Hi, get everybody. I'm Dan Hord and thanks for downloading the Bengals Booth Podcast. The chit Chit changes addition as we get to know two young coaches who have earned promotions on the Bengals staff, new Quarterbacks coach Brad Kragthorpe
and new safety secondary coach Jordan Kovacs. The Bengals Booth Podcast is brought to you by pay Core, proud to be the Bengals official HR software provider, by Alta Fiber future proof fiber Internet designed to elevate your home, business and community to a new level, and by Kettering Health the best care for the best fans. Kettering Health is
the official healthcare provider of the Bengals. Now here's a quick reminder that you can have the latest edition of this podcast delivered right to your phone, tablet, or computer by subscribing wherever you get your podcasts. It's the greatest thing since drivers who are ready at a light. We all have pet peeves. Here's one of my biggest, and it happened to me yesterday. You're in a line of cars at a stop light. The light turns green, and the person at the front of the line just sits there.
And sits there and by the time that person finally hits the gas, you don't make it through the light. Come on, people, we're all in this together. Green means go. Rant concluded, Now let's get to football. When Brian Callahan landed the Tennessee Titans head coaching job, it created a domino effect on the Bengals staff. Dan Pitcher was promoted from quarterbacks coach to offensive coordinator, and now his spot
has been filled by Brad Cragthorpe. If the last name sounds familiar, his dad, Steve, was the head coach at Louisville and Tulsa, and his grandfather, Dave, was the head coach at South Dakota State, Idaho State, and Oregon State. At the middle of those stops, he gave Marvin Lewis his first coaching job. I spoke to thirty one year old Brad Kragthorpe this week. Brad, your father and your
grandfather were college football head coaches. So you know what you are getting into when you chose the coaching life. What drew you to this profession.
Really everything involved with it. Initially I wanted to play for as long as I could, and then once I realized that I wasn't going to be able to play
as extensively as I ultimately wanted to. I knew that I was eventually going to be drawn to coaching and so getting to be around my dad and my grandpa too, but my dad more specifically every day grown up, and I was fortunate that he got to be a head coach when I was in middle school and high school, kind of formative years that really led to me falling in love with the profession and being around the program, getting to go to practices, going to meetings with him,
and doing all those things that not a lot of other kids had the opportunity to do. I fell in love with it then and knew that this was certainly going to be my calling.
You've been with a Bengal since Zach Taylor's been the head coach. What was the connection? How did you land that initial spot?
So, Zach was on the staff at Texas A and M in two thy and ten, and my dad had just gotten let go at Louisville and had joined that staff for just the off season, so the spring of the summer, and we initially were going to be moving down to College Station as a family and so I was going down there during the summer to go to all the camps and just hang out with my dad, and Zach again was a GA on that staff, and so he was coaching me in a lot of those
camps that I was going to. And then during my downtime, I was just hanging out up at the facility in the offensive staff meeting room.
Zach was the guy that has set up.
A computer and his whole office set up was in there, and so I ended up hanging out quite a bit of Zach and knew that again whenever I was graduating from college and wanted to get into coaching, he was one of the first people I hit up. And it was when he was Offensive Cornara, you see, and I initially was trying to get on his staff here as a GA. It didn't work out then, but we were able to reconnect three years later.
What's it like working here.
It's outstanding. I think this is the best organization in the NFL. We have a very unique setup in the ownership group that we have and their relationship and familiarity with the game and understanding and perspective in the game, and the family like atmosphere I think is second to
none here. Everybody is truly connected from the top down, and I think that's that starts at the top with mister Brown and then it trickles all the way down through the rest of the organization, and it's something that is intentionally cultivated and something I'm really really proud to be a part of.
We're visiting with Brad Craigthorpe. You played quarterback your quarterbacks coach now, but you have been working with other positions in your time here in Cincinnati, including a two year stint as the assistant wide receivers coach. Was that challenging for you having been a quarterback and has it helped your development?
It certainly helped my development in terms of viewing the
game from different perspectives. Like you said, playing quarterback growing up my entire life, I really viewed the game through that lens primarily all the way up until I graduated from college, and so getting into the receiver room being involved with the tight ends for one year in my career has really opened my eyes to different areas of offensive football and different ways that potentially issues could pop up, issues could be resolved, and certainly gave me a perspective
and one that I'm appreciative for when it comes to the totality of offensive football that maybe not quarterback.
Maybe quarterback might not specifically always see, but it is something that he needs to be aware of.
So during training camp, we will see you as the quarterbacks coach, conducting drills with the quarterbacks. But there's obviously a lot more to the job than working on their fundamentals. Your predecessor, Dan Pitcher was closely involved with the third down package every week over the past few years. What all encompasses the job of quarterbacks coach in this organization.
Well, I think first and foremost, it's getting the quarterback prepared to play.
His absolute best on Sundays.
It starts with that, and then from there it's daily improvement in all areas of the quarterback position for those guys, finding different ways that we can improve on the field off the field. And then obviously game planning is a big portion of as well. Like you said, Dan was
heavily involved in the third down plan. We're still working through all the responsibilities and who's gonna be doing what when it comes to game plan responsibilities next year, but that's certainly a part of it that I'm looking forward to as well.
You are obviously going to be working closely with Joe Burrow, and you got to know Joe before you got to Cincinnati. You are on the staff at LSU back in twenty eighteen. That was the year that he transferred from Ohio State to LSU, and he hadn't played in a few years at that point. What did Joe show you in that first year at LSU.
A lot of the things that you're seeing now. Leadership was the first thing that immediately jumped out at you. Is his ability to authentically connect with his teammates and the way that his teammates were drawn to him and followed his example, which is not something that you typically see from a transfer, So that was very unique. You saw the toughness, you saw the decision making ability, and you.
Saw the accuracy as a passer.
And those are all traits that I think he is elite at and ones that have really propelled him to have the career that he's currently having.
Were you at all surprised the following season You weren't there anymore, But when he had the Heisman Trophy season and led LSU to an undefeated national championship, campaign.
I was not surprised by that, No, which might be surprising to hear, but you could see, like you said, he hadn't played a lot of football up until that point. So that first season there was an element of knocking the rust off. And we had a lot of young players including Jamar Chase and Justin Jefferson and Clyde Edwards Hilaire that had n't played a lot of football themselves,
college football at that level. And so we knew and we saw as that season progressed in twenty eighteen and we continue to get better and better and better on offense, that with all of these guys returning the next year, that we were ready to explode.
We're chatting with Brad Craigthorpe, the Bengals new quarterbacks coach. The head coach at LSU back then was ed Orgeron. I got to know ed a little bit when he was the defensive line coach at Syracuse about thirty years ago. What was it like to work for coach O and what did you learn from him?
It was a unique experience and one that I'm very grateful for. Predominantly, more than anything else, I learned how to be a great recruiter under Coach O, which is a vital part of being a good college football coach. I learned the effort and the preparation and everything that goes into recruiting that you might not naturally see that goes on behind the scenes. So that was first and foremost the thing that I learned from Coach oh.
And then beyond that, I learned how to motivate.
He, in my mind, is one of the best motivators, and it was one of the best motivators in all of college football whenever he was coaching LSU, and he understands how to connect with guys and force them to bring the best out in themselves. And that's something that I took with me from my experience with him.
You obviously don't recruit in the same way in the NFL as you do in college, but there's some recruiting involved, whether it's the college free agency process for guys that don't get drafted or actual free agency. Money's obviously a key there. But do some of those recruiting lessons from Coach O apply now.
In some ways?
Yeah?
I mean, like you said, there's a recruiting element involved after the draft with some of the college free agents. There's a recruiting element involved with pro free agents, But more than anything, it taught me about the depths of all the areas of coaching that you might not necessarily see at face value, and so the depths of what it takes to be a great recruiter, the effort, the preparation, and everything that goes into it, I think applies across a lot of levels of being a coach.
Let's get back to Joe Burrow for a second. What's it take as a coach to earn his trust and respect.
I think it takes a couple of things.
I think that it takes knowledge of the position and the offensive scheme. I think displaying that you have a great understanding of what we're doing and why we're doing it is really all that Joe wants in a coach is someone that can guide him and help him make the best decisions on Sunday, and then showing that you care about him, showing that you always have his best interest at heart, and displaying that ultimately you always just
want what's best for him. And I think that that's something that he cares a lot about.
After he suffered his wrist injury, last year, Jake Browning stepped in and did a terrific job. The team went four and three, and the games that he started he had a passer rating over ninety eight. What impressed you most about Jake Browning when he stepped in as the starting quarterback.
His poise, his composure, and his ability to distribute the ball to all of the skilled players that we have, which is something that we all expected Jake to do. It may have seemed like a surprise to people on the outside, but whenever Jake got his opportunity, the way he played was not a surprise to anybody in this building,
including his teammates. And so Jake has a great understanding of how to play the quarterback position and offensive football as a whole, and he understands the big picture of everything, and his ability to distribute, make great decisions and distribute the football is as good as a lot of starters in this league.
So, as we do this interview, the Bengals announced a little while ago that aj McCarron has been released, So the Bengals are going to be in the market. I would think for a young, developmental type third string quarterback. Will you be involved in scouting college players and possible free agents.
I think so.
Yeah, I've kind of begun that process already and trying to find some guys that potentially fit the mold of what we're looking for. We'll see what that looks like as this evaluation process unfolds over the next month or so, but yeah, we're certainly looking for a guy that fits what we want to bring into our quarterback room.
Let's talk a little bit about the Bengals offense. The team finished sixteenth in points scored last year. You only had a healthy Joe Burrow for five games. Are there any obvious things that you think the offense must do better in twenty twenty four.
I think that we can be more explosive as a unit, whether that's in the run game or the pass game. I think that's something that was really beneficial for us in twenty twenty one and twenty twenty two is our ability to create explosive plays on a consistent basis, and that wasn't always a strength of ours last year, and I think that would be an example of something that we need to get back to moving into twenty twenty four.
All right, let's turn the clock back with you a little bit. You were a backup quarterback at LSU and the holder on field goals and pat and you were involved in one of the great trick plays of all time twenty fifteen LSU versus Florida. Both teams are undefeated, both teams are in the top ten, the game is tied to twenty eight in the fourth quarter. You pick up the story from there.
Yeah, that's one of the benefits of being a holder on a Less Miles coaching team is there's always a potential. First of all, we always have a bunch of fake field goals that are in the plan each week, and there's always a potential that one of them is goetn't get called in a high pressure moment like that one,
And so credit to coach Miles. He decided to pull that one out and we were able to execute it well, and our kicker, Trent Domain, was able to outrase their guys to the end zone and the rest is history.
Now I'm going to describe your role a little bit. You're there on a knee ready to hold, you catch the snap, You put the ball down as if the kicker about to approach it and kick it. But in the meantime he is sprinting out to the left, so you sell the fake. Then you throw the ball sideways and he runs in untouched for the TD. How nervous were you in front of one hundred and two thousand people in Death Valley knowing that you've got to sell this fake and make the throw.
In the moment, you really aren't that nervous. Maybe jogging out there you feel the butterflies a little bit, but once you get out there, you're looking for a certain criteria, certain formation that you want the defense to be in, and that's really your main focus. And then you know, once the ball hits your hands, you just do what your coach to do and you make the throw.
There really wasn't a.
Whole lot of nerves involved with it. The only thing that was a little bit nervous or nerve racking about that play is that it was a backward pass, and so if it would have hit the ground, it would have been a fumble, and then I would have became a defender and potentially had to go and make a tackle, which would have been a lot more nerve wracking than just making a simple fifteen year throw.
So if I'm in baton rouge and I drop your name at a bar, what's the likelihood that a rabid Tigers fan is going to go, oh, my gosh, twenty fifteen LSU Florida.
There's a chance. There's a chance. I don't know. I don't feel like my.
Accolades at LSU are really all that impressive, but yeah, there's a chance that someone my recognizement my name.
So you have ascended to quarterbacks coach here with the Cincinnati Bengals. Zach Taylor as a quarterbacks coach. He's obviously an NFL head coach. Brian Callahan was a quarterbacks coach elsewhere. He's now the head coach of the Tennessee Titans. Is that the ultimate goal in your future?
It is? It is?
It is my ultimate goal to become a head coach in the NFL, and I feel very fortunate to be in the position that I am right now, and it is a multi step process, and I'm my sole focus right now is just being the best quarterback coach that I can for this sin SINETI Bengals. But yeah, ultimately I do have the goal of being a head coach in this league at one point in time.
Yea, I know you've worked very hard for this. Congratulations on the opportunity and best of luck going forward.
Thank you, Dan, I really appreciate you having me.
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the official healthcare provider of the Bengals. In addition to Brian Callahan leaving for Tennessee, the Bengals also lost a member of the defensive staff as safeties coach Rob Livingston left to become Dion Sanders defensive coordinator at the University of Colorado. Rob Spott has been filled by Jordan Kovacs, who's been on the staff for the last five years after playing in the NFL for the Myami Dolphins. I talked to Jordan about his background as well as the
young safeties he'll be coaching this year. Jordan, you are from the Toledo area. You played college football at Michigan. Congratulations on the national championship. By the way, your dad is also a former Wolverine who was a reserve under Boucham Beckler. Was that your childhood dream to play football there?
Yes, you know, I grew up in the big House. I'd say we grew up with season tickets, so every home game we were in the Big House, myself, my dad, my brother, and Yeah, it was a lifelong dream to play football there. And the road to get there was a little whiny, a little kurvey at times, but it ultimately worked out.
Well, let's talk about the road, because you eventually became a captain and an All Big Ten safety, but you started out as a walk on. Did you have opportunities elsewhere?
No, I didn't, you know, not really.
I would say D three schools had been calling Division two schools. I went up to Hillsdale College and worked out. At this point, you know, by my senior year of high school, I was really just kind of looking for any offer, just to more or less say I had an offer. I went up to Hillsdale College and worked out, and they didn't offer. They said I could walk on there, and by that point I was pretty set on. You know, once I got into school at Michigan, I'll try out
for the team whatever, it takes. I want to play football at Michigan, and yeah, sure enough.
That's how it worked out.
I got into Michigan and was invited to an open student body tryout the day the first day of school at six in the morning. And you know, there's probably a lot to the story. I don't want to bore you, but the first tryout I made it failed to physical. So I had to come back six months later after the season and retry out for my second semester there. And I made that tryout, went through springball, and then
was on the team after that. Why'd you fail at physical, Tormaniscus, Yeah, slightly, Torminiscus. So I had arthur'scopic surgery my senior year of high school and it still wasn't feeling great, and I probably disclosed a little too much information in the physical and learned the hard way. So then I was sent home. I had to have a second knee surgery and got it taken care of though, and retried out, you know, the next January.
So when you have a path like that, walk on to eventual team captain, All League player, eventually the NFL will cover that at some point. Does that influence your approach to things to this day.
Yeah, I mean sure, you know, I don't take anything
for granted. You know, I know how hard it took to become a player really at Michigan, and then you know, even more work to play in the NFL, and now, you know, as a coach, and I just feel like, you know, I've just tried to work hard and earn everything that that's come my way, and I've taken pride in that, and you know, it's just everything that my parents instilled in me from day one, is just to work hard and be tough, be respectful, be kind, and be a person.
And good things happened.
And you know, I think that's more or less been the story of my journey.
You played on a team that beat Ohio State. Now you played on a team that won the Sugar Bowl. What was the highlight of your entire Michigan experience in Ann Arbor.
Well, if you as a Michigan fan, you know day one, the one, the one game that has circled on your calendar every year is the Ohio State Michigan game. And I grew up obviously in Ohio, right, so I'm on the in the battlegrounds are in Toledo. So the first thing, most important thing I ever cared about was being Ohio State and to get that win in twenty eleven was you know, a huge, you know, huge win and probably
the highlight of my career. And then, as you mentioned later that season, we played in the Sugar Bowl, went down to New Orleans and played Virginia Tech. Had we had a great game against Virginia. Virginia Tech came down to a couple of miss field goals and I think it went into overtime, but it was just a fun way to cap a really big season.
We're chatting at safeties coach Jordan Kovacs. You weren't drafted, but you signed with the Dolphins as a college free agent and you made the team playing for three NFL seasons. The defensive backs coach at the time was lou Anarumo. Describe what it was like to play for lou Yeah.
I loved playing for lou you know, I guess just my perspective from being an undrafted free agent was here we go again. I'm walking on again, and I wouldn't want it any other way. And the one thing I always respected about Lou is it didn't matter how you got there. You know, it was the same thing that my coaches at Michigan told me. It was the best players will play, the best players will make the team. Doesn't matter if you're an undrafted free agent or if you're a seventh round pick.
It didn't matter.
And I did respect that about Lou, and I really enjoyed working with Lou and coach Coyle. Mark Duffner was on the staff there. Zach Taylor was on the staff there, so it was a really good staff and it was a lot of fun to play down there in Miami.
How much did you interact with Zach since he was the quarterbacks coach?
He probably got on my ass if I messed up as scout cards, I would say that was probably about the extent of the interactions.
But no, he was great.
I always had a lot of respect for Zach and the way that he carried himself and the way he coached the quarterbacks. But yeah, no, it was obviously a great relationship, and really the reason that I'm here today.
Roughly ten years later, has Lou changed.
It's same Lou, same Lou.
You know, I think you know, probably where I've seen the most growth is in how he leads a room.
You know.
I saw him as a player and I was, you know, one of his players in his defensive backs room, and I knew he was a leader then, and then just seeing him evolve and being able to run a whole defense right, And I think that he's just such a good coach. He's grown in a lot of ways, and I've always had a lot of respect for lou.
In your third year with Miami, there was a head coaching change. Dan Campbell took over as the interim head coach for the final twelve games of the season. And we've all seen since he's been the Lions head coach, the biting kneecap speech and some of the other amusing things that he's done. What was it like to play for Dan Campbell?
I loved playing for Dan.
He is very much He's from the old school, Bill Parcells Tree and from day one. I'll never forget when he took over. I think he took over on the bye week, and it was very much competitions. Every day we're going to compete in something. And early on in
that bye week it was Oklahoma Drill. It was some tackling drills that you don't do in the NFL anymore, and then eventually by you know, a few weeks down the road, it was a pieh eating contest, it was a frisbee throwing contest, but there was always some element of competition.
And again, I.
Have a lot of respect for Dan the way that he's run things, or that he did run things, and it's not surprising at all to me the level of success that he's had as the head coach of the Lions.
We're chatting with safeties coach Jordan Kovacs. When did you get the coach bug?
That's a great question.
I would say it was early in my playing career at Michigan.
You know, I.
Played under Brady Hoak and I just had a lot of respect for the way. I love the way that he interacted with players and the influence that I felt like he had on kids and that he had on his players, and he was a father figure to a lot of guys, and I just you know, I remember one day in warmups, warm ups, just watching coach Hoak walk around and interacting with the guys and thinking, you know what, I think, that's what I want to do one day. You know, I want to I want to
lead I want to be. I want to be a football coach and a leader of men. And you know, he's certainly a guy that I've always looked up to.
You played safety in college and in the NFL, and you're going to be coaching the safeties and other members of the secondary now here in Cincinnati. But since you've been here, you've coached different positions. You've been with the linebackers the last few years. Was that by design and has it helped your overall understanding?
Yeah, I think that that's kind of how I always approached this thing. You know, I knew early as a young coach that it would be beneficial for me to just be exposed to as much of the game as I could, especially on the defensive side of the ball. And Frank, I'll take you back even further. When I first got into coach and I worked at Michigan as a GA under coach Harball, and I told coach I wanted to work with the defensive line, and that was
where Greg Madison was coaching at the time. And you know, the defensive line, really the line of scrimmage is so much different than anything that I had ever been exposed to, and it really took me a long time to really see and feel what you're coaching up front, but looking back, that was invaluable. It probably took me months to really understand what good technique looked like, and it has proven to be invaluable. And then, yeah, getting here, I'm talking
with Zach. You wanted He and I both thought it would be beneficial for me to be in the linebacker room, and yes, I've done that for five years now, and I do think that that it does bring a lot of valuability to my perspective now from the defensive back room, just knowing how those linebackers are coached, where they're going to be and we're all tied together. So yes, you know, starting from the front all the way to the back, it's proven to be invaluable.
I think. So.
Now that you've taken over as the Bengals safeties coach, let's discuss the safeties, beginning with your fellow Michigan Wolverine Dax Hill. How would you characterize his first season as a starter last year?
Yeah, you know, it's obviously experience is the most important thing in anything, and especially in the National Football League, and he's been great. He's got the skill set right, Dax's he can cover, and that doesn't you know, that's not easy to come by for safeties.
He's had high highs.
He's made some really good plays, and I'm sure he'd be the first to tell you that there's a few plays that he'd like back, but that's what happens when you're a young safety. And he's done a great job just kind of trying to get a little better over the course of the season. So I have high expectations for Dax. I'm looking forward to working with him, and I expect him to make even bigger strides this year.
I know he played a lot of slot corner his final year at Michigan. Is that a big transition?
Yeah.
I mean, anytime you're going from nickel to safety, there is a transition, and there's a learning curve, and you know, once you're on the back end of this thing, you're really the quarterback of the defense. And I'm sure he's I know he's continuing to learn and grow there. And you know, communication, in my opinion, is one of the areas that we've got to take a huge step forward.
Right we're the quarterback, we're running the defense. We've got to communicate, make sure everybody's on the same page, because you have a bust on the back end and it's a touchdown, right, we can't afford those sorts of things, those sorts of miscommunications. So I expect him to do a great job in that area.
Is communicating the biggest key to cutting down on some of the big plays allowed last year.
Yeah.
Absolutely, communication and tackling. I think those are two of the most important things that we can do on our back end, and two areas that again we're looking to improve this year.
Jordan Battle stepped in as a rookie. He started the final seven games of the season.
How do you do I thought he played played well for a rookie. You know, I think he did.
Again, there's a lot that comes with just playing time, and these guys are continuing to learn and continuing to get better. Jordan's a physical player, He's very comfortable in the box. He sees the game naturally. He's a good safety and again another guy them looking forward to working with.
So I think the official title is safety's slash secondary coach. You're working closely with cornerbacks coach Chuck Burks. Let's talk about the corners a little bit. You've got two talented young ones in Cam Taylor Britt and DJ Turner. Do you look at those two guys as potentially two of the better young cornerbacks in the NFL.
Yeah, no doubt.
I think really since Cam's been here, he's just he's he's he's the real deal outside. He can cover, and I think what I like most about Cam is he's tough. You know, he'll come up and he'll hit you, he'll tackle, and he's the total package there. And then yeah, Dj is obviously same thing. You know, he's he's he's a guy that can run. He's got the skill set. Obviously, again, it was his rookie year, so there's some high highs or some low lows. That's that's what happens when you're
a rookie. And he has improved quite a bit over the course of the season and a guy that again we look forward to getting in here this spring and continuing to work.
So the combine is right around the corner. What will your responsibilities be when it comes to the draft.
Uh, yeah, so I'll be working obviously with the safeties. I'm looking forward to really, you know, the combine. You can kind of get up and get there see him in person. You get to interact with them and interview each guy. So I'll be evaluating all the safeties and helping Chuck with the corners as need be. And you know again, I look forward to kind of get my hands on these guys and seeing them up close and personal.
It's not easy to become a position coach at this level, the highest level of football. What's it mean to you to get this opportunity.
I'm just grateful, you know, I'm excited. I'm really, really, really excited to just work with these guys. It's a fresh start for all of us. And just grateful from Zach and Taylor and mister Brown and lou An Rumo just for the opportunity and I'm looking forward to making the most of it.
Seems like a great collaboration in this building. What's it like to be a member of the Bengals coaching staff.
Yeah, I think that that starts, you know, up top with with Zach.
You know, it's all hands on deck.
He does a great job of He's an excellent leader, just does a great job of delegating tasks and trusting in his coaches, and you know, again, I'm grateful for the opportunity and looking forward to it.
I know you have grinded hard to earn this opportunity. Congratulations and we look forward to a visiting with you and the way to come.
Thanks Dan, I appreciate it.
That's going to do it for this episode of the Bengals Booth Podcast, brought to you by pay Core, Proud to be the Bengals Official HR software provider, by Alta Fiber future proof fiber Internet designed to elevate your home, business and community to a new level, and by Kettering Health the best care for the best fans. Kettering Health
is the official healthcare provider of the Bengals. If you haven't done so already, please subscribe to this podcast and if you have a minute, give it a rating or share a comment that helps more Bengals fans find us. I'm Dan Hord and thanks for listening to The Bengals Booth Podcast.