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My goodness, being Frank right where the only way to be is Frank. Hello everyone, and welcome to being Frank. We're the only way to be is Frank. I'm your host, FRANKL. Borno, and I'd like to thank you for joining us on what we like to call the Intelligent Conversation podcast, where no conversations out of bounds and all points of view are welcome. You know, we record live to tape. I give you the date so you have some context and relevance. It is the twenty ninth of January, as we celebrate
Black History Month. Few communities in America have had more impact in more ways in the development of this country than Black Americans. From their introduction as slaves in sixteen nineteen and corresponding degradation through the elevation of the first black man as President of the United States four hundred years later, they have come more obstacles and challenges than any other ethnic or racial group to achieve greatness in
every endeavor they attempt. In a vast list that includes the likes of Frederick Douglas, Paul Robes, and Maya Angelo Malcolm Exanina Simone, Barack Obama, and of course Martin Luther King, just to name a precious few. They have risen from the bonds of slavery to the pinnacle of American society, and of course their contributions continue today in so many
ways and on so many levels. My guest has for many years been using his many very talents as an artist, organizer, teacher, and activist to enrich his community.
In everyone in it.
I could read a long list of his accomplishments, including his induction into the Rockland County Civil Rights Hall of Fame and his inclusion in NIAC Historical Siety's Great African American Portrait Exhibit. But as is the case with so many of my guests, it's so impressive that would spend half the show simply doing that. So why not meet him and hear his story his own words. Welcome Bill Batson.
Thank you, Frank. That was quite an exceptional summary of you know, the the the community that celebrated in Black History Month, and I'm honored to be on your program and I'm I'm humbled to be a part of a program with that kind of introduction.
Well, Bill, it's true you know, we tease one another. I don't know who's busy, or you or I doing many little things. I don't know if there are too many great things, but certainly little things that add up to a lot of things. And we're going to go through some of them because I think they're important, especially your involvement here in Nayak. We both live in Nayak. You have a very strong connection here for many years. I want to talk a little bit about that. But
let's let's assume no one knows Bill Batson. What should people know about you? Tell us a little bit about your background, where you grew up, and how you came to where you are now.
Well, you know, Nike is a very just significant threat. I mean everybody, you're shaped by your family. You're shaped by your neighborhood and the institutions, the schools, and the places where you work. So for me, I came to Nayak in nineteen sixty four. I was adopted into a family, an African American family. I'm biracial. My grandmother and had been here her whole life. My great grandfather came, her father came in the eighteen eighties. They were some of
the earliest members of Saint Philip's Amision Church. They shaped me as a young person. My grandmother was a pillar in her community. Despite the fact that she was a domestic she owned a home, had that home rudely taken from her by the process of eminent domain. Nayak is one of those communities that had Nerve and Renewal program.
Talk about that in some detail going forward.
Yes that you know, it's a sanitized term. We call it negro removal. And despite that, she managed to acquire a second home once again on a maid's salary, and raise a family and be a civic leader. And so she kind of set me out into the world. I went to art school after graduating from high school in Teaneck, New Jersey, and then became involved in the arts community.
And at one point I found myself in Greenpoint, Brooklyn, and artists tend to look for neighborhoods that are cheap because we don't have a lot of money, and but for other people were sometimes a gentrifying force, and there
are others families living around us. I was in a building where the door didn't lock, so homeless people were living inside, and there were some drug abuse and there was some really horrible situations for the young families that were trying and many immigrant families that were trying to raise their kids. So I became a housing organizer. And basically my whole life has been kind of pivoting back and forth between culture and civics. So I came back
to I did a lot of jobs in politics. I mean, most of my working life was I was the press secretary for eleven ninety nine SCIU, a healthcare workers union. But while I was there, I founded artists for Jesse Jackson his eighty eight campaign. We created all the merch and did large events and fundraisers. And then I worked for NYCLU, a civil liberties union. I was an assistant director there. I was constantly drawing on the subway back and forth to work. But I left there and ran
Norman Sieguals campaign for Public Advocate. I later worked for David Patterson when he was the minority leader of the State Senate, and continued to make art. Around two thousand and six, I think my father was diagnosed with Alzheimer's because of what happened to my grandmother. We have a tradition of not leaving our homes voluntarily. And my father wanted to die at home and that was something that he gave to a privilege that he gave to his mother.
So my cousin Sylvia and I performed that service for my father and his sister Adline. So we did the home hospice route. I was with I was his primary caregiver for about two years. And Nayak. I've been around the world. I've seen a couple of places. There's really no place for me as wonderful as Nyac, and I think many people agree. You know, when you get that perspective of seeing other places, you sometimes you realize how special it is where you started out.
No, they would never get that for me. My friends all the time about Nayak, how much I love this place, and why don't you about that? Not a perfect You're intantly you're also yeah, I remember, yeah, yeah.
So I'm just I'm just really, you know, happy to be here. And I feel like I had to follow my my grandmother's footsteps. So we'll talk a little bit about the legacy of urban renewal in Nayak. But you know, there are issues that constantly require the attention of citizens now more than ever before. We have a form of government that relies on an informed citizenry. And we know what happens when one when an informed citizens citizen ry does not show up and does not take its responsibilities.
So right now living that right now, Bill, It's not a secret, certainly not here in Nayak.
The one last thing I'd say is that because of my kind of history and past, I did start this thing called the Night Sketch Log. So since I've been home, I've been chronicling the history of Nayak on Night News and Views. I had for ten years a weekly column and published two books, and I continue to show work and to write about my community.
We're going to talk about the sketch Log and how you it's morphed and grown now to include a civil rights aspect to it. We will get to that in some detail. But while you happen to mention it. Through your job, you had the opportunity to get involved with many great people, great figures who in your mind sticks out and someone that you might point to as a real role model.
Well, okay, in terms of a role model, I've always been a you know, subscriber of Kingyan nonviolence and a practitioner of Kingyan non violence. So that has been a constant for me. But in terms of the ability to be in the audience of a person who I think is a significance beyond beyond their time, would be the opportunity I had to meet Nelson Mandela in nineteen ninety six, I spent two years in South Africa. I had a chance to go to Robin Island and see the conditions
that political prisoners there were held under. I got to see a country transform from one of the most racist states on the planet to a multi racial democracy. It was the first country in the in the world to recognize same sex marriage. It has certainly had its struggles, but it's it's a glorious example of of of hope and what can happen when people do resist oppressions and come to together in large numbers and mass movements. So
I had a chance of medium. It was an extraordinary occasion, and one of my favorite possessions on the planet is an autographed copy I have of Antigony. No less Now, I would not proclaim Mandela as an actor per se. I don't think he would claim to be a Thespian. But when he was on Robin Island, every year, the prisoners were allowed a performance, and I read in his biography that he was fond of the play Antigony by Sophocles, and he played the role of Creon, which is the
bad guy. He's like the you know, he's the de clerk character. But he actually believed in himself to such an extent. I believe while he was imprisoned, he imagined himself free and the president of South Africa because he picked the role of illegal because he thought that leaders
had responsibilities and were to be tested. So when I met him, I wanted him to sign the book, and I was in a receiving line and it felt selfish of me to like try to stop him, so I walked away in one of his six foot five Africannor security guards asked me what I had in my hand. I thought I was about to get, you know, a searched and I said a book. And he said, you
want old man to sign book? So I handed it to him with my business card, and three weeks later in the mail in Brooklyn, I got my autograph of Nelson Mandel.
Incredible story. Now there's also an element. I've heard you tell the story, and it's wonderful. I'm glad you shared it with us. But you also there's something very interesting. You mentioned his security detailed as africaners and which were the white, the Dutch white, if you will, early rulers in apartheid, but he made a point of employing them as his bodyguards. It took a little bit about that and why that was important to him and what message that sends.
You subscribe to the Emma Goldman philosophy that the revolution you make determines what comes after. So there was great fear in South Africa that that the you know, the African population was suppressed so violently for so long, and in a very similar way to how the black community in America during Jim Crow was was was you know, subjected to violence and intimidation and lynchings.
So there was a.
Fear that when when the worm turned, that there would be retribution. And Mandela was very mindful of of not wanting to unleash that that beast. And he uh, he's also smart. And the guards that he had on Robin Island, he was a political prisoner of of extreme importance. And I imagine that they acquitted themselves in such a way where it occurred to him that if he was going to be protected outside of prison, that they might be
well equipped to do it. But I also think that for men who had been the guard of a political prisoner was suddenly released, I imagine they thought that they their days were numbered and to suddenly be elevated to a position of you know, presidential guard. They protected that man. He probably had the best protection on the planet because they were so appreciative and it's sent a great, great symbol.
In the same way that he and Bishop Tout decided to support the South African rugby side in the World Cup, and rugby was not an African sport. It was considered more of an africaner sport.
And they made a lot.
Of steps, I think, to to you know, unite the country. But of course, of course they also went after the truth through the Truth and Reconciliation Commission. I think that there's so many parallels between South Africa and the United States that need to be examined. Right now, Robert F. Kennedy is being mismntled in front of the Congress, as he should be, But his father made note of the fact that both South Africa and the United States were originally founded by the Dutch and then taken over by
the British. They violently suppressed an indigenous population. They had an extraordinary civil rights movement, and they have always struggled to repair the breach of discord and racial discord in
their in their you know, in their countries. And when we talked later about uh urban renewal and Nayak, while I was in South Africa, I found papers that suggested that the South African government came to the United States in the fifties and sixties to study our urban renewal program to use it as a template for their forced removals. And then they studied our reservation system for the Native
Americans to create their homelands. So, you know, oftentimes we think we're the paraton of virtue, but often, you know, that's not necessarily the case. So I think that there's a lot that we can learn from South Africa that's positive, and unfortunately, there was a lot that they learned from us that was negative.
Perfect segue my very next question urban renewal in Nayak. You know, we who live here, and you mentioned it, it's a unique place, it's a diverse place. One of the strengths of it, but it's not a perfect place, and it has suffered from the scourge of racism like
many other places. And one of that was through, as you mentioned, a clean word, if you will, of urban renewal, and it happened, of course, in the Black neighborhood and in a strange quirk Jackson Avenue, which was kind of the main boulevard, if you will, through the Black neighborhood. I now live on Jackson Avenue and it's still a
wonderfully diverse neighborhood. I want to talk a little bit more about that later if it will stay, because we have quite a few Latinos and Hispanics in our neighborhood. We know what's happening there. But you were affected directly. Family was affected directly. What was that like, what kind of effect, what kind of emotional mental effect did that have on your family?
I mean, it was devastating. It was a wound that we never really fully recovered from. Certainly economically, you know, home ownership is really the ticket out of poverty. And to have a you know, a home basically stolen from you for pennies and then being forced into the real
estate market. The interesting thing about Naik is that, for whatever reason, in the eighteen eighties, the real estate community and the you know, the fathers, I'll say intentionally because I'm sure the women weren't voting, so the village fathers permitted black families to own property. That wasn't the case in the sixties. Black families could not find because of redlining and because of racist practices in the real estate industry.
No matter how much money you were given as as a settlement from you know, the eminent domain process, you couldn't find anybody to buy sell your house. And my grandmother said, in a quote from the time, you know what do you want us to be? Nomadic people like wandering the hills. She was lucky, I think because of the work that she did in some of the families
that she cleaned house for. I think she actually worked for the Jewett family for a long time, which were very prominent Nayak, and there was a Jewet who was mayor of Upper n eighth for a very long time. She was able to find. I think she ended up buying the home of one of the Jewet children, so she was able to but a lot of the families of the dozens of families that were uh this you know,
uh displaced. Only a handful were able to buy homes in NYAC, a very very few, and and it was primarily people of color and Niak, I think it was eighty percent that that neighborhood around Jacksonamily is about eighty percent black, but there's some white families that were displaced. It wasn't just homeowners, it was there were some businesses that were displaced, and those people were not compensated for losing a business, they were just compensated for their property.
But across America there were other like in in Boston, for instance, Logan Airport that was an Italian neighborhood that was taken. And you know, the the process of you know, taking somebody's home is something that you know, is really kind of uh hypocritical, because you know, for a country, we've always you know, held property rights on on the highest tier. And yet and these these takings and these these dispossessions, you know, you you you were just robbed
of everything. And uh and in Nayak, you know, we're still trying to figure out what to do. So there's a film called What Happened to Jackson Avenue? It was created by Phoenix Ensemble Theater at jakim Olum and Rudy Jewel, incredibly talented young filmmakers put together something that I hope the whole country gets to see. I know it's done well in some you know, the film festivals. It's going to be shown tomorrow night. As a matter of fact, at the library.
I just give the date because this gets archives and repeated if you're watching now the thirtieth a Thursday night, just to give that accuracy that sorry, Bill continue.
So and and we're trying to figure out what to do the the The current the administration of the village is very different in every way then the administration that allowed this horrible process to occur. And you know it was done to kind of revitalize Nayak and actually tore the heart out of Naiac.
And it's interesting and not to be tried. To quote Joey Mitchell, they turned tore down paradise to put up a parking lot. And that's literally true if you would the story behind it. Merchants felt they would lose A new Nanuette mall was being built, and merchants felt they were losing business because there was no parking, So they created a parking lot out of a neighborhood.
Really, people go on to Facebook any day of the week in Nayak, you'll see people still complaining about lack of parking. So it solved absolutely nothing. It just injured a lot of people. So the current administration has actually made all the files that pertained to urban renewal available there now within the storage space of the Historical Society of the Nayaks, And we're going to go through there and try to see if we can do some truth and reconciliation.
Would any kind of repatriation or anything kind of remuneration any is any of that possible.
Well, we're gonna look at what's happening in other cities. It's you know, I think there are three hundred thousand people in America were affected by it, you know, hundreds of communities. I believe it's it's Las Vegas and uh Palm springs, uh uh Cinta, Monica. There are a couple of communities that have had uh uh cases where people have attempted to you know, get some kind of you know justice. So, yeah, we're gonna we're gonna look at at what what would be the best because Nayak, you know,
the housing shortage. Uh, you know, we need housing, we don't need parking lots and and and that's still the case very much today. So you know, anything that we can do to lessen the harm to the families that were suffered, but more importantly, to create a situation where, you know, people Nayak of all you know, races and all walks of life, have a secure place to live. You know that that would be something that we would want to pursue in any any further action.
You know, Nyak has always prided itself on its diversity, and one of the reasons why I say we live here. That's an important part of it. But as I mentioned often, it's not paradise and there are issues here and is there an it's it's a question that I've raised and others have raised, is there truly enough mixing in a town like Nyac It's or is it more of a separate but equal And again it's not. It's it's something I've heard from more than one person.
Well, so, I actually I brought it up in the film. If you see the film, it's like, we're not segregated, but we're not integrated either. And I don't think that's a Nyac problem. I think that's an American problem. I think that for whatever reason that that whole notion of a melting pot, well, first of all, it's a little bit furious because there's no reason for a person to
surrender their culture in order to you know, coexist. And you know, in in in modern society, there's certain things that we love about the different places that we come from. But I think we we hold on to difference in a way here and we're divided and where we're we're pit against each other. Maybe that's actually the proper you know, description of it. And uh, you know, it persists to this day. It's almost sometimes a formula for you know, uh,
political parties and and even businesses. Dare I say in order to avoid you know, or in order to profit. Let's just say that there's there's there's Certainly if something persists, as long as it has, somebody has benefited from it, and certainly not the people who were divided like I've been in other parts of the world, and it's just not as not the same. I don't think it's necessarily a formula. It would not make everything go away if
we were closer together. But when you go into a pub in Britain, for instance, in some working class communities, you'll see people of all races at every single table together. So you wouldn't even be able to say, is this an Indian neighborhood, is this a black neighborhood? Is this a white neighborhood. But if you go into you know, bars in our country or public places in our country, it might be people of all races, but they tend to still congregate together. Yeah, very very tribal about the
United States. And it's unfortunate because our greatest moments have been, like some people have said, the Civil Rights movement was an incredible convergence of interests. The Jewish community, the Black community, the Latino community. We're all in common, you know, kind of common accord. But then there was also another moment during the during the underground railroad. Nayak was a stop
on the underground railroad. So as tragic as there is an event like urban renewal, there are also examples of extraordinary you know, uh uh, collective spirit and and and unity. And the only way you can have an underground railroad location that was successful is that it kind of had to be multiracial. You had to have a black community because if it was an all white community, an escaping slave seen anywhere which stand out like sore Thumb so was known Newburgh to our North, Jersey City to our
south were known. And just to to share the persistence of these stories and the importance I think in our identity, our national identity, there is going to be a bus coming from Nyak on March eighth, from Brooklyn all the way to Buffalo, and what they're trying to create is
a Harriet Tubman Heritage Corridor. It will actually eventually extend from Maryland where she was born, to Nova Scotia, where that was the part of this point north that a slave escaping from the South can get following the North Star, which was the name of Frederick Douglas's publication. And so Nick is going to be a stop on that. When Tony Morrison was here and dedicated a bench in Memorial Park, it was to a woman named Cynthia Hesdra who was
a conductor on the underground railroad. So there are examples of you know, multi racial unity and action, but it doesn't always you know, you know, show itself in our day to day lives. And that's a real shame because you know, that is one of the promises of our country. I think it was the fact that you know, from pluribus unham right out of many one one. Yeah, yeah, we're often many.
But will we seem to have lost that? You know, to the point maybe people questioning if we ever really had it. But under the current administration, with mass deportations, et cetera, the list is vast of things that leave me scratching my head and worse. But how will that affect it? Like, as I mentioned, I live on Jackson Avenue and it's a very diverse community, White families, black families, Latino families, and I wonder if it will be the
same after this. Uh what effects do you think it'll have, the current policies on a community like Nayak and others throughout the country.
Well, once again, I'll return to Martin Luther King.
One of his.
Quotes that means so much to me, especially now, is that truth pressed to the ground rises, and when when people are tested and and and forced to confront the the outrages of of the system that that supports them, that surrounds them, that they feed into it's harder for people to be complacent and it and it does demand action.
As I mentioned two instances. Unfortunately, it was the brink of a civil war, which which actually the Civil War and the aftermath that that showed the extraordinary resolve of people to abolish slavery and and help slave to escape. And then the Civil rights movement, which was a little bit of a different kind of set of circumstances. It was really more from I think returning soldiers demanding freedom and you know, factors in the South, people trying to
prevent that from happening. But there there are moments that where the when the rubbers hit the road and people have stepped forward. So you would hope that this would be one of those I've never you know, seen such uh uh, you know, just disregard for I mean, the mass deportation is something that that feels a little bit like the mass incarceration that's affected the African American community. Some people have maybe been able to sit on the
sidelines and not take a stand. But right now, to quote uh a Texan politician who Jim high Tower, right now, there's nothing in the middle of the road except a yellow line. And dead Armadilla. It's hard not to take pick aside, and it's unfortunate that it had to get to this point. But if people are some people who are comfortable with what's going on, I don't know a single god faring, decent human being who is comfortable. The people that I love and admire and respect are outraged.
And you know, we have, for the time being, a democracy that gives us opportunities to resist what's going on. And I pray that those of us were able to take an opportunity to stand up, because there are many countries in the world that were once free and are no longer. And I hope that in the United States did not join that sad list.
I think you mentioned something earlier too that's important about democracy, and that it's participatory. If you don't participate, it doesn't work. And it was classic in the most recent election, how many people stayed home? Again? Why is that bill? Why Americans can talk a good game, but then when it comes to producing i e. Voting, so many of them stay home. Why?
I think that's just structural. I mean, why would you have anybody who is in government resists making it easier to vote. You know, the reason you would do that is that you wanted to protect incumbency. Incumbency is probably one of the greatest, you know, guarantees of of of you know, maintaining power. Once you're in. It's so hard to dislodge people. So in some countries you're penalized if you don't vote. In some countries the balloting takes place
over weeks. In some countries, you there's universal enfranchisement. You don't have to opt in, you're you're automatically registered. And you know, it's just it's not the case here. I mean, there's a state in in in the south North Carolina that was obviously upset that so many black people were voting on Sundays before the election, so they did away with polling on Sundays. How you know, I guess. You know, we make a big, we boast a lot about our
form of democracy, but it's not direct. The people who have power certainly are reluctant to share it. And right now, the people who have power have a very warped notion of of, you know, what our future should be like. So I don't see how anybody. Maybe this is what mobilizes us, maybe getting this close to the brink is what will increase voter participation. I can't, you know, imagine
anybody who you know, this functionality. Almost everybody who was relying on any federal program almost lost any money that they had. And certainly I don't think people, you know, veterans voted for that. I don't think law enforcement voted for that. I don't think people in the banking community
voted for that. So so what's going on now does affect everybody, and hopefully you know, there will be instead of mass deportations and mass incarceration to maybe it'll be mass voter perce participation.
Well, we're gonna take a quick break. Bill, it's been terrific so far. Really appreciate all your input, and you've got some exciting things to come up and talk about. I'll give you a little bit of the list. Your participation in the historic Mount Moore Cemetery, a thing called Indivisible Rockland, your sketch log and now being called the Civil Rights Sketch Log, the anniversary of the Farmer's Market, which you helped to manage. Okay, more from NYAK News
and Views. Possibly becoming a charitable organization, and you're teaching civics in the round post school system, so this awful lot to talk about fun stuff after the commercial breaks. This is Being Frank. I'm your host, Frank Lebono. Our very special guest is Bill Batson. We're celebrating Black History Month with so much more to come up. Right after these brief commercial messages, don't go anywhere yet, We'll be right back.
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Welcome back to Being Frank, the Intelligent Conversation podcast. Thanks for sticking with us. I'm your host, Franklbono, and of course our engineers, the mailman Neil Richter, are a very special guest. He's an educator and activist and artists and so much more. Of mister Bill Batson. You know, we bring our audience a fresh topic just about every week. Can We stream from Hudson River Radio, which is located and beautiful and historic Stony Point, New York. And I
do mean that you can peck. You can catch Being Frank anywhere you get your favorite podcast Apple Spotify, Oharic Radio and all the others. And because every Being Frank is archived, you can listen to any of our programs any time you like. Find the link to Being Frank on the Hudson River Radio Facebook page or at our website Hudson Riverradio dot com. Just click and you're there. Okay, back to our conversation. Bill. As I mentioned, I tease,
but it's the truth. You are a very busy man involved in so many things here, not only in Nyak, but throughout Rockland County and the area. Now, one of the things I know you just received a wonderful honor about a very historic black, traditional black cemetery here in Nyak. I believe it's in West Nike. It's called Mount Moore. Tell us a little bit about the cemetery itself itself and your involvement with it.
Well, if anybody has a chance to see a film called Mega Mall by Vera Arnaut, we in our county became the location of I think the second largest mall in America in the and it was. It was not without a lot of controversy, and one of the most upsetting factors was the attempt by the paramid corporation to forcibly remove a cemetery. It was almost like an urban renewal, but on a corporate scale. And the people that they were trying to move were the Eternal Residence of Mount Moore.
Mount Moore was established in eighteen forty eight. It was a historic black cemetery. The absurdity of racism in America did not end when you died. Cemeteries were also segregated, and when you looked at who was in that that that burial ground, you had veterans from every single war, from the Spanish American War, and the fact that they were being so dishonored by being segregated wasn't bad enough. But now you know corporation was trying to literally disinter
them and move them. So Hezekia Easter, who I know you met, Frank because one of the great pieces of archival evidence of his work is a program you shot in the.
Old Eye on Rockland days. People still remember it.
It was a great, great interview on the site. Hezeki Easter stopped them in their tracks and forced the Pyramid Corporation to agree in perpetuity to protect and to preserve and to maintain that site. So Hezekiah was the president of the Mount Moore Cemetery Association. That organization unfortunately sunseted and the land eventually became back into the possession of Clarkstown. But Willie Trotman and England and others formed the Friends of Mount Moore Cemetery and I was recently elected to
be the president. It's an awesome, you know, opportunity to share what is there. Most people drive by and yeah, I want.
To explain to people if they're not familiar with the area. It's the Palisades Mall. If you drive west on Route fifty nine, okay, coming out of from where the river is in the Cuomo Bridge, and you're heading out towards Nanuet and you see the huge mall. On the right, there's this kind of little hill, a little green patch of hill, and if you look closely, you'll see the gravestones. So they kind of like built the mall around the
around the cemetery. But it's there and the gravestones are still there, and it's a great place to walk and look at some of these historic headstones.
One of the eternal residents was an eyeball witness to the surrender of General Lee at the Appomatos Courthouse. Another gentleman was a part of the Alabama Battle where the phrase damn the torpedoes, full speed ahead was first uttered. The exceptional thing about what Hezekia put into place, Hezekiah was the last person.
The last person buried there in.
The year two thousand and seven. He was buried there, and so now he stands eternal vigil over the site. But when I said that the Pyramid Corporation was was to accept the responsibility to take care of the cemetery in perpetuity, I spoke prematurely because the Pyramid Corporation went out of business and now there is a new landlord that we're looking forward to to meeting and working with. But we have installed new headstones. I'll use the word
perpetuity again. The mill. The Veterans Administration in our country has a commitment to veterans that extends forever. And if you are a US military veteran, they will provide you with a headstone, and if your headstone decays and is you know, destroyed for whatever reason, they'll replace it. So when you go by, it doesn't necessarily look like a historic cemetery because there are a lot of brand new headstones.
They're about a dozen. There a wonderful historian named and and and and Actually he's a member of an organization called the Sons of the Union Soldiers. William Stump helped us with that.
Great all right, indivisible Rockland tell us about that.
Well there. The last time that Donald Trump was elected, the reaction created an organization called Indivisible. There was also the Women's March. Uh, it's a very different response right now. I think that there's I think people are being much more sophisticated, not knee jerk. I don't think that the absence of, you know, demonstrations in the street means that there's consent. I think that people are being much more methodical and and and and careful and what they're doing.
We organized a march on Martin Luther King's birthday, which converged with the inauguration of of Donald Trump. We had to do something, but we were silent and solemn because you know, as citizens, you know, you don't really imagine that your adversary will be your government. It's really not the paradigm that you expect in a democracy. But there are people in our community who are being targeted and were promised day one executive orders that would round them up,
and and this this wave of mass deportations. And when whenever you hear the word mass, it means that there's no careful adjudication, there's no discernment. It's just a blanket, you know, reactionary way of approaching a group of people. And we wanted folks to know that we would stand
with them in solidarity. So we marched past the first Haitian church in Rockland County to say that the Haitian community has been with us for fifty years and if anyone flees poverty and instability in Haiti looking for work, there are neighbors and our friends, and we want them here and we will support them. And we marched past the place where the first woman voted, Natalie Couch, because we take it for granted that, you know, women are
given full rights in this country. But now we've just nominated a Secretary of Defense who does not believe women should serve in the military. And apparently i've heard either someone in this administration offered the notion that they didn't think women should vote. So as ridiculously extreme as that sounds, that's a commonly held notion among some people in this
new government. We marched past the Pride Center to tell the people in the LGBTQ community that we would support them and they are being targeted with discriminatory legislation throughout the country and individual states and on the national level. And we also marched past Liberty School to remember a building that was taken through urban renewal and the fact that we are still suffering from a shortage in housing and the problem of affordability. So you know, those are
communities that we want to be with. So Indivisible Rockland will be meeting again February tenth, twenty twenty five, at Valley College Library at seven pm. We don't really have I would honestly say, a program at this point and a agenda because we are wanting to wait and see who in our community needs assistance, but we do want to be like that pledge of allegiance promise is indivisible, and right now some people are using division to profit.
And right now, you know, as much as ideology is discussed, and and you know, certainly there are some very uh uh, you know, nefarious ideas about people's identity and race and and all of this is I think a smoke screen because I just see a lot of rich people getting richer, and when we're fighting each other, we can't, you know, take care of it and not to notice. Yeah, and that's what I think is really going off. We have we we've somehow gone from democracy to clubtocracy.
All right, let's move on to a one that's very near and dear to your heart, the sketch log. I have one of your sketch logs, used Niac sketch Log book. It's on my coffee table. It's wonderful. And some of your your hand droid cards, greeting cards are wonderful. And now you're creating from that. Tell us a little bit about the origin of the sketch log and you're moving it now, specifically to a civil rights sketch log. Tell us about that.
Well, so you know, as I said, my hometown shaped me. It's near and dear to me. But civil rights has shaped me too. It's it's informed my worldview and to the extent that I know freedom and liberty. It was granted to me by people who came before and who sacrificed a lot. And I think now more than ever before, we need the stories of the civil rights movement as a playbook, as a as a as a template for what we do next. FOO as a matter of fact, had al Cap do a graphic novel about the Montgomery
bus boycott and that Fellowship of Reconciliation. By the way, I'm sorry, there's a local group that was here in Nayak for over a century. It was a peace group, but they supported the civil rights movement. And that illustrated UH comic made its way around the world in different translations and helped support, you know, UH liberation movement. So you know, we're in need of a liberation movement here
in our country. So I'm going to try to create a list using crowdsourced, a Patreon, and and and and social media to have people suggest sites that are significant to civil rights struggles. I'm not going to define it narrowly according to race. I'm going to look at places like the Triangle Shirt Factory where the labor movement was was advanced. I'm going to look at Stone Wall with the LGBT community, l g P TQ community. I had
a defining moment. I'm going to ask for people to send in ideas and I'm going to pick fifty significant sites, and I'm going to uh do a sketch. And for me, the sketching is is a meditation. You know. We uh have ideas that are are you know, complex and hard to communicate, but there are sometimes simple gestalts that kind of root things and make them real. Anybody who's ever seen the Edmund Pettis Bridge, it is so evocative to that day called Bloody Sunday that produced the Voting Rights Act.
So I want to find symbols and find structures that convey the message of of of these kind of various movements. And I want to create a civil rights sketch log and I'm going to release it. My goal is Martin Luther King's birthday in twenty twenty six, which is, of course the two hundred and fiftieth anniversary of the United States.
And I think that if we are going to celebrate the United States and we're going to have a cake, that I think civil rights should be the candle on top of that cake, because you know, without civil rights, there wouldn't be you know a lot of folks experiencing, you know, any kind of happiness over you know, the two hundred and fiftieth anniversary. So I think it's very important to include everybody, and that's where I'm going to create this.
Outstanding now the Nayak Farmers Market. Every Thursday morning, I get a little plug in there. I live up the street. It's in the parking lot by the way. That was created, but one of the few good things that maybe came out of that whole thing. I know you are very involved in. It's an adverse.
I said, we don't leave voluntarily, so I haven't left.
Yeah, and I understand there's an anniversary. I love it. It's a great little farmer's market, all locally store source stuff, crafts as well as as food items and vegetables and fruits, et cetera. It's a wonderful little market and it's been thereund for what thirty years.
Now, Yep, we're celebrating our thirtieth anniversary.
You know.
It's interesting. We recently had a supermarket open and we were kind of worried that it would maybe, you know, cause it decline, but it's been quite the exact opposite. You know. There's a synergistic relationship between fresh Market and the night farmers Market, and we're happy that we're there. We hope that they're thirty years from now. Because you live downtown Nayak, it's good to have a supermarket within walking distance. Yes, it is, and so the Farmer's Market
is thirty years old. Now we're going to be doing a whole lot of things to thank people for supporting us for all these years. And it really is a unique thing for people to meet the folks that grow
the food that we eat. I would argue that with less and less regulation over the next few years from the FDA, who knows if these organizations are going to be able to do their jobs, that you should try to find food that you have some you know, faith in, and you know the farmers that are like orchards of Conklin. It's a great story talk about anniversaries. They're over three hundred years old years old. Yeah, orchard that has been in continuous operation by the same family, the Conklin family.
So if you really want to, you know, kind of get something that's really truly from the soil of where you live and meet the people who've grown it, you know, come on down to the night Farmers.
Market there if I can them there every Thursday morning and it's there all winter. Long Rainshine. I think it's only been canceled once in this harsh winter, so that's a pretty good.
Record, that's right. Yeah, there's a certain temperature where even the apples, you know, starts to degrade. So but but we stand out there. You know, farmers are tough, a tough life, you know.
To the Sicilian it's anything under fifty degrees and I'm harbinating. But now, Bill, you're also heavily involved in a really wonderful, uh local online publication that I also do some writing for on occasion, Niak News and Views, And I understand you'd like to get that into a nonprofit situation where it's recognized as very.
Very close to to to the the where were the steps that are necessary to have a nonprofit status have been completed. We're close to making an announcement that we are nonprofit. There's a news desert that that you hope.
You know that you've been fighting against Frank and your work and and you know, it used to be that we could trust that there would be radio journalists, television journalists and print journalists and and then for a time digital platforms like the Patch part of the promising even the patch was that we're there'd be something called hyper vocal that you would be able to find news about
where you live, and that has absolutely just disappeared. You know, you know the media better than anybody else, but national you know, ownership of some of these local you know, stations have have just made it impossible for a story that takes place in your neighborhood to reach that level. So you know, you don't see yourself on television, you don't see your community paper, and that means that that people who are you know, up to no good can
go on with impunity. There's no investigative reporting, there's no accountability, there's no fourth estate. So that's a very dangerous world to live in. And and we're trying to do our little bit in dignews and views. So you know, Mike Hayes is a great writer who tell stories of local history. There's there, you know, there's an archive of my sketchlog. Frank, you've been contributing, you know your voice and uh and and we we we do a summary of events going
on on the weekend. We try to support local nonprofits that are doing important work. So I encourage people to check out nine News and views.
You know, if a paraphrase Thomas Jefferson, and he said, if I had a choice between no government and no press, I would choose no government. Again, that's that's uh, that's paraphrasing. That's the power of a free press anyway, and we should never lose sight of that. Now, you teach in so many ways, Bill, your your very life is a teaching moment, but specifically now you're teaching civics in the round po school system. Tell us about that and why that's important to you.
Well, you know, there there's certainly a moment when you know, we we we marvel at the major events that have happened around the world and around the country, and sometimes they've taken place right here in Rockland. So most people don't know this. In nineteen forty, Thurgood Marshall came to Hillburn to end a segregated school system. There was a one school called the Brooks School for colored children, and then there was the Hilburn Elementary School where the white students went.
And he ended that was what had the end of a bathrooms by the way, they could clearly known that. You know, that kind of thing.
Is you know, you might think that that's history. But more and more, you know, segregation, and and you know, unequal practices are occurring in our world. And and Hilburn has been an example of educational inequity. There was also a recent example in Ramapo, and a court found that
ramapost students were being properly you know represented. So I felt like the students in the Ramapo High School should have access to this history, so they should see what has happened in the past to correct inequity and have an opportunity to to to apply those lessons in their own lives. So we're going to be looking at the underground railroad. They'll be visiting spark Hill on Friday actually
to see learned about scon Colo. Then we'll be going to Hillburn and we'll walk from the Hillburn School to the remains the ruins of the Brooks School for Colored Children will meet out their chief Perry. Colored children in that context represented not just black students, but there were also native students from the Ramapo nations that were studying there or or actually being given less than you know, a place to study, but they were together. And then
we're going to be looking at urban renewal. And then we're actually going to go to Stony Point and learn about the history of Latino immigrants in Rockland County.
So it's so cool. It's really participated getting out of the classroom and getting into it.
I love it that kids are going to be reporters and they're going to be creating a visual term paper in the on the walls of the Hopper House. So the Edward Hopper House has stepped up and is participating in this project. So on May third, in twenty twenty five, there will be an exhibit of the what we're calling the Rockland County Civic Survey, and twenty seven students will share what they learned through this project.
That is so special. Bill Betson, thank you so much for sharing your intelligent conversation with us as all ways, this was terrific and you can edifying, gratifying all the good stuff.
Listening to that list of what I've been doing lately, Frank, it was it made me so exhausted, But then it made me remember what Fenny Liuhamer said that we who believe in freedom cannot rest, so there's not going to be much rest for any of us.
I'm with you, I'm with your brother, and of course we are some special thanks to our listeners who take time to give us a voice in their lives. And remember we offer fresh topic just about every week. Catch us wherever and whenever you get your favorite podcasts that includes Apple, Spotify, all the others. Check us out on the Hudson River Radio Facebook page leave us a comment. We also ask you consider consider sharing being frank with others. I always like to leave you with a little bit
extra to take into the evening with you. One is a quote and done some music. First, the quote from Malcolm X. And you know, I grew to really respect and admire Malcolm X after reading the autobiography of Malcolm X, which was interesting written by Alex Haley. But he became such a complete human being from the beginning of the book to the end, and you could just feel his and hear his development. And this is what he became. This is a quote from him. I'm for truth, no
matter who tells it. I'm for justice, no matter who it's for or against.
It's just about says it all.
We've got some great closing music from two friends who are always willing to contribute. Great musicians, Steven Swan and David Snyder with a very appropriate song for this evening's program, stand Up and be Counted for our engineer the Mailman, Neil Richter. I'm your host, Frank Lebono, and we hope to have you join us on the next being Frank, We're the only way to be is Frank recorded to handle.
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