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industry live to tape on the nineteenth of October. The current dysfunction we are seeing in Congress has become far more than an inconvenience to the American people.
It's a clear and present danger. The Republican majority in the House of Representatives has failed to coalesce around anyone they might find suitable to fill the vacant role a Speaker of the House, and without one, that body continues to fail and its only true mission, the governance of the country, unfortunately, is emblematic of the growing partisan divide that has become the norm to many of our representatives has chosen party over country, and it seems to be getting worse,
or perhaps in one way or another, it's always been that way. Joining us now to give her a unique insiders perspective, gain from years on the national political scene, including two stands inside the White House. So director of communications for Hillary Clinton's presidential campaign, to frequent guest on ms NBC and co host of the very popular showtime series The Circus, and a very busy lady today my friend Jennifer Palmiery. Jennifer, thank you so much for joining us.
I mean that lots going on today. The President is speaking tonight, we have to talk about Congress, we have to talk about Israel. So I really appreciate you taking the time. You know, I'm always happy to talk to you. Frank, I love it. Yeah, it's really really it's our pleasure. Well, let's talk a little bit about the role of
speaker. What does it mean to be Speaker of the House, Well, it means that you're presiding over the business of the House, and the speaker largely controls what bills come to the floor and when, so it is the ultimate It's it's a management job. I mean, it comes with enormous power. But because you do design, because you are you are ultimately the one who's deciding you know when, when which regition is gonna is going to get
voted on and uh. But you also you know when you have a divided Congress like we have now in uh White House, in one party in the House and another, it's also a big uh. It's a compromise job.
And you know that the most successful speakers are the ones that know how to keep their coalition together, keep their UH caucus aligned, but also are able to have enough credibility within their caucus, you know, like the in Jordan's case, the House Republican caucus, that they are able to negotiate deals when they need to sort of on their own right, because you can't have four hundred and thirty five members in a room. And Nancy Pelosi is emblematic as
somebody who was very successful in trying to do both things right. She she she was really great at holding her caucus together. The big show is you know, you know she would never bring you ask if the bill is going to pass, and the question is the Nancy plusy bring it to the floor, because anty pussy is not bringing a bill to the floor that is not going to pass. That is never going to happen, and it never did
happen. But she also had enough credibility with the Democrats that she was able to negotiate when she needed to with the Senate Republicans to gunt and know that her caucus was ultimately going to back her with whatever she compromises she had to make. So it is, it's a pretty thing. It can be often a very thankless job. Is a very hard job. It requires a lot of nuance and skill. Well, let's talk about right now with it.
There's a numbers game, and we mentioned artisan politics and the compromise, et cetera. Two hundred and eighteen votes are needed to get the full majority to elect the Speaker of the House. But in a in a divided house where it seems like just everybody goes strictly acording to party lines, how does anyone get to that number. I mean, well, yeah, it's I mean it's well, we've never we've never had before, We've never had a party
failed to be able to unite behind one leader. So that has that's just not happened, you know. You just you don't go to the floor and wing it thea like Kevin McCarthy did in January, where it took fifteen votes in order for him to finally get a majority to get to to eighteen and become speaker. So the you know, it is not you know, there's there's now sort of a question and it's I mean, Frank like I it's
it's you know, we're doing this Thursday afternoon. I didn't look at the New York Times for an hour thought, you know, and thought that the Republicans had decided that they would not try to opt for a third vote of trying to get Jim Jordan O were uh to uh to tow eighteen And an hour later they've decided no, They're going to go forward again. So this is it is it is. It's not something that in modern certainly in modern political history, certainly like in the last hundred years, this just is not
a situation that we have been in before. You know, it's interesting because I said, I better check a quick look at see and then to see what the latest is because the situation has been that mercial and and changing so rapidly. Now you're you're the veteran of two administrations, correct, Clinton and Obama? Clinton? Obama? Yeah, yes, So what was who was speaker at that time? Was Pelosi? For for both of administrations? It was for Clinton it was Tom Foley and then and then new Gingridge and he
didn't last he did not last very long. And then it was Bob Livingston for like a hot minute, and then I guess it was Denny Hastert, and then for Obama it was Pelosi, and then Bayner and then Ryan and yeah, no, I was just gonna say, and Baine, I would say, you know, Bayner and Ryan, uh it was. I would say, that is where it started. You could see the House Republican Caucus start to break down in terms of its ability to hold uh you know,
to to hold their members together. And Bayner and Ryan both had really difficult times trying to uh uh you know, particularly Ryan when he was speaker in the Trump administration, very difficult time holding holding their their their own party members together, and so they proved to be ineffectual. And you know, they were usually elected. You know, they're elected in mid terms. That's what happens. Right at president it's elected midterm election. The other party does better,
might take over control of the Congress. But you know, with any moment years they just they they not. Even though Bayner and Ryan were sort of in the mold of what you want in a speaker, kind of a traditional establishment, not a grand standard, someone who can work effectively behind the scenes, but even they couldn't, uh, you know, had a hard time keeping their caucus aligned. Talk about the relationship that the speaker has with
the president is a very direct relationship. Is it a hands on relationship? Do they do they meet on a regular basis and answer that person follow up question from there? No, it depends. I mean I think that the speaker that probably work the most directly with the president that I can recall as Tip O'Neill and President Reagan. They I wouldn't say that happened all the time,
but they had divided government. The House was constantly the House was in Tip O'Neill's control the entire time that Reagan was president, and there was a lot that did pass on a bipartisan basis, so they did have to work together. They were very ideologically in different places, but seem to respect each other and and kind of enjoy sparring with each other. But I would say
you Pelosi and Obama had a good relationship. They It's not the kind of thing where you're going to talk to them every week, but when you are, but when you're in the situation of having to get something done, it is you may talk to the speaker five times in one day. So it kind of goes and fits and starts. There will be meet meetings are largely
ceremonial. They usually happen when you're trying to, you know, show that you're working together and trying to make progress if you're at loggerheads or get when you're getting ready to kick something off. But it's important that there is it's
important that there's a lot of trust in that relationship. Well, the perfect segue with that in mind, Jen, you have two powerful people, in some cases a woman, in other cases a man of supposedly with the balance of power in a sense almost equally powerful, almost, but there's the enormous power of the president president. Is that always there is that? Is the speaker always aware of that or are they more on equal footing? What you're
feeling with that? Well, I think normally this honestly, I think when it comes to dealing with the president, the speaker usually is I would say has more power than the president does because the speaker the president doesn't have anything that necessarily that the speaker was. The speaker very much has something that the president wants. And of course, being president the United States might be the most powerful job in the world. It's also the job with the president has
a lot of power. They don't have a lot of control, right, you have very little control when you're a president and uh, and that you know, that's it's very any anything that happens in the world can become your problem, your responsibility can up end whatever you have planned. And this the speaker, uh, you know, they will need the president to not undercut them if they will need this the president to sign off on a deal that
they need the president's support. But really it is uh, the speaker that the president that's relying on the speaker to move a legislative agenda on their behalf. Interesting. Well, yeah, another point that you spoke of too, is working across the aisle yea a description mixed you that was Republican Congress and a Democrat or vice versa. Yeah, and again we see that divine getting wider. But before to get to that, how did it work? How
do they make it work? Can you mentioned people can be really diametrically opposed in a very deep sense and yet still get stuff done. How so the I would say, my first sort of up close look at that was during the Clinton administration in nineteen ninety four. We lost both the House and the Senate. It was very historic. It was the first time in forty years
that Republicans controlled the House. It was an earthquake of epic proportions politically, and Clinton saw immediately an opportunity to try to work with Republicans to you know, to move to move things forward. Particularly this is on the budget was the big example of where this was done on a bipartisan basis. Two years later, enacted a balanced for the first time in a very long time in
the UH in in US history. It can happen when the incentives in both parties are aligned to get something done and the problem and what's happened in the more recent history, in the last decade and a half maybe is that the incentives and the Republican Party are such that you are rewarded for being an extremist. And I'm not I'm trying to not be partisan myself. I'm just objectively
you know this. Those are the incentives in the Republican Party to get on Fox News, to uh, to be to be sensational on social media, to raise money that way, and that has so that so you do not need to be uh. It used to be that both parties are trying to sort of capture the center in politics in order to win reelection or or or
or or beat an incumbent. And what's happened then, What sort of happened was that, particularly in the House of Representatives, where if the Republican districts were gerrymandered so that they were heavily concentrated Republican voters, the incentives was just to worry about winning a Republican primary and not a concern about capturing voters in the middle. And then that's when the dysfunction really started to take hold.
I have a counter intuitive view about this, so that which is that I think it's getting better, which I know when you look at the day, I was just going to say, get worse. What are we going to do about it? All over that one so the but so if you you
know, progress doesn't happen in a straight line. And so let's say we have complete dysfunction in the household right now, that it's been more than two weeks that there is no speak or and you know, we don't know, I don't know it's recording this on Thursday, October nineteenth, I don't you know, we can't. I don't know what's going to happen. If Jordan's going to get the votes to become speaker today, I kind of doubt it. I mean, he's moving out of panic right now as opposed to seems
like a position to strength that he actually has the votes. But if you look at the first two years of the Biden administration, it was by far the most bipartisan, productive, normal Congress that we have seen since George W. Bush was president. There was you know, there was no these are low bars, but there was no there was no true threat of a government the government shutting down there uh they you know, there was no big showdown
over the debt limit. They passed bipartisan infrastructure bill after ten years of trying. They passed a bill that's referred to as the Chips Bill that helps to build semiconductor plans in the US. Really important foundational bill for both technology and infrastructure in the US that will help for decades. The Congress, with just Democratic votes, it passed the Inflation Reduction Act that did a lot on climate
but even on you know, by the bipartisan basis judges. This is a very shocking thing to say, but a lot of judges were confirmed on a bipartisan basis, including Supreme Court justices that Republicans voted for. And then even when the Republicans took over the House, and this is what ended up being Kevin McCarthy's downfall. But even when the Republicans took over the House under President Biden in the last year, again they avoided a government shut down. Kevin
McCarthy was able. He worked with Democrats to do that. He worked with Democrats to pass the down limit agreement. Now it then blew up on him in his own caucus. But the point is there are Democrats in Republicans in both the House and the Senate, particularly in the Senate uh gun control. There, they passed a measure last year after the Vivaldi shooting to UH to
to make it harder for people who shouldn't have guns to buy them. So that I think that and that's just happening because I think individual members of Congress are making the decision that they just want government to work, you know, And I think it's really important in particularly for Democrats, even beyond accomplishing you know, particular goal, just not showing because on the other side, on the Republican side, it's a lot of chaos, a lot of disruptions that
were represented by President Trump himself, but on the so on the democratic side, like you need to prove that government can still work, that the democracy can respond to the concerns that people it represents. And so I think that even though we had this craziness right now that's concentrating the Republican caucus, there's a lot of evidence that Congress is functioning. It's just true. It's just
a fact that it's functioning better than it has in twenty years. And you know, for this thing to work, the Democrats have to come around as well too, and they've refused. They refused to support McCarthy, and they refuse to support any of the current Republicans for Speaker of the House. What's that about? So I think, you know, to go back to the original McCarthy, the vote from two weeks ago, where no Democrats voted to say McCarthy. I talked to a lot of I was on the Hell that
day. I talked to a lot of moderate Democrats, Democrats who often cross over and vote with the Republicans, and each of them said it was there was just no question in their mind, but that would be the wrong thing to do. That It would that, you know, Democrats and House can't prop up a Republican speaker. It's just not going to work. And felt that first of all, they have a larger problem, or probably have a
larger problem in their caucus. If you can't get two hundred and eighteen people to vote for you, to vote for your leader after you won the majority, you've got a bigger problem you need to work out on your own. But then also as a practical matter, I think it would have fallen apart.
I think if Democrats started to vote for Kevin McCarthy, that republic more conservative Republicans would have bolted and not voted to save McCarthy because they would have stopt you know, some kind of fixes in or it's just so, I just don't think that it is palatable for without a broader agreement for Democrats to elect a Republican speaker. Now. Having said that, the Democrat leader in the House of King Jeffrey So I think is very able, very effective.
He has, you know, he said the next day, Democrats are standing ready, we are ready to work on a bipartisan basis to to you know, he kind of leaves it open, but the point being it's kind of like, make me an offer, you know, make me an offer about
something that we can that Democrats can get behind. And he has. You know, there's a notion now that Patrick McHenry, the Republican Congressman who's currently serving as a Speaker pro tem, uh that the Democrats could get behind a deal that he remains, that he remains a speaker and you know, and then presumably he would he would have to agree though to to you know, some kind of agreement where the Democrats had not you know, not really a
power sharing agreement, but at least some some some guarantees about how that the House, how the House was going to be conducted. We may end up there, you know, Like I I don't know, but I think that Democrats certainly decided there was no way. They also felt like they couldn't trust
McCartney. You know, there's just also like there's honor among faiths in politics, you know, and and they're there can be you know, like there is and you know, there are Republicans they trust that sticks by their word, and he is not one of them. And they're just like, there's just no way we could ever trust even if he was offering to make us a deal, that we could ever abide by it. So that's why the days have thus far not been you know, participated. But I think that
they still could. Let's talk a little bit about the political ramifications, particularly for Republicans and some moderate Republicans, one particularly from the area where I live. Mike Lawler. Mike Leler, Yeah, I've got to know him a
little bit. Has been all over the place, very well spoken, very interesting in talks at least all the time about compromise going across the aisle, and often very critical of some of his his Republican co members of Congress, particularly the more radical, and we know we're talking about Marjorie Taylor Green, Lauren Bolber, Matt Getz, et cetera. I think there are ramifications for someone like that who won as a Republican in an area that was that overwhelmingly
voted for Biden. He has to be aware that people, even though he's trying, he could be blamed for the failure of the government. So there are political ramifications, particularly for more moderate Republicans like Michael. Yeah, there eight there are eighteen House Republicans who live in districts that Joe Biden won, and he's you know, he's he's probably the savviest of the group. I would say, you see him on MSNBC a lot his district, his district,
his district. I think his district could be the highest per capital of the audience of MSNBC of any congressional district in the country, or certainly one of them. So he is very good at showing that he's trying to be a different kind of Republican, and he has thus far, he has refused to vote for Jim Jordan. But the DIC, you know, I think it's going to be very hard for the House for the for for people like I mean, Lawlor is a pretty, you know, pretty relatively talented politician.
He may survive, but I have a hard time seeing the Republicans being able to hold onto the House in twenty twenty four when they cannot govern. I mean, you are in charge, you have you. It's and Frank, it's not just that they can't, it's almost as if they don't want to, you know, they're not. Brendon Bach, who was worked for one of their former Republican speakers, his friend of mine, I can't. I think he worked for he worked for Paul rant and he said, you
know, they're just the way the Republican Party is right now. They're just they're not built to govern. They're just not They're built to be an opposition and they can do that really well, and they can rile up their base really well. But they are not built to come to any kind of census.
And so I think it is going to be very difficult. If there are twelve of the eighteen Republicans that represent Biden House districts that voted for Jim Jordan, who, by the way, isn't you know Kevin McCarthy voted to overturn the presidential election in twenty twenty. I think people kind of don't realize that. I think they think that Kevin McCarthy is sort of a normal book
and he voted to not certify the presidential election in twenty twenty. But then Jim Jordan is something wholly other because not only did he do that, but he was you know, he was helping behind he was behind the scenes, helping to try to orchestrate how the president, how President Trump could hijack the election on the on the House and Senate floor. So it's just not an
exaggeration to say he is an insurrectionist. And if Republican members and tough districts vote for them, the dj will see, which is the organization that Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee that helps to allow Democrats to the House of Representatives. They're fucking points on the day that the first day Jordan, the first day it was a Jordan votes of that any Republican in a battleground district that voted for that, they would make sure that anyone who voted for him that there was
a career ending move. I think they think it is a It just sort of encapitulate, encapsulates you know, just maga extremism that people in those districts can have a hard time beaten back. I want to talk a little bit
about that and the so called Maga extremism. I think it's it's certainly fascinating to me that a relative handful nine people tend it changes from nine to ten or eleven of these extreme Republicans again labeled as maga super support as a former President Trump have that kind of control someone like a Matt Getz, who seems to repel most people, I think nationally, yet has managed to garner an enormous amount of power, enough any way to throw Congress into a complete right.
How can that be? How can that happen? Because Kevin McCarthy gave him the power? You know, I mean they they need the you know, I mean that is that is what what what happened was Kevin McCarthy could not on his own gain he did he you know, didn't have the credibility, the leadership skills whatever. For whatever reason, he was not able to
get two hundred and eighteen members of his own House caucus. And people, by the way, often talk about how like, oh, well, the Republicans, uh, their margins are so narrow that they only have a I think it's it's the four or five set margin uh over the the over the Democrats. That is, Kevin McCarthy had the exact same margin that Nancy Pelosi had, Okay, the exact same and she and look at everything she accomplished
in the first two years of the Biden administration with the same numbers. So he was because I mean I and I think that Jonathan Martin, his friend of mine, who has the columnist for Politico, he had a great piece yesterday. It's just like, there's nothing that holds the Republican Party together right
now. And that's what you're seeing play out here right so you know, so that they there's just not there's not any there's nothing that there's nothing that is make there's no cohesion around an agenda, a particular set of principles. So McCarthy had to make a bunch of deals in order to win the speakership the first time. One of the deals he made was giving the power to any one person to you know, motion in the term is motion of ak, which means anyone person can say I want this, I want to vote
on removing the speaker by the way. That motion of ak was in place for a very long time, like one hundred years until twenty eighteen, and Nancy Pelosi had it removed because she's savvy and so it's not event So this power has existed for a long time. No one ever used it because you see the result. It's a destructive It was switched gears just slightly. And
it's certainly related to our conversation. But you mentioned it. Within the first two years, the Biden administration has been, by most standards, enormously successful. There have been missteps, there have been issues the border we can talk about later, but there has also been a goodly amount of success. Yet the country is still almost equally divided. So you have the enormous political sense of Biden versus the continuing popularity of a man who has been indicted over has
been served over ninety indictments in former President Trump. Why is that? And why do you think the Biden administration has had such difficulty in conveying that. You know, they've overall have done very well. If you look at the call numbers, they're still almost neck and neck. It's early, but that's the truth. Yeah, they have I mean, I would say you know, I mean the Biden administration has accomplished more than any presidency in the last
sixty years. I mean, at this point, you have it's beyond LBG at this point. At this point you have to go back to FDR. So that is how phenomenally successful. Now people can agree, you know,
just choose to agree or disagree with what they've done. But the truth is they've put in place with both the Infrastructure Bill and as I mentioned before, the Chips Bill, things you know, gains that will be made over decades for the United States and for the economy and sort of splaying a new a new, a new foundation that it can that it can grow from and really put us in UH a position to be competitive, you know, to maintain
our UH domination UH on the world global economic stage. But I think that there's the two big problems are UH, the you know, the divided country. And it's not just that we're divide over politics. We just we have different views of the truth. You know, we say that all the time. Don't really positive appreciate how how damning that is. But the I I in my job at the circus, they spend a lot of time at Trump rallies and talking to Trump supporters, and they you know a lot of them,
you know, they believe they're doing the right thing. They believe President Trump tells them. They think he won the election. They think that the country is truly under siege. And uh, they're just not open to hearing anything about Biden and what Biden has done. And so where as you used to be able to win over some measure sure of Republicans by arguing facts,
there's just different view of facts. And then the second thing I think that's holding President Biden back, and this may change, is that even though the economic numbers are good, you know, wages arising, inflation is going down, there's you know, very low unemployment, lots of job growth. Interest rates are you know at you know, the high as they've been in twenty
years, and costs are still high. The average family, Mark Zandy's economist, I saw presentation by him recently and he said that the average family of four has their expenses are eight hundred dollars a month higher than they were when Trump was president. That is a you know, that is a very big deal. That is a very big deal. People always think with their pockets or pocketbooks whatever the case, it's always been the case. You know what
was favoring says the economy stupid. You know, that was a very a very salient point, Jen before we take a break, and I want to talk a little bit about the president's trip to Israel and what's going on there and things of that nature. But before that, you mentioned the divide seems to be widening and with people who just won't listen to reason or fact,
they're just so and to a degree on both sides. But that's not also true if you haven't real it's not really because if you have real facts that are truthful facts, they are what they are, whether people want to listen to them or not. But how did we get there where there is a significant sixty million people are more voted for Trump based on many laws that they chose to believe. How did we get here? I think two factors. One is we did not do a good job dealing with the impact of globalization
and wage inequality and the growing disparity with wealth. So for the last thirty years, people have been losing jobs and industries that are going away in America. Haven't done a good job of replacing them, haven't done a good job dealing with you know, at the richer getting richer, the poorer getting poorer, and Congress has not been as a you know noted before the last twenty years has been really ineffectual, and so people, I mean, there are
notable exceptions to that. For example, passing Obamacare Affordable Care Act, it's you know, done enormous good in helping people save mone also helping people just have access to healthcare. But you look at the education system, you look, you look at people who've lost you know, you look at these pockets of poverty in the United States that continue to grow as well. So I think there's a lot of disillusionment and people were ripe to uh tune into somebody
like Trump that wanted to blow everything up. You know, I talked to a lot of Trump supporters, and a lot of them will say the same thing. He says what I think, or we just need to blow it
up. He's right about that, And then I think the other you know, the sort of like catastrophic collision, is that's happening at a time where you have the internet, like we're we used Frank, I mean, you were at CBS for a long time, like there used to be gates that you had to go through in order for your views to be heard on a massive scale. And that is just that is gone. And I don't think
that we appreciate how big of a deal that is. You know, people go back you know after you know, after the printing of the Bible, like and you know, and and and you know what that set off in the UH and in the globe when you had television and radio and then you had like the rise of uh you know, mass media. You had the rise of Hitlery, the rise of fascism, riots of communism, these these communication math the ability to communicate in a mass level sets off big changes in
the world. And so I think it's both of those things happening at the same time. Well, you see old it must be true. I saw it on the internet. Yeah, I mean it's I mean, internet is bigger than television or radio. But you know, you know, it's just so it is, you know, And so then there's no truth because there's no agreed upon set of anything there used to be. Chen Let's let's take
a little bit of a break here. When we come back, I want to talk a little bit about Israel and the Middle East and the President's trip there and what that meant and how that was organized. Also, want to get your thoughts. One of the presidents, lawyer Sidney Powell, was found was actually pled guilty today. I want to get your thoughts on that, and also what's ahead with co hosting the circus, what's planned for the next season. So we've got a lot to talk about. I'm so glad that
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on Thursdays, but you can listen at your convenience. Every program is archives, so you can listen to Being Frank virtually any time you want to. We think it's the intelligent thing to do, and we're sure having some intelligent conversation with my very special guest, Jennifer Palmieri genuine teased a little before the commercial break. The President was just in Israel following the horrific attacks by Hamas,
which virtually entire world has condemned. But he must walk an incredible tightrope between the support of Israel and their right to exist and their right to defend themselves, but yet at the same time deal with the retaliation that Israel must do, at least on some level to protect themselves. So in other words, it's a real balancing act. And to travel to Israel in a battle zone that must have sent the White House into an incredible amount of prenetic activity
to tell us what that might be like. So the amazing I mean it. I was shocked that they announced that he was going to Israel, because we do. When I work for both President Clinton and President Obama, and you know this, Frank from working for CBS, we would do what we would call dark and night trips, and that's that's when you would go to Afghanistan or Iraq. So in my experience and working for President Obama and President Clinton, we bring the press with us, but we're in a small pool
of press on Air Force one. We take them into a room in the White House and tell them you are going on this trip. You're not to tell anyone. They don't tell their editors, they don't tell their family members were what's happening. They just disappear. There's no public notice, and then we wake up to the news. You know, President Obama arrived in Afghanistan overnight, or or more recently, President Biden arrived in you know, we
woke up with the President Biden is in Kiev active war zone. And so I mean, given how dangerous the region is in general, but after what happened that the fact that why a Tony Blinken, the Secretary of State, walked out of a meeting in the region and said President Biden has come in Israel on Wednesday, on Monday night, you know, so that means that there's thirty six hours to get a trip together, but also thirty six hours
that the people who wish you ill are aware of the President United States is coming to coming to a war zone. So you know, I guess the time was in their favor and that the people who want to cause trouble don't have a lot of time to prepare, but you don't have the element of surprise, and they had to quickly put this trip together. So it was scary in terms of just his safety. You know. Fortunately, you know,
it worked out, It all works out fine. But then just incredibly high stakes and very tricky political balance, and and you know what happens just as the President is leaving to get on Air Force one to fly over there, Uh, there's the horrible bombing of the hospital in Gaza, and the
you know, he's supposed to be with the UH. He's supposed to meet with Preme Miister and net Yahoo and then do an Arab summit in Jordan, and the Arab leaders pull out, and so now he is the balance is gone, right, He's walking on Air Force one and all it's all it's all tilted towards backing Israel. And that is a very scary proposition as you're you know, getting present United States on this plane to go do this. I think they did a remarkable job, you know, going to Israel.
And you know, he said, he kept saying, The President kept saying. A number one message is you are not alone. Israel is not alone, like the United States will always back you. But because he went and showed his space there and stood with Israel, he was also able to say eight to Prime Minister net Yahoo, you know, the concerns about limiting impact to civilians and protecting Palestinian civilians, making the point to the world that Palestinians
and Hamas are not the same thing. You know, they're there are the Palestinian civilians are caught in this crossfire from what the terrorists you control, you know who who who control their region, are are putting them in this situation, and so I think that they did a remarkable job from you know what what they said on the ground to the israelis what that gave him the room
to say about protecting Palestinians. The humility with which President Biden said, you know, we had our nine to eleven and learned from our mistakes about how you know, we may have over corrected in our in our in our response
and be smart about this. And then on after the after the trip, on the way home, went to the back of the plane on Air Force one to talk to the press something the press really appreciates, something that the president almost never does, and said, if if you know, after being so supportive of Israel and continuing to be supportive of Israel, also saying if there are unacceptable Palestinian casualties of civilians, we're going to hold Israel accountable and
so and then came back landed it in DC and said we're going to do an He's going to do an Oval Office address on Thursday night, which is the Kupda grad The ultimate thing, the ultimate tool and your toolkit as president of communicating to the American public is the Oval Office address. And that's what are going to do tonight, can now communicate to the American people what is at stake and what our interests are here. So I mean that is talk
about high stakes. When the rug gets pulled out from under you as you're leaving, I think they handled it really well. A relative question, Let's talk about the leadership role that the United States plays in the in the world. Uh, there are those who feel we shouldn't take care of our own first, et cetera, and would limit the role that we play in the world. None agrees with that. What are your thoughts, Jed? How important is it for us to or or not to play a major role in
world politics. I am a big believer in engagement, you know, they I think you can want. Biden has managed to do thus far, and you know, we don't need this. What's happening in the Middle East right now is very you know, volatile and carry situation. But he's managed to restore American leadership in the world. You know, I'm thinking of Ukraine and and rallying NATO, which after the Trump years was maybe there's a question about
that alliance was going to survive, that alliance was even relevant anymore? Are you know, in the post Cold War world. And I believe that, you know, holding native together in that in that way sort of re established US as a global leader. And then you know, President Biden has dove headfirst into the current conflict, you know, in a way that maybe he didn't maybe you know, other presidents haven't in recent decades. I felt that
American leadership was really called for. I think that like, why does it matter the world? You know, it's it's a very global world. What happens in other parts of the world affects us. It certainly affects us economically, it's certainly terrorism certainly affects us personally. And the US, you know, Madame all Bright would also calls the indispensable nation. And when there's really you know, there's the other. You know, there's no Soviet Union,
there is China, but there's no one else. There is a vacuum of leadership on the world stage to try to, you know, keep just keep a lid on things. And so while there can be isolation as tendencies in the US, our geography certainly allows for that in some ways. It just does you know, in the global world, it you know, you you you were not safe from you you can You cannot insulate yourselves from these challenges, and so I think that it is really important. And while you know
this, this still be a difficult time coming for the manings. A lot of people say it's going to go before it gets better. You just got to take it day by day. And that's far. The US has really played an important role here and keeping things from descending. It could have in the first week descended into uh, you know how the war expand hasn't happened yet. Now it's really switched here. So I want to get your thoughts. We found out one of President Trump's lawyers, Sidney Powell, pled guilty
in the Georgia election case. What what are some of your feelings on that situation? So not an expert, but my friends who are you know, you know she she made a deal, and so that this is not the
first time that's happened. There's going to be uh, you know, he has there's a trial that starts, you know, that starts next week that he's going to be involved in. When you look at the political calendar next year, Ryan, there's Egen Carroll case happens, it meets again in January and then the day before super Tuesday is when the election case, you know,
another the elections case, I think it starts. So he's going to be you know, he's facing people are turning on him, and you know, we could very well be facing by the time we get to the election, the Republican presidential candidate for presidented States having been convicted. It's just it's like kind of hard to wrap your head around what that's gonna just be like. But it's just extraordinary. Yeah, yeah, extraordinary. Jim befre we have a little bit of time left. I want to know what's next for
you with the circus. You work with MSNBC and all. You'll be at the White House tonight. That's why, so please that you took yeah to join us. You're a busy lady. Let's next, don't Jennifer Palmieri's cadis Oh my god. So the circus is back. So we uh, this is our We've been back for two weeks. We have four more weeks. We do sort of like you know, we blocked uh uh break it down
into different blocks because it's very it's very intense when you do it. And so we're on Sunday night at seven o'clock on Showtime Arizgon at seven thirty, also ten and ten thirty for the again for the West Coast, and this week we are looking at you know, we started the week saying, you know, looking to see how the how President Biden was dealing with the Israeli crisis and look to see how that was impacting his political fortunes standing overall.
And uh, you know, there's you know, that was our theory at the end of the week. And then of course the week got more dramatic, both in Washington with the Republicans and then overseas as well. So that's what we're so we have We're on for four more weeks and then on MSNBC. By the way, I have a new podcast and I'm doing with Clara mccaskell. Oh cool. It's called Yeah, it's very cool. It's called
How to Win twenty twenty four. And so each week we focus on, you know, kind of look at the political current political situation, say okay, now, how you know, look, we look very specifically at the electoral implications of of of what is happening. So we'll run every Thursday between now and the twenty twenty four election. Well, you're amazing you know you should uh for complete transparency. Your your husband, Jim and I are h
plus your friends. We're childhood friends and we're looking to slow down. We talk about it all the time, and you just keep going faster and fast. That is not true for either one of you. You never you never cease to amaze me, Jennifer, honestly, and again, I want to thank you for your intelligent conversation here on being Frank. Really a pleasure and I know how busy you are, so it means a lot. Always a pleasure, All pleasure, Frank And of course we arefer special thanks to our
listeners who take time to give us a voice in their lives. Remember we offer a fresh topic every week. Catch us wherever and whenever you get your favorite podcasts that's Apple, Spotify, iHeartRadio, specret more. You can also check us out on the Hudson River Radio Facebook page. Like us, leave a comment, and when you add, we ask you that you consider sharing Being Frank with others. Of course, I've got a couple of little nuggets left for you. This one is from Ben Franklin, and I think it's
very appropriate, appropriate considering what's going on in the world. There never was a good war or a bad piece. We have some music for you too, from a good friend Babner Sissy and he's just has just very clever songs. You'll appreciate if you listen and listen to the lyrics. This one is called live aids, not live aid Live aids. It's interesting. I think you'll find it as such. So for our engineer Neil Richter, I'm your host, Frank Levuono. We hope to have you join us for the next
being. Frank, We're the only way to be is Frank. Thanks for
listening. Pleasure Realli flair of the nineties needs of America to the really badlic of wits and stands, supplings of people, people taking the seafo I've got damn people can see food, they hung the stops can't damn school from that was why God God that wings well, said mister cape In markeularns the box and rather bad VOCALI radity for mask, super fucking Albush, super fucking audience, so fucking abbish, so fucking obvious, working all so fucking albis.
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