth Podcast: Getting Better

and seven Browns in Cleveland. Coming up, I'll be joined by my broadcast partner Dave Lapham as we discussed the latest Bengals news, including the return of John Ross, a fair assessment of offensive lineman Bobby Hart, and what seems like an absurd question, do the Bengals have to worry

about one win going to their heads? My locker room conversation this week is with safety Jesse Bates, who describes just how good it felt to no longer have to worry about possibly joining the two thousand and eight Lions and the two thousand and seventeen Browns and the Owen sixteen Club. And in this week's No the Fox segment, we'll get the lowdown on the Cleveland Browns from one of my favorite radio play by play guys in the NFL,

Cleveland's Jim Donovan. All of that is straight ahead, but first, here's a quick reminder that you can have the latest edition of this podcast delivered right to your phone, tablet, or computer by subscribing on iTunes, Stitcher, Google Play, Spotify, or pod Bean. It's the greatest thing since the movie die Hard. The Christmas season is upon us, and that means there should be plenty of opportunities while scanning around the dial to find the perfect Christmas movie. Die Hard.

It's one of my all time favorite movies period. Bruce Willis has never been better. Alan Rickman is the perfect villain as Hans Gruba, and it's one of the most quotable movies ever, from Shoot the Glass to Hans Bubby, I'm Your White Knight, to Yippie Kaye mother, Well, you know the rest. So tis the season to be jolly and to spend a couple of hours at the Nakatomi

plazat Christmas Party. Now, let's get to the latest Bengals news with my broadcast partner Dave Lapham, and we start with a Bengals defense that held the New York Jets to two hundred and seventy one yards and two field goals last week and did not give up a twenty yard play for the first time in twenty seven games. Lap the Bengals defense has held three straight opponents to seventeen or fewer points. Is that mostly due to mediocre opponents or do you see signs that the defense might

actually be decent. I think it's a combination of both, you know. I do think that anytime you hold any offense, I don't care if it's peewee football out of the end zone and limit them to field goals, you've done a hell of a job. And I thought that defensive performance they had last week was masterful. Really. I mean, they didn't even let him in the red zone. They didn't even let him inside the twenty yard line one snap,

just a yeoman's effort right there. But I do think that it's a combination of the level of the opponent and the people up front, coupled with the Bengals getting healthy on their side of it defensively, so instead of six man rotation, they've had a full eight man rotation against lesser groups, And that combination, that synergy of not as good an opponent up front and having all of your guys and keeping your stars fresh, fresher in the fourth quarter and all throughout the football game has been

a big, big deal. Because in the opener against Seattle when all hands were on deck. Defensive line kicked some tail, I mean, just dominated up front. And then the injuries start happening and they're playing good quality opponents and Lamar Jackson's of the world and you're down a few guys in your front seven. You know, those things kind of snowball the wrong way. Now maybe you're playing you know, you're done with Jackson and the Baltimore Ravens. You don't

have to worry about that that craziness anymore. You don't have the forty nine ers with what they were doing, a lot of those offenses and those offensive lines are gone, and you're playing, you know, offenses that aren't quite as explosive with less talent in their offensive line, and you've got your troops back. I think I think it's that that entire storyline right there. John Ross, his eligibolter, returned from the injured list this week. It sounds like he's

going too. How does that impact the playbook? Well, I mean, I keep going back to Deshaun Watson, you know, talking about um he had he had a subpart performance and then the following week came back and played very well, you know, and then Thursday Night football. He had another great game. But when he went from the poor performance to coming back and playing well, he was asked after the game, you know, what's the difference in how you performed?

You said, got Fuller back. Fuller of Notre Dame stretched the field man. Bengals almost drafted him, they wanted him, and the Texans got them right. The Bengals did, and then later on they draft John Ross to that same role.

So Fuller and Ross provide the same thing. What's Fuller provided to Deshaun Watson, Ross is going to provide to Andy Dalton, and what Fuller provided to his cohorts the receiver position, John Ross is going to provide to Tyler Boyd and his cohorts at the receiver position as well. So I think that it's just having speed, somebody that

you know, takes the top off the defense. The box that the Bengals will have been playing and will finally be open and they'll be able to walk outside the box and get some fresh air and say, wow, it's nice out here, you know. And I think there's going to be an impact. And like we've talked about a few times, it not only impacts the passing attack where guys like Tyler Boyd and Tyler Eiffert, can you know,

abuse the middle of the football field. When John Ross is stretching one side of it, he is going to tilt coverage. You know. It opens up some running lanes for Joe Mixon, makes it easier for the offensive line to create some cavities for Joe Misson to take advantage of and man up in Cleveland, it's grass in Miami's grass. Oh my goodness, of AJ Green would come back as well, And obviously that's a hope in her prayers. There's no indication that that would be the case at this point

in time. But if he were to come back, have John Ross on one side, AJ Green and the other taking the top off the defense on both sides of the football field, I mean, the offense would look so different. People would be like, where's this been. It's been on the sideline with injury. I mean, the Bengals have been playing. They've been hamstrung all season long in terms of what they really are offensively. Let's talk about a wide receiver

who does not have great speed, Audent Tate. He never really seems to be open, but he's become a key weapon. He had four catches for sixty six yards last week. He's on a pace for seven hundred forty five receiving yards this year. Have you ever seen anybody quite like Auden Tate? You know, he's I've seen a lot of receivers that you know, don't didn't have great speed, but could find a way to get open, you know, Danny Abramowitz and Fred Bolitnikoff, and I mean, but that's that's

back a lot of years ago. Chip Myers was a big receiver, tall, not super speed, but kind of deceptive speed. Pat mcinally same type of guy, big, tall receiver, deceptive speed. This guy, though, is six to five almost two hundred and thirty pounds, like two hundred and twenty eight pounds, So you know, I'm sure a lot of teams in the league there was a temptation to say, hey, let's get him up to like two thirty eight, two forties and see if he can play tight end. But he's

he is a gifted wide receiver. I mean that's due to the injuries. He's had a legitimate chance, and he's proven that he belongs in the National Football League's He's a guy that he's not going to run by you. But when he's covered, he's open because he'll box you out. I mean, he uses his body position to his advantage. He's got extremely long arms, so you know, he's got these big candle levers that he's got a huge catching radius. And when he gets his hands on the football, they're

extremely strong. They're like suction cups, and he wins contested catches. And the one thing that he does is when he's right at the end of his route, at the top of his route, he does have the step to short space quickness for his size, and he can get you know, a little bit of separation just enough where he'll be able to use his body and do the things that that he can do. But man, I mean we've seen him contorting his body and you know, diving and making

these circus catches. I mean, it's it's incredible to watch this kid and quarterbacks feel totally confident going back shoulder if he's covered, just going back shoulder to take get it anywhere in that vicinity. He'll make a play on it. It's it's been impressive to watch. He's been you know, he's been a nice storyline to follow this year. Offensive coordinator Brian Callahan had praised for right tackle Bobby Hart this week. It wasn't effusive, but he said he's had

a solid season overall. Do you agree. I think people are. I mean, they'd love to pile on on Bobby Hart, there's no question. I mean it started with the contract. You know, he gets more money than people felt like he should get, so he becomes an easy target, you know, in their mind. And he'll have his you know, a moment where he jumps off sides or whatever. But his whole thing is he wants to be on the cutting edge of I have to get off these defensive linemen.

I don't want to let them have a good get off on me. I'm quick, My strength was my feet. I'm an He's an athletic guy, he really is. He's not a big, group overpower you type guy, but he's got really good feet, he's got long arms, he uses his hands well, and yeah, honestly, he's he's played pretty solidly. I mean, you know, where would they be without Bobby Hart and Trey Hopkins. I mean those guys have been the staples, you know, in terms of and Bobby Honestly,

since the Baltimore game, the second Baltimore game. Has been playing with a bum shoulder and it's he said, it's not getting worse, but he's had a harness on it from time to time and you can't really get it up above his head. But you don't need to to be able to block. So he has enough of his power and his strength where he can keep his hands and arms below his shoulders and be able to block people.

So the fact that he's out there sucking it up, you know, playing hurt and the shoulder injury is not fun. Believe me, when you have shoulder problems, it's not fun when you're alignment because you know you're dealing with you're dealing with that pain every snap. So you know, I think that saying that he's had a solid season would I wouldn't dispute that. I wouldn't disagree with that whatsoever. Speaking of the old line, rookie Michael Jordan was back

in this dining lineup last week. How did he do a lot better? You know, I thought, you know, lesson learned and was learned against a great player, I mean, Cameron Heyward is He's a man. There's no doubt about that. Fellow Buckeye. He's having a Pro Bowl season. I don't think he gets enough credit, even though it's a Pro Bowl player. It's like nobody talks about him enough in my opinion. But you know, Michael learned a lot that

football game in Pittsburgh. As a line they gave up eight sacks and Cameron Hayward had two and a half of them. So he's worked his way back. He was nicked up a little bit injury wise, worked his way back. They started using him as the extra tight end and formations and there he is out there again. Another guy with huge radius, I mean, long athletic, can move his feet, He's got power. The biggest thing about Michael Jordana that has impressed me extremely mature. I mean he's only twenty

two years old. I think he just recently turned it and his parents raised him right. I mean, that kid is mature and a lot of guys might have crumbled and assumed the fetal position to never recover after what happened with Cameron Hayward. But he uses as a learning tool and I think he's gonna have a hell of a career. I think he's gonna play a long time. I think he's gonna play at a very high level for a long time. I think they feel like traded up to get him for a reason, and I think

they feel comfortable with it. Bengals in Cleveland to take on the Browns this Sunday, Lap the Browns. Around the cover of Sports Illustrated's NFL Preview edition, SI predicted that the Browns would win the AFC North. Well, they're five and seven. They lost to the Steelers last week with Devlin Duck Hodges at quarterback. Are you surprised that the Browns aren't that good? You know, I think that sometimes expectations are set so high it's almost impossible to achieve them.

And honestly, a first time head coach takes time. I mean, he was assistant running back coach. I think at the beginning of the year a year ago, it was crazy. I mean, the Mete York rise has been just, you know, a site to behold. Freddy Kitchens came out of nowhere, and you know, I really thought that the way they the way they responded, you know, last year to Greg Williams, I really thought that that might be a direction that they go and maybe make Freddy Kitchens offensive coordinator because

there's a relationship with Baker Mayfield. Because of his relationship with Baker Mayfield, they named him the head coach and let Greg Williams walk so and I think the defense was playing so well into Greg Williams. I would have just kept him around and kept that kind of style

of play that they were responding to. So I you know, I think I think part of it is decisions that were made in the coaching aspect of it, and then a lot of times you accumulate star players like they did, doesn't mean it's going to work in terms of chemistry, in terms of you know, defining roles on a football team, checking egos and all the things that have to go

with that. So I thought they would be better. I did not see them, you know, being a super Bowl winner, of being a Super Bowl participant, winning the AFC Championship. I didn't see that. But I saw them being a potential playoff team. You know what, the talent they have, and they haven't performed up to that level. There's there's no doubt about that, and there's there's a myriad of reasons why, and it just goes to show you that the intangibles are at least as maybe more important than

intangibles when you're putting the thing together. And I think I think this football team is probably a pretty good example of that lap. After setting a rookie record with twenty seven touchdown passes and becoming a pitch man for every other advertiser on TV, Baker Mayfield has had a lousy year. He has last among qualifying quarterbacks and passer rating. He's got fourteen interceptions. That's the third most in the NFL. Are we talking second year growing pains or something more?

That's that's a great question. I mean, I think that a lot of times defensive coordinators have a full offseason to take a look at Baker Mayfield, what he does best, to take away from him, Like Bill Belichick always says, take a player's strength, the way, make him play left handed if he's a right handed player, or vice versa, you know, And I think people are doing that with Baker Mayfield somewhat. Maybe he's not handling the looks and the pressures as much or as well as he did.

That's a good question. I mean, it would have to be. You don't have to be tracking him almost on a week to week basis. Up there to see and to see what they're doing against him. And part of it too is you know, bringing in a guy like Beckham and you know you've got Landry who you had established a relationship. Now Beckham wants the ball. I mean, it's just it's kind of a tug of war. Even if it's not something that is verbalized, you know that everybody

wants to football. It's to me, it's almost like when you have too many superstars at one position group, it can be an issue. You know there you're always better off having a clear cut number one and then you know, and then everybody else has roles. Sometimes when you have one and one a or two ones or whatever it is, that can kind of play with a quarterback a little bit too. I think losing his tight end to injury, who's a big time playmaker, was a factor in it

as well. He does like to utilize the tight end. He had a great one when he was at Oklahoma Andrews was playing well, you know, for the Baltimore Ravens. So he's very mindful of involving tight ends in the passing game. So it's a bunch of things. Offensive line I don't think is his playing as well, maybe as they did last year. So it's probably not just a thing. It's like it always is. It's an accumulation of a lot of things, and sometimes those little things start accumulating,

they become big issues. Lap As crazy as this might sound, after No. And eleven start, did the Bengals have to worry about one win going to their heads? You know, handling success, that that old story is a factor, and you know, one win, he can't hardly term it success, but it is such a relief. It's like that nasty pimple that filled and all that pressure and finally that sucker pops, you know. I mean, that's what you're hoping might happen, and the Bengals get that victory and it

alleviates and leaves all that pressure. But Dan, it wasn't a masterpiece. I mean, they averaged one point eight yards a carry. They had no players of twenty yards or more. Their longest run was nine yards, their longest pass I think was seventeen. It was a touchdown. I mean, it wasn't like they ripped it up offensively. Defensively, you know, they were unbelievable defensively. They've only given up one touchdown

the last ten quarters of play. I mean, that's that's pretty phenomenal and thirty nine points in the last three games. They've been building and getting better on the defensive side of things. But there were a lot of corrections to be made looking at that tape. And I bet if guys looked at that tape against the New York Jets, particularly offensively, they can point to other games as an offensive line where we blocked guys better than that and

lost the football game by two scores. We didn't block these guys as well in the running and we by two scores. So it's a crazy game, and you just always have to try to improve on your techniques and fundamentals and and try to make plays. I mean, it's all about making plays and limiting the plays that the other team makes. It's that simple. Best analogy ever, getting a win after an on eleven start is like popping

a nasty pimple. I wouldn't want to see that line on a T shirt, although someday I hope to see a Dave Lapham T shirt with the words A loose groin is a happy groin. Now, time for this week's locker Room Conversation. As I visit with a second year Bengal who will be looking for his first win in three tries against Baker Mayfield and the Cleveland Browns. We're in the locker room with second year safety Jesse Bates. Give me a few words to describe how good it

felt on Sunday night. Yeah, it's a lot of worries I can say about getting the first win. Obviously, it's something that we've won it all year. Um, it sucks that we had to wait until week twelve or whatever it was, but we finally got the monkey off our back and hopefully we can continue to build some minimum for next year, just knowing that we're that we can't play for any championships this year. So we're talking to Jesse Bates. When you guys came back to work on Monday,

did everybody have a little pep in their step? Yeah? It was a little different, um watching the film compared to you know, losing. Um, I think we played a complete game as a whole football team, not just defensively or offensively. I think we played well consistently throughout the game. So that was good to see. I hate to even ask the question, but there've only been two oh and sixteen teams in history. As the losses were mounting, were

you getting worried about that potential scarlet letter? UM? It's funny there was no conversation throughout the players thinking about going on sixteen. I think we're we did a really good job of just going in to every week, just going one to know UM. And unfortunately, like I said, we had to wait until week thirteen or whatever it was to get the first win. UM. We amongst you know, family and friends, you never want to be that team UM.

For example, like the Cleveland Grounds. I mean they're they're all sixteen UM, and we don't want to be that. So hopefully we can stack some wins and you know, makes the season feel a little better on the back end. We're talking to Jesse Bates. Over the last three weeks, the defense is given up seventeen, sixteen and six points. That's going to get you a win almost any time. What's been the difference? UM, I just think that we

executed UM the game plan very well. UH. The biggest thing that a lot of people have noticed is that we haven't given up a lot of explosive players. UM. And that's been the key part that hurt us um in the first part of the season. Um. And also we've we've been able to generate some turnovers as well and stop the run. So those three things. I mean that that has been the huge key for us defensively to give up. I mean I think that we're giving up to touchdown or a touchdown and up past ten

quarters or something like that. Um, it's just good that we're playing well. It just needs to continue to snowball effect, like I said, and build the momentum to weeks on. Go ahead, Jesse, your thirteenth in the NFL and solo tackles. Switch is necessarily ideal when you're playing safety. But how much pride do you take and getting guys to the ground. Um yeah, it's something that Um, that's that's my job. That's my job description. Um, I'm a safety. I'm the

last line of defense. And UM, if you can't get people on the ground, you're not doing your job, your job very well. So UM, me and me and Sean we take pride and you know, getting guys on the ground, making sure that there's no um, you know, explosive touchdowns that are happening. So UM yeah, I mean I take pride in that, and that's good to hear. So Sean, of course, is Sean Williams your fellows safety. He has

played with a wide variety of injuries this year. I mean, everybody's bagged up this time of year, but in his case, it's been some pretty serious stuff. I might respect you have for him. Yeah, you know this isn't just the only example of having respect for him. You know, coming in as a rookie last year and hanging on to him and him taking me under his wing was a huge respect thing for me. And it's built not just

on the field, it's built off the field as well. Um, Sean is pretty much like a big brother to me. So I got a lot of respect for him. You face the Browns this week. I heard you say earlier in the week that everybody knows about Odell Beckham Junior and Jarvis Landry and they're great players, but the real key is the running backs. Yeah, and I think the two hour receivers they let everyone know when they catch

the ball. I think that's what everybody, all the fans and stuff, wants to see because, like like you're saying, Um, before the season, they were the Super Bowl team that everybody thought that I was gonna make it to the Super Bowl. Um, and it's not such like that anymore. U. So yeah, I just think you know, Nick Chubb and Cream Hunt, those are the guys that gets that team going. Um. It's not the receivers, obviously, they're very dynamic. Um. But the thing that gets that that team going is those

two running backs. So that's something that we've keyed in on this week. So last thing, Baker Mayfield has four teen picks this year. Is he a guy that has so much faith in his arm and his ability to stick it in a tight window that you think there will be opportunities to pick one off? Yeah? Absolutely. Um, I think last year he got away with a lot of stuff didn't and now it's kind of hurting him. He's thrown a lot of interceptions. Um. You know, hopefully

you can throw us some. I mean, we haven't got as many as we wanted to as a secondary, as a whole defense. Um, but yeah, hopefully we can get him ratled and give him to talk a little stuff and those some interceptions. I hope this Monday is as enjoyable as last Monday. Wise, best of thanks for the time. Yes, Sir, that's Jesse Bates Baker. Mayfield has not had a good year other than cashing the checks for being on every

other commercial on TV. But the Bengals only have to pop on the tape from last season to see Mayfield at is absolute best. In two wins against Cincinnati, the former Heisman Trophy winner through seven touchdown passes with no interceptions and a passer rating of one thirty five point eight.

This year, it's been a different story. The number one pick in last year's draft ranks last among qualifying quarterbacks in completion percentage, touchdown to interception ratio and passer rating, and this week he's dealing with a bruised hand suffered late in the second quarter in last week's loss in Pittsburgh. Dave lappom and I discussed that and much more in this week's No The Faux segment with the radio voice of the Browns, Jim Donovan. My first question is how

are those Pittsburghs started a T shirt selling? Are you wearing one as we speak? Right? If I did not wear mine outside to a movie? Yeah, I just got to go to the mister Rogers round. It's a great day in the papers of the movie and I did not have my uh fo it started his T shirt on. I have to tell you that's uh that whole thing. I mean not only that, I mean the T shirt, but what triggered it all That Thursday night game. Um, you know that that that was a great, great night

in Cleveland. That turned into a real bad night in Cleveland. I mean it really did. When you beat the Steelers especially, I mean, you know, we it spent so long since the Browns had beaten the Steelers, but when you beat them it should be a holiday. The that statement. I have to tell you guys, because of the last eight seconds of that game and how it all you know, went down in that ugly melee when you watched out

the first Entergy Stadium that night. It really how what they lost that night, and then all the other stuff that's gone down the road with it has been unbelievable. Freddy Kitchen seems like a likable guy, but that was just kind of such a silly thing to do, to be photographed with a fan. I would think you would have to know how that would come off. Is he just naive? Yeah? I think so, Dan, I really do.

I think all of this notoriety. That really started last year when he became the offensive coordinator and the offense really started to Cleitch as you guys saw when he took over the play calling, and you know, he was just I think Clevelander said, Hey, this guy's like one of us. I mean, he wore the orange sweatshirt at that time that said dog Pound on it, and people really related to that. And so he became kind of a real favorite and the team finished well, and and

he bought into that too. I mean, you know, he's out there. He's like a greeter when you meet him out in the streets. I mean he stops and talks to everybody. So I think all of this that came along with being the head coach of the Browns really

was overwhelming to him. And there are a lot of areas whereas he has had a tough time handle, like what happened with the T shirt, but also what's happened with the you know, the multitude of responsibilities that go with becoming a head coach because he has never been a head coach before. Is the situation here in Cincinnati is Zach Taylor head coach and play caller is Freddie Kitchen's head coach. Is Monkin play caller? Is Freddie play caller?

How much influence does Todd Monkin have on the offense. Well, that equation has been hard to decipher, but at least on game day, Freddie is the head coach and he is calling the play right Todd Monkin sits upstairs. They have never really come out and said here's how it happens, you know, to radio's down to play and then Freddie says, yeah, you're nay, And they've never really gone over that. You know.

David was like it was a funny situation anyway, because Monkin is a you know, he's a pretty well established guy who was a head coach in college and of course a play caller before in and when he came here and Freddie had been come the head coach and was and openly said I'm gonna I'll call the place, he wondered why Monkin came here in the first place

to do that. You know, it was kind of a strange set up for a guy that was so h you know, he has such good experience, but they've never really come out and said this is how we do it. They don't even describe what the format they go through during the week. Other than I know Todd, you know as a was a bit fan. I mean when he came here, he talked a great deal about getting the opportunity to be around a young quarterback like Baker Mayfield

and watching him grow. And I know he was in love with, you know, the air raid offense coming into the NFL, and he up with what Kansas City was doing and he wanted to see that he put into the to the Cleveland offense. So I'm sure there's monk in influence. But as far as strategically on game day, as far as I know and what we've seen through the throe of these games, these twelve games, I would have to say that Freddie is he's calling the place too right. We are talking to the voice of the Browns,

Jim Donovan. Jim. A lot of us expected to be the brown expected the Browns to be good this year. I'll put myself in that category. I'm not necessarily talking Super Bowl good, but certainly playoff good in my case at least, what did so many of us get wrong about the Cleveland Browns? Yeah, I think, Um, I think there's a lot to be said for chemistry. And I think at the end of the year last year when they get on that nice little run, they had a

nice little chemistry going. They really did, and whether it was pretty you know, turning the offense around and and and Greg Williams really kind of making them to the long they were a very disciplined team at the end of the year. Um, but that was last year. But then coming into this year, you know, they added the big name parts. I mean they've been obviously OBJ and

coming here that was the biggest of them all. And with the you know, Kareem Hunt joining the team and then sitting out the eight weeks because of suspension, and then adding him into the offense, It's been kind of like when you go into a buffet line and you just take everything, and they went and they took everything and they added that, and then when you sit down at potendy, you go on, this is just too much

for me to eat. And really, when they're out on the field, you look at it and you just say, I don't think they really know what they want to do with all of this. I don't think they know how they can function. It's great to say we have Nick Chubb and Kareem Hunt, but I don't think they have a downpack yet. Of Okay, it's great to have them, but how are we going to use each one of their skills? How are we going to have them on the field together. What are we going to do? And

the bier stopsacle has been Beckham. How it get him involved? And there has just been no chemistry. But I have to say this, in the off season, you know, Odell Beckham Junior really didn't do anything in the off season. He attended one OTA session, he came to the Mints, but he really didn't do anything. He came to training camp, he never played in the preseason game. So when they went out on the field and the opening game of the season against Tennessee, they can't expected, I think, to

just snap their fingers and it's gonna work. And it has not worked. You mentioned discipline. You look at penalty yards. The Bengals of one and eleven football team have the fewest penalty yards of any team in the NFL. Number one, only five hundred and forty penalty yards. The team that has the most of the Cleveland Browns, you know, they've got nine hundred and twenty six penalty yards. The Bengals case, just have not made enough plays. Penalties have not betrayed

the big plays. Have penalties betrayed and offset a lot of big plays by the Browns. Had they been not only numerous, but very untimely. Yeah, they have, and there's been and there's a lot of after the whistle stuff, Gabe. It really is, especially early in the year. The opening game of the year against Tennessee, they had eighteen eighteen accept eighteen accepted penalties. I mean they are over twenty. You know, if they had taken them all. Um, you know,

they've had thirteen penaltyue games eleven. Only in the last couple of weeks has that come. I'm down a little bit. But yeah, there was a lot of there's a lot of unsports fell conduct, rough in the passer, that kind of stuff. I mean, they've had ejections. I mean not just the Miles Garrett one. I mean they've had to you know, there's there's left tackle Greg Robinson got kicked out of the opening game for kicking a guy in the head. I mean really, I mean really undisciplined stuff.

Now during during the summer, you know, Hardy was saying they we're going to be a very tough football team, and I want them to be tough, and you know we're going to come back people. But there's a real line. I think that you have to you have to watch that you go over on the wrong side of that line. And I think too many times, uh that's happened. I mean,

they the penalties have been absolutely just absurd. And then you go at the tikie tack ones where they can't get lined up, you know, a lot of false starts things like that. So, um, you know that that that's been something that really, you know a lot of people have said, hey, listen, there's a there's a discipline problem, you know, bordering on totally doing discipline. And I think that that falls on the post, on the head coach and definitely his staff. Sure. A couple more questions for

the Voice of the Browns. Jim Donovan described Baker Mayfield's play this year. He's had a tough year, he really has. I mean, he had a sophomore I don't think it's I don't know if it's a sophomore slump. I think it definitely probably. Yeah, I think you could probably characterize it that way. Now. To hear myself saying it because I've watched it go. He has not. I don't think he's been comfortable guys with that offensive line in front of him, and I think he's taken a lot of hits.

And he had a rough day in Pittsburgh last Sunday. He got sacked five times, he had an injured hand, he fumbled, he got intercepted. The interceptions were really high, especially early in the season. Got a little bit better before the Pittsburgh game when they won the three games in a row. He's been very frustrating at times. He's battled with the media a couple of times. You know, he looks as though he just doesn't know what he

wants to do at times. And he was so decisive and so affluent last year, and I think that's why everybody was so excited about him coming into his second season. But whether it's just the odd of having a guy like Odell Beckham Junior out there and saying to yourself, I gotta get him the ball. I gotta get him

the ball. It was a little bit like that when they had Josh Gordon here and he would return after a suspension and they would say, okay, listen, he's back in the lineup, we've got to push the ball to him, and everybody else fell out of the offense. And it's been like that. He's had a very, very tough year. I think that this will be a year. I think when he goes into year three next year, he'll look back and say, Wow, it's this position is really a lot tougher than I thought it was going to be

after my rookie year. Two players, one offense, one defense, I think are a little uncelebrated in terms of what they do in my mind. Like you say, quarterback, star receivers, Nick Chubb, dude, I mean he's leading the NFL and rushing he runs as hard as anybody's ever seen. Eleven hundred and seventy five rushing yards, averaging almost five yards to carry, seven rushing touchdown. This dude is the real deal. And then defensively, Joe Schobert. Nobody talks it. He's a

tackling machine. He's got fifty more tackles than the next guy. Basically Mack Wilson two sacks, four interceptions, all you know, all in the last in the last four games. Nine pass defense, two forced fumbles, fumble, recovery. He's a stat line stuff for those two guys, one on offense, one on defense. I'm like, man, they just jump out on tape now. Yeah. Nick Chubb is just the ultimate professional who doesn't look for any of the spotlight. He shuns it.

He really does. He just does. He just does his work out in the field. There are no wild celebrations after touchdowns. He does it the old fashioned way, Dade. He kind of hands the ball to the official breed. He really is a rare breed. The other thing is he can run with power and then he's had an extra gear. He can run away from you. I mean he's had some classic long runs. He had a ninety two yard or in the big win that they had in Baltimore earlier season. It really kind of broke the

game open. He can get you a yard, he can get you fifty yards. He's worked awfully hard, and especially when you know they had traded Duke Johnson and they didn't have Kareem Hunt for the first eight weeks, Chuck really worked hard him being a good receiver out of the background, and he's become more than adequate at doing that. But he is the ultimate throwback professional guy just a tremendous Kip doesn't say boo, and I mean he does it in a skyway, not in a way that you know,

he shuns you. The other guy is he's a great story. Joe Shoulberg was a guy that when they joke to him, they thought, this guy's gonna be a core special teams player. Baby, he might get on the field. But I gotta give Gleg Williams a lot of credit. He's the guy that changed him into a mere linebacker. And he's really like a coordinator out on the field for them and they need that, believe me. You know, he gets the line up and then he makes play and he's all over

the field. He can go sideline to sideline. His death on being able to drop in the passing in is tremendous and he's really a he's a terrific player. Keith thing Now, I mean, this is a contract year for him and it will be interesting to see what they do as far as they able to give him back next year. Our thanks to Jim Donovan. And that's going to do it for this episode of the podcast. If you haven't done so already, don't forget to subscribe. And if you have a minute, please give it a rating

or share a comment. Five star ratings help more Bengals fans find this podcast. I'm Dan Horde and thank you for listening to the Bengals Booth podcast